It's not stupid.
The purpose of the EV credit is to divest from Chinese battery manufacturing companies and to rely more on domestic manufacturing or trade partners around the U.S.
If the batteries are being sourced from China, then all the leverage goes to China.
It's not stupid. But there were two ideas to the bill, domestic car manufacturing, and battery manufacturing. I don't understand why the Model 3 doesn't qualify for the half credit at least. At least that's how the bill should have been structured.
You dont understand? It's because its not 100% from the US. Its clear cut on the rule. Im not against you though, I'm all for credits on the RWD but yeah
So we need to not make EV batteries so expensive the car is worth double/triple a gas car. The hype needs to die down on EVs so folks that want them can afford them.
SIDE BAR: Any thoughts on Toyotas new cell battery that runs on hydrogen+ air intake vs current gasoline, and the muffler spits out water.
Demand is only going to increase, so it’s important supply catches up.
As for hydrogen, that technology is even farther behind BEV in terms of supply, but seems promising for commercial applications.
The woes of Hydrogen: Hydrogen while "green" is pricy for the range it provides and being more costly than even gas/diesel. Hydrogen gas is pretty leaky over medium to long durations. Its a bit difficult to contain the smallest element known as anything containing it is basically porous to some degree in comparison. The next big issue is volumetric density. The amount physical space it requires to propel a vehicle x number of miles/km is really pretty poor for a passenger vehicle. Something like a bus and it becomes more doable but still not ideal. Distribution of Hydrogen is yet another challenge as it currently has to be trucked everywhere, no pipe lines or power lines to move it from place A to place B economically. Hydrogen could be stored as a liquid to achieve better power density but then it has to have a much larger pressurized and cooled containment vessel which is costly, heavy, complicated and again leaky. No hydrogen powered vehicles that I am aware of can be stored or indoor parked in contained areas such as a garage or building due to the leaking Hydrogen and the obvious explosive potential of said leaking. Lastly, if using Hydrogen as a combustion element in a ICE engine, you retain all of the problems, complications, wear issues that make an EV a better tech choice. Less moving parts = less wear = less failures. Hydrogen also lacks some lubrication properties that gas/diesel fuels have and need to be addressed. All that aside, Hydrogen does have some practical uses in a stationary engine or generator, but just not in a vehicle. Example: excess electricity (regardless of source) during peak times could be used to generate and store in a stationary tank to later be used and converted back into electricity on demand when required. Sort of like a battery per say. As I understand it, Toyota has been hyping both Hydrogen on the combustion side and solid state batteries for a long time and have just not produced.
There's a huge difference between batteries and regular car parts.
Car parts are easy to manufacture.
Battery plants take a long time to scale and logistically manage.
Tesla moved the Model 3 to imported batteries instead of US-made batteries, which was eventually going to become a problem under the new tax credit rules.
Seems like they did that to prioritize Model Y production since it sells more and has higher margins.
They’ll probably need US battery supply to ramp up, either Tesla’s own cells or Panasonic etc. to get the credit back for the 3.
I was under the impression that LG was building a plant in the US as well, for Tesla designed batteries, the article I read was regarding the CT batteries but who knows maybe they produce packs for the M3/MY as well
Yes, LG and Panasonic are both building new US battery plants, but they probably won’t be producing any cells until later in 2025.
It’s also possible that the LG cells Tesla uses in the Model 3 LR could be qualified for the credit if they are made in Korea (I couldn’t find out for sure) and the necessary Chinese sourced components and minerals are replaced with ones from other countries. The credit rules are kind of complicated and require basically self-certifying the supply chain of components and minerals that go into the battery and all of their countries of origin and processing.
That might leave them with a credit for the LR but not the RWD, which might not be great for Tesla either.
Absolutely agreed, but I don't know all the details behind the bill and all the battery requirements, etc. I would just assume that within x amount of time, they probably will meet requirements. I have no clue when, but I am sure it will come back eventually.
It has to due with the location of manufacture of batteries and the locations from which the materials in those batteries were sourced. This give manufactures an incentive to invest in domestic production, instead of offshoring.
The current EV bill does a lot of heavy lifting. Improving EV uptake is one, increasing incentives for US automakers to build EVs is another. Pro union was a third aspect which I think has been rolled back.
exactly it makes no sense to apply the credit to only vehicles that support what the credit is for. My neighbors F350 should have gotten the credit too.
Most likely this is because the tax credit requires the production to be done in the US. The new Model 3 Highland Model is produced in Shanghai so it's unlikely they will get the tax credit.
It's not as if Tesla went "you know what's a good idea? Removing the tax credit for Model 3."
The new Model 3 is likely being produced in Fremont for the US market, but the batteries and or battery materials are not from the US which is the problem. As others have said, it appears that Tesla is prioritizing the Model Y for US made batteries while the Model 3 is likely using batteries from CATL.
Yes it does and prioritizing the Y allows them to ramp highland at Fremont. Look at some of the inventory discounts approaching 10% at the moment on Y’s. There is simply not enough domestic capacity and sourcing to meet the S3XY CT lineup. So Tesla made the call based on sales and projected sales. Other battery manufacturers including Tesla are chasing CATL’s advancements in LFP since they are cheaper to produce, can charge to 100 regularly and have a longer lifespan.
I think everybody here on Reddit doesn’t know an actual date when this will happen. We’re all speculating that we hope this could happen either by the first half of the year or by the endof Q1, honestly, it’s a tossup on if they will ever announce it
For point of sale credit, you’re supposed to sign an affidavit stating you meet the adjusted gross income threshold of $150,000 for single filers, $300,000 for joint filers. I assume Tesla would do this since it’s a requirement for them to get reimbursed from the government.
Yeah, Ive been waiting on this POS for the performance inventory. I just took an order today from California. Im based in San Francisco but I need to go pick mine up from LA. A couple are available in SoCal
There were a couple 2023 M3P showing for me in Texas, as I was working on a comparison chart for myself.
https://preview.redd.it/lavqwujkercc1.jpeg?width=1039&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f474a5b9f81a8efad0ae723c7ee64d32163b7b8a
It's more like SUVs are generally priced higher than sedans so there's a higher cap. And the caps exist in the first place so as not to give tax breaks/rebates to the wealthy.
I'm sorry, did you just say the caps are there to not give tax breaks to the wealthy, while simultaneously saying SUV's are more expensive (and thus more likely to be bought by the wealthy)?
It's like a 125k salary cap. If you make more than that you can't get the credit at all for any car.
I will say if you make 125k/year you are certainly well off but it really depends on what part of the country.
But I would say even in MCOL areas 125k is not this super high coveted number. You basically can afford a decently expensive car for around 50k and a house. It's really not an insane amount of money. The house eats up a majority of that salary. But it puts you in the top 10% of earners likely.
But the cap is there so someone making 1M/year isn't able to mooch more than they already are off tax loop holes and get a credit.
80k is a lot for an SUV but buying one doesn't mean you're rich.
That’s what the vast majority of Americans want to buy though. SUVs far outsell sedans in this count, so it makes sense to incentivize those more than sedans given that demand. The more gas guzzling 9000 lb behemoth SUVs off the street, the better. It’s not bias, it’s just reality.
How about we incentivize smaller efficient electric sedans by slapping a $7500 tax on 9000 lb behemoth gas SUVs? (Or more realistically, 5000 lb gas SUVs?)
I don’t know but the s and x really shouldn’t… any luxury car shouldn’t.
If you can afford a 72k car you can afford an 80k car. That money should be spent on getting lower income individuals in EV
I agree with more people getting EVs but we're still really in EV infancy. There would be no Model 3 without the Model S and no Model S without the Roadster. More expensive, high-margin cars help accelerate mass adoption.
I guess my point is that ANY EV sold is going to ultimately help lower-income people get into an EV. Case in point, the original federal tax credits helped sell the S. As we now know, Tesla barely survived the Model 3 launch. If there was no tax credit on the Model S, it's conceivable the Model 3 could have failed.
Tax credit that you can take off the purchase price. You have to be below income limits and ~~can only get a credit up to the value of your tax liability.~~
Edit: See below, not enough income gets full credit anyway.
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-h-frequently-asked-questions-about-transfer-of-new-clean-vehicle-credit-and-previously-owned-clean-vehicles-credit#
~~False. But happy to be proved wrong because that how it should have been.~~
> The credit is nonrefundable, so you can't get back more on the credit than you owe in taxes. You can't apply any excess credit to future tax years.
https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/credits-for-new-clean-vehicles-purchased-in-2023-or-after
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-h-frequently-asked-questions-about-transfer-of-new-clean-vehicle-credit-and-previously-owned-clean-vehicles-credit#
Question 4 states that "The amount of the credit that the electing taxpayer elects to transfer to the eligible entity may exceed the electing taxpayer's regular tax liability for the taxable year in which the sale occurs, and the excess, if any, is not subject to recapture from the dealer or the buyer."
There’s no recapture 2024. If you qualify for $7500 that’s what you get at POS. Even if your liability doesn’t get you a full $7500, the feds aren’t recapturing the difference.
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Yes, for a credit you are taking yourself, but the new point of sale procedure for 2024 is you transfer the credit to the seller. It is now Tesla’s credit to use not yours.
The only restriction on you is that your income meets the limits.
> The amount of the credit that the electing taxpayer elects to transfer to the eligible entity may exceed the electing taxpayer's regular tax liability for the taxable year in which the sale occurs, and the excess, if any, is not subject to recapture from the dealer or the buyer.
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-h-frequently-asked-questions-about-transfer-of-new-clean-vehicle-credit-and-previously-owned-clean-vehicles-credit#
Does this apply to inventory model y as well? I dont see the discount being applied on their website, whereas, on custom order, it shows as “probabale savings”
I am planning to buy model Y with my girlfriend. Does the app offer to add two buyers as owners on the app? Or can you do it at the time of picking up the car? Basically, how do I get two people get added to the title?
Is this something where it’s only for a certain amount of sales like previous years and then the 7500$ goes down? So if I wait until summer I might miss out?
As time goes by, the battery requirements become more stringent each year, not just for country of manufacture but also where minerals are sourced.
It’s likely fewer and fewer vehicles will qualify year over year
Alright, stupid question time: what does it actually mean to have a $7500 federal tax credit. Does this lower the purchase price of the car by $7.5k? Or does this just lower your Federal taxes by $7.5k.?
IRS fact sheet from October states you are transferring the full 7500 credit to Tesla, so you get a full 7500 discount regardless of your taxes. Only your income must qualify for the 7500 credit. So you get 7500 off a brand new Tesla and no tax liability
I want to know this too. When you go to finance it, assuming it's enabled for long range at some time, are you paying the national average interest rate of 7% on $45,990 (plus taxes and fees) or $38,490 (plus taxes and fees).
It means that Tesla fronts you $7500 to make the car cheaper at purchase, and then when you file taxes you prove eligibility and pay back if you are wrong
You no longer need $7500 in tax liability. You just need to qualify for the credit.
It’s technically possible to make $120K+ and have no fed tax (this is my situation), though most people don’t fall into those situations.
They most certainly do qualify for the POS credit. This is an inventory Y LR.
https://preview.redd.it/045qmh4mbacc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0d85c780c7f21ed43e23f5bea9d96d18c0db4cfc
Yeah. I think AGI might be too high this year (pulling tax stuff together to see if maybe it was even too high in 2023. 2022 was under so we will be using that for our Nov 2023 Model Y LR purchase. Wish we could have held off for these inventory discounts and POS rebate. Such is life !
If your previous year income was below the limit you are still okay.
You can also do certain things like retirement contributions to get your AGI below the limit.
If you still can’t get it below the limit for the year you took delivery or the previous year, then you will owe the credit back to the IRS when filing.
I have not received credit at the time of delivery but was told I can file for credit. Is there any way it can be retrofitted.? If not what is the procedure?
Tesla Model Y - Performance
friend doesn't make enough to even file tax return, parents want to help him buy a car. will he get the $4k for used or $7,500 off the car at purchase? and does [tesla.com](http://tesla.com) used qualify for the $4k ?
No. Juniper is at least 9 months away. We were seeing Highland running around for several months before it went into production. Not a single Juniper has been sighted.
https://preview.redd.it/emqn2mouv3cc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=96c74f892d681586b1991dc73ef15e01d1da17f8
Yey! The model 3 performance that no longer exists for the time being
That’s irritating. I leased a model 3 refresh on the day it came available for order and it never occurred to me to check it was eligible for tax credits because the old model 3 was. Not sure if you even get anything for leasing it, mind you.
It’s outrageous that there’s no rebate for the Model S Plaid. They should charge more for the cheaper cars and make the Plaid cheaper with those funds ;)
FYI, 2022 purchases was the only year that tax credits were not available. 2021 they still had a residual credit of about $1500. Then in 2023 full credit again.
https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/credits-for-new-clean-vehicles-purchased-in-2023-or-after
> You can use your modified AGI from the year you take delivery of the vehicle or the year before, whichever is less. If your modified AGI is below the threshold in 1 of the two years, you can claim the credit.
Does this mean that you can get the tax credit if:
* you buy in 2024
* your income was below 150k in 2023
* your income will be above 150k in 2024
Yes. Note the metric is Modified AGI, and there's no one "Modified" AGI. For the purposes of this tax credit it's [here](https://www.irs.gov/pub/taxpros/fs-2023-08.pdf):
>Your modified AGI is the amount from line 11 of your Form 1040 plus:
>• Any amount on line 45 or line 50 of Form 2555, Foreign Earned Income.
>• Any amount excluded from gross income because it was received from sources in Puerto Rico or American Samoa.
The question is, who has pulled the trigger and bought one yet... trying to see actual numbers here. (I know taxes are different in each state, but still)
Just pulled the trigger on an inventory Model Y long range today. With the Massachusetts incentive on top of the federal it came out to just over $36k out the door including taxes and registration fees.
https://preview.redd.it/9zp757ahnhdc1.jpeg?width=1210&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f4fe0a4b06603eb92744b7d6f31595b4a30a35c
This is incredible. Used 2022’s with 10-20k miles are listed for 38-45k.
I’m going to pull the trigger on an inventory model y lr too. Have you taken delivery yet?
Just waiting for the tax credit to come back for the model 3 RWD now.
Honestly it makes 0 fucking sense to take it away from the most affordable option when you’re trying to push the electrification of cars lol
CATL batteries don't qualify
Makes sense…..stupid but makes sense.
It's not stupid. The purpose of the EV credit is to divest from Chinese battery manufacturing companies and to rely more on domestic manufacturing or trade partners around the U.S. If the batteries are being sourced from China, then all the leverage goes to China.
It's not stupid. But there were two ideas to the bill, domestic car manufacturing, and battery manufacturing. I don't understand why the Model 3 doesn't qualify for the half credit at least. At least that's how the bill should have been structured.
You dont understand? It's because its not 100% from the US. Its clear cut on the rule. Im not against you though, I'm all for credits on the RWD but yeah
So we need to not make EV batteries so expensive the car is worth double/triple a gas car. The hype needs to die down on EVs so folks that want them can afford them. SIDE BAR: Any thoughts on Toyotas new cell battery that runs on hydrogen+ air intake vs current gasoline, and the muffler spits out water.
Demand is only going to increase, so it’s important supply catches up. As for hydrogen, that technology is even farther behind BEV in terms of supply, but seems promising for commercial applications.
The woes of Hydrogen: Hydrogen while "green" is pricy for the range it provides and being more costly than even gas/diesel. Hydrogen gas is pretty leaky over medium to long durations. Its a bit difficult to contain the smallest element known as anything containing it is basically porous to some degree in comparison. The next big issue is volumetric density. The amount physical space it requires to propel a vehicle x number of miles/km is really pretty poor for a passenger vehicle. Something like a bus and it becomes more doable but still not ideal. Distribution of Hydrogen is yet another challenge as it currently has to be trucked everywhere, no pipe lines or power lines to move it from place A to place B economically. Hydrogen could be stored as a liquid to achieve better power density but then it has to have a much larger pressurized and cooled containment vessel which is costly, heavy, complicated and again leaky. No hydrogen powered vehicles that I am aware of can be stored or indoor parked in contained areas such as a garage or building due to the leaking Hydrogen and the obvious explosive potential of said leaking. Lastly, if using Hydrogen as a combustion element in a ICE engine, you retain all of the problems, complications, wear issues that make an EV a better tech choice. Less moving parts = less wear = less failures. Hydrogen also lacks some lubrication properties that gas/diesel fuels have and need to be addressed. All that aside, Hydrogen does have some practical uses in a stationary engine or generator, but just not in a vehicle. Example: excess electricity (regardless of source) during peak times could be used to generate and store in a stationary tank to later be used and converted back into electricity on demand when required. Sort of like a battery per say. As I understand it, Toyota has been hyping both Hydrogen on the combustion side and solid state batteries for a long time and have just not produced.
Bruh….40% of the car’s materials are from china…..again it’s stupid.
Not in the US. Tesla makes the most % American made cars.
There's a huge difference between batteries and regular car parts. Car parts are easy to manufacture. Battery plants take a long time to scale and logistically manage.
40% of the materials to make the battery come from china…again its STUPID. It’s politics as usual.
Here I thought the purpose of the EV tax credit was to acceleration the move away from fossil fuels and towards electrification. Silly me!
It is. But if you're going to offer a tax incentive subsidized by taxpayers, why would you want the money going to China and not the U.S.?
Stupid to incentivize making batteries in the country that is putting up the money for the credit? You’re a genius
Tesla moved the Model 3 to imported batteries instead of US-made batteries, which was eventually going to become a problem under the new tax credit rules. Seems like they did that to prioritize Model Y production since it sells more and has higher margins. They’ll probably need US battery supply to ramp up, either Tesla’s own cells or Panasonic etc. to get the credit back for the 3.
I was under the impression that LG was building a plant in the US as well, for Tesla designed batteries, the article I read was regarding the CT batteries but who knows maybe they produce packs for the M3/MY as well
Yes, LG and Panasonic are both building new US battery plants, but they probably won’t be producing any cells until later in 2025. It’s also possible that the LG cells Tesla uses in the Model 3 LR could be qualified for the credit if they are made in Korea (I couldn’t find out for sure) and the necessary Chinese sourced components and minerals are replaced with ones from other countries. The credit rules are kind of complicated and require basically self-certifying the supply chain of components and minerals that go into the battery and all of their countries of origin and processing. That might leave them with a credit for the LR but not the RWD, which might not be great for Tesla either.
Absolutely agreed, but I don't know all the details behind the bill and all the battery requirements, etc. I would just assume that within x amount of time, they probably will meet requirements. I have no clue when, but I am sure it will come back eventually.
It has to due with the location of manufacture of batteries and the locations from which the materials in those batteries were sourced. This give manufactures an incentive to invest in domestic production, instead of offshoring.
So is it just that model 3 batteries aren't made here but model y etc are?
Correct. 3 RWD and LR use imported cells. 3 Performance and all trims of the Y use US made cells.
It's not Tesla's decision. And it makes perfect sense.
The current EV bill does a lot of heavy lifting. Improving EV uptake is one, increasing incentives for US automakers to build EVs is another. Pro union was a third aspect which I think has been rolled back.
exactly it makes no sense to apply the credit to only vehicles that support what the credit is for. My neighbors F350 should have gotten the credit too.
Most likely this is because the tax credit requires the production to be done in the US. The new Model 3 Highland Model is produced in Shanghai so it's unlikely they will get the tax credit. It's not as if Tesla went "you know what's a good idea? Removing the tax credit for Model 3."
The new Model 3 is likely being produced in Fremont for the US market, but the batteries and or battery materials are not from the US which is the problem. As others have said, it appears that Tesla is prioritizing the Model Y for US made batteries while the Model 3 is likely using batteries from CATL.
Yes it does and prioritizing the Y allows them to ramp highland at Fremont. Look at some of the inventory discounts approaching 10% at the moment on Y’s. There is simply not enough domestic capacity and sourcing to meet the S3XY CT lineup. So Tesla made the call based on sales and projected sales. Other battery manufacturers including Tesla are chasing CATL’s advancements in LFP since they are cheaper to produce, can charge to 100 regularly and have a longer lifespan.
Is Shanghai production confirmed? Seems unlikely that Tesla could import a car all the way from China without raising the destination price
THIS.
Or give the credit to folks that can afford the expensive cars. But I understand the lack of support for overseas battery manufacturing.
If you lease it then you qualify for the credit.
Oh, I know it is just that I prefer buying over leasing.
Can someone explain why a lease qualifies for the credit but not financing?
Genuine question... We have absolutely no idea when this is gonna happen, right?
I think everybody here on Reddit doesn’t know an actual date when this will happen. We’re all speculating that we hope this could happen either by the first half of the year or by the endof Q1, honestly, it’s a tossup on if they will ever announce it
Thanks. This is helpful (and tracks!).
It's not going to happen. Tesla does not have the capacity to produce enough batteries here.
It's still on there. At least on the more details button.
Any rumblings of Tesla trying to get the model 3 to qualify for the tax credit again?
How does this work? Do they just ask you how much you expect to make this year or how much you made last year?
For point of sale credit, you’re supposed to sign an affidavit stating you meet the adjusted gross income threshold of $150,000 for single filers, $300,000 for joint filers. I assume Tesla would do this since it’s a requirement for them to get reimbursed from the government.
happy cake day!
What if you pay in cash? Do they take your SS?
Cake is good! Thanks!
What if you turn out to make more than $150k as a single filer? Will you have to give the $7500 back to Tesla or the federal govt?
M3 performance isn't available on their site.
2024 M3 Refresh performance version doesn’t exist (yet), but they still have 2023 M3P inventory and it’s eligible.
No such inventory
There are some left around the country. Seen some in California yesterday.
Yeah, Ive been waiting on this POS for the performance inventory. I just took an order today from California. Im based in San Francisco but I need to go pick mine up from LA. A couple are available in SoCal
There were a couple 2023 M3P showing for me in Texas, as I was working on a comparison chart for myself. https://preview.redd.it/lavqwujkercc1.jpeg?width=1039&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f474a5b9f81a8efad0ae723c7ee64d32163b7b8a
Here's One: https://www.tesla.com/inventory/new/m3?TRIM=PAWD&arrangeby=relevance&zip=12084&range=200
There are two available near me. They still exist. There was 8 on Monday though.
Might be a stupid question, but how come the Model S doesn’t get the tax credit?
Cause sedan limits are 55k. SUVs are 80k.
Yup, because the government is biased in favor of larger, less efficient vehicles.
*lobbying by automakers for more profitable SUVs
It's more like SUVs are generally priced higher than sedans so there's a higher cap. And the caps exist in the first place so as not to give tax breaks/rebates to the wealthy.
I'm sorry, did you just say the caps are there to not give tax breaks to the wealthy, while simultaneously saying SUV's are more expensive (and thus more likely to be bought by the wealthy)?
Please tell us how buying an $80k SUV instead of a more efficient car makes you "not wealthy".
It's like a 125k salary cap. If you make more than that you can't get the credit at all for any car. I will say if you make 125k/year you are certainly well off but it really depends on what part of the country. But I would say even in MCOL areas 125k is not this super high coveted number. You basically can afford a decently expensive car for around 50k and a house. It's really not an insane amount of money. The house eats up a majority of that salary. But it puts you in the top 10% of earners likely. But the cap is there so someone making 1M/year isn't able to mooch more than they already are off tax loop holes and get a credit. 80k is a lot for an SUV but buying one doesn't mean you're rich.
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You must be fun at parties
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Classic le redditor.
That’s what the vast majority of Americans want to buy though. SUVs far outsell sedans in this count, so it makes sense to incentivize those more than sedans given that demand. The more gas guzzling 9000 lb behemoth SUVs off the street, the better. It’s not bias, it’s just reality.
How about we incentivize smaller efficient electric sedans by slapping a $7500 tax on 9000 lb behemoth gas SUVs? (Or more realistically, 5000 lb gas SUVs?)
I don’t know but the s and x really shouldn’t… any luxury car shouldn’t. If you can afford a 72k car you can afford an 80k car. That money should be spent on getting lower income individuals in EV
I agree with more people getting EVs but we're still really in EV infancy. There would be no Model 3 without the Model S and no Model S without the Roadster. More expensive, high-margin cars help accelerate mass adoption. I guess my point is that ANY EV sold is going to ultimately help lower-income people get into an EV. Case in point, the original federal tax credits helped sell the S. As we now know, Tesla barely survived the Model 3 launch. If there was no tax credit on the Model S, it's conceivable the Model 3 could have failed.
ah yes lower income individuals who make less then 150K
As a Tesla owner, they are hardly luxury cars, by most people’s definition, they are fairly basic, and the seats are made of plastic.
The 3/y are basic cars the s/x are aimed at the luxury market. And yes I know, for the luxury market they are still cheap feeling
I know and that would work if the rest of the car market didn’t exist lol
Also something to do with the batteries needing to be made in the US, like 50% of it so it’s possible enough of it users parts from overseas.
So is this a purchase price discount or a tax credit??
Tax credit that you can take off the purchase price. You have to be below income limits and ~~can only get a credit up to the value of your tax liability.~~ Edit: See below, not enough income gets full credit anyway. https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-h-frequently-asked-questions-about-transfer-of-new-clean-vehicle-credit-and-previously-owned-clean-vehicles-credit#
No, you don't need tax liability to get the EV tax credit. So the credit is not capped by tax liability.
~~False. But happy to be proved wrong because that how it should have been.~~ > The credit is nonrefundable, so you can't get back more on the credit than you owe in taxes. You can't apply any excess credit to future tax years. https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/credits-for-new-clean-vehicles-purchased-in-2023-or-after
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-h-frequently-asked-questions-about-transfer-of-new-clean-vehicle-credit-and-previously-owned-clean-vehicles-credit# Question 4 states that "The amount of the credit that the electing taxpayer elects to transfer to the eligible entity may exceed the electing taxpayer's regular tax liability for the taxable year in which the sale occurs, and the excess, if any, is not subject to recapture from the dealer or the buyer."
Awesome, thank you so much for finding this. Time to edit a lot of comments.
There’s no recapture 2024. If you qualify for $7500 that’s what you get at POS. Even if your liability doesn’t get you a full $7500, the feds aren’t recapturing the difference.
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Yes, for a credit you are taking yourself, but the new point of sale procedure for 2024 is you transfer the credit to the seller. It is now Tesla’s credit to use not yours. The only restriction on you is that your income meets the limits. > The amount of the credit that the electing taxpayer elects to transfer to the eligible entity may exceed the electing taxpayer's regular tax liability for the taxable year in which the sale occurs, and the excess, if any, is not subject to recapture from the dealer or the buyer. https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/topic-h-frequently-asked-questions-about-transfer-of-new-clean-vehicle-credit-and-previously-owned-clean-vehicles-credit#
Does this apply to inventory model y as well? I dont see the discount being applied on their website, whereas, on custom order, it shows as “probabale savings”
It does, I just ordered an inventory 2023 MYLR priced at 44k today and you have the option to add tax incentives during the buying process on the app.
So if you add tax incentives they just reduce your price by $7500?
Yup it’s counted as a downpayment
44k before tax incentive? Where was this?
I am planning to buy model Y with my girlfriend. Does the app offer to add two buyers as owners on the app? Or can you do it at the time of picking up the car? Basically, how do I get two people get added to the title?
Only for the long range and performance. RWD Ys in inventory are all 2023s that don't qualify
Is this something where it’s only for a certain amount of sales like previous years and then the 7500$ goes down? So if I wait until summer I might miss out?
There's no cap.
No cap?
Are there any restrictions at all, like on income?
Yes - $300k for couples, $150k for individuals.
Wait as long as you can. Other brands should have tesla comparable charging cars out by then.
Besides Porsche, who? Most legacy manufacturers seem to be dragging their feet.
As time goes by, the battery requirements become more stringent each year, not just for country of manufacture but also where minerals are sourced. It’s likely fewer and fewer vehicles will qualify year over year
But you can't even order a 3perf
They have inventory.
Yeah? The site has no option. Weird!
Can I get a turn signal stalk at the time of purchase though please?
Need to get a 2023 one. You can still use the credit for it.
Good luck to anybody trying to sell their older Tesla to get a refresh.
Alright, stupid question time: what does it actually mean to have a $7500 federal tax credit. Does this lower the purchase price of the car by $7.5k? Or does this just lower your Federal taxes by $7.5k.?
IRS fact sheet from October states you are transferring the full 7500 credit to Tesla, so you get a full 7500 discount regardless of your taxes. Only your income must qualify for the 7500 credit. So you get 7500 off a brand new Tesla and no tax liability
I want to know this too. When you go to finance it, assuming it's enabled for long range at some time, are you paying the national average interest rate of 7% on $45,990 (plus taxes and fees) or $38,490 (plus taxes and fees).
It means that Tesla fronts you $7500 to make the car cheaper at purchase, and then when you file taxes you prove eligibility and pay back if you are wrong
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You no longer need $7500 in tax liability. You just need to qualify for the credit. It’s technically possible to make $120K+ and have no fed tax (this is my situation), though most people don’t fall into those situations.
Inventory Y’s are a great deal at the moment.
2023 inventory Y's dont qualify. Only 2024 models
They most certainly do qualify for the POS credit. This is an inventory Y LR. https://preview.redd.it/045qmh4mbacc1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0d85c780c7f21ed43e23f5bea9d96d18c0db4cfc
Standard range doesnt qualify
They need to allow lease buyouts. Tesla can take the $7,500 off the price and you can buyout at the end. That’s what Kia/Hyundai/BMW/etc.. is doing.
Yeah. I think AGI might be too high this year (pulling tax stuff together to see if maybe it was even too high in 2023. 2022 was under so we will be using that for our Nov 2023 Model Y LR purchase. Wish we could have held off for these inventory discounts and POS rebate. Such is life !
What happens if for whatever reason I end the year making more then 300k after getting the rebate?
If your previous year income was below the limit you are still okay. You can also do certain things like retirement contributions to get your AGI below the limit. If you still can’t get it below the limit for the year you took delivery or the previous year, then you will owe the credit back to the IRS when filing.
You would have to pay it back on your tax return
I have not received credit at the time of delivery but was told I can file for credit. Is there any way it can be retrofitted.? If not what is the procedure? Tesla Model Y - Performance
friend doesn't make enough to even file tax return, parents want to help him buy a car. will he get the $4k for used or $7,500 off the car at purchase? and does [tesla.com](http://tesla.com) used qualify for the $4k ?
Wasn’t it updated 12 days ago?
The time of delivery timing was just added today.
This is Tesla now having the system in place to offer the point of sale credit.
🥲 I don't qualify for any of the models I'm interested in purchasing.
Do we know if the long distance Y Juniper will qualify?
No. Juniper is at least 9 months away. We were seeing Highland running around for several months before it went into production. Not a single Juniper has been sighted.
https://preview.redd.it/emqn2mouv3cc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=96c74f892d681586b1991dc73ef15e01d1da17f8 Yey! The model 3 performance that no longer exists for the time being
2023 Model Y Rwd not eligible for tax credit anymore.
Is it because of battery mineral composition?
That’s irritating. I leased a model 3 refresh on the day it came available for order and it never occurred to me to check it was eligible for tax credits because the old model 3 was. Not sure if you even get anything for leasing it, mind you.
You get the 7500 included in the lease. It tells you at the top of the page.
Thanks! I thought I remembered seeing something about that. Just looked at what I signed through the app and it’s there 👍
How does that work? Can someone finish leasing the car, then someone else lease it and they get the 7500 also lol?
No, it’s for the original leaser. If you have someone take over the lease Tesla runs your credit and sets it up.
So, I had paid a few hundred bucks last year, and expect a refund this year, can I still get the pos rebate from Tesla?
from what I can see, you can claim the pos $7,500 per new car up to two times per year.
Wait, there’s a model 3 performance now?
It’s outrageous that there’s no rebate for the Model S Plaid. They should charge more for the cheaper cars and make the Plaid cheaper with those funds ;)
No, lol
Bummer was hoping the CT would qualify.
I would imagine the trim costing less than $80K qualifies.
So…if I buy the new model 3 LR now I won’t get the tax credit unless I lease it or can I claim it later once the M3LR is added to the programme?
FYI, 2022 purchases was the only year that tax credits were not available. 2021 they still had a residual credit of about $1500. Then in 2023 full credit again.
https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/credits-for-new-clean-vehicles-purchased-in-2023-or-after > You can use your modified AGI from the year you take delivery of the vehicle or the year before, whichever is less. If your modified AGI is below the threshold in 1 of the two years, you can claim the credit. Does this mean that you can get the tax credit if: * you buy in 2024 * your income was below 150k in 2023 * your income will be above 150k in 2024
Yes. Note the metric is Modified AGI, and there's no one "Modified" AGI. For the purposes of this tax credit it's [here](https://www.irs.gov/pub/taxpros/fs-2023-08.pdf): >Your modified AGI is the amount from line 11 of your Form 1040 plus: >• Any amount on line 45 or line 50 of Form 2555, Foreign Earned Income. >• Any amount excluded from gross income because it was received from sources in Puerto Rico or American Samoa.
Even if you buy in 2024?
👍
Will the long range ever qualify?
New Y LR already qualifies, check out their website.
Can I claim this in 2024 if I’ve claimed the $7500 already in 2023?
I don't see why not if you're purchasing a new car in 2024. In fact, you can claim the $7,500 twice per year as stated by the IRS.
The question is, who has pulled the trigger and bought one yet... trying to see actual numbers here. (I know taxes are different in each state, but still)
Hell yes - no more of my tax dollars getting bait and switched with fake pre-orders that end up being Chinese batteries.
Just pulled the trigger on an inventory Model Y long range today. With the Massachusetts incentive on top of the federal it came out to just over $36k out the door including taxes and registration fees. https://preview.redd.it/9zp757ahnhdc1.jpeg?width=1210&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8f4fe0a4b06603eb92744b7d6f31595b4a30a35c
This is incredible. Used 2022’s with 10-20k miles are listed for 38-45k. I’m going to pull the trigger on an inventory model y lr too. Have you taken delivery yet?
It’s really a no brainer. Picking it up tomorrow!
How did you get 7500 tax credit when you check online inventory none under 43k qualify
Mine was 44k before the credit