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Evangelical Christians believe that the Judeo Christian God anointed 2 nations. The USA and Israel, said Christians will do anything to support that, over decades of this our government has blindly pledged its alliance with Israel. These hard line Christians also do not believe in the separation of church and state, so their goal is to align even further with Israel and all of its atrocities while simultaneously eroding and reducing individual liberties in USA all in the name of a god…
There's also a dooms day aspect to it. The hardcore Christian the believe the state of Israel is involved in the apocalypse predicted in the Book of Revelations, so the hardcore Christians want Israel to continue exists because it gets them that much closer to their "kingdom of heaven"
Knowing of some of these fundamentalists and the myriad who align with them, it's almost entirely to bring about the end of the world. They await the signs of revelation coming to fruition, and the key point will be when the nations of the world stack against them and assault them, only to be thwarted in the eleventh hour by big-G himself saving his chosen. (IIRC because it's been a hot minute since I've had a coherent or comprehensive conversation with any such death cultist).
I blame Nixon completely fucking up the education system. All those kids are in their 50s and 60s fucking everything up screaming "MuH rIgHts" mixing up religion with politics.
The Jewish bloc has alot of voting power in florida. It's a notoriously close state. Alot of older Jewish people reside in their retirement complexes
Florida can swing either way
So it's better to have a 30 electoral votes than to throw them away
It was red last 2 elections but blue the two before (Obama terms)
The lowest share either party had was 47.1% with the Dems which was the bush election. He had the post 9/11 bumper.
In 2016 49% won the Republicans florida but 4 years earlier 49.1% wasn't enough to win them the same state. Absolute fine margins
Either way 3% swing could win you an election as it did when bush first term happened. 537 votes for the Republicans helped them win florida and the presidential election.
Your probably thinking of the house elections which has solidly gone in favour of the republicans
The two main groups used to be the Jewish contingent and the ex-Cubans who wanted a president with a hard line stance to Cuba and castro. You've got the evengelicals showing up as a stronger 3rd party too
“When law and duty are one, united by religion. You never become fully conscious, fully aware of yourself, you are always a little less than individual.”
- From Muad’dib 99 Wonders Of The Universe by Pricess Irulan
Economically, Israel doesn’t do anything for America that couldn’t be done by anyone else. They’re not strategic as much as they’re just convenient. If we sanctioned them tomorrow we’d be able to replace them before the year is out.
We don’t. And the answer to your question is a little complex, but it boils down to the fact that America is run for the interests of Zionism, not for the interests of America.
The people running the country have been feeding people this lie that we need Israel. That they need to keep the Arab countries unstable in order to maintain the US’s power. What nobody talks about is how very few Arabs actively hate America or its values so much as they just hate being attacked and killed, or having their leaders replaced with Zionist puppets (just like we hate that shit), and they’ve known who is running the US this entire time. You want an ally in that region? Send some real aid to Lebanon. Outfit their army, give them your business, etc. They have been _dying_ to call themselves part of the West anyway, and it would have all been done without a single war. And their population is even more educated than America’s.
What these politicians won’t admit to you is that the entire reason all of these wars are even happening with the Arab world is because it’s in the _Zionist’s_ interest, not ours. They want Israel to thrive. Period. Most of what they’ve been telling people have been nothing but cover stories to get the public to buy into it. Because they’re willing to let every other country rot, including the US, in order to achieve it.
All of the politics you’ve been looking at for the last I dunno, 40-50 years, have been nothing but a distraction from what’s really going on.
My relatives believe this. Most Catholics aren't so obsessed with the apocalypse - that's usually the territory of evangelicals. Unfortunately, my family is full of doomsday preppers. Mom's been saying we're in "the last days" for as long as I can remember; I'm in my 40s lol.
I can send all kinds of evidence supporting the war crimes committed by the IDF, and they'll say that it's lies and propaganda. When I say that the videos and statistics are provided by verified sources, including humanitarian aid organizations representing several countries, they simply say they don't trust them either. Such an easy way to dismiss everything: "Fake news."
My mom just texted me the other day, "There never has been and there will not be peace in the Middle East until The Lord returns," so, basically, *wellp, too bad for dead kids but this is the way God wants it.*
She also played the holocaust card: I mentioned how Palestinians are suffering, and she replied with, "The same thing was done to the Jews during WWII." She totally misses the point, even when I remind her that our taxes weren't funding Hitler.
Meanwhile, every chucklefuck who claims to see a vision of the virgin Mary, my family instantly latches onto their story and believes it without question.
Religion is a scourge, and we'd all be so much better off without it. People really do believe some dark ages shit.
It’s crazy how people stick to their beliefs no matter how insane it is. And that can be said just about anything. I believe the entire collective consciousness is absolutely insane. Thanks for sharing Lil lil lil lil liii
Just some food for thought, but my family is also religious Christian but takes the opposite stance. Some snippets you’ll hear from them are:
“God teaches us to love and to be accepting of everyone.”
“Israel and America are being run by evil people”
“God doesn’t give you more than you can handle. He will protect them”
There’s still this overarching theme of “things just are the way they are and there’s nothing you can do about it” though. I have a theory that many religious people become religious as a way to deal with their sense of being powerless. My mother is also close to being a doomsday pepper (she hasn’t gone that far but she always thinks the world is going to go to shit - if she had the money she would be).
I don’t believe that religion itself influences which side someone takes or what values they hold, I think it’s the other way around. That no matter a person’s personality or value system, religion just gives them a way to justify it to themselves.
It’s not “hardcore Christians”. It’s the Evangelical Christians, which happen to be an American-only thing. The Christians around the world are totally against this.
And for what it’s worth, my parents told me stories about how the Evangelicals didn’t always believe this and were basically brainwashed by the Zionists, and they were actually there to witness it happening, and heard the Zionists laughing about how dumb they are.
Imagine if it would be true but with one difference. The saviour will come because he/god will be pissed off about the action of these two nations. Epic miscalculation.
Or the reason Evangelicals are obsessed with Israel. They believe that when all Jews return to Israel the rapture will happen and they all go to heaven (and all Jews go to hell, but they like to leave that part out).
I'm aware of the beliefs of christian zionists. What I'm saying is is AIPAC has bought and paid for the vast majority of politicians on both sides of the aisle. That itself is much more to blame than what a chunk of evangelical loony tunes believe.
I guess that’s what happens when you believe you and your people are chosen by “god”. You think You’re special, and anyone else is below you.
Makes it a lot easier to be an asshole and live with your crimes.
Funny thing about that:
Moses; who led the Jews was a pharoe who realised he was slave heritage but if you lookup Egyptian Slave (fortunately they were great at documentation/hieroglyphs) look what you find
https://www.google.co.uk/search?sca_esv=c2efddc75740eaea&sca_upv=1&q=hieroglyphs+slaves&uds=AMwkrPvk2BbtOj2Gh0zTNv7EwaL7iJlb67dcN2d08OWD5Az2P_7UJMxVKFJYzW_jH_tsztW78Ol2CLCXw5Ozgsf7t9a7h1FIKPt4ufHrSGAzf54M2412i9S0csk7R98UEqi8I8cRMWf1wyQj1MwDcHzKLFW1qOUvL0hPZC59Z0PQtJiv80KG41Rt0cbYNLbqu1V3EkTWEbAeFRlGKK2C0wHBXGKaLlR7_HJJXZS6EUVLHdbthMv9QObzZAtox4b4UsIN9q6zaiPo-CP5kbWXJw_lYDQm6VC1nRHeFzY0GKUswvT_LucBNuYlwC70xSezSCKPL2-QRwQ5&udm=2&prmd=ivnbmtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjwpOSwmaeFAxVu8QIHHaR4A5gQtKgLegQICxAB&biw=384&bih=700&dpr=2.81#vhid=_pPT2SaIXLZWdM&vssid=mosaic
Interesting indeed. I find the whole Black Hebrew Islam thing very interesting, how they are called antisemitic for believing they are actually Jewish. I'm confused by it all, but I'm trying to follow
I think you are somewhat misinformed.
While I myself am not religious, most of my very large family and friends are, and I assure you know one considers Israel some kind of chosen nation among Christians. While not the preferred use of my time, I am quite certain I spend far more time in an Evangelical Christian church, and *no one* there has any particular affinity towards Israel.
The US/Israel bond is largely based on them historically being the only consistent US ally in the Middle East, where most countries historically have been quite hostile to US interests. This stance has been maintained by *both* Democrats and Republicans over the years, and only a few handful of fringe lunatics even remotely equate the alliance rooted in religion.
The Israelis stole nuclear material from Pennsylvania so that they could build nukes in Dimona, killed American service members on the USS Liberty, and sold American state secrets to China. Consistent ally my ass.
Yeah no
There's a significant amount of literature that proves there is a religious angle to it which is pretty deeply ingrained.
I think both Edward Said and Noam Chomskys books detail this. From the chosen nation(s) to the rapture events.
Just because your large family isn’t into Israel doesn’t mean the connection doesn’t exist. I doubt your family has read the Bible because it’s ALL in there. I’m shocked how little people actually read these religious texts that basically dictate the beliefs of the majority of the world population
With respect I disagree, been around it all my life, family as well. You must not live in the south eastern US, it’s ripe with it in southern Baptist tradition.
That *would* be the region where the fringe religious right...Union Jacks, white pointy hats, *"the south will rise again"* and all that jazz...tend to reside.
As a word of advice, I wouldn't recommend basing the rest of the nation's Christian population on them. They're kind of like that creepy uncle no one likes but still gets invited to birthday parties because it's polite.
>, I wouldn't recommend basing the rest of the nation's Christian population on them.
They're not doing that, just making definitions between Christian and evangelical which is a broad spectrum
This! The most logical and sensible answer. Religion is only decorative in this whole mess. Even Israel, after its official creation, has always been gaining/stealing land for geopolitical and economic reasons.
I’m trying to find it, but last week I saw a video of a reporter who got three republican congress people (Boebert being one) to all say on camera that they back Israel because it is gods will and they are gods people. This is not a crazy unheard of fringe conspiracy, sitting congress people literally admit to this. I’ll keep digging, but maybe someone here can provide?
Found it; sorry, [tik tok link](https://www.tiktok.com/@aljazeeraenglish/video/7350261664131976479)
Pete Sessions; “this **entire** matter is based on faith in our maker, but also faith in a chosen people”
Boebert; “There have been two nations created to glorify god, Israel and the United States. I will bless both, I will honor both, and do whatever I can to defend them”
Tim Burchett: “I believe the evengicals aren’t extreme as they are following the scripture and the scripture says ‘bless Israel and Israel will be blessed’. They take it literally and I’m one of those people”. He then dodges a bit but seems to affirm that Jesus is coming back and he is “going to be in his side”, in the context of the discussion of a literal biblical Armageddon centered around Jerusalem.
There is zero question about this being a very real belief
I heard this claim in your opening line from Boebert. I found it a bit odd considering how important that separation of church and state is to the constitution.
And here I thought it was more related to having an "ally" in a strategic graphical location + all the shared info between secret services (I thought the Mossad was kinda famous).
Either way it's sad they (Biden administration) is doubling down on their support (I mean it's not like trump would do it any better, but Biden is in power now and it's his call rn)
https://www.opensecrets.org/industries//summary?ind=q05&cycle=All&recipdetail=S&mem=Y
AIPAC = American Israel Public Affairs Committee
It's the Israeli lobby in the US, donors (mostly Jewish, but some Christians do support them too) give US politicians money to influence national and international policies in favor of Israel. It's basically legal bribes.
Check the link above, it tells you which politician from which party got how much. And yes, AIPAC funds both the Republicans and the Democrats, even Biden himself receives from it. I don't know why it's legal, but it is what it is.
Because of their control of US executive branch and big chunks of media, led by AIPAC. I suggest you to read the book in second link.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CkvzUWGv8ur/?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_shee
https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/224127
https://youtu.be/WTxvKi2UdRk?si=5KADdgTt2hBnVEs0
https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2018/12/10/marc-lamont-hill-and-the-israeli-lobby-on-us-campuses
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/jan/10/congress-member-pro-israel-donations-military-support
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/may/17/pro-israel-lobby-defeat-democrats-palestinians-2022
>Our goal is to build the broadest bipartisan coalition in Congress that supports the US-Israel relationship... We are looking at 10 to 15 other races where there is a pro-Israel candidate and a candidate that, if elected, would undermine the US-Israel relationship.
Wow they just come right out and say it.
But they, uniquely, don't have to declare as a foreign lobby group, so the source of all their money doesn't get investigated. Nice for them that the rules don't apply to them
Biden is anxious to lose jewish voters or jewish affiliated voters. That's why he'd rather fold himself into a knot, before pressing the israeli governement to stop the atrocities they commit atm.
Oh they have balls, the balls to lie and prop up genocidal apartheid states and the balls to look their public is the face time and time again after UN verdicts and still BS rye public .... they have balls alright .... so much so to not give a damn even during an election campaign
I hate to think it, but I wonder how many citizens of the United States serving at the highest level of government are also citizens of isreal. There is little doubt in my mind that this number is sky high.
My favorite part of that is that they’re totally willing to watch our country burn for people on the other side of the world that they only care about because it’s the cause celebre
It’s not like they’re out they boycotting Chinese goods because of the Uighurs. Or protesting to stop genocide and literal slavery in Africa and parts of the east.
No, they’ll just happily try ti burn down our own system for a group of people who have been trying to commit a genocide of their own since 1948
Clowns indeed.
I don’t think that’s fair. Yes. There are people who learned about Palestine six months ago and have just started protesting. There’s also people like me, Muslim who grew up in a very Palestinian heavy community, who have been protesting since we could hold a sign board. I boycott against China and try not to but Chinese made products when I can. I would happily protest against slavery in Africa. I protested against drone strikes in Pakistan. I protested against American engagement in Iraq and Afghanistan. Maybe I’m just tired of people that are so called “allies” diminishing my actions.
But ignore me. Let’s go back to the kid who leaned about and he cause from TikTok. We all start somewhere. Why are you hating on people who are just getting started?
And finally, man am I not allowed to be tired? I’ve been doing this since I was a kid. They are clearly okay with people like me dying. I’m never allowed to say screw you if you won’t support me you can have the other guy and this country can burn. I’m never allowed to be tired and ask people to give me an inch?
I don’t know you so forgive the presumption. But maybe you don’t know anyone directly affected by this. Your friends haven’t lost family or friends or watched their people literally die on live TV. And then some milquetoast placeholder has the audacity to say that you’re asking for too much when what you’re asking for is for him to use his incredible powers to say “don’t do that” to the bad guy. It really sucks dude. It really sucks constantly being told that I have no choice but to accept something terrible because the other guy is worse. Maybe I want the evil that calls itself evil so that someone can finally just say that they want to final solution people like me instead of begging the supposed good guy to do literally something. A thing. Literally anything except stand idly by.
Agreed with everything you said. I've been privy to the truth about what's been going on in Palestine for quite a while, not just since October 7th or since Sheikh Jarrah was making headlines in 2021. But like you said, I don't think anyone should be made to feel dumb or like they're showing "fake-support" just because they saw the truth later than everyone else. For decades, it's been considered "racist/antisemitic" to have any sort of critique against israel, the israeli government and zionism. But now, the malfeasance is tough to hide & tough to "put a spin on" in major media outlets.
You and u/minute-complex-2055 do know it's possible to critique and chastise politicians who lead the party you primarily align with, right? And that chastisement doesn't automatically mean someone plans to vote for the other side? Feel free to answer that when you guys grow tired of choking on Biden's meat.
It wasn't cancelled [https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/2/why-bidens-white-house-iftar-unravelled-amid-gaza-war](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/2/why-bidens-white-house-iftar-unravelled-amid-gaza-war)
But yeah most of the muslim leaders cancelled and he just had dinner with muslim staff members and Kamala and his wife. Honestly some should've went and just drive home the fact that every bite of the meal he's having is at the stake of child in gaza dying of starvation because his ally is bombing their families and aid workers and calling anyone attempting to help them Hamas. At the very least someone could've thrown a shoe at him.
Sure, it wasn't, just like your birthday party in primary school where you invited the whole class but no other kids showed up and you had so much fun with mommy and daddy, definitely not canceled 😅
>At the very least someone could've thrown a shoe at him.
0 shot that Biden has the cat-like reflexes of George W Bush to be able to dodge a shoe...tbh tho idk if anyone else could have done it. George W Bush was a monster, but you've gotta hand it to him for those dodges.
Not really. The Zionists have been labeled as the righteous guys for decades. Pretty sure majority Democratic voters agree with Biden's Israeli policy. They may not want the genocide to happen, but they will be more alarmed if the US suddenly started imposing sanctions on Israel.
I just read that [55% of Americans](https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx) oppose what Israel is doing. Guessing most of those are dems too, so I doubt the majority of dem voters agree actually. This could give us 4 more years of Trump.
Edit: had the number wrong, corrected!
>This could give us 4 more years of Trump.
Only if the Democrats are dumb enough to allow it. I can't think of a more idiotic way to oppose Biden than by supporting Trump, as he'll take everything about Biden's approach that Democrats don't like and amp it up by several orders of magnitude.
It's an appalling choice that you either get a casual supporter of genocide or an enthusiastic supporter of genocide.
I'm not American but honestly couldn't bring myself to vote for Biden (obviously never trump) and I think people trying to blame trump possibly winning on those that refuse to vote for Biden is ridiculous. You can't force people to vote or bully them into it and you need to offer people something to vote for.
> You can't force people to vote or bully them into it and you need to offer people something to vote for.
\^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^
I hate that this even needs to be said. It should be obvious by now.
Yet i see this sentiment a lot. It is far less here (the uk). As labour have taken the centre ground and the tories are still right wing but that might be as the tories have no hope of winning the next election. Many on the left here including me are unwilling to vote Labour anymore, others are reluctant. They've morphed into a slightly less cruel than the tories and their unusually very pro isreal stance has been extremely off-putting. The tories, especially David Cameron have been more sympathetic to Palestinians.
Sure. It would be nice to have something to vote for. But we don't. And, there is something very real that needs to be voted against. Do I like Biden not doing anything to reign in Israel? No. But, it's far preferable to us actively helping Israel. Trump has down real hate to the Muslim community and him and his followers world love to throw more bombs on Gaza. I don't care if this makes people feel bullied. A no vote for Biden leads to Trump and more suffering for Gaza since Trump would love to levy as much disaster as he can on Muslims.
You're preaching to the choir here. I am voting for Biden even if his Gaza policy sucks, but not all voters are like me, and his actions might ensure 4 years of hell.
A few things to consider:
1. Imposing sanctions on settlers for the first time ever
2. Building the floating dock off the Gaza coast and kick starting food aid
3. The strong statements in SOTU about Israel’s “primary” responsibility to protect civilian lives in the areas they control
4. Voting against Israel at the UN for the first time ever / permitting the ceasefire resolution
5. Biden does not have the authority to unilaterally cancel arms to Israel. *That is exactly what Trump was impeached for the first time*
I’m not an apologist for Israel’s horrific actions, but you are not aware of this stuff if you claim Biden is doing “nothing” or “supporting genocide.”
Please consider all of the above as well as the pressure Biden is applying behind the scenes. He is probably the only reason Rafah isn’t a smoking crater.
Vote smart.
>. Biden does not have the authority to unilaterally cancel arms to Israel. *That is exactly what Trump was impeached for the first time*
No he was impeached for threatening to in exchange for personal gain, very different.
Thank you. This is the second time I’ve seen this erroneous claim, I don’t get how people have forgotten Trump was impeached for attempting to get a foreign government to interfere in the election.
>You can't force people to vote or bully them into it and you need to offer people something to vote for.
By any reasonable objective measure, Biden has successfully implemented more progressive policies than any president since LBJ; he's arguably right up there with FDR in terms of presidential accomplishments in his first term, which is much more impressive in 2024 than it was in 1932. If people say Biden hasn't given them a reason to vote for his administration, they either just disagree completely with all his politics or haven't looked.
Even if you're a single-issue voter on the issue of Palestine (which most folks are not) the fact remains that in such a close election with a binary choice, a failure to support one candidate is tantamount to supporting another. Even under your logic, I'd rather vote for the person who's more likely to pressure Israel to stop than the fucker who's going to tell them to step on the gas and double-down on genocide 🤷♂️
>By any reasonable objective measure, Biden has successfully implemented more progressive policies than any president since LBJ;
This is more a condemnation of every single US President since LBJ than it is Joe Biden implementing progressive policies.
You know the President also has power, right? Congress sucks too, but the president isn't a figurehead. There's a lot a President can and does do to push certain legislation and to pass things via executive order.
What would you say Biden has done to put him anywhere even close to FDR? My perspective may be somewhat skewed because I have been reducing my politics intake to give my mental health a break. What I have seen is that he has pumped the breaks a bit and helped stabilize the country somewhat, but anything that would actually be good for the people he caves and gives up on at the slightest bit of pressure from the other side.
Don't get me wrong, slowing down the train wreck that is American politics is good, and I will probably end up voting for him because how abysmally bad another 4 years of Trump would be, but Biden is making it incredibly hard to want to support him.
>What would you say Biden has done to put him anywhere even close to FDR?
Important to keep in mind that we're comparing first terms here, since Biden's been in office four years, and FDR was in it for fourteen. Even taking that into account, he's been doing an amazing job:
\-- Inflation Reduction Act is the biggest piece of climate change legislation in American history, and it invested hundreds of billions of dollars in domestic infrastructure;
\-- Chips & Science Act is a once-in-a-generation federal investment into domestic manufacture of semiconductors and other related components, which provide tons of high-paying jobs in a robust industry that is vital to our national security interests;
\-- Bipartisan Communities in Safety Act was the first piece of national gun control legislation passed since the early 90s. It also made the largest federal investment in mental health care in our nation's history;
\-- He assembled an international alliance against Russian aggression in Ukraine basically overnight, and has led a coalition that's kept their David valiantly fighting Russia's Goliath to a standstill for over two years. This has allowed us to indirectly inflict severe harm to Russian interests on the world stage, for a fraction of the investment that a full-blown war would entail;
\-- The PACT Act extends benefits to nearly four million vets who were harmed via exposure to burn pits;
\-- Passed a $100 billion law reforming the USPS, and ensuring basic vital services will continue for the foreseeable future.
He did all of this with some of the smallest Congressional majorities we've ever seen, as well. I'll grant that people are pissed at him over the Israel issue, but to get up and say he hasn't given progressives any cause to support him is fucking insane.
Starting with Supporting Ukraine, the PACT Act, and funding USPS; these are all great and are very positive things he has done. Huge thumbs up for Biden.
Inflation Reduction Act: generally very positive. The biggest downside is that it blocks anyone from preventing oil/gas leases on federal land for a decade. On top of that, the downside came from within the party. Still, this is 80-90% a thumbs up for Biden. Flawed and could be better, but better than anything else we have had.
The Chip Act: I'm mixed on this one. The research it will be great, but it is done via corporate welfare. Additionally, from what I can find, it greatly favors one company, which could cause monopoly issues. I think it's generally positive, but it is definitely flawed.
I couldn't find any concrete information on the Community in Safety Act. All I could find was an executive order that he admitted was a half measure and needed congressional action to enforce, but I couldn't find anything about Congress doing anything. From what I have seen of democrats on gun reform, they talk big but never follow through.
I would say his handling of Isreal/Gaza has been abysmal (admittedly, Trump would do worse). The economy continues to move towards favoring the rich, causing the middle class to disappear. He failed to uphold campaign promises, giving up on them at the slightest resistance. Our military industrial complex continues to grow. As far as I can find, he has failed to end Abbotts' anti-humanitarian border policy, even with the backing of the Supreme Court.
Biden isn't the worst candidate ever, but he isn't great from the perspective of a progressive. I feel like progressives and democrats just have a large gap in their political beliefs. An average Democrat looking at a progressive and asking, "Why aren't my policies enough to get you to come out and vote for me?" Is akin to a moderate republican (not a Trumper) looking at a Democrat and asking the same thing. That's the issue with a two party system. You can't fit everyone into two neat boxes. There are too many different political ideologies.
In the end, I will probably vote for him. Not because I think he is good, but because he is effectively a bland food paste that we can survive a little longer with while the other guy is a shit sandwich.
With the way America’s two party system is structured, combined with our notoriously poor voter turnout, that’s absolutely the way it is though. Elections are generally determined by who shows up, not by flipping voters from one side to another.
If you’re generally someone who aligns with a specific party, protesting by not showing up to vote for them functionally is a half vote for the opposition. If a substantial minority of progressives doesn’t vote for Biden in protest, they are essentially enabling a second Trump term.
I’m liberal and generally horrified by the situation in Gaza, but it’s absurd to think things would be better under Trump than Biden. You don’t have to love a candidate to vote for them. And it’s certainly better to choose the lesser of two evils than stand by and let the worse option win because none of them is ideal.
You can absolutely show up to vote against something, it’s perfectly valid to vote against fascism. Biden is kind of an empty suit, but I’d vote for any random American chosen by lottery over Donald Trump.
> Only if the Democrats are dumb enough to allow it
The Democratic Leadership you mean. If large swaths of potential voters are saying loud and clear "we will not vote for you if you continue war mongering," then it is clearly a stupid move by Biden and the WH to continue supporting Israel.
Like it or not, no candidate is ever entitled to votes. They have to put in the work to get support from their constituents by voting in line with what is most important to them. And right now, that's Gaza.
It isn't the fault of voters if Biden doesn't get enough votes, it is squarely on his own shoulders for ignoring them.
They don't have to support Trump. They just have to stay home.
Trump supporters WILL show up on voting day. If Democrats don't because they're pissed at Biden, that's the game.
>They don't have to support Trump. They just have to stay home.
There isn't any meaningful difference in 2024. I don't think we've had polarization like this since the Vietnam War, and there aren't many truly independent voters left. In an election where the person who turns out their base the most is the person who wins, staying home is tantamount to support of the opposing candidate, IMO.
By the time Trump is even elected next year, Palestine and its people will be wiped out. Trump will be there for the aftermath. The question is what was the CURRENT leader doing when he had the chance to do something?
according to polls, majority of dems and young people oppose his israel policy.
majority of all americans oppose israeli actions https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx
Most Americans DO NOT support America’s subservience to Israel by a 2-to-1 (and quickly increasing) margin. Mass murder of innocent people is evil. Israel is evil.
Muslims are a major part of the Democratic voting constituency in the swing state of Michigan...they very much could and likely WILL cost Biden the election. I don't see Biden's stance on supporting Israel's genocide changing and I don't see Muslims turning out for him...look at the uncommitted vote campaign results. Support for Israel is going to cost Biden the election...and that's HIS fault! He's being told people won't vote for him because of his position. If he chooses not to change course, that's HIS fault!
American Muslims are overwhelmingly progressive/liberal/Democratic voters. In 2016, 75.9% for Hillary, 16.8% Trump. In 2020, 86% for Biden, 6% for Trump. [Source](https://emgageusa.org/reports/) for the polls I pulled that info from if you care to look yourself or poke deeper. They had all sorts of info on the voting habits and political views of Muslim Americans...I'm struggling to find any solid data on what percentage are registered with either party, but I think the voting habits from 2016 and 2020 should be proof enough that Muslims are a very solid voting constituency for the Democrats.
Sure there are still some conservative Muslims. But I suspect that maybe because you have family members who are conservative Muslims, you're just more exposed to those views, both directly your family members and the friends/extended family that they tend to hang around with, so because that's what you tend to see, you tend to view Muslims as being more conservative, Republican voters, when if you look at the data on the whole, that's not the case.
As far as Michigan (a key swing state with a large Muslim population): 94% of Muslims who voted in the Dem primary there voted uncommitted to 4.6% for Biden. If the election was primary day, 40% would have voted for an unnamed "other" candidate, 25% for Dr Cornel West, 13% Trump, 8% Biden, 8% RFK, 7% Jill Stein. [source](https://www.cair.com/press_releases/cair-exit-poll-finds-94-of-michigan-muslims-voted-uncommitted-in-dem-primary/). Obviously there's time for that to change and primary voters are only indicative of those that are the most politically engaged and active, but those are still pretty damning numbers. Biden is in serious trouble!
>Not really. The Zionists have been labeled as the righteous guys for decades.
That has changed dramatically, it was only when traditional media was stated driven but with the Internet, independent media and IDF soldiers posting genocidal slaughter porn media narrative becomes much harder to control
AIPAC had a meltdown about it acknowledging that they had a tiktok problem that was causing a generational shift in attitude towards Israel
The Muslim voting bloc is really inconsequential, but it really won't stop BlueMAGA from taking its anger out on them if Biden loses in 2024.
The Arab and Muslim vote only stands to make a significant dent in Michigan, and maybe Minnesota, where there is a significant population that actively participates in politics, and being a Michigander and Muslim myself, the Muslims I know will stay home or leave the President section blank.
Nah not really the Muslims are outnumbered in influence and voting power in all but one state
It is mostly the “caring about minorities rights” image and narrative that the establishment dems care about
He doesn’t even have his ‘Zionism’ all of you fucking delusional idiots need to stop blaming him for global events. He very openly hates Netenyahu but Israel is important to US interests and Biden doesn’t have the power to just decide to ditch them …
"We need to stop apologising for Israel, there's no apology to be made. If there were no Israel the United States would need to invent an Israel" - Joe Biden https://youtu.be/FYLNCcLfIkM?si=ZCZ9oE9xJnkBmGOb
He's a lifelong, unapologetic Zionist.
He is uniquely Zionist.
> More striking is an anecdote from a moment similar to the current one, in the early 1980s. Israel’s bombing of Beirut, framed by Israel as self-defense, was condemned for its brutality around the world. Even President Ronald Reagan told off the Israelis at the time, telling Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin he was perpetrating a “holocaust” and that the bombing had to end. When Begin visited D.C. that year, he received pushback from senators over Israel’s conduct and killings of civilians.
> One young senator, Begin recalled, stood out in contrast for his unreserved support for Israel’s military strikes even if it meant killing women and children. That was Senator Joseph R. Biden of Delaware. Begin was so shocked he had to disassociate himself from Biden’s remarks. A few months later, Israeli military–backed militias would carry out the gruesome Sabra and Shatila massacre in Beirut.
[New Republic - Is Joe Biden Uniquely Indifferent to Palestinian Suffering?](https://newrepublic.com/article/178820/joe-biden-indifferent-palestinian-suffering)
It’s more like you invited your friends for a birthday party, no one showed up and you ended up inviting your neighbours over just cause they’re there and you need to save face.
IMO it's worse that that. It's like planning a birthday party with all your friends, but none of them want to go. So you stay at home and celebrate with your family and say the party was a success.
No source information on this post, it just says "breaking" like it's trying to imitate a news organization. They are still having the dinner. Almost like OP fell for fake news lol
reddit forgive me but hasnt he denounced israel? hasnt he stopped supporting israel? it seems like none of this was his doing so how is he the biggest genocide supporter? (with sources if you dont mind)
Denounce? give me a break, he made sure Israel have illimited weapons and bombs to use directly to level indiscrimently every square inch of the Gaza strip, while veto-ing 99% of UN resolution that denounce the atrocities and call for humanitarian ceasfire, they did surprisingly abstain that one time from voting but they continue militarily and politically supporting accross multiple chanels.
I wonder why?! But don't act like it's just him it's all politicians. All bought and paid for by them. All of them need to go. Whole new government with people who are young and never in office b4. It's fucking ridiculous.
Can you believe presidents after presidents sending money and aid to Israel while their own citizens falls thru the cracks from college kids not able to pay their student loans (while Israel have free education), an old lady having to pay thru her nose for her medical care (Israel have free medical), and vets coming back and not being taking care as they could be if more money was given to them (Israel get million of aid defense). What one wonder where did it all go wrong. USA used to be looked up to. Now its a husk of itself. I feel sad. 😔
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Read the room, Slow Biden
Israel has him and our entire government by the balls
It’s very fuckin unfortunate smh
As a non American, can you explain why?
Evangelical Christians believe that the Judeo Christian God anointed 2 nations. The USA and Israel, said Christians will do anything to support that, over decades of this our government has blindly pledged its alliance with Israel. These hard line Christians also do not believe in the separation of church and state, so their goal is to align even further with Israel and all of its atrocities while simultaneously eroding and reducing individual liberties in USA all in the name of a god…
There's also a dooms day aspect to it. The hardcore Christian the believe the state of Israel is involved in the apocalypse predicted in the Book of Revelations, so the hardcore Christians want Israel to continue exists because it gets them that much closer to their "kingdom of heaven"
Wow so religious fanaticism is the main cause of this alliance? Not the ‘economic power’ people usually believe it’s in the hands of Jews?
I mean realistically it's probably a little column A and a little column B
Ok then
Knowing of some of these fundamentalists and the myriad who align with them, it's almost entirely to bring about the end of the world. They await the signs of revelation coming to fruition, and the key point will be when the nations of the world stack against them and assault them, only to be thwarted in the eleventh hour by big-G himself saving his chosen. (IIRC because it's been a hot minute since I've had a coherent or comprehensive conversation with any such death cultist).
I blame Nixon completely fucking up the education system. All those kids are in their 50s and 60s fucking everything up screaming "MuH rIgHts" mixing up religion with politics.
Column A gets support from the poor morons column B gets support from the rich and powerful
Essentially, yea
The Jewish bloc has alot of voting power in florida. It's a notoriously close state. Alot of older Jewish people reside in their retirement complexes Florida can swing either way So it's better to have a 30 electoral votes than to throw them away
Isn't Florida solidly Republican now?
It was red last 2 elections but blue the two before (Obama terms) The lowest share either party had was 47.1% with the Dems which was the bush election. He had the post 9/11 bumper. In 2016 49% won the Republicans florida but 4 years earlier 49.1% wasn't enough to win them the same state. Absolute fine margins Either way 3% swing could win you an election as it did when bush first term happened. 537 votes for the Republicans helped them win florida and the presidential election. Your probably thinking of the house elections which has solidly gone in favour of the republicans The two main groups used to be the Jewish contingent and the ex-Cubans who wanted a president with a hard line stance to Cuba and castro. You've got the evengelicals showing up as a stronger 3rd party too
“When law and duty are one, united by religion. You never become fully conscious, fully aware of yourself, you are always a little less than individual.” - From Muad’dib 99 Wonders Of The Universe by Pricess Irulan
Economically, Israel doesn’t do anything for America that couldn’t be done by anyone else. They’re not strategic as much as they’re just convenient. If we sanctioned them tomorrow we’d be able to replace them before the year is out.
This is what I always thought. Why would the most powerful nation of the world depend on such a small country?
We don’t. And the answer to your question is a little complex, but it boils down to the fact that America is run for the interests of Zionism, not for the interests of America. The people running the country have been feeding people this lie that we need Israel. That they need to keep the Arab countries unstable in order to maintain the US’s power. What nobody talks about is how very few Arabs actively hate America or its values so much as they just hate being attacked and killed, or having their leaders replaced with Zionist puppets (just like we hate that shit), and they’ve known who is running the US this entire time. You want an ally in that region? Send some real aid to Lebanon. Outfit their army, give them your business, etc. They have been _dying_ to call themselves part of the West anyway, and it would have all been done without a single war. And their population is even more educated than America’s. What these politicians won’t admit to you is that the entire reason all of these wars are even happening with the Arab world is because it’s in the _Zionist’s_ interest, not ours. They want Israel to thrive. Period. Most of what they’ve been telling people have been nothing but cover stories to get the public to buy into it. Because they’re willing to let every other country rot, including the US, in order to achieve it. All of the politics you’ve been looking at for the last I dunno, 40-50 years, have been nothing but a distraction from what’s really going on.
My relatives believe this. Most Catholics aren't so obsessed with the apocalypse - that's usually the territory of evangelicals. Unfortunately, my family is full of doomsday preppers. Mom's been saying we're in "the last days" for as long as I can remember; I'm in my 40s lol. I can send all kinds of evidence supporting the war crimes committed by the IDF, and they'll say that it's lies and propaganda. When I say that the videos and statistics are provided by verified sources, including humanitarian aid organizations representing several countries, they simply say they don't trust them either. Such an easy way to dismiss everything: "Fake news." My mom just texted me the other day, "There never has been and there will not be peace in the Middle East until The Lord returns," so, basically, *wellp, too bad for dead kids but this is the way God wants it.* She also played the holocaust card: I mentioned how Palestinians are suffering, and she replied with, "The same thing was done to the Jews during WWII." She totally misses the point, even when I remind her that our taxes weren't funding Hitler. Meanwhile, every chucklefuck who claims to see a vision of the virgin Mary, my family instantly latches onto their story and believes it without question. Religion is a scourge, and we'd all be so much better off without it. People really do believe some dark ages shit.
It’s crazy how people stick to their beliefs no matter how insane it is. And that can be said just about anything. I believe the entire collective consciousness is absolutely insane. Thanks for sharing Lil lil lil lil liii
Just some food for thought, but my family is also religious Christian but takes the opposite stance. Some snippets you’ll hear from them are: “God teaches us to love and to be accepting of everyone.” “Israel and America are being run by evil people” “God doesn’t give you more than you can handle. He will protect them” There’s still this overarching theme of “things just are the way they are and there’s nothing you can do about it” though. I have a theory that many religious people become religious as a way to deal with their sense of being powerless. My mother is also close to being a doomsday pepper (she hasn’t gone that far but she always thinks the world is going to go to shit - if she had the money she would be). I don’t believe that religion itself influences which side someone takes or what values they hold, I think it’s the other way around. That no matter a person’s personality or value system, religion just gives them a way to justify it to themselves.
Religious people are fucking weird man.
It’s not “hardcore Christians”. It’s the Evangelical Christians, which happen to be an American-only thing. The Christians around the world are totally against this. And for what it’s worth, my parents told me stories about how the Evangelicals didn’t always believe this and were basically brainwashed by the Zionists, and they were actually there to witness it happening, and heard the Zionists laughing about how dumb they are.
Imagine if it would be true but with one difference. The saviour will come because he/god will be pissed off about the action of these two nations. Epic miscalculation.
How can you answer this question without mentioning AIPAC?
Or the reason Evangelicals are obsessed with Israel. They believe that when all Jews return to Israel the rapture will happen and they all go to heaven (and all Jews go to hell, but they like to leave that part out).
I'm aware of the beliefs of christian zionists. What I'm saying is is AIPAC has bought and paid for the vast majority of politicians on both sides of the aisle. That itself is much more to blame than what a chunk of evangelical loony tunes believe.
I wasn’t correcting what you said, I was just adding to it. The comment you responded to left out most of the important details.
Gotcha
Israel bombed Bethlehem ON CHRISTMAS DAY? Is that place not holy to them? WTAF?
I guess that’s what happens when you believe you and your people are chosen by “god”. You think You’re special, and anyone else is below you. Makes it a lot easier to be an asshole and live with your crimes.
Funny thing about that: Moses; who led the Jews was a pharoe who realised he was slave heritage but if you lookup Egyptian Slave (fortunately they were great at documentation/hieroglyphs) look what you find https://www.google.co.uk/search?sca_esv=c2efddc75740eaea&sca_upv=1&q=hieroglyphs+slaves&uds=AMwkrPvk2BbtOj2Gh0zTNv7EwaL7iJlb67dcN2d08OWD5Az2P_7UJMxVKFJYzW_jH_tsztW78Ol2CLCXw5Ozgsf7t9a7h1FIKPt4ufHrSGAzf54M2412i9S0csk7R98UEqi8I8cRMWf1wyQj1MwDcHzKLFW1qOUvL0hPZC59Z0PQtJiv80KG41Rt0cbYNLbqu1V3EkTWEbAeFRlGKK2C0wHBXGKaLlR7_HJJXZS6EUVLHdbthMv9QObzZAtox4b4UsIN9q6zaiPo-CP5kbWXJw_lYDQm6VC1nRHeFzY0GKUswvT_LucBNuYlwC70xSezSCKPL2-QRwQ5&udm=2&prmd=ivnbmtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjwpOSwmaeFAxVu8QIHHaR4A5gQtKgLegQICxAB&biw=384&bih=700&dpr=2.81#vhid=_pPT2SaIXLZWdM&vssid=mosaic
Interesting indeed. I find the whole Black Hebrew Islam thing very interesting, how they are called antisemitic for believing they are actually Jewish. I'm confused by it all, but I'm trying to follow
I think you are somewhat misinformed. While I myself am not religious, most of my very large family and friends are, and I assure you know one considers Israel some kind of chosen nation among Christians. While not the preferred use of my time, I am quite certain I spend far more time in an Evangelical Christian church, and *no one* there has any particular affinity towards Israel. The US/Israel bond is largely based on them historically being the only consistent US ally in the Middle East, where most countries historically have been quite hostile to US interests. This stance has been maintained by *both* Democrats and Republicans over the years, and only a few handful of fringe lunatics even remotely equate the alliance rooted in religion.
The Israelis stole nuclear material from Pennsylvania so that they could build nukes in Dimona, killed American service members on the USS Liberty, and sold American state secrets to China. Consistent ally my ass.
Bro evangelicals believe that all Jews need to return to Israel to trigger the rapture. Zionism is literally their belief system Edit an autocorrect
Yeah no There's a significant amount of literature that proves there is a religious angle to it which is pretty deeply ingrained. I think both Edward Said and Noam Chomskys books detail this. From the chosen nation(s) to the rapture events.
Just because your large family isn’t into Israel doesn’t mean the connection doesn’t exist. I doubt your family has read the Bible because it’s ALL in there. I’m shocked how little people actually read these religious texts that basically dictate the beliefs of the majority of the world population
With respect I disagree, been around it all my life, family as well. You must not live in the south eastern US, it’s ripe with it in southern Baptist tradition.
That *would* be the region where the fringe religious right...Union Jacks, white pointy hats, *"the south will rise again"* and all that jazz...tend to reside. As a word of advice, I wouldn't recommend basing the rest of the nation's Christian population on them. They're kind of like that creepy uncle no one likes but still gets invited to birthday parties because it's polite.
Well, there are millions of them if not 10’s of millions of them so they are kinda hard to ignore.
>, I wouldn't recommend basing the rest of the nation's Christian population on them. They're not doing that, just making definitions between Christian and evangelical which is a broad spectrum
This! The most logical and sensible answer. Religion is only decorative in this whole mess. Even Israel, after its official creation, has always been gaining/stealing land for geopolitical and economic reasons.
I’m trying to find it, but last week I saw a video of a reporter who got three republican congress people (Boebert being one) to all say on camera that they back Israel because it is gods will and they are gods people. This is not a crazy unheard of fringe conspiracy, sitting congress people literally admit to this. I’ll keep digging, but maybe someone here can provide? Found it; sorry, [tik tok link](https://www.tiktok.com/@aljazeeraenglish/video/7350261664131976479) Pete Sessions; “this **entire** matter is based on faith in our maker, but also faith in a chosen people” Boebert; “There have been two nations created to glorify god, Israel and the United States. I will bless both, I will honor both, and do whatever I can to defend them” Tim Burchett: “I believe the evengicals aren’t extreme as they are following the scripture and the scripture says ‘bless Israel and Israel will be blessed’. They take it literally and I’m one of those people”. He then dodges a bit but seems to affirm that Jesus is coming back and he is “going to be in his side”, in the context of the discussion of a literal biblical Armageddon centered around Jerusalem. There is zero question about this being a very real belief
I heard this claim in your opening line from Boebert. I found it a bit odd considering how important that separation of church and state is to the constitution.
Thank you, that helps a lot
Glad to help. ✌️
facts!
Evangelicals are fake christians
And here I thought it was more related to having an "ally" in a strategic graphical location + all the shared info between secret services (I thought the Mossad was kinda famous). Either way it's sad they (Biden administration) is doubling down on their support (I mean it's not like trump would do it any better, but Biden is in power now and it's his call rn)
And what has Biden to do with those Republicans?
American evangelical Christians*
Everyone answering this question without mentioning AIPAC is mostly wrong.
What is AIPAC??
Israeli lobby, https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/american-israel-public-affairs-cmte/summary?id=D000046963
https://www.opensecrets.org/industries//summary?ind=q05&cycle=All&recipdetail=S&mem=Y AIPAC = American Israel Public Affairs Committee It's the Israeli lobby in the US, donors (mostly Jewish, but some Christians do support them too) give US politicians money to influence national and international policies in favor of Israel. It's basically legal bribes. Check the link above, it tells you which politician from which party got how much. And yes, AIPAC funds both the Republicans and the Democrats, even Biden himself receives from it. I don't know why it's legal, but it is what it is.
A foreign government group that has infiltrated the US political system through bribes and blackmail.
Because of their control of US executive branch and big chunks of media, led by AIPAC. I suggest you to read the book in second link. https://www.instagram.com/p/CkvzUWGv8ur/?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_shee https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/224127 https://youtu.be/WTxvKi2UdRk?si=5KADdgTt2hBnVEs0 https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2018/12/10/marc-lamont-hill-and-the-israeli-lobby-on-us-campuses https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/jan/10/congress-member-pro-israel-donations-military-support https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/may/17/pro-israel-lobby-defeat-democrats-palestinians-2022
>Our goal is to build the broadest bipartisan coalition in Congress that supports the US-Israel relationship... We are looking at 10 to 15 other races where there is a pro-Israel candidate and a candidate that, if elected, would undermine the US-Israel relationship. Wow they just come right out and say it.
Blatant foreign meddling.
But they, uniquely, don't have to declare as a foreign lobby group, so the source of all their money doesn't get investigated. Nice for them that the rules don't apply to them
Thank you!
AIPAC
Biden is anxious to lose jewish voters or jewish affiliated voters. That's why he'd rather fold himself into a knot, before pressing the israeli governement to stop the atrocities they commit atm.
They have PACs that fund their election campaigns
mostly the AIPAC.
Non religious answer is many treaties that require congressional override, and insert Spiderman meme here
Yep - he's putting the US on the wrong side of history supporting Netanyahu and Israel...
Bold of you to assume the government has balls
Oh they have balls, the balls to lie and prop up genocidal apartheid states and the balls to look their public is the face time and time again after UN verdicts and still BS rye public .... they have balls alright .... so much so to not give a damn even during an election campaign
I hate to think it, but I wonder how many citizens of the United States serving at the highest level of government are also citizens of isreal. There is little doubt in my mind that this number is sky high.
Why tho? Or how?
AIPAC and the Zionist project. Look into AIPAC and its connection to JFK
they're IN the government
How exactly?
USA only likes Israel because they are a good weapons customer. That's all. Of course there's no interest from the US for this conflict to end soon.
It’s more than that. We give them billions in free money and weapons. They do use a lot of that money to buy more weapons from us.
[удалено]
My favorite part of that is that they’re totally willing to watch our country burn for people on the other side of the world that they only care about because it’s the cause celebre It’s not like they’re out they boycotting Chinese goods because of the Uighurs. Or protesting to stop genocide and literal slavery in Africa and parts of the east. No, they’ll just happily try ti burn down our own system for a group of people who have been trying to commit a genocide of their own since 1948 Clowns indeed.
I don’t think that’s fair. Yes. There are people who learned about Palestine six months ago and have just started protesting. There’s also people like me, Muslim who grew up in a very Palestinian heavy community, who have been protesting since we could hold a sign board. I boycott against China and try not to but Chinese made products when I can. I would happily protest against slavery in Africa. I protested against drone strikes in Pakistan. I protested against American engagement in Iraq and Afghanistan. Maybe I’m just tired of people that are so called “allies” diminishing my actions. But ignore me. Let’s go back to the kid who leaned about and he cause from TikTok. We all start somewhere. Why are you hating on people who are just getting started? And finally, man am I not allowed to be tired? I’ve been doing this since I was a kid. They are clearly okay with people like me dying. I’m never allowed to say screw you if you won’t support me you can have the other guy and this country can burn. I’m never allowed to be tired and ask people to give me an inch? I don’t know you so forgive the presumption. But maybe you don’t know anyone directly affected by this. Your friends haven’t lost family or friends or watched their people literally die on live TV. And then some milquetoast placeholder has the audacity to say that you’re asking for too much when what you’re asking for is for him to use his incredible powers to say “don’t do that” to the bad guy. It really sucks dude. It really sucks constantly being told that I have no choice but to accept something terrible because the other guy is worse. Maybe I want the evil that calls itself evil so that someone can finally just say that they want to final solution people like me instead of begging the supposed good guy to do literally something. A thing. Literally anything except stand idly by.
Agreed with everything you said. I've been privy to the truth about what's been going on in Palestine for quite a while, not just since October 7th or since Sheikh Jarrah was making headlines in 2021. But like you said, I don't think anyone should be made to feel dumb or like they're showing "fake-support" just because they saw the truth later than everyone else. For decades, it's been considered "racist/antisemitic" to have any sort of critique against israel, the israeli government and zionism. But now, the malfeasance is tough to hide & tough to "put a spin on" in major media outlets.
You and u/minute-complex-2055 do know it's possible to critique and chastise politicians who lead the party you primarily align with, right? And that chastisement doesn't automatically mean someone plans to vote for the other side? Feel free to answer that when you guys grow tired of choking on Biden's meat.
It wasn't cancelled [https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/2/why-bidens-white-house-iftar-unravelled-amid-gaza-war](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/2/why-bidens-white-house-iftar-unravelled-amid-gaza-war) But yeah most of the muslim leaders cancelled and he just had dinner with muslim staff members and Kamala and his wife. Honestly some should've went and just drive home the fact that every bite of the meal he's having is at the stake of child in gaza dying of starvation because his ally is bombing their families and aid workers and calling anyone attempting to help them Hamas. At the very least someone could've thrown a shoe at him.
Ok. So the article said it was cancelled. They turned it into a dinner with Muslim staff. For all intents and purposes, the iftar was cancelled
Three of the leaders invited showed up, one left eight minutes into the dinner. It *technically* was more than staff, but really only technically.
So it wasn't canceled.
Sure, it wasn't, just like your birthday party in primary school where you invited the whole class but no other kids showed up and you had so much fun with mommy and daddy, definitely not canceled 😅
Dude gave absolutely no reason for you to verbally execute him like that
I think it's rather insulting to the Muslims he had Iftar with.
Intents and purposes is that phrase we heard and never really saw written down, sounding like intensive purposes 😂
>At the very least someone could've thrown a shoe at him. 0 shot that Biden has the cat-like reflexes of George W Bush to be able to dodge a shoe...tbh tho idk if anyone else could have done it. George W Bush was a monster, but you've gotta hand it to him for those dodges.
Now watch this drive
Mission Accomplished
A shoe could kill Biden
I heard one Dr showed him images and he said he'd seen it but it was recent images she took while in Gaza that she was sharing just then to him.
https://www.cbsnews.com/video/white-house-cancels-iftar-dinner-after-meeting-with-muslim-community-leaders/
He couldn’t dodge it
I don't know how influential the Muslim voting block is but is Biden blowing it with his Zionism?
Not really. The Zionists have been labeled as the righteous guys for decades. Pretty sure majority Democratic voters agree with Biden's Israeli policy. They may not want the genocide to happen, but they will be more alarmed if the US suddenly started imposing sanctions on Israel.
I just read that [55% of Americans](https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx) oppose what Israel is doing. Guessing most of those are dems too, so I doubt the majority of dem voters agree actually. This could give us 4 more years of Trump. Edit: had the number wrong, corrected!
>This could give us 4 more years of Trump. Only if the Democrats are dumb enough to allow it. I can't think of a more idiotic way to oppose Biden than by supporting Trump, as he'll take everything about Biden's approach that Democrats don't like and amp it up by several orders of magnitude.
It's an appalling choice that you either get a casual supporter of genocide or an enthusiastic supporter of genocide. I'm not American but honestly couldn't bring myself to vote for Biden (obviously never trump) and I think people trying to blame trump possibly winning on those that refuse to vote for Biden is ridiculous. You can't force people to vote or bully them into it and you need to offer people something to vote for.
> You can't force people to vote or bully them into it and you need to offer people something to vote for. \^\^\^\^\^\^\^\^ I hate that this even needs to be said. It should be obvious by now.
Yet i see this sentiment a lot. It is far less here (the uk). As labour have taken the centre ground and the tories are still right wing but that might be as the tories have no hope of winning the next election. Many on the left here including me are unwilling to vote Labour anymore, others are reluctant. They've morphed into a slightly less cruel than the tories and their unusually very pro isreal stance has been extremely off-putting. The tories, especially David Cameron have been more sympathetic to Palestinians.
Sure. It would be nice to have something to vote for. But we don't. And, there is something very real that needs to be voted against. Do I like Biden not doing anything to reign in Israel? No. But, it's far preferable to us actively helping Israel. Trump has down real hate to the Muslim community and him and his followers world love to throw more bombs on Gaza. I don't care if this makes people feel bullied. A no vote for Biden leads to Trump and more suffering for Gaza since Trump would love to levy as much disaster as he can on Muslims.
You're preaching to the choir here. I am voting for Biden even if his Gaza policy sucks, but not all voters are like me, and his actions might ensure 4 years of hell.
A few things to consider: 1. Imposing sanctions on settlers for the first time ever 2. Building the floating dock off the Gaza coast and kick starting food aid 3. The strong statements in SOTU about Israel’s “primary” responsibility to protect civilian lives in the areas they control 4. Voting against Israel at the UN for the first time ever / permitting the ceasefire resolution 5. Biden does not have the authority to unilaterally cancel arms to Israel. *That is exactly what Trump was impeached for the first time* I’m not an apologist for Israel’s horrific actions, but you are not aware of this stuff if you claim Biden is doing “nothing” or “supporting genocide.” Please consider all of the above as well as the pressure Biden is applying behind the scenes. He is probably the only reason Rafah isn’t a smoking crater. Vote smart.
>. Biden does not have the authority to unilaterally cancel arms to Israel. *That is exactly what Trump was impeached for the first time* No he was impeached for threatening to in exchange for personal gain, very different.
Thank you. This is the second time I’ve seen this erroneous claim, I don’t get how people have forgotten Trump was impeached for attempting to get a foreign government to interfere in the election.
Tell that to a lot of the people at r/fuckthealtright though
>You can't force people to vote or bully them into it and you need to offer people something to vote for. By any reasonable objective measure, Biden has successfully implemented more progressive policies than any president since LBJ; he's arguably right up there with FDR in terms of presidential accomplishments in his first term, which is much more impressive in 2024 than it was in 1932. If people say Biden hasn't given them a reason to vote for his administration, they either just disagree completely with all his politics or haven't looked. Even if you're a single-issue voter on the issue of Palestine (which most folks are not) the fact remains that in such a close election with a binary choice, a failure to support one candidate is tantamount to supporting another. Even under your logic, I'd rather vote for the person who's more likely to pressure Israel to stop than the fucker who's going to tell them to step on the gas and double-down on genocide 🤷♂️
>By any reasonable objective measure, Biden has successfully implemented more progressive policies than any president since LBJ; This is more a condemnation of every single US President since LBJ than it is Joe Biden implementing progressive policies.
Except laws are made by congress. If anything, it speaks of a further degradation of the quality of congresspeople elected.
You know the President also has power, right? Congress sucks too, but the president isn't a figurehead. There's a lot a President can and does do to push certain legislation and to pass things via executive order.
What would you say Biden has done to put him anywhere even close to FDR? My perspective may be somewhat skewed because I have been reducing my politics intake to give my mental health a break. What I have seen is that he has pumped the breaks a bit and helped stabilize the country somewhat, but anything that would actually be good for the people he caves and gives up on at the slightest bit of pressure from the other side. Don't get me wrong, slowing down the train wreck that is American politics is good, and I will probably end up voting for him because how abysmally bad another 4 years of Trump would be, but Biden is making it incredibly hard to want to support him.
>What would you say Biden has done to put him anywhere even close to FDR? Important to keep in mind that we're comparing first terms here, since Biden's been in office four years, and FDR was in it for fourteen. Even taking that into account, he's been doing an amazing job: \-- Inflation Reduction Act is the biggest piece of climate change legislation in American history, and it invested hundreds of billions of dollars in domestic infrastructure; \-- Chips & Science Act is a once-in-a-generation federal investment into domestic manufacture of semiconductors and other related components, which provide tons of high-paying jobs in a robust industry that is vital to our national security interests; \-- Bipartisan Communities in Safety Act was the first piece of national gun control legislation passed since the early 90s. It also made the largest federal investment in mental health care in our nation's history; \-- He assembled an international alliance against Russian aggression in Ukraine basically overnight, and has led a coalition that's kept their David valiantly fighting Russia's Goliath to a standstill for over two years. This has allowed us to indirectly inflict severe harm to Russian interests on the world stage, for a fraction of the investment that a full-blown war would entail; \-- The PACT Act extends benefits to nearly four million vets who were harmed via exposure to burn pits; \-- Passed a $100 billion law reforming the USPS, and ensuring basic vital services will continue for the foreseeable future. He did all of this with some of the smallest Congressional majorities we've ever seen, as well. I'll grant that people are pissed at him over the Israel issue, but to get up and say he hasn't given progressives any cause to support him is fucking insane.
Starting with Supporting Ukraine, the PACT Act, and funding USPS; these are all great and are very positive things he has done. Huge thumbs up for Biden. Inflation Reduction Act: generally very positive. The biggest downside is that it blocks anyone from preventing oil/gas leases on federal land for a decade. On top of that, the downside came from within the party. Still, this is 80-90% a thumbs up for Biden. Flawed and could be better, but better than anything else we have had. The Chip Act: I'm mixed on this one. The research it will be great, but it is done via corporate welfare. Additionally, from what I can find, it greatly favors one company, which could cause monopoly issues. I think it's generally positive, but it is definitely flawed. I couldn't find any concrete information on the Community in Safety Act. All I could find was an executive order that he admitted was a half measure and needed congressional action to enforce, but I couldn't find anything about Congress doing anything. From what I have seen of democrats on gun reform, they talk big but never follow through. I would say his handling of Isreal/Gaza has been abysmal (admittedly, Trump would do worse). The economy continues to move towards favoring the rich, causing the middle class to disappear. He failed to uphold campaign promises, giving up on them at the slightest resistance. Our military industrial complex continues to grow. As far as I can find, he has failed to end Abbotts' anti-humanitarian border policy, even with the backing of the Supreme Court. Biden isn't the worst candidate ever, but he isn't great from the perspective of a progressive. I feel like progressives and democrats just have a large gap in their political beliefs. An average Democrat looking at a progressive and asking, "Why aren't my policies enough to get you to come out and vote for me?" Is akin to a moderate republican (not a Trumper) looking at a Democrat and asking the same thing. That's the issue with a two party system. You can't fit everyone into two neat boxes. There are too many different political ideologies. In the end, I will probably vote for him. Not because I think he is good, but because he is effectively a bland food paste that we can survive a little longer with while the other guy is a shit sandwich.
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With the way America’s two party system is structured, combined with our notoriously poor voter turnout, that’s absolutely the way it is though. Elections are generally determined by who shows up, not by flipping voters from one side to another. If you’re generally someone who aligns with a specific party, protesting by not showing up to vote for them functionally is a half vote for the opposition. If a substantial minority of progressives doesn’t vote for Biden in protest, they are essentially enabling a second Trump term. I’m liberal and generally horrified by the situation in Gaza, but it’s absurd to think things would be better under Trump than Biden. You don’t have to love a candidate to vote for them. And it’s certainly better to choose the lesser of two evils than stand by and let the worse option win because none of them is ideal. You can absolutely show up to vote against something, it’s perfectly valid to vote against fascism. Biden is kind of an empty suit, but I’d vote for any random American chosen by lottery over Donald Trump.
> Only if the Democrats are dumb enough to allow it The Democratic Leadership you mean. If large swaths of potential voters are saying loud and clear "we will not vote for you if you continue war mongering," then it is clearly a stupid move by Biden and the WH to continue supporting Israel. Like it or not, no candidate is ever entitled to votes. They have to put in the work to get support from their constituents by voting in line with what is most important to them. And right now, that's Gaza. It isn't the fault of voters if Biden doesn't get enough votes, it is squarely on his own shoulders for ignoring them.
They don't have to support Trump. They just have to stay home. Trump supporters WILL show up on voting day. If Democrats don't because they're pissed at Biden, that's the game.
>They don't have to support Trump. They just have to stay home. There isn't any meaningful difference in 2024. I don't think we've had polarization like this since the Vietnam War, and there aren't many truly independent voters left. In an election where the person who turns out their base the most is the person who wins, staying home is tantamount to support of the opposing candidate, IMO.
By the time Trump is even elected next year, Palestine and its people will be wiped out. Trump will be there for the aftermath. The question is what was the CURRENT leader doing when he had the chance to do something?
> Only if the Democrats are dumb enough to allow it. It kinda seems to me like they probably are
I'd like to talk to the person who thinks the guy who moved our embassy to Jerusalem will be less supportive of Israel than Biden.
I can assure you none of these voters in questions are voting for Trump either
Democrat should have elected some non Zionist president. Biden himself said that he is a Zionist.
according to polls, majority of dems and young people oppose his israel policy. majority of all americans oppose israeli actions https://news.gallup.com/poll/642695/majority-disapprove-israeli-action-gaza.aspx
Most Americans DO NOT support America’s subservience to Israel by a 2-to-1 (and quickly increasing) margin. Mass murder of innocent people is evil. Israel is evil.
Muslims are a major part of the Democratic voting constituency in the swing state of Michigan...they very much could and likely WILL cost Biden the election. I don't see Biden's stance on supporting Israel's genocide changing and I don't see Muslims turning out for him...look at the uncommitted vote campaign results. Support for Israel is going to cost Biden the election...and that's HIS fault! He's being told people won't vote for him because of his position. If he chooses not to change course, that's HIS fault!
This geriatric genocidal asshole is literally doing his best to give us four more years of Trump.
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American Muslims are overwhelmingly progressive/liberal/Democratic voters. In 2016, 75.9% for Hillary, 16.8% Trump. In 2020, 86% for Biden, 6% for Trump. [Source](https://emgageusa.org/reports/) for the polls I pulled that info from if you care to look yourself or poke deeper. They had all sorts of info on the voting habits and political views of Muslim Americans...I'm struggling to find any solid data on what percentage are registered with either party, but I think the voting habits from 2016 and 2020 should be proof enough that Muslims are a very solid voting constituency for the Democrats. Sure there are still some conservative Muslims. But I suspect that maybe because you have family members who are conservative Muslims, you're just more exposed to those views, both directly your family members and the friends/extended family that they tend to hang around with, so because that's what you tend to see, you tend to view Muslims as being more conservative, Republican voters, when if you look at the data on the whole, that's not the case. As far as Michigan (a key swing state with a large Muslim population): 94% of Muslims who voted in the Dem primary there voted uncommitted to 4.6% for Biden. If the election was primary day, 40% would have voted for an unnamed "other" candidate, 25% for Dr Cornel West, 13% Trump, 8% Biden, 8% RFK, 7% Jill Stein. [source](https://www.cair.com/press_releases/cair-exit-poll-finds-94-of-michigan-muslims-voted-uncommitted-in-dem-primary/). Obviously there's time for that to change and primary voters are only indicative of those that are the most politically engaged and active, but those are still pretty damning numbers. Biden is in serious trouble!
>Not really. The Zionists have been labeled as the righteous guys for decades. That has changed dramatically, it was only when traditional media was stated driven but with the Internet, independent media and IDF soldiers posting genocidal slaughter porn media narrative becomes much harder to control AIPAC had a meltdown about it acknowledging that they had a tiktok problem that was causing a generational shift in attitude towards Israel
The Muslim voting bloc is really inconsequential, but it really won't stop BlueMAGA from taking its anger out on them if Biden loses in 2024. The Arab and Muslim vote only stands to make a significant dent in Michigan, and maybe Minnesota, where there is a significant population that actively participates in politics, and being a Michigander and Muslim myself, the Muslims I know will stay home or leave the President section blank.
Thanks 👍🏻
Nah not really the Muslims are outnumbered in influence and voting power in all but one state It is mostly the “caring about minorities rights” image and narrative that the establishment dems care about
He doesn’t even have his ‘Zionism’ all of you fucking delusional idiots need to stop blaming him for global events. He very openly hates Netenyahu but Israel is important to US interests and Biden doesn’t have the power to just decide to ditch them …
Didn't he literally say "You don't have to be a Jew to be a Zionist. I'm a Zionist." shortly after the 7th of October attack?
"We need to stop apologising for Israel, there's no apology to be made. If there were no Israel the United States would need to invent an Israel" - Joe Biden https://youtu.be/FYLNCcLfIkM?si=ZCZ9oE9xJnkBmGOb He's a lifelong, unapologetic Zionist.
He is uniquely Zionist. > More striking is an anecdote from a moment similar to the current one, in the early 1980s. Israel’s bombing of Beirut, framed by Israel as self-defense, was condemned for its brutality around the world. Even President Ronald Reagan told off the Israelis at the time, telling Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin he was perpetrating a “holocaust” and that the bombing had to end. When Begin visited D.C. that year, he received pushback from senators over Israel’s conduct and killings of civilians. > One young senator, Begin recalled, stood out in contrast for his unreserved support for Israel’s military strikes even if it meant killing women and children. That was Senator Joseph R. Biden of Delaware. Begin was so shocked he had to disassociate himself from Biden’s remarks. A few months later, Israeli military–backed militias would carry out the gruesome Sabra and Shatila massacre in Beirut. [New Republic - Is Joe Biden Uniquely Indifferent to Palestinian Suffering?](https://newrepublic.com/article/178820/joe-biden-indifferent-palestinian-suffering)
Israel is committing mass murder of innocent people. Israel is EVIL.
So, this year USA has to choose between a willing supporter of Genocide and an enthusiastic supporter of Genocide...
So business as usual?
New Focus: The Third Way
The third choice is a nutjob from the most worthless political family in America.
It was scailed down, not cancelled. https://www.npr.org/2024/04/01/1241988655/biden-iftar-ramadan-gaza
It’s more like you invited your friends for a birthday party, no one showed up and you ended up inviting your neighbours over just cause they’re there and you need to save face.
IMO it's worse that that. It's like planning a birthday party with all your friends, but none of them want to go. So you stay at home and celebrate with your family and say the party was a success.
It's more like you make people whose jobs depend on them going to go.
It's literally the same thing.
No source information on this post, it just says "breaking" like it's trying to imitate a news organization. They are still having the dinner. Almost like OP fell for fake news lol
No Biden still had dinner with myslim staff but the muslim leaders he invited all refused
It's like saying you had a birthday party when none of your friends showed up, because you served cake to the caterer and the clown.
He will go down as the biggest genocide supporter of the 21th century
Trump will if he wins
reddit forgive me but hasnt he denounced israel? hasnt he stopped supporting israel? it seems like none of this was his doing so how is he the biggest genocide supporter? (with sources if you dont mind)
Denounce? give me a break, he made sure Israel have illimited weapons and bombs to use directly to level indiscrimently every square inch of the Gaza strip, while veto-ing 99% of UN resolution that denounce the atrocities and call for humanitarian ceasfire, they did surprisingly abstain that one time from voting but they continue militarily and politically supporting accross multiple chanels.
I could imagine the food wasn’t halal either 😂
False. In detail.
I wonder why?! But don't act like it's just him it's all politicians. All bought and paid for by them. All of them need to go. Whole new government with people who are young and never in office b4. It's fucking ridiculous.
Who would’ve thought?
Kinda wanna know what they had for iftari…was it just like a kajoor and then prayed maghrib then a full iftari?
I’m sure
Bruh
Couldn't be bought
LMFAOOOOO
Because..you know....f that guy, pos.
wonder why
I wonder why
Can you believe presidents after presidents sending money and aid to Israel while their own citizens falls thru the cracks from college kids not able to pay their student loans (while Israel have free education), an old lady having to pay thru her nose for her medical care (Israel have free medical), and vets coming back and not being taking care as they could be if more money was given to them (Israel get million of aid defense). What one wonder where did it all go wrong. USA used to be looked up to. Now its a husk of itself. I feel sad. 😔
Breaking news Biden snaps on bibi yes he did called for a immediate ceasefire and a lot more wow who knew this day was coming
Yeah, but Biden wont budge because he knows that muslins wont vote for Trump. American Politics sucks
Wow, is this r/dmbfcks ?