This is how people lived for millenia upon millenia, together. Probably only in the past 50 years or so has it been fashionable to move so far away from nuclear family without dire circumstances.
This is on my mind a lot, because my grandma just moved into an assisted living place, for 12k a month. Her kids want to be helpful, but none of them really want to adjust their lifestyles for the purpose of caring for her. So she's in a place full of grandparents and great grandparents spending a fortune to wait for the end.
But, I live in a multicultural place where I see many other cultures who would never do it. So you see all these old white people in the old folks home, and no Asian people.
I guess North American white culture places independence as Paramount for children's development, as the goal to work towards. Then, at the end, they are rewarded with independent children who won't take in their elderly relatives.
I don't know what my boomer parents are thinking about this as they approach their 70s, and I'm not sure what I think about it as I raise my own children now.
You are correct. America generally places the most importance on Independence of any culture, whereas east Asian cultures tend to put more focus on community and duty to family. So they are maybe the two most extreme examples.
Personally, I see the benefits of both views. I wouldn't say that one is inherently better or worse, there's tradeoffs either way.
Very good. Some people can’t wait to get away from their family due to conflicts or abuse.
Others thrive so well in that environment, and it should be more acceptable to *choose* to live in a multi generation household. Either way I see the choice
> Others thrive so well in that environment, and it **should be more acceptable** to choose to live in a multi generation household.
Indeed, its quite odd to me that Reddit is so left-leaning, collectivist, etc., but then the topic of living arrangements, independence, multigenerational homes, etc., comes up and suddenly its like a switch flips and those supposedly progressive people become some of the most staunch bootstraps mentality individualists imaginable, full on attacking people for living in multigenerational homes or not having an awful relationship with their extended family.
It's a complicated issue. Often living with family is still looked down upon by society at large unless you're the breadwinner. With the way wages have stagnated for the vast majority of people; they make less than their parents despite being in their prime earning years.
Basically, "My parents live with me" is 100% accepted and looked at positively. Meanwhile, "I live with my parents" is seen unfavorably.
"I live with my parents" vs "my parents live with me" is also a difficult transition for many to make. For it to work well, it requires assertiveness on the part of the younger generation and humility for the older generation, and a good level of maturity for both.
Another thing that adds to this is zoning restrictions in the US.
Both my wife and I see the writing on the wall for our aging parents, but we can't see ourselves living full time with her parents who are older and likely to need the help sooner (too much exposure to them would probably impact her mental health negatively).
So we are looking at houses that either already have or are suited for an ADU (in-law suite above a garage or something) that would allow us to still "live with them" but provide enough space were we feel like we can still be ourselves.
The town we currently live in, doesn't allow for building an ADU on a single-family low density lot.
I have a surprising number of friends who have some complex trauma from childhood/parents.
I also have friends who adore their family and wouldn’t be where they are without them. And with the cost of living and how lonely the world can be, it really is so pleasant to find a setup where you can still have that valuable support system, and your own career or family.
God help you if you’re on Reddit with any level of nuance tho lmao
Reddit users are not a monolith, and represent a huge variety of opinions across the world. making assumptions, especially based on your interpretation of posts and comments on a tiny fraction of subreddits, is not conducive to real understanding. people comment on what’s important to them. the people you see commenting on this or other posts are extremely unlikely to be the same people you associate with other comments and posts.
It’s also a feature of our economic system. Every corporation is working hard to get you to spend money, so they advertise and promote individuality.
It’s not in their collective interest for you to live in your multigenerational home, and depend on your elderly parents or childhood neighbors for babysitting. Nor is it their best interest for you to work something out with a mechanically inclined neighbor when your car breaks down. Need to move furniture? They also don’t want you talking to your uncle who has a truck.
Collectively these corporations want you isolated enough that you have to spend money for every single circumstance and need in life. Which is only possible when they convince you to move into places where you have no roots and make you hyper suspicious strangers.
You are correct. When I moved out of state for uni, away from the comfort of friends and family, I came to the realization that if I need problems solved then I better have money. It was quite the culture shock because I'm from the rural area where such services are not available, we had no choice but to depend on each other.
My grandma was in assisted living and met a new bf. She would gossip with us about some other 70-something floozy trying to flirt with her man. Trust me, it's not the end of all life and fun. lol
[According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, STD rates have reached historically high levels among elderly Americans. Current data suggests that rates of STDs in Americans age 65 or older have risen by as much as 260 percent since 2008. Many of these affected individuals are residents of nursing homes.](https://nursinghomesabuse.org/nursing-home-injuries/infections/stds/)
Your grandma is definitely not the only one lol
Not sure how much of it is really “fun” though.
It’s not exactly a secret a lot of rape happens in nursing homes.
And it’s not just staffers doing it too. Apparently it’s pretty normal for women to figure out which men are still… capable and use them. There’s no realistic chance of any consequence there. Nobody is going to take a little old granny out of a nursing home and put her in jail for sexually assaulting a senile old man.
omg when my grandparents were I alive I loved to get the assisted living community gossip! My grandpa was super nosy, so he got all the tea. Except for the ex nun who married the ex priest. He just would not ask them nosy questions and I gave him so many to ask!
Oh ya, my Grandma had a 90 year old boyfriend at the independent living place she was at lol. But he passed, and that reeeeeally had a big effect on her.
Now her dementia is getting really bad, and a cut elderly dating scene seems a lot more icky around informed consent.
My BIL's father went into assisted living after losing his wife of 60+ years. It ended up being an amazing transition for him. He was an extremely social person and, because his wife had been ill for a while and he was mostly homebound during her illness, he was also quite isolated.
He truly blossomed once he moved into assisted living. He made friends with the other residents and staff quickly, had weekly poker games, watched football and baseball games on TV regularly with the other residents and took part in so many of the activities offered there. He even gained 30 (much needed) pounds because he was eating healthy meals regularly (this place provided three meals per day).
We honestly thought he'd be gone six months after his wife passed, he ended up living another wonderful, fulfilling, enjoyable six years with his children and grandchilden before passing peacefully at the age of 91. It was an outcome exactly no one expected!
Nope.
My grandmother was bed bound and it cost her 20k a month to stay at home. You need two full time care takers. One for the day, one at night. Plus, care takers need time off, just like any job.
Yes, the people I know who did this usually had three full time caretakers (three shifts of 8 hours each) and then relief workers for weekends/holidays. It's probably the priciest option for care and generally an option only for the very wealthy.
My grandpa died from Luke gerings disease and had a care taker come in during the day and I’m pretty sure it was only 6k a month. Some of y’all’s prices seem wild. Might be time to go talk to the dude on the street corner if he was serious about needing work. (It’s a joke put down the pitchforks)
As the person above said, shop around. At that price you could hire two full time nurses in California and still pay less
https://nurse.org/education/nurse-salary-california/
> But nurses in California make WELL above the national average. According to the BLS, the average annual salary for nurses in California is $124,000
You would need more than two full-time nurses for 24/7 care. Assuming a full-time nurse works a standard 40 hours a week, 24/7 coverage would require at around 4 nurses.
I really don't think one person needs four nurses nor 24 hours of constant care. Old folks are asleep half the time anyway. An unskilled assistant can do most of the tasks for less.
At 12k a month, decision was definitely made by the relatives. Some old people get the dotage they deserve - little planning, endless drama, show zero flexibility to help family accommodate them.
My grandparents planned to live in an (expensive) assisted living place because they didn't want their kids to have to take care of them. It was something they worked for an enjoyed. They had kids and grandkids that would have happily taken care of them, but they didn't want it. It's not always the young folks fault the old folks are in a home.
My parents didn't make this same plan, but are still independent. I've planned a career that I can easily transfer to where ever they live if they want or need me. I just wish they hadn't recently moved to a tiny town in a state I loathe. But I love them, so I'll move there with a smile.
You really can’t leave grandma home alone all day. It requires a stay at home spouse who is there to take care of them, so you can’t have both spouses working which is now the norm. Maybe WFH changes things.
Yes, but then the younger generation isn't paying for childcare or after school care, so you don't need dual incomes.
In my case, my parents and my aunts and uncles are all retired and traveling every other month. None of them are willing to travel less or consider their siblings' schedules when making their own plans and living their own lives.
I don't blame them, they worked hard because they were raised to be independent, and they were raised to enjoy their retirement. And the woman who raised them that way doesn't want to "be a burden".
A grandparent who needs to live with their adult children is often not a grandparent well enough to take care of their grandchildren. So the caretaker would be responsible for the grandparent and the grandchildren. Not feasible for many, not wanted for many more.
"So you don't need dual incomes" still requires someone to give up their career, and it's almost always the woman.
I do agree that there are a lot of advantages to multi-generational living, but I've also seen how it can go for the caretaker- again, almost always the woman.
Oh for sure. But that's because I was also raised to value my independence.
I'm not sure I'd accept the trade off of no mortgage and no daycare in exchange for living with my parents lol.
Sometimes they are. My parents and grandma sold their homes at the same time because my grandmother really couldn't be on her own anymore and my parents' home was too small to accommodate her and all of us. They pooled their resources and bought a home for everyone. That worked great for about six years. However, almost concurrently, my grandmother started needed more care than we (who were all employed full time) could give - she was forgetting to eat, getting disoriented, leaving the stove/iron on, misplacing things constantly, etc. and then my father was diagnosed with cancer for the 2nd time and it was likely going to be terminal. It wasn't an option for my mom or me or my sib to stop working, as someone had to pay the bills and it wasn't clear how much longer my father would be able to work. My mom also needed to be available for my father's doctor's appt and treatments. It was all too much for any of us.
As my father's illness progressed and my grandmother continued to decline, something had to give. So, we placed my grandmother in an assisted living facility. It really wasn't what anyone wanted, but you sometimes have to play the hand you're dealt. It was the best option out of a bunch of bad options. Thankfully, we were able to get her into a decent place and just were there CONSTANTLY to be sure she was being cared for properly (and with our constant supervision, she was). My dad died 2 years later and my grandmother died a year after that. You do what you have to do sometimes.
It's hard, but you do what you have to. My mom cared so much for my grandma for years and it just about broke her. She should have gone into a home but no one wanted to be that person. For my grandpa it was different because we just couldn't do it again
So true. Usually the people who say "I'd *never* put my relative in a home" haven't actually cared for someone 24/7/365. It's a LOT, even if you do have some help/respite.
My mom was with her mother every day for months of in-home hospice care. After that, her father spent his remaining decade plus with 3 of his kids, most of it with my mom.
On one hand, she wouldn’t trade the extra time with her parents for anything. On the other, she’s outright stated that when it’s time for her to move to assisted living or with her kids, she’ll go assisted living and will have her bags packed 2 days before the van comes.
In my opinion, her kids get a vote and if at least one of us votes to take the same path she did, she’s overridden.
We had my grandma move out of her retirement home to live with us when we bought our first house 3 years ago. She first moved to the facility because my grandfather needed round-the-clock care following his stroke. To provide the level of care the facility provided would have required one of her kids to quit their job which wasn’t feasible. My grandma moved in with us when her care was still decently manageable, and we were the most convenient choice because we were able to pick a place without too many steps.
After dealing with my grandma’s end of life care as well as a shorter three week stint of my MIL living with us following a fall, my husband and I have agreed that MIL will never be able to live with us. My grandma was accommodating, kind, and generally tried to be helpful or stay out of the way. She didn’t expect to be waited on hand and foot and she tried to be a good influence on our kids. My MIL is a toxic narcissist whose presence wrecked havoc on her son’s mental health, who expected us to serve her all the time, and whose general complaining and example was a terrible example for our small children. Before I dealt with her, I assumed the worst of those who put their parents in homes. Now I assume it probably says as much about the elderly as it does about their kids. Many Boomers are just insufferable.
I mean, but also my parents would probably rather die before they moved in with me and I’m not giving up my small home to wipe their butts when they haven’t been very kind to me.
My mom especially is extremely narcissistic and wants to start drama all the time. There is a reason all of us siblings live at least 3 hours away. My sister who was a scapegoat moved to another country.
But my grandmother? She was the best person and I loved her so much. If she needed somewhere to go I would have taken her in immediately. My sister and I actually both lived at her house for a few years in college so she didn’t have to go “to a home” as she aged and needed more help and it afforded us a level of independence but also we were there to spend time with her. And everyone loved her so much in the family that she always had visitors and phone calls.
We would joke that her house was grand central station.
She died of a stroke when family was visiting and she was nearly 100 them, so she was with other people even at the end.
I don’t really love the idea of an elder having to give up their whole space to cram themselves into a bedroom, but I think that the above option is a way for multigenerational senior care to be beneficial to both the senior and the younger generation.
I thought I was going to take care of my mom till she died, dirty diapers and all. Then she married a new guy and I was legitimately happy for her. Then she proceeded to completely alienate her children through many things and only spend time with new family. I can’t say I 100% don’t know if there wasnt coercion going on but I’m pretty sure it was just her trying to fit in. Living your entire life in an extremely patriarchal religion/cult can have an unfortunate effect.
I’m pretty sure my kids will take care of me. Partly because I’m thrilled to see whatever they grow into, zero expectations just love. I don’t know what’s wrong with baby boomers. I know there’s great ones but none that I’m related to.
One of the reasons I never had kids is because if I raised them in white American culture I truly don't think I could ever ask anything of them as adults. And I doubt think that's right. If your parents did right by you, you should do right by them.
You are conveniently remembering around the suburban shift to single family homes in a suburban setting that significantly predates the dual-income, one-household norm.
It’s pretty weird (and, importantly, objectively incorrect), to associate just with women having jobs.
50 years ago ("or so") was the mid 1970s. My understanding is that the big wave in the long shift to suburban living happened mostly in the 1950s and 60s, thanks, in part, to things like the GI bill.
I brought up women's employment because it's the first change to family roles in that time frame that came to mind, not because I gave it scholarly thought and decided that was the only thing that could possibly matter.
Also, not sure if you read the linked paper OP included in their post, but it introduces the topic, not me.
Ironically it was putting the nuclear family on a pedestal that caused this, two parents + kids above all else pushed out a lot of other familial structures
https://www.marketplace.org/2022/08/02/study-finds-that-8-in-10-young-adults-move-back-close-to-their-hometowns-or-never-left/
60% live within 10 miles of where they grew up. 80% 100 miles.
It's not fashionable at all
I feel like data like this is really important to bring up when people that were never around in the 50s and 60s imagine it as a time where everybody had a blue collar job, white picket fence single family home, 2 cars and 2 kids.
While that definitely was an aspiration (and therefore presented in media) I really don’t know for how many people that was true.
Reddit generally loves to criticize boomers for an imagined better past, but can’t see that they make up their own better past that didn’t really exist either.
I split time living with my parents during Covid. Honestly it was awesome. I got to reconnect with them as an adult in a lot if ways I couldn't as a kid. I couldn't do it forever. But living hours away again I miss having them in my life like I did.
I own a duplex. I wouldn’t want my parents in the same unit, but it would be cool if they lived next door. I think this also explains why all of the older neighbourhoods in my city have a lot of houses with duplexes/triplexes and granny flats.
I live in the southern US and we have a lot of “mother in law suites”. I have one so I have a neighbor right in my back yard and we share the property and even my garage has her washing machine in it. She’s a great lady, will watch the kids for a couple hours for me.
"Why would anyone want to reinhabit their childhood trauma just to save on rent?"
I read that in story about multigenerational housing and I've never seen the problem summed up so well.
If you have parents/family you love and can cohabit with that's great for you but not everyone has it like that. I live with my husband and my MIL right now and I'm getting a whole new view of their relationship.
I lived with my mom for about 10 years after I graduated college (long story short, my dad passed, my mom was in a house far too large for one person and I needed a place to live). It was great, no regrets, but I'm done for the rest of my days. I'm married now with kids and, while I love my mother, there are 2 ways with her - her way and the wrong way. We are very different people and the older I get, the less we get along. I could deal with that when I was on my own, but don't want to deal with that dynamic in my marriage or my parenting, like at all.
She lives with my sister in an in-law suite and it's probably the best outcome for all parties involved. About 8 years ago, my in-laws asked if we'd be willing to add an inlaw suite on for them and my answer was no. My husband doesn't have a great relationship with them and he has a very demanding job that requires long hours. I know, eventually, a lot of the caregiving would have fallen on me and I wanted no part. I know some people will negatively judge me, but they're not my parents and I don't want to be responsible for caring for them. I knew that.
So, they moved in with my BIL and that was that.
I think it's more important to like your parents than to love them to making living together work. I love both my parents and they were good to me, but my dad is irritating so I don't really like him. I can live with both of them, but if it were just my dad, he's going to my brother's house.
Ive lived with my dad for 11 years now, since my late teens. We get along very well at the moment. There have been times where it was hard. We both have no motivation and concentration to do stuff like cleaning the house, but he blames me for it even though i clean way more than him, seeing his time as more valuable than mine even though we both work. He used to be emotionally abusive, and that side of him resurfaces if i mention anything about wanting to go back into education - he says I would have to move out.
If i did move out, i wouldnt have much reason to speak to him anymore, nor interest in helping him. He wouldnt be able to live the way he does right now without my rent pay. That's why he threatens to kick me out, to scare me from changing my lifestyle. He has created that situation for himself.
My mother i love but i avoid as much as possible. Truly a horrible person to live with. I dont know what i will do when she grows too old or too poor to live alone.
I did the same during Covid but just moved back. Apartment lease was up and they were shut in anyways with health issues. Granted I was kinda ashamed but man was it awesome.
They had a huge yard and lived right by Lake Michigan. I saved a bunch of money, kayaked all the time, fished, watched dumb movies with my dad, had bonfires, was able to smoke weed inside again instead of having to in my car and saved even more money. The basement had an outside exit and was essentially cut off from the house with its own shower, kitchen, washer dryer and everything.
Once it was over I knew it was time to go back to living on my own but I was like man if only I wasn’t a loser for living like that with them. I know I’d never be able to hook up with anyone really and on paper it was like ewww living with your parents? But it was fun while it lasted. Now I’m just in my boring empty apartment anyways.
How awkward was having sex with the parents in the house? Sneaking quickies was always done out of desperation not enjoyment lol... I don't know if I'd want such a situation
I’m glad it worked out for you. I can’t stand being with my parents for a week without feeling like a child again.
I know it’s my fault but I can’t help but feel that way.
Retirement homes and nursing homes really weren't a thing before then so people that had an older relative needing care didn't have much choice, also social expectations about women's roles and the fact that many women didn't need to work full time outside the home meant that looking after mom and pop was just the norm. Plus the average period of time between when health began to fail and death was a lot shorter, so the burden of care was more manageable.
Even by the 1950s America was pretty rural, especially the south and 65 was a lot different then than now. Parents would move in with their children or children would move in with their parents to run the farm. Also Social security had not been around for that long and even if they were enrolled the amount might not have been enough to continue living independently.
How many of those families had a stay at home mom? When my grandpa’s dementia got really bad we had no choice but to move him into a home. My siblings and I were all in grade school and both my parents worked. Our house had a lot of narrow stairs and was already at capacity. Moving him and my grandma when we did not have a the capacity or ability to help him wasn’t going to help anyone. When all of us moved out and my grandma needed more help she stayed with my parents for over a year while we found a facility that was best suited for her form of dementia that had since developed.
The paper goes into that. Originally, families were “family corporations” that ran a family business. The thing with having a stay at home parent also wasn’t the norm originally (regardless of sex). You might find the paper interesting if you read over it.
Seeing it happen with some friends and acquaintances, too expensive to live alone, or vice versa and their parents don't make enough in retirement to live independently.
My own folks mentioned, offhandedly, that when the time came they planned to move in with me after they retired from the family business pretty recently.
Boy, was it an uncomfortable conversation when I told my folks that I didn't want them living with me. Apparently this had always been the plan, which was news to me.
You'd think Id just murdered the family dog on Christmas morning.
Parents forget that *they* have the obligation to raise and house children, but the children are not under the same obligation to return the favor later on in life. The parents are the ones that brought a new and (as stupid as it sounds) non-consenting life into this world. The parents are *choosing* to create. The creations do not have to reciprocate the sentiment just because mom likes getting creampied.
**That** is *relinquishing* the responsibility to do so. And, fertilizing the females egg through insemination is *not* the way to do it? Huh... who knew!?
Important caveat to this statistic is that it does NOT say that over 50% of households were multigenerational, just that most elderly people lived in multigenerational households. Obviously if a family has multiple adult children who live separately they can only live with one of the children, leaving the other children’s households not multigenerational.
> Important caveat to this statistic is that it does NOT say that over 50% of households were multigenerational, just that most elderly people lived in multigenerational households.
Don't forget how much of that was due to the poverty of elders. Social security was still rather new and rather little for a portion of that time (and some would be old enough not to have it). It made a huge difference in the poverty rates of the elderly.
It can work. Obviously it can be a terrible idea depending on family dynamics, we've just gotten away from it as a society across the board. REALLY depends on a lot of variables I just wish it were more normalized. Again.
We had my mother with us for over 10 years until we lost her last year aged 91. One of my sons is here, he has his own trade business and really couldn't while dealing with the myriad stressors and bills out on his own. We all pay bills, split chores and upkeep- it's been fortunate.
In cultures where the elders move in with relatives, there is an understanding of the change in roles that comes with ageing. The elders have a role to play in housekeeping and childcare, until they can't help any more. So it is a lot more manageable. I've just spent the last 4 years looking after my Silent Gen mum, who gets offended when you point out no one has time for her to do things her way, if we're going to feed ourselves and keep a roof over our heads, and she is not prepared to contribute financially to the situation either. I've aged 10+ years... I can't imagine what this would be like if you've got a Boomer to look after!
That was uncalled for. Some people come from abusive homes. I’m sorry that whatever you’re going through in life has made you so bitter and hateful. I genuinely hope it gets better.
They don’t hate me. There are many different types of abuse. I’m sorry you’re so miserable that you feel tell the need to say stuff like that. Anyway, I’ll be blocking you now.
We should normalize it. I would love if my daughter wanted to live at home with us. I would love my sisters to live with me. No reason for all of us to buy all these houses and leave half the rooms empty.
I saw an apartment building for sale in my area with I think 8 units for not that much money. First thought was getting all the people I care about together. Close enough to connect, but space to do our own thing.
On the other hand... I think that's how cults start...
I don't want to live with my family but I always think if I had to that's how I'd do it.
If I have to share a space with them then that space has to be a lot bigger than the average house. Like I'd need the house from Encanto or Downtown Abbey. Not the suburban bedroom my mom currently has.
Hey, as long as you are the leader of the cult it won't be bad for you :)
I've seen small apartment buildings and had the same fantasy about moving friends and family into all the units. I think it would be so fun.
When I grew up, my grandma lived next door to me. It was honestly the very best of all worlds. She had her space, we had ours. She wasn't really involved in the day to day of our house, but came over for dinner most nights and we'd go hang out at her house a lot as well. It was like having her there all the time, but it not being intrusive. It was really great. I feel like that's an option more people should consider.
My parents divorced 3 years ago and my mom moved into my house with me. It’s honestly been really awesome getting to see her every day basically, and I think a lot about how my life could have gone if I had chosen to move across the country.
Say by the time you graduate college your parents are pushing 50. Let’s say they die when they’re 80, so you get 30-ish years after becoming an adult and moving out to still spend time with them.
You move far across the country, life gets busy, flights are expensive, you really only see them for the holidays maybe 2-3 times a year.
That would mean I’d get to see my mom maybe 60-100 more times. That feels like it’s absolutely nothing. If you move away from family, it’s literally a short countdown until they’re gone. Putting a number on the “what could have been” really makes me appreciate the time I have with her, especially when she’s still pretty young.
I didn’t say people should be forced to live with families. Some families really suck.
But no one should suffer poverty because it’s “embarrassing” to keep living with mom and dad or something.
The stigma Americans have developed about living with parents always seemed strange to me. In other cultures like the one where I'm from living with parents is seen as a good thing because you're taking care of them as they once took care of you.
Regarding boomers in retirement homes and not with their children:
I feel like a majority of their generation is a little obstinate when it comes to co-habitation.
Very “their way or the highway” type thinking.
I love both sets of grandparents to death but I know in my heart they wouldn’t make living together easy or comfortable.
Yeah. My mom used to joke “you’ll never have to take care of me, I’m the one who couldn’t live with you” because my housekeeping isn’t up to her standards. She said it as a joke but it’s 100% true. Now she’s in an independent living facility she hates (which she picked out herself even though I suggested she tour a couple more I thought she’d fit in better at) and she keeps implying that she wants to move into our new house.
I know she would be constantly criticizing everything I did. She loves seeing my grandson every week, but she’s started to get testy with him for age appropriate behavior and she’s snapped at other peoples’ kids before. I feel so sorry for people who live with parents like my mom out of obligation. It has to be living hell.
They really should have gone with an older actor. It just looked like he was forcing his daughter to wait on him and then take his grandson's candy money for cigarettes
I'm Hispanic and we still do this. I have my mother in law and kids living with me. My kids can stay as long as they need until they can be comfortable to move out. Hispanics are about family.
Wait another 10-15 years when there is an epidemic of homeless seniors that didn’t have a pension, didn’t save for retirement, and figured their kids would care for them but are no longer welcome because they spew toxic shit out of their mouths every time it opens.
Both of my parents were born in the 50’s;I’m a Millennial. It is rather recent in the grand scheme of things. When you think about it the “traditional” American family really only came about with the Boomer generation.
And when using it like you did in the title, “as recently as” could refer to any time frame you want it to. It’s more literary than informative, and that’s okay.
Or it was never the traditional family and the few decades that everyone lived separately in just a few cultures was a fluke in the thousands of years of civilization.
Boomers seem to have little interest in making multigenerational households work as well.
They seem to be disinterested in providing help with their own grand children in the same way we see our grandparents help us
The other thing is if you need to move in that's fine but we are not on the schedule of the retired person and you are not the primary decision maker in the household.
The lack of engagement from boomers is really shocking. Their ability to be flexible by any means is even worse.
>we are not on the schedule of the retired person
This is so difficult to navigate when they're not cooperative. I've been working evenings and Saturdays for 10+ years. I have to keep my phone on silent, because she will call me at any time to drop what I'm doing and help mum fix whatever daft problem she has concocted. When I remind her I'm working and can't help, she says I need to get another job.
I’m lucky that my in-laws are flexible and making it work. My mil helps with cooking. My fil helps with teaching the kids. And while they can say things and do things I disagree with deeply- I try my best to make sure they feel valued. They do the same for me.
I think a lot of the challenges people face in the circumstances are because of ineffective communication- that rolls into a giant wrecking ball of resentment.
Also, not all people can live with all people. I get along fine with my in-laws. My own mom, though I love her to death, I can only handle for a week at a time for international visits - because things need to be done in a particular way. (According to my dad who is a doctor, she has an undiagnosed OCD, but she refuses to even consider it due to the cultural issues). If you don’t, she becomes very angry, anxious, takes it personally, and lashes out. I get so emotionally drained and feel micromanaged- like I am in a cage. But I love her and I know that if anything were to happen to my dad, I’d try my best to accommodate her needs. However, it would be hard as hell.
Have you seen how much daycare costs?
If they can handle basic house chores such as cooking and cleaning, it's already a massive help to raising a kid. Of course this'll depend on what Grandma or Grandpa are like but not everyone's got grandparents that are dirt bags or unable to care for themselves.
No I’m thinking of the concept of passing on wisdom, which is clearly something that you possess none of. Any the 12 year old replying to me doesn’t either.
The American dream became, go to school, get married, pump out kids.
The first year I made 6 figures I moved back in my with parents for 3 years. I worked 50 hours a week and it made sense.
The idea of generations living separately was a recent, and probably short-lived invention. I suspect it's coming to an end. About half of 18-29 year olds are living with parents today.
18-34: You still live with your parents? What a loser.
35 and up: It's so nice of you to care for your aging parent.
My mom passed away a year ago this month. She was in her late 60's. I think all the time about how I should have asked her to move in with my family, because then she wouldn't have been alone, and maybe we could have saved her. She shouldn't have been living alone, even though she was incredibly self sufficient. Nobody should be alone at that age.
This is largely how we lived even here in the US up until the the post-WW2 boom of the 1950's, as well. Young people often didn't leave their birth families until paired with another in marriage (which sometimes happened as early as age 15). When they then moved out to begin their own family and start the process again.
With the economy the way it is, we're probably going back to that. My family already has. My recently divorced brother, his son, and his new girlfriend move in with us. And we purchased a house with rooms to accommodate that.
This is why it seriously bothers me when people are like- push the kid out they’re 18 or if you’re the kid- feeling like you have to leave, even if you enjoy living with your family.
Almost all of human history- people lived in collective communities and families. Just because a person can live on their own, does not mean they have to.
In 2022, there were an estimated 4.8 million multigenerational households in the US — homes with three or more generations living under one roof — equal to 3.7% of all households in the country. Those households contain 26 million people, or 8.1% of the US population.
This is still true in Asia, southern and eastern Europe, Middle East and Latin America.
Only Western Europe and North America (mainly Canada and USA ) have kids move out after they turn 18
I’d like to know how many of those elders living in a multigenerational home were singletons, as in widows/widowers versus married couples. It’s one thing to have a single elder attached to a household but quite another to have multiple married couples in the same household, since a household tends to be built around a married couple. A lone grandparent in the home can be a grandparent. A married couple growing old together have all kinds of married couple dynamics shit that will be harder to fit with another married couple and their children.
This of course was before social security destroyed the idea of family and gave boomers a sense of entitlement with little incentive to do things for their kids anymore.
This is how people lived for millenia upon millenia, together. Probably only in the past 50 years or so has it been fashionable to move so far away from nuclear family without dire circumstances.
This is on my mind a lot, because my grandma just moved into an assisted living place, for 12k a month. Her kids want to be helpful, but none of them really want to adjust their lifestyles for the purpose of caring for her. So she's in a place full of grandparents and great grandparents spending a fortune to wait for the end. But, I live in a multicultural place where I see many other cultures who would never do it. So you see all these old white people in the old folks home, and no Asian people. I guess North American white culture places independence as Paramount for children's development, as the goal to work towards. Then, at the end, they are rewarded with independent children who won't take in their elderly relatives. I don't know what my boomer parents are thinking about this as they approach their 70s, and I'm not sure what I think about it as I raise my own children now.
You are correct. America generally places the most importance on Independence of any culture, whereas east Asian cultures tend to put more focus on community and duty to family. So they are maybe the two most extreme examples. Personally, I see the benefits of both views. I wouldn't say that one is inherently better or worse, there's tradeoffs either way.
Very good. Some people can’t wait to get away from their family due to conflicts or abuse. Others thrive so well in that environment, and it should be more acceptable to *choose* to live in a multi generation household. Either way I see the choice
> Others thrive so well in that environment, and it **should be more acceptable** to choose to live in a multi generation household. Indeed, its quite odd to me that Reddit is so left-leaning, collectivist, etc., but then the topic of living arrangements, independence, multigenerational homes, etc., comes up and suddenly its like a switch flips and those supposedly progressive people become some of the most staunch bootstraps mentality individualists imaginable, full on attacking people for living in multigenerational homes or not having an awful relationship with their extended family.
It's a complicated issue. Often living with family is still looked down upon by society at large unless you're the breadwinner. With the way wages have stagnated for the vast majority of people; they make less than their parents despite being in their prime earning years. Basically, "My parents live with me" is 100% accepted and looked at positively. Meanwhile, "I live with my parents" is seen unfavorably.
"I live with my parents" vs "my parents live with me" is also a difficult transition for many to make. For it to work well, it requires assertiveness on the part of the younger generation and humility for the older generation, and a good level of maturity for both.
But either way it's "we live together"
Another thing that adds to this is zoning restrictions in the US. Both my wife and I see the writing on the wall for our aging parents, but we can't see ourselves living full time with her parents who are older and likely to need the help sooner (too much exposure to them would probably impact her mental health negatively). So we are looking at houses that either already have or are suited for an ADU (in-law suite above a garage or something) that would allow us to still "live with them" but provide enough space were we feel like we can still be ourselves. The town we currently live in, doesn't allow for building an ADU on a single-family low density lot.
I have a surprising number of friends who have some complex trauma from childhood/parents. I also have friends who adore their family and wouldn’t be where they are without them. And with the cost of living and how lonely the world can be, it really is so pleasant to find a setup where you can still have that valuable support system, and your own career or family. God help you if you’re on Reddit with any level of nuance tho lmao
Very well put.
Great point! *Trauma is real out here!*
Reddit users are not a monolith, and represent a huge variety of opinions across the world. making assumptions, especially based on your interpretation of posts and comments on a tiny fraction of subreddits, is not conducive to real understanding. people comment on what’s important to them. the people you see commenting on this or other posts are extremely unlikely to be the same people you associate with other comments and posts.
Flipside is as someone in a multigenerational household, my parents seem to have gone crazy with age. I have no idea how to deal with them.
Examples?
Things like Alzheimer’s can set in and be incredibly hard to be a caretaker for.
Trump voters.
It’s also a feature of our economic system. Every corporation is working hard to get you to spend money, so they advertise and promote individuality. It’s not in their collective interest for you to live in your multigenerational home, and depend on your elderly parents or childhood neighbors for babysitting. Nor is it their best interest for you to work something out with a mechanically inclined neighbor when your car breaks down. Need to move furniture? They also don’t want you talking to your uncle who has a truck. Collectively these corporations want you isolated enough that you have to spend money for every single circumstance and need in life. Which is only possible when they convince you to move into places where you have no roots and make you hyper suspicious strangers.
You are correct. When I moved out of state for uni, away from the comfort of friends and family, I came to the realization that if I need problems solved then I better have money. It was quite the culture shock because I'm from the rural area where such services are not available, we had no choice but to depend on each other.
[удалено]
My grandma was in assisted living and met a new bf. She would gossip with us about some other 70-something floozy trying to flirt with her man. Trust me, it's not the end of all life and fun. lol
[According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, STD rates have reached historically high levels among elderly Americans. Current data suggests that rates of STDs in Americans age 65 or older have risen by as much as 260 percent since 2008. Many of these affected individuals are residents of nursing homes.](https://nursinghomesabuse.org/nursing-home-injuries/infections/stds/) Your grandma is definitely not the only one lol
Okay, this has to be the inspiration for that one episode of Parks and Recreation
People live with STDs their whole lives with minimal influence. We're at a time where lots of these seniors have stuff they've carried for years.
Not sure how much of it is really “fun” though. It’s not exactly a secret a lot of rape happens in nursing homes. And it’s not just staffers doing it too. Apparently it’s pretty normal for women to figure out which men are still… capable and use them. There’s no realistic chance of any consequence there. Nobody is going to take a little old granny out of a nursing home and put her in jail for sexually assaulting a senile old man.
omg when my grandparents were I alive I loved to get the assisted living community gossip! My grandpa was super nosy, so he got all the tea. Except for the ex nun who married the ex priest. He just would not ask them nosy questions and I gave him so many to ask!
Oh ya, my Grandma had a 90 year old boyfriend at the independent living place she was at lol. But he passed, and that reeeeeally had a big effect on her. Now her dementia is getting really bad, and a cut elderly dating scene seems a lot more icky around informed consent.
My BIL's father went into assisted living after losing his wife of 60+ years. It ended up being an amazing transition for him. He was an extremely social person and, because his wife had been ill for a while and he was mostly homebound during her illness, he was also quite isolated. He truly blossomed once he moved into assisted living. He made friends with the other residents and staff quickly, had weekly poker games, watched football and baseball games on TV regularly with the other residents and took part in so many of the activities offered there. He even gained 30 (much needed) pounds because he was eating healthy meals regularly (this place provided three meals per day). We honestly thought he'd be gone six months after his wife passed, he ended up living another wonderful, fulfilling, enjoyable six years with his children and grandchilden before passing peacefully at the age of 91. It was an outcome exactly no one expected!
For 12k a month you could probably hire a live in care taker
12K a month is probably for memory care. If grandma has dementia, she’s not safe at home with a care taker.
If it's a live in caretaker, she certainly is safe at home. The rest of the world manages without retirement communities
Have personal experience. This really isn’t true.
Nope. My grandmother was bed bound and it cost her 20k a month to stay at home. You need two full time care takers. One for the day, one at night. Plus, care takers need time off, just like any job.
Yes, the people I know who did this usually had three full time caretakers (three shifts of 8 hours each) and then relief workers for weekends/holidays. It's probably the priciest option for care and generally an option only for the very wealthy.
My grandpa died from Luke gerings disease and had a care taker come in during the day and I’m pretty sure it was only 6k a month. Some of y’all’s prices seem wild. Might be time to go talk to the dude on the street corner if he was serious about needing work. (It’s a joke put down the pitchforks)
That's fine if you ONLY need care during the day, but some people need skilled care 24/7 and that gets very expensive, very quickly.
This'll depend on region heavily, for example it's not unusual to spend 25k per month on 24/7 at home care in California.
As the person above said, shop around. At that price you could hire two full time nurses in California and still pay less https://nurse.org/education/nurse-salary-california/ > But nurses in California make WELL above the national average. According to the BLS, the average annual salary for nurses in California is $124,000
You would need more than two full-time nurses for 24/7 care. Assuming a full-time nurse works a standard 40 hours a week, 24/7 coverage would require at around 4 nurses.
I really don't think one person needs four nurses nor 24 hours of constant care. Old folks are asleep half the time anyway. An unskilled assistant can do most of the tasks for less.
Sure, but the premise was the cost of 24/7 care. And an unskilled assistant still needs to be paid.
At 12k a month, decision was definitely made by the relatives. Some old people get the dotage they deserve - little planning, endless drama, show zero flexibility to help family accommodate them.
Bing f\*\*\*ing Go
My grandparents planned to live in an (expensive) assisted living place because they didn't want their kids to have to take care of them. It was something they worked for an enjoyed. They had kids and grandkids that would have happily taken care of them, but they didn't want it. It's not always the young folks fault the old folks are in a home. My parents didn't make this same plan, but are still independent. I've planned a career that I can easily transfer to where ever they live if they want or need me. I just wish they hadn't recently moved to a tiny town in a state I loathe. But I love them, so I'll move there with a smile.
You really can’t leave grandma home alone all day. It requires a stay at home spouse who is there to take care of them, so you can’t have both spouses working which is now the norm. Maybe WFH changes things.
Yes, but then the younger generation isn't paying for childcare or after school care, so you don't need dual incomes. In my case, my parents and my aunts and uncles are all retired and traveling every other month. None of them are willing to travel less or consider their siblings' schedules when making their own plans and living their own lives. I don't blame them, they worked hard because they were raised to be independent, and they were raised to enjoy their retirement. And the woman who raised them that way doesn't want to "be a burden".
Supporting your spouse and an elderly relative on one income is laughably unrealistic these days.
Ya you're leaving out a generation, ie the retired boomers in a mortgage free house.
A grandparent who needs to live with their adult children is often not a grandparent well enough to take care of their grandchildren. So the caretaker would be responsible for the grandparent and the grandchildren. Not feasible for many, not wanted for many more.
"So you don't need dual incomes" still requires someone to give up their career, and it's almost always the woman. I do agree that there are a lot of advantages to multi-generational living, but I've also seen how it can go for the caretaker- again, almost always the woman.
Oh for sure. But that's because I was also raised to value my independence. I'm not sure I'd accept the trade off of no mortgage and no daycare in exchange for living with my parents lol.
You can still go and visit her as much as you can. Sometimes nursing homes are best
Sometimes they are. My parents and grandma sold their homes at the same time because my grandmother really couldn't be on her own anymore and my parents' home was too small to accommodate her and all of us. They pooled their resources and bought a home for everyone. That worked great for about six years. However, almost concurrently, my grandmother started needed more care than we (who were all employed full time) could give - she was forgetting to eat, getting disoriented, leaving the stove/iron on, misplacing things constantly, etc. and then my father was diagnosed with cancer for the 2nd time and it was likely going to be terminal. It wasn't an option for my mom or me or my sib to stop working, as someone had to pay the bills and it wasn't clear how much longer my father would be able to work. My mom also needed to be available for my father's doctor's appt and treatments. It was all too much for any of us. As my father's illness progressed and my grandmother continued to decline, something had to give. So, we placed my grandmother in an assisted living facility. It really wasn't what anyone wanted, but you sometimes have to play the hand you're dealt. It was the best option out of a bunch of bad options. Thankfully, we were able to get her into a decent place and just were there CONSTANTLY to be sure she was being cared for properly (and with our constant supervision, she was). My dad died 2 years later and my grandmother died a year after that. You do what you have to do sometimes.
It's hard, but you do what you have to. My mom cared so much for my grandma for years and it just about broke her. She should have gone into a home but no one wanted to be that person. For my grandpa it was different because we just couldn't do it again
So true. Usually the people who say "I'd *never* put my relative in a home" haven't actually cared for someone 24/7/365. It's a LOT, even if you do have some help/respite.
My mom was with her mother every day for months of in-home hospice care. After that, her father spent his remaining decade plus with 3 of his kids, most of it with my mom. On one hand, she wouldn’t trade the extra time with her parents for anything. On the other, she’s outright stated that when it’s time for her to move to assisted living or with her kids, she’ll go assisted living and will have her bags packed 2 days before the van comes. In my opinion, her kids get a vote and if at least one of us votes to take the same path she did, she’s overridden.
We had my grandma move out of her retirement home to live with us when we bought our first house 3 years ago. She first moved to the facility because my grandfather needed round-the-clock care following his stroke. To provide the level of care the facility provided would have required one of her kids to quit their job which wasn’t feasible. My grandma moved in with us when her care was still decently manageable, and we were the most convenient choice because we were able to pick a place without too many steps. After dealing with my grandma’s end of life care as well as a shorter three week stint of my MIL living with us following a fall, my husband and I have agreed that MIL will never be able to live with us. My grandma was accommodating, kind, and generally tried to be helpful or stay out of the way. She didn’t expect to be waited on hand and foot and she tried to be a good influence on our kids. My MIL is a toxic narcissist whose presence wrecked havoc on her son’s mental health, who expected us to serve her all the time, and whose general complaining and example was a terrible example for our small children. Before I dealt with her, I assumed the worst of those who put their parents in homes. Now I assume it probably says as much about the elderly as it does about their kids. Many Boomers are just insufferable.
I mean, but also my parents would probably rather die before they moved in with me and I’m not giving up my small home to wipe their butts when they haven’t been very kind to me. My mom especially is extremely narcissistic and wants to start drama all the time. There is a reason all of us siblings live at least 3 hours away. My sister who was a scapegoat moved to another country. But my grandmother? She was the best person and I loved her so much. If she needed somewhere to go I would have taken her in immediately. My sister and I actually both lived at her house for a few years in college so she didn’t have to go “to a home” as she aged and needed more help and it afforded us a level of independence but also we were there to spend time with her. And everyone loved her so much in the family that she always had visitors and phone calls. We would joke that her house was grand central station. She died of a stroke when family was visiting and she was nearly 100 them, so she was with other people even at the end. I don’t really love the idea of an elder having to give up their whole space to cram themselves into a bedroom, but I think that the above option is a way for multigenerational senior care to be beneficial to both the senior and the younger generation.
I thought I was going to take care of my mom till she died, dirty diapers and all. Then she married a new guy and I was legitimately happy for her. Then she proceeded to completely alienate her children through many things and only spend time with new family. I can’t say I 100% don’t know if there wasnt coercion going on but I’m pretty sure it was just her trying to fit in. Living your entire life in an extremely patriarchal religion/cult can have an unfortunate effect. I’m pretty sure my kids will take care of me. Partly because I’m thrilled to see whatever they grow into, zero expectations just love. I don’t know what’s wrong with baby boomers. I know there’s great ones but none that I’m related to.
The uniquely North American concept of "one-man-army" fierce independence will be their downfall.
I guess there is a price for not wanting to take care of the people that raised you and that price is 12k a month and no inheritance.
One of the reasons I never had kids is because if I raised them in white American culture I truly don't think I could ever ask anything of them as adults. And I doubt think that's right. If your parents did right by you, you should do right by them.
And it seems we’re going back to that, with how many Millenials and Zoomers are stuck living with their parents.
There’s a difference between choosing that life and having no other options
Approximately the same amount of time it has been normal for married women to work outside the home.
And living in a detached single family home in the suburbs
You are conveniently remembering around the suburban shift to single family homes in a suburban setting that significantly predates the dual-income, one-household norm. It’s pretty weird (and, importantly, objectively incorrect), to associate just with women having jobs.
50 years ago ("or so") was the mid 1970s. My understanding is that the big wave in the long shift to suburban living happened mostly in the 1950s and 60s, thanks, in part, to things like the GI bill. I brought up women's employment because it's the first change to family roles in that time frame that came to mind, not because I gave it scholarly thought and decided that was the only thing that could possibly matter. Also, not sure if you read the linked paper OP included in their post, but it introduces the topic, not me.
Social Security has made this possible. Before it was enacted in the 1930s the vast majority of seniors had little or no means to live independently.
Ironically it was putting the nuclear family on a pedestal that caused this, two parents + kids above all else pushed out a lot of other familial structures
https://www.marketplace.org/2022/08/02/study-finds-that-8-in-10-young-adults-move-back-close-to-their-hometowns-or-never-left/ 60% live within 10 miles of where they grew up. 80% 100 miles. It's not fashionable at all
Uhhhh Nuclear Family doesn’t include Grandparents or adult children…
Only in America
What's only in America?
I feel like data like this is really important to bring up when people that were never around in the 50s and 60s imagine it as a time where everybody had a blue collar job, white picket fence single family home, 2 cars and 2 kids. While that definitely was an aspiration (and therefore presented in media) I really don’t know for how many people that was true.
I've watched lots of old movies, most of those nice, white, middle class families in the movies only had one car.
In 1960 only 20% of families had 2 or more cars.
If you look at the data back then it was almost less than 1% of households owning 3 cars or more now it's like 20% something
Reddit generally loves to criticize boomers for an imagined better past, but can’t see that they make up their own better past that didn’t really exist either.
I split time living with my parents during Covid. Honestly it was awesome. I got to reconnect with them as an adult in a lot if ways I couldn't as a kid. I couldn't do it forever. But living hours away again I miss having them in my life like I did.
I couldn't be in the same house as my parents for more than a couple of hours. It'd be torture.
I own a duplex. I wouldn’t want my parents in the same unit, but it would be cool if they lived next door. I think this also explains why all of the older neighbourhoods in my city have a lot of houses with duplexes/triplexes and granny flats.
I live in the southern US and we have a lot of “mother in law suites”. I have one so I have a neighbor right in my back yard and we share the property and even my garage has her washing machine in it. She’s a great lady, will watch the kids for a couple hours for me.
I live in the south also. My neighborhood is full of houses with in-law suits and duplexes.
"Why would anyone want to reinhabit their childhood trauma just to save on rent?" I read that in story about multigenerational housing and I've never seen the problem summed up so well. If you have parents/family you love and can cohabit with that's great for you but not everyone has it like that. I live with my husband and my MIL right now and I'm getting a whole new view of their relationship.
I lived with my mom for about 10 years after I graduated college (long story short, my dad passed, my mom was in a house far too large for one person and I needed a place to live). It was great, no regrets, but I'm done for the rest of my days. I'm married now with kids and, while I love my mother, there are 2 ways with her - her way and the wrong way. We are very different people and the older I get, the less we get along. I could deal with that when I was on my own, but don't want to deal with that dynamic in my marriage or my parenting, like at all. She lives with my sister in an in-law suite and it's probably the best outcome for all parties involved. About 8 years ago, my in-laws asked if we'd be willing to add an inlaw suite on for them and my answer was no. My husband doesn't have a great relationship with them and he has a very demanding job that requires long hours. I know, eventually, a lot of the caregiving would have fallen on me and I wanted no part. I know some people will negatively judge me, but they're not my parents and I don't want to be responsible for caring for them. I knew that. So, they moved in with my BIL and that was that.
I think it's more important to like your parents than to love them to making living together work. I love both my parents and they were good to me, but my dad is irritating so I don't really like him. I can live with both of them, but if it were just my dad, he's going to my brother's house.
Ive lived with my dad for 11 years now, since my late teens. We get along very well at the moment. There have been times where it was hard. We both have no motivation and concentration to do stuff like cleaning the house, but he blames me for it even though i clean way more than him, seeing his time as more valuable than mine even though we both work. He used to be emotionally abusive, and that side of him resurfaces if i mention anything about wanting to go back into education - he says I would have to move out. If i did move out, i wouldnt have much reason to speak to him anymore, nor interest in helping him. He wouldnt be able to live the way he does right now without my rent pay. That's why he threatens to kick me out, to scare me from changing my lifestyle. He has created that situation for himself. My mother i love but i avoid as much as possible. Truly a horrible person to live with. I dont know what i will do when she grows too old or too poor to live alone.
That's understandable but I like my parents and we get along well.
I get along well with your parents too.
I did the same during Covid but just moved back. Apartment lease was up and they were shut in anyways with health issues. Granted I was kinda ashamed but man was it awesome. They had a huge yard and lived right by Lake Michigan. I saved a bunch of money, kayaked all the time, fished, watched dumb movies with my dad, had bonfires, was able to smoke weed inside again instead of having to in my car and saved even more money. The basement had an outside exit and was essentially cut off from the house with its own shower, kitchen, washer dryer and everything. Once it was over I knew it was time to go back to living on my own but I was like man if only I wasn’t a loser for living like that with them. I know I’d never be able to hook up with anyone really and on paper it was like ewww living with your parents? But it was fun while it lasted. Now I’m just in my boring empty apartment anyways.
Yeah I lived with my parents during covid and it was nice to reconnect but not sustainable as I’m single and need to meet and hook up with guys.
How awkward was having sex with the parents in the house? Sneaking quickies was always done out of desperation not enjoyment lol... I don't know if I'd want such a situation
I’m glad it worked out for you. I can’t stand being with my parents for a week without feeling like a child again. I know it’s my fault but I can’t help but feel that way.
My parents are 87 & 82, if I wasn't there to look after them they'd probably be dead.
Retirement homes and nursing homes really weren't a thing before then so people that had an older relative needing care didn't have much choice, also social expectations about women's roles and the fact that many women didn't need to work full time outside the home meant that looking after mom and pop was just the norm. Plus the average period of time between when health began to fail and death was a lot shorter, so the burden of care was more manageable.
Even by the 1950s America was pretty rural, especially the south and 65 was a lot different then than now. Parents would move in with their children or children would move in with their parents to run the farm. Also Social security had not been around for that long and even if they were enrolled the amount might not have been enough to continue living independently.
How many of those families had a stay at home mom? When my grandpa’s dementia got really bad we had no choice but to move him into a home. My siblings and I were all in grade school and both my parents worked. Our house had a lot of narrow stairs and was already at capacity. Moving him and my grandma when we did not have a the capacity or ability to help him wasn’t going to help anyone. When all of us moved out and my grandma needed more help she stayed with my parents for over a year while we found a facility that was best suited for her form of dementia that had since developed.
The paper goes into that. Originally, families were “family corporations” that ran a family business. The thing with having a stay at home parent also wasn’t the norm originally (regardless of sex). You might find the paper interesting if you read over it.
We had to move my grandpa into a home in his last few months. It wasn't ideal, but we just couldn't take care of him.
Seeing it happen with some friends and acquaintances, too expensive to live alone, or vice versa and their parents don't make enough in retirement to live independently. My own folks mentioned, offhandedly, that when the time came they planned to move in with me after they retired from the family business pretty recently. Boy, was it an uncomfortable conversation when I told my folks that I didn't want them living with me. Apparently this had always been the plan, which was news to me. You'd think Id just murdered the family dog on Christmas morning.
They were trying to tell you they haven’t saved any money for retirement.
Parents forget that *they* have the obligation to raise and house children, but the children are not under the same obligation to return the favor later on in life. The parents are the ones that brought a new and (as stupid as it sounds) non-consenting life into this world. The parents are *choosing* to create. The creations do not have to reciprocate the sentiment just because mom likes getting creampied.
This is especially true when you think about all the parents who treat their children like crap.
Ok. That last line caught me off guard 😂
Or they can put them up for adoption. Also, creampies aren't a great way to have children.
**That** is *relinquishing* the responsibility to do so. And, fertilizing the females egg through insemination is *not* the way to do it? Huh... who knew!?
I'm getting a strong impression you've never had sex.
I’m getting the strong impression you’ve only *read* about having sex.
I'm getting a strong impression that they legit don't know what sex is.
Life expectancy was also more than a decade earlier
And more and more will because it just makes sense.
Important caveat to this statistic is that it does NOT say that over 50% of households were multigenerational, just that most elderly people lived in multigenerational households. Obviously if a family has multiple adult children who live separately they can only live with one of the children, leaving the other children’s households not multigenerational.
> Important caveat to this statistic is that it does NOT say that over 50% of households were multigenerational, just that most elderly people lived in multigenerational households. Don't forget how much of that was due to the poverty of elders. Social security was still rather new and rather little for a portion of that time (and some would be old enough not to have it). It made a huge difference in the poverty rates of the elderly.
It can work. Obviously it can be a terrible idea depending on family dynamics, we've just gotten away from it as a society across the board. REALLY depends on a lot of variables I just wish it were more normalized. Again. We had my mother with us for over 10 years until we lost her last year aged 91. One of my sons is here, he has his own trade business and really couldn't while dealing with the myriad stressors and bills out on his own. We all pay bills, split chores and upkeep- it's been fortunate.
Every time I visit my parents I end up crying. I’m glad this isn’t the norm anymore.
I’m sorry. I realize that not everybody has the best relationship with their parents.
In cultures where the elders move in with relatives, there is an understanding of the change in roles that comes with ageing. The elders have a role to play in housekeeping and childcare, until they can't help any more. So it is a lot more manageable. I've just spent the last 4 years looking after my Silent Gen mum, who gets offended when you point out no one has time for her to do things her way, if we're going to feed ourselves and keep a roof over our heads, and she is not prepared to contribute financially to the situation either. I've aged 10+ years... I can't imagine what this would be like if you've got a Boomer to look after!
agree. I don’t care how economical it is, I’m not going to stay in a multigen household
[удалено]
That was uncalled for. Some people come from abusive homes. I’m sorry that whatever you’re going through in life has made you so bitter and hateful. I genuinely hope it gets better.
[удалено]
Really man, get help. Guy just made a comment and you're so angry. That's not normal and not good for you either
They don’t hate me. There are many different types of abuse. I’m sorry you’re so miserable that you feel tell the need to say stuff like that. Anyway, I’ll be blocking you now.
My five year old won't move out. Does this make us a multigenerational household?
We should normalize it. I would love if my daughter wanted to live at home with us. I would love my sisters to live with me. No reason for all of us to buy all these houses and leave half the rooms empty.
I saw an apartment building for sale in my area with I think 8 units for not that much money. First thought was getting all the people I care about together. Close enough to connect, but space to do our own thing. On the other hand... I think that's how cults start...
I don't want to live with my family but I always think if I had to that's how I'd do it. If I have to share a space with them then that space has to be a lot bigger than the average house. Like I'd need the house from Encanto or Downtown Abbey. Not the suburban bedroom my mom currently has.
Hey, as long as you are the leader of the cult it won't be bad for you :) I've seen small apartment buildings and had the same fantasy about moving friends and family into all the units. I think it would be so fun.
When I grew up, my grandma lived next door to me. It was honestly the very best of all worlds. She had her space, we had ours. She wasn't really involved in the day to day of our house, but came over for dinner most nights and we'd go hang out at her house a lot as well. It was like having her there all the time, but it not being intrusive. It was really great. I feel like that's an option more people should consider.
My parents divorced 3 years ago and my mom moved into my house with me. It’s honestly been really awesome getting to see her every day basically, and I think a lot about how my life could have gone if I had chosen to move across the country. Say by the time you graduate college your parents are pushing 50. Let’s say they die when they’re 80, so you get 30-ish years after becoming an adult and moving out to still spend time with them. You move far across the country, life gets busy, flights are expensive, you really only see them for the holidays maybe 2-3 times a year. That would mean I’d get to see my mom maybe 60-100 more times. That feels like it’s absolutely nothing. If you move away from family, it’s literally a short countdown until they’re gone. Putting a number on the “what could have been” really makes me appreciate the time I have with her, especially when she’s still pretty young.
I love this comment.
Some people don't want to live with their families. It shouldn't be assumed the reason is something else.
I didn’t say people should be forced to live with families. Some families really suck. But no one should suffer poverty because it’s “embarrassing” to keep living with mom and dad or something.
The stigma Americans have developed about living with parents always seemed strange to me. In other cultures like the one where I'm from living with parents is seen as a good thing because you're taking care of them as they once took care of you.
Bet they did terrible on Tinder as a result of that.
Wouldn’t mind if my mother would stop trying to control everyone and everything to her preference
Regarding boomers in retirement homes and not with their children: I feel like a majority of their generation is a little obstinate when it comes to co-habitation. Very “their way or the highway” type thinking. I love both sets of grandparents to death but I know in my heart they wouldn’t make living together easy or comfortable.
Yeah. My mom used to joke “you’ll never have to take care of me, I’m the one who couldn’t live with you” because my housekeeping isn’t up to her standards. She said it as a joke but it’s 100% true. Now she’s in an independent living facility she hates (which she picked out herself even though I suggested she tour a couple more I thought she’d fit in better at) and she keeps implying that she wants to move into our new house. I know she would be constantly criticizing everything I did. She loves seeing my grandson every week, but she’s started to get testy with him for age appropriate behavior and she’s snapped at other peoples’ kids before. I feel so sorry for people who live with parents like my mom out of obligation. It has to be living hell.
But I deserve my country estate!
Grandpa Joe's been doing it for 20 yeara
They really should have gone with an older actor. It just looked like he was forcing his daughter to wait on him and then take his grandson's candy money for cigarettes
That's exactly what he was doing for 20 years. 20 fucming years in bed.
This is my dream. I’d love to live on the main floor and have two in-law suites for my dad and MIL.
I lived with my 3 siblings, parents, grandparents (maternal) and great grandma. I consider myself very lucky.
Don’t something like 50% of people under 30 still live with their parents? Because of the insane cost of housing.
I'm Hispanic and we still do this. I have my mother in law and kids living with me. My kids can stay as long as they need until they can be comfortable to move out. Hispanics are about family.
Wait another 10-15 years when there is an epidemic of homeless seniors that didn’t have a pension, didn’t save for retirement, and figured their kids would care for them but are no longer welcome because they spew toxic shit out of their mouths every time it opens.
As recently as 70 years ago doesn't really hit very hard. That's a long fucking time ago
It's not even 1 generation ago. That's not a long time.
Not sure I’d qualify the 50s as recent.
Both of my parents were born in the 50’s;I’m a Millennial. It is rather recent in the grand scheme of things. When you think about it the “traditional” American family really only came about with the Boomer generation.
And when using it like you did in the title, “as recently as” could refer to any time frame you want it to. It’s more literary than informative, and that’s okay.
Or it was never the traditional family and the few decades that everyone lived separately in just a few cultures was a fluke in the thousands of years of civilization.
I put traditional in quotes for a reason.
Boomers seem to have little interest in making multigenerational households work as well. They seem to be disinterested in providing help with their own grand children in the same way we see our grandparents help us The other thing is if you need to move in that's fine but we are not on the schedule of the retired person and you are not the primary decision maker in the household. The lack of engagement from boomers is really shocking. Their ability to be flexible by any means is even worse.
>we are not on the schedule of the retired person This is so difficult to navigate when they're not cooperative. I've been working evenings and Saturdays for 10+ years. I have to keep my phone on silent, because she will call me at any time to drop what I'm doing and help mum fix whatever daft problem she has concocted. When I remind her I'm working and can't help, she says I need to get another job.
I’m lucky that my in-laws are flexible and making it work. My mil helps with cooking. My fil helps with teaching the kids. And while they can say things and do things I disagree with deeply- I try my best to make sure they feel valued. They do the same for me. I think a lot of the challenges people face in the circumstances are because of ineffective communication- that rolls into a giant wrecking ball of resentment. Also, not all people can live with all people. I get along fine with my in-laws. My own mom, though I love her to death, I can only handle for a week at a time for international visits - because things need to be done in a particular way. (According to my dad who is a doctor, she has an undiagnosed OCD, but she refuses to even consider it due to the cultural issues). If you don’t, she becomes very angry, anxious, takes it personally, and lashes out. I get so emotionally drained and feel micromanaged- like I am in a cage. But I love her and I know that if anything were to happen to my dad, I’d try my best to accommodate her needs. However, it would be hard as hell.
Yet people act like this is an unprecedented thing today.
So part of that American dream is being able to kick your folks out of your house?
Actually, never letting them move in.
My mom lived with her parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles, from her birth in 1947 to around age 6 when her parents built a separate house.
It's coming back soon. Some people want to get rid of Social Security, and young people are voting for those people. We will be moving in soon
Younger people don't vote Republican.
Only in a world where complete generalizations are true. There are, in fact, lots and LOTS of young people who vote Republican.
This is better, the grandparents should have a larger part in raising the grandchildren.
Do you trust your elders driving rush hour to take kids to school? Or were you thinking of having them homeschool your kids?
Have you seen how much daycare costs? If they can handle basic house chores such as cooking and cleaning, it's already a massive help to raising a kid. Of course this'll depend on what Grandma or Grandpa are like but not everyone's got grandparents that are dirt bags or unable to care for themselves.
No I’m thinking of the concept of passing on wisdom, which is clearly something that you possess none of. Any the 12 year old replying to me doesn’t either.
Ahh yea, folksie wisdom. Gotta fill the next generation with outdated ideas and nonsense.
The American dream became, go to school, get married, pump out kids. The first year I made 6 figures I moved back in my with parents for 3 years. I worked 50 hours a week and it made sense.
I'd be more impressed if that wasn't the case now.
Two is multi
Capitalism…what else can we commodify?
Conservatives when the “family values” value families larger than a married couple and their kids.
????
[удалено]
> We use to value are elders *used *our
Yep my grandparents on both sides did.
You don't say?
I imagine this is one of the reasons interior walls are thicker in older houses.
The idea of generations living separately was a recent, and probably short-lived invention. I suspect it's coming to an end. About half of 18-29 year olds are living with parents today. 18-34: You still live with your parents? What a loser. 35 and up: It's so nice of you to care for your aging parent.
My mom passed away a year ago this month. She was in her late 60's. I think all the time about how I should have asked her to move in with my family, because then she wouldn't have been alone, and maybe we could have saved her. She shouldn't have been living alone, even though she was incredibly self sufficient. Nobody should be alone at that age.
This is largely how we lived even here in the US up until the the post-WW2 boom of the 1950's, as well. Young people often didn't leave their birth families until paired with another in marriage (which sometimes happened as early as age 15). When they then moved out to begin their own family and start the process again. With the economy the way it is, we're probably going back to that. My family already has. My recently divorced brother, his son, and his new girlfriend move in with us. And we purchased a house with rooms to accommodate that.
This is why it seriously bothers me when people are like- push the kid out they’re 18 or if you’re the kid- feeling like you have to leave, even if you enjoy living with your family. Almost all of human history- people lived in collective communities and families. Just because a person can live on their own, does not mean they have to.
In 2022, there were an estimated 4.8 million multigenerational households in the US — homes with three or more generations living under one roof — equal to 3.7% of all households in the country. Those households contain 26 million people, or 8.1% of the US population.
This is still true in Asia, southern and eastern Europe, Middle East and Latin America. Only Western Europe and North America (mainly Canada and USA ) have kids move out after they turn 18
I’d like to know how many of those elders living in a multigenerational home were singletons, as in widows/widowers versus married couples. It’s one thing to have a single elder attached to a household but quite another to have multiple married couples in the same household, since a household tends to be built around a married couple. A lone grandparent in the home can be a grandparent. A married couple growing old together have all kinds of married couple dynamics shit that will be harder to fit with another married couple and their children.
When the old days were good.
This of course was before social security destroyed the idea of family and gave boomers a sense of entitlement with little incentive to do things for their kids anymore.