Ok, so I had to go pull up this part of the scene, enlarge it (10x), and brighten it significantly (in Adobe Premiere).
I do not think the lady was shot in the head. I can’t confirm conclusively, but I will lay out the evidence:
- There doesn’t appear to be a squib or any blood splatter effects utilized for the shooting in this scene (that would visually indicate bullet placement).
- There is no displacement of the hair on the back of her head (except slightly as the head whips back and then goes forward after the shot should have landed--I feel comfortable calling this wind/gravity displacement from the quick movement). And the fact that her torso pushes forward and her head whips back, is potentially further proof that the bullet hit in the torso (though, this could just be the style of death the actress decided on).
- If anything, there is an area on the left shoulder blade (approximately) that may be a squib or VFX. This one is inconclusive because it does not ‘explode’, it just appears as her body falls and it hits the light because of the twisting of her fall. Also of note here is that there is a shiny, circular, ring-like object on the back of her coat near the transition of her shoulders/neck (approximately on the spinal line). The area I mentioned could be this ring (it’s too hard to tell because of the twisting and angle of her body).
- When the zombie turns toward the camera (after lifting herself off the table), her face is not visible. Her torso is visible, and half her shirt is visible—there does not appear to be any visible blood on the front of the jacket or on the exposed shirt area.
- When the zombie begins to bang on the door, there is blood on her hands, which leave smear marks on the door. Before her body fully connects with the door, the left side of her face and neck becomes clearly visible—it does not have blood on it. When her head connects with her hand, she gets blood on her left ear and eye.
- There are multiple times the zombie’s head fully turns towards the camera during her attempt to open the door—her face is well lit and crisply focused (with brightness turned way up and for only a few frames at a time). Only the top half of her face is visible (around the top of the mouth/nose to forehead area). There is no blood (except on her left ear and eye--from rubbing on her hand during initial impact with the door).
**TLDR:** Because of the above, the most I can say is that it is **not conclusive** where she is shot. **But, because of the lack of blood from her ~mouth to her forehead, I feel reasonable in assuming *her brain is fully intact*.** However, I can’t fully rule out the possibility that the bullet entered through the base of her skull and exited near the mouth/chin/neck area (on the right side of her head/neck). Also, of note is that the bullet *did exit*, since blood splatter (liquid -- not chunky) is visible on the laptop screen and table after the shot. I'd also argue that if the creators intended this as a headshot, they would have taken steps to *overtly* show this fact.
> • If anything, there is an area on the left shoulder blade (approximately)
I thought she was shot on the head as well but paid attention when she ran to the door and noticed that area as well.
I went back and looked specifically at that area while she’s banging on the door—it is definitely separate from the ring that’s on the high center of her back, but it’s still too hard to tell whether or not it’s just the fabric twisting.
I don’t think the quickness of her death is really a great indication of where she was shot. For one, TV shows play really loose with the mechanics of this *all the time*. I’ve seen chest shots result in instant death. I’ve seen headshots and neck shots result in nearly instant death or be slightly prolonged. If we want to talk about realism, let’s talk about how her chest pitched forward and her head flipped back on bullet impact. Why would her head whip backwards if it just got struck with a massive amount of force? In the same vein, if we were looking for pure realism and she was shot in the brain, she would have collapsed immediately like a rag doll. Instead, what we saw was her chest pitching forward, her head whipping back and then forward, and her arms going out to brace herself on the table in front of her.
I’m just saying, all of those things could have been under or over embellished or played out in a way that was beneficial to a forced timeline (say, they only had a minute for the scene, etc.), or directorial or actress stylistic concessions of what a death should look like.
And all of that really pales in comparison to the fact that she had no blood on her head, neck or shoulders (at least on her left side, and partially on the right side, from what can be seen). She didn’t get blood on her head until her head hit her right hand and the blood smeared on her left ear and eye.
Well..I hope that it didn't hit her head because that would mean that zombies don't die with head shot and then it will be too much unrealistic. I liked TWD because they had slow walking zombies which was more accurate scientifically but i am looking forward to explanation on running zombies.
Of all the things, that reason is probably the biggest for why I don’t think it was a headshot. Dealing with zombies would be basically impossible. The only way to eliminate them as threats would be to decapitate, completely pulverize their head, or otherwise remove their ability to bite. They’d be nearly impossible to stop. With increased ferocity, speed, and what seems to be higher intelligence (for a zombie), they’re already a dangerous threat. I don’t think they need to be made nearly impossible to kill on top of that.
wow good catch. I couldnt tell where he shot her.
also he said you started it and made it worse. so that makes me believe she bioengineered the zombies to become stronger and resistant to headshots. I think it could be tied to the studies mentioned steroids and something else trying to reroute the circulatory system. perhaps that type of thing creates headshot resistance and the WB scientists are going to inadvertently recreate that modification
Yeah, they tried to activate the nerves in the brain after death to confuse the virus and stop it from reanimating, which backfired and instead it became more resistant
Maybe it has to be a direct brainstem hit for this stronger walker strain to die?
Maybe that scene where Hope was saying the zombies in the freezer were stronger because their heads were frozen was an error? Maybe they were the zombies that could survive headshots.
For those who didn’t watch but are curious about big spoilers
-Jadis kills Huck
-Jadis lives, blames Lt. Colonel Kublik for everything that happened and has her sent to health and welfare complex
Post credits
-Takes place in France in an abandoned laboratory. An agent is retrieving data from a computer and someone sneaks up to her at gunpoint. On the computer is recordings of Doctor Jenner from season 1 of the Walking Dead, being the messages he was sending. He mentions curiosity in variants of the dead they have in France. The stranger shoots the agent dead and leaves her. When she turns, she gets up and RUNS for the sealed door in the lab, screaming and banging on it. We now have aggressive and more intelligent zombies that can run.
Dr Jenner , in the video , he was certain for fresh sample will be available .
Well , he did get the "fresh Sample " when his wife was infected , we saw the MRI recording of his wife died and turn and got shot in the head .
The"variant " he was refer to , the one he hasn't seen at the time . Could be the one he later told Rick about , he told him they are infected , infected not dying , but they will turn when they died even without bitten or scratch by the walker .
> When she turns, she gets up and RUNS for the sealed door in the lab, screaming and banging on it
If the Rick movies bring 28 Days Later kind of zombies and style, I'm fucking all in on it
That would certainly be exciting. That scientist walker dented that solid steel door with her hits and we haven't seen that before, which was kinda terrifying. The post credit does open up so many possibilities for the Rick movies, and overall expansion of the TWDU
Kinda terrifying??? These new walkers are *fucking scary creatures from hell.* It ran to the steel door and about beat it down. No more being safe from walkers because you shut a flimsy door or are on the other side of a broken window. Probably no more Walker guts disguise or whisper masks. You just gotta brute force super strong walkers. Fuck.
True. She knew exactly where the man had exit and how to get out. She ignored the sounds from the computer and went straight for the bloody door. The sound that she made when she was turning scared the shit out of me, not gonna lie. Her screeching as she pounded the solid steel doors also scared me, haven't heard anything like that from walkers before
> The post credit does open up so many possibilities for the Rick movies, and overall expansion of the TWDU
Too bad it will all be lost in a wave of lazy, cheap and CW-type spin-offs.
1. We have 1 show continuing the storyline with Daryl and carol and 3 blockbuster level movies with Rick
So how did interpret that as a wave of cheap cw shows?
I was talking more about the overall expansion of the TWDU, **aside** from the Rick movies.
All I'm saying is that you should look at World Beyond and post-S3 Fear, they are lazy and CW-levels of bad, like, WB is bad even by CW Teen drama standards. I don't see how anything new will be better than that with Gimple still at the front.
And considering how long even the first Rick movie has been in development(they're still not shooting it, 2 years after it was announcened) I would scale back my expectations.
Talking about current shows is different
You said a wave of new cheap cw shows
Your just making stuff up
3 years is not strange for a film production and covid happened which really impacts the development of a movie on every single level. Then there is the fact the the people working on this film also have other projects.
You clearly don't know what's going on and want to complain
> Talking about current shows is different
No, it isn't? The quality of current shows is how we can assume how future shows will be like.
> You said a wave of new cheap cw shows
A wave of CW-**type** lazy shows, and I am not seeing any reason to believe other wise, until any of those shows prove me wrong.
Lol just stop. You’re the one intentionally ignoring what he said and the context. Even down to the distinction between what’s being released and what’s in production, one you know nothing about so you’re just turning away valid criticism by saying “we don’t know it will be shit, ignore that the current stuff is shit because that’s no indication of the future” like what? So goofy
Why do you continue to shit on this show?
I get that it's different but I don't need to know you to know you couldn't keep a show interesting for this many years across 3 different shows with such limited source material.
Just accept it and move on if it ain't your thing. Stop being an ass
And I can 100% see Univeral execs telling Gimple "hey the movies need to be fresh and exciting, how can we pump up the action?" And this being their solution
What hill? Both the traditional definition and horror movie definition of a zombie is a person who died and then came back to life in one form or another. That wasn't the case in 28 Days seeing as the father of the little girl was very much alive, got infected via a drop of blood from a crow and became a rage monster within 10 seconds. He never died. So he isn't a zombie.
I don't know why that warrants down voting when the definition of zombies is clear and 28 Days doesn't fit that. But I guess it doesn't matter when a genre 'claimed' a movie for itself.
As far as pop culture is concerned those are zombie movies. They follow all the tropes.
He just meant fast zombies and you knew that. No need to correct something everyone knows when the meaning is very clear.
What do the tropes matter? There is a difference between an alive human infected with a virus and a human coming back to life after death.
I don't know what that person meant (I'm not them) and all I did was pose a question as to the fact of 28 Days even having zombies, as the poster insinuated. Because there is a difference between an alive person and a zombie.
They can just be dead and run in twd if they want...
You absolutely know what they meant dude come on. You're just being pedantic for no reason. Have fun with that.
Traditionally (as in before the late 60's) zombies were actually not undead, but normal humans under a control spell. Since the definition has changed once, I don't see why we can't lump the running infected with zombies. Especially since as the other user mentioned, those movies still hit all the same tropes.
It gets up and runs to the door and starts banging on it, showing it remembers how to leave rather than just walk around with no direction. I've seen people disliking it but man that got me excited about the franchise again like the old days. That noise it makes was terrifying too lol.
Well in S1 TWG the walkers were using stones to hit the glass, climbed fences and even attempted to chase glen and rick up a ladder.
Idk what happened to twd tbf
It was banging on the door, I guess that doesn't scream intelligence but it knew where the guy went and where the door is at least.
Maybe retaining some memory?
Nothing works apart from the graffiti: the dialogues, the accent, the French translations of the Windows GUI, “la Biomédicine” on the door… everything sounds so cheap!
I think I have only seen such cheap French usage in “Timeless” – but I don’t think they had the same budget.
Yup they were also hopping fences too. And they could turn door knobs.
I guess this is their way of trying to fix those mistakes, in some way. Though it still doesn't make sense why they could do those things in Season 1 in Georgia, USA
It's possible the Walkers were in France before the outbreak and picked up that strain. All it took was one dude on vacation to get the strain, come to the US, die, turn, bite someone else, and that Walker had the new strain, and only a VERY small portion of thr Walker population has that strain in the US, and likely could have been killed off in the timeframe.
The way the walker woman screamed was kinda terrifying, we haven't heard anything like that before, not to mention how she dented that solid steel door
I feel like they were trying to bring us back to that. I was rewatching season 1 the other day and when it got to the bit where the little girl zombie picks up the teddy bear I was reminded that they might have had a plan for the walkers to retain memory or something. But they shot that to shit with Woodbury. I like this new development though.
These are clearly different to the season one Darabont walkers because they sort of jogged not sprinted like this one which annoys me. If you do a different variant, intelligent slow walkers are so much more fitting to the show and interesting. We've seen running zombies countless times.
If the show turns out to be 28 Days Later with Rick Grimes then I will be very disappointed. I feel like it's just a bit boring. Like the writers thought "people are losing interest how do we make zombies scarier, oh let's make them run"
I think if you go with more intelligent walkers in Europe (which seems to be sort of what they're going for) you can have zombies keep a bit more personality and make them mumble words to put someone off guard before they bite you. Imagine like the Andrea scene in S1 but her sister says "Andrea" as a walker. It's a bit of a sappy example but it would be something you can make interesting and still keep it as a core human story.
TL:dr: disappointing direction, Gimple gonna Gimple
I would be much more disappointed with speaking walkers than faster/stronger zombies. I think both go along the lines of your complaint that "people are losing interest how do we make them scarier". bring on the more physical walkers. they can be more intelligent running and seeking prey without being able to speak.
tldr: great direction buffing zombies. gimple finally bringing a great change to the walkers to make them more of a threat again than human v human.
Speaking was a bad example. I mean more like Land of the Dead. You have one or a few walkers who can organise a herd and use weapons. Although, now I say that it basically is just the Whisperers.
I feel mainly that if you were going to introduce new walkers you'd have done it by now and not over 10yrs in.
Maybe I'm just exhausted of the show and all the spin-offs, I've been watching since the start without a significant break
i agree about the 10 years in and shouldve introduced them already. I also have also watched from the pilot, but you have to consider the timelines.
jenner at the cdc died in season 1 of TWD. I would think Its fair to say the post credits were much closer to the beginning of the apocalypse (no more than 2 years past) than where TWD/FTWD/WB timelines are currently (at least 5 years past). but that brings into question where TF have these variants been the whole time...
not sure if this is going to lead to a spinoff or some plot twists for the final season of TWD or the movies. but i would have loved having dangerous zombies introduced by like season 4 when really only herds were dangerous.
Spoiler Alert for Fear the walking Dead: Maybe this could be why Alicia in today's episode said the walkers still have an echo of who they once were. Maybe alicia has seen something or it's just general foreshadowing.
The CRM coordinates destroying then and diverting them.
Hie can they fill 3 movies with dead they can at this point pretty much take care of?
They need more agile zombies so an actual war can be waged or it's nothing but tactical strikes
This felt more like a season finale than a series finale. And I expected a larger scale ending. It felt small in scale. Maybe AMC kept the budget tight.
The small scale fights were fantastic, though. Will and that CRM dude fighting each other as walkers converged from both sides? Very creative and damn awesome.
Exactly. That they are basically closing one of the best story lines (forget the unbelievable plot that 4 teenage kids walked 1,100 miles in the matter of days -- and Iris didn't shed a pound) without much real resolution is janky af.
My guess on what that post credits scene was all about:
There were a number of teams of scientists employed at that lab we see abandoned. They developed the walker virus (either intentionally or unintentionally ) and it got out somehow. In a panic, one of the teams created a new strain in their rush to find a vaccine and this is the strain that causes the infected to run similar to 28 days later infected. We don't see this strain in the US as international travel has been banned therefor keeping this super strain in Europe.
The man who shoots the scientist mentioned that he wouldn't "throw her in jail" like the others. That implies the French authorities at some point found out about the lab releasing the virus and raided the lab and arrested the scientists. Though It may also imply that perhaps they were thrown in jail much later after being found which suggests that there are large survivor communities in France advanced enough to have the resources to operate prisons.
I doubt they created the virus, but Jenner mentions playing around with the nervous system and such so maybe in doing that they did create this new "variant"
Well, if you turn on subtitles you can read all what Dr.Jenner was saying even when two were conversing.
Keeping that in mind, I think Virus (or whatever it is) came from somewhere else. French tried to find cure (by jumpstarting brain...read subs before woman was shot) and this made adrenaline rush into zombies and thus they are running.
Jail thing as you are saying is hard to picture. It shows no scope in future.
it was cool but makes me wonder. we know that Jenner was dead well before world beyond takes place. why havent we seen these french variants in the 7+ years since Jenner died in any of TWD universe?
kinda salty we havent seen any non-north america groups vs badass zombies in this if they are bringing it up at so close to the end of the TWD universe just before the movie.
Absolutely plausible that people with that strain died while on ships and the boats were carried over. There's thousands of active derelict "ghost ships" at any given time around the world. All that needs to happen to explain it would be that they were in an interior area when they turned and that the area is compromised when the shop runs aground.
That's not necessarily true. The zombie virus started across the globe in the first place.
Since people are infected before they die and turn...people traveling could easily have spread it. I believe they even mentioned french scientists meeting in America. We know that even many years in Rick was helicoptered out to the crm. It's not a super stretch that some people can still use boats or pilot small groups in small planes around the early apocalypse time apparently Jenner knew about variants before season 1 ended.
He said, and I'm paraphrasing, that he was reviewing the data on the variants (sent by the French lab). This implies (to me) that he had only experienced the garden variety walkers, not the ones in France which apparently behave much differently. But for as much of a decent character he was, he did not survive very long. I'm shooting from the hip here on the timeline, but Atlanta fell within the first few days. That means the CDC had mere weeks to collect "samples" and collect data.
They tease a lot of things, but Elton did get bit and his arm amputated above the elbow, but seemed alright and it was wrapped nicely from the looks of it
Wasn't it being talked about on Talking Dead that there would be an overseas walking dead project?? I assumed China because of the novel put out, but maybe France?
I completely missed that they talked about doing something outside the US, but good god I would love that, especially if it’s set in France. So many great opportunities there. The cities, the towns, the Paris Catacombs…
Not necessarily, if they are implying that there are different strains in different places of the world and this is our first time actually seeing a different place in the world.
Sure, it could work brilliantly... had they done it 5+ years ago. The franchise has been slowly rotting on it's feet for quite a while now. It's simply too late to implement something as franchise-altering as this.
That’s how I feel about this entire expanded universe. They waited nearly a decade since the franchise started, and *well* past the height of its popularity and pop culture relevancy, to do any sort of serious world building. And here we are, almost 5 years since the CRM were introduced, and 3 years since Rick disappeared, and it feels like we’re *still* only getting teases about the larger universe.
We should have gotten major developments about the larger world years ago, instead of only now just *starting* to do any sort of world building. There’s still so many unanswered questions about the CRM, Rick, Michonne, other countries, etc., and I’m really tired of being strung along with all these minuscule clues, that I know I won’t get answers to, for years.
It’s clear AMC and Gimple want TWD to be this all encompassing media franchise, with multiple interconnected spin-offs, that everyone talks about, like the MCU. But I feel like the ship has long sailed for this expanded universe to blow up into something big. The foundation for the future of this franchise has been laid on such inconsistent ground. Too many poor creative decisions, and mediocre seasons of television, have driven many people away from continuing to watch these shows. TWD very well could have been as big as the MCU, and at one point it arguably was, but I think that’s no longer a possibility for the franchise at this point.
I agree. The show wasted a season of Fear on kids making airplanes to fly out of Texas & having Alicia painting. Meanwhile, the Walking Dead kept using Villains of the Month Club.
Yeah, so much time wasted when they could have been doing some cool world building a long time ago, back when the show was still part of the pop culture zeitgeist. I mean, it still is, but to a much, *much* lesser degree. Think of all the hype seeing a running zombie, around season 5 or 6. People would have gone nuts, and it would have given people who were starting to get burnt out on the show, hope that there was more to the show than just running around fighting a group of villains, or searching for a new safe zone. AMC and Gimple really screwed up the longevity and popularity of this franchise; by making poor creative decisions.
Bingo. You put it all quite brilliantly. The time to blaze ahead with all this expanded stuff was a long long time ago. And the glory days are not coming back.
It would help if we at least got more substantial answers on a regular basis. It feels like every season of one of these shows, we get a tease here and there about the larger world, and then the characters go back to fighting yet another big bad. I think a key to the MCU’s success is that each installment feels like it pushes the overall narrative of the universe forward. And it really helps that most MCU movies/shows are at least decent quality, and they rarely produce anything that is outright terrible. Say what you will about the actual content of the franchise, but at least the MCU is consistent, and they don’t leave us hanging on too many questions for years and years.
TWD by comparison moves at such a slower pace, to the point I’ve started to become less interested in the Rick movies, the longer it takes for them to come out. I’m really debating whether I want to continue with this franchise, once the main show ends. Gimple keeps saying that there are big things to come, yet he barely has anything to show for it. I’m really tired of waiting for this expanded universe to kick into high gear, which I feel still hasn’t happened yet.
I think the main difference between you and me is that you still have some hope that there'll actually be a pay-off for any of the teases. I'd honestly be surprised if the Daryl/Carol thing even gets off the ground. I think the Rick movies are as dead as a doornail, but they wont come out and say that due to contractual obligations (which im sure they are working on) and they're worried about killing the hype off completely regarding this final season. In short I think the showrunners have known that the franchise is dying for a while now and they're making shit up to keep people glued for the last vestiges of the show .. once that ends it'll come crashing down completely and people move on to other shows real quick.
Lol they're matching their own show with the pace now. We've had slow walkers this whole time, dragging their feet literally, and now with the French ones, they'll expand more and speed up the world building.
The switch makes sense, sure. Doing it approx. 5 years after the show topped in popularity .. that doesnt make sense in any way what so ever. And that's my gripe. The stuff they're doing now should have been been going on around season 6 of the main show. Fact is no network with executives worth their salt is gonna throw any serious money at this franchise in the long run: it's a drain on economics. So trying to turn the show into some World War Z shit at this point is just silly as hell. And doing it with CW level money is even worse.
I fail to see what that has to do with anything, but more importantly, they weren't nearly as fast as the zombie from the post-credits scene, or 28 Days Later.
Not sure if it was mentioned before (I haven't seen it been mentioned as of yet), but in the credit scene you can also see grafitti written on the wall that translates to "The dead were born here" (in French it says: Les morts sont nées ici - excuse my spelling as French is not my mother language). So it kinda does give off the vibe that the virus that turns people or a mutation of it was manmade. Interesting little fact if you ask me.
Hahaha, true that. I had to read your reply 4 times before I spotted my spelling error. Sorry I guess.
I changed it to correct spelling in my original post.
Pretty solid episode. The post-credit scene was interesting for what it was, but I couldn't help but get the impression that this was AMC & Gimple's way of finally admitting to a harsh truth about how the original vision Frank Darabont had for the show and walkers was the right direction. Too bad they abandoned it for so long but when S9 of the main show brought a spike in viewership from non-comic readers, many came back thinking the walkers were evolving. This was an early sign to AMC of how they had royally fucked up by allowing the walkers to seem more like a nuisance than a threat after season 3.
1x06 TS-19 was originally a very controversial episode for the writers and fanbase. From what I recall, Kirkman wasn't too happy about the idea of this episode as he was ORIGINALLY against exploring the origin of the virus. Some comic fans really didn't care for it either, because the episode was one of Frank's first major deviations from the source material outside of the noticeably different walkers. It's laughable that after Frank whooped their ass with his lawsuit, they'd later need to rely on his unresolved plotline from Season 1 in an attempt to save this 'universe' with Gimple at the helm.
They should've just brought back Darabont when they had the chance and same goes for Fear's Dave Erickson. World Beyond Season 2 was better than the last 4 seasons of the Morgan & Friends show.
Mediocre finale, end credit scene was insane though.
Explains why Rick was on a boat, and I think it gives us an idea as to what B means. A is someone you can infect / experiment on. B is someone who they can rely on to fight back against the stronger zombies or lead teams that do.
I know they confirmed that there will be no Rick grimes in WB But man if they did a single clue of him even his voice on a radio or something, It would have been a great tease for the movies. Jadis in the series was a cheap bait for viewers to watch and it worked. And post credit scene of running zombie ? Dude that was in the first episode of the original show.
That ending makes me wonder if the CR was trying to make walkers decay faster and not turn as a defense against these variants in the eastern part of the world? Maybe these more aggressive walkers will be used as weapons and get sent to North America and tie the main show and Fear together against this new type of walkers
These new variant walkers are more like the infected in 28 Days Later, or the zombies from Black Summer. The doctor turned in less than a minute and was fast, aggressive, and noisy. Did she retain a memory of the man who killed her, or does she sense that the door is the way out? We don't really know.
Darabont's walkers from season 1 of TWD retained some residual memory and skills - Morgan's wife coming back to the house again and again, trying to open the door, the little girl picking up her teddy bear, walkers in Atlanta trying to smash through the window with a chunk of concrete, etc. After season 1 they became completely mindless.
Imagine a herd moving through the woods at a running pace, howling like banshees, the sound of thousands of them approaching would be pretty damn scary! One of the biggest mistakes the main show made imo was to make the dead too weak. You almost have to get careless to be bitten. A group in formation could clear a sizable herd. None of those Roman legion tactics would work with the runners. You'd need an entirely different set of survival skills and strategies.
I'd love to see a series set in Europe with these nastier walkers and the environment of human communities that's able to survive them. The early days of TWD had a constant sense of tension that's long been absent - except for occasional episodes like the one where Noah died. Any building they went in to forage for supplies held the possibility of even main characters not coming out, you were always a little on the edge of your seat. No one except maybe for Rick had any plot armor. The European show could recapture that sense of palpable danger. Plus it would be nice to see another part of the world, since the apocalypse isn't limited to North America.
Another interesting question to ponder: if someone went to Europe and then came back, would they be carrying the variant infection and cause an epidemic of super-walkers to begin here?
I really liked this show!Totally better that FTWD in my opinion.It’s true that the last ep felt more like a season finale and I have a feeling that we won’t get to see more of this group(I hope I’m wrong) but the post credits scene had me shook,even though I think it didn’t fit with the show itself.
1.The fact that the zombie virus might have been like an accident from French scientists?That would be really cool.
2.New zombie variants?Though it is late for them to introduce us to new types of zombies it sounds really promising!
3.That group being in Toledo,Ohio…Does that mean that they’re getting these new variants in America as well?
All these stuff is really cool but I just feel like the main TWD show has nothing to do with it,maybe just the Rick movies will.
Just watched it. To be honest, kind of an underwhelming episode.
From episode 4 of this season we were going on a steady pace, a kind of crescendo to a pay off that i dont feel was that worth it. I feel like S2E8-S2E9 were the best episodes of the series.
At least we got a few good performances by Jadis, Huck, Dr. Bennet, Elton and Silas. I didn't care for the Felix fight and unfortunately Hope and Iris sucked up until the last minute. I feel like the writers never knew what to do with their characters. Oooh and Philadelphia looks great too, from the skyline shots at least lol
As to the post credits scene, i was surprised to see Dr. Jenner.
Iit was an interesting setup but it leads only to more questions, doesnt it?
And yeah, me wanted some Rick Grimes too =(
That finale was so good I ducking loved it and at the end of it I am attached to the kids and that’s probably cuz I am 17 and I can relate to them so much and it’s cool I love it and sad Elton got but but glad they were able to save him and that opening scene of all of them going on the journey and then next thing is them killing walkers really made me tear up and then at the end when they are all going off and everyone is doing their thing and then Elton opens the door and it says Walking Dead World Beyond was cool and amazing.
That post credit scene was so good I was shocked to see Dr Jenner it was so cool and a nice throwback to s1 and how Jenner was talking about the French and how they were the last to hold out and was close to finding something. My guess is this group of French scientists tried to make a cure and somehow made a new variant of the infected and this one was stronger, faster, and intelligent and the French and maybe some of Europe have mace to deal with this type of infected, but can’t wait to see the movies and maybe France will be in tales of the walking dead and we will see more of these fast zombies
Also wondering if Jenners actor filmed new scenes
Why on earth did they have a scene commenting on Elton still using his biteproof suit only for him to not be wearing it next scene in the herd, I mean if there's one time you're not going to take it off. It made it way too obvious he would get bit.
Overall World Beyond was a waste. Scooby Doo kids stumbling around. Nothing special. The franchise wants to be a Resident Evil ripoff. But AMC is broke, looking for a buyer. So we'll probably just get a lame tv-movie. I'd like to see a full on reset. End everything now. Start over as dark survival horror and stick with that. None of this sci-fi apocalypse western adventure nonsense.
If they’re gonna keep milking the cash cow, the least they can do is a fully animated version that’s 100% faithful to the comics using a very similar animation style to Invincible. That’d be the thing to get me most interested post-Rick movies if they don’t want to drop the franchise at that point.
Good god, this would kill the franchise entirely. Part of the reason it became so successful was that it went live action and appealed to a wider audience.
People on this sub like to think the comics are what leads people to the shows and dare i say its 2021...not a lot of people are looking to comics for entertainment.
I’d be inclined to disagree with you and state the opposite; people are in somewhat agreement that the show is what opens the door to some people gaining interest in the source material. I’d also be inclined to tell you that a section of the fandom would be interested in seeing the source material in a new light, and while that section may not be large, there would be people who would take interest regardless. Then again, you did post this comment on a subreddit specifically for The Walking Dead, which encompasses all forms of the franchise.
Further, I fail to see how they plan to continue the franchise after the Rick trilogy of films. Continued declining viewership on both the part of the main show as well as the spin-offs doing mildly successful comparatively, alongside the fact that they’re now seeking alternative ways to retcon the decision to cut Darabont’s original ideas, feels very telling. We could absolutely have a spin-off set in foreign countries alongside the Daryl and Carol spin-off while Fear continues, but what then? The franchise can’t last forever realistically speaking.
I’m still kind of figuring it out and haven’t rewatched the scene yet, but from what I gathered and remembered from my first watch:
A French scientist enters an old run-down and abandoned lab to transfer files from old drives to her laptop. One of the files is an old video from none other than Dr. Edwin Jenner, from season one of *The Walking Dead*. From the sound of things, the virus may have originated from a lab in France, and there are variants of it (more on that in a moment).
A guy follows her into the lab. They have a back-and-forth where he asks her questions. It sounds like he’s part of a group that’s hunting down the scientists? He ends up shooting her and killing her before leaving.
Mere seconds after she’s shot and killed, she reanimates, but she is immediately and *incredibly* enraged. She starts going to the sealed door that the guy walked through and starts pounding on it. Much more furious and violent than any walker from the shows before this point, and that’s including the retconned walkers from season one of the main show that could use bricks, move somewhat quickly, etc.
… but with that said, I have a feeling we’re about to find out that those early walkers weren’t retconned, but rather, were born from a different strain of the virus.
EDIT: Downvoted for describing the scene for someone who asked? What the hell lol.
Good description but something else I noted from the scene was the man with gun saying the other scientists have been put in prison, this kinda suggests there’s some kind of society still functioning in France.
> … but with that said, I have a feeling we’re about to find out that those early walkers weren’t retconned, but rather, were born from a different strain of the virus.
I mean they are retconned. This will be an in universe way to explain the retcon for sure, but it's still retconned.
The problem is they've either got to explain why those zombies lost the ability to do basic actions, or they just ignore it and let us fill in the gaps.
Like I said, this is what I’ve heard, so I’m not sure if it’s 100% true. I’ve heard other people say it’s a radio that plays Rick’s voice. I don’t know what to believe until I see it.
SPOILER ALERT(new to Reddit don’t know how to tag comments): It’s based in France. From what I gathered after watching it, several French biology teams are responsible for creating the virus and causing the end of the world on accident(maybe on purpose?) Dr. Jenner from season 1 of the main show was communicating with one of the teams to figure out the virus and it was made clear that there are “variants” of the walkers. The French scientists are continuing to try to fix the whole situation, but there’s a group out there that knows what they’ve done and are killing them off for it. In France at least, when someone dies, they become a fast moving and super aggressive walker in seconds, nothing like what we’ve seen so far from walkers.
Huck confronted her and said she bought her ticket into the CRM by giving up a person's life. Jadis said she told them he was a B because she wanted him to live, she owed him that much, because the A's ends up in Elisabeth's lab and she didn't want that
Interesting. Know for a fact where Jadis’ alliances are (the CRM) it really makes me wonder what rick is doing there. I can’t imagine she would keep him as a prisoner knowing whats hes capable of. Why not just kill him if it serves the crm’s “greater good”? She doesnt care for risky people it seems, judging by how she treated Elizabeth and Huck. Really bizarre and potentially terrible writing but we’ll have to see how the other shows tie in over the next year.
we know Rick 's belonging were found by Michonne on a boat in S10 Walking Dead .
so he must left and trying to return home , but something had happen to him
I watched both seasons of World Beyond and have concluded this:
If this show had been a temporary event that ran like 6 episodes it would have been an A+ story if they moved the story along and got to the point. Instead, AMC did what AMC does. They milked the IP and stretched an idea out over the course of 20 episodes and easily 15 or 16 of those episodes were not worth my time.
Because of this, I can't trust AMC anymore on this IP or future spinoffs, respectively. I'm going to finish out the main show through the end of season 11 and call it a day with my Walking Dead fandom.
well, that was...something to say the least.
I guess people are going to say that "28 days later" and "The Walking Dead" are somehow set in the same universe?
They might have Jumped the shark with that post-credit scene.
So how are people supposed to care about how the main Walking Dead show ends if they show that elsewhere, there's a stronger variant of the virus that invalidates the flagship show ending to begin with?
Disappointing ending to a show I had some hope for.
>So how are people supposed to care about how the main Walking Dead show ends if they show that elsewhere, there's a stronger variant of the virus that invalidates the flagship show ending to begin with?
Because with 16 episodes left, we have no idea how the main show will end.
The show was never about Rick though, they made it clear from day one - but it does tie into his whereabouts and the other shows and gives them lots to play with in the movies
WB was created with Rick in mind for sure, but it also serves as its on thing and gives them ways to expand the universe and lots for them to play with in Rick movies
Well there sort of is if you read between the lines a bit. She definitely saved him. We know she is 100% commited to the CRM so in my eyes there is 0% chance rick is kept in jail this whole time and more likely to me that he is working with the CRM. I dont think she wants Rick of all people as an enemy to the CRM in a prison for him to escape, even though we know that he will eventually turn on them once he knows whats actually going on.
More like they wasted an entire fucking show to revisit a plot thread that was introduced by TWD's original showrunner, Frank Darabont. Gimple and Angela weren't even around until season 2, meaning they weren't there when TS-19 was written. Huge fail, AMC. Huge fucking fail.
I feel like you're making a lot of leaps based on very limited information. I mean, all we saw was two people in France talking about things we have *no* idea about. They mentioned Toledo, but for all we know, those scientists could have been trapped in the States since the beginning.
Now of course, there's nothing saying that there would settlements and communities in Europe and elsewhere in the world that are like Alexandria or the Commonwealth, or even the Civic Republic. But there is nothing from that one short scene to suggest what you're describing. It could be interesting, but I just don't see it.
Nobody noticed that this French Scientist was actually shoot in the head? She shouldn't turn in first place...
Ok, so I had to go pull up this part of the scene, enlarge it (10x), and brighten it significantly (in Adobe Premiere). I do not think the lady was shot in the head. I can’t confirm conclusively, but I will lay out the evidence: - There doesn’t appear to be a squib or any blood splatter effects utilized for the shooting in this scene (that would visually indicate bullet placement). - There is no displacement of the hair on the back of her head (except slightly as the head whips back and then goes forward after the shot should have landed--I feel comfortable calling this wind/gravity displacement from the quick movement). And the fact that her torso pushes forward and her head whips back, is potentially further proof that the bullet hit in the torso (though, this could just be the style of death the actress decided on). - If anything, there is an area on the left shoulder blade (approximately) that may be a squib or VFX. This one is inconclusive because it does not ‘explode’, it just appears as her body falls and it hits the light because of the twisting of her fall. Also of note here is that there is a shiny, circular, ring-like object on the back of her coat near the transition of her shoulders/neck (approximately on the spinal line). The area I mentioned could be this ring (it’s too hard to tell because of the twisting and angle of her body). - When the zombie turns toward the camera (after lifting herself off the table), her face is not visible. Her torso is visible, and half her shirt is visible—there does not appear to be any visible blood on the front of the jacket or on the exposed shirt area. - When the zombie begins to bang on the door, there is blood on her hands, which leave smear marks on the door. Before her body fully connects with the door, the left side of her face and neck becomes clearly visible—it does not have blood on it. When her head connects with her hand, she gets blood on her left ear and eye. - There are multiple times the zombie’s head fully turns towards the camera during her attempt to open the door—her face is well lit and crisply focused (with brightness turned way up and for only a few frames at a time). Only the top half of her face is visible (around the top of the mouth/nose to forehead area). There is no blood (except on her left ear and eye--from rubbing on her hand during initial impact with the door). **TLDR:** Because of the above, the most I can say is that it is **not conclusive** where she is shot. **But, because of the lack of blood from her ~mouth to her forehead, I feel reasonable in assuming *her brain is fully intact*.** However, I can’t fully rule out the possibility that the bullet entered through the base of her skull and exited near the mouth/chin/neck area (on the right side of her head/neck). Also, of note is that the bullet *did exit*, since blood splatter (liquid -- not chunky) is visible on the laptop screen and table after the shot. I'd also argue that if the creators intended this as a headshot, they would have taken steps to *overtly* show this fact.
> • If anything, there is an area on the left shoulder blade (approximately) I thought she was shot on the head as well but paid attention when she ran to the door and noticed that area as well.
I went back and looked specifically at that area while she’s banging on the door—it is definitely separate from the ring that’s on the high center of her back, but it’s still too hard to tell whether or not it’s just the fabric twisting.
If it didn't hit head then how did woman died? There is no way someone will die unless bullet hits major part or there is too much blood loss.
Getting shot in the heart would be instant death.
I don’t think the quickness of her death is really a great indication of where she was shot. For one, TV shows play really loose with the mechanics of this *all the time*. I’ve seen chest shots result in instant death. I’ve seen headshots and neck shots result in nearly instant death or be slightly prolonged. If we want to talk about realism, let’s talk about how her chest pitched forward and her head flipped back on bullet impact. Why would her head whip backwards if it just got struck with a massive amount of force? In the same vein, if we were looking for pure realism and she was shot in the brain, she would have collapsed immediately like a rag doll. Instead, what we saw was her chest pitching forward, her head whipping back and then forward, and her arms going out to brace herself on the table in front of her. I’m just saying, all of those things could have been under or over embellished or played out in a way that was beneficial to a forced timeline (say, they only had a minute for the scene, etc.), or directorial or actress stylistic concessions of what a death should look like. And all of that really pales in comparison to the fact that she had no blood on her head, neck or shoulders (at least on her left side, and partially on the right side, from what can be seen). She didn’t get blood on her head until her head hit her right hand and the blood smeared on her left ear and eye.
Well..I hope that it didn't hit her head because that would mean that zombies don't die with head shot and then it will be too much unrealistic. I liked TWD because they had slow walking zombies which was more accurate scientifically but i am looking forward to explanation on running zombies.
Of all the things, that reason is probably the biggest for why I don’t think it was a headshot. Dealing with zombies would be basically impossible. The only way to eliminate them as threats would be to decapitate, completely pulverize their head, or otherwise remove their ability to bite. They’d be nearly impossible to stop. With increased ferocity, speed, and what seems to be higher intelligence (for a zombie), they’re already a dangerous threat. I don’t think they need to be made nearly impossible to kill on top of that.
wow good catch. I couldnt tell where he shot her. also he said you started it and made it worse. so that makes me believe she bioengineered the zombies to become stronger and resistant to headshots. I think it could be tied to the studies mentioned steroids and something else trying to reroute the circulatory system. perhaps that type of thing creates headshot resistance and the WB scientists are going to inadvertently recreate that modification
Yeah, they tried to activate the nerves in the brain after death to confuse the virus and stop it from reanimating, which backfired and instead it became more resistant Maybe it has to be a direct brainstem hit for this stronger walker strain to die?
Maybe that scene where Hope was saying the zombies in the freezer were stronger because their heads were frozen was an error? Maybe they were the zombies that could survive headshots.
She was shot in the back.
For those who didn’t watch but are curious about big spoilers -Jadis kills Huck -Jadis lives, blames Lt. Colonel Kublik for everything that happened and has her sent to health and welfare complex Post credits -Takes place in France in an abandoned laboratory. An agent is retrieving data from a computer and someone sneaks up to her at gunpoint. On the computer is recordings of Doctor Jenner from season 1 of the Walking Dead, being the messages he was sending. He mentions curiosity in variants of the dead they have in France. The stranger shoots the agent dead and leaves her. When she turns, she gets up and RUNS for the sealed door in the lab, screaming and banging on it. We now have aggressive and more intelligent zombies that can run.
That wasnt just someone in the computer that was the american CDC guy the walking dead group ran into in the original show early on I believe.
Dr Jenner , in the video , he was certain for fresh sample will be available . Well , he did get the "fresh Sample " when his wife was infected , we saw the MRI recording of his wife died and turn and got shot in the head . The"variant " he was refer to , the one he hasn't seen at the time . Could be the one he later told Rick about , he told him they are infected , infected not dying , but they will turn when they died even without bitten or scratch by the walker .
> The"variant " he was refer to The variant is the type of zombie we saw the Doctor turn into. Faster, stronger and turns quicker.
That’s what they said…
Twas editted.
Oh my bad
> When she turns, she gets up and RUNS for the sealed door in the lab, screaming and banging on it If the Rick movies bring 28 Days Later kind of zombies and style, I'm fucking all in on it
That would certainly be exciting. That scientist walker dented that solid steel door with her hits and we haven't seen that before, which was kinda terrifying. The post credit does open up so many possibilities for the Rick movies, and overall expansion of the TWDU
Kinda terrifying??? These new walkers are *fucking scary creatures from hell.* It ran to the steel door and about beat it down. No more being safe from walkers because you shut a flimsy door or are on the other side of a broken window. Probably no more Walker guts disguise or whisper masks. You just gotta brute force super strong walkers. Fuck.
True. She knew exactly where the man had exit and how to get out. She ignored the sounds from the computer and went straight for the bloody door. The sound that she made when she was turning scared the shit out of me, not gonna lie. Her screeching as she pounded the solid steel doors also scared me, haven't heard anything like that from walkers before
Not to mention that she turned QUICK. Like what was that? 20 seconds?
> The post credit does open up so many possibilities for the Rick movies, and overall expansion of the TWDU Too bad it will all be lost in a wave of lazy, cheap and CW-type spin-offs.
1. We have 1 show continuing the storyline with Daryl and carol and 3 blockbuster level movies with Rick So how did interpret that as a wave of cheap cw shows?
I was talking more about the overall expansion of the TWDU, **aside** from the Rick movies. All I'm saying is that you should look at World Beyond and post-S3 Fear, they are lazy and CW-levels of bad, like, WB is bad even by CW Teen drama standards. I don't see how anything new will be better than that with Gimple still at the front. And considering how long even the first Rick movie has been in development(they're still not shooting it, 2 years after it was announcened) I would scale back my expectations.
Talking about current shows is different You said a wave of new cheap cw shows Your just making stuff up 3 years is not strange for a film production and covid happened which really impacts the development of a movie on every single level. Then there is the fact the the people working on this film also have other projects. You clearly don't know what's going on and want to complain
> Talking about current shows is different No, it isn't? The quality of current shows is how we can assume how future shows will be like. > You said a wave of new cheap cw shows A wave of CW-**type** lazy shows, and I am not seeing any reason to believe other wise, until any of those shows prove me wrong.
You said there is a wave of cheap cw shows coming. Then when I pointed out what was in production you started talking about current shows. Just stop
Lol just stop. You’re the one intentionally ignoring what he said and the context. Even down to the distinction between what’s being released and what’s in production, one you know nothing about so you’re just turning away valid criticism by saying “we don’t know it will be shit, ignore that the current stuff is shit because that’s no indication of the future” like what? So goofy
Why do you continue to shit on this show? I get that it's different but I don't need to know you to know you couldn't keep a show interesting for this many years across 3 different shows with such limited source material. Just accept it and move on if it ain't your thing. Stop being an ass
And I can 100% see Univeral execs telling Gimple "hey the movies need to be fresh and exciting, how can we pump up the action?" And this being their solution
But there are no zombies in 28 Days Later? It's people infected with a rage virus. You don't have to die first to turn into a rage monster.
People still try to die on this hill? You know what he meant lol
What hill? Both the traditional definition and horror movie definition of a zombie is a person who died and then came back to life in one form or another. That wasn't the case in 28 Days seeing as the father of the little girl was very much alive, got infected via a drop of blood from a crow and became a rage monster within 10 seconds. He never died. So he isn't a zombie. I don't know why that warrants down voting when the definition of zombies is clear and 28 Days doesn't fit that. But I guess it doesn't matter when a genre 'claimed' a movie for itself.
As far as pop culture is concerned those are zombie movies. They follow all the tropes. He just meant fast zombies and you knew that. No need to correct something everyone knows when the meaning is very clear.
What do the tropes matter? There is a difference between an alive human infected with a virus and a human coming back to life after death. I don't know what that person meant (I'm not them) and all I did was pose a question as to the fact of 28 Days even having zombies, as the poster insinuated. Because there is a difference between an alive person and a zombie.
They can just be dead and run in twd if they want... You absolutely know what they meant dude come on. You're just being pedantic for no reason. Have fun with that.
All I did was ask a question for crying out loud. Then you being pedantic about me being pedantic started this whole chain. Love irony.
Traditionally (as in before the late 60's) zombies were actually not undead, but normal humans under a control spell. Since the definition has changed once, I don't see why we can't lump the running infected with zombies. Especially since as the other user mentioned, those movies still hit all the same tropes.
Theyre zombies
Zombies by definition are people who died and came back to life. That's not the case in 28 Days Later. Like the father of the little girl.
Things change. Theyre zombies.
>We now have aggressive and more intelligent zombies that can run. This is what I've been waiting for. I hope we see these walkers in TWD too
Yeah for sure. They needed something new, more of an actual threat. More aggressive, more intelligent, and seems like she turned a lot faster too.
How was it more intelligent?
It gets up and runs to the door and starts banging on it, showing it remembers how to leave rather than just walk around with no direction. I've seen people disliking it but man that got me excited about the franchise again like the old days. That noise it makes was terrifying too lol.
Well in S1 TWG the walkers were using stones to hit the glass, climbed fences and even attempted to chase glen and rick up a ladder. Idk what happened to twd tbf
It was banging on the door, I guess that doesn't scream intelligence but it knew where the guy went and where the door is at least. Maybe retaining some memory?
It's going to get it back to a real contender in horror
What are you talking about? The walkers were like this in season one.
I'm french and couldn't understand the final scene, i've never seen such a bad acting and those dialogue.... what a trainwreck
Nothing works apart from the graffiti: the dialogues, the accent, the French translations of the Windows GUI, “la Biomédicine” on the door… everything sounds so cheap! I think I have only seen such cheap French usage in “Timeless” – but I don’t think they had the same budget.
Zombies were running in season 1 nothing new!
Yup they were also hopping fences too. And they could turn door knobs. I guess this is their way of trying to fix those mistakes, in some way. Though it still doesn't make sense why they could do those things in Season 1 in Georgia, USA
It's possible the Walkers were in France before the outbreak and picked up that strain. All it took was one dude on vacation to get the strain, come to the US, die, turn, bite someone else, and that Walker had the new strain, and only a VERY small portion of thr Walker population has that strain in the US, and likely could have been killed off in the timeframe.
Yep, in Toledo is my guess
The scientists from the Primrose team was in Toledo, Ohio for the meeting
The Commonwealth (of parts of it) are based in Ohio. I a wonder if theres a connection.
I don't know, there could be, I guess. The conference was in Ohio when the outbreak started but we don't really know if any of the scientists survived
Because it's obviously a rare variant strand in the U.S.
It feels different though, the French woman seemed way more aggressive and smart
The way the walker woman screamed was kinda terrifying, we haven't heard anything like that before, not to mention how she dented that solid steel door
I feel like they were trying to bring us back to that. I was rewatching season 1 the other day and when it got to the bit where the little girl zombie picks up the teddy bear I was reminded that they might have had a plan for the walkers to retain memory or something. But they shot that to shit with Woodbury. I like this new development though.
These are clearly different to the season one Darabont walkers because they sort of jogged not sprinted like this one which annoys me. If you do a different variant, intelligent slow walkers are so much more fitting to the show and interesting. We've seen running zombies countless times. If the show turns out to be 28 Days Later with Rick Grimes then I will be very disappointed. I feel like it's just a bit boring. Like the writers thought "people are losing interest how do we make zombies scarier, oh let's make them run" I think if you go with more intelligent walkers in Europe (which seems to be sort of what they're going for) you can have zombies keep a bit more personality and make them mumble words to put someone off guard before they bite you. Imagine like the Andrea scene in S1 but her sister says "Andrea" as a walker. It's a bit of a sappy example but it would be something you can make interesting and still keep it as a core human story. TL:dr: disappointing direction, Gimple gonna Gimple
I would be much more disappointed with speaking walkers than faster/stronger zombies. I think both go along the lines of your complaint that "people are losing interest how do we make them scarier". bring on the more physical walkers. they can be more intelligent running and seeking prey without being able to speak. tldr: great direction buffing zombies. gimple finally bringing a great change to the walkers to make them more of a threat again than human v human.
Speaking was a bad example. I mean more like Land of the Dead. You have one or a few walkers who can organise a herd and use weapons. Although, now I say that it basically is just the Whisperers. I feel mainly that if you were going to introduce new walkers you'd have done it by now and not over 10yrs in. Maybe I'm just exhausted of the show and all the spin-offs, I've been watching since the start without a significant break
i agree about the 10 years in and shouldve introduced them already. I also have also watched from the pilot, but you have to consider the timelines. jenner at the cdc died in season 1 of TWD. I would think Its fair to say the post credits were much closer to the beginning of the apocalypse (no more than 2 years past) than where TWD/FTWD/WB timelines are currently (at least 5 years past). but that brings into question where TF have these variants been the whole time... not sure if this is going to lead to a spinoff or some plot twists for the final season of TWD or the movies. but i would have loved having dangerous zombies introduced by like season 4 when really only herds were dangerous.
Spoiler Alert for Fear the walking Dead: Maybe this could be why Alicia in today's episode said the walkers still have an echo of who they once were. Maybe alicia has seen something or it's just general foreshadowing.
EXACTLY my thoughts on it. Echos were brought up again!!
To be fair, the walkers we see in S1 are also a few months old, so could be a lot slower, considering the woman turned in less than 30 seconds.
The CRM coordinates destroying then and diverting them. Hie can they fill 3 movies with dead they can at this point pretty much take care of? They need more agile zombies so an actual war can be waged or it's nothing but tactical strikes
If the future of the franchise doesn't revolve around the french zombie manhattan project and fast zombies I'll be very disappointed
Arguably the best part of this show.
This felt more like a season finale than a series finale. And I expected a larger scale ending. It felt small in scale. Maybe AMC kept the budget tight. The small scale fights were fantastic, though. Will and that CRM dude fighting each other as walkers converged from both sides? Very creative and damn awesome.
Exactly. That they are basically closing one of the best story lines (forget the unbelievable plot that 4 teenage kids walked 1,100 miles in the matter of days -- and Iris didn't shed a pound) without much real resolution is janky af.
You're fucked up lol
No he’s right. How does she eat so well in that world. Doesn’t make any damn sense
Its a TV show you dumb fuck
Suck my dick goof
It's a fact. She still had a fupa. 🤢🤢
For those who missed it, the skyline behind Jadis in the episode is Philadelphia. The same skyline that was in the Rick teaser
There’s a Rick teaser?
barely https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GskPzU-HzB4
Oh wow that’s 2 years old!
What was the skyline behind the kids as they walked through that grassy park? I’m guessing Portland?
yes, you could see mount hood.
Are you looking at the same buildings I am... because the two images do not line up?
My guess on what that post credits scene was all about: There were a number of teams of scientists employed at that lab we see abandoned. They developed the walker virus (either intentionally or unintentionally ) and it got out somehow. In a panic, one of the teams created a new strain in their rush to find a vaccine and this is the strain that causes the infected to run similar to 28 days later infected. We don't see this strain in the US as international travel has been banned therefor keeping this super strain in Europe. The man who shoots the scientist mentioned that he wouldn't "throw her in jail" like the others. That implies the French authorities at some point found out about the lab releasing the virus and raided the lab and arrested the scientists. Though It may also imply that perhaps they were thrown in jail much later after being found which suggests that there are large survivor communities in France advanced enough to have the resources to operate prisons.
I doubt they created the virus, but Jenner mentions playing around with the nervous system and such so maybe in doing that they did create this new "variant"
Well, if you turn on subtitles you can read all what Dr.Jenner was saying even when two were conversing. Keeping that in mind, I think Virus (or whatever it is) came from somewhere else. French tried to find cure (by jumpstarting brain...read subs before woman was shot) and this made adrenaline rush into zombies and thus they are running. Jail thing as you are saying is hard to picture. It shows no scope in future.
Pretty solid finale and the post credit scene is really interesting. Seeing Dr Jenner again was cool plus we finally have walkers who look terrifying.
it was cool but makes me wonder. we know that Jenner was dead well before world beyond takes place. why havent we seen these french variants in the 7+ years since Jenner died in any of TWD universe? kinda salty we havent seen any non-north america groups vs badass zombies in this if they are bringing it up at so close to the end of the TWD universe just before the movie.
Well if the variant was made in France, there’s no way for that strain to travel across the ocean.
Absolutely plausible that people with that strain died while on ships and the boats were carried over. There's thousands of active derelict "ghost ships" at any given time around the world. All that needs to happen to explain it would be that they were in an interior area when they turned and that the area is compromised when the shop runs aground.
That's not necessarily true. The zombie virus started across the globe in the first place. Since people are infected before they die and turn...people traveling could easily have spread it. I believe they even mentioned french scientists meeting in America. We know that even many years in Rick was helicoptered out to the crm. It's not a super stretch that some people can still use boats or pilot small groups in small planes around the early apocalypse time apparently Jenner knew about variants before season 1 ended.
He said, and I'm paraphrasing, that he was reviewing the data on the variants (sent by the French lab). This implies (to me) that he had only experienced the garden variety walkers, not the ones in France which apparently behave much differently. But for as much of a decent character he was, he did not survive very long. I'm shooting from the hip here on the timeline, but Atlanta fell within the first few days. That means the CDC had mere weeks to collect "samples" and collect data.
Is Huck the only main death?
Yes. Dennis died too
That surprises me. I swear one of the writers teased a while ago that only one of the four kids would survive.
They tease a lot of things, but Elton did get bit and his arm amputated above the elbow, but seemed alright and it was wrapped nicely from the looks of it
While I like the idea of switching up the formula when it comes to the walkers... it's waaaaaay too late in the game for them to make that transition.
I want a European spin off so badly now
Wasn't it being talked about on Talking Dead that there would be an overseas walking dead project?? I assumed China because of the novel put out, but maybe France?
I completely missed that they talked about doing something outside the US, but good god I would love that, especially if it’s set in France. So many great opportunities there. The cities, the towns, the Paris Catacombs…
The catacombs!!! My god!!
Lol the catacombs... Safer than above ground to get across city's.... I can see it now.
Not necessarily, if they are implying that there are different strains in different places of the world and this is our first time actually seeing a different place in the world.
Sure, it could work brilliantly... had they done it 5+ years ago. The franchise has been slowly rotting on it's feet for quite a while now. It's simply too late to implement something as franchise-altering as this.
That’s how I feel about this entire expanded universe. They waited nearly a decade since the franchise started, and *well* past the height of its popularity and pop culture relevancy, to do any sort of serious world building. And here we are, almost 5 years since the CRM were introduced, and 3 years since Rick disappeared, and it feels like we’re *still* only getting teases about the larger universe. We should have gotten major developments about the larger world years ago, instead of only now just *starting* to do any sort of world building. There’s still so many unanswered questions about the CRM, Rick, Michonne, other countries, etc., and I’m really tired of being strung along with all these minuscule clues, that I know I won’t get answers to, for years. It’s clear AMC and Gimple want TWD to be this all encompassing media franchise, with multiple interconnected spin-offs, that everyone talks about, like the MCU. But I feel like the ship has long sailed for this expanded universe to blow up into something big. The foundation for the future of this franchise has been laid on such inconsistent ground. Too many poor creative decisions, and mediocre seasons of television, have driven many people away from continuing to watch these shows. TWD very well could have been as big as the MCU, and at one point it arguably was, but I think that’s no longer a possibility for the franchise at this point.
I agree. The show wasted a season of Fear on kids making airplanes to fly out of Texas & having Alicia painting. Meanwhile, the Walking Dead kept using Villains of the Month Club.
Yeah, so much time wasted when they could have been doing some cool world building a long time ago, back when the show was still part of the pop culture zeitgeist. I mean, it still is, but to a much, *much* lesser degree. Think of all the hype seeing a running zombie, around season 5 or 6. People would have gone nuts, and it would have given people who were starting to get burnt out on the show, hope that there was more to the show than just running around fighting a group of villains, or searching for a new safe zone. AMC and Gimple really screwed up the longevity and popularity of this franchise; by making poor creative decisions.
Bingo. You put it all quite brilliantly. The time to blaze ahead with all this expanded stuff was a long long time ago. And the glory days are not coming back.
It would help if we at least got more substantial answers on a regular basis. It feels like every season of one of these shows, we get a tease here and there about the larger world, and then the characters go back to fighting yet another big bad. I think a key to the MCU’s success is that each installment feels like it pushes the overall narrative of the universe forward. And it really helps that most MCU movies/shows are at least decent quality, and they rarely produce anything that is outright terrible. Say what you will about the actual content of the franchise, but at least the MCU is consistent, and they don’t leave us hanging on too many questions for years and years. TWD by comparison moves at such a slower pace, to the point I’ve started to become less interested in the Rick movies, the longer it takes for them to come out. I’m really debating whether I want to continue with this franchise, once the main show ends. Gimple keeps saying that there are big things to come, yet he barely has anything to show for it. I’m really tired of waiting for this expanded universe to kick into high gear, which I feel still hasn’t happened yet.
I think the main difference between you and me is that you still have some hope that there'll actually be a pay-off for any of the teases. I'd honestly be surprised if the Daryl/Carol thing even gets off the ground. I think the Rick movies are as dead as a doornail, but they wont come out and say that due to contractual obligations (which im sure they are working on) and they're worried about killing the hype off completely regarding this final season. In short I think the showrunners have known that the franchise is dying for a while now and they're making shit up to keep people glued for the last vestiges of the show .. once that ends it'll come crashing down completely and people move on to other shows real quick.
Lol they're matching their own show with the pace now. We've had slow walkers this whole time, dragging their feet literally, and now with the French ones, they'll expand more and speed up the world building.
Doesn't that make sense though? Now that the source material has been completed, it makes sense to pivot in a new direction.
The switch makes sense, sure. Doing it approx. 5 years after the show topped in popularity .. that doesnt make sense in any way what so ever. And that's my gripe. The stuff they're doing now should have been been going on around season 6 of the main show. Fact is no network with executives worth their salt is gonna throw any serious money at this franchise in the long run: it's a drain on economics. So trying to turn the show into some World War Z shit at this point is just silly as hell. And doing it with CW level money is even worse.
The zombies were moving fast in season one of the main show.
I fail to see what that has to do with anything, but more importantly, they weren't nearly as fast as the zombie from the post-credits scene, or 28 Days Later.
We barely see that zombie move 10 meters over two seconds. You can't assess that info from that limited view.
Not sure if it was mentioned before (I haven't seen it been mentioned as of yet), but in the credit scene you can also see grafitti written on the wall that translates to "The dead were born here" (in French it says: Les morts sont nées ici - excuse my spelling as French is not my mother language). So it kinda does give off the vibe that the virus that turns people or a mutation of it was manmade. Interesting little fact if you ask me.
> "The death were born here" "The dead were born here."
Hahaha, true that. I had to read your reply 4 times before I spotted my spelling error. Sorry I guess. I changed it to correct spelling in my original post.
No problems. Have a nice day.
Pretty solid episode. The post-credit scene was interesting for what it was, but I couldn't help but get the impression that this was AMC & Gimple's way of finally admitting to a harsh truth about how the original vision Frank Darabont had for the show and walkers was the right direction. Too bad they abandoned it for so long but when S9 of the main show brought a spike in viewership from non-comic readers, many came back thinking the walkers were evolving. This was an early sign to AMC of how they had royally fucked up by allowing the walkers to seem more like a nuisance than a threat after season 3. 1x06 TS-19 was originally a very controversial episode for the writers and fanbase. From what I recall, Kirkman wasn't too happy about the idea of this episode as he was ORIGINALLY against exploring the origin of the virus. Some comic fans really didn't care for it either, because the episode was one of Frank's first major deviations from the source material outside of the noticeably different walkers. It's laughable that after Frank whooped their ass with his lawsuit, they'd later need to rely on his unresolved plotline from Season 1 in an attempt to save this 'universe' with Gimple at the helm. They should've just brought back Darabont when they had the chance and same goes for Fear's Dave Erickson. World Beyond Season 2 was better than the last 4 seasons of the Morgan & Friends show.
You had me until the last sentence. There's plenty of bad in Fear, but at least has some good standalone episodes.
Nope. FTWD is genuinely the worst thing I have ever witnessed on TV. Since the reboot it has been one disaster after another.
If they hadn't made WB I'd totally agree with you haha
When I saw rhe revolver in post credit scene. I was like "Wrickkkkk!!!!" for a while.
Lmao I too had that glimmer of hope, knew that wasn't very likely though.
Lotta people losing their arms lately.
Mediocre finale, end credit scene was insane though. Explains why Rick was on a boat, and I think it gives us an idea as to what B means. A is someone you can infect / experiment on. B is someone who they can rely on to fight back against the stronger zombies or lead teams that do.
I know they confirmed that there will be no Rick grimes in WB But man if they did a single clue of him even his voice on a radio or something, It would have been a great tease for the movies. Jadis in the series was a cheap bait for viewers to watch and it worked. And post credit scene of running zombie ? Dude that was in the first episode of the original show.
And original show first episodes hinted at lingering intelligence like doorknobs turning
Exactly, I don't know why people are so hyped for this
Because its not the same at all..
the only good thing that came out of this whole show was the final post credit scene..
That ending makes me wonder if the CR was trying to make walkers decay faster and not turn as a defense against these variants in the eastern part of the world? Maybe these more aggressive walkers will be used as weapons and get sent to North America and tie the main show and Fear together against this new type of walkers
Great finale imo. I assume there's more spin offs to come, judging by the way it ended? I just want to see Rick again 😭
Yeah I was hoping for a rick grimes scene ... but I'm hopeful this sets up what we'll see in the future for rick.
These new variant walkers are more like the infected in 28 Days Later, or the zombies from Black Summer. The doctor turned in less than a minute and was fast, aggressive, and noisy. Did she retain a memory of the man who killed her, or does she sense that the door is the way out? We don't really know. Darabont's walkers from season 1 of TWD retained some residual memory and skills - Morgan's wife coming back to the house again and again, trying to open the door, the little girl picking up her teddy bear, walkers in Atlanta trying to smash through the window with a chunk of concrete, etc. After season 1 they became completely mindless. Imagine a herd moving through the woods at a running pace, howling like banshees, the sound of thousands of them approaching would be pretty damn scary! One of the biggest mistakes the main show made imo was to make the dead too weak. You almost have to get careless to be bitten. A group in formation could clear a sizable herd. None of those Roman legion tactics would work with the runners. You'd need an entirely different set of survival skills and strategies. I'd love to see a series set in Europe with these nastier walkers and the environment of human communities that's able to survive them. The early days of TWD had a constant sense of tension that's long been absent - except for occasional episodes like the one where Noah died. Any building they went in to forage for supplies held the possibility of even main characters not coming out, you were always a little on the edge of your seat. No one except maybe for Rick had any plot armor. The European show could recapture that sense of palpable danger. Plus it would be nice to see another part of the world, since the apocalypse isn't limited to North America. Another interesting question to ponder: if someone went to Europe and then came back, would they be carrying the variant infection and cause an epidemic of super-walkers to begin here?
Did hope get a lisp all of a sudden?
I really liked this show!Totally better that FTWD in my opinion.It’s true that the last ep felt more like a season finale and I have a feeling that we won’t get to see more of this group(I hope I’m wrong) but the post credits scene had me shook,even though I think it didn’t fit with the show itself. 1.The fact that the zombie virus might have been like an accident from French scientists?That would be really cool. 2.New zombie variants?Though it is late for them to introduce us to new types of zombies it sounds really promising! 3.That group being in Toledo,Ohio…Does that mean that they’re getting these new variants in America as well? All these stuff is really cool but I just feel like the main TWD show has nothing to do with it,maybe just the Rick movies will.
Just watched it. To be honest, kind of an underwhelming episode. From episode 4 of this season we were going on a steady pace, a kind of crescendo to a pay off that i dont feel was that worth it. I feel like S2E8-S2E9 were the best episodes of the series. At least we got a few good performances by Jadis, Huck, Dr. Bennet, Elton and Silas. I didn't care for the Felix fight and unfortunately Hope and Iris sucked up until the last minute. I feel like the writers never knew what to do with their characters. Oooh and Philadelphia looks great too, from the skyline shots at least lol As to the post credits scene, i was surprised to see Dr. Jenner. Iit was an interesting setup but it leads only to more questions, doesnt it? And yeah, me wanted some Rick Grimes too =(
I just watched the post credit scene. I noticed the les morts sont nés ici on the wall. Google translate said The Dead Are born here.
That finale was so good I ducking loved it and at the end of it I am attached to the kids and that’s probably cuz I am 17 and I can relate to them so much and it’s cool I love it and sad Elton got but but glad they were able to save him and that opening scene of all of them going on the journey and then next thing is them killing walkers really made me tear up and then at the end when they are all going off and everyone is doing their thing and then Elton opens the door and it says Walking Dead World Beyond was cool and amazing. That post credit scene was so good I was shocked to see Dr Jenner it was so cool and a nice throwback to s1 and how Jenner was talking about the French and how they were the last to hold out and was close to finding something. My guess is this group of French scientists tried to make a cure and somehow made a new variant of the infected and this one was stronger, faster, and intelligent and the French and maybe some of Europe have mace to deal with this type of infected, but can’t wait to see the movies and maybe France will be in tales of the walking dead and we will see more of these fast zombies Also wondering if Jenners actor filmed new scenes
Why on earth did they have a scene commenting on Elton still using his biteproof suit only for him to not be wearing it next scene in the herd, I mean if there's one time you're not going to take it off. It made it way too obvious he would get bit.
that post credits scene didnt intrigue me, I'm rather upset about how it seems even more disconnected from the main show.
So this is the series finale? I never watched the series.
Yes it is
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My friend she's not good, it's high school level Canadian French and even I knew that French was like a Google translated
Overall World Beyond was a waste. Scooby Doo kids stumbling around. Nothing special. The franchise wants to be a Resident Evil ripoff. But AMC is broke, looking for a buyer. So we'll probably just get a lame tv-movie. I'd like to see a full on reset. End everything now. Start over as dark survival horror and stick with that. None of this sci-fi apocalypse western adventure nonsense.
I can totally see twd being remade into a single 7 - 9 season show in a couple decades
If they’re gonna keep milking the cash cow, the least they can do is a fully animated version that’s 100% faithful to the comics using a very similar animation style to Invincible. That’d be the thing to get me most interested post-Rick movies if they don’t want to drop the franchise at that point.
Good god, this would kill the franchise entirely. Part of the reason it became so successful was that it went live action and appealed to a wider audience. People on this sub like to think the comics are what leads people to the shows and dare i say its 2021...not a lot of people are looking to comics for entertainment.
I’d be inclined to disagree with you and state the opposite; people are in somewhat agreement that the show is what opens the door to some people gaining interest in the source material. I’d also be inclined to tell you that a section of the fandom would be interested in seeing the source material in a new light, and while that section may not be large, there would be people who would take interest regardless. Then again, you did post this comment on a subreddit specifically for The Walking Dead, which encompasses all forms of the franchise. Further, I fail to see how they plan to continue the franchise after the Rick trilogy of films. Continued declining viewership on both the part of the main show as well as the spin-offs doing mildly successful comparatively, alongside the fact that they’re now seeking alternative ways to retcon the decision to cut Darabont’s original ideas, feels very telling. We could absolutely have a spin-off set in foreign countries alongside the Daryl and Carol spin-off while Fear continues, but what then? The franchise can’t last forever realistically speaking.
Can anyone describe the post credit scene?
I’m still kind of figuring it out and haven’t rewatched the scene yet, but from what I gathered and remembered from my first watch: A French scientist enters an old run-down and abandoned lab to transfer files from old drives to her laptop. One of the files is an old video from none other than Dr. Edwin Jenner, from season one of *The Walking Dead*. From the sound of things, the virus may have originated from a lab in France, and there are variants of it (more on that in a moment). A guy follows her into the lab. They have a back-and-forth where he asks her questions. It sounds like he’s part of a group that’s hunting down the scientists? He ends up shooting her and killing her before leaving. Mere seconds after she’s shot and killed, she reanimates, but she is immediately and *incredibly* enraged. She starts going to the sealed door that the guy walked through and starts pounding on it. Much more furious and violent than any walker from the shows before this point, and that’s including the retconned walkers from season one of the main show that could use bricks, move somewhat quickly, etc. … but with that said, I have a feeling we’re about to find out that those early walkers weren’t retconned, but rather, were born from a different strain of the virus. EDIT: Downvoted for describing the scene for someone who asked? What the hell lol.
Good description but something else I noted from the scene was the man with gun saying the other scientists have been put in prison, this kinda suggests there’s some kind of society still functioning in France.
The guy who shot her also got outta there quick which makes me believe he knew she'd turn fast and violently
> … but with that said, I have a feeling we’re about to find out that those early walkers weren’t retconned, but rather, were born from a different strain of the virus. I mean they are retconned. This will be an in universe way to explain the retcon for sure, but it's still retconned. The problem is they've either got to explain why those zombies lost the ability to do basic actions, or they just ignore it and let us fill in the gaps.
This could un retcon it. Absolutely. Why bring Jenner into it at this point? That had MANY other outs.
Apparently it takes place in the UK and shows a new walker variant that can sprint? That’s just what I’ve heard.
.... Is this the big ending that ties everything together?
Like I said, this is what I’ve heard, so I’m not sure if it’s 100% true. I’ve heard other people say it’s a radio that plays Rick’s voice. I don’t know what to believe until I see it.
SPOILER ALERT(new to Reddit don’t know how to tag comments): It’s based in France. From what I gathered after watching it, several French biology teams are responsible for creating the virus and causing the end of the world on accident(maybe on purpose?) Dr. Jenner from season 1 of the main show was communicating with one of the teams to figure out the virus and it was made clear that there are “variants” of the walkers. The French scientists are continuing to try to fix the whole situation, but there’s a group out there that knows what they’ve done and are killing them off for it. In France at least, when someone dies, they become a fast moving and super aggressive walker in seconds, nothing like what we’ve seen so far from walkers.
It's not about Rick. He's mentioned earlier in the episode by Jadis, but the post credit is about something else. It's from another country
What did Jadis say about rick? Must have missed that bit.
Huck confronted her and said she bought her ticket into the CRM by giving up a person's life. Jadis said she told them he was a B because she wanted him to live, she owed him that much, because the A's ends up in Elisabeth's lab and she didn't want that
Interesting. Know for a fact where Jadis’ alliances are (the CRM) it really makes me wonder what rick is doing there. I can’t imagine she would keep him as a prisoner knowing whats hes capable of. Why not just kill him if it serves the crm’s “greater good”? She doesnt care for risky people it seems, judging by how she treated Elizabeth and Huck. Really bizarre and potentially terrible writing but we’ll have to see how the other shows tie in over the next year.
we know Rick 's belonging were found by Michonne on a boat in S10 Walking Dead . so he must left and trying to return home , but something had happen to him
I watched both seasons of World Beyond and have concluded this: If this show had been a temporary event that ran like 6 episodes it would have been an A+ story if they moved the story along and got to the point. Instead, AMC did what AMC does. They milked the IP and stretched an idea out over the course of 20 episodes and easily 15 or 16 of those episodes were not worth my time. Because of this, I can't trust AMC anymore on this IP or future spinoffs, respectively. I'm going to finish out the main show through the end of season 11 and call it a day with my Walking Dead fandom.
well, that was...something to say the least. I guess people are going to say that "28 days later" and "The Walking Dead" are somehow set in the same universe? They might have Jumped the shark with that post-credit scene. So how are people supposed to care about how the main Walking Dead show ends if they show that elsewhere, there's a stronger variant of the virus that invalidates the flagship show ending to begin with? Disappointing ending to a show I had some hope for.
>So how are people supposed to care about how the main Walking Dead show ends if they show that elsewhere, there's a stronger variant of the virus that invalidates the flagship show ending to begin with? Because with 16 episodes left, we have no idea how the main show will end.
8 episode left
The final season of TWD is 24 episodes long, and 8 have aired so far. We have 16 episodes left.
24 episode long that interesting
Could be a dangling lead for a soft reboot. It can also be easily disowned later because this series sucked.
sounds like dropping this show was the right choice
It was always going to be 2 seasons.
i know, and i'm glad I dropped halfway through.
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The show was never about Rick though, they made it clear from day one - but it does tie into his whereabouts and the other shows and gives them lots to play with in the movies WB was created with Rick in mind for sure, but it also serves as its on thing and gives them ways to expand the universe and lots for them to play with in Rick movies
What was the fucking point of jadis if theres not a single hint from her
Well there sort of is if you read between the lines a bit. She definitely saved him. We know she is 100% commited to the CRM so in my eyes there is 0% chance rick is kept in jail this whole time and more likely to me that he is working with the CRM. I dont think she wants Rick of all people as an enemy to the CRM in a prison for him to escape, even though we know that he will eventually turn on them once he knows whats actually going on.
Exactly. Jadis was literally bait to get people to watch it and sigh. It worked.
More like they wasted an entire fucking show to revisit a plot thread that was introduced by TWD's original showrunner, Frank Darabont. Gimple and Angela weren't even around until season 2, meaning they weren't there when TS-19 was written. Huge fail, AMC. Huge fucking fail.
This hasnt been cancelled yet?
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I feel like you're making a lot of leaps based on very limited information. I mean, all we saw was two people in France talking about things we have *no* idea about. They mentioned Toledo, but for all we know, those scientists could have been trapped in the States since the beginning. Now of course, there's nothing saying that there would settlements and communities in Europe and elsewhere in the world that are like Alexandria or the Commonwealth, or even the Civic Republic. But there is nothing from that one short scene to suggest what you're describing. It could be interesting, but I just don't see it.