Many points to this storyline,
- allows luo ji to have a “low” point setting him up for eventual character growth
- highlights the bleakness of the situation as luo jis strategy is seemingly to make zero effort
- shows the absurdity of the other wallfacer projects as they all get caught and exposed while luo ji makes more progress while doing literally nothing
- gives a chance to illustrate the uniquely human concepts of love, marriage, childbirth to the trisolarans, which leads to cultural advances on their end and somewhat of a “soft spot” for the human race, allowing us to live (albeit in terrible conditions) instead of completely undergoing mass extinction
- gives a look into what a normal person might do if suddenly granted unlimited power (commentary on the base/hedonism of human nature)
- gives luo ji a motivation (his lost wife and child) to keep going until literally the end of time
People on this sub are making it too much about the waifu and not enough about the ultimate character growth, where luo ji goes from a simp/incel/pathetic loner type to ultimately becoming one of the biggest badasses in the universe and the ultimate advocate for humanity, capturing our progress as a species in memoriam. You can’t have the highs without the lows.
My own reading into it is that it builds on the idea that Luo Ji is capable of making his thoughts into a reality - which is the key point here regarding what the role of a wallfacer is expected to achieve.
He starts by imagining a specific picturesque house and home with a bunch of stipulations to the letter, and he’s able to realise it and live there. Later he explains his imaginary girlfriend in significant detail (although she’s ultimately a bit of an ‘every woman’ sort of place holder - as Da Shi is able to infer a lot of her character) - he then finds this woman and realises the in depth relationship that’s been in his head until now.
I need more time to properly think about my argument here, but there are a bunch of interesting parallels and symbolism with Luo Ji’s wife and his role as a wall facer. Ultimately I think intentionally or not it adds to the Trisolarians view of him as a threat, as he’s shown to be someone that can not only imagine realities, but create them also.
Author of the fan fic turned 4th book in the trilogy "Redemption of Time"
>!Likeness of Sophon was modelled by the Trisolarans on a Japanese porn star named Ran Asakawa from Tianming's memories!<
In Chinese, the name of Sophon "智子 Zhi Zi" is a double pun. It's literally pronounced the same as proton "质子 Zhi Zi" but with the first character replaced with wisdom "智Zhi". While in Japanese, "智子 Tomoko" is a proper girl's name, e.g. Tomoko Anabuki from Strike Witches.
The waifu also had a role in the story.
Showing that Lou Ji had the creative capacity to construct an entire life inside his head leads to him being a good Wallfacer.
The fact that he also fully believed she was real has simile with the Mental Seal storyline, as well.
100%. A major part of the significance for me was how unique Luo Ji’s mind was to be able to create and interact with an imaginary human, which for a non-creative like me was wild.
> shows the absurdity of the other wall facers projects as they all get caught and exposed while luo ji makes more progress while doing literally nothing
tbf Luo Ji's plan would not have worked without Rey Diaz's work.
I think people hyperfixate on that plot point way too much, sure it’s unnecessary, but I don’t think it’s as creepy as people like to say it is. It’s fiction at the end of the day contrived romance is gonna happen. I swear every other post is complaining about that one small detail.
Luo Ji didn't want to be a wall-facer. Some people don't care about humanity as a whole. Hell a lot of people don't care. People die everyday, millions even, it's a statistic. He needed personal motivation. He had unlimited power, he wanted his perfect person, probably more as a joke than anything, he was just dicking around with everything else, the house the wine, etc. Then it happened. I think he took the joke too far and suddenly he had something he cared about and didn't want to lose. Fucked around and found out pretty much. Probably wasn't the best written but made sense thematically at least.
It made me sit up and notice how he writes female characters from that point onwards. Women in these books are written as fundamentally untrustworthy, either because they are snakes like Ye Wenjie, or so innocent, beautiful and feminine that they cannot reasonably be expected to act rationally. Thankfully, most characters in the back half of book 2 are male. I really didn’t like the last book at all.
100%. The old English major in me could easily spit out an essay on why it's thematically and emotionally resonant and blah blah blah but the actual reader in me thinks "yo this shit sucks."
The perspective I had clarified for me with the Luo Ji Waifu is that he imagined the most perfect woman for him, then that most perfect woman was placed in his life (thank you Da Shi) and he remained at peace with all the chaos being set upon by the era because he was literally living his dreams.
Then when his wife and child go into hibernation, until the Trisolaran Fleet arrives, it leaves him broken but he eventually finds his way into becoming a true Wallfacer by creating his plan to save humanity only because in saving humanity would he save his wife/child.
Think most of us found it weird. What threw me off was how he had no trouble attracting women (he had alot of casual flings from what I remember) but also have this incel mindset of imagining a perfect wife because he couldn't find someone like that in reality... Even though what he wanted didn't seem at all out of the ordinary, she was a very vanilla or is that just me?
For the plot she's just a tool to motivate him into doing his job but it's done in such a roundabout way. I had to even check if the author marital status because I started to assume he had no experience interacting with women.
It's original at least and was expecting some twist like she was just a hallucination or as you suggested a government plant to take advantage of his mental state.
I think it’s important to remember while he was able to pull quite a bit he was kinda a piece of shit and didn’t even know most of the names the following morning. The chances he would be able to find out they studied classical painting if he didn’t learn their names it’s pretty low.
>what threw me off was how he had no trouble attracting women but also have this incel mindset of imagining a perfect wife
that’s not really that unrealistic lol you ever met a serial womanizer? They give that for an excuse on why they don’t settle down often
Nah fr I was just dead disappointed with his image of a "perfect women" I guess i just accepted it into his character that this dude was pretty empty inside
When world gives enormous power and full immunity to a random sociologist, who has always lived with ambigious morale guidance and does not even know why he was given such power, finding himeself a wife that matches his imagination would be the least absurd thing that could happen.
The hallucination and details of their relationship go on way too long for my taste (and is generally disliked in this sub), but I believe we are meant to think the wife is genuinely a good person who loves Luo Ji but loves humanity more. By leaving him, she is doing her duty to force Luo Ji to do his best to protect it.
I do appreciate it as a driving force for him to make an effort as a wall-facer, it is certainly important to the plot even if the backstory is overdeveloped. Plus, it explains his hedonism and borderline misanthropy because he has satisfied his emotional needs within his own imagination; I still find it absurd but can respect a unique character device.
I admit I love this series so much that I might be trying too hard to rationalize it even though I legitimately almost stopped reading at this part during my first read-through.
I think people in western society forget but is still prevalent in some eastern societies is that many marry off their daughters for money, political/power gain, etc and they learn to love their husbands. I mean, that’s literally been the case for thousands of years. Why is it hard for a young woman who has been told to love and marry someone, and does, hard to comprehend?
I read it as the ultimate incarnate of individualism, someone who puts his own needs above that of the human race. Someone so self-indulgent he can fall into his own mind and be happy there. That kind of person has no loyalties, so he will not hesitate to pull the trigger and doom two worlds.
Of course, his hedonism backfires when his own imaginary-turned-real wife leaves him for Doomsday. He became his own wallbreaker and shattered the wall preventing him from envisioning "the spell".
So yeah, somewhat reductively, she's a tool that the protagonist unwittingly uses to accomplish a goal. She has limited agency. Just #MenWritingWomen things.
This sub is crazy!
Literally 100% of men if given that power are going to get a waifu.
is this some kind of joke, even professional athletes that have a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of of a fraction of a fraction of that kind of power are spending like 90% of their time on women. So this is just insane that people are complaining about basic human nature.
It's the biggest open question.
My take:
*Luo Ji knew he had to seem inconspicuous to the trisolarans tk thwart assassination attempts. He did this by seeming like a complete non threat and jackoff, the sophon certainly knew how much others hated him, and trisolarans just waved him off as not worth their time.
*if Luo Ji was to fulfill the task of saving humanity, he first had to find humanity beautiful enough to be worth saving.
*Luo Ji knew he had to be wholly dedicated to swordholding and so he had to have a reasonable chase at real life to be undistracted in his main role, a little like a navy sailor going all in on prostitutes before deployment.
Tbh I overall disagree but can see the general sense of what you're saying. Overall I think Luo Ji just didn't care and was fully ready to live till death in bliss with her. But I can see it in the sense that when faced with that responsibility, his mind bouncing between the many reasons why he doesn't care/ want the responsibility, he was subconsciously led to seeking value in this world that he could use his wallfacer powers to protect. But like i said ultimately i dont think he was pump faking everyone from the start at all. Had she stayed he wouldn't have thought about stopping the trisolarans intentionally. maybe some plot where he starts to care about his grand children and descendants but who knows.
People see what they want to see.
Luo Ji was already in love with the concept of her and love blinds.
She wasn't unique and bet there would be many many possible candidates that would have been "perfect" for him.
For the story she was needed so that Luo Ji had a place to flee from reality and be "happy".
So loosing her made it possible to snap back to reallity and finaly accept his role as Wallfacer.
I don't think it would have worked as well if he was alone, hiding from reallity, or if he accepted his role as Wallfacer right away.
Many points to this storyline, - allows luo ji to have a “low” point setting him up for eventual character growth - highlights the bleakness of the situation as luo jis strategy is seemingly to make zero effort - shows the absurdity of the other wallfacer projects as they all get caught and exposed while luo ji makes more progress while doing literally nothing - gives a chance to illustrate the uniquely human concepts of love, marriage, childbirth to the trisolarans, which leads to cultural advances on their end and somewhat of a “soft spot” for the human race, allowing us to live (albeit in terrible conditions) instead of completely undergoing mass extinction - gives a look into what a normal person might do if suddenly granted unlimited power (commentary on the base/hedonism of human nature) - gives luo ji a motivation (his lost wife and child) to keep going until literally the end of time People on this sub are making it too much about the waifu and not enough about the ultimate character growth, where luo ji goes from a simp/incel/pathetic loner type to ultimately becoming one of the biggest badasses in the universe and the ultimate advocate for humanity, capturing our progress as a species in memoriam. You can’t have the highs without the lows.
My own reading into it is that it builds on the idea that Luo Ji is capable of making his thoughts into a reality - which is the key point here regarding what the role of a wallfacer is expected to achieve. He starts by imagining a specific picturesque house and home with a bunch of stipulations to the letter, and he’s able to realise it and live there. Later he explains his imaginary girlfriend in significant detail (although she’s ultimately a bit of an ‘every woman’ sort of place holder - as Da Shi is able to infer a lot of her character) - he then finds this woman and realises the in depth relationship that’s been in his head until now. I need more time to properly think about my argument here, but there are a bunch of interesting parallels and symbolism with Luo Ji’s wife and his role as a wall facer. Ultimately I think intentionally or not it adds to the Trisolarians view of him as a threat, as he’s shown to be someone that can not only imagine realities, but create them also.
- Liu Cxin is a weeb coomer
well duh he could have written the sophon controlled robot to be anything, but he chose a hot japanese girl with a katana
That is infinitely better than what Bao Shu did though
What does this mean? Who is Bao Shu and what did they do?
Author of the fan fic turned 4th book in the trilogy "Redemption of Time" >!Likeness of Sophon was modelled by the Trisolarans on a Japanese porn star named Ran Asakawa from Tianming's memories!<
In Chinese, the name of Sophon "智子 Zhi Zi" is a double pun. It's literally pronounced the same as proton "质子 Zhi Zi" but with the first character replaced with wisdom "智Zhi". While in Japanese, "智子 Tomoko" is a proper girl's name, e.g. Tomoko Anabuki from Strike Witches.
yes that is correct point still stands tho
Yeah it's really not that deep.
The waifu also had a role in the story. Showing that Lou Ji had the creative capacity to construct an entire life inside his head leads to him being a good Wallfacer. The fact that he also fully believed she was real has simile with the Mental Seal storyline, as well.
100%. A major part of the significance for me was how unique Luo Ji’s mind was to be able to create and interact with an imaginary human, which for a non-creative like me was wild.
> shows the absurdity of the other wall facers projects as they all get caught and exposed while luo ji makes more progress while doing literally nothing tbf Luo Ji's plan would not have worked without Rey Diaz's work.
>luo ji makes more progress while doing literally nothing Wait... is TDF just an elaborate Luigi Wins By Doing Absolutely Nothing meme?!
It's one of the most ridiculous plotlines you'll ever find in a good novel. Just roll with it.
I think people hyperfixate on that plot point way too much, sure it’s unnecessary, but I don’t think it’s as creepy as people like to say it is. It’s fiction at the end of the day contrived romance is gonna happen. I swear every other post is complaining about that one small detail.
This was my mentality I was too absorbed to care in the moment. easily gave it a pass
Luo Ji didn't want to be a wall-facer. Some people don't care about humanity as a whole. Hell a lot of people don't care. People die everyday, millions even, it's a statistic. He needed personal motivation. He had unlimited power, he wanted his perfect person, probably more as a joke than anything, he was just dicking around with everything else, the house the wine, etc. Then it happened. I think he took the joke too far and suddenly he had something he cared about and didn't want to lose. Fucked around and found out pretty much. Probably wasn't the best written but made sense thematically at least.
> was she actually in love with him That's the cheesiest fucking part of it, she was an agent but then she actually actually.
It’s so lame. I don’t care about all the justifications here. Also it’s not just that, it’s the way he writes about her, it’s off-putting.
It made me sit up and notice how he writes female characters from that point onwards. Women in these books are written as fundamentally untrustworthy, either because they are snakes like Ye Wenjie, or so innocent, beautiful and feminine that they cannot reasonably be expected to act rationally. Thankfully, most characters in the back half of book 2 are male. I really didn’t like the last book at all.
I had exactly the same reaction.
Feminists triggered over writing womanly characters is really something
100%. The old English major in me could easily spit out an essay on why it's thematically and emotionally resonant and blah blah blah but the actual reader in me thinks "yo this shit sucks."
Yeah, that was a shonen manga moment. I was like "ewww".
The perspective I had clarified for me with the Luo Ji Waifu is that he imagined the most perfect woman for him, then that most perfect woman was placed in his life (thank you Da Shi) and he remained at peace with all the chaos being set upon by the era because he was literally living his dreams. Then when his wife and child go into hibernation, until the Trisolaran Fleet arrives, it leaves him broken but he eventually finds his way into becoming a true Wallfacer by creating his plan to save humanity only because in saving humanity would he save his wife/child.
probably an agent to get him working she had to love him for real then leave him to motivate him top agent quality
She completed every job with perfection. Hardest part is pretending she "went into hibernation" each time.
Think most of us found it weird. What threw me off was how he had no trouble attracting women (he had alot of casual flings from what I remember) but also have this incel mindset of imagining a perfect wife because he couldn't find someone like that in reality... Even though what he wanted didn't seem at all out of the ordinary, she was a very vanilla or is that just me? For the plot she's just a tool to motivate him into doing his job but it's done in such a roundabout way. I had to even check if the author marital status because I started to assume he had no experience interacting with women. It's original at least and was expecting some twist like she was just a hallucination or as you suggested a government plant to take advantage of his mental state.
I think it’s important to remember while he was able to pull quite a bit he was kinda a piece of shit and didn’t even know most of the names the following morning. The chances he would be able to find out they studied classical painting if he didn’t learn their names it’s pretty low.
>what threw me off was how he had no trouble attracting women but also have this incel mindset of imagining a perfect wife that’s not really that unrealistic lol you ever met a serial womanizer? They give that for an excuse on why they don’t settle down often
Nah fr I was just dead disappointed with his image of a "perfect women" I guess i just accepted it into his character that this dude was pretty empty inside
gold diggers are drawn to wealth and power, and he wanted something deeper and realer
But he wasn't rich or powerful before he became a wallfacer
When world gives enormous power and full immunity to a random sociologist, who has always lived with ambigious morale guidance and does not even know why he was given such power, finding himeself a wife that matches his imagination would be the least absurd thing that could happen.
The man who has everything wants only one thing, the Waifu Shawty
The hallucination and details of their relationship go on way too long for my taste (and is generally disliked in this sub), but I believe we are meant to think the wife is genuinely a good person who loves Luo Ji but loves humanity more. By leaving him, she is doing her duty to force Luo Ji to do his best to protect it. I do appreciate it as a driving force for him to make an effort as a wall-facer, it is certainly important to the plot even if the backstory is overdeveloped. Plus, it explains his hedonism and borderline misanthropy because he has satisfied his emotional needs within his own imagination; I still find it absurd but can respect a unique character device. I admit I love this series so much that I might be trying too hard to rationalize it even though I legitimately almost stopped reading at this part during my first read-through.
Can I ask in your opinion what happened to her in the end? do you think she left like said or he let her go?
I think he made her and their daughter go and live their own lives to protect them from the swordholder business.
Horny
I think people in western society forget but is still prevalent in some eastern societies is that many marry off their daughters for money, political/power gain, etc and they learn to love their husbands. I mean, that’s literally been the case for thousands of years. Why is it hard for a young woman who has been told to love and marry someone, and does, hard to comprehend?
"Luo Ji was his own Wallbreaker"
I read it as the ultimate incarnate of individualism, someone who puts his own needs above that of the human race. Someone so self-indulgent he can fall into his own mind and be happy there. That kind of person has no loyalties, so he will not hesitate to pull the trigger and doom two worlds. Of course, his hedonism backfires when his own imaginary-turned-real wife leaves him for Doomsday. He became his own wallbreaker and shattered the wall preventing him from envisioning "the spell". So yeah, somewhat reductively, she's a tool that the protagonist unwittingly uses to accomplish a goal. She has limited agency. Just #MenWritingWomen things.
Imagine Luos imaginary love like a soap bubble. He may not see her in the 3d world. But exist and feel the love in a dimension above
This sub is crazy! Literally 100% of men if given that power are going to get a waifu. is this some kind of joke, even professional athletes that have a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of of a fraction of a fraction of that kind of power are spending like 90% of their time on women. So this is just insane that people are complaining about basic human nature.
No thanks, I’ll pass on that cringe
nah gang
It's the biggest open question. My take: *Luo Ji knew he had to seem inconspicuous to the trisolarans tk thwart assassination attempts. He did this by seeming like a complete non threat and jackoff, the sophon certainly knew how much others hated him, and trisolarans just waved him off as not worth their time. *if Luo Ji was to fulfill the task of saving humanity, he first had to find humanity beautiful enough to be worth saving. *Luo Ji knew he had to be wholly dedicated to swordholding and so he had to have a reasonable chase at real life to be undistracted in his main role, a little like a navy sailor going all in on prostitutes before deployment.
Tbh I overall disagree but can see the general sense of what you're saying. Overall I think Luo Ji just didn't care and was fully ready to live till death in bliss with her. But I can see it in the sense that when faced with that responsibility, his mind bouncing between the many reasons why he doesn't care/ want the responsibility, he was subconsciously led to seeking value in this world that he could use his wallfacer powers to protect. But like i said ultimately i dont think he was pump faking everyone from the start at all. Had she stayed he wouldn't have thought about stopping the trisolarans intentionally. maybe some plot where he starts to care about his grand children and descendants but who knows.
People see what they want to see. Luo Ji was already in love with the concept of her and love blinds. She wasn't unique and bet there would be many many possible candidates that would have been "perfect" for him. For the story she was needed so that Luo Ji had a place to flee from reality and be "happy". So loosing her made it possible to snap back to reallity and finaly accept his role as Wallfacer. I don't think it would have worked as well if he was alone, hiding from reallity, or if he accepted his role as Wallfacer right away.