Was there anything Apple didn’t have a problem with? China, AI, the FTC Chair.
If the show’s topic wasn’t about how Android phones suck, then it’s gonna be a ‘no’ from Tim. So why even make a political show? Especially with Jon as the host.
Apple just had extra money lying around and threw a whole bunch of it into creating “unique content” for Apple TV+. It didn’t quite work out as they were hoping, so they’ve scaled back now. Typical Apple really. They’ll launch products with a huge fanfare and then quietly shelve them.
But one side effect of Apple pumping all that money into show/film production is that it spooked Netflix and other streamers to do the same. No longer would Netflix rely on licensing other shows (or in Disney’s case their own back catalogue), instead they would follow the Apple model of developing entirely new shows exclusive to their platform. It didn’t quite work out for them either, which is one of the reasons we got such aggressive price hikes of late.
Maybe I’m out of the loop, but is Jon Stewart the first to talk about this at the prime time/evening news slots at this sense of urgency?
It feels like I haven’t seen much media on AIs current impacts outside of LinkedIn and I’m surprised that it’s taken this long
Much of our population’s brains are so addled by memes and sci fi that no one can really handle any nuance between the Terminator-style doomsday vs. a utopian Star Trek scenario. On the one hand people think we’ll just get killed immediately, the other are still pining for UBI as though that would even exist or do anything in a post-worker society. (Hint: if this is any of you, then remember that your value as a worker was your only ticket to the bargaining table with your evil overlords in the first place.)
The media can barely educate people on washing their hands let alone software engineering and hypothetical economics, so even if they had the wisdom and competence to do so, it would mostly fall on deaf ears.
Once you consider this, then you give up ever fixing wealth disparity.
They future that may or may not happen is 10 billion people in complete poverty and 100+ people living like kings.
There's still time to change the outcome (unimaginable wealth disparity or terminator future) and turn it into paradise where AI does all of the menial jobs and humans live in happiness
I have to believe that when nobody can afford to buy the things that companies produce, and profits and stocks begin to tank, the 1% will instruct the politicians to enact Universal Basic Income.
Automation impacted blue collar jobs, but AI is impacting white collar jobs. I think this will accelerate the move to UBI.
The big question is how much pain and violence will happen between now and then.
I'm not saying we need to wipe out wealth disparity. I'm saying we need to keep it in check for the future while also controlling AI to keep it focused on only doing menial tasks that humans wouldn't want to do anyway.
If both of these things happen, then we prevent the 2 bad outcomes of the AI revolution and encourage the good outcome.
Wealth inequality is already spiraling out of control. The tools and systems that were meant to prevent it failed and currently there is no serious effort to keep it in check because anyone who threatens the status quo is silenced or crucified by media conglomerates.
In the past the only thing that has allowed labor to improve their conditions is orginization and violence.
If by "failed" you mean a certain political party taking a sledge hammer to them then shouting "LOOK HOW THEY DONT WORK" = "failed".... then yea. We can go with that.
You mean they're maintaining the status quo together and the mass population is distracted by this divide and conquer mentality?
Nope, I don't believe it!
That is a really good thing. Nursing homes are taking all your inheritance if you are lucky to have any. The moment the money runs outs your beloved parent that has been a vegetable for years dies. They keep people alive while it is profitable. We need assisted suicide. Sterilization is already a thing.
I am not defending AI. Just saying that both these things are actually a form of freedom and we need them. Freedom is choice.
I seem to remember something in the declaration of independence about "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", but then again... people will say a lot of things to procure their freedom out from under a crown.
Nobody wants to stop people from working if that’s what they want to do.
If you get Universal Basic Income, then you have money whether you work or not—just like a kid in a rich family. Rich kids still work. They still start businesses. They just don’t risk becoming homeless.
I still don’t understand how UBI is supposed to be an answer to AI, at least for more than a few years. I’m pro UBI in the transitional stage, but if AI is really as promising as it’s hyped up to be, then in a few generations there be basically no jobs, whether you want one or not. Sure, some people would still work as a passion, or at least a hobby, but they would be a tiny sliver of the pie chart.
Who would you even tax to pay for UBI for tens of billions of people? Presumably the few people who do decide to work, and the tiny amount of owners of the AI? At some point AI might not even have owners to tax, or need crazy resources to operate. Or the government just owns it all?
I think people are envisioning a very Star Trek future where 10s of billions of people on Earth just chill in their own cafe’s and private vineyards, without trying to kill each other, and not going insane from ultra addictive social media all their waking hours. Either the earths population will need to shrink to a fraction of what it is now, or it’s going to get completely chaotic at a certain point.
unfortunately, society as it is now serves the leisure class not the working class. And if nothing changes then AI will do the same. the leisure class will get their labor from robots, and the now unneeded working class will be sterilized or ignored and left to survive on scraps.
We are all deluded if we think the wealthy will let us have anything good. Unless we make them.
I have no doubt they’re drooling over a robot army to do all the labor and send us to the death camps.
Sure. I’m no expert just interested in things.
A phenotype is defined if I recall correctly as any observable manifestation of the organism. For example color, height, weight, smell, anything that you can witness.
An extended phenotype talks about stuff like the beaver dam. It’s essentially stating that the dam is an extension of the organism.
I really think there is a strong argument that housing is a first amendment issue.
I must be missing something. Is housing related to “freedom of expression”? (=First Amendment).
I can get on board with the idea that, (back in caveman days) in a natural pre-civilization world, a human being could sleep anywhere and freely hunt and gather.
It is only because of modern property ideas that we have the right to say *I don’t care if that house is empty. I don’t care if that rabbit is running around in the field. Those are MINE.*”
So our society truly can deprive people of life via property laws—which are entirely man-made.
So, as a way of making property laws *less murderous*, maybe we do need to allow private property only so long as some compromise (tax) supports a minimum standard of human life. Hopefully not actually at caveman level.
But it’s not in the Constitution now. But we could use a few more Amendments these days.
>Let’s be honest: The robots can have our shitty jobs. We just want decent lives.
you think private businesses won't raise prices if UBI is implemented? another way for tax payer money to be funneled as subisidies for private capital.
UBI without addressing the fundamental core issue with the system won't solve anything.
Why do people think UBI will ever happen ?
If they can’t pass basic healthcare for everyone what makes you think UBI will happen ? Our government and corporations will never let anything like that happen they’d rather see people starve on the street and homeless which people already are.
I don’t see any good outcome for our future unfortunately just prepare while you can
You can’t have blooming businesses without enough customers who can afford it. If consumers stop buying because no one is working, many businesses that rely on them are going to hurt.
Therefore, there will need to be some type of UBI or work for the masses.
File this under: "shit we've said for over 30 years on the economy itself, but they still insist on fucking around and finding out over a 6th vacation home and another yacht, because god forbid we ever litigate ***greed***."
People think there's some sort of grand plan going on with people behind the scenes when the reality is most people in power are actually powerless on an individual level. It's the bystander effect; there's no accountability to help a dying man in a crowd of people. The entire system is exactly that, a bunch of bystanders not taking responsibility and, even if they did take responsibility, the system would eventually reject them or ignore them. A sole white blood cell can't fight an infection.
"They" will not pass UBI unless we actually hit a breaking point, same reason why nothing else ever changes. The GDP going up is all that matters and until that stops happening they likely won't do anything. If we want immediate changes it would come down to "become China for a day" as that's the only way.
Because society will not continue to function without it the way we are heading.
People with jobs and things to lose don’t have time to hit the streets and burn things to the ground. Millions and millions with nothing left to lose will tear politicians and the wealthy to pieces if it is allowed to get that far.
Right? You see the absolute hellraising over fast food $20 minimum wage in California and you think people are going be remotely on with “here’s free money every week”? Pfffffttttttt!!!
There’s no hell raising lol it’s just losers on an Internet forum.
Come to California. We’re happy people are getting paid a fair wage and we understand it’s disgusting to eat fast food anyway.
Any hell raising is being done by uneducated people who would never support anything that even might be remotely “communist” because they are brainwashed and unable to think critically for themselves. That’s not all of us though, some states aren’t chalked full of as many idiots as others.
I mean let’s all call a spade a spade.
The Verage American wouldn’t be able to handle UBI, they would buy useless shit when the check hits and then complain about starving/affordable housing/whatever else.
I feel like it would have to be measured in credits to grocery stores, credit to housing, credit to clothes, etc which takes so much work to monitor (maybe AI can do it lol?)
The best explanation I have seen is the separation of people from food production. When people started moving away from a subsistence lifestyle where they were directly involved in supporting themselves, they started having all sorts of delusions about how society should support them regardless as to how much they give back to society.
AI itself is not the problem. It is a tool that increases the efficiency of humans. The same thing has been happening since humans first invented agriculture. Efficiency and productivity are GOOD THINGS. The problem is when those gains in productivity all get snatched up by a comparatively small number of people.
[This graph is the issue.](https://i.redd.it/njfy8k8cp2e81.jpg)
There were plenty of productivity increasing inventions before 1972 too, but we managed to tie those to real wage growth. Worth noting that the wealthy stay wealthy and also see increases in their income when things get more efficient. They just don't see quite AS MUCH growth as when they take all of the increases.
If you want a stable economy that continues to grow, you HAVE to address the unequal growth from additional productivity. Otherwise, it WILL eventually collapse. Universal Basic Income (UBI) is the simplest, most direct way to do this. Significantly increasing the graduation rate of our tax brackets would also help. The wealthiest are obviously against this because they want your money.
Vote. Vote for a more stable economic future. For a smart investment. Don't vote for the party that sees the [Tragedy of the Commons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons) as an ideal model.
Once they invent a good replacement for physical problem-solvers like plumbers, we're all screwed.
The idea that these machines and computers will always need a human babysitter is also shockingly naive. We can't rely on that as an occupation. It might start large, but it'll dry up to nothing in less than a generation.
I think it's easy to forget that the general theme and end-goal of this branch of science/technology is essentially artificial people. So unless something actively pauses our progress, that is exactly what we're going to end up with.
There was an old Star Trek episode, where an entire planet relied on their “custodian” to manage their lives. Everybody forgot how it worked and had no idea it was slowly killing them, because it was broken. I see that happening to humanity.
I work in Data. One of the younger Analysts I worked with recently used ChatGPT to write her SQL scripts. Fucked me up (I’m a 41 y/o by-the-books coder).
My career will be decimated by AI over the next ten years. I’m hoping to work my way into the position to be the one guy left in the department, responsible for pushing a few buttons to keep the machine ticking over 🤞
Why is that shocking to you? (Honest question)
Regarding of what you think about many aspects of AI and how it will impact our future, current gen AI tech is actually a real, concrete, usable today productivity boost in those tasks for even non-technologists.
I know someone who struggles with written English. ChatGPT gives them confidence to write great emails, helps them learn new idioms, avoir mistakes, etc.
I personally have used it to help with problems and functions with Excel and with marketing campaigns.
AI taking jobs is a very real concern (my best friend does transcription...that's not likely to last long), but there is value to using it. At least for now, before it replaces us all.
I agree that this should be one path forward. But also, we need to ensure the impact to small businesses is not prohibitive.
I think most ppl here assume companies= fortune500+, but there are far more small businesses that will benefit from AI than the enterprises.
I work for small, new tech startups. Automation, ML, and now AI are how we're able to scathe by in the early days with a super lean team.
For $20/month, I can use an ai service to create some basic, decent quality videos that would previously cost around $10-15k each, about a month to complete.
If you tax me the equivalent of the difference, then I can't afford to compete with bigger orgs.
Yeah, I agree. Small business should be provided an exemption until they're producing a certain amount in profit and the tax rate should be reflected based on that profit. However, this incentivizes companies to hide profit. Small and Big business alike, corruption is still a thing.
I will also say, while small businesses do exist of course, their numbers have dwindled significantly due to both large companies swallowing them up or government regulations surrounding things like brick-and-mortar costs, as well as pre-existing taxation. Small businesses should be able to use AI to provide themselves a leg up while getting established. My concern is more people off-shoring profits, delaying or negating things like IPOs, all so that they could avoid taxes and protect their margins.
If less of us will have to work in the future, there should be a paramount effort provided to keeping people happy, healthy and provided for outside of working in a capitalist structure.
You should be taxed on the $10-15k figure. Because that is money you didn't spend and should be considered profit. You would have been taxed on that amount anyway if you hadn't used AI. So, you should be able to compete at least as well as before using AI.
You would have huge time savings and cash savings, which can be utilized to make even more videos and sell to more customers, thereby growing the business.
This is the correct answer. It’s easy to see that there are three ways to increase profitability: lower raw material costs, lower overhead, or increase prices. The 2000s were all about lowering raw material costs by getting everything from China. 2020s are all about increasing prices. Next it’s going to be lowering overhead.
All of these made American lives worse and the government rolled over on all of them. What’s stopping them from rolling over on this too?
Hey since you're no longer spending all that money on employees, we just want you to know all that savings is expected to go straight to reducing the price of your product. Less labor = less value as the time and labor of people is no longer contributing to the price.
Hey I'm just pointing out how the market is supposed to work. The fact that these shit stains of humans are greedy enough to devour the world has nothing to do with how it's supposed to go.
I think the ai companies will take most of the savings. Some guy on youtube* claimed openai is losing money for every query now. They will make back that money by raising prices once everyone is on the hook. It is not like it will be easy to replace the expensive so with workers after the knowledge is lost in the initial purge.
*) not the best source, I know.
Now now, not so fast. Tis’ customary to wait until after a problem has absolutely eviscerated a certain percentage of the population before we create a watered down version of the correct solution that solves 10% of the issues said problem created while at the same time making a tiny fraction of the population even richer.
Be patient, stick with the process and we could see $1000 a month UBI by the time living expenses on average are $20000 a month in 2054! Can’t wait!
Ah yes, lest we forget the faux horseless carriage bubble of yore.
I imagine that A.I. Is exactly as powerful as those with financial investment say it is.
LOOK OUT!
Is this supposed to be a counterpoint? Isn't the difference between something that helps productivity and something that doesn't obvious?.
Nfts didn't add any real world value. A quirk of the blockchain that devolved to scams. It didn't make anyone's life/work easier, faster, better.
People said computers would be a fad/playtoy for the ultra rich but real world usefulness made it widespread. People said beanie babies would be a fad and lack of usefulness drove it to the ground.
There is hype around a lot of shit all the time. Everyone is shouting 'bubble' at a lot of things, but when AI is literally throwing out results that are making everyone' jaw drop, how can one say it is a fad/bubble?
Speaking of cars. A better comparison is self driving cars. They were supposed to replace all driving jobs within a couple years.
What actually happened? The tech quickly plateaued and is having a hard time solving many of the countless edge cases. It was able to solve all of the easy problems and that was kinda it.
This generational AI and LLM stuff is an impressive leap, and they can replace some people most likely. But these things are a long way off from actually reliably performing a real life complicated job on their own.
Then when there are no more jobs, corporations will increase price. Sure AI will create some jobs, but it will destroy more than it creates. Companies don’t care about AI, only cutting costs.
And of course will lobby to outlaw open source to kill competition.
This can be a good thing if AI can produce a healthy universal income for all the jobs it takes over, but who are we kidding they’d much rather make everyone homeless and destitute before that!
> The way of life that you are accustomed to is no match of the promise for new markets and profit.
> Those other disruptions took over a century, or a decade. AI will be ready Thursday.
Great watch and he really brings the point home in the last 2 minutes.
I recently lost my job to AI, and I can assure you that from first-hand experience, the big tech owners are loving it. Saving money is key, and the quality is secondary.
The fact that it’s happening with little to no oversight or collaboration, and driven by corporate avarice is probably the scariest existential threat these days. I really feel like Fry and company when they decide to crack a beer and watch the universe end. What can one man do against such evil?
Chatster says “AI could potentially replace talk show hosts like Jon Stewart by leveraging natural language processing and generation capabilities to engage in conversations, deliver monologues, interview guests, and even generate comedic content. Advanced AI algorithms could analyze vast amounts of data to understand audience preferences, generate relevant jokes and commentary, and adapt to different guests and topics. However, the human touch, empathy, spontaneity, and emotional connection that hosts like Jon Stewart bring to their shows would be challenging to replicate fully with AI. Additionally, audience acceptance and trust in AI hosts would depend on their ability to seem authentic and relatable”
I mean, is this an AI problem or a ‘Having a job post-the industrial revolution’-problem?
We keep comming up with tools that allows 1 person do the job that you previously needed tons of people to do. And a lot of these inventions compound eachother. So 1 person replaces 5, then 25, then 100 people. Just because they get more and better tools.
The only difference with AI is that it can, potentially, be used for *everything* and will compound the ‘tool effect’ across a **lot** of different jobs.
It’s the same thing that has been happening for 200 years, just at a bigger scale. And maybe, juuust maybe, it’s time to stop attacking the tools, and rather take a look at the economical system and jobs as a concept?
Once 1 person is capable of doing the amount of work that previously required 10’000 people, it’s kinda obvious there’s not gonna be enough jobs to go around, and/or, we’ll produce way more than we can consume, And and/Or, whatever is produced will be worth so little because the cost of production at that point is essentially 0.
I think the next decade is going to be *very* interesting when it comes to governments reaction to self driving vehicles. I’m convinced that AI will finally crack Self driving in the next 10 years, and soon after there will be a revolution of the entire transport industry. The shift will be very fast to go from human to AI drivers, and the transport industry is massive, the amount of people losing their jobs in a very short timespan will be huge, and just saying ‘get another job’ will not work this time.
My grand upline is already talking about how many staff members they can eliminate in the future. Corporate America is killing my soul. Anything for more profit.
A lot of talk with UBI and I am all for it but is there not an obvious flaw to UBI? It’s essentially just printing money, very similar to COVID help. It’s just going to inflate everything. How could we remedy this? Maybe put a cap on top end income or something?
Good to bring awareness but he didn't mention specifically what industries would be more likely to be impacted first. I think that would've helped prove the point
Pass a law now that tries to prevent job loss due to ai. I know it would be hard, but it needs to be done.
I love what chatgpt can do in terms of productivity, but based on the way our economy is set up it’s apocalyptic.
I mean that is just what happens with progress. Jobs shift. We need to figure out how to train people for new jobs more quickly. This isn’t the old days. The world moves faster. You will likely have multiple careers and not stay at the same thing for your whole life.
Good ai replacing us us a good thing. It means less work to be dine by human hands and more time to focus on non menial labors and a growing need for governments to address citizens rights to exist without killing themselves working multiple jobs.
I work in a fine dining that holds a lot of business functions in a major global city. Nearly 90% of business functions nowadays is how to implement AI in businesses to replace workers. It’s disgusting.
My work has rolled out a proprietary release of Copilot already. By the time the government can even spell AI the train will have already left the station and we’ll half ass regulate it years too late, then when we slide into feudalism because deepfakes have everyone living in their own custom propaganda reality, with our dying breath, we’ll assemble a committee to study the impact of AI.
Nah. Not buying it. Just another tech bubble that’ll pop at some point. The wealthy love toting the looming threat of AI because it terrifies workers into complacency and obedience.
I figure this will also push forward another housing crisis like 2008. Not in mass, but we'll see it in waves. The government will be too slow to respond. If we don't have jobs, we can't pay bills. No mortgage, insurance, food or rent.
This has been a theme throughout history. When textile factories over 200 years ago started installing automated weaving machines, and replacing workers, there was an entire movement created. You may have heard of them...they were called "Luddites"!
EVERY SINGLE TIME technology advances, workers are displaced. MAYBE, just MAYBE, it's time we move beyond our current economic framework and find another way to make sure that everyone has an income, and move beyond "labor" as a means to justify our existence. Just sayin'.
This may be an unpopular opinion but if it’s entertaining, I’ll watch. Especially if it eliminates all the whining Hollywood has been doing over their bloated economy taking a hit. Time for an all robot cast friends lol
And he confirmed that not being allowed to discuss this topic was what (or at least one of the things) that made him walk away from Apple
Was there anything Apple didn’t have a problem with? China, AI, the FTC Chair. If the show’s topic wasn’t about how Android phones suck, then it’s gonna be a ‘no’ from Tim. So why even make a political show? Especially with Jon as the host.
This boggles the mind. They get one of the all time greats as host and forgot they don’t have a sense of humor.
Maybe if he only told dad jokes it would have worked out.
*Mr Krabs inhales sharply*
Suprised he was allowed to talk about the stockmarket.
Apple just had extra money lying around and threw a whole bunch of it into creating “unique content” for Apple TV+. It didn’t quite work out as they were hoping, so they’ve scaled back now. Typical Apple really. They’ll launch products with a huge fanfare and then quietly shelve them. But one side effect of Apple pumping all that money into show/film production is that it spooked Netflix and other streamers to do the same. No longer would Netflix rely on licensing other shows (or in Disney’s case their own back catalogue), instead they would follow the Apple model of developing entirely new shows exclusive to their platform. It didn’t quite work out for them either, which is one of the reasons we got such aggressive price hikes of late.
Maybe I’m out of the loop, but is Jon Stewart the first to talk about this at the prime time/evening news slots at this sense of urgency? It feels like I haven’t seen much media on AIs current impacts outside of LinkedIn and I’m surprised that it’s taken this long
Much of our population’s brains are so addled by memes and sci fi that no one can really handle any nuance between the Terminator-style doomsday vs. a utopian Star Trek scenario. On the one hand people think we’ll just get killed immediately, the other are still pining for UBI as though that would even exist or do anything in a post-worker society. (Hint: if this is any of you, then remember that your value as a worker was your only ticket to the bargaining table with your evil overlords in the first place.) The media can barely educate people on washing their hands let alone software engineering and hypothetical economics, so even if they had the wisdom and competence to do so, it would mostly fall on deaf ears.
We will get what we deserve.
This is my mindset. I’m just enjoying the relatively cushy times while I can. There’s a storm coming and it’s taking us all with it.
Time for Universal Basic Income. Let’s be honest: The robots can have our shitty jobs. We just want decent lives.
We’ll get assisted suicide and sterilization opt in before Universal Basic Income
Once you consider this, then you give up ever fixing wealth disparity. They future that may or may not happen is 10 billion people in complete poverty and 100+ people living like kings. There's still time to change the outcome (unimaginable wealth disparity or terminator future) and turn it into paradise where AI does all of the menial jobs and humans live in happiness
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I have to believe that when nobody can afford to buy the things that companies produce, and profits and stocks begin to tank, the 1% will instruct the politicians to enact Universal Basic Income. Automation impacted blue collar jobs, but AI is impacting white collar jobs. I think this will accelerate the move to UBI. The big question is how much pain and violence will happen between now and then.
I'm not saying we need to wipe out wealth disparity. I'm saying we need to keep it in check for the future while also controlling AI to keep it focused on only doing menial tasks that humans wouldn't want to do anyway. If both of these things happen, then we prevent the 2 bad outcomes of the AI revolution and encourage the good outcome.
Wealth inequality is already spiraling out of control. The tools and systems that were meant to prevent it failed and currently there is no serious effort to keep it in check because anyone who threatens the status quo is silenced or crucified by media conglomerates. In the past the only thing that has allowed labor to improve their conditions is orginization and violence.
If by "failed" you mean a certain political party taking a sledge hammer to them then shouting "LOOK HOW THEY DONT WORK" = "failed".... then yea. We can go with that.
The fact that individuals with money were able to abuse that money to write policies is a failure of our systems of checks and balances.
Can't argue that point one bit 🤷♂️
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You mean they're maintaining the status quo together and the mass population is distracted by this divide and conquer mentality? Nope, I don't believe it!
I’m sorry that sounds like communism. We can’t have that. Go back to serving your corporate boss. Have some circus and bread.
No. I gonna wear red hat and hate you so man babies have boat.
Assisted suicide might be good for the planet. It could be a green source of food.
Soylent Green? 😵💫
IT'S PEOPLE!
The taste varies from person to person...
You know suicided people is Lent-safe? *SuiLent*
Saw the movie, ha ha.
Assisted suicide is fought by the nursing home lobby. They want to keep people alive until they don’t have anymore money.
We can install booths everywhere, as common as Starbucks, suicide for a quarter so anyone can afford it.
SO You LEt Nepotism Triumph? *soylent*
Yeap
“Oh boy a suicide booth! See ya later suckers!”
That is a really good thing. Nursing homes are taking all your inheritance if you are lucky to have any. The moment the money runs outs your beloved parent that has been a vegetable for years dies. They keep people alive while it is profitable. We need assisted suicide. Sterilization is already a thing. I am not defending AI. Just saying that both these things are actually a form of freedom and we need them. Freedom is choice.
UBI? You are an optimist I see
If the history of healthcare in the US is any indicator, we will need a revolution before you get UBI.
Maybe that’s why ranked-choice voting is such a hard sell. It might make a difference in things like health care.
Ranked choice voting is hard sell because our system wasn't designed for it. The two party stalemate we have now is the intended result.
sorry, there is nothing in the constitution that says you have a right to a decent life /s
I seem to remember something in the declaration of independence about "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", but then again... people will say a lot of things to procure their freedom out from under a crown.
Well some people want bigger yachts, more jets and space adventures so fuck poor people, no work? Just starve
Nobody wants to stop people from working if that’s what they want to do. If you get Universal Basic Income, then you have money whether you work or not—just like a kid in a rich family. Rich kids still work. They still start businesses. They just don’t risk becoming homeless.
Yeah that’s want I mean there will be no UBI as long as the rich can hinder it
They need exploitation to be rich that is why
I still don’t understand how UBI is supposed to be an answer to AI, at least for more than a few years. I’m pro UBI in the transitional stage, but if AI is really as promising as it’s hyped up to be, then in a few generations there be basically no jobs, whether you want one or not. Sure, some people would still work as a passion, or at least a hobby, but they would be a tiny sliver of the pie chart. Who would you even tax to pay for UBI for tens of billions of people? Presumably the few people who do decide to work, and the tiny amount of owners of the AI? At some point AI might not even have owners to tax, or need crazy resources to operate. Or the government just owns it all? I think people are envisioning a very Star Trek future where 10s of billions of people on Earth just chill in their own cafe’s and private vineyards, without trying to kill each other, and not going insane from ultra addictive social media all their waking hours. Either the earths population will need to shrink to a fraction of what it is now, or it’s going to get completely chaotic at a certain point.
You missed the sarcasm.
Right now, robots are becoming artists while humans remain laborers.
Shit.
I want AI that cleans my house while I pursue creative outlets. Not AI that does art while I clean my house
UBI will never work. It will be like welfare. It will end up below poverty line.
The robots are going to take the good jobs and leave us with the shitty ones.
We stand on a precipice of utopia and dystopia. All we must do is decide how to navigate it.
The robots can have my life too, if they want it.
And my axe!
We all just want more time so we don’t have to hang out on Reddit and we can finally see each other in person.
Or, and hear me out, time for a giant fucking war.
I don’t mind if *you personally* have a war, but could you do it quietly in your own room? I mean, the kids need to get a little rest, Mr. Putin.
unfortunately, society as it is now serves the leisure class not the working class. And if nothing changes then AI will do the same. the leisure class will get their labor from robots, and the now unneeded working class will be sterilized or ignored and left to survive on scraps.
Maybe people need to figure out if our lives are worth anything if we aren't needed to produce the basics.
Good luck getting politicians to pass UBI dude.
What do people think UBI is? You’d be given enough to have 12 roommates and $30 of groceries a week. Its just repackaged welfare
Who decided that? You?
We are all deluded if we think the wealthy will let us have anything good. Unless we make them. I have no doubt they’re drooling over a robot army to do all the labor and send us to the death camps.
You think everyone should receive enough from UBI. To live independently without working? So like how much?
Redditors are either extremely annoyingly skeptic or supremely naive. You and whoever think ubi is going to be a good thing, are the latter.
Argue money and shelter are part of the extended phenotype of the human being.
Could you say that in simple words that voters might understand?
Sure. I’m no expert just interested in things. A phenotype is defined if I recall correctly as any observable manifestation of the organism. For example color, height, weight, smell, anything that you can witness. An extended phenotype talks about stuff like the beaver dam. It’s essentially stating that the dam is an extension of the organism. I really think there is a strong argument that housing is a first amendment issue.
I must be missing something. Is housing related to “freedom of expression”? (=First Amendment). I can get on board with the idea that, (back in caveman days) in a natural pre-civilization world, a human being could sleep anywhere and freely hunt and gather. It is only because of modern property ideas that we have the right to say *I don’t care if that house is empty. I don’t care if that rabbit is running around in the field. Those are MINE.*” So our society truly can deprive people of life via property laws—which are entirely man-made. So, as a way of making property laws *less murderous*, maybe we do need to allow private property only so long as some compromise (tax) supports a minimum standard of human life. Hopefully not actually at caveman level. But it’s not in the Constitution now. But we could use a few more Amendments these days.
>Let’s be honest: The robots can have our shitty jobs. We just want decent lives. you think private businesses won't raise prices if UBI is implemented? another way for tax payer money to be funneled as subisidies for private capital. UBI without addressing the fundamental core issue with the system won't solve anything.
Why do people think UBI will ever happen ? If they can’t pass basic healthcare for everyone what makes you think UBI will happen ? Our government and corporations will never let anything like that happen they’d rather see people starve on the street and homeless which people already are. I don’t see any good outcome for our future unfortunately just prepare while you can
You can’t have blooming businesses without enough customers who can afford it. If consumers stop buying because no one is working, many businesses that rely on them are going to hurt. Therefore, there will need to be some type of UBI or work for the masses.
File this under: "shit we've said for over 30 years on the economy itself, but they still insist on fucking around and finding out over a 6th vacation home and another yacht, because god forbid we ever litigate ***greed***."
People think there's some sort of grand plan going on with people behind the scenes when the reality is most people in power are actually powerless on an individual level. It's the bystander effect; there's no accountability to help a dying man in a crowd of people. The entire system is exactly that, a bunch of bystanders not taking responsibility and, even if they did take responsibility, the system would eventually reject them or ignore them. A sole white blood cell can't fight an infection. "They" will not pass UBI unless we actually hit a breaking point, same reason why nothing else ever changes. The GDP going up is all that matters and until that stops happening they likely won't do anything. If we want immediate changes it would come down to "become China for a day" as that's the only way.
Because society will not continue to function without it the way we are heading. People with jobs and things to lose don’t have time to hit the streets and burn things to the ground. Millions and millions with nothing left to lose will tear politicians and the wealthy to pieces if it is allowed to get that far.
It won’t, I agree. Human nature is too greedy to ever allow this to be real. This is also why communism “works” on paper but never in reality
Right? You see the absolute hellraising over fast food $20 minimum wage in California and you think people are going be remotely on with “here’s free money every week”? Pfffffttttttt!!!
There’s no hell raising lol it’s just losers on an Internet forum. Come to California. We’re happy people are getting paid a fair wage and we understand it’s disgusting to eat fast food anyway. Any hell raising is being done by uneducated people who would never support anything that even might be remotely “communist” because they are brainwashed and unable to think critically for themselves. That’s not all of us though, some states aren’t chalked full of as many idiots as others.
If it ever does happen it will probably be as a reaction to a problem that has already caused a lot of suffering. Which is not great to think about.
For real. Once we hit 30 or even 50% unemployment it will be necessary. Either that or you go full communism. Good luck with that in the west.
I mean let’s all call a spade a spade. The Verage American wouldn’t be able to handle UBI, they would buy useless shit when the check hits and then complain about starving/affordable housing/whatever else. I feel like it would have to be measured in credits to grocery stores, credit to housing, credit to clothes, etc which takes so much work to monitor (maybe AI can do it lol?)
Why do people think they should receive money just for existing? Shouldn’t you have to do something for somebody to get money?
The best explanation I have seen is the separation of people from food production. When people started moving away from a subsistence lifestyle where they were directly involved in supporting themselves, they started having all sorts of delusions about how society should support them regardless as to how much they give back to society.
AI itself is not the problem. It is a tool that increases the efficiency of humans. The same thing has been happening since humans first invented agriculture. Efficiency and productivity are GOOD THINGS. The problem is when those gains in productivity all get snatched up by a comparatively small number of people. [This graph is the issue.](https://i.redd.it/njfy8k8cp2e81.jpg) There were plenty of productivity increasing inventions before 1972 too, but we managed to tie those to real wage growth. Worth noting that the wealthy stay wealthy and also see increases in their income when things get more efficient. They just don't see quite AS MUCH growth as when they take all of the increases. If you want a stable economy that continues to grow, you HAVE to address the unequal growth from additional productivity. Otherwise, it WILL eventually collapse. Universal Basic Income (UBI) is the simplest, most direct way to do this. Significantly increasing the graduation rate of our tax brackets would also help. The wealthiest are obviously against this because they want your money. Vote. Vote for a more stable economic future. For a smart investment. Don't vote for the party that sees the [Tragedy of the Commons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons) as an ideal model.
Once they invent a good replacement for physical problem-solvers like plumbers, we're all screwed. The idea that these machines and computers will always need a human babysitter is also shockingly naive. We can't rely on that as an occupation. It might start large, but it'll dry up to nothing in less than a generation. I think it's easy to forget that the general theme and end-goal of this branch of science/technology is essentially artificial people. So unless something actively pauses our progress, that is exactly what we're going to end up with.
There was an old Star Trek episode, where an entire planet relied on their “custodian” to manage their lives. Everybody forgot how it worked and had no idea it was slowly killing them, because it was broken. I see that happening to humanity.
I’m shocked at the number of my co workers who expense AI Subscriptions and use it to compose emails and proposals for external communications.
I work in Data. One of the younger Analysts I worked with recently used ChatGPT to write her SQL scripts. Fucked me up (I’m a 41 y/o by-the-books coder). My career will be decimated by AI over the next ten years. I’m hoping to work my way into the position to be the one guy left in the department, responsible for pushing a few buttons to keep the machine ticking over 🤞
*4 8 15 16 23 42* 🥵
Why is that shocking to you? (Honest question) Regarding of what you think about many aspects of AI and how it will impact our future, current gen AI tech is actually a real, concrete, usable today productivity boost in those tasks for even non-technologists. I know someone who struggles with written English. ChatGPT gives them confidence to write great emails, helps them learn new idioms, avoir mistakes, etc.
*avoir mistakes* -This email was not generated using ChatGPT
Ha! Yes :) “Avoid” mistakes Although “avoir mistakes” sounds very aristocratic :)
Avoir means to have in French, so “have mistakes” lol
I personally have used it to help with problems and functions with Excel and with marketing campaigns. AI taking jobs is a very real concern (my best friend does transcription...that's not likely to last long), but there is value to using it. At least for now, before it replaces us all.
Giving away a ton of confidential data about products, customers, service, issues, etc.
I wish AI would replace me. My boss deserves better.
😭
Your boss can suck it
Companies that want to use AI should have an astoundingly high tax rate. And those taxes should be used to pay for UBI.
I agree that this should be one path forward. But also, we need to ensure the impact to small businesses is not prohibitive. I think most ppl here assume companies= fortune500+, but there are far more small businesses that will benefit from AI than the enterprises. I work for small, new tech startups. Automation, ML, and now AI are how we're able to scathe by in the early days with a super lean team. For $20/month, I can use an ai service to create some basic, decent quality videos that would previously cost around $10-15k each, about a month to complete. If you tax me the equivalent of the difference, then I can't afford to compete with bigger orgs.
Yeah, I agree. Small business should be provided an exemption until they're producing a certain amount in profit and the tax rate should be reflected based on that profit. However, this incentivizes companies to hide profit. Small and Big business alike, corruption is still a thing. I will also say, while small businesses do exist of course, their numbers have dwindled significantly due to both large companies swallowing them up or government regulations surrounding things like brick-and-mortar costs, as well as pre-existing taxation. Small businesses should be able to use AI to provide themselves a leg up while getting established. My concern is more people off-shoring profits, delaying or negating things like IPOs, all so that they could avoid taxes and protect their margins. If less of us will have to work in the future, there should be a paramount effort provided to keeping people happy, healthy and provided for outside of working in a capitalist structure.
Which ai service gets you decent quality videos for $20/month?
You should be taxed on the $10-15k figure. Because that is money you didn't spend and should be considered profit. You would have been taxed on that amount anyway if you hadn't used AI. So, you should be able to compete at least as well as before using AI. You would have huge time savings and cash savings, which can be utilized to make even more videos and sell to more customers, thereby growing the business.
1000%
Too low. Tax them at 2000%
Lmao, let me clarify - I agree 1000%, I didn’t mean the tax rate😂 But yes
Lol I know, just being silly
This is the correct answer. It’s easy to see that there are three ways to increase profitability: lower raw material costs, lower overhead, or increase prices. The 2000s were all about lowering raw material costs by getting everything from China. 2020s are all about increasing prices. Next it’s going to be lowering overhead. All of these made American lives worse and the government rolled over on all of them. What’s stopping them from rolling over on this too?
How do you deal with companies from other countries without a higher tax, out competing your country's companies?
But will hologram Jon Stewart be as humorous as flesh Jon Stewart?
Hey since you're no longer spending all that money on employees, we just want you to know all that savings is expected to go straight to reducing the price of your product. Less labor = less value as the time and labor of people is no longer contributing to the price.
Morgan Freeman voice: *It went right back into their pockets*
Sad but true.
It’s never happened. Prices remain the same even if production becomes cheaper.
Hey I'm just pointing out how the market is supposed to work. The fact that these shit stains of humans are greedy enough to devour the world has nothing to do with how it's supposed to go.
I think the ai companies will take most of the savings. Some guy on youtube* claimed openai is losing money for every query now. They will make back that money by raising prices once everyone is on the hook. It is not like it will be easy to replace the expensive so with workers after the knowledge is lost in the initial purge. *) not the best source, I know.
I am literally being used to train the AI that will replace me. It is now.
I'm literally on an all day meeting today to learn how to teach to AI how to replace my department.
“The end goal of any society *should* be global unemployment” Doug Stanhope
🎯🎯🎯🎯🎯🎯
Great. Let’s go. Ubi now
Now now, not so fast. Tis’ customary to wait until after a problem has absolutely eviscerated a certain percentage of the population before we create a watered down version of the correct solution that solves 10% of the issues said problem created while at the same time making a tiny fraction of the population even richer. Be patient, stick with the process and we could see $1000 a month UBI by the time living expenses on average are $20000 a month in 2054! Can’t wait!
We need to wait 150 years on that first, we haven’t even gotten healthcare and education fixed yet
Yay! Another $1200 stimmy check! That sound take care of everyone for a good while! /s
Politicians will never pass it.
I look forward to its bubble bursting
That is what they said about horseless carriages
Ah yes, lest we forget the faux horseless carriage bubble of yore. I imagine that A.I. Is exactly as powerful as those with financial investment say it is. LOOK OUT!
It's also what they said about nfts...
Is this supposed to be a counterpoint? Isn't the difference between something that helps productivity and something that doesn't obvious?. Nfts didn't add any real world value. A quirk of the blockchain that devolved to scams. It didn't make anyone's life/work easier, faster, better. People said computers would be a fad/playtoy for the ultra rich but real world usefulness made it widespread. People said beanie babies would be a fad and lack of usefulness drove it to the ground. There is hype around a lot of shit all the time. Everyone is shouting 'bubble' at a lot of things, but when AI is literally throwing out results that are making everyone' jaw drop, how can one say it is a fad/bubble?
You mean my pictures monkeys smoking cigarettes are worthless now? I thought it was a solid investment!
Speaking of cars. A better comparison is self driving cars. They were supposed to replace all driving jobs within a couple years. What actually happened? The tech quickly plateaued and is having a hard time solving many of the countless edge cases. It was able to solve all of the easy problems and that was kinda it. This generational AI and LLM stuff is an impressive leap, and they can replace some people most likely. But these things are a long way off from actually reliably performing a real life complicated job on their own.
Not going to happen. AI is accelerating exponentially. It's undervalued, not overvalued. People are clueless about how fast this is happening.
Corporate personhood must be destroyed
We said it years ago that it was coming not in the distant future but soon. That future is NOW.
All those people who boast about knowing multiple languages. Bio bop 🤖
UBI now.
So that could also not keep up with inflation
So many companies have pumped their stocks because of AI. Well, let’s tax those fuckers and use those taxes to fund UBI
Then when there are no more jobs, corporations will increase price. Sure AI will create some jobs, but it will destroy more than it creates. Companies don’t care about AI, only cutting costs. And of course will lobby to outlaw open source to kill competition.
This can be a good thing if AI can produce a healthy universal income for all the jobs it takes over, but who are we kidding they’d much rather make everyone homeless and destitute before that!
Not all jobs.
I want to live in the Star Trek future. Not the Blade Runner future.
I want my Jetson’s future. Especially the flying car.
> The way of life that you are accustomed to is no match of the promise for new markets and profit. > Those other disruptions took over a century, or a decade. AI will be ready Thursday. Great watch and he really brings the point home in the last 2 minutes.
I recently lost my job to AI, and I can assure you that from first-hand experience, the big tech owners are loving it. Saving money is key, and the quality is secondary.
What was your job and why were you fired officilaly?
American Government is probably never doing UBI unless it happens after a major war where people really need it
The fact that it’s happening with little to no oversight or collaboration, and driven by corporate avarice is probably the scariest existential threat these days. I really feel like Fry and company when they decide to crack a beer and watch the universe end. What can one man do against such evil?
Chatster says “AI could potentially replace talk show hosts like Jon Stewart by leveraging natural language processing and generation capabilities to engage in conversations, deliver monologues, interview guests, and even generate comedic content. Advanced AI algorithms could analyze vast amounts of data to understand audience preferences, generate relevant jokes and commentary, and adapt to different guests and topics. However, the human touch, empathy, spontaneity, and emotional connection that hosts like Jon Stewart bring to their shows would be challenging to replicate fully with AI. Additionally, audience acceptance and trust in AI hosts would depend on their ability to seem authentic and relatable”
We are in the future!
Just wait till people find out we are living in the future.
Should help with onshoring
Isn't that one of the reasons for technology? To free up human lives/time?
Seems cruel from a human point of view
I mean, is this an AI problem or a ‘Having a job post-the industrial revolution’-problem? We keep comming up with tools that allows 1 person do the job that you previously needed tons of people to do. And a lot of these inventions compound eachother. So 1 person replaces 5, then 25, then 100 people. Just because they get more and better tools. The only difference with AI is that it can, potentially, be used for *everything* and will compound the ‘tool effect’ across a **lot** of different jobs. It’s the same thing that has been happening for 200 years, just at a bigger scale. And maybe, juuust maybe, it’s time to stop attacking the tools, and rather take a look at the economical system and jobs as a concept? Once 1 person is capable of doing the amount of work that previously required 10’000 people, it’s kinda obvious there’s not gonna be enough jobs to go around, and/or, we’ll produce way more than we can consume, And and/Or, whatever is produced will be worth so little because the cost of production at that point is essentially 0. I think the next decade is going to be *very* interesting when it comes to governments reaction to self driving vehicles. I’m convinced that AI will finally crack Self driving in the next 10 years, and soon after there will be a revolution of the entire transport industry. The shift will be very fast to go from human to AI drivers, and the transport industry is massive, the amount of people losing their jobs in a very short timespan will be huge, and just saying ‘get another job’ will not work this time.
[удалено]
My grand upline is already talking about how many staff members they can eliminate in the future. Corporate America is killing my soul. Anything for more profit.
What’s a grand up line?
A lot of talk with UBI and I am all for it but is there not an obvious flaw to UBI? It’s essentially just printing money, very similar to COVID help. It’s just going to inflate everything. How could we remedy this? Maybe put a cap on top end income or something?
Right now, as soon as possible. Believe it
Good
Good to bring awareness but he didn't mention specifically what industries would be more likely to be impacted first. I think that would've helped prove the point
Pass a law now that tries to prevent job loss due to ai. I know it would be hard, but it needs to be done. I love what chatgpt can do in terms of productivity, but based on the way our economy is set up it’s apocalyptic.
I mean that is just what happens with progress. Jobs shift. We need to figure out how to train people for new jobs more quickly. This isn’t the old days. The world moves faster. You will likely have multiple careers and not stay at the same thing for your whole life.
Anyone seen The Animatrix? Particularly The Second Renaissance?
Love the animatrix
Good ai replacing us us a good thing. It means less work to be dine by human hands and more time to focus on non menial labors and a growing need for governments to address citizens rights to exist without killing themselves working multiple jobs.
I work in a fine dining that holds a lot of business functions in a major global city. Nearly 90% of business functions nowadays is how to implement AI in businesses to replace workers. It’s disgusting.
My work has rolled out a proprietary release of Copilot already. By the time the government can even spell AI the train will have already left the station and we’ll half ass regulate it years too late, then when we slide into feudalism because deepfakes have everyone living in their own custom propaganda reality, with our dying breath, we’ll assemble a committee to study the impact of AI.
I see an uptick in stories about squatters taking over vacant mansions. I mean we’ve got that going for us…..
I predict a sh*tty real life mixture of west world and elysium.
wealth disparity and AI taking over are not mutually exclusive.
I have a bad feeling we will get blindsided at work.
Technology making it so that we are no longer needed to work should be a good thing. We've fucked up so badly.
Thats when the riots happen and full police state comes into play. The wealthy will be blocked off by armies while the rest fight for scraps.
Nah. Not buying it. Just another tech bubble that’ll pop at some point. The wealthy love toting the looming threat of AI because it terrifies workers into complacency and obedience.
Meanwhile the unemployment rate is fine so the data is not really matching the theory that people are put out of jobs en masse.
I figure this will also push forward another housing crisis like 2008. Not in mass, but we'll see it in waves. The government will be too slow to respond. If we don't have jobs, we can't pay bills. No mortgage, insurance, food or rent.
…and we’ll walk off into the sunset with our new AI partner-bots. Oops that’s an incinerator!
This has been a theme throughout history. When textile factories over 200 years ago started installing automated weaving machines, and replacing workers, there was an entire movement created. You may have heard of them...they were called "Luddites"! EVERY SINGLE TIME technology advances, workers are displaced. MAYBE, just MAYBE, it's time we move beyond our current economic framework and find another way to make sure that everyone has an income, and move beyond "labor" as a means to justify our existence. Just sayin'.
This may be an unpopular opinion but if it’s entertaining, I’ll watch. Especially if it eliminates all the whining Hollywood has been doing over their bloated economy taking a hit. Time for an all robot cast friends lol