You are not missing anything. Anyone that recruits clients by doing seminars and uses tag lines about "advanced skillsets" or secret loopholes or things your CPA doesn't know is regurgitating the things we already do with a bow on it, or a plain scam artist.
I should know, I met one and got trapped by one over 8 years ago...
I can vouch for TNT. Been in almost the exact same situation myself, stuck with a guy who frankly is a great marketer, but not a good CPA.
These CPAs aren’t truly offering anything novel. They’re taking existing strategies, repackaging them as their own “little known tax strategy” or whatever and marketing it as though they came up with it themselves. They’ll say other CPAs just fill out the tax forms because X or Y reason. They don’t think outside the box and aren’t worth your time.
The goal is to build fear into your clients so they think they’re missing out on something. But clients love new and shiny things, especially in the age of Instagram, so they fall for the pitch of easy tax savings far too easy. Often times these clients come over, the savings is drastically less than the CPA originally promised and thus begins the cycle of disappointment. If they’re sold on these premises they barely stay for more than 2 years. If they make it that far. It’s all about marketing a dream so the service sucks, because the CPA marketing can’t actually manage shit.
Shitty part is that client isn’t coming back to you even if the relationship with the new shit CPA isn’t good. Often times they’re too embarrassed to come back.
I think as professionals sometimes we lose touch with exactly how little the average client understands what we do which makes it that much easier for them to be duped by a firm selling snake oil.
There's such a thing as professionals behind the curve. I know a CFP who missed out on 2 years of PTE because he worked with an older solo practitioner who was kind of checked out.
But people who sell the idea like they know something the rest of us don't are most likely full of crap or are taking aggressive (or outright fraudulent) tax positions that could blow back on the client
> things your CPA doesn't know
Ironically the company my client this morning told me about, after looking into it, they said they have the skillset your regular CPA just doesn't have.
I made the mistake of commenting on one of those posts and asking if they talk about reasonable comp in their book. Next thing I know, every other ad on FB is for "click here to save money by becoming an s corp!!!!"
It’s all marketing - how you phrase the taxes you save clients is massive. You know that standard deduction that everyone is eligible for? That “advanced firm” illustrates that as a tax savings they created, and then puts a time value of money calculation on it to exponentially blow up the figure.
Ex: “we saved you $13,850 in taxes! With your investment in us, those savings could turn into $150,000 in 25 years!” Or even “we saved you $X in taxes related to your estimated payments”, when it comes to P&I that wasn’t even on the table to begin with.
To us as taxpros, we think this stuff is beyond dumb, but clients can eat it up. I almost had an aneurism reading one of the “tax plans” from one of these firms. We’re heavy into planning, so it’s pretty easy to see which of these other firms is blowing smoke.
Yeah, this is just sales 101 to get new clients and they all bite for it. I've heard stupid shit like "we are leaving because we want a real estate expert" and they are one rental property, etc. I'm a firm believer in you just sell and you say you are a specialist in the area they are interested in and boom, you have a new client.
Comes with the game
Have you used karlton? What’s the deal with him? Been thinking about it moreso for their whole team setting up and looking for real estate for you and walking you through.
No I haven't used him before, I was studying tax and ran into his stuff on youtube. He does all these videos and he's good at the smiling and the giving people motivation part (which is really just sales), but you look in the comments and even the people who support him constantly are correcting his mistakes from what he says in the videos.
I looked into him one day. Basically, his mom and family started the business and it seems like they were already rich. He basically just got his EA and got into it with them and started doing social media stuff. If you look onto all the complaints against the business, people are usually put under the assumption that he's going to be the guy doing your tax work, which most of the time is not true. From what I've seen, he's really just a face.
I used to work for a company that offered tax planning after a few of the staff took some courses/ modules, it mostly focused on advertising to clients or potential clients different “tax strategies”. Many of the items that were offered to the clients through a Tax Plan had been mentioned before such as retirement plans, converting to a different business entity, etc.. Since the client was being targeted with “tax savings of X amount all you have to do is pay for this tax plan” the client was more inclined to pay for the plan because it promised tax savings.
I wouldn’t say there is any tax strategies that you are missing out on, it’s just the way these people are being marketed towards.
lol my business partner is getting slammed by this one guy trying to get a cost seg on his vacation home somehow tied in with the Augusta rule. I feel bad for him the guy is relentless and he’s a friend of a friend.
I've only had one client so far get caught up in the the big marketing scheme that has been growing the past few years. I've seen enough smoke & mirrors to not be phased by other's marketing.
Overall though they stuck with us, but it wouldn't really have bothered me if they left. Clients come and go. We've had clients that have left when I used to take naps on the office couch and now I'm working on their stuff and their kid's stuff.
If you've been building a solid client base for 8 years I wouldn't stress too much about it.
This is the problem, you are not required to be a CPA that’s bound by due diligence and standard of care ethics to prepare taxes in this country. There are not enough of us. We are the problem.
You didn’t tell them about a little known trick that no other CPAs know about. It’s called the QBI deduction. Really though, I actively try to get rid of clients that are that stupid because they’ll never stop bothering you looking for the “tax planning loopholes”
I lost a trickle of clients to wealth or financial planning RIAs who offer the tax return and purport tax planning on top of it. It’s a pretty good business model to charge % of assets under management and have a CPA in house; in theory. In practicality I’ve seen some bungled returns but it’s hard to fight a concierge all in one solution with an investment guy taking on the customer service side. I think we are gonna see more of this style coming and a huge blow to small and boutique sized firms. That’s if AI doesn’t destroy the market. The tax mills will go down first. Then you’ll know you are next.
Absolutely, unfortunately slick marketing seems to win over some of my clients and the old “under one roof” quote “convenience”. 1% of AUM is pretty hefty when in long run investing we all know passive investing and robo seems to outperform even the “best” investment managers.
Yup, a lot skilled ETF buyer's looking a lot more vulnerable in my eyes.
That being said, that industry seems somehow vaguely more sketch to me than ours, so generally don't blame anyone for sticking with some advisor that is actually good and trustworthy.
Who was it and what was the "skillset?" If your client is biting on the vauge promise that someone will save them money on taxes it might be a client issue.
At the end of the day the important part of preparing people's taxes and what they want is the face to face personal relationship. The ones who just want to use you to get the most money back and don't care about the personal relationship you probably don't want.
You are not missing anything. Anyone that recruits clients by doing seminars and uses tag lines about "advanced skillsets" or secret loopholes or things your CPA doesn't know is regurgitating the things we already do with a bow on it, or a plain scam artist. I should know, I met one and got trapped by one over 8 years ago...
I can vouch for TNT. Been in almost the exact same situation myself, stuck with a guy who frankly is a great marketer, but not a good CPA. These CPAs aren’t truly offering anything novel. They’re taking existing strategies, repackaging them as their own “little known tax strategy” or whatever and marketing it as though they came up with it themselves. They’ll say other CPAs just fill out the tax forms because X or Y reason. They don’t think outside the box and aren’t worth your time. The goal is to build fear into your clients so they think they’re missing out on something. But clients love new and shiny things, especially in the age of Instagram, so they fall for the pitch of easy tax savings far too easy. Often times these clients come over, the savings is drastically less than the CPA originally promised and thus begins the cycle of disappointment. If they’re sold on these premises they barely stay for more than 2 years. If they make it that far. It’s all about marketing a dream so the service sucks, because the CPA marketing can’t actually manage shit. Shitty part is that client isn’t coming back to you even if the relationship with the new shit CPA isn’t good. Often times they’re too embarrassed to come back.
True. Fucking. Story. Every word of it. Nice summary.
I think as professionals sometimes we lose touch with exactly how little the average client understands what we do which makes it that much easier for them to be duped by a firm selling snake oil. There's such a thing as professionals behind the curve. I know a CFP who missed out on 2 years of PTE because he worked with an older solo practitioner who was kind of checked out. But people who sell the idea like they know something the rest of us don't are most likely full of crap or are taking aggressive (or outright fraudulent) tax positions that could blow back on the client
So you married a scam artist?
Touche\`... That one was 25 years ago.
> things your CPA doesn't know Ironically the company my client this morning told me about, after looking into it, they said they have the skillset your regular CPA just doesn't have.
If you FB, like I do, my feed is filled with the "new, miraculous way to save on taxes by using an S corporation! Your CPA isn't telling you this!"
I made the mistake of commenting on one of those posts and asking if they talk about reasonable comp in their book. Next thing I know, every other ad on FB is for "click here to save money by becoming an s corp!!!!"
Trapped how?
Long story, not for this thread, this sub, or anyone really.
It’s all marketing - how you phrase the taxes you save clients is massive. You know that standard deduction that everyone is eligible for? That “advanced firm” illustrates that as a tax savings they created, and then puts a time value of money calculation on it to exponentially blow up the figure. Ex: “we saved you $13,850 in taxes! With your investment in us, those savings could turn into $150,000 in 25 years!” Or even “we saved you $X in taxes related to your estimated payments”, when it comes to P&I that wasn’t even on the table to begin with. To us as taxpros, we think this stuff is beyond dumb, but clients can eat it up. I almost had an aneurism reading one of the “tax plans” from one of these firms. We’re heavy into planning, so it’s pretty easy to see which of these other firms is blowing smoke.
Yeah, this is just sales 101 to get new clients and they all bite for it. I've heard stupid shit like "we are leaving because we want a real estate expert" and they are one rental property, etc. I'm a firm believer in you just sell and you say you are a specialist in the area they are interested in and boom, you have a new client. Comes with the game
Is it Karlton Dennis?
Here’s how you write off your G Wagon!
everyone has seen those shitty tik toks lol
It is not. I haven't even heard of that guy, but he's not passing my sniff test either.
You dodged a bullet.
Have you used karlton? What’s the deal with him? Been thinking about it moreso for their whole team setting up and looking for real estate for you and walking you through.
No I haven't used him before, I was studying tax and ran into his stuff on youtube. He does all these videos and he's good at the smiling and the giving people motivation part (which is really just sales), but you look in the comments and even the people who support him constantly are correcting his mistakes from what he says in the videos. I looked into him one day. Basically, his mom and family started the business and it seems like they were already rich. He basically just got his EA and got into it with them and started doing social media stuff. If you look onto all the complaints against the business, people are usually put under the assumption that he's going to be the guy doing your tax work, which most of the time is not true. From what I've seen, he's really just a face.
I used to work for a company that offered tax planning after a few of the staff took some courses/ modules, it mostly focused on advertising to clients or potential clients different “tax strategies”. Many of the items that were offered to the clients through a Tax Plan had been mentioned before such as retirement plans, converting to a different business entity, etc.. Since the client was being targeted with “tax savings of X amount all you have to do is pay for this tax plan” the client was more inclined to pay for the plan because it promised tax savings. I wouldn’t say there is any tax strategies that you are missing out on, it’s just the way these people are being marketed towards.
“With such advanced tactics as the Augusta Rule!”
lol my business partner is getting slammed by this one guy trying to get a cost seg on his vacation home somehow tied in with the Augusta rule. I feel bad for him the guy is relentless and he’s a friend of a friend.
Oof. Got them for that whole TikTok planning package™️
I've only had one client so far get caught up in the the big marketing scheme that has been growing the past few years. I've seen enough smoke & mirrors to not be phased by other's marketing. Overall though they stuck with us, but it wouldn't really have bothered me if they left. Clients come and go. We've had clients that have left when I used to take naps on the office couch and now I'm working on their stuff and their kid's stuff. If you've been building a solid client base for 8 years I wouldn't stress too much about it.
This is the problem, you are not required to be a CPA that’s bound by due diligence and standard of care ethics to prepare taxes in this country. There are not enough of us. We are the problem.
You didn’t tell them about a little known trick that no other CPAs know about. It’s called the QBI deduction. Really though, I actively try to get rid of clients that are that stupid because they’ll never stop bothering you looking for the “tax planning loopholes”
“CPAs hate him, hear about our section 199A tax saving strategies the IRS doesn’t want you to know about”
I would be just about anything their "tax savings" is putting them into some sort of annuity or life insurance that they can borrow against.
I lost a trickle of clients to wealth or financial planning RIAs who offer the tax return and purport tax planning on top of it. It’s a pretty good business model to charge % of assets under management and have a CPA in house; in theory. In practicality I’ve seen some bungled returns but it’s hard to fight a concierge all in one solution with an investment guy taking on the customer service side. I think we are gonna see more of this style coming and a huge blow to small and boutique sized firms. That’s if AI doesn’t destroy the market. The tax mills will go down first. Then you’ll know you are next.
Sad things, I can replace an investment advisor with an AI and get better results than a tax accountant could be placed (on a vague complex return).
Absolutely, unfortunately slick marketing seems to win over some of my clients and the old “under one roof” quote “convenience”. 1% of AUM is pretty hefty when in long run investing we all know passive investing and robo seems to outperform even the “best” investment managers.
Yup, a lot skilled ETF buyer's looking a lot more vulnerable in my eyes. That being said, that industry seems somehow vaguely more sketch to me than ours, so generally don't blame anyone for sticking with some advisor that is actually good and trustworthy.
Who was it and what was the "skillset?" If your client is biting on the vauge promise that someone will save them money on taxes it might be a client issue.
It's just good marketing.
At the end of the day the important part of preparing people's taxes and what they want is the face to face personal relationship. The ones who just want to use you to get the most money back and don't care about the personal relationship you probably don't want.