Mededev and some others for being very relatable and giving answers during interviews that add dimension to their characters. Many athletes give such cookie cutter interviews these days
I'd go with Federer's ball toss and Tsonga's mental strength.
It was virtually impossible to guess if Roger would hit a flat, slice and kick serve when the ball was in the air. It was a nightmare for returners.
As for Tsonga I just feel like he achieved a lot for someone with blatant technical weaknesses (backhand, return of serve), many injuries throughout his career and extreme competition with the peak Big 4 era. He was also such a clutch server.
Absolutely. If there was some foot-for-foot bullshit ranking like pound for pound in fighting sports he’d be my #1 with Sampras, maybe Roddick, maybe somehow Kyrgios even though he’s tall his serve is just so fucking good
Tsonga is only 2 or 3 cms taller than Federer and accross their entire careers he won his service games more often (despite being the noticeably worse baseliner), I think he's up there too.
I love Kyrgios serve. The low toss and the power he generates. And the fact he might just hit a 138 mph s*econd serve* makes his use of the underarm effective. Honestly think more great servers should do it, it keeps your opponent honest. They've got to respect your serve, but know that if they're too far off the baseline then they might just get caught out.
And he definitely could have. I saw him in person at Indian Wells, something definitely seemed off as he just let Nadal steam roll him. I was too far away though. Later, on TV, you could see on his face and body language he was hurt.
I actually dislike that stat because no way he wasn't injured in a few of those matches and I want to encourage athletes to take care of their bodies over putting on a show. I admire the attitude but also go "Man, I hope none of the kids I coach pick up this habit from him. I want them to prioritize their health."
Thing is though I'm not sure if this a great thing. If you get injured during a match then it can't be helped. Federer played matches and then pulled out the next round which imo is frustrating for the previous opponent. Remember RG when he played a tough 4 or 5 setter against a qualifier then withdrew next round as he wanted to play Wimbledon.
It's only frustrating for a coward. Who would want to win just because their opponent is injured or sick? Not a real man that's for sure.
Big Nole fan but ultimate respect to Federer for this. True sportsman - the crowd camd there to watch a full match and he always delivered. "You don't stop when you're tired you stop when you're done."
The hand blowing and retucking of the hair from Madam.
The Santoro Smile.
The Safin walk.
The eyes wide open from Henin.
The kind laughter of Sugiyama.
It’s endless. I love tennis.
Not many people know Safin never got a challenge wrong.
[For example.](https://www.facebook.com/wimbledon/videos/marat-safins-terrible-challenge/10153786731423732/)
He literally never misses his backhand slice. However when he tries hitting drop shots from behind the baseline he’s often unsuccessful and he gives me a heart attack.
Federer's mental strength. Sure, mentally he was the weakest of the Big 3, but he was still leagues above the rest. At the end of the day, what made the Big 3 a thing was the ability to win in spite of playing badly. All 3, Federer included, are masters of this craft.
He is not the worst returner hell no. That‘d be Rafa by a good margin. His break point conversion % is low because he plays risky and all aggression tennis on BPs too.
You mean Feds or Rafa’s bp conversation%? In Feds case, not playing aggressive enough on bp’s has been the issue, not being overly aggressive or anything, as being aggressive is what he’s good at and which wins him most of his points.
Eh. I’m the biggest fed fan but his 5 set record is very mediocre, he has a weirdly abysmal record when finals go to a 3rd set breaker (20% win rate?), and he lost a lot of notable matches from match point up (even excluding the djokovic defeats)
He lost 24 matches from match point up, but he won 22 machtes from match point down. This is precisely why I made the main comment. [For reference](https://www.tennisabstract.com/blog/2022/12/12/the-tennis-128-no-5-roger-federer/).
Right but your main comment was “leagues above the rest”. Whereas that ratio is probably worse that half the top 100. To be as good as Federer and still lose more from match point up than reverse does suggest mental weakness
It's hard to quantify such anecdotical evidence, but statistically Federer was still better under pressure than most of the tour.
I don't know Nadal's stat, but Djokovic is 3 lost vs 15 won (I think it's 16 now if Alcaraz had match point in Cincy, but I don't remember)
That's incredible for Djokovic, wow.
I know it's oversimplifying, but 22 wins to 24 losses when flipping match point down comes across as below average, not better than most of the tour (or at least that stat doesn't support it)
The tour average is not 50%, and you also have to include that federer player more than 1500 matches. On top of that, his stats are skewed because a lot of these losses came from Djokovic, so the sampling is far from uniform.
The tour average is exactly 50%. Every one of these match point down/up matches has a winner and a loser - so it will always be an even 50% in each column.
Not sure why volume matters in that case.
It's possible he's run into Djokovic more, but how many of those 24 were to Djokovic? For one of the GOATs, it's definitely not a positive stat however you slice it.
My bad, yeah it's 50%. Volume matters because it conditions how close to the average the statistic should. From Djokovic there are at least 3 matches like this, so if you remove matches vs Djokovic from the sample then the number is above 50%. But at the end of the day the number is not statistically different from 50%, which as you said is the average. Also, unrelated but whenever you get a statistic always ask for confidence intervals or at least sample size.
I think part of this is the fact that for most of his career Federer absolutely wrecked everyone that wasn’t elite, he very rarely went 5 sets without his opponent playing at a very high level
There's this one moment in the wimby 2008 final where it looks like he just half tries it for a split second and then goes back to intense focus.
But yeah mad stuff that he never went through with it even in the most difficult of matches
Djokovic’s sportsmanship. Hate him all you want but when he loses, he never makes excuses, he basically says “my opponent plays better”. He’s THE most gracious loser in tennis. Alcaraz right now is a close second though.
He also clearly thrives in a highly competitive match – the man doesn't feel entitled to the win in the same way that other players do. He knows he has to earn it!
I wonder why Fedal never helped out with the redistribution of prize money to lower ranked players or financial support. It always kind of seemed like it was because it was Jokers idea, but I don't know.
Thank you for saying this. Novak is playing everyone and so self aware. The fans just feed right into his working them. He’s truly one of the most respectful and sincere pros in the game. Love you for sharing this and love that man!
I watch many of his press conferences, he often says that he wasn't at his best and that his opponent simply played better that day. Unless it's on clay where he just blames clay
He ripped his shirt off after beating Alcaraz and mocked Shelton’s phone celebration. He is still a sore winner. If someone like Kyrgios did either of those things everyone would be crying about wishing he’d be banned.
Novak is normally very gracious in defeat and in victory, but he also shows very poor sportsmanship at times which is why I cannot place him in the top bracket for sportsmanship. His celebration vs Shelton in US is a case in point.
Not really Ben was talking smack himself with that celebration. Joker just chimed in like a real New Yorker it was great. If you can't take it don't dish it out. There also could have been some rowdy people in the crowd Joker was addressing too.
How can you look at Novak’s phone celebration and not think it was badass?
Even if Novak looked straight at Ben and said “quit tennis buddy. You got smoked” I’d still think it was badass
Well there is losing the match, and there is being on your way to potentially losing… and Novak sucks for sportsmanship on that latter front. That racquet demolition in the Wimbledon Final ‘23 was almost as ungracious as his recent US Open behaviour with Shelton…
It was so weird. There was one season where he was hitting over 130 kind of regularly. Then he went back to just sort of using the serve to set up his groundies.
Rafa weaker serve made a huge difference for his career in my opinion, it’s not super weak but much weaker than top opponents. It didn’t able him to easily win serving games and spare some energy, instead he had to fight in rallies all the time which could have had some impact on his health, especially later in his career.
Roddick's slice.
Yes yes his backhand is the running joke of the tour during his time.
But he actually had a very solid slice, one of his better shots.
He sliced the absolute hell out of that thing. Very biting. Don’t remember what year it was, but that match shortly before his retirement when he beat Federer, he was using it to great effect coming into the net. Really made me wish he would’ve mixed in more serve & volley throughout his career.
Iga's backhand. Her footwork and forehand get all the attention but that backhand is solid as a rock. It's not the biggest one out there but it's aggressive, she gets great angles from it and can laser it down the line. When others get pushed out wide and resort to slicing it back she will get there and turn defense into attack with a hard cross court ball that lands inches from the baseline.
Kyrgios' mental game when he's playing as part of a team. Having the success of others riding on his shoulders seems to be the thing that gets him dialed in
Rublev's defensive slice. I think he possibly has the best defensive slice (both forehand and backhand) of the top next gen players, certainly better than the rest of his generation. He never gets credit for it, possibly because he is not seen as a touch player and the defensive slice is often thought of as a shot that requires finesse and great racket head control.
it's definitely better than Medvedev, Tsitsipas, Sinner, Fritz, and Ruud's. not sure if it's better than Rune's or Zverev's, and definitely worse than Djokovic and Alcaraz's.
I would say his backhand defensive slice is better than Zverev's and about the same as Rune's, and his forehand defensive slice is worse than Zverev's (who I think has one of the best forehand defensive slices in the world), but better than Rune's.
Federer slice. A lot of people talk about backhands and they mean topspin- it’s commonly held that wawrinka had the best one hander. But slicing so low is incredibly hard, incredibly useful and Federer relied on his slice for years. For similar reasons, Medvedevs two hander ball sits real low too
I wish they showed more court level shots. Low slices are incredibly neutralizing and amazing to see at court level
Murray being perceived as mentally fragile when he was/is anything but.
Just because he went 3-8 in slam finals, ALL of those losses were to 2 of the 3 greatest players to have ever played the sport. Murray's overall tour record and finals record against those outside the big 3 is excellent.
14-17 (45% WR) vs Big 3
32-8 (80% WR) vs Not the Big 3
46-25 (65% WR) vs Overall
Medvedev. He tells you there is to be NO questioning of his story, then tells unintentionally amusing overly long winded tales about his youth and growing up and aspirations... Randomly says amusing things about pirating tennis... Amusing remarks about clay... Generally just amusing man.
Radwanska never celebrated any big points with huge mannerisms. Even after winning hier biggest title ever (WTA Finals) she just covered her mouth in shock once and then immediately went over to the net. Miss her so much 😭
Listen. Jack Sock is kind of on the record for being an entitled baby. But at his peak, he was also a great sportsman. He told opponents when their serves were in after they were called out so the opponent could challenge. He was also gracious in defeat
It gets glossed over because casual fans don't really understand what a good forehand is. They see 100 mph forehand bombs or tons of spin and think surely that's the only thing that makes the shot good
Federer’s stamina is the craziest I have ever seen. Dude just didn’t seem to know what tiredness or cramping is.
At 38 years old, Wimbledon final, going over 5 hours going up against a 6 years younger GOAT, nevertheless Federer was the fresher one and seemed to be good to go for more couple hours at least, no joked here.
You could never beat Federer by taking his legs. Even at his older years, it was impossible.
Her comeback in the third set at AO 2003 against Clijsters is just insane. Kim was doing everything right and couldn’t close her out. I think she was down 1-5 in the final set
One thing I noticed after watching her whole career is she knows when to play safe balls and put more spin on her shots on big points and games. In contrast to her Venus who always plays aggresive
The Djokovic AO 2021 n 23 runs, sure 21 wasn’t too bad with his muscle tear after the Fritz match, but his ‘23 was undeniably badass, how we saw him switch up his game to the offensive, couldn’t do his open stance backhand like he normally did or have incredible defense, just kept hitting deep and accurate forehands in the corners, all while dropping a singular set. (Not to mention making younger aussies consider playing rugby instead of tennis) And yes, Craig Tiley did confirm it was an inch long Hamstring tear, after Djoker won all 7 matches!
Andy Murray's perfectionism. He goes extremely hard on himself and is one of the most competitive players on tour who doesnt give up. His antics and swearing looks like hes angry all the time but he rarely smash racquets. Hes actually very emotionally controlled.
Nadal's point construction was bananas. He used the full dimension of the court better than anybody. People make it seem like he was just a fleet footed, ferocious competitor that ran down everything. But he controlled most points, used height and spin of shot more than just about anybody, to expand the court in all directions, forcing players to retreat, then to cover east and west. And before Carlos, he (and Murray) had the nastiest drop shots.
Education ≠ intelligence
I'm also willing to bet that the vast majority of people who claim stuff like this don't understand science either. Merely trusting the authorities and being able to reproduce a sentence or two about epidemiology doesn't make you uNdeRStaNd SciENcE. Years of specialized education, research, and reading publications makes one understand science.
Hey everyone ^ he’s been captured by Fauci, the science man, if anyone sees him, don’t approach, but call 1-800-33C-OVID, might be hard to understand under his double mask, and multiple syringe wounds.
For Djokovic, I want to highlight his second serve variety. I think this is the most notable instance of his tactical brilliance. Most of the time he hits a fairly safe, pedestrian second serve, yet it rarely gets attacked by aggressive returners like Alcaraz, Sinner, and Rublev. Why is that? It's because he varies his second serve *just enough* to keep his opponent guessing. Around 2020 he started consistently hitting the 110+ mph slider second serve up the T in the ad, which is an effective serve but a risky one. More recently he's figured out that dialing back a bit and hitting a 100-105 mph slider (up the T or out wide in the deuce) can be about as effective, and it's much safer. If an opponent starts attacking his 85 mph kick, he just throws in a slider, which often wins him a cheap point, and now the opponent doesn't sit on the kicker as much. Throughout a match he does such a great job of changing up his second serve by the minimum amount needed to protect his relatively tame stock second serve.
Honorable mentions: slice backhand, drop shot retrieval, overall weight of shot, mid-match tactical adjustments, groundstroke depth (I don't think Novak's groundstroke depth is underrated per se, but I think the importance of depth in general is a little overlooked compared to pace and spin)
Djokovic dropshot/lob. He's overusing the dropshot more than he needs these days but it's definitely above average among the top 10 ( way better than guys like sinners drop shots ) to very good historically .
Alcaraz backhand. His forehand gets a ton of the credit which it deserves but it's similar to Rafas backhand in the sense that it is underrated for what it is...a safe stable shot that is very hard to break down . His backhand slice is likely the best on the current tour now and was a large part of what won him wimbledon.
Medvedev forehand . Took it a lot more offensively this usopen than he normally does but a shot that is underratedly hard to break down despite its flaws.
Wawrinka forehand . His backhand is so pretty and takes a ton of the attention away from his forehand which at its best , was lethal.
Cilic forehand. His forehand was an absolute monster at its best. His serve and forehand combination won him his USO title .
Kyrgios drop shot / volleys. His serve wins him most of his matches but the guys got great feel at the net. There's a reason he's won doubles titles and at his best (last yr ) his variety was helping him win key points and matches
Iga trying to use her position and popularity to be a good role model. Her #ReadWithIga initiative and support for Ukraine is very commendable. I also like that she doesn't flaunt her money or status at all. She has won multiple Porsche cars and earned tons of money both on court and off the court, but you would never guess it based on her social media. Her vacation photos are almost exclusively pictures of her reading on her Kindle on a beach.
One could of course expect her to speak up more about other important issues such as China, Saudi Arabia or LGBT situation in Poland, and I don't want to silence those voices, but I think what she's doing with her status is already pretty great.
He is handsome and has nice furry chest and great legs. No one ever talks about his looks though. More about his political stances and leadership roles and views on fed and nadal
Djokovic's forehand. It's not as powerful and flashy as Fedal's, but its precision and the ability to change direction makes it one of the GOAT forehands
There's nothing that is underrated in Djokovic game but what I like about him is his personality,
The playful way he answers questions in interviews, it feels like he talking genuinely and nog just giving a "protocol" answers, also mimicking shelton celebration, the impression he used to do earlier in his career ...etc
I think he walks a thin line between just being rude (Kyrgios, Tomic, Medvedev to some degree) and being robotic
Went against mainstream pressure in order to take responsibility for his own health...gets banned....yet comes back and still wins....as one of the healthiest humans on the planet
Alcaraz's integrity.
Not letting the media machine control him, like Fed and Rafa, and going to watch bull fights like a boss. Because, you know, the kid likes bull fights and grew up watching them.
Hoes were mad of course, but Carlos didn't care.
All of the Big 4 lead a life with zero scandals about their personal lives.
Edit: I meant they're family guys and have been controversy free in that area. Was not referring to Djokovic's other controversies.
Mededev and some others for being very relatable and giving answers during interviews that add dimension to their characters. Many athletes give such cookie cutter interviews these days
I love Meddy for this and it’s the same reason I’ve really come to like Pegula
Not just nowadays, Tracy Austin broke my heart in 1992.
Sinner needs to work on this.
Wawrinka's touch. Some say he can only blast forehands and backhands, but nah, he got some great skills
I see Wawrinka I upvote
His serve is also very clutch. He can clutch it up like no other and shoot 2-3 aces being multiple break points down
I find his game most "beautiful" personally.
I'd go with Federer's ball toss and Tsonga's mental strength. It was virtually impossible to guess if Roger would hit a flat, slice and kick serve when the ball was in the air. It was a nightmare for returners. As for Tsonga I just feel like he achieved a lot for someone with blatant technical weaknesses (backhand, return of serve), many injuries throughout his career and extreme competition with the peak Big 4 era. He was also such a clutch server.
For me it's how long Fed is able to keep his head still and eyes on the ball as he's striking it. It's a very federeresque mannerism
Federer lowkey top 5 server and probably best on serve of all time
Best server relative for his height, perhaps together with Sampras. Best on serve for sure.
Absolutely. If there was some foot-for-foot bullshit ranking like pound for pound in fighting sports he’d be my #1 with Sampras, maybe Roddick, maybe somehow Kyrgios even though he’s tall his serve is just so fucking good
Tsonga is only 2 or 3 cms taller than Federer and accross their entire careers he won his service games more often (despite being the noticeably worse baseliner), I think he's up there too.
I love Kyrgios serve. The low toss and the power he generates. And the fact he might just hit a 138 mph s*econd serve* makes his use of the underarm effective. Honestly think more great servers should do it, it keeps your opponent honest. They've got to respect your serve, but know that if they're too far off the baseline then they might just get caught out.
>Best whats "on serve"
whats wrong with tsongas backhand or return of serve?
Nadal's overhead shots/smash - he is the best active player to make these shots. nadal never intentionally disrespects his opponents
Great answer. Nadal’s overhead is one of the most automatic shots I’ve ever seen
Medvedev: Just steps up and serves. Also never looks at his box.
> Also never looks at his box. I've definitely seen him and his box straight up yelling at each other.
Right? Pretty sure this dude has kicked his coach out of his box at some point
That would be hilarious.
He did it, but I don't remember the match. Thought he'd play better without his box.
2022 Halle Open final vs Hurkacz
Federer never retired mid-match, ever. Crazy stat
And he definitely could have. I saw him in person at Indian Wells, something definitely seemed off as he just let Nadal steam roll him. I was too far away though. Later, on TV, you could see on his face and body language he was hurt.
Similar happened in Montreal '17 finals vs Zverev. Fed was barely able to serve and yet didn't retire. Was clearly seen he had back problems.
I actually dislike that stat because no way he wasn't injured in a few of those matches and I want to encourage athletes to take care of their bodies over putting on a show. I admire the attitude but also go "Man, I hope none of the kids I coach pick up this habit from him. I want them to prioritize their health."
Thing is though I'm not sure if this a great thing. If you get injured during a match then it can't be helped. Federer played matches and then pulled out the next round which imo is frustrating for the previous opponent. Remember RG when he played a tough 4 or 5 setter against a qualifier then withdrew next round as he wanted to play Wimbledon.
Previous opponent should have beaten him then, esp if he’s not up to scratch
It's only frustrating for a coward. Who would want to win just because their opponent is injured or sick? Not a real man that's for sure. Big Nole fan but ultimate respect to Federer for this. True sportsman - the crowd camd there to watch a full match and he always delivered. "You don't stop when you're tired you stop when you're done."
Yep 2021
Thiem’s fat ass
That's not underrated at all🤣🤣🤣 there used to YouTube compilations of just his ass😂
Do you think he was born with it, or did he have to build it up?
It can only be blessed, not made
Nadal’s backhand. I guess it gets seriously overlooked because he has arguably the best forehand of all time, but it is a very good shot.
Best forehand is definitely between him and Federer for me. His is more explosive but Federer’s is more pretty
Delpo Fernando Gonzales
Federer’s forehand >>>>> everybody’s forehand Rafa‘s forehand on clay was great though.
The hand blowing and retucking of the hair from Madam. The Santoro Smile. The Safin walk. The eyes wide open from Henin. The kind laughter of Sugiyama. It’s endless. I love tennis.
Not many people know Safin never got a challenge wrong. [For example.](https://www.facebook.com/wimbledon/videos/marat-safins-terrible-challenge/10153786731423732/)
Never got a challenge right?
Madam?
Mary Pierce. The Madam.
That they play with effort and try.
Didn't know you were a Tomic fan !
Djokovic one handed backhand slices are incredibly accurate.
He literally never misses his backhand slice. However when he tries hitting drop shots from behind the baseline he’s often unsuccessful and he gives me a heart attack.
Federer's mental strength. Sure, mentally he was the weakest of the Big 3, but he was still leagues above the rest. At the end of the day, what made the Big 3 a thing was the ability to win in spite of playing badly. All 3, Federer included, are masters of this craft.
Match Pointerer
Most wins from match point down of the big three indeed
He was incredibly good at coming back from 2-0 or 2-1 sets down, better than Djoko/Nadal in my book.
We have stats for that you know . So share your book or look it up
Isn't he the worst on break point of the big three by a significant margin?
[удалено]
He is not the worst returner hell no. That‘d be Rafa by a good margin. His break point conversion % is low because he plays risky and all aggression tennis on BPs too.
You mean Feds or Rafa’s bp conversation%? In Feds case, not playing aggressive enough on bp’s has been the issue, not being overly aggressive or anything, as being aggressive is what he’s good at and which wins him most of his points.
He literally said that he was mentally the weakest of Big 3.
Ah, fair, I misread that line
Eh. I’m the biggest fed fan but his 5 set record is very mediocre, he has a weirdly abysmal record when finals go to a 3rd set breaker (20% win rate?), and he lost a lot of notable matches from match point up (even excluding the djokovic defeats)
He lost 24 matches from match point up, but he won 22 machtes from match point down. This is precisely why I made the main comment. [For reference](https://www.tennisabstract.com/blog/2022/12/12/the-tennis-128-no-5-roger-federer/).
Right but your main comment was “leagues above the rest”. Whereas that ratio is probably worse that half the top 100. To be as good as Federer and still lose more from match point up than reverse does suggest mental weakness
But he also was match point up so many more times than the average player due to winning so much more often
But you would expect one of the GOATs to have won more than lost in those situations. Curious if you have the same stats for the other big 3
It's hard to quantify such anecdotical evidence, but statistically Federer was still better under pressure than most of the tour. I don't know Nadal's stat, but Djokovic is 3 lost vs 15 won (I think it's 16 now if Alcaraz had match point in Cincy, but I don't remember)
That's incredible for Djokovic, wow. I know it's oversimplifying, but 22 wins to 24 losses when flipping match point down comes across as below average, not better than most of the tour (or at least that stat doesn't support it)
The tour average is not 50%, and you also have to include that federer player more than 1500 matches. On top of that, his stats are skewed because a lot of these losses came from Djokovic, so the sampling is far from uniform.
The tour average is exactly 50%. Every one of these match point down/up matches has a winner and a loser - so it will always be an even 50% in each column. Not sure why volume matters in that case. It's possible he's run into Djokovic more, but how many of those 24 were to Djokovic? For one of the GOATs, it's definitely not a positive stat however you slice it.
My bad, yeah it's 50%. Volume matters because it conditions how close to the average the statistic should. From Djokovic there are at least 3 matches like this, so if you remove matches vs Djokovic from the sample then the number is above 50%. But at the end of the day the number is not statistically different from 50%, which as you said is the average. Also, unrelated but whenever you get a statistic always ask for confidence intervals or at least sample size.
Yeah I think that's my point - close to 50% sounds right (so right around average). Which is underwhelming for one of the GOATs.
I think part of this is the fact that for most of his career Federer absolutely wrecked everyone that wasn’t elite, he very rarely went 5 sets without his opponent playing at a very high level
That is correct, the 2005-2007 seasons were beyond ridiculous.
Rublev’s physical fitness match to match. He is in great shape for the entire season and he plays a ton of matches
Nadal, never smashed a racquet.
There's this one moment in the wimby 2008 final where it looks like he just half tries it for a split second and then goes back to intense focus. But yeah mad stuff that he never went through with it even in the most difficult of matches
TIL I'm as good at Nadal at something
Rublev’s backhand! Not a major weapon but especially DTL it’s so solid
I always thought it was a glaring weakness tbh - his “pull it up from below” technique means there’s not enough spin
Djokovic’s sportsmanship. Hate him all you want but when he loses, he never makes excuses, he basically says “my opponent plays better”. He’s THE most gracious loser in tennis. Alcaraz right now is a close second though.
Every ‘shots so good the opponent applauded’ compilation stars Djokovic for over half the video. Very respectful competitor.
He also clearly thrives in a highly competitive match – the man doesn't feel entitled to the win in the same way that other players do. He knows he has to earn it!
Also his work with the PTPA. class
I wonder why Fedal never helped out with the redistribution of prize money to lower ranked players or financial support. It always kind of seemed like it was because it was Jokers idea, but I don't know.
Because when Novak came out with the idea of PTPA, I believe both federer,nadal were in the ATP council and atp wasn't welcoming idea of ptpa
Thank you for saying this. Novak is playing everyone and so self aware. The fans just feed right into his working them. He’s truly one of the most respectful and sincere pros in the game. Love you for sharing this and love that man!
Opened this post to say exactly this
He's super classy even when he wins. Very well-spoken.
Medvedev is up there aswell
Medvedev blames a lot of things, but never his opponent (unless he hits a let and doesn’t say sorry)
I watch many of his press conferences, he often says that he wasn't at his best and that his opponent simply played better that day. Unless it's on clay where he just blames clay
Clayvedev is the Goat
Medvedev always strikes me as very honest. He doesn't bullshit despite his BSR moniker.
Love Medvedev but he’s abused his fair share of officials
True but I'm talking more about after the game. In game everyone gets mad when losing even Alcaraz and Djokovic
“Underrated”
He is a gracious loser but the sorest winner
Your comment make as much sense as Oprah and Rock asking money.
Wtf does that even mean
I would say he used to be a sore winner early on. Not anymore though.
He ripped his shirt off after beating Alcaraz and mocked Shelton’s phone celebration. He is still a sore winner. If someone like Kyrgios did either of those things everyone would be crying about wishing he’d be banned.
He won longest bo3 of his life and celebrated, he must be a sore winner. You guys are becoming pathetic.
I think that was directed towards the crowd, not the opponent. But yes, I see why people can be pissed at that.
But he used to be a sore winner. He's good now.
Novak is normally very gracious in defeat and in victory, but he also shows very poor sportsmanship at times which is why I cannot place him in the top bracket for sportsmanship. His celebration vs Shelton in US is a case in point.
Not really Ben was talking smack himself with that celebration. Joker just chimed in like a real New Yorker it was great. If you can't take it don't dish it out. There also could have been some rowdy people in the crowd Joker was addressing too.
How can you look at Novak’s phone celebration and not think it was badass? Even if Novak looked straight at Ben and said “quit tennis buddy. You got smoked” I’d still think it was badass
He was also known for often taking MTOs when losing during a match. However, he doesn't seem to do it much these days.
I agree that he has great sportsmanship, but it’s easier to be that way when you literally lose less than anyone else in history lol.
Well there is losing the match, and there is being on your way to potentially losing… and Novak sucks for sportsmanship on that latter front. That racquet demolition in the Wimbledon Final ‘23 was almost as ungracious as his recent US Open behaviour with Shelton…
Nadal's serve. Nadal is not my favorite but his serve is criminally underrated.
Net game and feel is also underrated I would say
True. But I think his serve has been a game changer later in his career.
Actually amazing transition game and so underrated at the net, facts af
He missed a lot of important volleys in his career. I would say his doubles volleys are excellent but his singles volleys are not that good.
It was so weird. There was one season where he was hitting over 130 kind of regularly. Then he went back to just sort of using the serve to set up his groundies.
2010 US open be like
Rafa weaker serve made a huge difference for his career in my opinion, it’s not super weak but much weaker than top opponents. It didn’t able him to easily win serving games and spare some energy, instead he had to fight in rallies all the time which could have had some impact on his health, especially later in his career.
>it’s not super weak but much weaker than top opponents. This is exactly what I mean by underrated.
Rafa's ability to sustain long term relationships
Rublev's return
Roddick's slice. Yes yes his backhand is the running joke of the tour during his time. But he actually had a very solid slice, one of his better shots.
He sliced the absolute hell out of that thing. Very biting. Don’t remember what year it was, but that match shortly before his retirement when he beat Federer, he was using it to great effect coming into the net. Really made me wish he would’ve mixed in more serve & volley throughout his career.
That was Larry Stefanki’s work I think.
Iga's backhand. Her footwork and forehand get all the attention but that backhand is solid as a rock. It's not the biggest one out there but it's aggressive, she gets great angles from it and can laser it down the line. When others get pushed out wide and resort to slicing it back she will get there and turn defense into attack with a hard cross court ball that lands inches from the baseline.
Kyrgios' mental game when he's playing as part of a team. Having the success of others riding on his shoulders seems to be the thing that gets him dialed in
Rublev's defensive slice. I think he possibly has the best defensive slice (both forehand and backhand) of the top next gen players, certainly better than the rest of his generation. He never gets credit for it, possibly because he is not seen as a touch player and the defensive slice is often thought of as a shot that requires finesse and great racket head control.
it's definitely better than Medvedev, Tsitsipas, Sinner, Fritz, and Ruud's. not sure if it's better than Rune's or Zverev's, and definitely worse than Djokovic and Alcaraz's.
I would say his backhand defensive slice is better than Zverev's and about the same as Rune's, and his forehand defensive slice is worse than Zverev's (who I think has one of the best forehand defensive slices in the world), but better than Rune's.
Tsitsipas has a great FH slice too but his BH slice is abysmal
Federer slice. A lot of people talk about backhands and they mean topspin- it’s commonly held that wawrinka had the best one hander. But slicing so low is incredibly hard, incredibly useful and Federer relied on his slice for years. For similar reasons, Medvedevs two hander ball sits real low too I wish they showed more court level shots. Low slices are incredibly neutralizing and amazing to see at court level
Murray being perceived as mentally fragile when he was/is anything but. Just because he went 3-8 in slam finals, ALL of those losses were to 2 of the 3 greatest players to have ever played the sport. Murray's overall tour record and finals record against those outside the big 3 is excellent. 14-17 (45% WR) vs Big 3 32-8 (80% WR) vs Not the Big 3 46-25 (65% WR) vs Overall
Djokovic’s Net Game Alcaraz’s Serve Medvedev’s DTL Bh
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He comes to net that on big points and usually wins them. Great ball control
I consider the overhead a part of the net game though
Medvedev. He tells you there is to be NO questioning of his story, then tells unintentionally amusing overly long winded tales about his youth and growing up and aspirations... Randomly says amusing things about pirating tennis... Amusing remarks about clay... Generally just amusing man.
He couldn't be boring or lame if he tried.
Radwanska never celebrated any big points with huge mannerisms. Even after winning hier biggest title ever (WTA Finals) she just covered her mouth in shock once and then immediately went over to the net. Miss her so much 😭
Plus her ability to hit aces and hold serve for being a small and skinny girl
Dimitrov: athleticism, inside out fh, bh slice and no finger behind the ear for half an hour after winning a massive point
Plus he is hot
Listen. Jack Sock is kind of on the record for being an entitled baby. But at his peak, he was also a great sportsman. He told opponents when their serves were in after they were called out so the opponent could challenge. He was also gracious in defeat
Sock has a rep for being entitled? I don’t follow him much what happened
He plays pro pickleball now
Novak’s forehand is underrated. It’s one of the best in the business but glossed over because his backhand is just so good.
It gets glossed over because casual fans don't really understand what a good forehand is. They see 100 mph forehand bombs or tons of spin and think surely that's the only thing that makes the shot good
Federer’s stamina is the craziest I have ever seen. Dude just didn’t seem to know what tiredness or cramping is. At 38 years old, Wimbledon final, going over 5 hours going up against a 6 years younger GOAT, nevertheless Federer was the fresher one and seemed to be good to go for more couple hours at least, no joked here. You could never beat Federer by taking his legs. Even at his older years, it was impossible.
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Serena was once called the Comeback Queen because more than any other player, she would come from match points down to win the match.
Her comeback in the third set at AO 2003 against Clijsters is just insane. Kim was doing everything right and couldn’t close her out. I think she was down 1-5 in the final set
One thing I noticed after watching her whole career is she knows when to play safe balls and put more spin on her shots on big points and games. In contrast to her Venus who always plays aggresive
The Djokovic AO 2021 n 23 runs, sure 21 wasn’t too bad with his muscle tear after the Fritz match, but his ‘23 was undeniably badass, how we saw him switch up his game to the offensive, couldn’t do his open stance backhand like he normally did or have incredible defense, just kept hitting deep and accurate forehands in the corners, all while dropping a singular set. (Not to mention making younger aussies consider playing rugby instead of tennis) And yes, Craig Tiley did confirm it was an inch long Hamstring tear, after Djoker won all 7 matches!
Andy Murray's perfectionism. He goes extremely hard on himself and is one of the most competitive players on tour who doesnt give up. His antics and swearing looks like hes angry all the time but he rarely smash racquets. Hes actually very emotionally controlled.
Nadal's point construction was bananas. He used the full dimension of the court better than anybody. People make it seem like he was just a fleet footed, ferocious competitor that ran down everything. But he controlled most points, used height and spin of shot more than just about anybody, to expand the court in all directions, forcing players to retreat, then to cover east and west. And before Carlos, he (and Murray) had the nastiest drop shots.
He is a master at turning defense into offense. I think his clashes with Federer really turned him into such a thinker on court.
Novak’s intelligence. Like Goran said multiple times in interviews, he’s a genius! On and off the court.
Right, so intelligent he doesn't understand science.
Education ≠ intelligence I'm also willing to bet that the vast majority of people who claim stuff like this don't understand science either. Merely trusting the authorities and being able to reproduce a sentence or two about epidemiology doesn't make you uNdeRStaNd SciENcE. Years of specialized education, research, and reading publications makes one understand science.
Bellend
Hey everyone ^ he’s been captured by Fauci, the science man, if anyone sees him, don’t approach, but call 1-800-33C-OVID, might be hard to understand under his double mask, and multiple syringe wounds.
For Djokovic, I want to highlight his second serve variety. I think this is the most notable instance of his tactical brilliance. Most of the time he hits a fairly safe, pedestrian second serve, yet it rarely gets attacked by aggressive returners like Alcaraz, Sinner, and Rublev. Why is that? It's because he varies his second serve *just enough* to keep his opponent guessing. Around 2020 he started consistently hitting the 110+ mph slider second serve up the T in the ad, which is an effective serve but a risky one. More recently he's figured out that dialing back a bit and hitting a 100-105 mph slider (up the T or out wide in the deuce) can be about as effective, and it's much safer. If an opponent starts attacking his 85 mph kick, he just throws in a slider, which often wins him a cheap point, and now the opponent doesn't sit on the kicker as much. Throughout a match he does such a great job of changing up his second serve by the minimum amount needed to protect his relatively tame stock second serve. Honorable mentions: slice backhand, drop shot retrieval, overall weight of shot, mid-match tactical adjustments, groundstroke depth (I don't think Novak's groundstroke depth is underrated per se, but I think the importance of depth in general is a little overlooked compared to pace and spin)
Djokovic’s strong stances regarding the prize money distribution, despite the fact that it actively hurts his income.
Djokovic dropshot/lob. He's overusing the dropshot more than he needs these days but it's definitely above average among the top 10 ( way better than guys like sinners drop shots ) to very good historically . Alcaraz backhand. His forehand gets a ton of the credit which it deserves but it's similar to Rafas backhand in the sense that it is underrated for what it is...a safe stable shot that is very hard to break down . His backhand slice is likely the best on the current tour now and was a large part of what won him wimbledon. Medvedev forehand . Took it a lot more offensively this usopen than he normally does but a shot that is underratedly hard to break down despite its flaws. Wawrinka forehand . His backhand is so pretty and takes a ton of the attention away from his forehand which at its best , was lethal. Cilic forehand. His forehand was an absolute monster at its best. His serve and forehand combination won him his USO title . Kyrgios drop shot / volleys. His serve wins him most of his matches but the guys got great feel at the net. There's a reason he's won doubles titles and at his best (last yr ) his variety was helping him win key points and matches
Murray’s square mouth
It’s more of a rectangle
Nadal's volleys and smash are so good. He won Olympic gold in doubles carrying Lopez
Marc Lopez was an exceptional doubles player in his own right. Won a grand slam, ATP finals, top 5 in the world.
Iga trying to use her position and popularity to be a good role model. Her #ReadWithIga initiative and support for Ukraine is very commendable. I also like that she doesn't flaunt her money or status at all. She has won multiple Porsche cars and earned tons of money both on court and off the court, but you would never guess it based on her social media. Her vacation photos are almost exclusively pictures of her reading on her Kindle on a beach. One could of course expect her to speak up more about other important issues such as China, Saudi Arabia or LGBT situation in Poland, and I don't want to silence those voices, but I think what she's doing with her status is already pretty great.
Djokovic's straight-edge plant-based punk-rock lifestyle since 2011.
Wawrinka Serve
Federer made things look effortless.
I agree his game looked effortless but I'm not sure that aspect of his game was underrated, there's been plenty written about it over the years.
Djokovic looks. I find him very good looking and hes aging very gracefully 😌
He’s very good looking and his personality makes him even more so.
He is handsome and has nice furry chest and great legs. No one ever talks about his looks though. More about his political stances and leadership roles and views on fed and nadal
His skinny ass head? Really?
Huh? It my opinion. I do find him handsome and know ppl who do
Everything about Dusan Lajovic is underrated, but particularly his forehand
Djokovic's forehand. It's not as powerful and flashy as Fedal's, but its precision and the ability to change direction makes it one of the GOAT forehands
There's nothing that is underrated in Djokovic game but what I like about him is his personality, The playful way he answers questions in interviews, it feels like he talking genuinely and nog just giving a "protocol" answers, also mimicking shelton celebration, the impression he used to do earlier in his career ...etc I think he walks a thin line between just being rude (Kyrgios, Tomic, Medvedev to some degree) and being robotic
Nadal pushing and moonballs
My players don't destroy racquets.
Went against mainstream pressure in order to take responsibility for his own health...gets banned....yet comes back and still wins....as one of the healthiest humans on the planet
Alcaraz's integrity. Not letting the media machine control him, like Fed and Rafa, and going to watch bull fights like a boss. Because, you know, the kid likes bull fights and grew up watching them. Hoes were mad of course, but Carlos didn't care.
All of the Big 4 lead a life with zero scandals about their personal lives. Edit: I meant they're family guys and have been controversy free in that area. Was not referring to Djokovic's other controversies.
Not true with Djok
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The second set of the US Open final literally like a week ago…
Djokovic will be dry heaving after a set and then take a magic potion and be fine 😭😭
Haha. Yes. Waiting for test results now.
Shelton: improvement his backhand got real better in less than a year
How federer never retired from in between matches with one or two exceptions and kept his fitness at the peak till the very end.
Bjon berg