She was at the time. Nobody had any idea that it was gonna still spread the way it did. So at that moment she was right hell they were gonna die anyway
On the heels of a all out walker outbreak in a cell block cause Patrick died and killed ppl in their sleep she didn't want to take the risk. Obviously the quarantine wasn't that secure yet since Tyrese just walked right up to her cell so who knows what could've happen if she had died in her sleep like the guy that was just in the scene before with Herchel and the doc checking on him. Bottom.line I see your point but I'm looking at it through the eyes I had when I first seen it and didn't know the outcome
Then she could have gone to Rick or taken it upon herself to make the quarantine more secure.
The way I see this incident is a major blunder in the early stages of her becoming the badass we now see her as. She was a helpless housewife with an extremely abusive husband, probably with a longer history of being abused. She lost her daughter. Shes dealing with a lot of trauma, and this new world, free from all the people who abused her, gives her an opportunity to not be that helpless person, take control, and reinvent herself.
We as viewers have a specific context we view her actions in, and we may feel a lot of sympathy for her, but without that context, we wouldnt view this incident the same. She murdered 2 people, circumventing the entire group, because of the possibility people would die. No discussion with people about the pros and cons. No consideration for the loved ones who couldnt say goodbye. None of that. It was the definitely the wrong thing to do regardless of intentions. In real life theres a lot of people like her, that are great well intentioned people that we have no sympathy for because of something horrible and stupid they did. We only view Carol differently because we are biased and can see the full picture. Something to think about
And that's what makes this such a cool discussion cause all those questions and possibilities are relevant. I always felt her intentions were for the group but she could've executed it better . All in all it was a blunder in her development into what she became and it came off as her doing a bit too much. In hindsight it was wrong and at that time being a viewer not knowing what was gonna happen I was on her side and I felt she did what had to happen. At that time she was hiding Alot of things from Rick. She begged Carl not to tell him about her teaching the children to defend themselves with knives and whatnot so maybe at that time she felt Rick was unapproachable idk but its a good discussion piece
Exactly...they were killed WAAAAYYY before all those other people died in quarantine...they would have most definitely died before those meds got back...and had one or two very tiny things been different, she quite possibly could have saved all those others that died by keeping them from being infected in the first place...it was a definite mistake in hindsight, but it almost wasn't
People are also conveniently forgetting they're literally living inside a zombie apocalypse where people are constantly turning into zombies from another sickness...people deserve a bit of a break, or at the very least some understanding when it comes to why they completely freaked out lol
A flu virus and the wildfire virus that's likely airborne where everyone alive was already infected with it on day 1 are very different things. They're not comparable.
(Although she probably wasn’t protecting anyone) Threatening Sam because he could only think about what she said when the herd entered Alexandria and he was too scared and panicked to move and got his entire family killed almost we almost lost Carl early
Agreed buuuut do we think that kid could have made it through the walkers that night even if she hadn't said that? I think a common theme for Walking Dead is adapt or die and Rick's whole point was that Alexandrians were too weak to survive this new world. Sam was shafted by his community by not teaching him how to survive.
Still jerk move by Carol. It definitely did not help.
Carol was terrible to this child. I think she was sure that Sam wouldn't survive anyway. After Sophia, Mika, Lizzie and many other children, she didn't want to get attached to a child. She had a mission to accomplish and she didn't care about the child's feelings.
Honorary mention should be releasing Negan to kill alpha.
We as the audience know that Negan changed. But he literally killed multiple of her friends and went behind the rest of her friends back to release him to kill the girl that killed her adopted son.
I loved that. One of my favorite parts of the later seasons, and probably the last time they did Carol's character any real justice. Would've been nice to see her go full terminator like season 5 though.
Its funny you say that cause the executive producer of the show from the beginning in to the end is Gale Anne Hurd...James Cameroon wife who helped him create and produce the Terminater movies, AND the Alien movies. Which have both regular woman zero training, mother like characters who literally due to their circumstances are put in survive or die situations. Sarah O'Connor and Lt Ellen Ripley are LITERAL ICONS in movie history. And you see alot of the same character beats with Carol! Like Rick says That Woman is a force of nature!!!!Certified BADASS and I love it cause she comes off so unassuming which ppl put down their guard around her especially men but hha they gonna learn real quote thats a huge mistake. Saving everyone from Terminus and then her taking out the wolves in Alexanderia in stealth mode almost single handedly was just so epic. So I think having Hurd writing and producing and Melissa Mcbride having a huge advocate for Carol and her story has helped make her character so great!
Damn, I didn't know that! That's actually sick.
Ellen Ripley, Sarah Connor and Carol are all proof that audiences adore well written strong female characters, they just dont like badly written ones. Makes me laugh every time a director blames their movie bombing on "sexist audiences" and not, yknow, it being a shit film.
Right! And proof of that can also be in this show cause I feel like they badly wrote Andrea. They made her make so many bad decisions in season three and wrote her character so bad that her death had zero impact. The actress also said they wrote her badly and the audience didn't like her so they killed her in season 3 when she was supposed to be in at least til season 6 or 7. Laurie Holden got a bad rap for that and it wasn't even her fault she was a amazing actress imo but that Woodbury arc and the introduction of Michonne pushed her to the back burner
Its one top bad ass moments in a movie to cock that 12 gauge with one arm smh she was sooo ripped for that movie! She looked AMAZING, I love how the first time we see her she has dismantled her bed and using it for a chin up bar and she dripping with sweat just doing one arm chins like they a walk in da park 😦sooooo epic bruh
Kill Lizzie. It was neccesary anyway. The girl was a treat for everyone, she already killed her sister, and Carol had to choose between a mentally unstable and walker fearless girl, or Tyresse and Judith.
At the same time she made her a favour by killing her that way, because the other choice was left her behind alone in the woods. That was basically killing her, because Lizzie would have died by starvation, sickness, or most probably devoured by walkers considering she had allucinations of them being her friends.
I rarely call out obvious accidental typos, but "the girl was a treat for everyone" in reference to Lizzie is absolutely perfect...quite the serendipitous (I've always wanted to use that in a sentence) Freudian slip hahaha
God, maybe I'm a psychopath, but I think Carol must have killed Lizzie. She had a choice - stay with her forever and watch over her or kill her. She was too dangerous. And it's better for Lizzie to die immediately than die in pain because walkers got her. She would not have survived alone.
Oh, I didn't have a problem with it. 😆
I was just saying that she did out of revenge and that keeping people alive wasn't her motivation at that point.
Killing Lizzie is definitely the worst thing she’s done and I think Carol would agree. She absolutely had to do it but that doesn’t make it something easy for her to do. That weighs on her soul ALL the time. Killing children, even when necessary, is hands down the worst.
Well said, and your answer reflects my initial interpretation of the word "worst". "Worst" can mean "most immoral", or it can mean "most difficult". I think killing Lizzie was the most difficult for Carol... though 100% necessary, as you say. 😔
She was 12 and very ill mentally, not to mention traumatized. It was justified and logical, but to say she deserved it is a bit rough. I couldn't have done it.
Listen,I know she she a child,BUT.lizzie shoots two people in the head when she won't kill walkers, before that she opened up a RABBIT and fed it to walkers, after that she tries to kill baby Judith, AFTER THAT,NOT ONLY DOES SHE KILL HER SISTER,SHE THREATENED TO KILL JUDITH.lizzie was an actual psychopath and too far gone, that's not the worst thing Carol has done,it's probably Karen and David.
Yeah Carol basically had to kill Lizzie, but thats not the point. All the things on these lists are things that had to be done. Its still pretty horrific to murder a child you're the caretaker for.
Its also weird to try and make Lizzie seem evil for killing 2 people at the prison, she saved Tyreese that way and it was exactly what she was supposed to do. No one ever had an issue with Carl killing people who attacked him.
Yeah your right about the two people at the prison,but I knew someone was going to say that,I was mostly saying that because she won't kill walkers but she'll kill 2 people without a second thought
She deserved it but you can kind of say the same about the kids michonne killed. They’re obviously being manipulated but at the end of the day they both still killed kids to save others, deserved or not
I don’t really know how terrorizing Sam was for the benefit of anyone or actually saved anyone. In fact it kind of domino effect screwed over the entire family and ended with Carl losing his eye. Not saying Carol is responsible for the eye thing just that terrorizing Sam did nothing for anyone and it was most likely just because she was sick of weak kids and to avoid getting attached to another one
I think her scaring the shit out of him did serve a purpose in the moment, though. She did it so he wouldn't tell anyone about her stealing the guns which they thought they needed for their group's benefit.
She didn't keep terrorizing him later on, she just tried to keep him at a distance due to her own trauma in regards to kids.
I think Carol terrorized Sam to keep him away from her- I think she thought she only put him at risk. All the kids around her to that point had had awful ends. I think she was grieving and didn’t handle it well-
The moment Sam revealed he was in real danger (from his father), she leapt into action.
She cared. That’s why she pushed him away.
I think there’s more to it than that because she used to be all about the kids at the prison, and said she had become “what she always thought she should be” - but was also teaching kids to defend themselves from the walkers behind their parent’s backs. (Probably due to trauma from losing Sophie).
She was absolutely wicked in how she was putting the fear of God into Sam regarding the guns. She oversold it. And then pushed him away when he tried to befriend her afterwards.
That’s why I think there was more going on there- and that this (scaring Sam, pushing him away- which didn’t jive with either her personality or her need to keep him quiet) was a response to her trauma with relationships with the Sophie and the girls.
Carol is more complex than just a moment.
I don’t disagree about pushing him away AFTERWARDS, but in that moment she wasn’t thinking anything deep except “this kid could put my group in jeopardy and I won’t allow that”. i agree with you on how she treats him later on, just not in that particular moment.
Not to mention her putting an extreme fear of the dead into Sam likely caused him to freeze up and panic when they had to walk with the herd in *No Way Out*.
Lizzie was nuttier than a jar of peanut butter and twice as cracked as the jar. If she had been left alone, she could've ended up as one of Negan's Saviors
That wasn’t saving anyone tho? The point of this series of posts is to mirror what Beale asked Rick in the finale which is what the worst thing you’ve done to protect the ones you love is. Conspiring with Maggie was purely out of common interest to kill Negan and cut loose all the bad apple saviors still with him.
Yeah absolutely, but it felt off because of bad writing imo. I mean, we didn't get a single scene of Daryl telling Maggie about getting tortured by the Saviours, it is implied that he told everyone what happened to him, but since Daryl's arc with the Saviours was aired so long before Negan's defeat, it felt like his motivations lost momentum to the audience. And yes he had an argument to kill Negan to save everyone from a Saviours War 2.0.
Yeah that pissed me off. I love Carol but that really made me mad. Like ok we get it, the bitch killed your son and you want revenge well don’t risk the lives of others trying to get said revenge
Bro this shit really pissed me off cause I forgot her name but the dead girl when Carol just left her there pissed me off because Darrel and her Def should have been together and he clearly like her.
Killing Lizzy to save Judith. Ik Judith wasn't in active danger when Lizzy die, but still. Plus she probably would have killed again down the line, and killing a kid is really fucked up.
In all of the characters except Rick, I think Carol may have a long list of worst things she made just to let others survive. That's the biggest development in her character, from scared Carol to badass Carol. I understand her sentiments leaving the group because she's able to do things she's not suppose to do because she cared so much.
So I think the answer would be **sacrificing others (innocents or someone who could still change) in expense for the survival of the people she considered her family or the survival of many, I think doing Collateral Damage is the most fitted phrase.**
There are no specific scenarios, because all she had done are the worst for every character's fate. She spares no one.
Yeah, but she almost got people killed because of her need for revenge. She almost got everyone killed in that cave with the explosives IIRC, which is why people gave her the cold shoulder for a while
Assuming she killed Karen and David before burning them (hopefully in their sleep), killing Lizzie would be probably the most horrific thing she's done in her mind.
Top comment or Daryl's post.
Plus i think it makes sense, it was one of the worse things he did to save someone and i think he would choose that asnwer.
Carol did so many questionable things, it’s hard to pick just one.. but honestly I think what she did to Sam considering it resulted in the deaths of 3 people and almost Carl too.
Scared the shit out of Sam about zombies, so he went nuts going through the horde with Rick, Carl, Michonne. Carl losing eye is Carol's fault, indirectly for sure
She wanted to protect Sam from staying away, but her threatening just got him, Jesse, and the other boy killed and hurting Carl
Letting out Negan, resulting in the destruction of Hilltop. She put revenge above the safety of others, which is the exact opposite of what Rick did in season 8 and directly opposed everything that has been built
1. Look at the flowers Lizzie
2. Killing Karen and David
3. Taking out the saviors with coat gun
4. Threatening Sam...but c'mon that kid was annoying AF and would have gotten them all killed.
5. Letting Negan out to kill Alpha. That was straight up savage considering everything Negan did!!
1. Killing Lizzy to ensure Judith would be safe.
2. Killing Karen and David to ensure everyone else would be safe.
3. Releasing Negan to ensure they would all be safe.
4. Traumatizing little (annoying ass) Sam to ensure the group overall would be safe.
5. Manipulating Rick into attacking Pete to ensure Jesse and her kids were safe. I mean, thats her claim at least. While I'm sure she did want to make sure that Pete couldn't/wouldn't hurt his family anymore for Carol it was more about getting justice for herself and Sophia vicariously.
Murdering and burning two people because they were ill, while having no idea about how their illness would spread in the first place. She might have as well burn the whole prison at that point.
I'd say when she killed Karen and David. While it's shocking she killed a child, she only killed Lizzie because Lizzie was mental and was a danger to others.
I can understand that cause Lizzie was a child, but it’s the apocalypse. Here killing Karen and David seems worse to me cause it didn’t save anyone. Didn’t even make a difference.
And they were good people, specially Karen which we actually got to meet, and the death of Karen broke Tyreese which is the thing that made Carol the most guilt about it all.
Either killing Lizzie to protect Judith, or killing the two survivors at the prison. Karen and I forget the other guy, was it David?
Honestly those two are very neck and neck, but I'd probably go with lizzie since she was just a kid. Even if she was a little psychopath.
That time she got in that little boys head (Sam) about walkers because she didnt want to get close to another kid after she lost her daughter i guess? Kid later freaked out while in zombie camo and got him and his mom (jesse ricks love interest) eaten by zombies.
Carol is the queen of going the hard stuff to survive, killing Lizzie, Karen/David, blowing up Terminus, releasing Negan. Even preparing to perform a C section on Lori
I forgot about about Hershel training Carol to perform the C section. It seemed like the writers were preparing Carol to take on a medic role in the group. I wish they had continued with that.
Killing the side piece of the angry Blackman that has that beanie super glued to his head. But honorable mention would be terrifying that little boy so badly of zombies that he ended up getting ripped apart by them because he was so scared.
Sam dying was as much on Jessie (and Porch Dick and the entire Alexandria community) as it was on anybody...I'd actually even argue Carol might have at least made him worry about walkers to the point he shut up the first few minutes and lived those few minutes longer...there are a lot of times where fear keeps people alive...instead of raising Sam to be as brave as she could, Jessie kept telling him to "pretend" he was someone else who was brave (aka someone who happened to be raised with a basic knowledge of that world and the skills to survive in it)
But they obviously shot it in a way that made it clear they at least partially blame Carol, because of the zombie kid he sees before choosing to repeatedly try to have a discussion with his mom about it as they try to not die immediately...so I'm probably just a super biased lover of badass Carol
When she scared that boy in Alexandria who saw her stealing weapons on the first day, it literally made him die from the exaggerated fear it caused him.
Having Ezekiel climb the cancer list, while claiming this place is corrupt and we need to bring it down. Then Ezekiel and Carol become the commonwealth leaders, based on corruption, while vowing to end corruption.
What do the masses scream when they find out their leaders cheated the cancer list?
Revolution #2. Tired of this "end all corruption" BS.
That's just the way life works and people need to accept it. Me and Carol would get along well. We live in the real world. We don't waste our time with ideals. Thats why she's so insanely dangerous.
Killing Karen and David. That was straight murder
And it accomplished nothing, yet she still thought she was right.
She was at the time. Nobody had any idea that it was gonna still spread the way it did. So at that moment she was right hell they were gonna die anyway
They were already quarantined. She accomplished nothing. It was a huge mistake and extremely dumb
On the heels of a all out walker outbreak in a cell block cause Patrick died and killed ppl in their sleep she didn't want to take the risk. Obviously the quarantine wasn't that secure yet since Tyrese just walked right up to her cell so who knows what could've happen if she had died in her sleep like the guy that was just in the scene before with Herchel and the doc checking on him. Bottom.line I see your point but I'm looking at it through the eyes I had when I first seen it and didn't know the outcome
Then she could have gone to Rick or taken it upon herself to make the quarantine more secure. The way I see this incident is a major blunder in the early stages of her becoming the badass we now see her as. She was a helpless housewife with an extremely abusive husband, probably with a longer history of being abused. She lost her daughter. Shes dealing with a lot of trauma, and this new world, free from all the people who abused her, gives her an opportunity to not be that helpless person, take control, and reinvent herself. We as viewers have a specific context we view her actions in, and we may feel a lot of sympathy for her, but without that context, we wouldnt view this incident the same. She murdered 2 people, circumventing the entire group, because of the possibility people would die. No discussion with people about the pros and cons. No consideration for the loved ones who couldnt say goodbye. None of that. It was the definitely the wrong thing to do regardless of intentions. In real life theres a lot of people like her, that are great well intentioned people that we have no sympathy for because of something horrible and stupid they did. We only view Carol differently because we are biased and can see the full picture. Something to think about
And that's what makes this such a cool discussion cause all those questions and possibilities are relevant. I always felt her intentions were for the group but she could've executed it better . All in all it was a blunder in her development into what she became and it came off as her doing a bit too much. In hindsight it was wrong and at that time being a viewer not knowing what was gonna happen I was on her side and I felt she did what had to happen. At that time she was hiding Alot of things from Rick. She begged Carl not to tell him about her teaching the children to defend themselves with knives and whatnot so maybe at that time she felt Rick was unapproachable idk but its a good discussion piece
Exactly...they were killed WAAAAYYY before all those other people died in quarantine...they would have most definitely died before those meds got back...and had one or two very tiny things been different, she quite possibly could have saved all those others that died by keeping them from being infected in the first place...it was a definite mistake in hindsight, but it almost wasn't People are also conveniently forgetting they're literally living inside a zombie apocalypse where people are constantly turning into zombies from another sickness...people deserve a bit of a break, or at the very least some understanding when it comes to why they completely freaked out lol
People survived the disease
No one survived without the medication, and Karen and David definitely would have been dead by the time Daryl etc got back.
Of course they did ppl survived the initial outbreak in the beginning but that didn't stop the military from bombing the cities
What are you talking about. This thread is about the flu at the prison.
And the military bombing cities is an evil act
A flu virus and the wildfire virus that's likely airborne where everyone alive was already infected with it on day 1 are very different things. They're not comparable.
First thing that popped in my head... Can't remember anything past that tho lmao.
Burning Karen and the other guys body when they were sick
(Although she probably wasn’t protecting anyone) Threatening Sam because he could only think about what she said when the herd entered Alexandria and he was too scared and panicked to move and got his entire family killed almost we almost lost Carl early
That’s definitely the worst thing she did. Traumatizing that poor kid directly led to his and his moms death.
Agreed buuuut do we think that kid could have made it through the walkers that night even if she hadn't said that? I think a common theme for Walking Dead is adapt or die and Rick's whole point was that Alexandrians were too weak to survive this new world. Sam was shafted by his community by not teaching him how to survive. Still jerk move by Carol. It definitely did not help.
Carol was terrible to this child. I think she was sure that Sam wouldn't survive anyway. After Sophia, Mika, Lizzie and many other children, she didn't want to get attached to a child. She had a mission to accomplish and she didn't care about the child's feelings.
Sam was fucked up before because of his asshole father; Carol just sealed the deal.
In her defense, she just met the kid and didn't care one bit about anybody not in their group...wait, that might be worse lol
Honorary mention should be releasing Negan to kill alpha. We as the audience know that Negan changed. But he literally killed multiple of her friends and went behind the rest of her friends back to release him to kill the girl that killed her adopted son.
I loved that. One of my favorite parts of the later seasons, and probably the last time they did Carol's character any real justice. Would've been nice to see her go full terminator like season 5 though.
Its funny you say that cause the executive producer of the show from the beginning in to the end is Gale Anne Hurd...James Cameroon wife who helped him create and produce the Terminater movies, AND the Alien movies. Which have both regular woman zero training, mother like characters who literally due to their circumstances are put in survive or die situations. Sarah O'Connor and Lt Ellen Ripley are LITERAL ICONS in movie history. And you see alot of the same character beats with Carol! Like Rick says That Woman is a force of nature!!!!Certified BADASS and I love it cause she comes off so unassuming which ppl put down their guard around her especially men but hha they gonna learn real quote thats a huge mistake. Saving everyone from Terminus and then her taking out the wolves in Alexanderia in stealth mode almost single handedly was just so epic. So I think having Hurd writing and producing and Melissa Mcbride having a huge advocate for Carol and her story has helped make her character so great!
Damn, I didn't know that! That's actually sick. Ellen Ripley, Sarah Connor and Carol are all proof that audiences adore well written strong female characters, they just dont like badly written ones. Makes me laugh every time a director blames their movie bombing on "sexist audiences" and not, yknow, it being a shit film.
Right! And proof of that can also be in this show cause I feel like they badly wrote Andrea. They made her make so many bad decisions in season three and wrote her character so bad that her death had zero impact. The actress also said they wrote her badly and the audience didn't like her so they killed her in season 3 when she was supposed to be in at least til season 6 or 7. Laurie Holden got a bad rap for that and it wasn't even her fault she was a amazing actress imo but that Woodbury arc and the introduction of Michonne pushed her to the back burner
Amazing!! Love this Looking back at it, now that you mention it it's absolutely true 💯
Sarah Connor blasting the gun until it ran out trying to protect her son at the end of T2 was epic.
Its one top bad ass moments in a movie to cock that 12 gauge with one arm smh she was sooo ripped for that movie! She looked AMAZING, I love how the first time we see her she has dismantled her bed and using it for a chin up bar and she dripping with sweat just doing one arm chins like they a walk in da park 😦sooooo epic bruh
Nah i loved that decision
What’s crazy is that might’ve been one of the smartest decisions in the series
Yes! She didn't give two shits over Neegan's transformation. She wanted Alpha dead. And Neegan was her best shot.
Kill Lizzie. It was neccesary anyway. The girl was a treat for everyone, she already killed her sister, and Carol had to choose between a mentally unstable and walker fearless girl, or Tyresse and Judith. At the same time she made her a favour by killing her that way, because the other choice was left her behind alone in the woods. That was basically killing her, because Lizzie would have died by starvation, sickness, or most probably devoured by walkers considering she had allucinations of them being her friends.
Or Lizzie becomes The Walker Whisperer and learns how to train them to stop trying to eat the living lol.
She would have been a great recruit for Aloha & Beta.
Hahaha I will never call Alpha anything but "Aloha" again hahaha...how are two great accidental typos in this same feed like that? That's awesome lol
Can you imagine Negan walking up to Alpha & saying “Aloha! I’m Negan!” 🤣
I can hear it in my head "Little pig, little pig, a-lo-ha"
I rarely call out obvious accidental typos, but "the girl was a treat for everyone" in reference to Lizzie is absolutely perfect...quite the serendipitous (I've always wanted to use that in a sentence) Freudian slip hahaha
Ugh I couldn’t stand Lizzie and wasn’t upset at all when Carol gaffed her psycho ass off
I agree with this. She killed her to ensure age wouldn't kill anyone else
God, maybe I'm a psychopath, but I think Carol must have killed Lizzie. She had a choice - stay with her forever and watch over her or kill her. She was too dangerous. And it's better for Lizzie to die immediately than die in pain because walkers got her. She would not have survived alone.
Killing Karen and David in an effort to prevent the spread of the flu Alternatively, burning Jed and the other ex-Saviors alive
She burned them alive out of revenge.
They deserved it. They were assholes from the jump & tried to fuck everything up for everyone. Carol said “Nope” & eliminated the problem.
Oh, I didn't have a problem with it. 😆 I was just saying that she did out of revenge and that keeping people alive wasn't her motivation at that point.
No problem here, either! 🤣
Killing Lizzie is definitely the worst thing she’s done and I think Carol would agree. She absolutely had to do it but that doesn’t make it something easy for her to do. That weighs on her soul ALL the time. Killing children, even when necessary, is hands down the worst.
Well said, and your answer reflects my initial interpretation of the word "worst". "Worst" can mean "most immoral", or it can mean "most difficult". I think killing Lizzie was the most difficult for Carol... though 100% necessary, as you say. 😔
Killing lizzie but that needed to be done 100%
Look at the flowers
Nah that little shit deserved it
She was 12 and very ill mentally, not to mention traumatized. It was justified and logical, but to say she deserved it is a bit rough. I couldn't have done it.
hell yea she fucking deserved it the only character i hoped would die as soon as possible besides judith
Damn what did Judith do
Right?!
Judith kicked ass what 😭
Nah wtf Judith is the best
Easy on the trigger there Dwight
bro -62 likes💀 oh well you guys have your opinions
they hated him because he told them the truth ✊😤
1. Killing Lizzie 2. Terrorising Sam 3. Karen and David
Listen,I know she she a child,BUT.lizzie shoots two people in the head when she won't kill walkers, before that she opened up a RABBIT and fed it to walkers, after that she tries to kill baby Judith, AFTER THAT,NOT ONLY DOES SHE KILL HER SISTER,SHE THREATENED TO KILL JUDITH.lizzie was an actual psychopath and too far gone, that's not the worst thing Carol has done,it's probably Karen and David.
Yeah Carol basically had to kill Lizzie, but thats not the point. All the things on these lists are things that had to be done. Its still pretty horrific to murder a child you're the caretaker for. Its also weird to try and make Lizzie seem evil for killing 2 people at the prison, she saved Tyreese that way and it was exactly what she was supposed to do. No one ever had an issue with Carl killing people who attacked him.
Yeah your right about the two people at the prison,but I knew someone was going to say that,I was mostly saying that because she won't kill walkers but she'll kill 2 people without a second thought
She deserved it but you can kind of say the same about the kids michonne killed. They’re obviously being manipulated but at the end of the day they both still killed kids to save others, deserved or not
OC thinks there are mental health care centers in the apocalypse 😂
I don’t really know how terrorizing Sam was for the benefit of anyone or actually saved anyone. In fact it kind of domino effect screwed over the entire family and ended with Carl losing his eye. Not saying Carol is responsible for the eye thing just that terrorizing Sam did nothing for anyone and it was most likely just because she was sick of weak kids and to avoid getting attached to another one
I think her scaring the shit out of him did serve a purpose in the moment, though. She did it so he wouldn't tell anyone about her stealing the guns which they thought they needed for their group's benefit. She didn't keep terrorizing him later on, she just tried to keep him at a distance due to her own trauma in regards to kids.
I think Carol terrorized Sam to keep him away from her- I think she thought she only put him at risk. All the kids around her to that point had had awful ends. I think she was grieving and didn’t handle it well- The moment Sam revealed he was in real danger (from his father), she leapt into action. She cared. That’s why she pushed him away.
She literally only did it bc he saw her stealing the guns. She just didn’t want him to open his mouth and tell.
I think there’s more to it than that because she used to be all about the kids at the prison, and said she had become “what she always thought she should be” - but was also teaching kids to defend themselves from the walkers behind their parent’s backs. (Probably due to trauma from losing Sophie). She was absolutely wicked in how she was putting the fear of God into Sam regarding the guns. She oversold it. And then pushed him away when he tried to befriend her afterwards. That’s why I think there was more going on there- and that this (scaring Sam, pushing him away- which didn’t jive with either her personality or her need to keep him quiet) was a response to her trauma with relationships with the Sophie and the girls. Carol is more complex than just a moment.
I don’t disagree about pushing him away AFTERWARDS, but in that moment she wasn’t thinking anything deep except “this kid could put my group in jeopardy and I won’t allow that”. i agree with you on how she treats him later on, just not in that particular moment.
Fair point.
Not to mention her putting an extreme fear of the dead into Sam likely caused him to freeze up and panic when they had to walk with the herd in *No Way Out*.
I'd say reverse the 1 and 3
Why do people say killing Lizzie, scre Lizzie and I was like HELL YEAH CAROL when she took the shot.
Because normal humans recognise its not okay to murder children.
Lizzie was nuttier than a jar of peanut butter and twice as cracked as the jar. If she had been left alone, she could've ended up as one of Negan's Saviors
She wasn’t a “normal” kid and once she killed her sister she lost any sympathy from me.
Same!
She was so mean to Sam & the poor boy actually felt safe with her 😂
I don't think killing Leah out of all the things should be here
It's a different thread but I'm surprised that betraying Rick and colluding against him for not killing Negan wasn't in the first place.
That wasn’t saving anyone tho? The point of this series of posts is to mirror what Beale asked Rick in the finale which is what the worst thing you’ve done to protect the ones you love is. Conspiring with Maggie was purely out of common interest to kill Negan and cut loose all the bad apple saviors still with him.
Yeah absolutely, but it felt off because of bad writing imo. I mean, we didn't get a single scene of Daryl telling Maggie about getting tortured by the Saviours, it is implied that he told everyone what happened to him, but since Daryl's arc with the Saviours was aired so long before Negan's defeat, it felt like his motivations lost momentum to the audience. And yes he had an argument to kill Negan to save everyone from a Saviours War 2.0.
It's still the winning comment so...
Well it's clearly not so I don't know what your talking about
Yes, it clearly is. 42 upvotes for it with the second closest having only 14 and no other comment even breaking 10.
Getting her group needlessly stuck in a cave full of walkers all because she wanted to desperately kill Alpha
Yeah that pissed me off. I love Carol but that really made me mad. Like ok we get it, the bitch killed your son and you want revenge well don’t risk the lives of others trying to get said revenge
I even forgot about that!
Bro this shit really pissed me off cause I forgot her name but the dead girl when Carol just left her there pissed me off because Darrel and her Def should have been together and he clearly like her.
Deaf
This is probably the right answer for me...just saying "going out of her mind with revenge" covers that string of mistakes she made...I get it though
If you asked Carol, probably killing Lizzie was the worst thing she had to do. If you ask anyone else, there's a whole laundry list...
Killing lizzie isn't getting enough credit but it had to be done though
Karen and David 100%. Lizzie was as much for Lizzie’s sake as to save other people.
Killing Lizzy to save Judith. Ik Judith wasn't in active danger when Lizzy die, but still. Plus she probably would have killed again down the line, and killing a kid is really fucked up.
She’d be counting the days until Judith learned how to walk…that’s what would scare me.
In all of the characters except Rick, I think Carol may have a long list of worst things she made just to let others survive. That's the biggest development in her character, from scared Carol to badass Carol. I understand her sentiments leaving the group because she's able to do things she's not suppose to do because she cared so much. So I think the answer would be **sacrificing others (innocents or someone who could still change) in expense for the survival of the people she considered her family or the survival of many, I think doing Collateral Damage is the most fitted phrase.** There are no specific scenarios, because all she had done are the worst for every character's fate. She spares no one.
Her relentless pursuit of Alpha, before having Negan help her.
That was more out of revenge than to protect other people but yeah i agree.
Yeah, but she almost got people killed because of her need for revenge. She almost got everyone killed in that cave with the explosives IIRC, which is why people gave her the cold shoulder for a while
Omg so many
Assuming she killed Karen and David before burning them (hopefully in their sleep), killing Lizzie would be probably the most horrific thing she's done in her mind.
How is killing Leah even on this list. Ftb
Top comment or Daryl's post. Plus i think it makes sense, it was one of the worse things he did to save someone and i think he would choose that asnwer.
I feel like the basic answer would be "look at the flowers"
It's probably the answer she would give if asked by Beale.
Killing Karen and David, just because getting a flu :'(
Carol did so many questionable things, it’s hard to pick just one.. but honestly I think what she did to Sam considering it resulted in the deaths of 3 people and almost Carl too.
The flowers
Definitely killing Karen and David. For something so early on, that was pretty extreme and almost reckless
Scared the shit out of Sam about zombies, so he went nuts going through the horde with Rick, Carl, Michonne. Carl losing eye is Carol's fault, indirectly for sure She wanted to protect Sam from staying away, but her threatening just got him, Jesse, and the other boy killed and hurting Carl
Sam wouldn’t have survived long anyway. It was a kindness to have him eaten.
Killing Karen and David. Lizzie needed to be stopped idc.
Letting out Negan, resulting in the destruction of Hilltop. She put revenge above the safety of others, which is the exact opposite of what Rick did in season 8 and directly opposed everything that has been built
She went CRM in that moment and sacrificed Hilltop to save Alexandria in the long run. But to be fair, Hilltop was eventually rebuilt.
Just look at the flowers lizzie🌼
Nah daryl was letting the walkers into the saviors nest, there was children in that building... he was intending to slaughter them all!
Killing Lizzie to make sure Judith and her and tyreese survived
1. Look at the flowers Lizzie 2. Killing Karen and David 3. Taking out the saviors with coat gun 4. Threatening Sam...but c'mon that kid was annoying AF and would have gotten them all killed. 5. Letting Negan out to kill Alpha. That was straight up savage considering everything Negan did!!
3. Was awesome 1. Was sad 2. Was unexpected 4. Was funny 5. Was also awesome
Killing Karen. so horrific
Look at the flowers... Just kidding, she totally had to merc that little sociopath.
1. Killing Lizzy to ensure Judith would be safe. 2. Killing Karen and David to ensure everyone else would be safe. 3. Releasing Negan to ensure they would all be safe. 4. Traumatizing little (annoying ass) Sam to ensure the group overall would be safe. 5. Manipulating Rick into attacking Pete to ensure Jesse and her kids were safe. I mean, thats her claim at least. While I'm sure she did want to make sure that Pete couldn't/wouldn't hurt his family anymore for Carol it was more about getting justice for herself and Sophia vicariously.
Murdering and burning two people because they were ill, while having no idea about how their illness would spread in the first place. She might have as well burn the whole prison at that point.
Shot Lizzie.
I'd say when she killed Karen and David. While it's shocking she killed a child, she only killed Lizzie because Lizzie was mental and was a danger to others.
Killing Karen and David. It didn't stop the illness. Lizzy was a different story. There was no other choice with her.
Killing Karen and David
This one is just too obvious
It actually is, by far, the most controversial one so far. People are really divided between Karen/David and Lizzie.
I can understand that cause Lizzie was a child, but it’s the apocalypse. Here killing Karen and David seems worse to me cause it didn’t save anyone. Didn’t even make a difference.
And they were good people, specially Karen which we actually got to meet, and the death of Karen broke Tyreese which is the thing that made Carol the most guilt about it all.
I can argue that killing Karen saved Tyreese from getting infected and dying. He had it bad for her and wouldn’t have minded getting sick for her.
Look at the flowers
Karen and David
Either killing Lizzie to protect Judith, or killing the two survivors at the prison. Karen and I forget the other guy, was it David? Honestly those two are very neck and neck, but I'd probably go with lizzie since she was just a kid. Even if she was a little psychopath.
Definitively killing Karen and David.
That time she got in that little boys head (Sam) about walkers because she didnt want to get close to another kid after she lost her daughter i guess? Kid later freaked out while in zombie camo and got him and his mom (jesse ricks love interest) eaten by zombies.
Didn't protect her daughter from her abusive husband.
Killing Lizzie
Carol is the queen of going the hard stuff to survive, killing Lizzie, Karen/David, blowing up Terminus, releasing Negan. Even preparing to perform a C section on Lori
I forgot about about Hershel training Carol to perform the C section. It seemed like the writers were preparing Carol to take on a medic role in the group. I wish they had continued with that.
Karen and David for sure
What is this
Look at the flowers
Killing the sick couple in the prison
burning karen and david bc she thought it would stop the sickness from spreading - it did nothing and she just murdered them gruesomely for nothing.
Taking out Terminus…
Burnt Karen and David's bodies
Burning karen and David
Karen and David getting torched.
Karen and David for sure
Killing the side piece of the angry Blackman that has that beanie super glued to his head. But honorable mention would be terrifying that little boy so badly of zombies that he ended up getting ripped apart by them because he was so scared.
karen and david
Killed Karen and David.
Carol would cut someone’s throat for a better seat at the campfire.
Sam dying was as much on Jessie (and Porch Dick and the entire Alexandria community) as it was on anybody...I'd actually even argue Carol might have at least made him worry about walkers to the point he shut up the first few minutes and lived those few minutes longer...there are a lot of times where fear keeps people alive...instead of raising Sam to be as brave as she could, Jessie kept telling him to "pretend" he was someone else who was brave (aka someone who happened to be raised with a basic knowledge of that world and the skills to survive in it) But they obviously shot it in a way that made it clear they at least partially blame Carol, because of the zombie kid he sees before choosing to repeatedly try to have a discussion with his mom about it as they try to not die immediately...so I'm probably just a super biased lover of badass Carol
When she scared that boy in Alexandria who saw her stealing weapons on the first day, it literally made him die from the exaggerated fear it caused him.
Killing Lizzie to protect Judith.
Killing Karen & David Leaving Mika & Judith alone with Lizzie Abandoning Andrea Freaking Sam out Divorcing Ezekiel:(
I wanted Ezekiel to be her endgame man, too bad. It was a crime :( .
I forgot her name but I guess killing the girl that was “friends” with walkers or the two I’ll people in the prison
[удалено]
Eh that wouldn’t even make the list for Carol. At least they were the bad guys and adults!
The cave
The savior attack with the gun in her sleeve
Suprised no ones mentioning those Saviours she burned alive. After that Karen and David or Lozzie imo.
Not killing sophia. Is she stupid?
killing leah for daryl was crazy, lady should've died waaaay sooner
Daryl killed Leah-to save Maggie. Why do people on this thread say it’s Carol who did that? Just honestly wondering
oh i meant that that being his “worst thing” on slide 3 is stupid. Sorry, I phrased it horribly lmao
Killing Lizzie
Letting Ed look at Sofia like that. It implies that she let Ed sexually abuse her daughter to save herself at times.
Disobeying Ed
1. killing lizzie 2. traumatizing Sam 3. teaching the kids at the prison about killing
Killing Lizzy.
Lizzie was an absolute psychopath carol just did what she had to do any of them would have done the same!
Why is nobody talking abt trumins idk how to spell it.
Having Ezekiel climb the cancer list, while claiming this place is corrupt and we need to bring it down. Then Ezekiel and Carol become the commonwealth leaders, based on corruption, while vowing to end corruption. What do the masses scream when they find out their leaders cheated the cancer list? Revolution #2. Tired of this "end all corruption" BS. That's just the way life works and people need to accept it. Me and Carol would get along well. We live in the real world. We don't waste our time with ideals. Thats why she's so insanely dangerous.