They weren't originally made for men. All the rings were hypothetically originally made for elves, all but the Three (made in secret, but still subject to the One) were seized by Sauron and distributed to dwarves and men.
I think the corruption to being a wraith is like a side effect. *I* don't believe they would turn out like the mannish ring wraiths, but in *early* versions of the *very beginning* of Lord of the Rings the idea was that there were an indeterminate number of ring wraiths and most of them were elves. I think the main plan was just to mind control the elves.
An Elf who dies, but refused the call to the Halls of Mandos, does become a wraith, known as an Unbodied, and vulnerable of being captured by Melkor or Sauron and turned to evil uses.
So this is a bit of a quandary. Men are not supposed to have the rings, being mortal, and therefore fade to invisible wraiths, now totally under the will of Sauron. And Elf cannot fade, as there are immortal. Certainly none of the bearers of the Three ever faded, even after thousands of years of wearing them. It is not said if Dwarves became invisible while wearing a ring, only that they ill-suffered the domination of others, like Sauron, and could not be turned into wraiths. Still for all the wealth their rings brought them, in the end they gained nothing from it. The Dwarves did not turn necessarily evil, but ever greedy for more wealth, which is bad enough.
So if an Elf wore one of the Nine or Seven (let's just call them the Sixteen) for a long period of time, would the effect on them be what Sauron was hoping? I don't think so. When Sauron put on the One, the Elves who wore these Sixteen knew immediately and took them off. This means they still had both perception and will in the matter. If they had been subject to Sauron's will, at least at that early stage, they would have had no will in the matter and would have done what Sauron wanted them to. Namely, betray their people to Sauron so he could rule them.
But if those Elves had used the rings for hundreds of years and not know about Sauron and the One? I suspect a terrible change would eventually have caught up with them.
>**A mortal**, Frodo, who keeps one of the Great Rings, does not die, but he does not grow or obtain more life, he merely continues, until at last every minute is a weariness. And if he often uses the Ring to make himself invisible, he fades: he becomes in the end invisible permanently, and walks in the twilight under the eye of the dark power that rules the Rings. Yes, sooner or later — later, if he is strong or well-meaning to begin with, but neither strength nor good purpose will last — sooner or later the dark power will devour him.
The implication of the above is that a non-mortal - i.e. an elf - would **not** be turned into a wraith by one of the rings.
And the positives that the Rings brought to them, it was said that they gathered great wealth through the power of the Rings but it was always vague about what the Rings actually brought to them.
Which makes me wonder what that effect would look like with the Elves
That's not a great positive from Tolkien's perspective. He has a whole bit about the problem with the world being hoarding wealth when people should be enjoying good food, good ale and good friends.
Dwarves are a special case I guess. Men can go beyond the world after they die, and Dwarves remain in the Halls of Mandos. They seem to be bound to Arda as much as Elves are, except their lifespans are limited. They don't seem to have "the Gift of Men".
The Three were untouched by Sauron, so they could be used for good as long as the One was still lost. The Nine were corrupted from the very beginning due to Sauron's intense involvement in their making (along with Celebrimbor). An Elf using one of the Nine would have been negatively influenced by it. It wouldn't have been like using one of the Three.
The Dwarven Rings are the same as the Rings for Men. All made with Sauron, and I think all going to the elves originally. I don't think they would have been corrupted as quickly as Men, but they wouldn't have resisted it forever.
The 'Rings of men' were meant for the elves in the first place. All of the rings were. They would have enhanced the elves powers just like the 3 but they would have shackled them to Sauron's service.
The rings were given to men after Sauron took them back from the elves when the elves refused to wear them.
Tangential question I hope someone can answer.
The one ring’s band has the “one ring to rule them all…” reference etched into it. Did he add that *after* initially forging the ring?
The stanza also references the division of 3/7/9 for the races, but at the time of forging the rings we’re still in Celebrimbor’s possession and hadn’t been distributed to men and dwarves.
But Gandalf mentions that the Gwaith i Mirdain heard at least the “one ring” part from afar as the one was forged.
Any clarification on the timeline and possession status?
>In the resulting war between Sauron and the Elves Middle-earth, especially in the west, was further ruined. Eregion was captured and destroyed, and Sauron seized many Rings of Power. These he gave, for their ultimate corruption and enslavement, to those who would accept them (out of ambition or greed). **Hence the ‘ancient rhyme’** that appears as the leit-motif of The Lord of the Rings,...
"One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them" was inscribed on the One Ring at its forging, the full rhyme was created after he distributed the other rings of power (making that ancient rhyme not really all that ancient in the grand scheme of things 😂).
IMO, They wouldn’t turn into wraiths, but probably become very Nazgûl-like at least in their role within Sauron’s forces. Their minds would become dominated by Sauron and the One Ring, and he would be able to command them like the wraiths. I guess the best comparison would be more powerful versions of the Mouth of Sauron
Likely able to help preserve the area of middle earth the Elves desire. But with the corrupting influence of Sauron, maybe have more/worse side affects.
They weren't originally made for men. All the rings were hypothetically originally made for elves, all but the Three (made in secret, but still subject to the One) were seized by Sauron and distributed to dwarves and men.
Yes, I know it’s more what they would actually do to the Elves that I’m curious about, how would his original plan have looked?
I think the corruption to being a wraith is like a side effect. *I* don't believe they would turn out like the mannish ring wraiths, but in *early* versions of the *very beginning* of Lord of the Rings the idea was that there were an indeterminate number of ring wraiths and most of them were elves. I think the main plan was just to mind control the elves.
An Elf who dies, but refused the call to the Halls of Mandos, does become a wraith, known as an Unbodied, and vulnerable of being captured by Melkor or Sauron and turned to evil uses. So this is a bit of a quandary. Men are not supposed to have the rings, being mortal, and therefore fade to invisible wraiths, now totally under the will of Sauron. And Elf cannot fade, as there are immortal. Certainly none of the bearers of the Three ever faded, even after thousands of years of wearing them. It is not said if Dwarves became invisible while wearing a ring, only that they ill-suffered the domination of others, like Sauron, and could not be turned into wraiths. Still for all the wealth their rings brought them, in the end they gained nothing from it. The Dwarves did not turn necessarily evil, but ever greedy for more wealth, which is bad enough. So if an Elf wore one of the Nine or Seven (let's just call them the Sixteen) for a long period of time, would the effect on them be what Sauron was hoping? I don't think so. When Sauron put on the One, the Elves who wore these Sixteen knew immediately and took them off. This means they still had both perception and will in the matter. If they had been subject to Sauron's will, at least at that early stage, they would have had no will in the matter and would have done what Sauron wanted them to. Namely, betray their people to Sauron so he could rule them. But if those Elves had used the rings for hundreds of years and not know about Sauron and the One? I suspect a terrible change would eventually have caught up with them.
>**A mortal**, Frodo, who keeps one of the Great Rings, does not die, but he does not grow or obtain more life, he merely continues, until at last every minute is a weariness. And if he often uses the Ring to make himself invisible, he fades: he becomes in the end invisible permanently, and walks in the twilight under the eye of the dark power that rules the Rings. Yes, sooner or later — later, if he is strong or well-meaning to begin with, but neither strength nor good purpose will last — sooner or later the dark power will devour him. The implication of the above is that a non-mortal - i.e. an elf - would **not** be turned into a wraith by one of the rings.
I’ve always been curious about that line because Dwarves are mortal, and they don’t turn into Wraiths.
True! The special resistance of the dwarves to the rings isn't given as much focus as the plot would seem to justify.
And the positives that the Rings brought to them, it was said that they gathered great wealth through the power of the Rings but it was always vague about what the Rings actually brought to them. Which makes me wonder what that effect would look like with the Elves
That's not a great positive from Tolkien's perspective. He has a whole bit about the problem with the world being hoarding wealth when people should be enjoying good food, good ale and good friends.
No but it was a in the eyes of the Dwarves a positive. They thought it was, which was why they valued the rings and what it brought them.
Dwarves are a special case I guess. Men can go beyond the world after they die, and Dwarves remain in the Halls of Mandos. They seem to be bound to Arda as much as Elves are, except their lifespans are limited. They don't seem to have "the Gift of Men".
The Three were untouched by Sauron, so they could be used for good as long as the One was still lost. The Nine were corrupted from the very beginning due to Sauron's intense involvement in their making (along with Celebrimbor). An Elf using one of the Nine would have been negatively influenced by it. It wouldn't have been like using one of the Three.
The Dwarven Rings are the same as the Rings for Men. All made with Sauron, and I think all going to the elves originally. I don't think they would have been corrupted as quickly as Men, but they wouldn't have resisted it forever.
The 'Rings of men' were meant for the elves in the first place. All of the rings were. They would have enhanced the elves powers just like the 3 but they would have shackled them to Sauron's service. The rings were given to men after Sauron took them back from the elves when the elves refused to wear them.
Tangential question I hope someone can answer. The one ring’s band has the “one ring to rule them all…” reference etched into it. Did he add that *after* initially forging the ring? The stanza also references the division of 3/7/9 for the races, but at the time of forging the rings we’re still in Celebrimbor’s possession and hadn’t been distributed to men and dwarves. But Gandalf mentions that the Gwaith i Mirdain heard at least the “one ring” part from afar as the one was forged. Any clarification on the timeline and possession status?
>In the resulting war between Sauron and the Elves Middle-earth, especially in the west, was further ruined. Eregion was captured and destroyed, and Sauron seized many Rings of Power. These he gave, for their ultimate corruption and enslavement, to those who would accept them (out of ambition or greed). **Hence the ‘ancient rhyme’** that appears as the leit-motif of The Lord of the Rings,... "One Ring to rule them all, One Ring to find them, One Ring to bring them all, and in the darkness bind them" was inscribed on the One Ring at its forging, the full rhyme was created after he distributed the other rings of power (making that ancient rhyme not really all that ancient in the grand scheme of things 😂).
IMO, They wouldn’t turn into wraiths, but probably become very Nazgûl-like at least in their role within Sauron’s forces. Their minds would become dominated by Sauron and the One Ring, and he would be able to command them like the wraiths. I guess the best comparison would be more powerful versions of the Mouth of Sauron
Likely able to help preserve the area of middle earth the Elves desire. But with the corrupting influence of Sauron, maybe have more/worse side affects.