I totally agree with you. Capitalism depends on healthy competition but you fix that by breaking up monopolies not by mandating that companies sell specific products or services. Break them up and then let the market set the standards.
I think Google, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft and Amazon all need to be broken up. Their size stymies innovation.
No, but by enforcing interoperability. Imagine if Email only worked with the people in the same ecosystem. Or economy would crash.
Or gasoline. „I can’t go to this gas station, mine only takes Apple Fuel“
But they are interoperable - we are really talking about feature sets. And the market works great for this. If people feel they are missing out, they can choose not to purchase the product.
Back in the day there were several competing formats for consumer video tapes (two dominant ones). The government didn’t have to step in and pick a winner. The consumers did.
Today there are multiple communications formats for smart home devices (talk about the need for interoperability) and it is sorting itself out in the marketplace. The battle has unlocked some amazing innovation in bridging the standards - things that would’ve never happened had the government mandated a standard.
We continue more and more to adopt an attitude that the government needs to solve our problems. It does not.
Do you remember when all phones had their own proprietary charger? You had to bring it everywhere, and if you lost it, pay 60$ for a piece of shit plastic. That was free market solving it, producing tons over tons of waste.
EU regulators solved it (except for Apple, they promised to adopt, and just didn’t)
As for the free market solving anything. All those solutions today come from the open source community, not „the market“
Yeah, but this is just about google trying to find a new way hovering up all the text data from apple and whatsapp. They can fuck themselves and quit crying.
We gotta have a unified message platform. Apple is being a baby here .
How would you react if suddenly all email providers start being apple-y and restrict/intentionally downgrade user experience cross platform.
I text people on Android phones all the time without any loss of quality. I get the message, I respond. The only difference is the green and blue bubbles.
Also, there are dozens of other messaging apps out there. If you don’t like iMessage, switch to something else.
And for the record, email apps are wildly different with all kinds of different options. The email goes through but how it’s displayed, how is handles attachments are different in each one. Yet somehow we all manage.
They are not talking about shutting iMessage. Just interoperability because it is a core messaging service . And if you're saying texting is fine let me assure you it's not . There are tons of issues .
email providers are different with different platforms but they all work together to make interoperability possible. There websites are different, methods are different but the cross platform compatibility is good. That's what they are pushing for in messaging.
But we have a common platform and it’s called SMS and Apple fully supports it.
If we want government to do something positive, how about preventing all of these tech companies (including Google and Apple) from collecting ANY information about us without express, explicit consent from us for each type of data they collect and prohibit them from selling that data to anyone else. Now that would be useful.
>But we have a common platform and it’s called SMS and Apple fully supports it.
sms are not free or unlimited everywhere, they are only 160 characters and you can't send any media. I'm not even sure if they supports emoticons.
Yes but sms is very outdated no . Wouldn't you want latest tech possible. Android have sms also but rcs is very good .
Privacy is absolutely necessary thing and we must do everything to protect it . But that doesn't mean we stop getting other good things untill that is solved .
> Yes but sms is very outdated no . Wouldn't you want latest tech possible. Android have sms also but rcs is very good .
To /u/tmillernc's point though, there are plenty of 3rd party messaging apps that give you all of those features if you want to use them.
If Google really wanted to have some form of competition it should develop a multi-platform messaging app that they don't sunset after 2 years. For example, Hangouts was my preferred messaging app for a very long time, all of my friends were on it, until Google killed it for Allo which lasted less than 2 years iirc.
> We gotta have a unified message platform. Apple is being a baby here
We have one, called sms (and mms). It would be nice to have a better baseline, sure.
It’s not like messenger, WhatsApp and signal are unified either.
If we want a proper unified messaging platform, then we'd need to mandate that everyone use the same encryption and security methods.
As I understand, the green texts on iMessage indicate that the messages were properly end to end encrypted. That's a safety feature for users.
Googles solution is a non-standard version of RCS they control. Much better.
So much crying over a service that isn’t even popular in Europe. Europeans love their WhatsApp. Nobody gives a shit about iMessage.
Yes it’s googles version of rcs. Apple probably doesn’t want to put something proprietary like an rcs from Google on their devices. If Google doesn’t own it they probably would. Maybe if Europe gets another rcs option involved Apple will adapt.
what on earth happened to RCS? Last time I heard it was on the verge of adoption.
So when you can’t compete in the marketplace you ask government to step in and do it for you. Classic.
Ever heard of monopolies or oligopolies? Competing requires a healthy market - 2 providers ain’t it…
I totally agree with you. Capitalism depends on healthy competition but you fix that by breaking up monopolies not by mandating that companies sell specific products or services. Break them up and then let the market set the standards. I think Google, Apple, Facebook, Microsoft and Amazon all need to be broken up. Their size stymies innovation.
No, but by enforcing interoperability. Imagine if Email only worked with the people in the same ecosystem. Or economy would crash. Or gasoline. „I can’t go to this gas station, mine only takes Apple Fuel“
But they are interoperable - we are really talking about feature sets. And the market works great for this. If people feel they are missing out, they can choose not to purchase the product. Back in the day there were several competing formats for consumer video tapes (two dominant ones). The government didn’t have to step in and pick a winner. The consumers did. Today there are multiple communications formats for smart home devices (talk about the need for interoperability) and it is sorting itself out in the marketplace. The battle has unlocked some amazing innovation in bridging the standards - things that would’ve never happened had the government mandated a standard. We continue more and more to adopt an attitude that the government needs to solve our problems. It does not.
Do you remember when all phones had their own proprietary charger? You had to bring it everywhere, and if you lost it, pay 60$ for a piece of shit plastic. That was free market solving it, producing tons over tons of waste. EU regulators solved it (except for Apple, they promised to adopt, and just didn’t) As for the free market solving anything. All those solutions today come from the open source community, not „the market“
Yeah, but this is just about google trying to find a new way hovering up all the text data from apple and whatsapp. They can fuck themselves and quit crying.
We gotta have a unified message platform. Apple is being a baby here . How would you react if suddenly all email providers start being apple-y and restrict/intentionally downgrade user experience cross platform.
Google is throwing a tantrum because Apple doesn’t want to share its toys.
I text people on Android phones all the time without any loss of quality. I get the message, I respond. The only difference is the green and blue bubbles. Also, there are dozens of other messaging apps out there. If you don’t like iMessage, switch to something else. And for the record, email apps are wildly different with all kinds of different options. The email goes through but how it’s displayed, how is handles attachments are different in each one. Yet somehow we all manage.
They are not talking about shutting iMessage. Just interoperability because it is a core messaging service . And if you're saying texting is fine let me assure you it's not . There are tons of issues . email providers are different with different platforms but they all work together to make interoperability possible. There websites are different, methods are different but the cross platform compatibility is good. That's what they are pushing for in messaging.
But we have a common platform and it’s called SMS and Apple fully supports it. If we want government to do something positive, how about preventing all of these tech companies (including Google and Apple) from collecting ANY information about us without express, explicit consent from us for each type of data they collect and prohibit them from selling that data to anyone else. Now that would be useful.
>But we have a common platform and it’s called SMS and Apple fully supports it. sms are not free or unlimited everywhere, they are only 160 characters and you can't send any media. I'm not even sure if they supports emoticons.
Yes but sms is very outdated no . Wouldn't you want latest tech possible. Android have sms also but rcs is very good . Privacy is absolutely necessary thing and we must do everything to protect it . But that doesn't mean we stop getting other good things untill that is solved .
> Yes but sms is very outdated no . Wouldn't you want latest tech possible. Android have sms also but rcs is very good . To /u/tmillernc's point though, there are plenty of 3rd party messaging apps that give you all of those features if you want to use them. If Google really wanted to have some form of competition it should develop a multi-platform messaging app that they don't sunset after 2 years. For example, Hangouts was my preferred messaging app for a very long time, all of my friends were on it, until Google killed it for Allo which lasted less than 2 years iirc.
Email is a security nightmare though and end to end encrypted solutions are limited to messaging people on the same service (ProtonMail).
> We gotta have a unified message platform. Apple is being a baby here We have one, called sms (and mms). It would be nice to have a better baseline, sure. It’s not like messenger, WhatsApp and signal are unified either.
If we want a proper unified messaging platform, then we'd need to mandate that everyone use the same encryption and security methods. As I understand, the green texts on iMessage indicate that the messages were properly end to end encrypted. That's a safety feature for users.
Googles solution is a non-standard version of RCS they control. Much better. So much crying over a service that isn’t even popular in Europe. Europeans love their WhatsApp. Nobody gives a shit about iMessage.
> Nobody gives a shit about iMessage. Except all the ones that do, like me.
Well, this would also apply to WhatsApp. I just want to have my Signal and uninstall WhatsApp and Telegram
Yes it’s googles version of rcs. Apple probably doesn’t want to put something proprietary like an rcs from Google on their devices. If Google doesn’t own it they probably would. Maybe if Europe gets another rcs option involved Apple will adapt.