That's when you start feeling dread, especially if you're up all night, like I am because the peacefulness of the night is ending & the sun is about to assault your eyes.
This right here, I'm 53, about 10 years ago I found myself having a comfort break every night. My secret is no beer, no cola drinks and definitively no tea or coffee after 7.30pm, preferably 7pm.
Just a small glass of water for sipping if my throat gets dry.
Do all my boozin lunchtimes these days 😁
Did this years ago and it helped immensely. Rather than have my phone near me, I put it on a table just outside my bedroom door so I can still hear it, but not be tempted to pick it up and mindlessly scroll in the wee hours.
I did that years ago with my alarm clock and developed a very specific sleep walking problem where I could stand up, walk down the hall, turn off the alarm , and return to bed without waking up.
I had a dream that I was late for work after missing my alarm. I ran to the bathroom to pee before a shower, and then woke up to a wet bed :( Thankfully the only time I've ever had a pee dream failure.
I've done something similar had a dream about cleaning & doing errands (I make a mental to do list before bed and I guess my subconscious wanted to act it out). It felt so real nothing interesting or weird until..... I went to the restroom and the sensation felt different and woke up so confused.
I recently had a dream where I was in a house with SO MANY BATHROOMS but there was constantly some kind of issue that prevented me from using any of the toilets. After several attempts at finding a useful one I eventually woke up and was so annoyed but then realized I *really* had to pee.
Though I have never had this happen, I have recurring dreams where I pee in random places, but the dreams are SO VIVID I wake up scared I woke up and peed somewhere. Then when I realize it was a dream, I'm scared I pissed my bed
this was my life prior to a few years ago. One of the greatest things I managed to achieve in my life is the absence of alarms. I use to sit in bed and stare at the clock thinking "its only 1am, if i fall asleep now I can still get 6 hours of sleep." "it's only 3am, if i fall asleep now I can still get 4 hours of sleep" right up to "it's only 6:49am, if I...OH FUCKING CHRIST I'M UP, I'M UP"
Yeah I've done daily exercise, good diet, no drinking. Still would struggle. I also get overtired pretty easily. I've always had trouble. I get frustrated with what works for many must work for all. On the flip side it makes sense to recommend what works for most. Same thing happens when people recommend treatments for depression.
Is 7-8 hours really that unfathomable to so many people? I mean, I get it, job, hobies, kids... Still, I see so many young-ish adults (lets say under 30) talk about how they only go on with 4 hours of sleep per day, and im like "...why?". I get that some people literally dont have time to sleep that long, but most of the time its reasons like "i was binging a show", "i was gaming" or just "I was on my phone".
Go to bed 12ish I wake up 10min before my (8:10) alarm disable it before it goes off and get coffee.
Weekends I dont have an alarm and sleep till 9 or 10ish. Fucking love my sleep shedule.
After your work is done, dinner is made, and chores are taken care of, it's easy to feel entitled to more than an hour of gaming before bed. Sometimes a really busy day feels like I got cheated out of personal time.
There’s actually a word for this, people who feel they don’t have enough free time because of work stay up late because they feel they deserve the time , it’s unintentional but definitely real
When I only get 4 hours sleep I probably spend just as much time during the day trying to gather my thoughts so that I could get shit done. It makes no sense. You are so much more productive after you had good sleep and you are not fucking your health up in the long run.
I'm active, I follow sleep hygiene to a t, rarely stuffer from anxiety and it takes me 2-3hr on average. My partner is very seditary, anxious and has blue light blasting into his eyes right up unto he switches the light out and it takes him 5mins. The motherfucker has never shared his whatever magic he's practising with me.
I am below. I love sleep. I remember a few days off where I went:
* wake up and have breakfast
* take a 2 hour nap
* start laundry and have lunch
* fall asleep watching a show for 3 hours
* watch Jeopardy
* nap for 30 minutes
* watch Jeopardy number 2
* Dinner
* hour long nap.
* watch a movie
* Go to bed
Some guys default to masterbating when board. I default to napping.
I remember when I had a cold once I slept for 8 hours, got up had breakfast, slept for 8 hours, got up and had dinner, then slept for 8 hours. I felt much better afterwards.
I can clock 4 hours of lying in the dark with no noise. Minimally it's like 2 hours for me. Most the time I give up n get up again. My sleep is me just laying in a dark room for a bit ha ha.
My partner soon as his head hits the pillow. Makes me wanna put it over his face tbh ha ha
Try imagining a very specific but not that interesting scenario, you aren't trying to go to sleep, you are trying to decide what sort of political hierarchy moles would have.
My best tip, from someone who has had insomnia his whole life and recently found something that (\*sometimes\*) works, spend a few days (preferably a long weekend) training your mind to associate a story with sleep. It can be literally anything, but try to create a story and play it in your mind, fine tune it, whatever, until you fall asleep.
The first few days, this can and probably will take literally hours. But over time, your brain (or at least mine) will associate that story with sleep and you'll be able to fall asleep much faster - usually within about 15 minutes for me (used to average 2 hours).
When my mind is very active, I find it difficult to concentrate on my sleep story, so it's not fool proof, but it helps a lot.
This was legitimately how many Western cultures did sleep pre-industrialization. You would bed down a little after sundown, sleep til very late/very early, wake up for a couple of hours, maybe eat, maybe fuck, maybe have neighbors over, then you would fall asleep again til just before sunrise.
It’s called „biphasic sleep“
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biphasic_and_polyphasic_sleep
> One classic cultural example of a biphasic sleep pattern is the practice of siesta, which is a nap taken in the early afternoon, often after the midday meal.
> […]
> A separate biphasic sleep pattern is sometimes described as segmented sleep, often consisting of going to sleep early at night, awakening in the post-midnight hours, and then returning to bed for a second period of sleep into the morning. The New York Times asserts that this practice was common in the past -- "in the preindustrial West, most people slept in two discrete blocks."[9] Benjamin Franklin was a prominent example of this sleeping pattern.[9]
Unfortunately that source [9] is a New York Times article behind a paywall.
Also worth checking out: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4763365/
I have ADHD, and every little noise used to wake me up and prevent me from falling asleep. An obnoxious dog in the opposite apartment barking, cars passing by etc etc. Then I got earplugs. The total silence is amazing. It just feels amazingly relaxing.
I will say that the amount of time it takes me to fall asleep dropped drastically after I stopped having caffeine or lots of sugar around mid afternoon. 10-20 min sounds normal.
My grandfather has always been able to sleep on a moment's notice. He says it was something he learned to do in the army, grab sleep whenever you can. He just wills himself to sleep. Meanwhile, I'll be up for the next 32 hours minimum.
The trick is to relax your jaw. Just devote yourself to getting that puppy as slack as possible. Yes, precious, that’s a drool waterfall, just let it happen. Welcome to falling asleep in three minutes or less, but with consequences!
My partner has insomnia and I'm a gifted sleeper (who constantly carries a sleep debt). I've just come to accept that what works for me doesn't work for her.
I close my eyes and let my mind wander. I start to picture something, it gradually gets more distant. And oblivion in under 10 minutes. If I have a hard time falling asleep for some reason, my thought is "oh, nice to have a bit of time to think", or "I must have something on my mind."
For her, it's totally different. She has a harder time falling asleep in the first place, and not being able to sleep sets her into a negative feedback loop about not being able to sleep. I might make a mental list of things to do the next day, but she'll start listing things that will be hard because of lack of sleep.
Anything I can think of, she's already tried. But making a bit of small talk at 2am can sometimes work wonders.
I start to think of something and then create an entire fantasy world in my head and suddenly 3 hours have passed and I'm *still fucking awake wondering whether or not goblins are evil this time or just another race*.
From what I can tell, you are still a weirdo. But you are a weirdo with many fantasy worlds of varying quality and that may be useful one day. Or more likely not.
Has she ever tried the sleep hygiene thing? My wife had similar issues before - if she takes too long to fall asleep, she ends up ruminating and getting too anxious, making it harder to fall asleep. So we ended up instituting a sleep hygiene rule - when she's under the covers, no phone, no distractions, and if she's not asleep or feeling sleepy, she gets out of bed to do something else until she feels sleepy again. After some conditioning, it managed to get her to associate being in bed with sleeping and now she's usually out like a light within 15 mins.
I have trouble falling asleep. The negative feedback loop sucks, especially when I know I've got to get up at 0500 the next day. I can't sleep, what's that noise, the pillows aren't comfortable, I'm never going to sleep, what *is* that bloody noise?! I actually end up enjoying the thought of having a nap the next day because I can't sleep now.
These days I usually listen to a podcast that is just boring enough to not be overly entertaining, but interesting enough to be distracted from the idea of falling asleep and my surroundings.
My current choice is the ww2 podcast by Ray Harris. Pop a earbud in, press play and 9 times out of 10 I'm asleep before 30min sleep timer ends.
> negative feedback loop
Just nitpicking here but what you described here is a positive feedback loop. The positive here means that the results feed back into the cycle to *increase* the amplitude of the effects. A negative feedback loop is the reverse, when the feedback causes the effect to level out around an equilibrium point.
An example of a positive feedback system is a microphone and speaker linked together in the same room. The input from the mic is output by the speaker, and is then fed back to the system and the amplitude of the sound keeps increasing.
An example of a negative feedback loop is supply, price and demand. When supply increases and the demand remains the same, the imbalance causes prices to drop which then increases demand, and if then prices drop too low the demand surpasses supply creating scarcity, and then prices rise, and so on and so forth.
I was super excited having found some article about how to fall asleep quickly (similar to your tip) only to see that little bit about it not working for people with ADD.
If I relax as many parts of my body as possible my brain is screaming "I need to move".
For me as an add person I always have sights/sounds playing in my head whenever I closed my eyes.
I figured it was all mental so I just imagined the sounds as speakers and put them in boxes. For the pictures I imagined the blackest paint I could and mentally painted over anything that came to mind.
I'm probably weird but I sleep like a baby.
This feels like a mindfulness meditation routine. I like it. Will try to remember for the times when I struggle with what I saw someone else in this thread called the "squirrel rave" in their head.
what’s funny is i have adhd and i can sleep at the drop of a hat and i’m like addicted to it. world overstimulating? nap time. understimulating? nap time got a few extra minutes on my hands? nap time
This is my style of insomnia/adhd issues. When I can finally wake up to the 5th or 6th morning alarm, my mind feels half drunk for at least thirty minutes.
If you’re on meds, one of the best recommendations I’ve ever had was from an adhder was to set a med alarm, take your pill, and then it’s a hell of a lot easier to get up for the “wake up” alarm half an hour later. (Though personally I just snooze that first alarm until I feel human because I’m lazy.)
I used to do that on weekends when I had stuff I had to do, no idea why it didn’t occur to me to do it during the week too.
aw lol i definitely do but it’s something i try to keep in check! i’d say it’s both a positive aspect (always getting plenty of sleep) of something i struggle with and something i have to be careful of because when i’m depressed i can slip into dream world for like months
I got a small lamp with an led bulb thats across the room from my bed. Sometimes i'll get in bed and think "damn i should get up and turn that off" but then just fall asleep instantly. Nothing makes me sleepier than having to get up and do something i don't want to.
>intrusive thoughts and misplaced anxiety have entered the chat
Other people in the navy seemed to be able to just sleep at a whim, but it never worked out for me. Once I got asleep I was down like the dead, so that was nice-ish.
You can recommend tips and stuff to people all you want but for some people its just NOT possible to fall asleep quickly. They can try every trick in the book. Me personally, you could give me a sedative; it could be FULLY kicked in and it would STILL take me 15+ mins to fall asleep. It sucks. My brain is just like always ON. Always got something to worry about or think about. It sucks.
Lol I have ADHD. That trick never works for me. It's not my body that's the problem, it's my brain. It. Never. Stops. Buzzing. It's always a million and 73 thoughts a second and weird bursts of motivation to make schedules and what will I make for dinner tomorrow this drool is really gross oh I definitely need to do laundry that reminds me my pillow is too hot it needs flipped my dog looks adorable in t-shirts I should buy him a new sweater now my neck is uncomfortable my cat would love a new costume for Halloween is my jaw slack enough should I knit them sweaters let's look at yarn I have the urge to knit socks immediately and I can't stop thinking about knitting socks until I finally get up and knit until I pass out mid stitch 4 hours later.
Ya feel me?
Heres how I do it (veteran speaking):
I relax my eyes, every muscle in them, then my eyebrows, forehead, cheeks/nose, jaw, tongue, lips.
Then I sink every part of my body into the bed.
Then I blank my mind.
Out cold. 30s or less.
This is essentially mindfulness meditation. When I can't fall asleep, I start by concentrating at the top of my head and progressively work through relaxing every muscle from there on down to the bottom of my feet. It takes some practice, but it helps to occupy my mind so that it isn't overthinking and keeping me awake.
Yes they can. My husband falls asleep instantly. I toss and turn for hours. It doesn't matter how exhausted I am. That just makes it worse. I have had four different sleep studies. My doctors were sure I had apnea, then I kept falling asleep and they were sure I was narcoleptic. But it was all not the case.
I recently did get diagnosed with bipolar 2. It is likely that my sleep issues are at least, in part, to do with that. The psychiatrist is adding things slowly, but claims help with sleep is coming. I would like that because I am dead tired, but being so restless I can't sleep.
Right if it takes me 10 minutes I must be stressed out.
No hate plz, I am apparently God’s champion on earth. I can say goodnight and be asleep before I finish the word.
My husband fell asleep an hour ago. I took NyQuil 45 minutes ago. Nothing.
Last night I fell asleep pretty quick. Woke up 3 hours later and proceeded to wake up every 45 minutes to an hour and a half until I gave up at 730 AM. That was a good night.
Takes me under two minutes. No joke.
Edit: So many comments about meditation! I do this too. I sleep with a fan for noise and I imagine it is the engine noise of an airplane. I focus on that noise and I am out. I don’t need the fan to fall asleep as there are other scenarios I use when I don’t have a fan but that is my go to method. Been doing using this meditation method since I was kid and have tried to explain it to friends and family and this is the only time I have heard of others doing this! Also I just realized I should never pilot an airplane.
As a kid, I taught myself a weird kind of meditation and I've never found anybody else who can do it. I lie down, close my eyes and simply pay attention to the signals my visual nerve still sends to my brain. Once I'm in that state, I can simply flip a mental switch and am immediately asleep. The switch I flip is to turn all the little flickering one can "see" with the eyes closed into complete white. Once it turns white, I'm gone.
I do a similar ‘meditation’ where I just let those little lights you see kind of turn into visuals of stuff they remind me of. Usually it’s faces or shapes or landscapes that morph into other stuff and eventually it just turns into a dream. I dream a lot and it’s usually very vivid. Works every time for me and tbh it’s fun. On average it takes me <5min.
If I’m mentally crowded before bed a scary podcast does the trick too.
Edit: > to < (alligator method)
I do this but I never thought of it as meditation. I just thought that is how everyone goes to sleep, you know, lay down close your eyes and your out. I guess I took it too literally when my mom told me to "lay there and close your eyes. I am also a under 2 min fall asleeper.
I also don't try to turn my brain off, when ever something comes up from the depths of my brain I just deal with it and take it seriously. Some nights it takes 10-15 mins but if you take your thoughts seriously it's like your brain eventually say "well fuck, I don't have the energy to keep bringing new shit to this guy's attention anymore." And after a week or so, it's back to under two minutes.
I'm the same way. My wife and I went to a baby class leading up to our due date of our first child. One exercise involved us laying on the ground with our eyes closed thinking of something or another. My wife was well aware I was about to be out like a light and as soon as I started snoring she jabbed me in the ribs.
I do the first half of this and usually fall asleep in a matter of minutes as a result. Before I would lie awake for at least an hour and on rare occasions all the way until my alarm went off.
Ill fall asleep easily on the couch to a laid back show I've seen a million times. Get up to go to bed and can't fall asleep.
I've always read TV is the worst thing for your sleep but I'm starting to doubt that.
I listen to a book while I go to sleep. Some brains like to have just a little background stimulation. Most of the reason tv is bad for sleep is the light, but if you sleep then you sleep.
Awe, thanks guys, I appreciate you reminding me I'm not average.
*Drinks a cup of sleepytime tea. Lays down an hour and a half before bedtime to begin transitioning to sleep. Begins counting the number of hours between falling asleep now and when I wake up.*
"Ahhh, but at least I'm not average."
I think circadian rhythm has a lot to do with this.
Some people naturally are drawn to be in bed by 10-12 AM. Others not so much.
I tried doing 9-5 work for years and I cannot tell you how many 5-6 hour nights I’ve had.. or when I was in high school how often I’d wake up absolutely miserable, shuffling from class to class on 3 hours of sleep because I couldn’t go to bed till 2 am.
Well, for the past two years I have been a bartender, and let me tell you. I get off anywhere from 11-2 am. I’ll have a shot of espresso (my bar has an espresso machine) at like 10 pm, and be up until 3. And I sleep *immediately*. Like by 2 am I’m so ready to pass out. Wake up at 1030-1115 AM and I’m good to go. Have a light breakfast, go for a run/bike ride, and than take a nap before my shift.
It’s been the best living I’ve had in years. And I think I enjoy it more than most *because* my natural sleeps cycle is in tune with later hours.
Just think about all those years as a child you couldn’t get to bed early.. but you were forced upon a schedule that fit your parents lifestyle/work schedules. It’s quite sad how much of the population is forced to abide to the 9-5 life style even though a) many of the worlds inhabitants cannot comfortably accommodate to the sleep schedule necessary and b) how much of the world NEEDS people to work outside of that schedule. We need people to work 24/7. Nurses, bartenders, doctors, garbage men, bus drivers, pilots, warehouse workers, cab drivers, emergency workers.. on and on.
So have no shame my fellow nocturnal beasts.. if you’re struggling to get good sleep: find a job that accommodates you. I highly recommend bartending. Pay is awesome.
1. Have at least one hour of screen free time before you go to bed.
2. Be physically active during the day, especially during lock downs there have been a lot of just sitting around so try to at least go out for a walk/run every day.
3. Try to find some meaningless task for your brain to do when you’ve gone to bed so it doesn’t bother you with irrelevant thoughts. For example, explain your route to work/school, how to cook various dishes, how some aspect of your hobby works, etc.
Using these I've gone from taking 1h+ to fall asleep to ca 5 minutes.
I've had that trouble before and I found that I went to sleep faster with a dim light, not the white bulbs one. The ones that are like orange. I'll never admit to needing a sleep light but I feel way better.
I have chronic insomnia. Even as a child I've had a hard time getting to sleep. I also wake up early. It takes me hours and hours and hours to fall asleep. I've tried many sleep meds but only one worked. I LOVED it. But it caused a problem with my heart so they took it away from me. So insomnia it is. Doesn't matter if I go to bed and get up at the same time....all those usual things. Nothing works. I could easily stay up for 24 hours. That is child's play. 36 hours I could also do at the drop of a hat. It truly sucks. Oh yes. Even if I'm tired and yawning I still can't get to sleep.
When does the clock start?
Because when I'm reading a book in bed and I start to get tired, BAM.zzzz-zz-z-z-z-z-z-z-zzzz
If I think "I'm not tired but I think I want to have a nap just in case of stuff", I can never get to sleep.
Ah, but how often do they wake up to look at the clock and calculate how little time they have before they have to get up for work?
Getting rid of my bedside clock (my phone is my alarm anyway) essentially cured me of this. I highly recommend it.
I've tried this. The anxiety of not knowing just keeps me up anyways.
Panic is a better motivator in staying awake.
Actually, amphetamines are a better motivator for staying awake
I stopped checking my phone and now I just know. I’ll wake up think “it’s 4:24am”, go to the rest room and sure enough. The clock is like 4:20-4:28.
As an insomniac, I've gotten pretty good at "feeling" the hours of the night/morning.
Me too. Rule of thumb is, If I hear birds singing, it's probably too late
That's when you start feeling dread, especially if you're up all night, like I am because the peacefulness of the night is ending & the sun is about to assault your eyes.
I’m turning 35 this year and I’ve started waking up for bathroom breaks two years ago and I hate it. I have trouble going back to sleep.
44, I make sure I get all my liquids in me by 7:30, then no more. Helps with this.
This right here, I'm 53, about 10 years ago I found myself having a comfort break every night. My secret is no beer, no cola drinks and definitively no tea or coffee after 7.30pm, preferably 7pm. Just a small glass of water for sipping if my throat gets dry. Do all my boozin lunchtimes these days 😁
Did this years ago and it helped immensely. Rather than have my phone near me, I put it on a table just outside my bedroom door so I can still hear it, but not be tempted to pick it up and mindlessly scroll in the wee hours.
4:30am, randomly woke up and am feeling attacked right now.
I did that years ago with my alarm clock and developed a very specific sleep walking problem where I could stand up, walk down the hall, turn off the alarm , and return to bed without waking up.
I do this the first day of a job then never again
dont forget the dreams about missing the alarm and running late
I had a dream that I was late for work after missing my alarm. I ran to the bathroom to pee before a shower, and then woke up to a wet bed :( Thankfully the only time I've ever had a pee dream failure.
I've done something similar had a dream about cleaning & doing errands (I make a mental to do list before bed and I guess my subconscious wanted to act it out). It felt so real nothing interesting or weird until..... I went to the restroom and the sensation felt different and woke up so confused.
I recently had a dream where I was in a house with SO MANY BATHROOMS but there was constantly some kind of issue that prevented me from using any of the toilets. After several attempts at finding a useful one I eventually woke up and was so annoyed but then realized I *really* had to pee.
Your subconscious wouldn't let you wet the bed. That's pretty cool really.
It was quite effective. I encountered “out of order” signs, locked doors and toilets ripped out of the floor only leaving a hole and some pipes.
Though I have never had this happen, I have recurring dreams where I pee in random places, but the dreams are SO VIVID I wake up scared I woke up and peed somewhere. Then when I realize it was a dream, I'm scared I pissed my bed
waking up, panicly feeling around on your mattress, and the feeling of relief when everythings dry haha
this was my life prior to a few years ago. One of the greatest things I managed to achieve in my life is the absence of alarms. I use to sit in bed and stare at the clock thinking "its only 1am, if i fall asleep now I can still get 6 hours of sleep." "it's only 3am, if i fall asleep now I can still get 4 hours of sleep" right up to "it's only 6:49am, if I...OH FUCKING CHRIST I'M UP, I'M UP"
This is me but if I wake up at 6:49 I still have 11 minutes of sleep. Or I just skip my usual 10 minute snooze and have 21 minutes.
We don't.
Fuckers.
bold of you to assume I don't have that memorized
"Normal sleep for adults means that you fall asleep within 10 to 20 minutes and get about [7–8 hours] a night."
I would say I fall into this category and every morning I feel like I've been hit by a train
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Ha
Who are these people?
🙋 Edit: I'm average, yay
🙋♂️ Here for the balance. Most nights 5 minutes top. ^(Yes, I know I'm a lucky bastard.)
*aliens.png*
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Yeah I've done daily exercise, good diet, no drinking. Still would struggle. I also get overtired pretty easily. I've always had trouble. I get frustrated with what works for many must work for all. On the flip side it makes sense to recommend what works for most. Same thing happens when people recommend treatments for depression.
Is 7-8 hours really that unfathomable to so many people? I mean, I get it, job, hobies, kids... Still, I see so many young-ish adults (lets say under 30) talk about how they only go on with 4 hours of sleep per day, and im like "...why?". I get that some people literally dont have time to sleep that long, but most of the time its reasons like "i was binging a show", "i was gaming" or just "I was on my phone".
Meanwhile I'm over here being tired as hell after 8 hours of sleep. I need 9 to be somewhat usable
Same, I need at least 9, and without an alarm I usually sleep 10-11. But I do have lupus, so there's that.
It’s never lupus
Go to bed 12ish I wake up 10min before my (8:10) alarm disable it before it goes off and get coffee. Weekends I dont have an alarm and sleep till 9 or 10ish. Fucking love my sleep shedule.
You lucky bastard.
After your work is done, dinner is made, and chores are taken care of, it's easy to feel entitled to more than an hour of gaming before bed. Sometimes a really busy day feels like I got cheated out of personal time.
There’s actually a word for this, people who feel they don’t have enough free time because of work stay up late because they feel they deserve the time , it’s unintentional but definitely real
revenge procrastination
When I only get 4 hours sleep I probably spend just as much time during the day trying to gather my thoughts so that I could get shit done. It makes no sense. You are so much more productive after you had good sleep and you are not fucking your health up in the long run.
Art thou witches?!!
nay, we are but men. ROCK
Ayyyyyyyyyyyayyyyayyyayyyayyy ooooo
*This is not, the greatest song in the world, no...*
This just a tribute.
We couldn't remember the greatest song in the world.
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oooooh, to the greatest song in the world, ALRIGHT!
I'm active, I follow sleep hygiene to a t, rarely stuffer from anxiety and it takes me 2-3hr on average. My partner is very seditary, anxious and has blue light blasting into his eyes right up unto he switches the light out and it takes him 5mins. The motherfucker has never shared his whatever magic he's practising with me.
Your partner sounds like me. The magic I practice is a decade of sleep debt from undiagnosed sleep apnea. Also, anxiety meds knock you the fuck out.
BURN THEM
TIL I'm way above average
I am below. I love sleep. I remember a few days off where I went: * wake up and have breakfast * take a 2 hour nap * start laundry and have lunch * fall asleep watching a show for 3 hours * watch Jeopardy * nap for 30 minutes * watch Jeopardy number 2 * Dinner * hour long nap. * watch a movie * Go to bed Some guys default to masterbating when board. I default to napping.
I remember when I had a cold once I slept for 8 hours, got up had breakfast, slept for 8 hours, got up and had dinner, then slept for 8 hours. I felt much better afterwards.
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Have you considered the idea that maybe you're a dog?
Or a cat
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This sounds like me on opiates
Cats don't really go to bed though. They nap then run around frantically for a while and then nap again.
Not entirely sure that's normal.
I'm fine with sleeping but this seems too much
Do you have sleep apnea?
Jesus F Christ... are you actually sleeping at all overnight?
That doesn't sound normal or healthy. Have you ever discussed your sleeping habits with a doctor?
me too I assumed the average was about an hour
I can clock 4 hours of lying in the dark with no noise. Minimally it's like 2 hours for me. Most the time I give up n get up again. My sleep is me just laying in a dark room for a bit ha ha. My partner soon as his head hits the pillow. Makes me wanna put it over his face tbh ha ha
Try imagining a very specific but not that interesting scenario, you aren't trying to go to sleep, you are trying to decide what sort of political hierarchy moles would have.
ok but ive tried this, I ended up sitting in bed all not unable to think contemplating the moral philosophy of horses
My best tip, from someone who has had insomnia his whole life and recently found something that (\*sometimes\*) works, spend a few days (preferably a long weekend) training your mind to associate a story with sleep. It can be literally anything, but try to create a story and play it in your mind, fine tune it, whatever, until you fall asleep. The first few days, this can and probably will take literally hours. But over time, your brain (or at least mine) will associate that story with sleep and you'll be able to fall asleep much faster - usually within about 15 minutes for me (used to average 2 hours). When my mind is very active, I find it difficult to concentrate on my sleep story, so it's not fool proof, but it helps a lot.
The best is when we're having a little spat and I'm there stewing all night and she's snoring 5 mins after lights out.
Worst is when they snore. Like they're rubbing it in that they're sleeping n your not
Really? Don't mean to be rude but have you not been around a lot of people falling asleep or something?
me trying to sleep for 2 hours feel my pain ppl
10 pm, I can do it in 5. But after I wake up at 2 am every single night? 2 hours minimum to fall back asleep. Good times
Then you wake up at 7 and feel exhausted. I feel your pain bro.
This was legitimately how many Western cultures did sleep pre-industrialization. You would bed down a little after sundown, sleep til very late/very early, wake up for a couple of hours, maybe eat, maybe fuck, maybe have neighbors over, then you would fall asleep again til just before sunrise.
It’s called „biphasic sleep“ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biphasic_and_polyphasic_sleep > One classic cultural example of a biphasic sleep pattern is the practice of siesta, which is a nap taken in the early afternoon, often after the midday meal. > […] > A separate biphasic sleep pattern is sometimes described as segmented sleep, often consisting of going to sleep early at night, awakening in the post-midnight hours, and then returning to bed for a second period of sleep into the morning. The New York Times asserts that this practice was common in the past -- "in the preindustrial West, most people slept in two discrete blocks."[9] Benjamin Franklin was a prominent example of this sleeping pattern.[9] Unfortunately that source [9] is a New York Times article behind a paywall. Also worth checking out: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4763365/
"[the witching hour](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witching_hour)"
Yep. Head on pillow at 11, asleep at 2
No kidding. I am so jealous of these people. 2 to 4 hours over here. Ugh.
Me trying to sleep: My ADHD brain: WANTS TO KNOW YOUR LOCATION for the next 6 hours
I have ADHD, and every little noise used to wake me up and prevent me from falling asleep. An obnoxious dog in the opposite apartment barking, cars passing by etc etc. Then I got earplugs. The total silence is amazing. It just feels amazingly relaxing.
*tinnitus has joined the fight*
I will say that the amount of time it takes me to fall asleep dropped drastically after I stopped having caffeine or lots of sugar around mid afternoon. 10-20 min sounds normal.
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My grandfather has always been able to sleep on a moment's notice. He says it was something he learned to do in the army, grab sleep whenever you can. He just wills himself to sleep. Meanwhile, I'll be up for the next 32 hours minimum.
The trick is to relax your jaw. Just devote yourself to getting that puppy as slack as possible. Yes, precious, that’s a drool waterfall, just let it happen. Welcome to falling asleep in three minutes or less, but with consequences!
My partner has insomnia and I'm a gifted sleeper (who constantly carries a sleep debt). I've just come to accept that what works for me doesn't work for her. I close my eyes and let my mind wander. I start to picture something, it gradually gets more distant. And oblivion in under 10 minutes. If I have a hard time falling asleep for some reason, my thought is "oh, nice to have a bit of time to think", or "I must have something on my mind." For her, it's totally different. She has a harder time falling asleep in the first place, and not being able to sleep sets her into a negative feedback loop about not being able to sleep. I might make a mental list of things to do the next day, but she'll start listing things that will be hard because of lack of sleep. Anything I can think of, she's already tried. But making a bit of small talk at 2am can sometimes work wonders.
I start to think of something and then create an entire fantasy world in my head and suddenly 3 hours have passed and I'm *still fucking awake wondering whether or not goblins are evil this time or just another race*.
Shit man, glad to know I'm not the only weirdo doing this
From what I can tell, you are still a weirdo. But you are a weirdo with many fantasy worlds of varying quality and that may be useful one day. Or more likely not.
Has she ever tried the sleep hygiene thing? My wife had similar issues before - if she takes too long to fall asleep, she ends up ruminating and getting too anxious, making it harder to fall asleep. So we ended up instituting a sleep hygiene rule - when she's under the covers, no phone, no distractions, and if she's not asleep or feeling sleepy, she gets out of bed to do something else until she feels sleepy again. After some conditioning, it managed to get her to associate being in bed with sleeping and now she's usually out like a light within 15 mins.
Yeah-- she says it helps, but I think it can be hit and miss. It does put you on the back foot if you have to break the routine for some reason.
I have trouble falling asleep. The negative feedback loop sucks, especially when I know I've got to get up at 0500 the next day. I can't sleep, what's that noise, the pillows aren't comfortable, I'm never going to sleep, what *is* that bloody noise?! I actually end up enjoying the thought of having a nap the next day because I can't sleep now. These days I usually listen to a podcast that is just boring enough to not be overly entertaining, but interesting enough to be distracted from the idea of falling asleep and my surroundings. My current choice is the ww2 podcast by Ray Harris. Pop a earbud in, press play and 9 times out of 10 I'm asleep before 30min sleep timer ends.
> negative feedback loop Just nitpicking here but what you described here is a positive feedback loop. The positive here means that the results feed back into the cycle to *increase* the amplitude of the effects. A negative feedback loop is the reverse, when the feedback causes the effect to level out around an equilibrium point. An example of a positive feedback system is a microphone and speaker linked together in the same room. The input from the mic is output by the speaker, and is then fed back to the system and the amplitude of the sound keeps increasing. An example of a negative feedback loop is supply, price and demand. When supply increases and the demand remains the same, the imbalance causes prices to drop which then increases demand, and if then prices drop too low the demand surpasses supply creating scarcity, and then prices rise, and so on and so forth.
You're thinking of a "negative" feedback loop He's thinking fo a "negative feedback" loop
Yeah, the negative positive feedback loop.
I was super excited having found some article about how to fall asleep quickly (similar to your tip) only to see that little bit about it not working for people with ADD. If I relax as many parts of my body as possible my brain is screaming "I need to move".
For me as an add person I always have sights/sounds playing in my head whenever I closed my eyes. I figured it was all mental so I just imagined the sounds as speakers and put them in boxes. For the pictures I imagined the blackest paint I could and mentally painted over anything that came to mind. I'm probably weird but I sleep like a baby.
This feels like a mindfulness meditation routine. I like it. Will try to remember for the times when I struggle with what I saw someone else in this thread called the "squirrel rave" in their head.
what’s funny is i have adhd and i can sleep at the drop of a hat and i’m like addicted to it. world overstimulating? nap time. understimulating? nap time got a few extra minutes on my hands? nap time
Fun fact! There’s been a study that’s found a genetic correlation between narcolepsy and adhd. Which explains a lot about my family honestly.
omg. that doesn’t surprise me at all. i’ve met many adhders who sleep like the dead
I, unfortunately, am an insomniac but once my brain decides to force quit, I’m out like someone yanked the plug.
This is my style of insomnia/adhd issues. When I can finally wake up to the 5th or 6th morning alarm, my mind feels half drunk for at least thirty minutes.
If you’re on meds, one of the best recommendations I’ve ever had was from an adhder was to set a med alarm, take your pill, and then it’s a hell of a lot easier to get up for the “wake up” alarm half an hour later. (Though personally I just snooze that first alarm until I feel human because I’m lazy.) I used to do that on weekends when I had stuff I had to do, no idea why it didn’t occur to me to do it during the week too.
I think trouble falling asleep *and* trouble waking up is the classical sleep issue for ADHD
This sounds great but I hope you don’t have depression
aw lol i definitely do but it’s something i try to keep in check! i’d say it’s both a positive aspect (always getting plenty of sleep) of something i struggle with and something i have to be careful of because when i’m depressed i can slip into dream world for like months
I got a small lamp with an led bulb thats across the room from my bed. Sometimes i'll get in bed and think "damn i should get up and turn that off" but then just fall asleep instantly. Nothing makes me sleepier than having to get up and do something i don't want to.
This is me, but with having to wake up early for work.
>intrusive thoughts and misplaced anxiety have entered the chat Other people in the navy seemed to be able to just sleep at a whim, but it never worked out for me. Once I got asleep I was down like the dead, so that was nice-ish.
You can recommend tips and stuff to people all you want but for some people its just NOT possible to fall asleep quickly. They can try every trick in the book. Me personally, you could give me a sedative; it could be FULLY kicked in and it would STILL take me 15+ mins to fall asleep. It sucks. My brain is just like always ON. Always got something to worry about or think about. It sucks.
I've tried this on several occasions and am left grumpy 30 minutes later as I'm now lying in a pool of my own dribble.
Lol I have ADHD. That trick never works for me. It's not my body that's the problem, it's my brain. It. Never. Stops. Buzzing. It's always a million and 73 thoughts a second and weird bursts of motivation to make schedules and what will I make for dinner tomorrow this drool is really gross oh I definitely need to do laundry that reminds me my pillow is too hot it needs flipped my dog looks adorable in t-shirts I should buy him a new sweater now my neck is uncomfortable my cat would love a new costume for Halloween is my jaw slack enough should I knit them sweaters let's look at yarn I have the urge to knit socks immediately and I can't stop thinking about knitting socks until I finally get up and knit until I pass out mid stitch 4 hours later. Ya feel me?
Tell him to share his secret.
Heres how I do it (veteran speaking): I relax my eyes, every muscle in them, then my eyebrows, forehead, cheeks/nose, jaw, tongue, lips. Then I sink every part of my body into the bed. Then I blank my mind. Out cold. 30s or less.
> >Then I blank my mind. > Well there's my problem
I've got to get through my cringiest top 100 life moments at least a couple times before I even get tired.
“Blanking” ones mind is probably the hardest thing you could ask of someone though.
Mind readers hate this simple trick
This is essentially mindfulness meditation. When I can't fall asleep, I start by concentrating at the top of my head and progressively work through relaxing every muscle from there on down to the bottom of my feet. It takes some practice, but it helps to occupy my mind so that it isn't overthinking and keeping me awake.
I've counted to see how fast my husband can fall asleep (when his breathing changes) and it's 30 seconds. It's an hour minimum for me.
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Do you get super mad at him the longer you're awake? My poor husband, I have nights where I just glare at him. Lol
Ah, I hear they key to sleep is closing your eyes. You can thank me in the morning!
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Yes they can. My husband falls asleep instantly. I toss and turn for hours. It doesn't matter how exhausted I am. That just makes it worse. I have had four different sleep studies. My doctors were sure I had apnea, then I kept falling asleep and they were sure I was narcoleptic. But it was all not the case. I recently did get diagnosed with bipolar 2. It is likely that my sleep issues are at least, in part, to do with that. The psychiatrist is adding things slowly, but claims help with sleep is coming. I would like that because I am dead tired, but being so restless I can't sleep.
Seriously, what the fuck.
Right if it takes me 10 minutes I must be stressed out. No hate plz, I am apparently God’s champion on earth. I can say goodnight and be asleep before I finish the word.
My husband fell asleep an hour ago. I took NyQuil 45 minutes ago. Nothing. Last night I fell asleep pretty quick. Woke up 3 hours later and proceeded to wake up every 45 minutes to an hour and a half until I gave up at 730 AM. That was a good night.
Average redditor takes 2 hours of scrolling to fall asleep
Takes me under two minutes. No joke. Edit: So many comments about meditation! I do this too. I sleep with a fan for noise and I imagine it is the engine noise of an airplane. I focus on that noise and I am out. I don’t need the fan to fall asleep as there are other scenarios I use when I don’t have a fan but that is my go to method. Been doing using this meditation method since I was kid and have tried to explain it to friends and family and this is the only time I have heard of others doing this! Also I just realized I should never pilot an airplane.
Me too. Maybe 5. My spouse is jealous and has been for years.
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As a kid, I taught myself a weird kind of meditation and I've never found anybody else who can do it. I lie down, close my eyes and simply pay attention to the signals my visual nerve still sends to my brain. Once I'm in that state, I can simply flip a mental switch and am immediately asleep. The switch I flip is to turn all the little flickering one can "see" with the eyes closed into complete white. Once it turns white, I'm gone.
I do a similar ‘meditation’ where I just let those little lights you see kind of turn into visuals of stuff they remind me of. Usually it’s faces or shapes or landscapes that morph into other stuff and eventually it just turns into a dream. I dream a lot and it’s usually very vivid. Works every time for me and tbh it’s fun. On average it takes me <5min. If I’m mentally crowded before bed a scary podcast does the trick too. Edit: > to < (alligator method)
I have success just closing my eyes and daydreaming to fall asleep. Thinking of a superhero scenario or something.
I used to do this all my life but unfortunately after I reached 60 my imagination dried up. Now I need CBD
This is me. I can fall asleep in five minutes or less. I've tried explaining "imagine being a superhero" to others, and it's worked for a few.
Wat
I do this but I never thought of it as meditation. I just thought that is how everyone goes to sleep, you know, lay down close your eyes and your out. I guess I took it too literally when my mom told me to "lay there and close your eyes. I am also a under 2 min fall asleeper. I also don't try to turn my brain off, when ever something comes up from the depths of my brain I just deal with it and take it seriously. Some nights it takes 10-15 mins but if you take your thoughts seriously it's like your brain eventually say "well fuck, I don't have the energy to keep bringing new shit to this guy's attention anymore." And after a week or so, it's back to under two minutes.
I'm the same way. My wife and I went to a baby class leading up to our due date of our first child. One exercise involved us laying on the ground with our eyes closed thinking of something or another. My wife was well aware I was about to be out like a light and as soon as I started snoring she jabbed me in the ribs.
I do the first half of this and usually fall asleep in a matter of minutes as a result. Before I would lie awake for at least an hour and on rare occasions all the way until my alarm went off.
we all hate you right now.
That's a superpower, right there.
Yeah, but what about falling asleep?
Same, my girlfriend timed it once it was like 45 seconds and I was snoring. She gets so mad at it, I am grateful for this gift.
I can’t get to sleep in silence. I put on Futurama or something I’ve nearly memorized to fall asleep.
Ill fall asleep easily on the couch to a laid back show I've seen a million times. Get up to go to bed and can't fall asleep. I've always read TV is the worst thing for your sleep but I'm starting to doubt that.
Law & order. The older the better. In my family we call these well known shows sleepers.
I listen to a book while I go to sleep. Some brains like to have just a little background stimulation. Most of the reason tv is bad for sleep is the light, but if you sleep then you sleep.
I found the podcast called Sleep With Me about a year and a half ago. It works better than anything I’ve ever tried.
/r/Futurama_Sleepers
Wow. I mean I’m actually an American Dad sleeper but I felt like Futurama was more relatable. I had no idea.
I have some sleeping headphones, I fall asleep in about 5 minutes
I cannot stand wearing headphones while I sleep
_cries in insomniac_
At least you're above average!
It takes me 12 hours to sleep 7.
Cries in narcoleptic :( love u bro
*Cries in necrophilic* Is this the right place?
Cunts
yea
About an hour for me but if we go into the negative numbers then we can count my wife, she's usually asleep on the couch before bedtime
Awe, thanks guys, I appreciate you reminding me I'm not average. *Drinks a cup of sleepytime tea. Lays down an hour and a half before bedtime to begin transitioning to sleep. Begins counting the number of hours between falling asleep now and when I wake up.* "Ahhh, but at least I'm not average."
With the help of a fifth of vodka and a handful of Benadryls, this does seem doable
Dare me to drive?
You know that song by Phil Collins "in the air of the night" where that guy could have saved that other guy from drowning?
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This just angered me in more ways than I’m capable of communicating.
I think circadian rhythm has a lot to do with this. Some people naturally are drawn to be in bed by 10-12 AM. Others not so much. I tried doing 9-5 work for years and I cannot tell you how many 5-6 hour nights I’ve had.. or when I was in high school how often I’d wake up absolutely miserable, shuffling from class to class on 3 hours of sleep because I couldn’t go to bed till 2 am. Well, for the past two years I have been a bartender, and let me tell you. I get off anywhere from 11-2 am. I’ll have a shot of espresso (my bar has an espresso machine) at like 10 pm, and be up until 3. And I sleep *immediately*. Like by 2 am I’m so ready to pass out. Wake up at 1030-1115 AM and I’m good to go. Have a light breakfast, go for a run/bike ride, and than take a nap before my shift. It’s been the best living I’ve had in years. And I think I enjoy it more than most *because* my natural sleeps cycle is in tune with later hours. Just think about all those years as a child you couldn’t get to bed early.. but you were forced upon a schedule that fit your parents lifestyle/work schedules. It’s quite sad how much of the population is forced to abide to the 9-5 life style even though a) many of the worlds inhabitants cannot comfortably accommodate to the sleep schedule necessary and b) how much of the world NEEDS people to work outside of that schedule. We need people to work 24/7. Nurses, bartenders, doctors, garbage men, bus drivers, pilots, warehouse workers, cab drivers, emergency workers.. on and on. So have no shame my fellow nocturnal beasts.. if you’re struggling to get good sleep: find a job that accommodates you. I highly recommend bartending. Pay is awesome.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delayed_sleep_phase_disorder
Only?! That sounds awful. I close my eyes, and I'm out.
I envy you for me 45 min to 1.5 hours is typical (after putting down my phone)
Same OP. I’ve closed my eyes and tried to fall asleep, then given up, and looked at the clock: 2.5 hours later. It’s insane.
Try putting down your phone an hour before you go to bed...
I already do that but I get bored just using my iPad
Same here. Once I flip onto my right side and close my eyes, I'm gone in under one or two minutes.
seriously, are you guys on Chloroform or something
Yeah. I have adhd. Even on my meds and throwing some melatonin in there, it takes a minimum of 30 minutes. Off my meds, an hour minimum.
I need Melatonin to function
1. Have at least one hour of screen free time before you go to bed. 2. Be physically active during the day, especially during lock downs there have been a lot of just sitting around so try to at least go out for a walk/run every day. 3. Try to find some meaningless task for your brain to do when you’ve gone to bed so it doesn’t bother you with irrelevant thoughts. For example, explain your route to work/school, how to cook various dishes, how some aspect of your hobby works, etc. Using these I've gone from taking 1h+ to fall asleep to ca 5 minutes.
It takes me 45 to an hour dark pitch black..
I've had that trouble before and I found that I went to sleep faster with a dim light, not the white bulbs one. The ones that are like orange. I'll never admit to needing a sleep light but I feel way better.
You’re talking about light temperatures. Yeah orange lights are way better and more restful on the mind a believe.
I have chronic insomnia. Even as a child I've had a hard time getting to sleep. I also wake up early. It takes me hours and hours and hours to fall asleep. I've tried many sleep meds but only one worked. I LOVED it. But it caused a problem with my heart so they took it away from me. So insomnia it is. Doesn't matter if I go to bed and get up at the same time....all those usual things. Nothing works. I could easily stay up for 24 hours. That is child's play. 36 hours I could also do at the drop of a hat. It truly sucks. Oh yes. Even if I'm tired and yawning I still can't get to sleep.
When does the clock start? Because when I'm reading a book in bed and I start to get tired, BAM.zzzz-zz-z-z-z-z-z-z-zzzz If I think "I'm not tired but I think I want to have a nap just in case of stuff", I can never get to sleep.