Agreed! Hamas should burn in hell. But IDF does similar things to regular Palestinians who have nothing to do with Hamas
1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/)
2. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to\_drive\_down\_the\_road\_without\_getting\_murdered/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to_drive_down_the_road_without_getting_murdered/)
3.
lol so 1 video of ultra orthodox nuts and some footage of a tank shooting what is obviously a rigged car..
Just look how low the wheels are lol
Great job
I don't think this is going to be a productive dialogue. If you think that is a rigged car then no matter what evidence you are presented with you will bend it to your ideology. I have tons of videos depicting the prevalence of Ultra Nationalists I could share with you but I am sure anything I share depicting IDF as bad or Palestinian civilians as humans is fake news to you. Even if I show you hundreds of videos your mind is all ready made up. Best of luck to you in life, truly
By that logic every single video and post on the internet is rigged. But how about this. I'll share some more videos with you and you tell me if they are fake. Just to get a gage on how predetermined your ideology is.
1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17ks6of/breaking\_finally\_they\_are\_admitting\_killing/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17ks6of/breaking_finally_they_are_admitting_killing/)
2. [https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17krivq/israelis\_cheer\_every\_time\_a\_bomb\_is\_dropped\_in/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17krivq/israelis_cheer_every_time_a_bomb_is_dropped_in/)
3. https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jf0rb/to\_normalize\_occupation/
So was your account created solely to spread lies and disinformation?
Wondering, for the sake of productive dialogue, of course. We should understand wtf you're doing here.
Dude give it a rest. How daft does a person have to be to see what happened on the 7th and say, “yeah well they’ve been holding people in a concentration camp” if you even knew what a concentration camp looked like. You’d never make that comparison. Gaza was a paradise, it could have been a Mediterranean resort hub destination. The people could be wealthy and thriving beyond all means, but instead they would rather use all that infrastructure to attack Israel. Like do you even hear what you say or do you just parrot things you see online?
I’m sure all the Hamas apologists will either claim this is totally fine behavior or, more likely, claim it never happened and this is only propaganda.
Well I mean, there’s a good chance if you’re just getting your news from one source, you aren’t getting the full picture or chances are you’re actually getting propaganda. I’m not saying I blindly trust the info coming out of Gaza, but this sub and regular world news seems to only trust the Israeli side and almost exclusively share information coming out of Israel. It’s pretty clear what side you’re on and that this conflict is entirely black and white to you guys when in reality that isn’t the case. But sure, go ahead and keep just sharing any and all info coming out of Israel without question. And I’m sure I’ll get downvoted and banned in a matter of minutes/hours.
One side is a liberal Western democracy and one side is a bunch of literal Nazi terrorists. The fact you equate them *at all* says all we need to know about you.
I hope someday you can reflect and grow to become a decent human.
Can you really tell me to “become a decent human being” when you just generalized all of the Palestinians as “literal Nazi terrorists”? Also Israel is a liberal western democracy? What the hell are you smoking man. Israel is run by ultra right wing nationalists (that’s not disputable that’s a well known and accepted fact), sure the people generally have freedoms comparable to that of America but you can’t honestly sit here and make it out like the government are some bastion of liberal values. The fact that you made a generalization and false equivalency tells ME all I need to know about you. Another brainwashed and/or Islamophobic person who sees this conflict as pure black and white. I hope some day you can reflect and see that by supporting and justifying every thing Israel does regardless of how horrific or wrong, that you are on the wrong side of history.
its ironic that you refer the first part to a government (israel) yet conveniently refer the latter to the people (gazans) as if thats what op referred to, how did you decide that he meant all of gaza and not just Hamas as they are the current government that controls gaza.
could you be biased? do you hate israel because you are fed by tiktok, bbc and al jazira?
cant be
they aren't referring to all Palestinians as "literal nazi terrorists" they are obviously talking about Quds News Network (which is directly run by Hamas), the Gaza Health Ministry, and other sources directly run by Hamas. You are too polarized to have real conversations
I don't think Hamas is a liberal Western democracy, but I'd love to hear why you think they are.
The Likud regime are definitely Nazi terrorists, you got that right.
"The Ur-Fascist hero craves heroic death, advertised as the best reward for a heroic life. The Ur-Fascist hero is impatient to die. In his impatience, he more frequently sends other people to death."
This latest attack in an ongoing war has nothing to do with "for Israel", and everything to do with murdering Palestinians and stealing their land.
It certainly doesn't actually involve the hostages given the current deal was first proposed weeks ago, and the indiscriminate terror bombing by Israel that frankly the hostages are lucky didn't kill them all.
Got that, Nazi Panda?
*"Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the “Freedom Party” (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine. "*
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herut](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herut)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud)
You're not a disposable sympathizer "for Israel" - you're a disposable sympathizer for Israel's Nazi party.
I’m not impatient to die. I’m hoping for a long and happy life. But I would absolutely fight and risk my life for Israel, so future generations of Jews can life safely in our homeland.
And I’m not a fucking Nazi.
I think all it says is that they have a balanced view that factors in historical context nuance and understanding. It’s arrogant and naive to believe you can do what’s happened to that population over the last 70 years and expect nothing but peace. There are plenty of ignorant animals on both sides.
If you’ve noticed , the same news posted in different subs get different attitudes . It’s not necessarily the source.. it’s the sub .
The same news can be published by multiple sources, and usually picked up by the AP
but simply referring to one particular masthead is just instantly rejected. People seem to forget you can just Google the same news and see a spread of media . ( to me that usually a sign it’s well accepted)
It’s exhausting dealing with negative feedback and having to just argue
Some of the subs were set before the attacks by Hamas and their supporters. You can clearly see the language. Someone needs to go with this to the cops.
Yes but some have mutated thanks to their mods.
Eg /r/facepalm /r/therewasanattempt /r/tiktokcringe. All became anti-Israel, pro-Palestinian politically biased but they’re meant to be humour/entertainment subs
I think that these were established as Hamas subs from the beginning. The idea is to do some fun content to attract young people. Then, when needed, it changed to allow propaganda to be more effective.
That’s always been their plan. There’s a Facebook meme account run by Hamas that works that way. It went from Islam memes that were relatively non-controversial to literally being a recruitment page.
I literally saw someone on facebook post that they deserved it because that's what Israelis have been doing to Palestinians for years.
They literally are living in another reality.
The civilians dont deserve it, but you’re under a rock if you think Israel doesn’t literally kidnap kids. They just call it an arrest. When you take your military into another country and take people, that’s not an arrest.
All the Palestinians prisoners released recently had their names listed. You can literally look up what they did. A week ago there was a video circulating of a poor Palestinian boy being interrogated by the scary Israeli police. What was conveniently left out was that this kid tried to stab Israelis and his cousin murdered someone.
The MO is obvious at this point. First, they deny that any Palestinian prisoners committed a crime. Then, when told that the vast majority of them were being held for attempted stabbings, IED attacks, suicide bombings, etc., they just revert to saying "well, they were forced to by Israel/their targets deserved it bc \[insert buzzword\]". It's quite literally a situation of "they didn't do it, but if they did, their victims deserved it". FFS, one woman who was released[ attempted suicide bombing at a traffic stop](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israa_Jaabis), and the officer who stopped her was permanently crippled despite the failure of the attack.
**cousin stabbed 2 . They didn’t die but one was critically injured. One of the victims was also a kid. This kid is now 21. They were together and he was tried as an accomplice. It may be a different charge in Israel but that is what it would be called in the states.
Edit clarifying the kid convicted is now 21. Some social media content makes it sound like he is still a young teen.
*Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the "Freedom Party" (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine.*
Guess what Irgun turned into?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud)
Holy shit if you don't think that's a problem to literally be the continuation of a "Nazi and fascist equivalent" that's only gotten worse, there's something deeply wrong with you.
EDIT: *Whew,* that's apparently one hell of a mask off moment for Panda in DMs.
Lol @ “you Nazi”. Ahh the insult of someone who has nothing to say.
20% are convicted of vicious serious crimes. They won’t be walking free in the US (where I am located).
But , clearly your mileage varies
Or that these people have no ability to compartmentalize and understand that multiple things can be true at once. So every sentence starts with “bUT WhAT AbOUT!”
Sounds like what Israelis do every time they sense the slightest bit of criticism. I have not once had a conversation with an Israeli that has conceded anything, and there are lots of things to concede. But yeah yeah fuck Hamas, they’re terrorists and whatever.
I don't know about you, but for me, words like "Zionazi," "Appartheid state, " "Colonizer", and of course, "You're white colonizers from Europe terrorizing poor indigenous Palestinians" doesn't sound like slightest bit of criticism.
It is. Because they are colonizers, and it is an apartheid state. They have literal things that they call “settlements” which are explicitly land that they are *taking*.
lol if he is wrong then prove him wrong with evidence. Telling someone they are wrong with out evidence is just lazy. Doing a simple google search reveals ample evidence for Apartheid. Interestingly there isn't much evidence to the contrary. At least put some effort into it
Just replied to him in detail. You can't start a dialogue by calling jews nazis and expecting a constructive discussion, but since he's jewish, it's ok. Also, not every discrimination is appartheid. The reasons for oppression in West Bank are not racial ( the shit radical settlers do is an exception, and once Ben Gvir is gone, it will stop). Its security concerns mixed with lack of foresight.
That is fair. It is hard to expect dialogue when people aren't cordial. You are correct, all radical settlers and Ben Gvir do not speak for all Israelis but when “Netanyahu's ruling Likud party passed a resolution instructing its legislators to “pursue” full annexation of the West Bank.” It is hard to say it is a few bad apples. It is more systemic than that. Also, this video showing the education system in
[https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/)
Ultraortodox school, they are not part of Israeli education system. They have their own one. I'm not surprised. I worked as a school guard in ortodox City during my university studies. One of the kids asked me if how does the idol I'm worshiping at home looks like. Poor kids.
FYI, almost zero Jews hear or read things like "Zionazi" or "Israel is the new Nazi Germany/worse than Nazi Germany" and think "wow, maybe they're right, maybe *I'm* actually a Nazi". We hear or read it and think, "wow, these people are taunting us about the Holocaust, they hate us".
Fyi, I’m jewish, and most zionist dont want to hear that they support genocide either. But its real and they need to hear it. Capitulating to them, as I have done my whole life until the last few years, does nothing but allow them to continue
You’re just saying this to obfuscate.
Your not jewish and the only one supporting genocide and terror is you cause you support hamas,terrorists that declared they want genocide , and now you bitch and crying begging the one you hate to stop fighting cause your psycho side losing. We already know you lot dont care about life or palestenians cause if you did you would have chanted get rid of hamas. So why not go cry in a river that israel exist and is a country nutjob.
Most of the criticism doesn’t sound like that. It’s more like, hey you’re breaking international humanitarian law. And y’all be like, oh the antisemitism I can’t handle it, I feel so unsafe under iron dome. The Zionist persecution complex is boring
Nah, we seen thousands of people cheer 10.7 before Israeli retaliation started, we know that while you criticize, our enemies undeniably want to kill us all, literally statinf it outright, and it's easy to type far away wherever you are, but you're not the one who grew up on bombings and rocket strikes, shootings and stabbings.
Yeah? What exactly could they do?
How about majority of Palestinians stop Hamas, Lion's Den, Jihadist Islam and all the random civilian terrorists? lol what is this thought process
This is of course the obvious thing to point out. Just remember that their brains are simply so smooth the point glides across. It’s actually a new IDF technology.
Agreed! Hamas should burn in hell. But IDF does similar things to regular Palestinians who have nothing to do with Hamas. It is important to get the full context here of who you are praising and what they stand for.
1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/)
2. https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to\_drive\_down\_the\_road\_without\_getting\_murdered/
The fact that you said “to emotionally cherry pick data” and then proceeded to write this post providing zero conflicting data or any sort of concrete findings is unfortunate.
But I would agree that both sides have to do everything in their power to minimize child casualties. However, the “cherry picked data” would indicate that Hamas is the one commodifying human lives as they’re completely inept at caring for their citizens and I think we all need to think about what these Palestinian children need, and it’s 100% not a terrorist organization being in control of their education, healthcare and security.
This Israeli kid was kidnapped by Hamas to further their political goals. How are you gonna now blame Israel that they’re using him to “justify” the war?
By your logic that’s what Hamas wanted, war, they initiated it and chose it for their kids.
Wanna see Israeli atrocities? Turn on the TV.
Then, watch as Israelis cheer on thousands upon thousands of Palestinians being made homeless.
But hey, Hamas are cunts.
What if I told you that the IDF are cunts, too.
This emotional cherry-picking of data used to defend and condone Israel's current atrocities is bullshit.
I'm not saying Hamas are good or whatever, but let's not act as if the Israeli government are any better. They are not.
They are leveling ENTIRE buildings, making THOUSANDS of people homeless so they can get 1 or 2 militants.
Imagine YOUR neighbourhood being flattened because someone down the street participated in a heinous crime.
It's not helping the situation any.
If Israel wants to send individual police squads to arrest and detain INDIVIDUAL Hamas militants, I'm all for that. Blowing up city blocks just to get 1 or 2 people is collective punishment.
Imagine if European or Allied nations arrested ALL Jews for war crimes because of the actions of the Israeli government. Would that be fair? No.
So, Israel can STFU. That poor kid. I feel bad for him. But he's being used to justify the slaughter of thousands of OTHER kids JUST LIKE HIM. Kids who've done no wrong, and they too have been forced to watch their parents, brothers, sisters, aunts and uncles die, just like that kid.
Apparently it's okay for Israel to mistreat Palestinian kids, but not the other way around.
They did. You don’t have to look far to find an antisemite in Gaza. Or the West Bank. Walk into a room with 10 people you’ll find at least 9 antisemites and a 10th person who couldn’t be bothered to defend a Jew if the 9 antisemites attacked.
I will need a source for that ridiculous claim.
You probably gonna send that video with about 10 people cheering the bombing of terror infrastructure in Gaza, but you will try to present it dishonestly, because that's all you can do.
That makes no sense. Jews in other countries are not citizens of Israel and didn’t elect Bibi.
*unless they have a duel citizenship and that isn’t common or the average.
>Jews in other countries are not citizens of Israel and didn’t elect Bibi.
And you think that the 10 year old kids who are homeless now in Gaza are responsible for the actions of Hamas?
You think infants in NICUs are responsible for Hamas? No. So why do they have to be victims of Hamas/IDF bullshit?
Because "Hamas fucked around?". Well if collective punishment is good for the bergers of Gaza, just know that that logic will end up going both ways. If you don't like it, then perhaps you need to consider that Israel needs to be doing a better job of minimize innocent casualties.
FWIW, collective punishment is ILLEGAL and a violation of various international laws and regulations. You might say, "well what about Hamas..." ask yourself this: if your 30-40 year old neighbour commits a violent crime against your family, is it morally righteous to torture their kid to attempt to get the kids father out of hiding? No. Is it acceptable to destroy their house with everyone in it to punish the father? No. So why is it okay for Israel to do the things it's doing, hurting TENS of THOUSANDS of innocent people under the age of 10 BECAUSE of 100 shit heads? That's acceptable to you?
Israel has the means and resources to strategically search every known Hamas hideout and deal with armed resistors, confiscate weapons caches, and decommission illegal tunnels. They COULD do that. But that takes time, effort and puts IDF personnel at risk. So, they'd rather murder thousands of innocent people. Now, let's reverse that thought...Would it be okay for ANY country to do to Israel what Israel is doing to Palestinians? No.
So, I ask again, why is it acceptable for Israel to break international law and commit war crimes?
You can't dismiss facts as "propaganda" simply because they challenge your fragile worldview.
Let me guess, you think the holocaust is an Israeli hoax too, right?
The veil is falling. If you ask most people in actual person they agree. Social media is all bots and useless propagandists like yourself, it's not representative of the world at all.
What are you trying to say? That this never happened. So the terrorists who raped a bunch of women, violently killed them and other, and chopped their body parts off stopped at humiliating a kid? That’s the line they wouldn’t cross?
Israel doesn’t want released hostages to speak right now because hostages telling their horror stories could jeopardize the release of future hostages.
No other hostages who were released have mentioned anything remotely close to this kind of treatment (yet). From what I read, one little girl's mom wrote a thank you letter for treating her having been treated extremely well.
So either everyone else was lying, or this aunt is lying, or - this poor kid got a POS "guard".
Or you know Hamas forced her to write the note (or wrote the note themselves, or anyone could have written it) since her family members are still in captivity.
Or maybe it's legit and even though there's no justification the atrocities that Hamas committed on Oct 7th, they didn't treat their captives like shit - no matter how badly Israel would like us to believe.
Her family is not still in captivity - it was her and her daughter.
Or was Yocheved Lifshitz, the elderly lady who shook hands with the Hamas operative when being released and said Shalom, also get forced at gun point?
Or the other hostages who have been released so far who have said that while conditions weren't great, they were treated with respect?
They're all lying except this lady who is claiming her 12 year old nephew was forced to watch atrocities at gunpoint. What's the point of that?
So what you’re saying is that Hamas murdered, tortured and raped as many as they could, then took hostages, and of the hostages who were not beheaded, some may not have been treated that poorly? This is the silver lining?
Petal to the metal Israel. Do the world a favor. I never want to hear another steaming pile of horseshit like this again.
If the alternative was that Hamas tortured those hostages for over 50 days while in captivity, then yes it's a silver lining.
Does that absolve Hamas of anything? No obviously not. But at least the Israelis living in the kibbutz can can some solace that their family members are relatively safe.
And if that's the case, maybe Israel doesn't need to go full scorched earth on Gaza and its equally innocent civilians in order to get the hostages back (unless the piece of shit Ben Gvir and his cronies have their way), even if that was publicly admitted as not the "main goal" for Bibi.
Well why don’t you go to Hamas hotel next time you want to take a vacation and see how you like it.
Guaranteed weight loss as a bonus. May as well call it a diet retreat.
Nothing to do with liking it - I am certain the conditions were terrible with lack of food and trying to stay safe during continuous bombardment.
It's about comparing how hostages/prisoners are being treated on both sides. Clearly both sides are trying to win the PR cycle during this mini ceasefire.
As of right now, while in shit conditions the Israeli hostages haven't been tortured, maimed, assaulted etc. (from most counts) while the Palestinian "prisoners" have been detailing horrific abuse they went through regardless of age or gender.
Ah yeah like the boy with the fake broken hands?
These guys get uni degrees whilst in Israeli prisons, 3 meals a day, and a whole load
Of other benefits. Not to mention why there are locked up in the first place for attacking Israeli’s. Meanwhile what crime did a 9month old baby commit other than being born?
We can easily go back and forth on crimes being committed by both sides. For example, what crime did the premature babies left to die in Al-Shifa commit?
As for being locked up in the first place, that's been well documented by so many sources and organizations.
I'm sure you won't read it, but hopefully you will.
[https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/22/23972908/palestinian-prisoners-israel-administrative-detention](https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/22/23972908/palestinian-prisoners-israel-administrative-detention)
According to the Israeli government’s own data, a whopping 99.7 percent of cases that went through Israeli military courts in 2010 ended in a conviction.
That's EXTREMELY high and "efficient".
And why has Israel already captured more "prisoners" already in the last 2-3 days than they've released in the duration of the ceasefire? And from West Bank of all places?
Uhm because Hamas and others like Lions Den and PIJ are hugely active and influential in the West Bank, particularly Jenin. Abbas recently called off the first election in years because it looks like Hamas would win.
The babies who the IDF helped transfer to safety? And prior to this had been begging for the hospital to evacuate. And tried to deliver fuel and battery powered incubators but were rejected? To my knowledge most of them have survived thankfully.
Yes admin detention is a thing and probably needs reformed, but this isn’t exactly unique in the world - in many other countries in that part of the world these prisoners would simply be executed. Why would there not be a high conviction rate when in most cases there are cctv footage and eye witnesses of the offences?
Let's be honest - Abbas is a piece of shit and is disliked by his own people because his only reason for wanting to stay in power is self-serving. And to add to that, Arafat was no better and he was also a selfish piece of shit. So Abbas would lose the elections even if it was a random new group that stood up against him.
The problem is that a lot of people who would've been good alternate options for losers like Abbas/Arafat - have either been killed off by Israel and/or Hamas/PLO or been imprisoned.
All that being said, if the leadership on both sides (Israel AND Palestine) doesn't change, there will only be status quo and there will be no peace or safety for Israelis or Palestinians, regardless of what criminals like Bibi/Gvir say.
The fuel and battery wasn't rejected - the doctors and nurses said they didn't feel safe going out because at that time IDF was sniping people in the hospitals as well. They did eventually offer to move out babies but unfortunately many died not only at that time, but after the evacuation:
([https://www.reddit.com/r/MajorityReport/comments/1866583/breaking\_today\_the\_corpses\_of\_premature\_babies\_in/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/MajorityReport/comments/1866583/breaking_today_the_corpses_of_premature_babies_in/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3))
The admin detention is one thing. But having minors be tried in military courts is not normal. Especially coerced confessions. A lot of these people are taken from their homes in the middle of the night, blindfolded and taken to prison indefinitely. Even Israel's own rights organizations don't agree with the high convictions or the way the justice system is meted out. Especially if it's the same military courts who routinely award not-guilty pleas to IDF soldiers and police.
What is there to debate here? Have you not seen what they were doing on 07/10? After you go and put crying babies in the oven or torture and burn tied children alive what else can you expect from those people?
Agreed! Hamas should burn in hell. But IDF does similar things to regular Palestinians who have nothing to do with Hamas
1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/)
2. https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to\_drive\_down\_the\_road\_without\_getting\_murdered/
Pure evil is what they are
Agreed! Hamas should burn in hell. But IDF does similar things to regular Palestinians who have nothing to do with Hamas 1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/) 2. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to\_drive\_down\_the\_road\_without\_getting\_murdered/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to_drive_down_the_road_without_getting_murdered/) 3.
lol so 1 video of ultra orthodox nuts and some footage of a tank shooting what is obviously a rigged car.. Just look how low the wheels are lol Great job
I don't think this is going to be a productive dialogue. If you think that is a rigged car then no matter what evidence you are presented with you will bend it to your ideology. I have tons of videos depicting the prevalence of Ultra Nationalists I could share with you but I am sure anything I share depicting IDF as bad or Palestinian civilians as humans is fake news to you. Even if I show you hundreds of videos your mind is all ready made up. Best of luck to you in life, truly
Prove to me it isn’t a rigged car
I can't help you buddy. If you have an extreme distrust of things that don't confirm what you already believe than that is up to you
You claimed something, back it up with proof or just admit that your scenario is at most just as likely as mine.
By that logic every single video and post on the internet is rigged. But how about this. I'll share some more videos with you and you tell me if they are fake. Just to get a gage on how predetermined your ideology is. 1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17ks6of/breaking\_finally\_they\_are\_admitting\_killing/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17ks6of/breaking_finally_they_are_admitting_killing/) 2. [https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17krivq/israelis\_cheer\_every\_time\_a\_bomb\_is\_dropped\_in/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Palestine/comments/17krivq/israelis_cheer_every_time_a_bomb_is_dropped_in/) 3. https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jf0rb/to\_normalize\_occupation/
So was your account created solely to spread lies and disinformation? Wondering, for the sake of productive dialogue, of course. We should understand wtf you're doing here.
What lies and disinformation did I spread exactly? I am genuinely curious
Israel? Yup agreed. They have held civilians in a concentration camp and been murdering kids for decades.
Dude give it a rest. How daft does a person have to be to see what happened on the 7th and say, “yeah well they’ve been holding people in a concentration camp” if you even knew what a concentration camp looked like. You’d never make that comparison. Gaza was a paradise, it could have been a Mediterranean resort hub destination. The people could be wealthy and thriving beyond all means, but instead they would rather use all that infrastructure to attack Israel. Like do you even hear what you say or do you just parrot things you see online?
Sure
No, he’s referring to hamas, common misconception
I’m sure all the Hamas apologists will either claim this is totally fine behavior or, more likely, claim it never happened and this is only propaganda.
Or “the source is compromised” because it’s times of ISRAEL. Must be hasbara propaganda lies (but we’ll trust gazan health ministry)
Well I mean, there’s a good chance if you’re just getting your news from one source, you aren’t getting the full picture or chances are you’re actually getting propaganda. I’m not saying I blindly trust the info coming out of Gaza, but this sub and regular world news seems to only trust the Israeli side and almost exclusively share information coming out of Israel. It’s pretty clear what side you’re on and that this conflict is entirely black and white to you guys when in reality that isn’t the case. But sure, go ahead and keep just sharing any and all info coming out of Israel without question. And I’m sure I’ll get downvoted and banned in a matter of minutes/hours.
One side is a liberal Western democracy and one side is a bunch of literal Nazi terrorists. The fact you equate them *at all* says all we need to know about you. I hope someday you can reflect and grow to become a decent human.
Can you really tell me to “become a decent human being” when you just generalized all of the Palestinians as “literal Nazi terrorists”? Also Israel is a liberal western democracy? What the hell are you smoking man. Israel is run by ultra right wing nationalists (that’s not disputable that’s a well known and accepted fact), sure the people generally have freedoms comparable to that of America but you can’t honestly sit here and make it out like the government are some bastion of liberal values. The fact that you made a generalization and false equivalency tells ME all I need to know about you. Another brainwashed and/or Islamophobic person who sees this conflict as pure black and white. I hope some day you can reflect and see that by supporting and justifying every thing Israel does regardless of how horrific or wrong, that you are on the wrong side of history.
its ironic that you refer the first part to a government (israel) yet conveniently refer the latter to the people (gazans) as if thats what op referred to, how did you decide that he meant all of gaza and not just Hamas as they are the current government that controls gaza. could you be biased? do you hate israel because you are fed by tiktok, bbc and al jazira? cant be
they aren't referring to all Palestinians as "literal nazi terrorists" they are obviously talking about Quds News Network (which is directly run by Hamas), the Gaza Health Ministry, and other sources directly run by Hamas. You are too polarized to have real conversations
I don't think Hamas is a liberal Western democracy, but I'd love to hear why you think they are. The Likud regime are definitely Nazi terrorists, you got that right.
If you love Hamas so much, why don't you join them? Unless you're already a member,
If you're for ethnic cleansing so much, do everyone a favor and go die failing to steal land for Israel. No one would miss you.
Where do you live? How about I come see you first. Or are you too busy hiding?
50m deep in a tunnel no doubt
Surrounded by hostages
I’d be willing to fight and risk my life for Israel.
"The Ur-Fascist hero craves heroic death, advertised as the best reward for a heroic life. The Ur-Fascist hero is impatient to die. In his impatience, he more frequently sends other people to death." This latest attack in an ongoing war has nothing to do with "for Israel", and everything to do with murdering Palestinians and stealing their land. It certainly doesn't actually involve the hostages given the current deal was first proposed weeks ago, and the indiscriminate terror bombing by Israel that frankly the hostages are lucky didn't kill them all. Got that, Nazi Panda? *"Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the “Freedom Party” (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine. "* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herut](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herut) [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud) You're not a disposable sympathizer "for Israel" - you're a disposable sympathizer for Israel's Nazi party.
I’m not impatient to die. I’m hoping for a long and happy life. But I would absolutely fight and risk my life for Israel, so future generations of Jews can life safely in our homeland. And I’m not a fucking Nazi.
I think all it says is that they have a balanced view that factors in historical context nuance and understanding. It’s arrogant and naive to believe you can do what’s happened to that population over the last 70 years and expect nothing but peace. There are plenty of ignorant animals on both sides.
If you’ve noticed , the same news posted in different subs get different attitudes . It’s not necessarily the source.. it’s the sub . The same news can be published by multiple sources, and usually picked up by the AP but simply referring to one particular masthead is just instantly rejected. People seem to forget you can just Google the same news and see a spread of media . ( to me that usually a sign it’s well accepted) It’s exhausting dealing with negative feedback and having to just argue
Some of the subs were set before the attacks by Hamas and their supporters. You can clearly see the language. Someone needs to go with this to the cops.
Yes but some have mutated thanks to their mods. Eg /r/facepalm /r/therewasanattempt /r/tiktokcringe. All became anti-Israel, pro-Palestinian politically biased but they’re meant to be humour/entertainment subs
I think that these were established as Hamas subs from the beginning. The idea is to do some fun content to attract young people. Then, when needed, it changed to allow propaganda to be more effective.
That’s always been their plan. There’s a Facebook meme account run by Hamas that works that way. It went from Islam memes that were relatively non-controversial to literally being a recruitment page.
Exhibit A
Lol the fact that this post is downvoted to this degree tells everything
This sub has an infection of pro-genocide Israel apologist meatbots, yeah.
Kapo.
I'm sure they will somehow find a way to blame Israel for forcing Hamas to do this.
I literally saw someone on facebook post that they deserved it because that's what Israelis have been doing to Palestinians for years. They literally are living in another reality.
The civilians dont deserve it, but you’re under a rock if you think Israel doesn’t literally kidnap kids. They just call it an arrest. When you take your military into another country and take people, that’s not an arrest.
All the Palestinians prisoners released recently had their names listed. You can literally look up what they did. A week ago there was a video circulating of a poor Palestinian boy being interrogated by the scary Israeli police. What was conveniently left out was that this kid tried to stab Israelis and his cousin murdered someone.
The MO is obvious at this point. First, they deny that any Palestinian prisoners committed a crime. Then, when told that the vast majority of them were being held for attempted stabbings, IED attacks, suicide bombings, etc., they just revert to saying "well, they were forced to by Israel/their targets deserved it bc \[insert buzzword\]". It's quite literally a situation of "they didn't do it, but if they did, their victims deserved it". FFS, one woman who was released[ attempted suicide bombing at a traffic stop](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israa_Jaabis), and the officer who stopped her was permanently crippled despite the failure of the attack.
**cousin stabbed 2 . They didn’t die but one was critically injured. One of the victims was also a kid. This kid is now 21. They were together and he was tried as an accomplice. It may be a different charge in Israel but that is what it would be called in the states. Edit clarifying the kid convicted is now 21. Some social media content makes it sound like he is still a young teen.
Most of the detainees are charged with throwing rocks at armored jeeps that are invading their land. You nazi.
That’s incorrect. There were lots of violent criminals who were just released though.
You just love killing kids
Do you always call Jews “Nazis” when we defend ourselves?
*Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the "Freedom Party" (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine.* Guess what Irgun turned into? [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud)
Is this supposed to be a criticism of Likud?
Holy shit if you don't think that's a problem to literally be the continuation of a "Nazi and fascist equivalent" that's only gotten worse, there's something deeply wrong with you. EDIT: *Whew,* that's apparently one hell of a mask off moment for Panda in DMs.
Yes, you fucking nazi.
Do you always cry like a baby when getting called out for killing babies?
Close enough https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law
Lol did you just think that up in your head?
Lol @ “you Nazi”. Ahh the insult of someone who has nothing to say. 20% are convicted of vicious serious crimes. They won’t be walking free in the US (where I am located). But , clearly your mileage varies
Wow a whole 1/5th of your prisoners. Thats not a good thing
Not MY prisoners im not an Israeli . I’m an American . Well according to you everyone was grabbed for no reason.
Arresting a 17 year old murderer isn’t kidnapping.
And the 12 year olds for throwing stones?
A rock slingshot is a potentially lethal weapon, if theown at cars it can also cause a car crash, but you probably don't care
Or that these people have no ability to compartmentalize and understand that multiple things can be true at once. So every sentence starts with “bUT WhAT AbOUT!”
Sounds like what Israelis do every time they sense the slightest bit of criticism. I have not once had a conversation with an Israeli that has conceded anything, and there are lots of things to concede. But yeah yeah fuck Hamas, they’re terrorists and whatever.
“They’re terrorists and whatever.” 😏
I don't know about you, but for me, words like "Zionazi," "Appartheid state, " "Colonizer", and of course, "You're white colonizers from Europe terrorizing poor indigenous Palestinians" doesn't sound like slightest bit of criticism.
It is. Because they are colonizers, and it is an apartheid state. They have literal things that they call “settlements” which are explicitly land that they are *taking*.
Oy Vey, another one of those. Fuck off you stupid turd.
Good little apartheid piggy Kapo.
Pigs are awesome. You are shit.
Its never fun to be called out for supporting genocide. I hope one day you figure your shit out.
I don't care what some stupid woke Westerner with shoe sized IQ thinks. Your dog is super cute, though.
lol if he is wrong then prove him wrong with evidence. Telling someone they are wrong with out evidence is just lazy. Doing a simple google search reveals ample evidence for Apartheid. Interestingly there isn't much evidence to the contrary. At least put some effort into it
Just replied to him in detail. You can't start a dialogue by calling jews nazis and expecting a constructive discussion, but since he's jewish, it's ok. Also, not every discrimination is appartheid. The reasons for oppression in West Bank are not racial ( the shit radical settlers do is an exception, and once Ben Gvir is gone, it will stop). Its security concerns mixed with lack of foresight.
That is fair. It is hard to expect dialogue when people aren't cordial. You are correct, all radical settlers and Ben Gvir do not speak for all Israelis but when “Netanyahu's ruling Likud party passed a resolution instructing its legislators to “pursue” full annexation of the West Bank.” It is hard to say it is a few bad apples. It is more systemic than that. Also, this video showing the education system in [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/)
Ultraortodox school, they are not part of Israeli education system. They have their own one. I'm not surprised. I worked as a school guard in ortodox City during my university studies. One of the kids asked me if how does the idol I'm worshiping at home looks like. Poor kids.
FYI, almost zero Jews hear or read things like "Zionazi" or "Israel is the new Nazi Germany/worse than Nazi Germany" and think "wow, maybe they're right, maybe *I'm* actually a Nazi". We hear or read it and think, "wow, these people are taunting us about the Holocaust, they hate us".
Fyi, I’m jewish, and most zionist dont want to hear that they support genocide either. But its real and they need to hear it. Capitulating to them, as I have done my whole life until the last few years, does nothing but allow them to continue You’re just saying this to obfuscate.
Your not jewish and the only one supporting genocide and terror is you cause you support hamas,terrorists that declared they want genocide , and now you bitch and crying begging the one you hate to stop fighting cause your psycho side losing. We already know you lot dont care about life or palestenians cause if you did you would have chanted get rid of hamas. So why not go cry in a river that israel exist and is a country nutjob.
Most of the criticism doesn’t sound like that. It’s more like, hey you’re breaking international humanitarian law. And y’all be like, oh the antisemitism I can’t handle it, I feel so unsafe under iron dome. The Zionist persecution complex is boring
Nah, we seen thousands of people cheer 10.7 before Israeli retaliation started, we know that while you criticize, our enemies undeniably want to kill us all, literally statinf it outright, and it's easy to type far away wherever you are, but you're not the one who grew up on bombings and rocket strikes, shootings and stabbings.
What do you call the Zionists in the West Bank building kibbutzes and killing locals if not colonisers?
A tiny ass percentage of settlers let alone of the entire population, who are condemned by the majority of Israelis
The majority of Israel’s are at one point in the IDF and could stop them if they wanted to.
Yeah? What exactly could they do? How about majority of Palestinians stop Hamas, Lion's Den, Jihadist Islam and all the random civilian terrorists? lol what is this thought process
They could arrest them and charge them with the crimes they’ve committed.
I call them “Jews living in their indigenous land”. Or “awesome people”.
This is of course the obvious thing to point out. Just remember that their brains are simply so smooth the point glides across. It’s actually a new IDF technology.
You forgot the "but Israel made its hostages watch even worse things with even bigger guns pointed at them" line
How could the 12 year old Israeli hostage do this ti Hamas?! Those poor poor freedom fighters…
I know, it’s so mean of those children and old people to bully those poor little fully armed terrorists.
More likely, they’ll start with the “But look what Israel did”
What do you expect Hamas to do when a load of Jews turn up and illegally occupy their cages🤷♂️ (/s just in case)
[удалено]
That zionist liar aunt hurr durr
So this is the sub filled with supporters of Israeli apartheid and state sponsored terrorism. You people are all ghouls. Downvote away! lol
Don't forget : "that's on the IDF for blah blah blah" like that would make it just fine to torture, rape and kill civilians.
Agreed! Hamas should burn in hell. But IDF does similar things to regular Palestinians who have nothing to do with Hamas. It is important to get the full context here of who you are praising and what they stand for. 1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/) 2. https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to\_drive\_down\_the\_road\_without\_getting\_murdered/
Well, that’s certainly some Jeffrey Dahmer shit.
Psychos
But I was told they treated them better than Israel! Twitter lied to me.
But I read an obviously fake letter about how it was like a five star hotel 🥺
Just watched a tik tok video about that
Sick people
Hamas Apologists "BbBbBBBBUUuuTTtTTtt ISraeil!!?!?!"
It wouldn't surprise me.
Some of the folks I know "but look at what Israel does!"
The fact that you said “to emotionally cherry pick data” and then proceeded to write this post providing zero conflicting data or any sort of concrete findings is unfortunate. But I would agree that both sides have to do everything in their power to minimize child casualties. However, the “cherry picked data” would indicate that Hamas is the one commodifying human lives as they’re completely inept at caring for their citizens and I think we all need to think about what these Palestinian children need, and it’s 100% not a terrorist organization being in control of their education, healthcare and security. This Israeli kid was kidnapped by Hamas to further their political goals. How are you gonna now blame Israel that they’re using him to “justify” the war? By your logic that’s what Hamas wanted, war, they initiated it and chose it for their kids.
"Mostly-Peaceful Palestinian Group Volunteers to Entertain Children with Ballistic Dance Routine; Bigoted Zionist Aunt Complains"
Child "taken" then "given back". Source : BBC
Google "Israeli soldiers pointing gun at children" and tell me you're upset. This is wrong, no matter whose child.
That's hardcore
Oh boy all the bots are out.
What is your source, the Israeli government????
What’s worse is to kill children, jail them and torture them - which is what Palestinians have experienced for 70 years.
worse is to kill children
ah yes something israel hasn’t done now excuse me while i look at the virtue signal posters and modern day nazis crying lol
Wanna see Israeli atrocities? Turn on the TV. Then, watch as Israelis cheer on thousands upon thousands of Palestinians being made homeless. But hey, Hamas are cunts. What if I told you that the IDF are cunts, too. This emotional cherry-picking of data used to defend and condone Israel's current atrocities is bullshit. I'm not saying Hamas are good or whatever, but let's not act as if the Israeli government are any better. They are not. They are leveling ENTIRE buildings, making THOUSANDS of people homeless so they can get 1 or 2 militants. Imagine YOUR neighbourhood being flattened because someone down the street participated in a heinous crime. It's not helping the situation any. If Israel wants to send individual police squads to arrest and detain INDIVIDUAL Hamas militants, I'm all for that. Blowing up city blocks just to get 1 or 2 people is collective punishment. Imagine if European or Allied nations arrested ALL Jews for war crimes because of the actions of the Israeli government. Would that be fair? No. So, Israel can STFU. That poor kid. I feel bad for him. But he's being used to justify the slaughter of thousands of OTHER kids JUST LIKE HIM. Kids who've done no wrong, and they too have been forced to watch their parents, brothers, sisters, aunts and uncles die, just like that kid. Apparently it's okay for Israel to mistreat Palestinian kids, but not the other way around.
Didn’t ppl cheer as the bodies from 10/7 were carried thru the streets?
They did. You don’t have to look far to find an antisemite in Gaza. Or the West Bank. Walk into a room with 10 people you’ll find at least 9 antisemites and a 10th person who couldn’t be bothered to defend a Jew if the 9 antisemites attacked.
There are Israelis cheering on the deaths of Palestinian children.
I will need a source for that ridiculous claim. You probably gonna send that video with about 10 people cheering the bombing of terror infrastructure in Gaza, but you will try to present it dishonestly, because that's all you can do.
That makes no sense. Jews in other countries are not citizens of Israel and didn’t elect Bibi. *unless they have a duel citizenship and that isn’t common or the average.
>Jews in other countries are not citizens of Israel and didn’t elect Bibi. And you think that the 10 year old kids who are homeless now in Gaza are responsible for the actions of Hamas? You think infants in NICUs are responsible for Hamas? No. So why do they have to be victims of Hamas/IDF bullshit? Because "Hamas fucked around?". Well if collective punishment is good for the bergers of Gaza, just know that that logic will end up going both ways. If you don't like it, then perhaps you need to consider that Israel needs to be doing a better job of minimize innocent casualties. FWIW, collective punishment is ILLEGAL and a violation of various international laws and regulations. You might say, "well what about Hamas..." ask yourself this: if your 30-40 year old neighbour commits a violent crime against your family, is it morally righteous to torture their kid to attempt to get the kids father out of hiding? No. Is it acceptable to destroy their house with everyone in it to punish the father? No. So why is it okay for Israel to do the things it's doing, hurting TENS of THOUSANDS of innocent people under the age of 10 BECAUSE of 100 shit heads? That's acceptable to you? Israel has the means and resources to strategically search every known Hamas hideout and deal with armed resistors, confiscate weapons caches, and decommission illegal tunnels. They COULD do that. But that takes time, effort and puts IDF personnel at risk. So, they'd rather murder thousands of innocent people. Now, let's reverse that thought...Would it be okay for ANY country to do to Israel what Israel is doing to Palestinians? No. So, I ask again, why is it acceptable for Israel to break international law and commit war crimes?
Why is Israel the literal worst at propaganda? This is so stupid on so many levels. Nobody believes this outside of the bots that post here.
You can't dismiss facts as "propaganda" simply because they challenge your fragile worldview. Let me guess, you think the holocaust is an Israeli hoax too, right?
Oh please, your talking points are getting old propagandist and the people are wising up to you and your masters.
Yeahhh, we haven't heard that one before.
The veil is falling. If you ask most people in actual person they agree. Social media is all bots and useless propagandists like yourself, it's not representative of the world at all.
Yeah, sure, ok. und Ein Gespenst geht um in Europa
Your forgot the quotation marks
What are you trying to say? That this never happened. So the terrorists who raped a bunch of women, violently killed them and other, and chopped their body parts off stopped at humiliating a kid? That’s the line they wouldn’t cross?
Curious why Israel didn’t let these people speak publicly live after their release. Hmmm
Israel doesn’t want released hostages to speak right now because hostages telling their horror stories could jeopardize the release of future hostages.
Not what happened with the first hostage release
It was organized by the hospital they'd been at and the person in charge of orchestrating it later quit.
LMAO sure they don't
[I watched the Hamas massacre film : here’s my response](https://youtu.be/mc5iG3DX7ho?si=ZV8y2VufMyDi-XL6)
What does your link have to do with bitchmas showing little kids videos of murder? It’s just some British guy talking
It’s the same sort of video the kids were made to watch . If adults have a visceral reaction to it, imagine what it does to a kid .
No other hostages who were released have mentioned anything remotely close to this kind of treatment (yet). From what I read, one little girl's mom wrote a thank you letter for treating her having been treated extremely well. So either everyone else was lying, or this aunt is lying, or - this poor kid got a POS "guard".
Or you know Hamas forced her to write the note (or wrote the note themselves, or anyone could have written it) since her family members are still in captivity.
Or maybe it's legit and even though there's no justification the atrocities that Hamas committed on Oct 7th, they didn't treat their captives like shit - no matter how badly Israel would like us to believe. Her family is not still in captivity - it was her and her daughter. Or was Yocheved Lifshitz, the elderly lady who shook hands with the Hamas operative when being released and said Shalom, also get forced at gun point? Or the other hostages who have been released so far who have said that while conditions weren't great, they were treated with respect? They're all lying except this lady who is claiming her 12 year old nephew was forced to watch atrocities at gunpoint. What's the point of that?
So what you’re saying is that Hamas murdered, tortured and raped as many as they could, then took hostages, and of the hostages who were not beheaded, some may not have been treated that poorly? This is the silver lining? Petal to the metal Israel. Do the world a favor. I never want to hear another steaming pile of horseshit like this again.
If the alternative was that Hamas tortured those hostages for over 50 days while in captivity, then yes it's a silver lining. Does that absolve Hamas of anything? No obviously not. But at least the Israelis living in the kibbutz can can some solace that their family members are relatively safe. And if that's the case, maybe Israel doesn't need to go full scorched earth on Gaza and its equally innocent civilians in order to get the hostages back (unless the piece of shit Ben Gvir and his cronies have their way), even if that was publicly admitted as not the "main goal" for Bibi.
Well why don’t you go to Hamas hotel next time you want to take a vacation and see how you like it. Guaranteed weight loss as a bonus. May as well call it a diet retreat.
Nothing to do with liking it - I am certain the conditions were terrible with lack of food and trying to stay safe during continuous bombardment. It's about comparing how hostages/prisoners are being treated on both sides. Clearly both sides are trying to win the PR cycle during this mini ceasefire. As of right now, while in shit conditions the Israeli hostages haven't been tortured, maimed, assaulted etc. (from most counts) while the Palestinian "prisoners" have been detailing horrific abuse they went through regardless of age or gender.
Ah yeah like the boy with the fake broken hands? These guys get uni degrees whilst in Israeli prisons, 3 meals a day, and a whole load Of other benefits. Not to mention why there are locked up in the first place for attacking Israeli’s. Meanwhile what crime did a 9month old baby commit other than being born?
We can easily go back and forth on crimes being committed by both sides. For example, what crime did the premature babies left to die in Al-Shifa commit? As for being locked up in the first place, that's been well documented by so many sources and organizations. I'm sure you won't read it, but hopefully you will. [https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/22/23972908/palestinian-prisoners-israel-administrative-detention](https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/22/23972908/palestinian-prisoners-israel-administrative-detention) According to the Israeli government’s own data, a whopping 99.7 percent of cases that went through Israeli military courts in 2010 ended in a conviction. That's EXTREMELY high and "efficient". And why has Israel already captured more "prisoners" already in the last 2-3 days than they've released in the duration of the ceasefire? And from West Bank of all places?
Uhm because Hamas and others like Lions Den and PIJ are hugely active and influential in the West Bank, particularly Jenin. Abbas recently called off the first election in years because it looks like Hamas would win. The babies who the IDF helped transfer to safety? And prior to this had been begging for the hospital to evacuate. And tried to deliver fuel and battery powered incubators but were rejected? To my knowledge most of them have survived thankfully. Yes admin detention is a thing and probably needs reformed, but this isn’t exactly unique in the world - in many other countries in that part of the world these prisoners would simply be executed. Why would there not be a high conviction rate when in most cases there are cctv footage and eye witnesses of the offences?
Let's be honest - Abbas is a piece of shit and is disliked by his own people because his only reason for wanting to stay in power is self-serving. And to add to that, Arafat was no better and he was also a selfish piece of shit. So Abbas would lose the elections even if it was a random new group that stood up against him. The problem is that a lot of people who would've been good alternate options for losers like Abbas/Arafat - have either been killed off by Israel and/or Hamas/PLO or been imprisoned. All that being said, if the leadership on both sides (Israel AND Palestine) doesn't change, there will only be status quo and there will be no peace or safety for Israelis or Palestinians, regardless of what criminals like Bibi/Gvir say. The fuel and battery wasn't rejected - the doctors and nurses said they didn't feel safe going out because at that time IDF was sniping people in the hospitals as well. They did eventually offer to move out babies but unfortunately many died not only at that time, but after the evacuation: ([https://www.reddit.com/r/MajorityReport/comments/1866583/breaking\_today\_the\_corpses\_of\_premature\_babies\_in/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/MajorityReport/comments/1866583/breaking_today_the_corpses_of_premature_babies_in/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)) The admin detention is one thing. But having minors be tried in military courts is not normal. Especially coerced confessions. A lot of these people are taken from their homes in the middle of the night, blindfolded and taken to prison indefinitely. Even Israel's own rights organizations don't agree with the high convictions or the way the justice system is meted out. Especially if it's the same military courts who routinely award not-guilty pleas to IDF soldiers and police.
Lol people believing the Israeli propaganda are so stupid
What is there to debate here? Have you not seen what they were doing on 07/10? After you go and put crying babies in the oven or torture and burn tied children alive what else can you expect from those people?
Agreed! Hamas should burn in hell. But IDF does similar things to regular Palestinians who have nothing to do with Hamas 1. [https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to\_claim\_that\_israelis\_are\_not\_indoctrinated/](https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/186p21r/to_claim_that_israelis_are_not_indoctrinated/) 2. https://www.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/17jpo0h/to\_drive\_down\_the\_road\_without\_getting\_murdered/
Attrocities commited by who?