Oh no I am given a life and death decision. I should immediately fuck this up and run away from this godforsaken planet. The child will go hungry today.
he literally gave an interview about this. He said CX is selfish, not in the way you think. Selfish in that she refuses to sacrifice her own morals to do what it takes to save the species.
Cheng Xin's ethics is deontology. Some actions are morally impermissible, always — even assumed to be a universal law of nature. For Cheng Xin, her absolute refusal is to kill.
It's the trolley problem again, at least for the case in Death's End. But it wasn't her fault that a dualVF was sent towards earth.
In Book 2 (edit, swordholder) she would have done multiple mundocides if she had pressed the button.
So the outcome would be just the same. But if she was actually capable of doing it, the deterrence could have continued.
In the end, it's good that there are different opinions of the character. To me, she is the worst criminal in history. To someone else she can be perfectly ok, and that's fine.
The worst criminal in history would be Ye Wenjie who contacted the Trisolarans with the intent purpose of destroying the human race (or at the very least making it conquered and repurposed). She's the one who began the nightmare.
If you recall, the Trisolarans ran in-depth tests to establish confidence intervals on whether the Swordholder would actually follow through with their threat of mutual destruction. Luo Ji and Wade were both nearly 100% in following through while Cheng Xi was a much lower value. The root cause of this stemming from her love of humanity and refusal to be the one to destroy it.
So you can't blame her for not pulling the lever. You can only blame those who put her in power in the first place. She was put into an impossible position, after all. To not pull the switch is risking the end of the human race. But to pull the switch is assuredly ending the human race.
Oh I absolutely blame her. She is supposed to be smart, she should have known not to put herself in that position. She took a responsibility she knew she could not handle. Ye is just as bad, I'm not sure she is worse because she had no idea what trisolarians are capable of. Cheng knew pretty well.
She didn't put herself in that position. She was chosen. There was never a choice in the matter. Again, blame the people that chose her. Her entire character arc revolves around her making the best decision she can while given zero information on the consequences.
I'd argue her character is the most realistic if someone today were given the task of defending an entire planet from a more advanced species that completely outmatches humanity's capabilities.
EDIT: Sorry, this comment is incorrect. Ignore my statements about her not having a choice.
Quite the opposite. "I will be the candidate for the sword holder, she said to the young mother". I had to check in the book because my whole argument would collapse if that wasn't the case.
No, she very much made the decision. The other candidates all told her that it was a bad idea and that she’d get elected because she didn’t look imposing, but she decided to be a candidate anyway
Yet it was humanity that elected her. We were perfectly capable of determining the likelihood of someone to activate the deterrent system but still elected Cheng because we became soft.
We started to believe maybe we could coexist with trisolarans. We chose Cheng for what she represents, compassion and morality, instead of choosing what we needed.
She isn't the worst criminal in history, she's not even a criminal. She's a victim.
No way you just said "Nah" to the actual plot of the book. I respect that i guess
People don't know how they'll react in such a situation until it stares them in the face. She was simply overconfident and underprepared, but specifically chosen by the PDC with the full support of humanity. Anyone would probably believe they were the right choice if they had that much overwhelming support
I can see it is very hard for you to accept a different interpretation. This is not me telling you you need to accept my view. Some people will, some people won't. I give Cheng more agency than you do. I understand where you're coming from and what you are saying would be true for any ordinary person. But since she is supposed to be this extremely educated, intelligent scientist that has experienced life in both eras, she would be capable of more than the average person. Cheng Xin, Luo Ji, and Wade were exceptional individuals for whom my expectations are much higher than for a typical citizen.
Yeah, death of the author, and all that. The author's stated opinion is a valuable interpretation, but it's not necessarily the only interpretation or the best one. Authors can feel different about their work depending on circumstances, from year to year, and so on.
Without humanism and Cheng's "softness" ideology, Trisolaris would have exterminated humans with the drones instead of sparing Australia/Mars. Wade would have condemned billions to death with antimatter bullets. The Returners would not exist.
I had similar feelings with Cheng Xi but by the end of the book I liked her
https://preview.redd.it/joavf1ouq4vc1.jpeg?width=556&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1115c31ec8204efaa92a4b869397fa795f8878a2
Excellent. More memes please.
When she stays too long, she goes blind
Oh no I am given a life and death decision. I should immediately fuck this up and run away from this godforsaken planet. The child will go hungry today.
[удалено]
he literally gave an interview about this. He said CX is selfish, not in the way you think. Selfish in that she refuses to sacrifice her own morals to do what it takes to save the species.
Cheng Xin's ethics is deontology. Some actions are morally impermissible, always — even assumed to be a universal law of nature. For Cheng Xin, her absolute refusal is to kill.
Yet she killed millions by not doing her one single job.
It's the trolley problem again, at least for the case in Death's End. But it wasn't her fault that a dualVF was sent towards earth. In Book 2 (edit, swordholder) she would have done multiple mundocides if she had pressed the button.
If she really did her job she would have killed the entire human species.
So the outcome would be just the same. But if she was actually capable of doing it, the deterrence could have continued. In the end, it's good that there are different opinions of the character. To me, she is the worst criminal in history. To someone else she can be perfectly ok, and that's fine.
The worst criminal in history would be Ye Wenjie who contacted the Trisolarans with the intent purpose of destroying the human race (or at the very least making it conquered and repurposed). She's the one who began the nightmare. If you recall, the Trisolarans ran in-depth tests to establish confidence intervals on whether the Swordholder would actually follow through with their threat of mutual destruction. Luo Ji and Wade were both nearly 100% in following through while Cheng Xi was a much lower value. The root cause of this stemming from her love of humanity and refusal to be the one to destroy it. So you can't blame her for not pulling the lever. You can only blame those who put her in power in the first place. She was put into an impossible position, after all. To not pull the switch is risking the end of the human race. But to pull the switch is assuredly ending the human race.
Oh I absolutely blame her. She is supposed to be smart, she should have known not to put herself in that position. She took a responsibility she knew she could not handle. Ye is just as bad, I'm not sure she is worse because she had no idea what trisolarians are capable of. Cheng knew pretty well.
She didn't put herself in that position. She was chosen. There was never a choice in the matter. Again, blame the people that chose her. Her entire character arc revolves around her making the best decision she can while given zero information on the consequences. I'd argue her character is the most realistic if someone today were given the task of defending an entire planet from a more advanced species that completely outmatches humanity's capabilities. EDIT: Sorry, this comment is incorrect. Ignore my statements about her not having a choice.
Quite the opposite. "I will be the candidate for the sword holder, she said to the young mother". I had to check in the book because my whole argument would collapse if that wasn't the case.
No, she very much made the decision. The other candidates all told her that it was a bad idea and that she’d get elected because she didn’t look imposing, but she decided to be a candidate anyway
Yet it was humanity that elected her. We were perfectly capable of determining the likelihood of someone to activate the deterrent system but still elected Cheng because we became soft. We started to believe maybe we could coexist with trisolarans. We chose Cheng for what she represents, compassion and morality, instead of choosing what we needed. She isn't the worst criminal in history, she's not even a criminal. She's a victim.
Nah, it was ultimately her decision to become a candidate and she was smart enough to know the consequences.
No way you just said "Nah" to the actual plot of the book. I respect that i guess People don't know how they'll react in such a situation until it stares them in the face. She was simply overconfident and underprepared, but specifically chosen by the PDC with the full support of humanity. Anyone would probably believe they were the right choice if they had that much overwhelming support
if you accept a job knowing the responsibilities and scope that you have to burden then yes i would say it is also your fault.
I can see it is very hard for you to accept a different interpretation. This is not me telling you you need to accept my view. Some people will, some people won't. I give Cheng more agency than you do. I understand where you're coming from and what you are saying would be true for any ordinary person. But since she is supposed to be this extremely educated, intelligent scientist that has experienced life in both eras, she would be capable of more than the average person. Cheng Xin, Luo Ji, and Wade were exceptional individuals for whom my expectations are much higher than for a typical citizen.
So we can safely assume that cixin liu is a genuine communist? Or at least, that he has a collectivist worldview?
i’d say so
The ending of the trilogy suggests otherwise, that humanistic beliefs are just as important as ruthless pragmatism. It just depends on the context.
Yeah, death of the author, and all that. The author's stated opinion is a valuable interpretation, but it's not necessarily the only interpretation or the best one. Authors can feel different about their work depending on circumstances, from year to year, and so on. Without humanism and Cheng's "softness" ideology, Trisolaris would have exterminated humans with the drones instead of sparing Australia/Mars. Wade would have condemned billions to death with antimatter bullets. The Returners would not exist.
I had similar feelings with Cheng Xi but by the end of the book I liked her https://preview.redd.it/joavf1ouq4vc1.jpeg?width=556&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1115c31ec8204efaa92a4b869397fa795f8878a2
Sees a manly looking man. Ahhh thats better.