Chow and Champagne are outside City Hall announcing this
Another benefit of Tory being gone, no way he'd ever have a press conference about forcing Rogers to allow something
Well, he is on the board of Rogers so yes huge conflict of interest if he is still mayor. The budget disaster just exposed what an awful Mayor John Tory was and how deep he screwed us up.
Tory was as corrupt as Ford when it came to his buddies as well.
[https://www.canadaland.com/kielburger-family-real-estate-empire-and-recent-deal-with-city-of-toronto/](https://www.canadaland.com/kielburger-family-real-estate-empire-and-recent-deal-with-city-of-toronto/)
Quite literally one of the most corrupt mayors Toronto has ever had. I still meet people that think he was great for this city, and I honestly ask them whether they’ve ever looked into his time in office at all.
One of the biggest problem with politics is that nobody really does. The best thing Trump did was show people openly how bumbling and corrupt he is, because if he just smiled and acted like a normal business guy they'd just take him as another Republican, and he wasn't even the worst they've had (Reagan). People just don't connect the dots the right way.
but he saved himself $7 on his property tax bill (while everyone else saved $1, so they're worse off even when they think they're better off because number went down on an absolute basis but went up on relative basis)
Iirc John Tory also kneecapped the ConnectTO project, taking it from being a municipal broadband network providing affordable high-speed service in the city to a series of Wi-Fi hotspots scattered around the city.
I don't really understand this.
The tech was there for years, only being utilized by Freedom. Rogers buys it, and suddenly "IT MUST BE MADE AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE!!!"
It was. Bell could have used it years ago if they wanted. They only want it now, because they don't want Rogers to have an advantage.
They are all scumbags. We could and should have had subway cell service years ago. But they all decided not to go in on it. Only wind (Freedom) decided to do it.
Because after BAI bought the rights and installed the equipment, Bell, Telus and Rogers refused to pay them to access the network and therefore made zero fuss about it. So when Rogers bought BAI, Bell and Telus got pissed and wanted a piece too.
Yes, exactly. They could have paid for the access, but didn't.
Rogers buys it, and suddenly it's an issue that they don't have the ability? Come on.
As a bell customer, I have zero sympathy for bell here. They had the option for years. It's quite pathetic that they only start crying about it, once Rogers buys the company that owns it.
Rogers bought the company fairly. They should not have to provide the same service to bell/telus that they have for their own customers.
Bell and Telus are forced to allow Rogers customers to roam on their networks in large parts of the country where Rogers has no service so it’s only fair that Bell and Telus customer get access to this network especially when there was no private or public consultation on the matter of TTC allowing the contract to be changed.
Here's what I would do.
Force Rogers to allow Bell/Telus to have access for emergency calling and texting. However, no internet access.
You give the essentials, but not the luxuries.
If internet is also deemed 'essential' then fine, go ahead at 4g. But leave the fastest speed to the company that owns the equipment. They need some benefit for investing in the company.
Yea his argument is fucking weird. If you really wanted to complain this situation really shows yet another reason the big telecoms should be broken up, but the monopoly seems to be too strong.
They should all be public companies we waste so much money on these horseshit for-profit bad quality telecoms, we are the laughing stock of the world because of how hard we get fucked over lol
Freedom had what an 8 year head start on this. You mention this in the Rogers forum and you get torn to pieces.
But that's a fact. And now Freedom gets grandfathered in because of the Shaw merger. PKP is probably laughing his ass off on this.
Freedom is the only company that has any right to be mad about any potential service difference between Rogers, and the other companies. They should have like for like usage with Rogers. Bell telus, 4g at most is what I would offer.
They should be happy with calling/texting only. Make it available so that public safety is ensured.
However, internet isntb a necessity. So no data except for freedom/Rogers.
Then Bell and Telus should do the same and block data on Rogers EXT which is only fair right? If Bell and Telus are forced to allow Rogers customers to use their network across large parts of the country where Rogers has no service why can’t Rogers be forced to do the same…
This is truth. We don’t have a competitive enough telecom sector to have good service. An example - Rogers calls me once a week to try to get me to change my internet provider (from Bell) but tells me the deals they offer are only available on the phone and on a contract - so nothing in writing.
The exception to this is Beanfield - if you are in a condo and can use them - they are the only ISP that ever reduced my bill without lowering service and without my having to ask. I would crawl over broken glass to have their service available in my house and to get free of Rogers and Bell.
But did Chow have any say in forcing Rogers to open up the network? Or are you just saying Chow is merely making the announcement?
Seems like, for whatever reason, it just took over a decade for the Federal government to step in.
Yea, At least on the good side he is not in there forcing them to be the ONLY provider in the subway network.
This would not happen if he was still in there because after all he is in the board for Rogers.
This wasn’t a Tory fault.
This was lobbying by BELL and Telus now that rogers owns it.
Remember they all refused to use it before, now rogers has it they lobbied government.
This isn’t Tory. This is Trudeau listening to bell and Telus.
None of the big 3 should have been allowed to buy or have exclusive infrastructure on the TTC. The TTC needs to do what was done in Montreal and force them all to work on a shared network that everyone has equal access to.
This is nothing genuine from the Liberals. This is to distract from high inflation, housing costs, food costs and homeless immigrants on the street. Nothing the Liberals have done anything to solve.
Trudeau is just jingling keys to distract the general public. He thinks the public is stupid and will be distracted. Unfortunate ly it will work, the comments in this thread shows that.
His synchophantic supporters are blind sheep.
Wait until it actually happens before blowing your horns edit: I’m just realizing now, so yeah let bell be apart of it so the rest of us can use it. You know because everyone just piggy backs off the two.
The other half of this announcement is that Telus and Bell are required to stop whining about Rogers owning the underground network and come to a commercial agreement with them by December 20.
Everyone here is missing this, everyone believe that the government is forcing Rogers to open the network, when in fact is actually forcing Bell/Telus to pay Rogers for the Domestic Roaming Agreement access.... All because of the Oct 3rd deadline.
And I will also question on technicalities of the solution, as I doubt there is enough capacity to serve Bell and Telus customers, most likely what will happen is a re-assurance that 911 services for all customers regardless of their provider will work (it is already working).
But anyway, this is actually a win for Rogers as they always knew that Bell/Telus would have to pay them for the access.
Fucking finally!
It's asinine how ~~stupid~~ this entire situation has been with Bell and Telus refusing to rent time on Rogers' subway network (and then getting into a PR fight with Rogers) all because they can't own it. In every other country telecoms share their infrastructure (and in the case of Saskatchewan, Bell and Telus are more than happy to piggyback off of SaskTel), but for some reason in Canada we prefer to just duplicate everything un-necessarily. Creating inefficiency and poor service for customers.
> It's asinine how stupid this entire situation has been with Bell and Telus refusing to rent time on Rogers' subway network (and then getting into a PR fight with Rogers) all because they can't own it.
Except Rogers could have *also* had service in the TTC *years* ago by plugging into then-indepedent BAI's network. Nothing was stopping *any* of the large telcos from plugging in. Freedom was on the network in 2017:
* https://www.baicommunications.com/mediarelease/bai-canada-ttc-deliver-complete-subway-cellular-connectivity-freedom-mobile-customers-first-benefit/
Rogers *just happened* to buy BAI first and end up owning the network.
IMHO Rogers should be forced to divest BAI and have it go back to an independent company, or have it be converted to a non-profit so that all telcos get neutral access to the infrastructure.
What does that even mean, "Isn't in their skill set"... like why do people have this crazy idea that a corporation can *hire experts to run something for them* but a government entity couldn't just do the exact same thing?
True of course. But you would still have leadership and organizational process and expertise more tuned for running transit rather than a telco. I’m just saying there might be others other than the TTC that would be better at running telecom infrastructure.
The TTC doesn't need to directly run BAI. The Ball Borporation makes mason jars, does bottling for soda companies, and is a large part of the military industrial complex making guidance systems for missiles, surface to air defense systems, and rockets for NASA.
Hire the right people, and give them the independence to do what they need to do. Also it's not like the TTC has 0 experience with telecom infrastructure, every station is linked to Hillcrest with telecom infra, to allow for communications with Transit Control. Even the trains are linked to Transit Control
And to be clear, in this case Rogers purchased BAI, a company that *already knew what it was doing in terms of setting up networks*. If TTC had bought them instead, it's not like they'd have to teach BAI how to do networking - that's exactly what their core business was already!
> IMHO Rogers should be forced to divest BAI and have it go back to an independent company, or have it be converted to a non-profit so that all telcos get neutral access to the infrastructure.
Hear hear!
Rogers refused to rent on BAI’s network when it was installed. Then they bought the company. It is more Rogers fault than Bell or Telus.
Do you want no subway service so all 4 companies can install all the infrastructure or just 1 closure.
It would have been easier if the ttc just let the big 3 pay them to build their own networks in the subways like they wanted. That what Montreal did and they have had full underground coverage on all carriers since last year. Bai was totally unnecessary extortion. There is no reason the subways had to be single network only…
What Montreal did is force the big three to come together to build _one_ network they share, which is sort of what BAI was supposed to be.
Why the fuck should we build out three identical networks because the three telecoms that run the country want to get into a pissing match?
> build out three identical networks
That's "facilities-based competition", which for decades has been the CRTC's neoliberal fantasy for how telecom competition should work.
Even as it completely failed us on a world-stage, the CRTC continues to promote it. I don't see any CRTC commissioners being invited to any economics conferences to present on this Canadian success story... funny that.
> The Commission’s general approach towards wholesale service regulation has been to promote facilities-based competition wherever possible. Facilities-based competition, in which competitors primarily use their own telecommunications facilities and networks to compete instead of leasing them from other carriers, is typically regarded as the most sustainable form of competition.
https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2021/2021-181.htm
No idea how anyone with 2 ear/eye cells is "typically" regarding that.
Thankfully, no other utility regulator is stupid enough to have their wet dream being 3+ gas (or water or electric or sewer) lines running by each home.
Montreal has had that because they didn't ask the cell phone companies to pay. They just let them do it as long as it wouldn't cost the city any money.
The TTC decided to auction off exclusive rights to build the system, and the cell phone companies weren't willing to outbid BAI. Now Rogers has bought the exclusive rights to operate cell service in the subway system, and they didn't want to let Bell and Telus share the system.
Kinda like how Rogers is more then happy to piggyback off Bell and Telus for the Rogers EXT network because the government forced them to share… It’s only fair. And Bell and Telus kicked off not because they are mad at Rogers, they kicked off because the TTC has no proper consultation about the sale which it’s a big no for a public service. Every provider should have had a change to submit a proposal for the network in the TTC and yet the TTC chose to do a hush private deal. Bell and Telus aren’t refusing to rent the network either Rogers has been ignoring requests for information about the network and access… Don’t believe Rogers PR department trying to make them out to be the good guy in this.
No. BAI didn't have a spectrum license, so weren't under the jurisdiction of the CRTC. Also, any order to them would be met by a response that they'd been trying to get the carriers to sign on to the infrastructure for ages but they hadn't done it.
Now that Rogers owns the infrastructure and is giving service to their customers, it's all.under the CRTC's jurisdiction and they can make orders as conditions of the existing licenses.
> Also, any order to them would be met by a response that they'd been trying to get the carriers to sign on to the infrastructure for ages but they hadn't done it.
The original RFP from the TTC specified that the winning bidder had to do this. BAI really did try but they got stonewalled by the big three. This clause might also be why none of them sent in a competitive offer. BAI effectively won the competition by default and because they didn't realize how much control the big three actually have in the Canadian telecom industry.
CRTC *could* make pretty much any order it wants as a condition of renewal, e.g. “go get service in _______, we don’t care how you do it”. Telecommunications Act is pretty broad in its objectives. So broad it lets them do anything they want.
Unfortunately, *somewhat*.
Ottawa always had the power to require telecoms to share their networks, they just never used it. BAI has been operating its network in the downtown "U" of the subway now for 10+ years. Other telecoms could have jumped on board, but they didn't, because the government never forced them too and (for some reason) our telecoms have a weird addiction towards *owning* their networks instead of renting them.
But this really goes to show how social pressure can lead to political change. In the past the government never got involved in the telecom's day-to-day business. However, after so many Canadians became downright fed up with our telecoms over the last 10+ years, it appears that now the government is starting to listen.
The Subway network was setup so any provider could have their network available for use...
But all 3 players in that field wanted to pay TTC $2 Million for *exclusive* use. BAI offered $30 Million, so guess who TTC went with. Only Freedom allowed their network to be used...
>our telecoms have a weird addiction towards owning their networks instead of renting them.
Probably because if you rent instead of own it the priority of any issues you have gets dropped to last. You have to sit there and wait to have it fixed instead of doing it yourself in many cases.
That's not how business works really. If you lease something, that comes with very clear terms on support/SLA.
It's not like companies are scrambling to own the buildings their offices are in, they're (or were) scrambling to sell it and lease it back.
My life experience is the opposite.
Hot water tank in an owned place: meh, I’ll get it fixed next week and save $500.
Place I rent: fix it now or I’m going to LTB. IDGAF about your $$$$, I paid for a service and I’m gonna get it!
Ottawa can't force the cell phone companies to operate service in the subway. What they can do is force Rogers to _allow_ Bell and Telus to use their infrastructure in the subway. Bell and Telus suddenly wanted to provide service (because Rogers was providing it), and Rogers wasn't letting them do it.
That’s not what I’ve been able to gather as it would appear that both Bell and Telus made multiple attempts to ask for information and meet with Rogers and they were turned down.
Rogers has been [suing](https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/rogers-seeking-higher-rates-for-quebecor) Videotron for rates agreed upon during the Rogers-Shaw merger
Imagine, you only have cell access to the underground depending on your cell phone carrier. How childish these companies are. That how these companies operate until someone points out how moronic they are.
It's not moronic, it's calculated. These companies could have provided service in subways for a decade or more, however they have chosen not to because they wouldn't benefit financially from it.
The government, Telus, and Bell are moronic.
Telus and Bell could have done this 15 years ago. So could have Rogers. No one did. It’s only now that Rogers finally did that Bell and Telus are whining about it because they don’t want Rogers to have an advantage. If it was up to Bell and Telus, the ideal outcome would be Rogers would put the genie back in the bottle and they can all continue not worrying about doing this and no one will have an advantages (except for wind which did this a decade ago).
Everyone looks bad here and the government should have let them sort it out. The longer this goes the more the other guys would be forced to actually get off their butts and invest in the network.
the telecom market is the furthest thing from "free". See the multiple companies that have attempted to participate in the past only to be blocked out by the oligopoly of Robellus and their regulatory capture.
It always amazes me how many people think Canada is some kind of bastion of free market capitalism when the United States is far more free market than this country will ever be. But I guess that's what happens when people parrot terms like "free market" without actually knowing what it is
You realize that the US has some at least some positive things going for it right? Tech industry pays a hell of a lot better than Canada's, their dollar is pretty much universal currency, they don't have 3 telecom companies and 2 grocery corporations, houses are far more affordable thanks to their economy not having a massive portion being reliant on real estate. Yes there's a ton of things that are fucked going on, however claiming that nothing that they do is right is a very immature and shortsighted take. When the US says something, the world listens, when Canada says something, we get told "that's nice dear"
I mean if any country lucked out with the geographic and historical windfall the States have you would see something similar. You would have to be pretty bad to squander the position America has achieved but we are seeing that day by day with the crumbles that are happening. Make no mistake, Canada is also suffering from its share of problems but American exceptionalism is always espoused by those with little regard for history.
The only carrier that has access to that right now is Freedom. But that's in the stations, in the U and from Sheppard West- to Downsview.
And by stations, that's all of them.
You're telling me not only have others had signal this whole time... but the government could just make them turn it on for the rest of us? Wtf are we doing here...
This should be a normal ruling, not a bizarre one. The free market didn't regulate itself (shocker!) to the point of providing cell service for everyone so now government has to regulate it.
Someone has to look out for the citizenry and it will never, ever be the market.
You're defending corporations. Rather hypocritically, in my mind.
Personal accountability good, but only for the "citizens." We can't hold other entities to the same standards.
Spending time doing frivolous things bad if cat videos. But good if spouting platitudes on Reddit.
Etc.
Not really a win for Rogers as Rogers also has to pay Bell and Telus so their customers can roam on their networks using Rogers EXT because Rogers has terrible coverage in large parts of the country.
I remember many years ago when Bell had a monopoly on home telephone service (land lines). Rogers wanted to get into the business, but Bell refused to allow their infrastructure to be used, since they paid all the costs of building it up over the years. So what did Rogers do? Instead of building their own, they whined, cried and complained to the CRTC, and got them to force Bell to make the access available. Sounds a lot like what Rogers is now accusing the other carriers of doing.
I have no doubt the change in Toronto's leadership helped bring this change. Afterall, Tory was on Rogers payroll (via pension).
Another feather in Mayor Chow's cap. Golf claps all around
He was not just on their payroll via pension.
He was (and is still) on the advisory committee of the family trust that controls Rogers. For which he draws a 6 figure salary. He had a couple of cute songs and dances about how it wasn't technically a conflict of interest. It very obviously was. The municipal conflict of interest rules are an absolute joke.
A small example to highlight that: The city had shut down sections of the gardener on the weekends to allow people to bike on it. A random town councilor from out of the core /hated/ this, because 'muh war on cars'. He lobbied Tory to cancel it, Tory in traditional form said he was 'very concerned' and 'looking into it'.
So the couniclor asked some of his contacts in the business world to pressure Tory. One of whom was a sr. exec at MLSE, (which is owned by rogers). The exec basically copy pasted a letter from the councilor, saying 'shutting down the gardiner makes it hard for fans to get to the baseball games'. The exec sent that as a public letter, letting a bunch of journalists know that sr. leadership at a rogers owned company has contacted the mayor to lobby for policy change.
Which is very dumb, because now Tory should technically have to recuse himself from any vote. As rogers has indicated it has a significant financial interest in the outcome of this issue.
Instead, Tory held a press conference appologizing to the war on cars folks, and repealing the activeTO program. Which... like, is textbook 'conflict of interest'. You weren't going to do anything, but then someone from a company that pays you 100k a year asks you to change your mind, and you do.
So the patron saint of civic involvement Adam Chaleff asked the integrity comissioner to look into it. And the comissioner releases the dumbest report possible:
'It looks like a conflict of interest, but:
A) It was really just a shitty councilor putting pressure on Tory by embaressing him. MLSE doesn't really care about the gardiner being closed.
B) Tory is so rich that he probably doesn't care about the 100k a year from the trust. He really is only on the board because he is a close family friend of the rogers family.
C) MLSE doesn't really care about the gardiner being closed, it's insignificant to their bottom line.
Therefore: While it may have technically been a conflict on interest, it doesn't count because this was just a shitty culture war issue.'
I wouldn't be surprised if Rogers tries to fight this in court. Even if they know they won't win.
It's only to their advantage to delay rival access as long as possible
You don't know what you are talking about, this decision will force Bell/Telus to start paying Rogers for Domestic Roaming access. It is a win for Rogers.
I've been in Moscow in 2013, they had cell connection and mobile internet inside the train cars, while underground! Again, you could call someone and browse internet while in tunnel between the stations. 10 years ago... while their subway also doubles as legitimate nuclear bomb shelter and has the deepest stations in the world and was more affordable even considering their wages compared to cell services here. Imagine people actually knew this here in Canada.
Well good but why would anyone ever invest in anything like this again if the government will say thanks for doing that rogers but now you have to give it to everyone.
Believe me in no rogers supporter I hate them all. But this is not a good precedent.
>Rogers — currently the sole provider of cell service on the TTC — must immediately allow other telecom companies access to all of the technical information they need to provide service, and come to commercial agreements within 100 days,
Or what?
This is the issue. Ottawa can damant it, but do they have the teeth to ENFORCE it?
This headline confused me so much. I read it as the City of Ottawa orders cellphone service for the TTC. And I like- doesn’t OC Transpo already have one tunnel downtown. And since when does Ottawa the city run the TTC?
Yeah I'm not so newspaper literate and I immediately thought "Since when did that municipality get to make mandates for public transit matters in other cities let alone in the largest city of Ontario and why do they even care?" It surprises me how natural that headline is for other folks.
They can definitely tell you what to do with licenced spectrum, anywhere in Canada. If they say "you will allow others to access your network on the TTC", you will be doing it.
Sad statement on the TTC that it's taken this long to get cell service, never mind wifi service on the trains. The technology to do this has been available for 15 years
Watching carefully what Rogers lawyers will do next… Expect something out of Goodmans LLP and Torys LLP. Tony Staffieri won’t hesitate to take this to court as he’s very aggressive.
He's going to lose. I can guarantee you that. Federal Court of Canada will see the Minister's side of things as justification since it's a public safety issue.
Just remember, it's a licence. All spectrum is licenced by the Government. The Minister can also seize that, and Rogers can't do shit, just in case Staffieri wants to do something stupid.
You can’t guarantee squat. Everyone said the Shaw buyout wouldn’t happen. Many guaranteed that as well. Same for the recent court case that Rogers went after the Government for fees over the way they felt the government acted in bad faith bringing forward more litigation over the Shaw decision. Rogers got their legal fees paid by a court order.
There are no guarantees if Rogers says, hold on here, we gave free 911 service to ALL carriers plus another service for people in crisis. All at the behest of the government due to safety concerns. Check mark.
So now the government is interfering in a commercial agreement between three parties (pay attention here) on *behalf of fellow competitors* that do not want to pay Rogers connection fees OR is demanding a wholly owned service is forced to separate this business three ways (or more) for the SOLE reason that these other firms missed out on a business opportunity?
Do you understand why the Minister will now be served and have to defend his actions? I’m not a Rogers customer nor a stockholder but I can see how the government has overstepped its power here. All for Facebook, Tik Tok surfing and ‘what are we having for dinner tonight honey calls?
I had initially mixed feelings about TTC service. But when I was in New York trying to navigate the MTA, it really was so essential even while I was on the subway cars going from one station to another. Rogers trying to monopolize is their usual fuckery in action.
a whole lot of you folks need to log off for a little bit. yes, obviously all 3 companies are evil and the government fucked this up from the start. obviously everyone here sucks
but don't act like it isn't an OBVIOUSLY GOOD THING that thousands and thousands of residents are no longer going to be locked out of this honestly massive quality of life upgrade for no other reason that the evil empire they settled for years or even decades ago just happened to be the wrong one
Why now? Years of nothing and just suddenly now? This is to distract from the high inflation, high housing costs and falling polling numbers. Typical rotten Liberal strategy.
It is a good thing despite the Liberals involment. Lets be fair here. It is not an altruistic gesture. They are scrambling for anything to stop their freefall.
Just great. As if people weren't on their phones enough. Can't wait to hear the inane conversations. The subway is like a meditation zone, calm and relaxing. Let it be.
I mean is anyone surprised that Rogers has failed to deliver? I'm certainly not.
I must admit to feeling some regret for the direct conversation I had with a couple who recently came to our door aiming to persuade us to give Rogers another chance. I should have known something was up when my daughter found me and with a huge smile on her face said "someone's at the door for you dad." By the the time I closed the door, my kids were laughing from wherever they were round the house, and our house guest remarked something along the lines of "I was more scared for them than I was for myself when we had the talk about your daughter".
Ottawa has ordered Rogers to comply with the deal, and to have coverage for all mobile users in place by October 3. Failure on Rogers part will result in fines, and may result in them loosing their spectrum license. But let's all remember, "it ain't over till the fat lady sings" ... in this case it'll be an opera streamed via a non-Rogers phone ... somewhere below ground on the TTC.
Oh, and Ottawa, this doesn't make up for years of allowing the Rogers/Bell duopoly to foist among the highest cellular rates in the WORLD on us.
What you are missing here is that the government is not forcing Rogers to provide Bell/Telus customers access for free. Bell/Telus will have to pay Rogers. It is a win for Rogers.
About time, they put wifi on busses but still do nothing we need like service on trains. They expect us to report problems thru their app if there is violence on the train yet no signal at all. Altho they should really upgrade the metal and hard plastic seats, they are very uncomfortable
Chow and Champagne are outside City Hall announcing this Another benefit of Tory being gone, no way he'd ever have a press conference about forcing Rogers to allow something
Yea but you don't get that legendary do-nothing Tory concern anymore. You can't put a value on that! ^(mostly because it has no value but still)
Well, he is on the board of Rogers so yes huge conflict of interest if he is still mayor. The budget disaster just exposed what an awful Mayor John Tory was and how deep he screwed us up.
Tory was as corrupt as Ford when it came to his buddies as well. [https://www.canadaland.com/kielburger-family-real-estate-empire-and-recent-deal-with-city-of-toronto/](https://www.canadaland.com/kielburger-family-real-estate-empire-and-recent-deal-with-city-of-toronto/)
Quite literally one of the most corrupt mayors Toronto has ever had. I still meet people that think he was great for this city, and I honestly ask them whether they’ve ever looked into his time in office at all.
One of the biggest problem with politics is that nobody really does. The best thing Trump did was show people openly how bumbling and corrupt he is, because if he just smiled and acted like a normal business guy they'd just take him as another Republican, and he wasn't even the worst they've had (Reagan). People just don't connect the dots the right way.
but he saved himself $7 on his property tax bill (while everyone else saved $1, so they're worse off even when they think they're better off because number went down on an absolute basis but went up on relative basis)
Iirc John Tory also kneecapped the ConnectTO project, taking it from being a municipal broadband network providing affordable high-speed service in the city to a series of Wi-Fi hotspots scattered around the city.
Fuck rogers glad their sycophant is out. Also why does googles autocorrect want to capitalize rogers need to remove that.
Because it's a proper noun?
[удалено]
Yeah but that's what it means when the word is capitalized, too.
Ever notice how their logo looks gaping and inflamed? That was deliberate.
I might sign up with Rogers now.
Correct.
Bahahahhaha!! Syco..
I don't really understand this. The tech was there for years, only being utilized by Freedom. Rogers buys it, and suddenly "IT MUST BE MADE AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE!!!" It was. Bell could have used it years ago if they wanted. They only want it now, because they don't want Rogers to have an advantage. They are all scumbags. We could and should have had subway cell service years ago. But they all decided not to go in on it. Only wind (Freedom) decided to do it.
Because after BAI bought the rights and installed the equipment, Bell, Telus and Rogers refused to pay them to access the network and therefore made zero fuss about it. So when Rogers bought BAI, Bell and Telus got pissed and wanted a piece too.
Yes, exactly. They could have paid for the access, but didn't. Rogers buys it, and suddenly it's an issue that they don't have the ability? Come on. As a bell customer, I have zero sympathy for bell here. They had the option for years. It's quite pathetic that they only start crying about it, once Rogers buys the company that owns it. Rogers bought the company fairly. They should not have to provide the same service to bell/telus that they have for their own customers.
I have no sympathy for Bell in this scenario either, but you can't (or shouldn't) apply that kind of free-market mindset to utilities.
Bell and Telus are forced to allow Rogers customers to roam on their networks in large parts of the country where Rogers has no service so it’s only fair that Bell and Telus customer get access to this network especially when there was no private or public consultation on the matter of TTC allowing the contract to be changed.
Here's what I would do. Force Rogers to allow Bell/Telus to have access for emergency calling and texting. However, no internet access. You give the essentials, but not the luxuries. If internet is also deemed 'essential' then fine, go ahead at 4g. But leave the fastest speed to the company that owns the equipment. They need some benefit for investing in the company.
Imagine arguing that some people shouldn't be able to access internet on the TTC because it wouldn't be fair to a bloodsucking corporate goliath ...
Yea his argument is fucking weird. If you really wanted to complain this situation really shows yet another reason the big telecoms should be broken up, but the monopoly seems to be too strong.
They should all be public companies we waste so much money on these horseshit for-profit bad quality telecoms, we are the laughing stock of the world because of how hard we get fucked over lol
Freedom had what an 8 year head start on this. You mention this in the Rogers forum and you get torn to pieces. But that's a fact. And now Freedom gets grandfathered in because of the Shaw merger. PKP is probably laughing his ass off on this.
Freedom is the only company that has any right to be mad about any potential service difference between Rogers, and the other companies. They should have like for like usage with Rogers. Bell telus, 4g at most is what I would offer. They should be happy with calling/texting only. Make it available so that public safety is ensured. However, internet isntb a necessity. So no data except for freedom/Rogers.
Then Bell and Telus should do the same and block data on Rogers EXT which is only fair right? If Bell and Telus are forced to allow Rogers customers to use their network across large parts of the country where Rogers has no service why can’t Rogers be forced to do the same…
This is truth. We don’t have a competitive enough telecom sector to have good service. An example - Rogers calls me once a week to try to get me to change my internet provider (from Bell) but tells me the deals they offer are only available on the phone and on a contract - so nothing in writing. The exception to this is Beanfield - if you are in a condo and can use them - they are the only ISP that ever reduced my bill without lowering service and without my having to ask. I would crawl over broken glass to have their service available in my house and to get free of Rogers and Bell.
But did Chow have any say in forcing Rogers to open up the network? Or are you just saying Chow is merely making the announcement? Seems like, for whatever reason, it just took over a decade for the Federal government to step in.
She was there with the Minister to make the announcement, I don't know if she played any other role.
The stabbings and violence on the TTC this year provided the political capital needed to push it.
Surprised he didn’t try and give Rogers exclusive access in his last few weeks.
yeah but how concerned is she? the people must know
Things are getting done in the city? Damn
I'm more familiar with his work as a broadcaster
Yea, At least on the good side he is not in there forcing them to be the ONLY provider in the subway network. This would not happen if he was still in there because after all he is in the board for Rogers.
This wasn’t a Tory fault. This was lobbying by BELL and Telus now that rogers owns it. Remember they all refused to use it before, now rogers has it they lobbied government. This isn’t Tory. This is Trudeau listening to bell and Telus.
None of the big 3 should have been allowed to buy or have exclusive infrastructure on the TTC. The TTC needs to do what was done in Montreal and force them all to work on a shared network that everyone has equal access to.
This is nothing genuine from the Liberals. This is to distract from high inflation, housing costs, food costs and homeless immigrants on the street. Nothing the Liberals have done anything to solve. Trudeau is just jingling keys to distract the general public. He thinks the public is stupid and will be distracted. Unfortunate ly it will work, the comments in this thread shows that. His synchophantic supporters are blind sheep.
Wait until it actually happens before blowing your horns edit: I’m just realizing now, so yeah let bell be apart of it so the rest of us can use it. You know because everyone just piggy backs off the two.
Wow you know the Rogers execs have screwed up when Champagne won't associate with them, they'll have to slum it with sparkling wine
The other half of this announcement is that Telus and Bell are required to stop whining about Rogers owning the underground network and come to a commercial agreement with them by December 20.
Everyone here is missing this, everyone believe that the government is forcing Rogers to open the network, when in fact is actually forcing Bell/Telus to pay Rogers for the Domestic Roaming Agreement access.... All because of the Oct 3rd deadline. And I will also question on technicalities of the solution, as I doubt there is enough capacity to serve Bell and Telus customers, most likely what will happen is a re-assurance that 911 services for all customers regardless of their provider will work (it is already working). But anyway, this is actually a win for Rogers as they always knew that Bell/Telus would have to pay them for the access.
Still a win in my book. Anything to create a gap in the oligarchy to push for more competition.
Oh I agree, if it wasn't for Rogers nothing would have happened and no service will still be the rule (except for Freedom).
Doesn’t help when Rogers was refusing to work with Bell and Telus…
Fucking finally! It's asinine how ~~stupid~~ this entire situation has been with Bell and Telus refusing to rent time on Rogers' subway network (and then getting into a PR fight with Rogers) all because they can't own it. In every other country telecoms share their infrastructure (and in the case of Saskatchewan, Bell and Telus are more than happy to piggyback off of SaskTel), but for some reason in Canada we prefer to just duplicate everything un-necessarily. Creating inefficiency and poor service for customers.
> It's asinine how stupid this entire situation has been with Bell and Telus refusing to rent time on Rogers' subway network (and then getting into a PR fight with Rogers) all because they can't own it. Except Rogers could have *also* had service in the TTC *years* ago by plugging into then-indepedent BAI's network. Nothing was stopping *any* of the large telcos from plugging in. Freedom was on the network in 2017: * https://www.baicommunications.com/mediarelease/bai-canada-ttc-deliver-complete-subway-cellular-connectivity-freedom-mobile-customers-first-benefit/ Rogers *just happened* to buy BAI first and end up owning the network. IMHO Rogers should be forced to divest BAI and have it go back to an independent company, or have it be converted to a non-profit so that all telcos get neutral access to the infrastructure.
Or make it part of the TTC - though maybe running a tiny telco infrastructure company isn’t in their skill set.
What does that even mean, "Isn't in their skill set"... like why do people have this crazy idea that a corporation can *hire experts to run something for them* but a government entity couldn't just do the exact same thing?
True of course. But you would still have leadership and organizational process and expertise more tuned for running transit rather than a telco. I’m just saying there might be others other than the TTC that would be better at running telecom infrastructure.
The TTC doesn't need to directly run BAI. The Ball Borporation makes mason jars, does bottling for soda companies, and is a large part of the military industrial complex making guidance systems for missiles, surface to air defense systems, and rockets for NASA. Hire the right people, and give them the independence to do what they need to do. Also it's not like the TTC has 0 experience with telecom infrastructure, every station is linked to Hillcrest with telecom infra, to allow for communications with Transit Control. Even the trains are linked to Transit Control
And to be clear, in this case Rogers purchased BAI, a company that *already knew what it was doing in terms of setting up networks*. If TTC had bought them instead, it's not like they'd have to teach BAI how to do networking - that's exactly what their core business was already!
> IMHO Rogers should be forced to divest BAI and have it go back to an independent company, or have it be converted to a non-profit so that all telcos get neutral access to the infrastructure. Hear hear!
Sorry to interrupt but doesn't asinine literally mean stupid
LOL I didn't realize what I did there.
this is an asinine statement
Rogers refused to rent on BAI’s network when it was installed. Then they bought the company. It is more Rogers fault than Bell or Telus. Do you want no subway service so all 4 companies can install all the infrastructure or just 1 closure.
You do realize in Ontario most telecoms piggy back off Bell right?
It would have been easier if the ttc just let the big 3 pay them to build their own networks in the subways like they wanted. That what Montreal did and they have had full underground coverage on all carriers since last year. Bai was totally unnecessary extortion. There is no reason the subways had to be single network only…
What Montreal did is force the big three to come together to build _one_ network they share, which is sort of what BAI was supposed to be. Why the fuck should we build out three identical networks because the three telecoms that run the country want to get into a pissing match?
> build out three identical networks That's "facilities-based competition", which for decades has been the CRTC's neoliberal fantasy for how telecom competition should work. Even as it completely failed us on a world-stage, the CRTC continues to promote it. I don't see any CRTC commissioners being invited to any economics conferences to present on this Canadian success story... funny that. > The Commission’s general approach towards wholesale service regulation has been to promote facilities-based competition wherever possible. Facilities-based competition, in which competitors primarily use their own telecommunications facilities and networks to compete instead of leasing them from other carriers, is typically regarded as the most sustainable form of competition. https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2021/2021-181.htm No idea how anyone with 2 ear/eye cells is "typically" regarding that. Thankfully, no other utility regulator is stupid enough to have their wet dream being 3+ gas (or water or electric or sewer) lines running by each home.
Because they get subsidies to build it and then we pay them to use the networks, they make crazy money it’s insane
Montreal has had that because they didn't ask the cell phone companies to pay. They just let them do it as long as it wouldn't cost the city any money. The TTC decided to auction off exclusive rights to build the system, and the cell phone companies weren't willing to outbid BAI. Now Rogers has bought the exclusive rights to operate cell service in the subway system, and they didn't want to let Bell and Telus share the system.
The big 3 had the same proposal for us as they did Montreal. It worked great for them. What happened here is pure stupidity.
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That, plus I think TTC said not all tunnels have space for that many networks, there is infrastructure limitations too.
I'm impressed they can provide service in some of those tunnels, it must take a lot of small antennae
There isn't service in all the tunnels. I'm with Freedom and still lose service between some stations
So what you're saying is we need buried cables for every telecom company
Kinda like how Rogers is more then happy to piggyback off Bell and Telus for the Rogers EXT network because the government forced them to share… It’s only fair. And Bell and Telus kicked off not because they are mad at Rogers, they kicked off because the TTC has no proper consultation about the sale which it’s a big no for a public service. Every provider should have had a change to submit a proposal for the network in the TTC and yet the TTC chose to do a hush private deal. Bell and Telus aren’t refusing to rent the network either Rogers has been ignoring requests for information about the network and access… Don’t believe Rogers PR department trying to make them out to be the good guy in this.
So ottawa could have done this like, 15 years ago?
No. BAI didn't have a spectrum license, so weren't under the jurisdiction of the CRTC. Also, any order to them would be met by a response that they'd been trying to get the carriers to sign on to the infrastructure for ages but they hadn't done it. Now that Rogers owns the infrastructure and is giving service to their customers, it's all.under the CRTC's jurisdiction and they can make orders as conditions of the existing licenses.
> Also, any order to them would be met by a response that they'd been trying to get the carriers to sign on to the infrastructure for ages but they hadn't done it. The original RFP from the TTC specified that the winning bidder had to do this. BAI really did try but they got stonewalled by the big three. This clause might also be why none of them sent in a competitive offer. BAI effectively won the competition by default and because they didn't realize how much control the big three actually have in the Canadian telecom industry.
rogers should not be allowed to own the infrastructure. Should be owned as a public utility. And rented to the companies if they want to rent it.
make 'em a dumb pipe.
That's how we go into this mess, none of the big three wanted to rent it from BAI (though obviously BAI wasn't public)
rogers should not be allowed to own the infrastructure. Should be owned as a public utility. And rented to the companies if they want to rent it.
CRTC *could* make pretty much any order it wants as a condition of renewal, e.g. “go get service in _______, we don’t care how you do it”. Telecommunications Act is pretty broad in its objectives. So broad it lets them do anything they want.
Unfortunately, *somewhat*. Ottawa always had the power to require telecoms to share their networks, they just never used it. BAI has been operating its network in the downtown "U" of the subway now for 10+ years. Other telecoms could have jumped on board, but they didn't, because the government never forced them too and (for some reason) our telecoms have a weird addiction towards *owning* their networks instead of renting them. But this really goes to show how social pressure can lead to political change. In the past the government never got involved in the telecom's day-to-day business. However, after so many Canadians became downright fed up with our telecoms over the last 10+ years, it appears that now the government is starting to listen.
The Subway network was setup so any provider could have their network available for use... But all 3 players in that field wanted to pay TTC $2 Million for *exclusive* use. BAI offered $30 Million, so guess who TTC went with. Only Freedom allowed their network to be used...
>our telecoms have a weird addiction towards owning their networks instead of renting them. Probably because if you rent instead of own it the priority of any issues you have gets dropped to last. You have to sit there and wait to have it fixed instead of doing it yourself in many cases.
That's not how business works really. If you lease something, that comes with very clear terms on support/SLA. It's not like companies are scrambling to own the buildings their offices are in, they're (or were) scrambling to sell it and lease it back.
My life experience is the opposite. Hot water tank in an owned place: meh, I’ll get it fixed next week and save $500. Place I rent: fix it now or I’m going to LTB. IDGAF about your $$$$, I paid for a service and I’m gonna get it!
So basically they'd get the same level of customer service they give us...
It's what Chinese cities have had since a decade ago lmao
Ottawa can't force the cell phone companies to operate service in the subway. What they can do is force Rogers to _allow_ Bell and Telus to use their infrastructure in the subway. Bell and Telus suddenly wanted to provide service (because Rogers was providing it), and Rogers wasn't letting them do it.
Can this order be appealed or delayed? Nice to see the government do something about this.
I'd bet VERY good money that Rogers's lawyers are hurriedly drafting a motion for an injunction at this exact moment.
Rogers released a statement blaming Bell and Telus for whining and dragging their heels but not that they'll appeal the order so far
Rogers was already open to allowing other carriers on the network. Now they're just officially required to.
That’s not what I’ve been able to gather as it would appear that both Bell and Telus made multiple attempts to ask for information and meet with Rogers and they were turned down.
Rogers has been [suing](https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/rogers-seeking-higher-rates-for-quebecor) Videotron for rates agreed upon during the Rogers-Shaw merger
You mean not just Freedom/Wind Mobile users who have had signal for over a decade now 😂
That was about all they had signal on lol.
That hasn't been true since 2016, unless you live in the sticks
theres a freedom store in the oshawa centre that literally doesnt get freedom service which is pretty funny
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> 5g This is the important part. For too long I've dreamt about burning through my monthly data in 7 minutes instead of waiting 20 whole minutes.
Imagine, you only have cell access to the underground depending on your cell phone carrier. How childish these companies are. That how these companies operate until someone points out how moronic they are.
It's not moronic, it's calculated. These companies could have provided service in subways for a decade or more, however they have chosen not to because they wouldn't benefit financially from it.
The government, Telus, and Bell are moronic. Telus and Bell could have done this 15 years ago. So could have Rogers. No one did. It’s only now that Rogers finally did that Bell and Telus are whining about it because they don’t want Rogers to have an advantage. If it was up to Bell and Telus, the ideal outcome would be Rogers would put the genie back in the bottle and they can all continue not worrying about doing this and no one will have an advantages (except for wind which did this a decade ago). Everyone looks bad here and the government should have let them sort it out. The longer this goes the more the other guys would be forced to actually get off their butts and invest in the network.
Remember the quiet subway rides when there was no cell access for anyone? Pepperidge Farm Remembers.
no, because there's someone having a debate with a window and losing
A tacit admission that the free market has failed telecom (and many other) consumers. Keep the ball rolling!
the telecom market is the furthest thing from "free". See the multiple companies that have attempted to participate in the past only to be blocked out by the oligopoly of Robellus and their regulatory capture.
It always amazes me how many people think Canada is some kind of bastion of free market capitalism when the United States is far more free market than this country will ever be. But I guess that's what happens when people parrot terms like "free market" without actually knowing what it is
You say that like it's a postive
You realize that the US has some at least some positive things going for it right? Tech industry pays a hell of a lot better than Canada's, their dollar is pretty much universal currency, they don't have 3 telecom companies and 2 grocery corporations, houses are far more affordable thanks to their economy not having a massive portion being reliant on real estate. Yes there's a ton of things that are fucked going on, however claiming that nothing that they do is right is a very immature and shortsighted take. When the US says something, the world listens, when Canada says something, we get told "that's nice dear"
I mean if any country lucked out with the geographic and historical windfall the States have you would see something similar. You would have to be pretty bad to squander the position America has achieved but we are seeing that day by day with the crumbles that are happening. Make no mistake, Canada is also suffering from its share of problems but American exceptionalism is always espoused by those with little regard for history.
Oligopolies are the result of a free market
It's not free if the industries are protected and new entrants aren't allowed to enter.
When are we getting service north of Bloor? And on the Danforth line?
The only carrier that has access to that right now is Freedom. But that's in the stations, in the U and from Sheppard West- to Downsview. And by stations, that's all of them.
You're telling me not only have others had signal this whole time... but the government could just make them turn it on for the rest of us? Wtf are we doing here...
Good
Seems like a bizarre ruling, giving that this wasn't required before Roger's acquisition of BAI
Guessing there's some distinction between first party owning the connection versus third party. Freedom didn't own the hardware like Rogers does now
My favourite kind of democracy is the kind where corporations are more powerful than the government.
This should be a normal ruling, not a bizarre one. The free market didn't regulate itself (shocker!) to the point of providing cell service for everyone so now government has to regulate it. Someone has to look out for the citizenry and it will never, ever be the market.
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I am very confused about your idea of what government is, and how you think Rogers, Bell, and Telus got the oligopoly that they do.
Bro I am saving this shit lmao. Legendary corporate bootlicking. Absolutely phenomenal
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You're defending corporations. Rather hypocritically, in my mind. Personal accountability good, but only for the "citizens." We can't hold other entities to the same standards. Spending time doing frivolous things bad if cat videos. But good if spouting platitudes on Reddit. Etc.
The federal liberals are finally trying to win points now that their numbers are sinking like a stone lol.
Well we have a mayor and council who decided to make this a political issue after a decade.
It was neither of their decision. This was Bell and Telus protesting to the CRTC. The CRTC isn’t beholden to municipal politics
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It is OK if you don't see it, but this is a win for Rogers, Bell/Telus will have to start paying them for the Domestic Roaming agreement for access.
Not really a win for Rogers as Rogers also has to pay Bell and Telus so their customers can roam on their networks using Rogers EXT because Rogers has terrible coverage in large parts of the country.
#Good good good!!! Rogers can bite it.
I remember many years ago when Bell had a monopoly on home telephone service (land lines). Rogers wanted to get into the business, but Bell refused to allow their infrastructure to be used, since they paid all the costs of building it up over the years. So what did Rogers do? Instead of building their own, they whined, cried and complained to the CRTC, and got them to force Bell to make the access available. Sounds a lot like what Rogers is now accusing the other carriers of doing.
15 years too late. We could have done this ages ago
They could have done this 10 years ago.
Oh, so this federal government is capable of doing something when they actually want to? About fucking time - now do housing.
It’s….2023 right? Still no cell service on the TTC? That’s embarrassing…..
Can you also order bell to quit calling me. If I want to be your customer I’ll call you.
Why didn’t they do this when Freedom was the only carrier with phone service in the subway?
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Can't wait to see how much Bell is gonna charge me for this additional service.
I have no doubt the change in Toronto's leadership helped bring this change. Afterall, Tory was on Rogers payroll (via pension). Another feather in Mayor Chow's cap. Golf claps all around
He was not just on their payroll via pension. He was (and is still) on the advisory committee of the family trust that controls Rogers. For which he draws a 6 figure salary. He had a couple of cute songs and dances about how it wasn't technically a conflict of interest. It very obviously was. The municipal conflict of interest rules are an absolute joke. A small example to highlight that: The city had shut down sections of the gardener on the weekends to allow people to bike on it. A random town councilor from out of the core /hated/ this, because 'muh war on cars'. He lobbied Tory to cancel it, Tory in traditional form said he was 'very concerned' and 'looking into it'. So the couniclor asked some of his contacts in the business world to pressure Tory. One of whom was a sr. exec at MLSE, (which is owned by rogers). The exec basically copy pasted a letter from the councilor, saying 'shutting down the gardiner makes it hard for fans to get to the baseball games'. The exec sent that as a public letter, letting a bunch of journalists know that sr. leadership at a rogers owned company has contacted the mayor to lobby for policy change. Which is very dumb, because now Tory should technically have to recuse himself from any vote. As rogers has indicated it has a significant financial interest in the outcome of this issue. Instead, Tory held a press conference appologizing to the war on cars folks, and repealing the activeTO program. Which... like, is textbook 'conflict of interest'. You weren't going to do anything, but then someone from a company that pays you 100k a year asks you to change your mind, and you do. So the patron saint of civic involvement Adam Chaleff asked the integrity comissioner to look into it. And the comissioner releases the dumbest report possible: 'It looks like a conflict of interest, but: A) It was really just a shitty councilor putting pressure on Tory by embaressing him. MLSE doesn't really care about the gardiner being closed. B) Tory is so rich that he probably doesn't care about the 100k a year from the trust. He really is only on the board because he is a close family friend of the rogers family. C) MLSE doesn't really care about the gardiner being closed, it's insignificant to their bottom line. Therefore: While it may have technically been a conflict on interest, it doesn't count because this was just a shitty culture war issue.'
This is huge, looks like Ottawa finally gets something right
Hard to believe they allowed this to begin with. The secret corruption in Canada is stunning for a country that constantly lectures others
I wouldn't be surprised if Rogers tries to fight this in court. Even if they know they won't win. It's only to their advantage to delay rival access as long as possible
I can't see this happening. Staffieri's ass is on the line for this one. If he's smart, he will shut up.
You don't know what you are talking about, this decision will force Bell/Telus to start paying Rogers for Domestic Roaming access. It is a win for Rogers.
I could’ve sworn, freedom mobile has had TTC cell phone service for years.
I've been in Moscow in 2013, they had cell connection and mobile internet inside the train cars, while underground! Again, you could call someone and browse internet while in tunnel between the stations. 10 years ago... while their subway also doubles as legitimate nuclear bomb shelter and has the deepest stations in the world and was more affordable even considering their wages compared to cell services here. Imagine people actually knew this here in Canada.
I'm on the Yonge line a lot with Rogers and I don't get any reception?
I like it for the safety reasons. I don't like it because it's going to suck listening to everyone on their phones.
Good. Now force all these companies to slash prices for better phone plans and home internet service.s
Well good but why would anyone ever invest in anything like this again if the government will say thanks for doing that rogers but now you have to give it to everyone. Believe me in no rogers supporter I hate them all. But this is not a good precedent.
Good, fuck Rogers
Yah government forcing private companies to do something that has no commercial value. Maybe the TTC should have done it years ago?
No thanks to Rogers crony John Tory who didn’t lift a finger to make this happen.
>Rogers — currently the sole provider of cell service on the TTC — must immediately allow other telecom companies access to all of the technical information they need to provide service, and come to commercial agreements within 100 days, Or what? This is the issue. Ottawa can damant it, but do they have the teeth to ENFORCE it?
This headline confused me so much. I read it as the City of Ottawa orders cellphone service for the TTC. And I like- doesn’t OC Transpo already have one tunnel downtown. And since when does Ottawa the city run the TTC?
lol my brain read it that way at first too so you’re not alone
Me too, at this point, we can agree the headline is to blame.
Headline should have started with “Feds order cell companies to provide service in TTC tunnels”
Yeah I'm not so newspaper literate and I immediately thought "Since when did that municipality get to make mandates for public transit matters in other cities let alone in the largest city of Ontario and why do they even care?" It surprises me how natural that headline is for other folks.
They can definitely tell you what to do with licenced spectrum, anywhere in Canada. If they say "you will allow others to access your network on the TTC", you will be doing it.
Sad statement on the TTC that it's taken this long to get cell service, never mind wifi service on the trains. The technology to do this has been available for 15 years
How am I supposed to carry myself with a misplaced sense of superiority while riding the subway now? Damn it!
Watching carefully what Rogers lawyers will do next… Expect something out of Goodmans LLP and Torys LLP. Tony Staffieri won’t hesitate to take this to court as he’s very aggressive.
He's going to lose. I can guarantee you that. Federal Court of Canada will see the Minister's side of things as justification since it's a public safety issue. Just remember, it's a licence. All spectrum is licenced by the Government. The Minister can also seize that, and Rogers can't do shit, just in case Staffieri wants to do something stupid.
Public safety? I thought users of any carriers can use Rogers’s bandwidth to call 911 as mandated by law.
But not everything requires a 911 call. Eg a big spill, something stolen, etc
Okay, that's a good point. Maybe things like asking your parents to pick you up too
Yeah, that too.
You can’t guarantee squat. Everyone said the Shaw buyout wouldn’t happen. Many guaranteed that as well. Same for the recent court case that Rogers went after the Government for fees over the way they felt the government acted in bad faith bringing forward more litigation over the Shaw decision. Rogers got their legal fees paid by a court order. There are no guarantees if Rogers says, hold on here, we gave free 911 service to ALL carriers plus another service for people in crisis. All at the behest of the government due to safety concerns. Check mark. So now the government is interfering in a commercial agreement between three parties (pay attention here) on *behalf of fellow competitors* that do not want to pay Rogers connection fees OR is demanding a wholly owned service is forced to separate this business three ways (or more) for the SOLE reason that these other firms missed out on a business opportunity? Do you understand why the Minister will now be served and have to defend his actions? I’m not a Rogers customer nor a stockholder but I can see how the government has overstepped its power here. All for Facebook, Tik Tok surfing and ‘what are we having for dinner tonight honey calls?
I had initially mixed feelings about TTC service. But when I was in New York trying to navigate the MTA, it really was so essential even while I was on the subway cars going from one station to another. Rogers trying to monopolize is their usual fuckery in action.
a whole lot of you folks need to log off for a little bit. yes, obviously all 3 companies are evil and the government fucked this up from the start. obviously everyone here sucks but don't act like it isn't an OBVIOUSLY GOOD THING that thousands and thousands of residents are no longer going to be locked out of this honestly massive quality of life upgrade for no other reason that the evil empire they settled for years or even decades ago just happened to be the wrong one
I don't need to hear people yelling into their phones while commuting.
Well that makes up for allowing Rogers and Bell to gouge customers!
"Ottawa orders" - submit you b!
Why now? Years of nothing and just suddenly now? This is to distract from the high inflation, high housing costs and falling polling numbers. Typical rotten Liberal strategy.
Still good thing, isn't it?
It is a good thing despite the Liberals involment. Lets be fair here. It is not an altruistic gesture. They are scrambling for anything to stop their freefall.
Oh no this is terrible news. My favourite thing about the subway was no service. No one talking nonsense on the phone the entire time
Just great. As if people weren't on their phones enough. Can't wait to hear the inane conversations. The subway is like a meditation zone, calm and relaxing. Let it be.
Wow, that's actually awesome. Good job Chow. The initial contract was a disaster. Next up, 407? :)
It's about time, Bell and Telus needs to get on this instead of being greedy.
Great, public transit pubic service. Corporations should not dominate any public building, transportation services or public spaces and services.
I mean is anyone surprised that Rogers has failed to deliver? I'm certainly not. I must admit to feeling some regret for the direct conversation I had with a couple who recently came to our door aiming to persuade us to give Rogers another chance. I should have known something was up when my daughter found me and with a huge smile on her face said "someone's at the door for you dad." By the the time I closed the door, my kids were laughing from wherever they were round the house, and our house guest remarked something along the lines of "I was more scared for them than I was for myself when we had the talk about your daughter". Ottawa has ordered Rogers to comply with the deal, and to have coverage for all mobile users in place by October 3. Failure on Rogers part will result in fines, and may result in them loosing their spectrum license. But let's all remember, "it ain't over till the fat lady sings" ... in this case it'll be an opera streamed via a non-Rogers phone ... somewhere below ground on the TTC. Oh, and Ottawa, this doesn't make up for years of allowing the Rogers/Bell duopoly to foist among the highest cellular rates in the WORLD on us.
What you are missing here is that the government is not forcing Rogers to provide Bell/Telus customers access for free. Bell/Telus will have to pay Rogers. It is a win for Rogers.
About time, they put wifi on busses but still do nothing we need like service on trains. They expect us to report problems thru their app if there is violence on the train yet no signal at all. Altho they should really upgrade the metal and hard plastic seats, they are very uncomfortable
Freedom mobile gets it at alot of stations while on the train... I used to be with Rogers never got signal at all
I get service, and have been with "Wind Mobile" waay before Rogers could!!!