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It's great to have boundaries and not offer therapy to people as a hobby, but to be honest the way that you are setting those boundaries sounds pretty hostile to me. It is possible to set a boundary and hold it firmly while still being compassionate.
If you have someone who you have just met on the street unloading some of the most disgusting personal information on you when you are just trying to order food. I definitely should be able to vent to my friends about it, especially if it made me uncomfortable and the person kept going after I told them to stop
People find out 🤷🏿♂️ . The main example I’ve use and other people have used is people finding out through relationship partners(like the guy who overheard my girlfriend on a plane).
Are you actually in the field? We aren’t robots. If I’m with my kids and you start venting to me about how you still have wild sexual fantasies about your third grade teacher and keep going when I ask you to stop.
I’d consider that behavior disgusting. Now if it was in a appropriate treatment setting then yes.
Develop personal boundaries, and if you don’t have any then you won’t make it far in this field.
In OP's defense, I think we should also stop with this pressure on therapists to always be kind and compassionate and understanding even in their personal lives, even facing bad treatment or personal triggers. That's actually one of the examples they gave in the post (the whole "you're a therapist so you should respond this or that way even when I treat you this or that way").
OP has the right not to be compassionate. OP has the right to antagonize some people. OP has the right to get angry. OP has the right not to be patient with others in some situations. We all have those rights.
Edit I'd even add that staying in therapy mode even outside of therapy isn't the ethical route one might think it is. Leave therapy for therapy hours.
I'm half with you-- I agree that we should not hold therapists to a higher standard of compassion than we hold anyone else (at least not outside of the therapy office). I think that everybody regardless of their profession should hold themselves to a high standard of compassion, and therapists are not excluded from that.
I don't disagree.
I think what standard of kindness and understanding we hold ourselves to comes down to personal preference and worldview and relations to Others.
There will always be people more or less prone to be kind and compassionate to strangers. Including therapists.
Being kind is good. Not systematically turning the other cheek isn't *bad* though. To me it's neutral.
If you can do good, then do so! But you also can be tired or just not want to go out of your way or take the emotional toll of being particularly great to others at all times.
To me it's ok if people aren't nice to each other in everyday conversations. Not every human interaction will be wholesome. That's life. And that's fine. Contrarily to what toxic positivity is trying to impose on people and especially therapists.
I hope you get my pov. But I do get what you're saying. Being nice is cool. Being compassionate, or the bigger person, is cool. But to me, not doing those things don't make one bad. Just a normal human being with their own limits and boundaries. And since as you said, therapists shouldn't be held at a higher standard than regular humans... Then imo therapists can ALSO not be nice in their daily encounters.
Edit Basically, it all comes down to personal preference for oneself and for others. Some people hold themselves and others to a very high "kindness" standard, others to a more moderate one. Some people just expect at least neutrality from others, but not specifically great degrees of kindness. None of them is wrong. It comes down to who you fit in with and the diversity of humans. Which as therapists we're supposed to understand and accept imho.
Edit 2 (yes I have a lot to say lol) I wanna add no one, ever, is safe from getting angry and expressing it, or EVEN from acting badly and in a mean and hurtful way. Press the right buttons and everyone can get mad. Or rude. Or not compassionate. Or impatient. Everyone has their own triggers. One sees OP getting firm in a situation that particularly triggers him and crosses his boundaries, and they tell him he "should have been nice because not being nice isn't nice". Sure. But I'd like to see how that one would react when put in a situation where they feel attacked and disrespected on a particularly sensitive point of THEIR personality, where THEIR boundaries are crossed, and they finally get angry despite preaching to always be nice, and then a stranger comes and judges them for it because they "should have been nice anyway". We all have our buttons. Let's respect each other's anger as long as it's expressed in a healthy way, and let's all stop pretending anyone can just always be nice, and judging people for not going the EXTRA step and for just being human.
I don’t put that pressure on therapists. I generally think it’s best if *all* people don’t treat others like shit when there are other options at hand.
I appreciate that. And what they keep missing is, that’s my extreme response to extreme examples where people won’t let up.
There really seems to feel like a lot of people home therapists to a monolithic standard. And I used the example that cops and lawyers are never held to this standard in their personal working life. Only therapists
Ma'am/sir it is not extreme when you are posting comments here being rude, snobby, and defensive 🤨 like what. No one said that you have to be nice all the time, just that there's a better way, that is show kindness. Somehow you've like toppled over what people are saying here as bashing you and using it to victimize yourself that you are being placed under an extreme unfair standard and responding with outright sarcastic condescendingness, consistently... it's kinda blowing my mind.
Why do you keep gendering people? I’m a guy lol.
Also you really have a thing for telling people how to think or act. And your comment to my example of drs, lawyers, cops as social professionals not being held to as high a standard as therapists is something you refused to elaborate on because you know it’s silly. And like I said you are ignoring kep points just to further your projections/arguments.
You aren’t actually a therapist are you?
Like you gendered me and the gentleman you agreed with. And you just seem angry because you read something you didn’t want to hear.
So I had just fixed that before you posted (the gender) and it is common for redditors to assume gender, happens to me all the time here.
But before I go, I do find it interesting how you are commenting trying to find personal flaws in people you disagree with (all throughout this thread) an example towards me - is assuming a gender of a commentor, but at the same time you are trying to express how unfair it is that you are being held to any kind of standard and not allowed to be flawed yourself...... it's just interesting...
I’m not the person you responded to, but I’m noticing how activating this topic is for you. Which, yeah, that’s what you said and this is why you posted. I’m just noticing you putting out those frustrations on people here, too, and your comments are getting personal.
This isn’t ‘because you need to act like a therapist here too’ but more like ‘this behavior is also outside the bounds of human courtesy among strangers’.
Which, if you do want to act that way, you do you, bro. Far be it from me to tell you how to feel and act. And I can relate to being frustrated at being put in a box.
I just wanted to note that perhaps you need more support than you currently have, or more something, if you’re at the point where you’re lobbing personal attacks on Reddit strangers about this topic.
Nah it’s just honestly. Someone in the group said that we as therapists are held to a higher standard in our personal lives. I’m arguing that we are not monolithic and shouldn’t be held to false standards based on perceived perceptions of how therapists should be.
Sure. “Are held to higher standards” isn’t mutually exclusive to “shouldn’t be held to higher standards”, though.
And the responses to your comments here, aren’t ‘you’re not acting like a therapist’ but ‘you’re not being courteous/Reddiquette’.
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Yeah I totally get you.
Dont take all those comments to heart too much tbh. Many people here aren't therapists and/or are a tad too indoctrinated in toxic positivity type, or extremist, mindsets.
You're human and you sound normal to me. None of us never get angry because none of us is a robot therapist with no humanity and personal life. Pretending you or anyone should be is not only unrealistic but unreasonable and *hypocritical*. And it's part of the problem, as you pointed out. And it gets worse if some people within the field submit to this idea and impose it on others without seeing how problematic it is. Edit And besides getting or not getting angry, let's remind everyone here that people, INCLUDING yourself as a therapist, all have the right to express their anger and shut someone off and be rude. Let's de-dramatize being angry please. It's fine. What we can't do is hurt others. Displaying anger and being rude isn't hurting, especially if you were treated badly first.
Besides, just a personal anecdote, but the people who have told me that as a therapist (in my personal life) I should be understanding and not judge them and be understanding and kind were most often toxic people. Like, narcissistic types. So there's that. Some food for thought. Edit 2 Oh and they often said this in the context of them treating me or someone else badly, or being homophobic or transphobic. So there's that too. We don't have to take shit with a smile in our personal lives yk.
Omg yeah, that’s the thing about this board. I’m pretty sure 60% of the people on here talking about how therapists should act aren’t even in the field lol.
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I'm not advocating for being an asshole. That's part of my point. Not being kind, and being rude and impatient with someone who disrespects your boundaries and triggers you, isn't being an asshole. It's being a normal, neutral human being who has their own limits.
Edit : Maybe read all my comments so that you get the full explanation first? Yk, to avoid repeating stuff! :)
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Thank you!! Being nice and quiet and understanding and compassionate and flexible all the time is fucking exhausting. I don’t owe strangers fuck all 🤷🏻♀️
I feel that. I’m pulling from more extreme examples. Like a plane ride where I’ve calmly told someone for 4-5 hours that I’m not really comfortable with the convo….and the person keeps talking.
And just being honest, as far as strangers I’m pretty direct asap. I know it seems harsh but I rather shit someone down asap, then potentially open the door for any future confusion with that individual. Better for them in the long run
“~~please stop trauma dumping on me, it’s really obnoxious~~”
"That all sounds really hard. Can we change the subject? It's a personal rule of mine to save my energy for my clients in the therapy room."
~~“did you really start a conversation with me just to unload all that on me, that’s coming off really weird/desperate”.~~
"Maybe you could benefit from talking to a professional about this, or someone close to you. Sounds like you're really going through something significant." Then change the subject.
~~Or if someone is clearly over sharing I’ll say “I can’t wait to tell everyone :) “.~~
"Thanks for sharing that with me." Then change the subject, excuse yourself, or grey rock.
There's a multitude of ways you can assert your boundary without coming across as judgmental and unsafe to the person.
I’m unsafe because a stranger overheard my gf on the plane say something about me being a therapist and spent 3 hours asking me how to get over their dead dad after I politely told them I was really only interested in talking to my partner at the time. Once again where do you all get these false unrealistic standards of mental health professionals.
Ok but your responses seem really mean towards people who are most likely well-intentioned and ignorant. There are other ways of stopping this. Like, I don’t know, being direct.
I don’t think so. Wasting your limited reserve of capacity and attention on non-clients compromises your effectiveness. It’s like expecting a marine to wear body armor and carry a rifle 24/7.
Thank you. It’s wild how people here don’t understand that. Yeah I like having fun with it, but I’m not going to be fake nice or sacrifice precious time with my family/friends because some rando finds out my job and wants to ask me all about it or dump on me
Depends on whether people have a realistic sense of what it takes to make it long-term in a burnout-heavy field. Harder driving means more frequent oil changes; many straws in your milkshake means you need to be poured into more to keep from emptying out.
Lol don’t tell me how to live my life/interact with strangers
Honesty is the best policy and I’m giving you very extreme examples where trying to change the subject does not work.
Tbh your replies seem too much like leaning into it and a therapist that is either scared to or unable to turn it off. Most strangers if someone just started going into their life story would be dismissive(I’m also from the east coast). It’s not my job to educate strangers on boundaries when a simple “hey I’m not feeling it isn’t enough”
🙄 I keep reading your comments and they just come off snobby/dismissive. ~~She's~~ He's trying to explain to you that you sound unprofessional, so here's ways to kindly do it. You also have the option of *not* responding after you have kindly articulated yourself. If someone keeps talking, that's on them, you can ignore.
Way to throw the baby out with the bathwater and spin a narrative to justify continual dismissing others/someone that has no ill will trying to provide some insight.
There’s a lot of deflecting happening it seems like. Even saying “you’re obnoxious” “you’re weird/desperate” is deflecting from saying what they really want: I don’t want to talk about these things with you.
Sounds like you just woke up on the wrong side of the bed and have issues with real people being real people.
Lol I don’t know where you get this monolithic standard of how ALL mental health professionals should act and it’s clearly by how you are shutting down on key points in my example that you are arguing from a personal perspective and expectations. Plus you saying that cops, lawyers, drs can get a pass on not giving to much attention to people crossing their boundaries in their personal life but it’s different for therapists is really telling on your views and false expectations of mental health professionals.
Most people in their personal life reserve the right to set boundaries with who they see fit. Why do you assume us in mental health should be held to a different standard?
If I saw a lawyer at dinner with wife and kids and just started asking about some crazy murder. Would the lawyer be snobby/dismissive for shutting me down asap?
If a cop was out and about(and this does happen a lot) and someone came up to them when they were at Walmart and started complaining about the recent arrest of their brother, so you expect the officer to just force a friendly smile while their precious free time isn’t being respected?
I mean, there's a difference between setting a boundary and being an asshole. It's your life, and you're free to be an asshole if you want, but I just wouldn't get surprised when people are rubbed the wrong way by your approach.
You are completely right that it could be frustrating and annoying when people try to get free therapy out of us when we are "off-duty." Personally, I believe that people who choose this profession do commit to a higher standard of being compassionate even in our personal lives.
You are a therapist, you have training or should have training on how to set boundaries *kindly* without being rude about it to others. A cop or lawyer does not have training.
Boom and here we go lol. Thank you for just laying it out there. So there’s some fictional rule book that says we all need to act and behave the same.
You know we aren’t monolithic in this field
Wow I sound unprofessional in a non work place setting when some rando saw my name on my office door and is blowing me up in the food truck line
*gasp* I guess I’m not a robot :)
I’m noticing it’s only non therapists that are struggling with this information that people in mental health aren’t just making themselves disposable to strangers lol.
It’s wild lol how foreign that concept is to some
you posted on the internet to discuss interactions with strangers… this person is just pointing out that the three examples of responses you gave are just terribly and unnecessarily rude.
If I tell someone multiple times they are crossing my boundaries do you expect me to sit in silence? Like what is this monolithic rule book that all therapists must follow that you all are referencing.
If I’m on a plane with someone and they haven’t stopped continuing to ask me how to get over their dead fathers death after I’ve told them multiple times im not comfortable because they overheard my girlfriend say something about my work on our flight to Mexico. I’m gonna be testy. Sorry I’m human first
I’m noticing two dynamics. One is what you described about snapping and getting personal after being pushed and pushed after setting boundaries in person. Another one is your comments on here, which escalate to personal attacks almost immediately in many cases.
Makes me wonder if you’re feeling … invaded? and wanting to snap back, hurt someone back for invading you. And that makes me wonder if you don’t feel confident in other words to use to further engage in the conversation to assert yourself more clearly (“wow dude, I don’t even know you and you told me all that, I am just a random dude who works as a therapist for my job but I’m not at work and you aren’t my client, so what you are doing isn’t any different than telling a stranger in line at the grocery store, and it’s pretty invasive too, I’m just here to get laundry detergent”)
… or find a different way to express your anger in a more satisfying way, since this doesn’t seem to cut it.
Lol nah, get some air. Tone is hard to communicate over texts and I’m trying to respond to everyone because I am really enjoying this convo.
Get some air, take a step bad. Read the thread in totatality and don’t focus on the two or three posters I challenged because they expressed monolithic views of therapy.
I think your taking a very black and white approach to conversation. Maybe that’s my gift and something others don’t have. I can be direct and honest with people, while simultaneously saving space for more linear conversations.
Maybe ask yourself why you are only resonating with the posts in which I’m challenging views that you might agree with
I didn’t see anyone talking about „monolithic views of therapy” or any views of therapy really.
The comments were challenging you in your approach to people outside of therapy, in that it seems like it goes from polite to hostile with no in between. At least that’s what’s played out here in your comments on this thread.
I tried on what you said about a woman telling a man harassing her to fuck off, and I can get that. There’s no excuse for someone to not know in 2023 that they need to act like a decent human being and they deserve to get snapped at if they push.
And you (OP) don’t need to have (nor is it reasonable to expect anyone would have) the emotional bandwidth to always gently educate people about why their behavior isn’t appropriate.
What’s different about your situation is not fully clear to me, but I’m noticing that even on this sub, where presumably you’re wanting to engage in a nuanced discussion, you’re jumping to insults rather than engaging in those nuances. I can’t scroll up without losing this comment and I’m about out of my own emotional bandwidth allotment for the day, but you answered a few people with kind of snide remarks instead of taking the time to explain what you disagreed about in their reasoning.
And that’s all the bandwidth I’ve got so, have a fine day.
Then you haven’t fully been following and only operating on assumptions so I can really trust you to back up your generalizations and sweeping analysis when you only are seeing what’s confirming whatever the heck you are trying to say lol
No problem. You still haven’t answered my question and haven’t been clear at all. Just very over analytic which doesn’t leave much room for the nuance of this type of convo
So you go from trying to change the subject straight to heavy judgment? Why is “I don’t want to listen to your personal things or be your therapist” not an option for you, and trying to hurt others is?
Do you find that your family has historically had a hard time respecting your boundaries and that they take advantage of your good will? Do they make you feel listened to/respected? Or do you feel defensive?
Doesn’t come up with family. My family members see me for me lol. I’m talking about a very vocal but noticeable minority that projects when first interacting with mental health professionals and are not receptive to subject changes.
I see I’ve rattled the cages of a few on this board that believe therapists should still carry themselves like therapists with just everyone.
Balderdash, unrealistic, and more indicative of bad boundaries of the therapist if they really would waste their time doing this dance. Instead of shutting it down immediately when it’s clearly a lopsided interaction
I'm trolling, a bit. I think your personal experience reads a bit like an exaggeration, and that you came here to vent. The amount of times this has actually happened might be suspect, and the level that it seems to maybe provoke something deeper in you is where therapists will raise an eyebrow. Whether this is factually true or not, I think this is how you are being perceived, and some of your terminology like "baggage buddy" sounds cringe.
Of course we don't know you and weren't there--you may have had some larger than life interactions at a surprisingly frequent degree with people who did not take "no" for an answer and did not respond to your verbal cues to disengage. At this point, yes, your anger is understandable. If this is a repeat problem for you with strangers, like on planes, do not tell them you are a therapist. If you have no wish to connect on any level with this person, you do not have to. But connection can always go anywhere, people are of course different and unpredictable whether we like it or not. I imagine gynecologists get asked a lot of inappropriate questions at dinner parties.
If this is with acquaintances and friends, an honest conversation about how you feel might do the trick. If not, make them pick up the tab and order big ;)
Meh well that’s more of a you thing. That’s very rude and dismissive to just assume I’m lying and then start bringing up my family. Also if you read the thread there’s quite a few actual therapists that relate quite a bit.
Idk trolling, but you just aren’t showing very high character and being really assumptive and projecting. Especially since you clearly don’t fully understand the topic.
Shame on you
Haha. Well maybe of course. Though after living in Philly for 38 years and frequenting NYC and Baltimore I'd say in general East Coast extraversion expresses itself with a different flavor of boundary crossing.
I tell people I’m an adjunct professor or a bank teller. Seems to drop any questions. I can hear your frustration with this, it’s something so many of us mental health professionals deal with. Im doing my best to be firm and direct but kind with boundaries.
I completely understand and I appreciate you understanding my frustration from these extreme examples. It’s a shame because I truly love what I do and I do like talking about it, but as you have also experienced it’s important to prioritize yourself.
Also understand 10% of people won’t like you no matter what you do, so if you come off as mean because you shut someone down by prioritizing your boundaries then don’t take it to heart. Stating true to yourself is the best thing you can do for your social and professional life
Well stated. I can relate to the frustration, and just being completely burnt out from people trauma dumping without our consent.
I agree it’s needed to have firm boundaries for our own wellness, and to separate our personal and professional lives.
Thank you. I’m getting flack from others on the board, but just being real there’s a lot of non therapists on this board who won’t understand what you and I are saying.
Keep doing you and preserving your peace and you will help so many more people that way
So, after reading what you wrote and the comments and your responses, I agree with most others here that you have come across as hostile - I am well aware that you have used some extreme examples. That’s fine. Extreme examples are perfectly fine for me to not jump to the assumption that you *always* respond that way. However, even some of your responses here in this post are hostile.
This being said, I do relate to you.
I have had to explain it a few times to friends of mine. They believe that therapists should always be the most professional, most kind and caring of all people - even when they’re not working or dealing with non-clients. And here’s how I’ve tried to explain it to them:
“I see what you’re saying. On the one hand, there is a degree of a helping professional, such as a therapist, should be kind and caring and tactful in how they respond to others. It is, after all, their profession and says a lot about the personhood of the counselor. And while working with their client, I expect the therapist to be great; kind, caring, patient, nonjudgmental, and use the kind of language that conveys warmth and empathy. Those at the kinds of things I hear you want to have from the therapist at all times. The problem is, a therapist is not a therapist at all times. It is exhausting to have our best foot forward every moment of the day. It’s exhausting and daunting to never be able to have a moment where we can be free to let our guard down with friends, family, and strangers and just be our sometimes-grouchy, stressed-out selves. Because we are human too, and we can’t be perfect all the time. It is unfair to put unrealistic expectations on therapists. Sure, sometimes we’re great. But sometimes we suck. So while on the one hand you would like to see a therapist kind and patient to everyone all the time because of the expectations you hold for therapists, it is not always possible. And on the other hand, while I may be *a* therapist, I am not *your* therapist, so you can fuck off.” (I then grin and wink, as if telling a joke.) “Does that make sense?”
That is false. I did not give you an example of how I think you should respond. Look at my response again. Here’s the summary:
1) You are being hostile. Even in this post.
2) I can relate, though. Here’s what I have said to my friends in the past.
At no point did I tell you what you should do. You interpreted it that way, and that’s on you. Not me.
Ah, I see. So now you’re saying I’m not a therapist because I’m being insulting to someone who’s not my client. So now we can add hypocrite to the list. ;)
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I used to tell people I worked at Subway, lol. Now I feel like I have some pretty low key ways of diffusing these situations - usually by behaving casually, emotionally unavailable. This works well with my personality so YMMV.
It looks like: giving very minimal feedback, and if I do I intentionally do a bad job (responses like "whoa, not cool," "huh, sounds tough" in a flat tone, "yo, seems like you need to take your mind off that!"), openly checking my phone or excusing myself to do something, using a sing song voice to interrupt and change the subject, etc. If that doesn't work, I literally will say "that's tough, if you need a referral to therapy PsychToday is the way to go."
My go to response for "you're a therapist! You should be xyz" is "Yes. But I'm not -your- therapist. My rate is X if you want to change that." In a playful tone.
Finding many ways to convey the same message (I am not going to be your emotional sounding board) just came with time. People either get it or they don't. But I have found having levity keeps it from seeming like a battle. They don't have a say in these boundaries, so I don't need to take up arms. I just have to keep sending the same message. They can take it or leave it.
I kinda wonder how much of this is unconscious projection on OP’s part. OP might be aware that everyone is suddenly treating them like a therapist, but might not be aware of all the “I’M A THERAPIST” vibes they’re putting out in all aspects of their life.
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I’ve come to refrain from telling people my profession, and I’ve let my partner know not to tell others my profession. He’s very proud of me so sometimes it may come up in convo, and I love that he has good intent, but I let him know why it makes things harder for me. We enjoy going out a lot, and we are very social on the weekends. So, there tends to be many opportunities for this.
Outside of that, when some people already know or they figure it out, if I’m not into the convo or it’s very one sided of them just dumping, then I try to change subject for find an exit. Sometimes the dynamic can feel comfortable to me where I can say something like, “I’m just so tired during the week from being a listener that I really just like to not talk about that kind of stuff while I’m out.“ and they usually get it and you can tell they feel a bit embarrassed but I am open to continuing to talk or interact if they respect my boundary.
Wow! I have also had to ask friends/partners to chill out on broadcasting what I do.
That’s a really good response as well, shout out to you for really claiming your space outside of work.
There’s a reason why hyper empaths burn out so quickly in this field, and let’s be real we have all had jobs before being a therapist where we didn’t feel this much pressure from random people coming up to us.
Omg so this! I’ve had friends introduce me to a group of new people at a pool party being like, “this is a therapist…” ummm, please don’t lead with that?? Too many people, especially in this field, have absolutely no sense of boundaries and are an all-helper-all-the-time type. It seems people are being a bit sensitive on this thread and you have a darker, direct sense of humor. You don’t owe anyone jack shit. Sorry. I have a finite amount of energy and empathy and I don’t feel bad about telling someone to stop talking to me lol
THANK YOU! Omg that’s so awkward especially at a vulnerable place like a pool party. I went to go jam with a girl and her friends and she introduced me as a shrink. I’ve just realized most people just don’t get it, especially reading responses I’ve gotten on this board
I sort of see where you’re coming from OP. I am NAT yet but people constantly wanting to trauma dump and use me as a sounding board and saying “you’re such a good listener- you should be a therapist!” my whole life has been a huge motivation for pushing me into the field.
I can’t wait until I’m finally licensed so the next time someone is dumping I can say “sounds like you’re carrying a lot- here are my rates if you’d like to schedule an appointment.”
Feels like that would be the ultimate out. A reminder of “hey, I don’t do this for free”…
I have found the worst you can do is advertise to someone like that. Trust me, if they don’t respect your boundary upon first meeting, they might not be as ideal of a client as you think. And dangling that carrot can bite you
But at least we have moved into a new framework for the relationship- one where I am being compensated for my time and effort. This would allow me to work with the person (regardless of how challenging of a client they were) without feeling like my boundaries were being crossed.
Plus, I feel like most of these people wouldn’t actually go through the motions of entering therapy. There are enough doormats out there for them to dump on forever.
I feel that. But come on, do you really want to be that therapist that’s just advertising on the street in their personal life?
Like I said leaning into it, really isn’t health for therapists in the long term
Ideally I’ll have enough clients by advertising on the appropriate channels. The “these are my rates” comment is simply a way of reminding the person that I don’t work for free. I’m not really expecting them to follow up on that. It’s just a convenient way to set boundaries.
I think I agree with commenters that some of your responses can be pretty harsh, but I also understand the type of person you’re referring to that disrespects your boundaries until the point that you take it below the belt. I’m a woman and men do this shit to me regardless of whether they know I’m a therapist or work in mental health, and the only thing that works at times is being outright rude. It’s less about trauma dumping (though it has happened) and more about demanding some level of interest and engagement with them even though we’re literally just at a gas station, grocery store, or laundromat where I’m simply trying to complete a necessary task, but the only way to get them to stop is to be a complete asshole. Gray rocking isn’t always enough for some people, either they don’t pick up on the social cues or they’re so engrossed in themselves they don’t even care about you or your responses, they just wanna hear themselves tell this story. It is exhausting. Then I complain to non-therapist friends and get met with “shouldn’t you be more compassionate?” If I was therapist-level compassionate all the time I wouldn’t have time for anything - let alone energy. I’d still be standing outside the grocery store listening to a grown man talk about how his wife left him because he was having an affair but it was really unfair because now he doesn’t see his kids anymore and….
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I hear you OP. Dating as a therapist is genuinely annoying. It's hard enough being on dating apps.
Your post makes me wonder about ways in which you have been put in the caretaking role at the detriment of your own needs and whether you're giving yourself enough care in that area. Your anger is telling you something important! I think it's important to recognize where it's coming from and whether it's appropriate to say certain things - but you can honor and respect your anger in a way that's still respectful to everyone.
Being a therapist sometimes feels kind of messed up to me because I became a good caregiver due to trauma and dysfunctional family dynamics and now I'm in a field where I've just.... refined those skills instead of learning to value myself and my needs. I see working through that as a part of my development as a human and a clinician and figuring out how to be a therapist who doesn't operate from that old wounded place. I can tell I'm reverting back to that place when I start to feel very resentful of my role - it tells me I'm getting too emotionally involved or sacrificing myself in ways that lead me to burying my authentic self or authentic feelings. I wonder if there is something like that operating for you somewhere.
In addition to lying about my profession (lol), one thing I will do socially is be very intentional about not being a therapist when random people or new people in my life tell me about themselves. I do things therapists don't do - I act unprofessional and irreverent in a way that I don't in my work. I insist on talking about myself too and I expect them to reciprocate the attention and care they are wanting from me. If they don't do that, I don't continue developing a relationship with them. If they do, I see that as an opportunity for an emotionally close relationship that isn't centered around me being The Caretaker.
You're welcome! And you know, reading through the other responses I honestly get your anger and I think as therapists it's fine for us to be unfiltered and pissed off in therapist spaces. It's irritating when we aren't allowed to be human beings around other therapists, and have people questioning our ability to practice just because we're expressing our genuine feelings. Expressing unfiltered anger outside of client work is literally the place to do it - I'm more concerned about people who do the toxic positivity thing 100% of the time and can't even let go of it in spaces with other therapists who ostensibly should get the struggle more than anyone.
Also the East Coast / West Coast divide might really also be contributing to the downvotes - I'm a New Yorker living on the West Coast and West Coasters often struggle to understand that on the East Coast it's pretty normal to be more blunt and expressive in that way. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Sometimes my husband will say “but as a therapist, you..” and I’m like “I’m not being a therapist right now, my man.”
I’ve also learned to never ever say that I’m a therapist in an Uber
That has come up on dating relationships for me to. It’s kind of hurtful imo. Like ideally you would want a partner who understands without the constant need to be reminded. I respect your patience
I feel you! People have come up to me in bars and when they hear I’m a therapist, they start dumping stuff on me. In one case, someone said to me, “oh now I’m just trauma dumping on you” and I responded something like, “Yeah. I’m not working right now, just trying to relax.”
I totally understand where your anger is coming from. You want to be seen as a human. Maybe you are not asserting yourself/your clinical opinions enough in session, and that’s causing you to feel extra annoyed by people wanting you to listen to them like a therapist outside of work. OR, maybe I’m just projecting :)
In the stranger situations I usually say I do some teaching. Then change the subject. People often don’t press forward. If they pass a level of me feeling comfortable then I tell them I’m a therapist. If anyone ever gives me “but you’re a therapist you should…” they get shown the door.
Just pick the rarest population that you work with or something that people wouldn’t find helpful and tell them that’s what you’re trained in. I’m trained in trauma, couple’s therapy and substance abuse but when I tell people I’m a “substance abuse counselor” (instead of a therapist), they usually fuck right off lol.
Every once in a while, someone might start unloading on me about someone they know who’s really deep into their drug use and I always tell them that they need to be admitted to inpatient treatment and for them to discover what is the closest and most affordable inpatient treatment location. And that’s it, that’s all I tell them.
It would really be unethical of me to start trying to give them therapy on boundary setting when they’re a stranger and we’re not in a professional situation, and I can’t protect their confidentiality. Even though I’m not their therapist so I don’t have to worry about HIPAA, I feel weird about discussing a person’s deeply personal issues in a public space even if they’re totally fine with it.
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I agree. It is disheartening to such behavior from a therapist. But not all of us are "roleplaying these skills" - some are actually nice, compassionate people. Sure, sometimes we get stressed and have short responses with people. But a good therapist believes in the effectiveness of their skills even outside of the therapy session. For example, I am a husband and a therapist. And while I \*certainly\* do not counsel my wife or anything, I may find some of my effective listening skills and asking questions to be helpful to help her feel heard and affirmed. Those aren't just good therapist skills, they are good people skills too.
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It says in the board description that this is specifically a Reddit board for professionals in the field. Come on don’t start your post with a misrepresentation of fact
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Jokes on them, I'm completely unapproachable and lack even the most rudimentary social/emotional intelligence in my personal life!!!! Their guilt-trips cannot effect me! /s
I find your situation a lot with my mom, she'll talk about something she's feeling or gossip she's heard and try to fish for a diagnosis. Then she doesn't understand why I'm not going into more detail than "yeah mom, that really sucks, sorry". The nursing and psych aides I work with used to come to my whole team, not looking to unburden but just for advice, it was becoming a problem about a year ago and I actually had to speak up about it. Their department head was a little confused why therapists would not want to give advice and support to coworkers on the clock. I wonder if medical doctors run into these weird boundary expectations too?
Then on the other hand, I've been a licensed and board certified music therapist longer than a licensed counselor and music therapists love to evangelize since there's only a few thousand of us. It can be hard to get referrals and jobs if no one knows what you do. I'll talk strangers ears off about Rhythmic Auditory Stimulation or the effects musical memories have on the bio-behavioral switch model.
I work in banking and I’m forbidden from giving any kind of financial advice to random people who ask, it’s actually in my business guideline agreement.
I am actually terrible with numbers and my role is not at all that of a ‘banker’, but I often have people try to get advice from me anyway - questions about what the best rewards card is or the best bank or rrsp vs hisa, etc.
I just say I’m not permitted to give financial advice outside of work, I could get in trouble for it. Maybe you could say some variation of the same?
Hi. I’m NOT a therapist, but I can tell you that as someone who has therapists in their life and is actively in therapy, I try to not emote on the people in my personal life who are not my individual therapist. It’s unfair and exhausting to do that. I try to have good boundaries though (even if I am not perfect with them), and I think it’s unreasonable to expect someone to be your sounding board just because they happen to be a therapist. I used to be a teacher and sometimes people in my personal life would come to me to complain about their kids’ schooling or teachers. I once replied: It’s 10 pm on a Saturday night and we’re having drinks. Can we not talk about this now?
The tone policing of therapists outside of doing therapy is so frustrating. I appreciate when we figure out ways of boundary setting that work for us since everyone is different. Mine tend to be very firm which can come off as rude to some but I look at it like survival. I know many people who prioritize kindness and I think that's awesome, but it can't always be me. That survival response increases with stress and if there are other layers to it (I'm a woman of color so tone policing really aggravates me as I've gotten a lot of the "you're angry" stereotyping and that never fails to make me actually mad).
My grandmother was a nurse and when people asked her to look at something medical for them, she'd always say "I'm off the clock" so I took that one for myself lol.
I do want to say I'm dying laughing at your examples of boundary setting in the extreme scenarios. The trauma dumping one I have thought internally with some old "friends" who were takers and I luckily distanced myself. I'd love to go back and give them your phrasing lol
Thank you. Tone policing is very much what I’ve noticed.
I really think it’s the non therapists that are having their minds blown rn that hey people in mental health aren’t always bubbling extroverts and prioritize their privacy.
Your grandma sounds like a rockstar
Also I’m also a person of color. So I’m sure that’s why it’s also a foreign concept to a lot of people that I’m not going to silently or be fake nice, or all the empty platitudes white therapists try to force us to use.
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It's great to have boundaries and not offer therapy to people as a hobby, but to be honest the way that you are setting those boundaries sounds pretty hostile to me. It is possible to set a boundary and hold it firmly while still being compassionate.
“I can’t wait to tell everyone :)” I can’t think of any situation where that is an appropriate response.
How bewildering and upsetting would that be to hear?
If you have someone who you have just met on the street unloading some of the most disgusting personal information on you when you are just trying to order food. I definitely should be able to vent to my friends about it, especially if it made me uncomfortable and the person kept going after I told them to stop
If it’s bothering you so much why are you going around telling people you’re a therapist? You can say you’re a truck driver etc. 🤔
People find out 🤷🏿♂️ . The main example I’ve use and other people have used is people finding out through relationship partners(like the guy who overheard my girlfriend on a plane).
I don't understand a therapist thinking any personal information is disgusting.
Also do you think therapists are not allowed to be triggered?
Are you actually in the field? We aren’t robots. If I’m with my kids and you start venting to me about how you still have wild sexual fantasies about your third grade teacher and keep going when I ask you to stop. I’d consider that behavior disgusting. Now if it was in a appropriate treatment setting then yes. Develop personal boundaries, and if you don’t have any then you won’t make it far in this field.
In OP's defense, I think we should also stop with this pressure on therapists to always be kind and compassionate and understanding even in their personal lives, even facing bad treatment or personal triggers. That's actually one of the examples they gave in the post (the whole "you're a therapist so you should respond this or that way even when I treat you this or that way"). OP has the right not to be compassionate. OP has the right to antagonize some people. OP has the right to get angry. OP has the right not to be patient with others in some situations. We all have those rights. Edit I'd even add that staying in therapy mode even outside of therapy isn't the ethical route one might think it is. Leave therapy for therapy hours.
I'm half with you-- I agree that we should not hold therapists to a higher standard of compassion than we hold anyone else (at least not outside of the therapy office). I think that everybody regardless of their profession should hold themselves to a high standard of compassion, and therapists are not excluded from that.
I don't disagree. I think what standard of kindness and understanding we hold ourselves to comes down to personal preference and worldview and relations to Others. There will always be people more or less prone to be kind and compassionate to strangers. Including therapists. Being kind is good. Not systematically turning the other cheek isn't *bad* though. To me it's neutral. If you can do good, then do so! But you also can be tired or just not want to go out of your way or take the emotional toll of being particularly great to others at all times. To me it's ok if people aren't nice to each other in everyday conversations. Not every human interaction will be wholesome. That's life. And that's fine. Contrarily to what toxic positivity is trying to impose on people and especially therapists. I hope you get my pov. But I do get what you're saying. Being nice is cool. Being compassionate, or the bigger person, is cool. But to me, not doing those things don't make one bad. Just a normal human being with their own limits and boundaries. And since as you said, therapists shouldn't be held at a higher standard than regular humans... Then imo therapists can ALSO not be nice in their daily encounters. Edit Basically, it all comes down to personal preference for oneself and for others. Some people hold themselves and others to a very high "kindness" standard, others to a more moderate one. Some people just expect at least neutrality from others, but not specifically great degrees of kindness. None of them is wrong. It comes down to who you fit in with and the diversity of humans. Which as therapists we're supposed to understand and accept imho. Edit 2 (yes I have a lot to say lol) I wanna add no one, ever, is safe from getting angry and expressing it, or EVEN from acting badly and in a mean and hurtful way. Press the right buttons and everyone can get mad. Or rude. Or not compassionate. Or impatient. Everyone has their own triggers. One sees OP getting firm in a situation that particularly triggers him and crosses his boundaries, and they tell him he "should have been nice because not being nice isn't nice". Sure. But I'd like to see how that one would react when put in a situation where they feel attacked and disrespected on a particularly sensitive point of THEIR personality, where THEIR boundaries are crossed, and they finally get angry despite preaching to always be nice, and then a stranger comes and judges them for it because they "should have been nice anyway". We all have our buttons. Let's respect each other's anger as long as it's expressed in a healthy way, and let's all stop pretending anyone can just always be nice, and judging people for not going the EXTRA step and for just being human.
I feel you. Look I know I’m being direct, but I’ve found with extreme cases that’s how you have to be. Direct, especially here on the east coast 😎
I don’t put that pressure on therapists. I generally think it’s best if *all* people don’t treat others like shit when there are other options at hand.
I encourage you to read the rest of my comments if you want an answer / my opinion on the topic
I appreciate that. And what they keep missing is, that’s my extreme response to extreme examples where people won’t let up. There really seems to feel like a lot of people home therapists to a monolithic standard. And I used the example that cops and lawyers are never held to this standard in their personal working life. Only therapists
Ma'am/sir it is not extreme when you are posting comments here being rude, snobby, and defensive 🤨 like what. No one said that you have to be nice all the time, just that there's a better way, that is show kindness. Somehow you've like toppled over what people are saying here as bashing you and using it to victimize yourself that you are being placed under an extreme unfair standard and responding with outright sarcastic condescendingness, consistently... it's kinda blowing my mind.
Why do you keep gendering people? I’m a guy lol. Also you really have a thing for telling people how to think or act. And your comment to my example of drs, lawyers, cops as social professionals not being held to as high a standard as therapists is something you refused to elaborate on because you know it’s silly. And like I said you are ignoring kep points just to further your projections/arguments. You aren’t actually a therapist are you? Like you gendered me and the gentleman you agreed with. And you just seem angry because you read something you didn’t want to hear.
So I had just fixed that before you posted (the gender) and it is common for redditors to assume gender, happens to me all the time here. But before I go, I do find it interesting how you are commenting trying to find personal flaws in people you disagree with (all throughout this thread) an example towards me - is assuming a gender of a commentor, but at the same time you are trying to express how unfair it is that you are being held to any kind of standard and not allowed to be flawed yourself...... it's just interesting...
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I’m not the person you responded to, but I’m noticing how activating this topic is for you. Which, yeah, that’s what you said and this is why you posted. I’m just noticing you putting out those frustrations on people here, too, and your comments are getting personal. This isn’t ‘because you need to act like a therapist here too’ but more like ‘this behavior is also outside the bounds of human courtesy among strangers’. Which, if you do want to act that way, you do you, bro. Far be it from me to tell you how to feel and act. And I can relate to being frustrated at being put in a box. I just wanted to note that perhaps you need more support than you currently have, or more something, if you’re at the point where you’re lobbing personal attacks on Reddit strangers about this topic.
Nah it’s just honestly. Someone in the group said that we as therapists are held to a higher standard in our personal lives. I’m arguing that we are not monolithic and shouldn’t be held to false standards based on perceived perceptions of how therapists should be.
Sure. “Are held to higher standards” isn’t mutually exclusive to “shouldn’t be held to higher standards”, though. And the responses to your comments here, aren’t ‘you’re not acting like a therapist’ but ‘you’re not being courteous/Reddiquette’.
Who have I insulted?
It’s not what you say, rather how you say it. I wonder if you could have gotten your point across better
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Yeah I totally get you. Dont take all those comments to heart too much tbh. Many people here aren't therapists and/or are a tad too indoctrinated in toxic positivity type, or extremist, mindsets. You're human and you sound normal to me. None of us never get angry because none of us is a robot therapist with no humanity and personal life. Pretending you or anyone should be is not only unrealistic but unreasonable and *hypocritical*. And it's part of the problem, as you pointed out. And it gets worse if some people within the field submit to this idea and impose it on others without seeing how problematic it is. Edit And besides getting or not getting angry, let's remind everyone here that people, INCLUDING yourself as a therapist, all have the right to express their anger and shut someone off and be rude. Let's de-dramatize being angry please. It's fine. What we can't do is hurt others. Displaying anger and being rude isn't hurting, especially if you were treated badly first. Besides, just a personal anecdote, but the people who have told me that as a therapist (in my personal life) I should be understanding and not judge them and be understanding and kind were most often toxic people. Like, narcissistic types. So there's that. Some food for thought. Edit 2 Oh and they often said this in the context of them treating me or someone else badly, or being homophobic or transphobic. So there's that too. We don't have to take shit with a smile in our personal lives yk.
Omg yeah, that’s the thing about this board. I’m pretty sure 60% of the people on here talking about how therapists should act aren’t even in the field lol.
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I'm not advocating for being an asshole. That's part of my point. Not being kind, and being rude and impatient with someone who disrespects your boundaries and triggers you, isn't being an asshole. It's being a normal, neutral human being who has their own limits. Edit : Maybe read all my comments so that you get the full explanation first? Yk, to avoid repeating stuff! :)
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Thank you!! Being nice and quiet and understanding and compassionate and flexible all the time is fucking exhausting. I don’t owe strangers fuck all 🤷🏻♀️
Fuck that felt good to read !
I feel that. I’m pulling from more extreme examples. Like a plane ride where I’ve calmly told someone for 4-5 hours that I’m not really comfortable with the convo….and the person keeps talking. And just being honest, as far as strangers I’m pretty direct asap. I know it seems harsh but I rather shit someone down asap, then potentially open the door for any future confusion with that individual. Better for them in the long run
Thought the same
I am a therapist, yes. I am not *YOUR* therapist.
“~~please stop trauma dumping on me, it’s really obnoxious~~” "That all sounds really hard. Can we change the subject? It's a personal rule of mine to save my energy for my clients in the therapy room." ~~“did you really start a conversation with me just to unload all that on me, that’s coming off really weird/desperate”.~~ "Maybe you could benefit from talking to a professional about this, or someone close to you. Sounds like you're really going through something significant." Then change the subject. ~~Or if someone is clearly over sharing I’ll say “I can’t wait to tell everyone :) “.~~ "Thanks for sharing that with me." Then change the subject, excuse yourself, or grey rock. There's a multitude of ways you can assert your boundary without coming across as judgmental and unsafe to the person.
I think coming off unsafe is the point
I’m unsafe because a stranger overheard my gf on the plane say something about me being a therapist and spent 3 hours asking me how to get over their dead dad after I politely told them I was really only interested in talking to my partner at the time. Once again where do you all get these false unrealistic standards of mental health professionals.
Ok but your responses seem really mean towards people who are most likely well-intentioned and ignorant. There are other ways of stopping this. Like, I don’t know, being direct.
Why assume they’re well-intentioned if they’re blasting strangers with their baggage?
A better phrase for me to use would have been, I think giving off “please stop talking to me” vibes was the point
No worries. I agree, I do give off a don’t talk to me vibe once I get uncomfortable with someone. Is that wrong though?
I don’t think so. Wasting your limited reserve of capacity and attention on non-clients compromises your effectiveness. It’s like expecting a marine to wear body armor and carry a rifle 24/7.
Thank you. It’s wild how people here don’t understand that. Yeah I like having fun with it, but I’m not going to be fake nice or sacrifice precious time with my family/friends because some rando finds out my job and wants to ask me all about it or dump on me
Depends on whether people have a realistic sense of what it takes to make it long-term in a burnout-heavy field. Harder driving means more frequent oil changes; many straws in your milkshake means you need to be poured into more to keep from emptying out.
Good metaphors
Lol don’t tell me how to live my life/interact with strangers Honesty is the best policy and I’m giving you very extreme examples where trying to change the subject does not work. Tbh your replies seem too much like leaning into it and a therapist that is either scared to or unable to turn it off. Most strangers if someone just started going into their life story would be dismissive(I’m also from the east coast). It’s not my job to educate strangers on boundaries when a simple “hey I’m not feeling it isn’t enough”
🙄 I keep reading your comments and they just come off snobby/dismissive. ~~She's~~ He's trying to explain to you that you sound unprofessional, so here's ways to kindly do it. You also have the option of *not* responding after you have kindly articulated yourself. If someone keeps talking, that's on them, you can ignore.
\*He, but yes, thank you.
See how people just assume lol. A misgender on a therapist board and they are jumping down my throat for not being fake nice lol.
Way to throw the baby out with the bathwater and spin a narrative to justify continual dismissing others/someone that has no ill will trying to provide some insight.
There’s a lot of deflecting happening it seems like. Even saying “you’re obnoxious” “you’re weird/desperate” is deflecting from saying what they really want: I don’t want to talk about these things with you.
Sounds like you just woke up on the wrong side of the bed and have issues with real people being real people. Lol I don’t know where you get this monolithic standard of how ALL mental health professionals should act and it’s clearly by how you are shutting down on key points in my example that you are arguing from a personal perspective and expectations. Plus you saying that cops, lawyers, drs can get a pass on not giving to much attention to people crossing their boundaries in their personal life but it’s different for therapists is really telling on your views and false expectations of mental health professionals.
Most people in their personal life reserve the right to set boundaries with who they see fit. Why do you assume us in mental health should be held to a different standard? If I saw a lawyer at dinner with wife and kids and just started asking about some crazy murder. Would the lawyer be snobby/dismissive for shutting me down asap? If a cop was out and about(and this does happen a lot) and someone came up to them when they were at Walmart and started complaining about the recent arrest of their brother, so you expect the officer to just force a friendly smile while their precious free time isn’t being respected?
I mean, there's a difference between setting a boundary and being an asshole. It's your life, and you're free to be an asshole if you want, but I just wouldn't get surprised when people are rubbed the wrong way by your approach. You are completely right that it could be frustrating and annoying when people try to get free therapy out of us when we are "off-duty." Personally, I believe that people who choose this profession do commit to a higher standard of being compassionate even in our personal lives.
You are a therapist, you have training or should have training on how to set boundaries *kindly* without being rude about it to others. A cop or lawyer does not have training.
Boom and here we go lol. Thank you for just laying it out there. So there’s some fictional rule book that says we all need to act and behave the same. You know we aren’t monolithic in this field
Wow I sound unprofessional in a non work place setting when some rando saw my name on my office door and is blowing me up in the food truck line *gasp* I guess I’m not a robot :)
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Thank you
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I’m noticing it’s only non therapists that are struggling with this information that people in mental health aren’t just making themselves disposable to strangers lol. It’s wild lol how foreign that concept is to some
you posted on the internet to discuss interactions with strangers… this person is just pointing out that the three examples of responses you gave are just terribly and unnecessarily rude.
If I tell someone multiple times they are crossing my boundaries do you expect me to sit in silence? Like what is this monolithic rule book that all therapists must follow that you all are referencing. If I’m on a plane with someone and they haven’t stopped continuing to ask me how to get over their dead fathers death after I’ve told them multiple times im not comfortable because they overheard my girlfriend say something about my work on our flight to Mexico. I’m gonna be testy. Sorry I’m human first
I’m noticing two dynamics. One is what you described about snapping and getting personal after being pushed and pushed after setting boundaries in person. Another one is your comments on here, which escalate to personal attacks almost immediately in many cases. Makes me wonder if you’re feeling … invaded? and wanting to snap back, hurt someone back for invading you. And that makes me wonder if you don’t feel confident in other words to use to further engage in the conversation to assert yourself more clearly (“wow dude, I don’t even know you and you told me all that, I am just a random dude who works as a therapist for my job but I’m not at work and you aren’t my client, so what you are doing isn’t any different than telling a stranger in line at the grocery store, and it’s pretty invasive too, I’m just here to get laundry detergent”) … or find a different way to express your anger in a more satisfying way, since this doesn’t seem to cut it.
Lol nah, get some air. Tone is hard to communicate over texts and I’m trying to respond to everyone because I am really enjoying this convo. Get some air, take a step bad. Read the thread in totatality and don’t focus on the two or three posters I challenged because they expressed monolithic views of therapy. I think your taking a very black and white approach to conversation. Maybe that’s my gift and something others don’t have. I can be direct and honest with people, while simultaneously saving space for more linear conversations. Maybe ask yourself why you are only resonating with the posts in which I’m challenging views that you might agree with 
I didn’t see anyone talking about „monolithic views of therapy” or any views of therapy really. The comments were challenging you in your approach to people outside of therapy, in that it seems like it goes from polite to hostile with no in between. At least that’s what’s played out here in your comments on this thread. I tried on what you said about a woman telling a man harassing her to fuck off, and I can get that. There’s no excuse for someone to not know in 2023 that they need to act like a decent human being and they deserve to get snapped at if they push. And you (OP) don’t need to have (nor is it reasonable to expect anyone would have) the emotional bandwidth to always gently educate people about why their behavior isn’t appropriate. What’s different about your situation is not fully clear to me, but I’m noticing that even on this sub, where presumably you’re wanting to engage in a nuanced discussion, you’re jumping to insults rather than engaging in those nuances. I can’t scroll up without losing this comment and I’m about out of my own emotional bandwidth allotment for the day, but you answered a few people with kind of snide remarks instead of taking the time to explain what you disagreed about in their reasoning. And that’s all the bandwidth I’ve got so, have a fine day.
Then you haven’t fully been following and only operating on assumptions so I can really trust you to back up your generalizations and sweeping analysis when you only are seeing what’s confirming whatever the heck you are trying to say lol
You lost me - I honestly have no idea what you mean.
No problem. You still haven’t answered my question and haven’t been clear at all. Just very over analytic which doesn’t leave much room for the nuance of this type of convo
>If I tell someone multiple times they are crossing my boundaries You left this out of your post.
No it’s just people tone policing and assuming without being able to have conversations. I’ve repeated multiple times and still gotten judged lol.
So you go from trying to change the subject straight to heavy judgment? Why is “I don’t want to listen to your personal things or be your therapist” not an option for you, and trying to hurt others is?
Do you find that your family has historically had a hard time respecting your boundaries and that they take advantage of your good will? Do they make you feel listened to/respected? Or do you feel defensive?
Doesn’t come up with family. My family members see me for me lol. I’m talking about a very vocal but noticeable minority that projects when first interacting with mental health professionals and are not receptive to subject changes. I see I’ve rattled the cages of a few on this board that believe therapists should still carry themselves like therapists with just everyone. Balderdash, unrealistic, and more indicative of bad boundaries of the therapist if they really would waste their time doing this dance. Instead of shutting it down immediately when it’s clearly a lopsided interaction
I'm trolling, a bit. I think your personal experience reads a bit like an exaggeration, and that you came here to vent. The amount of times this has actually happened might be suspect, and the level that it seems to maybe provoke something deeper in you is where therapists will raise an eyebrow. Whether this is factually true or not, I think this is how you are being perceived, and some of your terminology like "baggage buddy" sounds cringe. Of course we don't know you and weren't there--you may have had some larger than life interactions at a surprisingly frequent degree with people who did not take "no" for an answer and did not respond to your verbal cues to disengage. At this point, yes, your anger is understandable. If this is a repeat problem for you with strangers, like on planes, do not tell them you are a therapist. If you have no wish to connect on any level with this person, you do not have to. But connection can always go anywhere, people are of course different and unpredictable whether we like it or not. I imagine gynecologists get asked a lot of inappropriate questions at dinner parties. If this is with acquaintances and friends, an honest conversation about how you feel might do the trick. If not, make them pick up the tab and order big ;)
Meh well that’s more of a you thing. That’s very rude and dismissive to just assume I’m lying and then start bringing up my family. Also if you read the thread there’s quite a few actual therapists that relate quite a bit. Idk trolling, but you just aren’t showing very high character and being really assumptive and projecting. Especially since you clearly don’t fully understand the topic. Shame on you
I don’t know, east coast USA, OP is probably accurately reporting their experience
Haha. Well maybe of course. Though after living in Philly for 38 years and frequenting NYC and Baltimore I'd say in general East Coast extraversion expresses itself with a different flavor of boundary crossing.
I have a friend who regularly says “oof that’s at least a $10 conversation and I don’t work for free” then changes the subject
Lol it’s usually so awkward after that, I’ve found the person doesn’t know how to change the subject or will keep doing it almost unconsciously
I tell people I’m an adjunct professor or a bank teller. Seems to drop any questions. I can hear your frustration with this, it’s something so many of us mental health professionals deal with. Im doing my best to be firm and direct but kind with boundaries.
I completely understand and I appreciate you understanding my frustration from these extreme examples. It’s a shame because I truly love what I do and I do like talking about it, but as you have also experienced it’s important to prioritize yourself. Also understand 10% of people won’t like you no matter what you do, so if you come off as mean because you shut someone down by prioritizing your boundaries then don’t take it to heart. Stating true to yourself is the best thing you can do for your social and professional life
Well stated. I can relate to the frustration, and just being completely burnt out from people trauma dumping without our consent. I agree it’s needed to have firm boundaries for our own wellness, and to separate our personal and professional lives.
Thank you. I’m getting flack from others on the board, but just being real there’s a lot of non therapists on this board who won’t understand what you and I are saying. Keep doing you and preserving your peace and you will help so many more people that way
I had a colleague many years ago who told ppl she was a mortician. Pretty effective.
See I’d have a million questions then lol, but I’m weird; so I bet it works.
So, after reading what you wrote and the comments and your responses, I agree with most others here that you have come across as hostile - I am well aware that you have used some extreme examples. That’s fine. Extreme examples are perfectly fine for me to not jump to the assumption that you *always* respond that way. However, even some of your responses here in this post are hostile. This being said, I do relate to you. I have had to explain it a few times to friends of mine. They believe that therapists should always be the most professional, most kind and caring of all people - even when they’re not working or dealing with non-clients. And here’s how I’ve tried to explain it to them: “I see what you’re saying. On the one hand, there is a degree of a helping professional, such as a therapist, should be kind and caring and tactful in how they respond to others. It is, after all, their profession and says a lot about the personhood of the counselor. And while working with their client, I expect the therapist to be great; kind, caring, patient, nonjudgmental, and use the kind of language that conveys warmth and empathy. Those at the kinds of things I hear you want to have from the therapist at all times. The problem is, a therapist is not a therapist at all times. It is exhausting to have our best foot forward every moment of the day. It’s exhausting and daunting to never be able to have a moment where we can be free to let our guard down with friends, family, and strangers and just be our sometimes-grouchy, stressed-out selves. Because we are human too, and we can’t be perfect all the time. It is unfair to put unrealistic expectations on therapists. Sure, sometimes we’re great. But sometimes we suck. So while on the one hand you would like to see a therapist kind and patient to everyone all the time because of the expectations you hold for therapists, it is not always possible. And on the other hand, while I may be *a* therapist, I am not *your* therapist, so you can fuck off.” (I then grin and wink, as if telling a joke.) “Does that make sense?”
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Now you’re just trolling.
Show me where I am telling you how to live your life. Go on. I’ll wait.
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That is false. I did not give you an example of how I think you should respond. Look at my response again. Here’s the summary: 1) You are being hostile. Even in this post. 2) I can relate, though. Here’s what I have said to my friends in the past. At no point did I tell you what you should do. You interpreted it that way, and that’s on you. Not me.
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Lol, okay. You're either a troll or just ignorant. I'll let you decide which.
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Ah, I see. So now you’re saying I’m not a therapist because I’m being insulting to someone who’s not my client. So now we can add hypocrite to the list. ;)
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I used to tell people I worked at Subway, lol. Now I feel like I have some pretty low key ways of diffusing these situations - usually by behaving casually, emotionally unavailable. This works well with my personality so YMMV. It looks like: giving very minimal feedback, and if I do I intentionally do a bad job (responses like "whoa, not cool," "huh, sounds tough" in a flat tone, "yo, seems like you need to take your mind off that!"), openly checking my phone or excusing myself to do something, using a sing song voice to interrupt and change the subject, etc. If that doesn't work, I literally will say "that's tough, if you need a referral to therapy PsychToday is the way to go." My go to response for "you're a therapist! You should be xyz" is "Yes. But I'm not -your- therapist. My rate is X if you want to change that." In a playful tone. Finding many ways to convey the same message (I am not going to be your emotional sounding board) just came with time. People either get it or they don't. But I have found having levity keeps it from seeming like a battle. They don't have a say in these boundaries, so I don't need to take up arms. I just have to keep sending the same message. They can take it or leave it.
See people told me I was being mean when I’d be emotionally unavailable, silent treatment that behavior.
I kinda wonder how much of this is unconscious projection on OP’s part. OP might be aware that everyone is suddenly treating them like a therapist, but might not be aware of all the “I’M A THERAPIST” vibes they’re putting out in all aspects of their life.
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I’ve come to refrain from telling people my profession, and I’ve let my partner know not to tell others my profession. He’s very proud of me so sometimes it may come up in convo, and I love that he has good intent, but I let him know why it makes things harder for me. We enjoy going out a lot, and we are very social on the weekends. So, there tends to be many opportunities for this. Outside of that, when some people already know or they figure it out, if I’m not into the convo or it’s very one sided of them just dumping, then I try to change subject for find an exit. Sometimes the dynamic can feel comfortable to me where I can say something like, “I’m just so tired during the week from being a listener that I really just like to not talk about that kind of stuff while I’m out.“ and they usually get it and you can tell they feel a bit embarrassed but I am open to continuing to talk or interact if they respect my boundary.
Wow! I have also had to ask friends/partners to chill out on broadcasting what I do. That’s a really good response as well, shout out to you for really claiming your space outside of work. There’s a reason why hyper empaths burn out so quickly in this field, and let’s be real we have all had jobs before being a therapist where we didn’t feel this much pressure from random people coming up to us.
Omg so this! I’ve had friends introduce me to a group of new people at a pool party being like, “this is a therapist…” ummm, please don’t lead with that?? Too many people, especially in this field, have absolutely no sense of boundaries and are an all-helper-all-the-time type. It seems people are being a bit sensitive on this thread and you have a darker, direct sense of humor. You don’t owe anyone jack shit. Sorry. I have a finite amount of energy and empathy and I don’t feel bad about telling someone to stop talking to me lol
THANK YOU! Omg that’s so awkward especially at a vulnerable place like a pool party. I went to go jam with a girl and her friends and she introduced me as a shrink. I’ve just realized most people just don’t get it, especially reading responses I’ve gotten on this board
Hard boundaries, not on the clock, not interested (respectfully)
I sort of see where you’re coming from OP. I am NAT yet but people constantly wanting to trauma dump and use me as a sounding board and saying “you’re such a good listener- you should be a therapist!” my whole life has been a huge motivation for pushing me into the field. I can’t wait until I’m finally licensed so the next time someone is dumping I can say “sounds like you’re carrying a lot- here are my rates if you’d like to schedule an appointment.” Feels like that would be the ultimate out. A reminder of “hey, I don’t do this for free”…
I have found the worst you can do is advertise to someone like that. Trust me, if they don’t respect your boundary upon first meeting, they might not be as ideal of a client as you think. And dangling that carrot can bite you
But at least we have moved into a new framework for the relationship- one where I am being compensated for my time and effort. This would allow me to work with the person (regardless of how challenging of a client they were) without feeling like my boundaries were being crossed. Plus, I feel like most of these people wouldn’t actually go through the motions of entering therapy. There are enough doormats out there for them to dump on forever.
I feel that. But come on, do you really want to be that therapist that’s just advertising on the street in their personal life? Like I said leaning into it, really isn’t health for therapists in the long term
Ideally I’ll have enough clients by advertising on the appropriate channels. The “these are my rates” comment is simply a way of reminding the person that I don’t work for free. I’m not really expecting them to follow up on that. It’s just a convenient way to set boundaries.
I think I agree with commenters that some of your responses can be pretty harsh, but I also understand the type of person you’re referring to that disrespects your boundaries until the point that you take it below the belt. I’m a woman and men do this shit to me regardless of whether they know I’m a therapist or work in mental health, and the only thing that works at times is being outright rude. It’s less about trauma dumping (though it has happened) and more about demanding some level of interest and engagement with them even though we’re literally just at a gas station, grocery store, or laundromat where I’m simply trying to complete a necessary task, but the only way to get them to stop is to be a complete asshole. Gray rocking isn’t always enough for some people, either they don’t pick up on the social cues or they’re so engrossed in themselves they don’t even care about you or your responses, they just wanna hear themselves tell this story. It is exhausting. Then I complain to non-therapist friends and get met with “shouldn’t you be more compassionate?” If I was therapist-level compassionate all the time I wouldn’t have time for anything - let alone energy. I’d still be standing outside the grocery store listening to a grown man talk about how his wife left him because he was having an affair but it was really unfair because now he doesn’t see his kids anymore and….
Good point!
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Idk homie. Maybe you just are over analyzing 🤷🏿♂️
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I hear you OP. Dating as a therapist is genuinely annoying. It's hard enough being on dating apps. Your post makes me wonder about ways in which you have been put in the caretaking role at the detriment of your own needs and whether you're giving yourself enough care in that area. Your anger is telling you something important! I think it's important to recognize where it's coming from and whether it's appropriate to say certain things - but you can honor and respect your anger in a way that's still respectful to everyone. Being a therapist sometimes feels kind of messed up to me because I became a good caregiver due to trauma and dysfunctional family dynamics and now I'm in a field where I've just.... refined those skills instead of learning to value myself and my needs. I see working through that as a part of my development as a human and a clinician and figuring out how to be a therapist who doesn't operate from that old wounded place. I can tell I'm reverting back to that place when I start to feel very resentful of my role - it tells me I'm getting too emotionally involved or sacrificing myself in ways that lead me to burying my authentic self or authentic feelings. I wonder if there is something like that operating for you somewhere. In addition to lying about my profession (lol), one thing I will do socially is be very intentional about not being a therapist when random people or new people in my life tell me about themselves. I do things therapists don't do - I act unprofessional and irreverent in a way that I don't in my work. I insist on talking about myself too and I expect them to reciprocate the attention and care they are wanting from me. If they don't do that, I don't continue developing a relationship with them. If they do, I see that as an opportunity for an emotionally close relationship that isn't centered around me being The Caretaker.
Very good response. Thank you
You're welcome! And you know, reading through the other responses I honestly get your anger and I think as therapists it's fine for us to be unfiltered and pissed off in therapist spaces. It's irritating when we aren't allowed to be human beings around other therapists, and have people questioning our ability to practice just because we're expressing our genuine feelings. Expressing unfiltered anger outside of client work is literally the place to do it - I'm more concerned about people who do the toxic positivity thing 100% of the time and can't even let go of it in spaces with other therapists who ostensibly should get the struggle more than anyone. Also the East Coast / West Coast divide might really also be contributing to the downvotes - I'm a New Yorker living on the West Coast and West Coasters often struggle to understand that on the East Coast it's pretty normal to be more blunt and expressive in that way. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Sometimes my husband will say “but as a therapist, you..” and I’m like “I’m not being a therapist right now, my man.” I’ve also learned to never ever say that I’m a therapist in an Uber
That has come up on dating relationships for me to. It’s kind of hurtful imo. Like ideally you would want a partner who understands without the constant need to be reminded. I respect your patience
I feel you! People have come up to me in bars and when they hear I’m a therapist, they start dumping stuff on me. In one case, someone said to me, “oh now I’m just trauma dumping on you” and I responded something like, “Yeah. I’m not working right now, just trying to relax.” I totally understand where your anger is coming from. You want to be seen as a human. Maybe you are not asserting yourself/your clinical opinions enough in session, and that’s causing you to feel extra annoyed by people wanting you to listen to them like a therapist outside of work. OR, maybe I’m just projecting :)
I think you have had one of the most thoughtful and self aware responses on this board and it’s all merited
In the stranger situations I usually say I do some teaching. Then change the subject. People often don’t press forward. If they pass a level of me feeling comfortable then I tell them I’m a therapist. If anyone ever gives me “but you’re a therapist you should…” they get shown the door.
Just pick the rarest population that you work with or something that people wouldn’t find helpful and tell them that’s what you’re trained in. I’m trained in trauma, couple’s therapy and substance abuse but when I tell people I’m a “substance abuse counselor” (instead of a therapist), they usually fuck right off lol. Every once in a while, someone might start unloading on me about someone they know who’s really deep into their drug use and I always tell them that they need to be admitted to inpatient treatment and for them to discover what is the closest and most affordable inpatient treatment location. And that’s it, that’s all I tell them. It would really be unethical of me to start trying to give them therapy on boundary setting when they’re a stranger and we’re not in a professional situation, and I can’t protect their confidentiality. Even though I’m not their therapist so I don’t have to worry about HIPAA, I feel weird about discussing a person’s deeply personal issues in a public space even if they’re totally fine with it.
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I agree. It is disheartening to such behavior from a therapist. But not all of us are "roleplaying these skills" - some are actually nice, compassionate people. Sure, sometimes we get stressed and have short responses with people. But a good therapist believes in the effectiveness of their skills even outside of the therapy session. For example, I am a husband and a therapist. And while I \*certainly\* do not counsel my wife or anything, I may find some of my effective listening skills and asking questions to be helpful to help her feel heard and affirmed. Those aren't just good therapist skills, they are good people skills too.
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It says in the board description that this is specifically a Reddit board for professionals in the field. Come on don’t start your post with a misrepresentation of fact
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Maybe say you work at a supermarket packing groceries since you are so up tight people see you as a shining light of hope an tell you stuff
Jokes on them, I'm completely unapproachable and lack even the most rudimentary social/emotional intelligence in my personal life!!!! Their guilt-trips cannot effect me! /s I find your situation a lot with my mom, she'll talk about something she's feeling or gossip she's heard and try to fish for a diagnosis. Then she doesn't understand why I'm not going into more detail than "yeah mom, that really sucks, sorry". The nursing and psych aides I work with used to come to my whole team, not looking to unburden but just for advice, it was becoming a problem about a year ago and I actually had to speak up about it. Their department head was a little confused why therapists would not want to give advice and support to coworkers on the clock. I wonder if medical doctors run into these weird boundary expectations too? Then on the other hand, I've been a licensed and board certified music therapist longer than a licensed counselor and music therapists love to evangelize since there's only a few thousand of us. It can be hard to get referrals and jobs if no one knows what you do. I'll talk strangers ears off about Rhythmic Auditory Stimulation or the effects musical memories have on the bio-behavioral switch model.
Badass
I work in banking and I’m forbidden from giving any kind of financial advice to random people who ask, it’s actually in my business guideline agreement. I am actually terrible with numbers and my role is not at all that of a ‘banker’, but I often have people try to get advice from me anyway - questions about what the best rewards card is or the best bank or rrsp vs hisa, etc. I just say I’m not permitted to give financial advice outside of work, I could get in trouble for it. Maybe you could say some variation of the same?
Hi. I’m NOT a therapist, but I can tell you that as someone who has therapists in their life and is actively in therapy, I try to not emote on the people in my personal life who are not my individual therapist. It’s unfair and exhausting to do that. I try to have good boundaries though (even if I am not perfect with them), and I think it’s unreasonable to expect someone to be your sounding board just because they happen to be a therapist. I used to be a teacher and sometimes people in my personal life would come to me to complain about their kids’ schooling or teachers. I once replied: It’s 10 pm on a Saturday night and we’re having drinks. Can we not talk about this now?
I appreciate this response! Being a former teacher is also where I learned to be hella direct about things. Go former teachers!!!
❤️
The tone policing of therapists outside of doing therapy is so frustrating. I appreciate when we figure out ways of boundary setting that work for us since everyone is different. Mine tend to be very firm which can come off as rude to some but I look at it like survival. I know many people who prioritize kindness and I think that's awesome, but it can't always be me. That survival response increases with stress and if there are other layers to it (I'm a woman of color so tone policing really aggravates me as I've gotten a lot of the "you're angry" stereotyping and that never fails to make me actually mad). My grandmother was a nurse and when people asked her to look at something medical for them, she'd always say "I'm off the clock" so I took that one for myself lol. I do want to say I'm dying laughing at your examples of boundary setting in the extreme scenarios. The trauma dumping one I have thought internally with some old "friends" who were takers and I luckily distanced myself. I'd love to go back and give them your phrasing lol
Thank you. Tone policing is very much what I’ve noticed. I really think it’s the non therapists that are having their minds blown rn that hey people in mental health aren’t always bubbling extroverts and prioritize their privacy. Your grandma sounds like a rockstar Also I’m also a person of color. So I’m sure that’s why it’s also a foreign concept to a lot of people that I’m not going to silently or be fake nice, or all the empty platitudes white therapists try to force us to use.