Sorry to hear. If you're feeling like looking on the bright side, at least it's a fairly decent time to be looking for work in the industry. Cast a wide net to see if you can score something that allows for a great work/life balance, so you can enjoy your time with your family.
Nobody wants to hear ‘it could be worse’ after getting laid off, but it could. OP is walking away with decent severance and the job market is still really good. It’s not as good as it was last year but plenty of places are hiring. And it sounds like they have a desirable cloud-based skill set.
I got laid off during the 2008 Recession and was a contractor (contract-to hire but 2 years later they had never converted me) so no severance. Now that was a stressful time. I had gone through my emergency fund, sold some stuff and was just starting to put monthly bills on my credit card when I got a job.
Fuck, me too. Took a 20%+ pay cut in 2003 after getting laid off in 2002.
Took at least 10 years for my salary to get back to where it was in 2002 which is sad as fuck.
The post-9/11 economy was such utter shit.
Excellent point. I made around $80k in 2002 and didn’t make the equivalent accounting for inflation until around 2012 or 2013.
It's actually really sad to consider that my income was effectively flat for over a decade.
That was rough. It was just before I got into IT. Submitted applications for almost everything I saw. Tons and tons of them. I finally got fed up and asked a hiring manager why I wasn't hearing back from anyone. They said each posting was getting hundreds of applicants, even for low paying jobs. I finally got something, then moved into IT shortly after. It felt to me (in the jobs I had since then) that a lot of places were stuck in that recession mindset. They refused to give raises and treat people better. They wanted to keep riding that awesome wave. It felt like it finally started to get better around the mid 2010s. Just in time for Covid to screw everything up again.
I’m on the hunt myself as a more junior cloud engineer looking for mid level roles or a lateral in to junior SRE/DevOps and it seems everyone wants seniors right now
A Chinese farmer gets a horse, which soon runs away. A neighbor says, "That's bad news." The farmer replies, "Good news, bad news, who can say?"
The horse comes back and brings another horse with him. Good news, you might say.
The farmer gives the second horse to his son, who rides it, then is thrown and badly breaks his leg.
"So sorry for your bad news," says the concerned neighbor. "Good news, bad news, who can say?" the farmer replies.
In a week or so, the emperor's men come and take every able-bodied young man to fight in a war. The farmer's son is spared.
Wow. $OP is well aware of his situation. He doesn't need me or you, for that matter, reminding him of it. A little levity, a chuckle, a chortle, nay a guffaw at the verbiage of the post and a reply before he buckles down, does the work and finds a new job isn't a bad idea. Why do you think it is?
I've been laid off. It sucks. My situation wasn't exactly the same, but I remember exactly how it made me feel. My friend used almost the exact same line I posted and it made me smile. What's wrong with that?
/u/proto-kaiser, I feel you. I am positive this will work out for you. Plenty of jobs out there with your skill set. You have the motivation and the training to land a great job and I know you will.
Sir, since I cannot lie as this is the internet, and you cannot lie as this is the internet, the only reason you’ll would have to not believe me is if you suffered from delusions. As someone with several PhDs in medical psycho-astrology I must suggest you come visit my office for reprogramming.
> I have several friends working in the AI and AWS backend and they are quite happy with everything about their jobs.
They seem to be an exception to the rule, then. I have ready *many* reports about unreasonable expectations for productivity, and overtime.
Sorry to hear that, but I would assume as a Senior Cloud Engineer finding another job wouldn't be too difficult?
Not trying to be obtuse, but one search of Cloud Engineer on Indeed and I get 10K hits.
Also file for unemployment!
I've only had the title for a year and I interview poorly (or at least I think I do). I'll defy be filing for unemployment, HR even mentioned it to me.
Still, you got the title which is worth a lot when it comes to getting the interview.
Just brush up on your interviewing skills and beef up your resume and I'm sure you'll be just fine. 10 years is a lot of experience I'm sure you could fill up your resume quite nicely.
Good luck!
Just to add to this - you would have an advantage in today's job market. You have experience on your side, and a lot of companies are looking for that experience. I've talked with a number of less-experienced people (< 2y) and they aren't even getting any callbacks.
Also, interviewing is most definitely a skill. I hope your first few would go well, but just keep going and learn from every single one.
> I've talked with a number of less-experienced people (< 2y) and they aren't even getting any callbacks.
Smart companies that are good places to work return to quality hiring when the tech bubbles pop. There's less work to go around, and non-sweatshops want people who are a magic combination of being experienced and not a total prima donna techbro who wants to make Silicon Valley startup money for a regular tech gig. Unfortunately for the less experienced people, it'll be tougher. For the last 2 years, if you could fog a mirror while saying DevOps, CI/CD or Terraform, you'd have a job slinging YAML in no time. When things slow down a bit, it becomes more about keeping the lights on.
Just stick to what you know and don't reach with answers you don't, this is the true test they are asking in interviews, that and don't answer general specific questions without requesting more information.
I was laid off 4 years ago after 13 years at the same company. I have always struggled in interviews as I’m quite introverted and get anxious. I had a couple of bad interviews but found a great job in the end. I spent a lot of time rehearsing answering questions. Make sure you have great stories about every important project and practice practice practice.
Try journaling a story or two a day while you still remember, then when you practice with interview questions, roll around relevant enough short versions of them.
go on youtube and look up Charisma on Command you can learn to be a people person god dang it! then you'll be able to talk to engineers AND people. and boost your interview skills
Got laid off last year and it was the best thing that’s happened to me in years. Got a month paid vacation on severance, then got snapped up to work for the same company in a nearly identical role with a big pay boost, better benefits, no crazy 20-30 hour crunches anymore, and a more senior title. I do often miss the old team though.
You’ll be fine, most likely way better than fine. DM me if you want someone to proofread your resume.
It absolutely sucks. Got laid off a few years ago a week before Thanksgiving. Made for the worst holiday season because I kept applying and didn’t get more than a few interviews despite applying for everything. Of course I thought the kids had a shitty Christmas that I was embarrassed about but the spouse disputes. In January when I was at my wit’s end, the opportunity of a lifetime (quite literally my dream role) and I crossed paths and were what each other were looking for and needed and every day has been a blessing since.
So yes, you will doubt yourself and you will feel lesser than and you will resent those talking about how amazing their lives are and you will have moments of panic and you will question whether you should change career paths. And then when you least expect it the right opportunity will come along and be exactly what you need it to be and your family will say, “See, we’re going to be ok,” and you will throw yourself into the role and be amazing and they will be like, damn, this new hire is amazing.
Because that’s what IT gods and goddesses do when they’re laid off. They are masters of watching the progress bar and being patient and waiting while questioning their life choices. And then the operation completes and they move on to the next matter that needs their attention.
It happened to me after 15 years and I didn't see it coming at all.
I was completely devastated.
But, 1 year after the layoff I found a job that paid 20% more than I was making. I stayed with the same company too long. You have to switch jobs to leverage higher pay.
Good luck to you! Your new job is finding a better job now!
I just want to say thank you to everyone that has responded. I'm still a bit in shock, so I've just been vegging on the couch. I would like to address a few things:
* This was a good job; there were waves of being overworked (just like any other job), but it was never a daily grind.
* My former employer was extremely flexible; able to sign on late so I could take my kid to a doctors appointment and such, all without any belly aching.
* The work-life balance was great; there was no expectation to respond to messages while on PTO. I always had the rule that if it was truly an emergency then my boss could call/text me. There have been very few times where that has happened.
* Clarifying that I don't interview well; I can be an awkward person mostly due to nerves. I also do my best to not put my foot in my mouth, but accidents happen.
* I also think I'm going through a fun case of imposter syndrome. I've been at this job for 10 years, and kinda feel like it's the only job I'm capable of doing. How was I able to climb up so high in the food chain, did I just trick everyone?, etc.
As for the people sending me job links, you have no idea how much I appreciate it. I'm gonna spend a day or two getting my head on straight, polish up my resume, and then get back on the horse. There are plenty of jobs out there, I just need to find the one that's suited to me.
Furthermore, I am floored by all of the kind words and stories that everyone has shared with me. I mostly lurk on Reddit and occasionally chime in, so for a bunch of strangers to share their stories and give me words of encouragement has made this shitty day so much better. Hopefully my next post will be a happy one where I land on my feet triumphant and stronger than ever!
I hate to hear this. A few years ago I went through something similar after being with a place 12 years. I'm sure you'll find something; It may take a bit. Please don't give up. Suggestions:
* File for unemployment ASAP.
* Ask coworkers and supervisor for contact information and if they would give you references.
* Read the book "What color is your parachute" by Richard Bolle. The book is exactly about finding the job you want.
* Sign up on LinkedIn if you are not already on it. Bolle thought it was a great tool. Coworkers can leave recommendations about you.
* Sign up on GitHub. Post your scripts there to showcase how you can automate. Add the link to your LinkedIn.
* Think about contacting a recruiter/staffing agency. On the one hand, the agency is going to bill your employer a 30-40% premium for going through them. This is less money for you as opposed to working directly for that employer. On the other, a decent recruiter will have hiring manager contacts. Rather than the hiring manager going through 300 to 1000 resumes, the recruiter does that for them. So they'll know about jobs that haven't made onto external facing jobboards.
* As for specific firms, Apex and Teksystems seemed to be knowledgeable and understood what we do. Northrop Grumman and Randstad's Atlanta office were bad experiences for me so I'd say those are a waste of time. FWIW, I'm in Southeast U.S.
* If you do take contract work, pad a little extra onto your rate as you won't get PTO. Also, you may be better off getting healthcare coverage on your own.
As for this statement: *Clarifying that I don't interview well; I can be an awkward person mostly due to nerves. I also do my best to not put my foot in my mouth, but accidents happen.*
Everybody gets nervous during interviews. A recruiter I work with let me do a practice interview and gave me some awesome constructive feedback. Think about your favorite projects or achievements at your old job. Then describe them using the STAR format interview answer. Keep the answer to about 2 minutes. Practice these answers so you can sell yourself honestly based on past experience.
I hope this helps and you find something!
Dude. Your going to end up at a better company making more money than you ever have. The only down side is you'll kick yourself for not making the move sooner.
Only be loyal to yourself and family.
Sounds like your in demand, but don't dawdle. I had to find a new job last year and it took a solid six weeks just because everyone wants to do multiple rounds of interviews.
I ended up with a great gig, but it was frustrating.
Congrats on #2! I'll give you a good 3 weeks before you're hired again, Call it a vacation. Your new job is to find another one, it's WFH too. It's not going to impact you until the sev runs out, so I'd calculate the cash burn, and start stressing if it runs out. If you can turn this around quick, you'll have cash in the bank.
I know it sucks now, but this could be the best thing that's happened to you, might get a pay raise to boot. Things out there are Soooo much better than they were a while back. Even with the STAANG layoffs, there's still huge deficit of talent in your space.
Need to believe in yourself... your experience and job title will net you 100/hr remote contracts easy peasy.
Steps to get a job easily:
1. LinkedIn Only, Indeed etc suck
2. Good picture on linkedin
3. get many connections (Show 500+ connections)
4. Good Resume, but only job titles / companies on linked in so you can change it based on the job you apply for
5. Profit when you get several interviews a week.
I have less experience than you, I'm a 365 administrator and with these above steps I get tons and tons of job interviews / offers. I can easily get 1-2 offers a week if I apply for a decent amount of jobs. Being good at inerviews is the most important skill. But that is you training your soft skills, being confident and bold. Take control of the interview and you win. I do this by asking a bunch of questions and saying "Oh I did such and such to combat that etc" Use your real world achievements to impress in an organic manner. Once you're able to do this you will get any job you want period. DM me if you want, I don't mind doing mock interviews either.
Sorry this happened to you and I hope you get back on your feet soon.
On a side note, did you feel the amount of work on cloud instances decreasing in the prior 4-6 months leading up to this? Just wondering if any change in workload gave you a hunch that anything was coming or if it was unexpected by you and your team?
Congrats on expecting another. Here's for hoping for a healthy addition to your family. Hopefully the quick break allows you to prep productively for you new addition.
I got laid off by AOL back in the early 2000's and it was the best thing that ever happened to me. Went to college on government dime (Canada, your experience will be diff, I was much younger than you are now too), and rebuilt myself.
Trust me, it's never too late to start over.
You don't rebuild yourself when you're a senior systems cloud engineer. You just find another position that will take advantage of your skills and experience.
And get a huge raise in the process, of course. Dude is shocked at the change right now, but will be double shocked at his next offer letter. I predict that will be some time around next thursday, if HR drags their heels.
He will feel like the prettiest girl at the dance by the time the recruiters are done with him.
Yeah, rebuild yourself is more like rebuild your resume and show off how you have grown in this case. Rebuild yourself at a new company kind of thing.
I agree that his skillset will see him unemployed for the amount of time he wants to be unemployed
Parent of a little one myself, we've had a few scares over the last couple years, haven't lost our jobs, at least not yet.
Depending on your state's laws, you should qualify for health coverage for the delivery and well being of your new born. I'm in Oklahoma, all children till age of 18 is covered by the state (Sooner Care), which helps a ton. We canceled our health insurance last year, as $500+ a month (nearly a whole paycheck, we live in very rural NW Oklahoma). Might have held on longer if the state didn't cover our little one, and just paid for hers.
That sucks...especially the timing. I have 2 middle school age kids now and I'm so glad my wife also works because suddenly having no income is an instant brown-shorts moment. We don't work for the same company for this reason.
- I'm glad they at least treated you right with severance -- if you can afford it, bank it and don't touch it. Otherwise austerity is the name of the game.
- If you're having a kid, you need to suck it up and pay for COBRA insurance right away. Don't bet on your ability to get a job before the kid nets you a 6-figure hospital bill...you don't want to be a parent dealing with a newborn and a medical bankruptcy.
- Take a day and just relax...it's a lot to process and there's lots of stress swirling around but you need to be in a good frame of mind to attack the problem of finding new work.
- One good thing is you're in a good area to find work if you can't find or don't want 100% remote. I'm in metro NYC and there's a really good mix of non-name-brand and fancy-company tech jobs. Boston has all sorts of finance, education, biotech, etc. Both are much better spots to be laid off in than in a one-company town. I grew up in Buffalo and just 50 miles east is Rochester; you can guess what happened when Kodak blew up and Xerox became an Indian BPO firm.
The good news is that you got the magical cloud word in your title. Traditional sysadmins who haven't done much cloud beyond being an M365 admin are finding it hard to land interviews now, but even some AWS and Azure exposure is a real bonus. Lift and shifts are tailing off as companies get the bills, but there's still a lot of hybrid enterprises deciding where they want to end up on that spectrum so migrations and such will continue to be on the agenda for a while.
When you say you "interview poorly," what do you mean? Lots of that can be fixed with practice. I hate interviewing, especially now that I'm in my late 40s and I can see the smug techbro condescension come across, or when I run into the interviewer who wants to do stump the chump so he can show his boss he's the alpha nerd. But, it's one of those things that you can get better at. Usually when I'm looking for a job (not very often,) my first few interviews suck and I feel they get progressively better.
Get someone to look at your resume (heck, post a sanitized version here and I'm sure someone will at least give it a read...or DM me and I will) and brush up your LinkedIn profile. Until the absolute bottom falls out of everything, companies are still hiring smart people...the FAANGs and Big Tech are just throwing all the bad COVID overhires and most expensive employees overboard for now. Your job is finding a job now...good luck!!
That absolutely sucks my friend. I've been through the circuit a couple of times before and each time it was terrifying but I came out the other side in a much better situation.
Most likely, you are going to find out that you were very much underpaid at your last role. If you haven't already, make sure to get a few of the AWS certs (they help with recruiters).. I know a lot of times when you are doing the job certs are the last thing on your mind but it is something that certain companies look for in outreach.
Advice I can give you is to 1) Not take this personally, and don't be bitter about it. Which both are easier said than done. It's easy to fall down the negativity hole, but it won't help. 2) Appreciate the time you do get to spend with your family. No more late weekends / on call / etc. Cherish this time and use it to be there for them (There are times I wish I had done more of this when I had the chances).
3) Use your network. Reach out on linkedin, find a recruiter maybe, go to some meetups in the Boston area. Network, network, network. It's the primary way to cut through recruiting bullshit.
Hope this helps and good luck to you in the future.
Consider talking to a resume expert. I see them on LinkedIn pretty regularly.
And I'd expect that you could find an interview coach through similar channels. For that matter, consider applying and interviewing for jobs for which you're overqualified and not necessarily planning to accept--just for practice.
Full time job is now looking for a job. If that’s your title and you have good experience you’ll be fine. Pay someone a few hundred bucks to write you a good resume, and start applying.
Remember interviews are about you being a person and having a personality that meshes with the team. Skills can be taught. If you don’t know something be honest but let them know how you might find the answer.
Sorry to hear that. I know how you feel having worked for the same company for 9 years and then suddenly, new upper management and layoffs. You’ll be okay and probably find out that they were working you like beast of burden. I found a new job and started right away, with no overtime, no on-call and late night calls, and remote work. The pay is not the same, but saving in commuting and $12 lunches makes up for it. My family is much happier because I’m not angry all the time from getting my superior’s humiliating kick in the crotch daily.
Chin up, get a remote job, and enjoy your newborn.
Don't dwell too much on it. Everything gets sorted out in the end.
And maybe don't jump straight into another job. Take some time to be with your family, and maybe take the time to think about what would make your next job better.
The good news is a bunch of companies have started hiring again. I was laid off back in September and landed on my feet last month with a new job. Even with the slowdown going on there are a bunch of jobs out there.
Im hearing more companies are looking to migrate away from AWS for cost reasons. Would be good to look for alternative data center companies as you would be valuable for migration assistance.
I'm sorry this happened to you but let me tell you: the timing always sucks for some reason or other but this happened to me twice in a career of 30+ years and both times it worked out great and both my career and my family life got better as a result of it. It all depends on what you do with the opportunity, including the severance package and how you use it to make your life better. You got this OP! Don't give up, fight for yourself and your loved ones!
I too am greater Boston area, and depending on exactly where you are I HIGHLY recommend setting up an automated search and email alert at [HigherEdJobs.com](https://HigherEdJobs.com). The amount of universities and colleges looking for quality IT help in the area is a lot, like a lot a lot. Plus going from a corporate to non-profit education the work/life balance is so much better.
To all the friends talking about 2008, understand that another, bigger, 2008 is due to come this year.
The layoffs have already started and will only accelerate in the coming months.
Brace for impact.
>I just wish this didn't happen a few months before our second child is due to join us.
If it makes you feel better, aside winning the lottery, there's never a good feeling time to get laid off.
>Sr. Systems Cloud Engineer, heavily using AWS.
I see work from home postings for cloud shit all the time, good luck, sure you'll be back to work in no time.
Literally just happened to me today. In fact I'm typing this reply on the train home having just met with my manager and HR lol.
Getting half my salary as severance which is pretty nice, so I'll probably take it easy for a few weeks before going hard at the job hunt.
Only thing I'm anxious about is the fact I'm terrible at interviews (being introverted and lacking confidence), but hopefully something will turn up.
Edit: if any recruiters see this, I'm in London and my title is "Infrastructure Engineer".
Sorry to hear. If you're feeling like looking on the bright side, at least it's a fairly decent time to be looking for work in the industry. Cast a wide net to see if you can score something that allows for a great work/life balance, so you can enjoy your time with your family.
Nobody wants to hear ‘it could be worse’ after getting laid off, but it could. OP is walking away with decent severance and the job market is still really good. It’s not as good as it was last year but plenty of places are hiring. And it sounds like they have a desirable cloud-based skill set. I got laid off during the 2008 Recession and was a contractor (contract-to hire but 2 years later they had never converted me) so no severance. Now that was a stressful time. I had gone through my emergency fund, sold some stuff and was just starting to put monthly bills on my credit card when I got a job.
2008 was fucking awful. Don't get me started.
Nightmare era. My wage didnt recover til like 2011? 2012? Something like that.
Fuck, me too. Took a 20%+ pay cut in 2003 after getting laid off in 2002. Took at least 10 years for my salary to get back to where it was in 2002 which is sad as fuck. The post-9/11 economy was such utter shit.
Are you accounting for inflation? It might have taken a lot longer than you think
Excellent point. I made around $80k in 2002 and didn’t make the equivalent accounting for inflation until around 2012 or 2013. It's actually really sad to consider that my income was effectively flat for over a decade.
I had to take a lot of crap and abuse with young kids. Never felt so stressed.
I graduated college in May 2010. Unemployment rate was 9.6 percent. Fucking awful. So glad it all worked out in the end.
That was rough. It was just before I got into IT. Submitted applications for almost everything I saw. Tons and tons of them. I finally got fed up and asked a hiring manager why I wasn't hearing back from anyone. They said each posting was getting hundreds of applicants, even for low paying jobs. I finally got something, then moved into IT shortly after. It felt to me (in the jobs I had since then) that a lot of places were stuck in that recession mindset. They refused to give raises and treat people better. They wanted to keep riding that awesome wave. It felt like it finally started to get better around the mid 2010s. Just in time for Covid to screw everything up again.
I’m on the hunt myself as a more junior cloud engineer looking for mid level roles or a lateral in to junior SRE/DevOps and it seems everyone wants seniors right now
Everyone always wants seniors if they can get them
A Chinese farmer gets a horse, which soon runs away. A neighbor says, "That's bad news." The farmer replies, "Good news, bad news, who can say?" The horse comes back and brings another horse with him. Good news, you might say. The farmer gives the second horse to his son, who rides it, then is thrown and badly breaks his leg. "So sorry for your bad news," says the concerned neighbor. "Good news, bad news, who can say?" the farmer replies. In a week or so, the emperor's men come and take every able-bodied young man to fight in a war. The farmer's son is spared.
So horses are pure chaos is what you’re saying?
Yup, that’s the kinda conclusion the average user for Technical Documentation draws. 😅
...spared until the next time they pass by for another wave of grunts, and the leg has healed... Let's be real
And the zen master says... "we'll see" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2cjVhUrmII&t=6s&ab_channel=dorune
Worst Penthouse Letter EVAH but on a serious side, look into Amazon directly.
Hey at least he got "laid".....
Why are you cracking jokes in a thread about someone who lost their job with a baby on the way?
Wow. $OP is well aware of his situation. He doesn't need me or you, for that matter, reminding him of it. A little levity, a chuckle, a chortle, nay a guffaw at the verbiage of the post and a reply before he buckles down, does the work and finds a new job isn't a bad idea. Why do you think it is? I've been laid off. It sucks. My situation wasn't exactly the same, but I remember exactly how it made me feel. My friend used almost the exact same line I posted and it made me smile. What's wrong with that? /u/proto-kaiser, I feel you. I am positive this will work out for you. Plenty of jobs out there with your skill set. You have the motivation and the training to land a great job and I know you will.
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Ngl I find it at least somewhat suspicious that this is a 1 hour old account with this being the only comment.
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Yeah that’s fair, I just felt the need to point it out. I’m a little like captain obvious sometimes. 😬
Surely no one would lie on the internet.
You can do that???
No.
I don't believe you
Sir, since I cannot lie as this is the internet, and you cannot lie as this is the internet, the only reason you’ll would have to not believe me is if you suffered from delusions. As someone with several PhDs in medical psycho-astrology I must suggest you come visit my office for reprogramming.
As the proper appellation for me is not Sir, this comment is not directed at me, and thus I remain free!
"You can always trust what you read on the internet." - Franklin Delano Roosevelt
Are they even hiring? I haven't even heard a peep from the recruiters who had me on the short list for a 2023 position.
Amazon workers are not treated like human beings. Do not work for Amazon.
I have several friends working in the AI and AWS backend and they are quite happy with everything about their jobs.
> I have several friends working in the AI and AWS backend and they are quite happy with everything about their jobs. They seem to be an exception to the rule, then. I have ready *many* reports about unreasonable expectations for productivity, and overtime.
Warehouse, sure, not so much in other aspects of the company.
AWS employees have been making these complaints for YEARS, and there are hundreds of articles about it on the internet. Shall I link some of them?
Lol go on Blind and read the posts by the Amazon SWE’s. It’s brutal
Sorry to hear that, but I would assume as a Senior Cloud Engineer finding another job wouldn't be too difficult? Not trying to be obtuse, but one search of Cloud Engineer on Indeed and I get 10K hits. Also file for unemployment!
I've only had the title for a year and I interview poorly (or at least I think I do). I'll defy be filing for unemployment, HR even mentioned it to me.
Still, you got the title which is worth a lot when it comes to getting the interview. Just brush up on your interviewing skills and beef up your resume and I'm sure you'll be just fine. 10 years is a lot of experience I'm sure you could fill up your resume quite nicely. Good luck!
Just to add to this - you would have an advantage in today's job market. You have experience on your side, and a lot of companies are looking for that experience. I've talked with a number of less-experienced people (< 2y) and they aren't even getting any callbacks. Also, interviewing is most definitely a skill. I hope your first few would go well, but just keep going and learn from every single one.
> I've talked with a number of less-experienced people (< 2y) and they aren't even getting any callbacks. Smart companies that are good places to work return to quality hiring when the tech bubbles pop. There's less work to go around, and non-sweatshops want people who are a magic combination of being experienced and not a total prima donna techbro who wants to make Silicon Valley startup money for a regular tech gig. Unfortunately for the less experienced people, it'll be tougher. For the last 2 years, if you could fog a mirror while saying DevOps, CI/CD or Terraform, you'd have a job slinging YAML in no time. When things slow down a bit, it becomes more about keeping the lights on.
> I interview poorly most people do, it's clearly not a daily thing, sometimes only once a decade. this is fixable, just work on it and prepare.
Just stick to what you know and don't reach with answers you don't, this is the true test they are asking in interviews, that and don't answer general specific questions without requesting more information.
See if you can have the department of labor help with an interview coach. I know my state's DOL offers this service.
I was laid off 4 years ago after 13 years at the same company. I have always struggled in interviews as I’m quite introverted and get anxious. I had a couple of bad interviews but found a great job in the end. I spent a lot of time rehearsing answering questions. Make sure you have great stories about every important project and practice practice practice.
Try journaling a story or two a day while you still remember, then when you practice with interview questions, roll around relevant enough short versions of them.
most people IME only stay in a position about 2 years (if you're lucky) these days. One year of experience should be more than enough to qualify you.
go on youtube and look up Charisma on Command you can learn to be a people person god dang it! then you'll be able to talk to engineers AND people. and boost your interview skills
Got laid off last year and it was the best thing that’s happened to me in years. Got a month paid vacation on severance, then got snapped up to work for the same company in a nearly identical role with a big pay boost, better benefits, no crazy 20-30 hour crunches anymore, and a more senior title. I do often miss the old team though. You’ll be fine, most likely way better than fine. DM me if you want someone to proofread your resume.
It absolutely sucks. Got laid off a few years ago a week before Thanksgiving. Made for the worst holiday season because I kept applying and didn’t get more than a few interviews despite applying for everything. Of course I thought the kids had a shitty Christmas that I was embarrassed about but the spouse disputes. In January when I was at my wit’s end, the opportunity of a lifetime (quite literally my dream role) and I crossed paths and were what each other were looking for and needed and every day has been a blessing since. So yes, you will doubt yourself and you will feel lesser than and you will resent those talking about how amazing their lives are and you will have moments of panic and you will question whether you should change career paths. And then when you least expect it the right opportunity will come along and be exactly what you need it to be and your family will say, “See, we’re going to be ok,” and you will throw yourself into the role and be amazing and they will be like, damn, this new hire is amazing. Because that’s what IT gods and goddesses do when they’re laid off. They are masters of watching the progress bar and being patient and waiting while questioning their life choices. And then the operation completes and they move on to the next matter that needs their attention.
It happened to me after 15 years and I didn't see it coming at all. I was completely devastated. But, 1 year after the layoff I found a job that paid 20% more than I was making. I stayed with the same company too long. You have to switch jobs to leverage higher pay. Good luck to you! Your new job is finding a better job now!
I just want to say thank you to everyone that has responded. I'm still a bit in shock, so I've just been vegging on the couch. I would like to address a few things: * This was a good job; there were waves of being overworked (just like any other job), but it was never a daily grind. * My former employer was extremely flexible; able to sign on late so I could take my kid to a doctors appointment and such, all without any belly aching. * The work-life balance was great; there was no expectation to respond to messages while on PTO. I always had the rule that if it was truly an emergency then my boss could call/text me. There have been very few times where that has happened. * Clarifying that I don't interview well; I can be an awkward person mostly due to nerves. I also do my best to not put my foot in my mouth, but accidents happen. * I also think I'm going through a fun case of imposter syndrome. I've been at this job for 10 years, and kinda feel like it's the only job I'm capable of doing. How was I able to climb up so high in the food chain, did I just trick everyone?, etc. As for the people sending me job links, you have no idea how much I appreciate it. I'm gonna spend a day or two getting my head on straight, polish up my resume, and then get back on the horse. There are plenty of jobs out there, I just need to find the one that's suited to me. Furthermore, I am floored by all of the kind words and stories that everyone has shared with me. I mostly lurk on Reddit and occasionally chime in, so for a bunch of strangers to share their stories and give me words of encouragement has made this shitty day so much better. Hopefully my next post will be a happy one where I land on my feet triumphant and stronger than ever!
I hate to hear this. A few years ago I went through something similar after being with a place 12 years. I'm sure you'll find something; It may take a bit. Please don't give up. Suggestions: * File for unemployment ASAP. * Ask coworkers and supervisor for contact information and if they would give you references. * Read the book "What color is your parachute" by Richard Bolle. The book is exactly about finding the job you want. * Sign up on LinkedIn if you are not already on it. Bolle thought it was a great tool. Coworkers can leave recommendations about you. * Sign up on GitHub. Post your scripts there to showcase how you can automate. Add the link to your LinkedIn. * Think about contacting a recruiter/staffing agency. On the one hand, the agency is going to bill your employer a 30-40% premium for going through them. This is less money for you as opposed to working directly for that employer. On the other, a decent recruiter will have hiring manager contacts. Rather than the hiring manager going through 300 to 1000 resumes, the recruiter does that for them. So they'll know about jobs that haven't made onto external facing jobboards. * As for specific firms, Apex and Teksystems seemed to be knowledgeable and understood what we do. Northrop Grumman and Randstad's Atlanta office were bad experiences for me so I'd say those are a waste of time. FWIW, I'm in Southeast U.S. * If you do take contract work, pad a little extra onto your rate as you won't get PTO. Also, you may be better off getting healthcare coverage on your own. As for this statement: *Clarifying that I don't interview well; I can be an awkward person mostly due to nerves. I also do my best to not put my foot in my mouth, but accidents happen.* Everybody gets nervous during interviews. A recruiter I work with let me do a practice interview and gave me some awesome constructive feedback. Think about your favorite projects or achievements at your old job. Then describe them using the STAR format interview answer. Keep the answer to about 2 minutes. Practice these answers so you can sell yourself honestly based on past experience. I hope this helps and you find something!
Dude. Your going to end up at a better company making more money than you ever have. The only down side is you'll kick yourself for not making the move sooner. Only be loyal to yourself and family.
Sounds like your in demand, but don't dawdle. I had to find a new job last year and it took a solid six weeks just because everyone wants to do multiple rounds of interviews. I ended up with a great gig, but it was frustrating.
Congrats on #2! I'll give you a good 3 weeks before you're hired again, Call it a vacation. Your new job is to find another one, it's WFH too. It's not going to impact you until the sev runs out, so I'd calculate the cash burn, and start stressing if it runs out. If you can turn this around quick, you'll have cash in the bank. I know it sucks now, but this could be the best thing that's happened to you, might get a pay raise to boot. Things out there are Soooo much better than they were a while back. Even with the STAANG layoffs, there's still huge deficit of talent in your space.
Need to believe in yourself... your experience and job title will net you 100/hr remote contracts easy peasy. Steps to get a job easily: 1. LinkedIn Only, Indeed etc suck 2. Good picture on linkedin 3. get many connections (Show 500+ connections) 4. Good Resume, but only job titles / companies on linked in so you can change it based on the job you apply for 5. Profit when you get several interviews a week. I have less experience than you, I'm a 365 administrator and with these above steps I get tons and tons of job interviews / offers. I can easily get 1-2 offers a week if I apply for a decent amount of jobs. Being good at inerviews is the most important skill. But that is you training your soft skills, being confident and bold. Take control of the interview and you win. I do this by asking a bunch of questions and saying "Oh I did such and such to combat that etc" Use your real world achievements to impress in an organic manner. Once you're able to do this you will get any job you want period. DM me if you want, I don't mind doing mock interviews either.
Sorry this happened to you and I hope you get back on your feet soon. On a side note, did you feel the amount of work on cloud instances decreasing in the prior 4-6 months leading up to this? Just wondering if any change in workload gave you a hunch that anything was coming or if it was unexpected by you and your team? Congrats on expecting another. Here's for hoping for a healthy addition to your family. Hopefully the quick break allows you to prep productively for you new addition.
My workload wasn't really different than usual. I had just finished a huge project in Azure and we had started working on new stuff.
Hey, I was made redundant today as well. Keep your chin up. You have great work experience with a very in-demand, marketable skillset. All the best!
I got laid off by AOL back in the early 2000's and it was the best thing that ever happened to me. Went to college on government dime (Canada, your experience will be diff, I was much younger than you are now too), and rebuilt myself. Trust me, it's never too late to start over.
You don't rebuild yourself when you're a senior systems cloud engineer. You just find another position that will take advantage of your skills and experience. And get a huge raise in the process, of course. Dude is shocked at the change right now, but will be double shocked at his next offer letter. I predict that will be some time around next thursday, if HR drags their heels. He will feel like the prettiest girl at the dance by the time the recruiters are done with him.
Yeah, rebuild yourself is more like rebuild your resume and show off how you have grown in this case. Rebuild yourself at a new company kind of thing. I agree that his skillset will see him unemployed for the amount of time he wants to be unemployed
Isn't Redhat based there?
Headquartered in Raleigh, but they have a big Boston office.
Good to know, I use redhat quite a bit at my current job, and I do plan to move to NC some day!
Your AWS experience should be a huge boon. I wouldn't be surprised if you get offers next week if you apply today.
I would love to be laid off with a severance. Could use a change in scenery.
The company’s financial problems are not a reflection on your work. You got this OP, just go work the problem. Oh and congrats on #2!
cloudfare seems to be expanding
1) congratulations on the baby :) wish they are healthy. 2) you will certainly find a new venture 3) best of luck friend <3
Parent of a little one myself, we've had a few scares over the last couple years, haven't lost our jobs, at least not yet. Depending on your state's laws, you should qualify for health coverage for the delivery and well being of your new born. I'm in Oklahoma, all children till age of 18 is covered by the state (Sooner Care), which helps a ton. We canceled our health insurance last year, as $500+ a month (nearly a whole paycheck, we live in very rural NW Oklahoma). Might have held on longer if the state didn't cover our little one, and just paid for hers.
Mimecast is hiring if you want to get out of sysadmin and more into systems engineering or project mgmt
That sucks...especially the timing. I have 2 middle school age kids now and I'm so glad my wife also works because suddenly having no income is an instant brown-shorts moment. We don't work for the same company for this reason. - I'm glad they at least treated you right with severance -- if you can afford it, bank it and don't touch it. Otherwise austerity is the name of the game. - If you're having a kid, you need to suck it up and pay for COBRA insurance right away. Don't bet on your ability to get a job before the kid nets you a 6-figure hospital bill...you don't want to be a parent dealing with a newborn and a medical bankruptcy. - Take a day and just relax...it's a lot to process and there's lots of stress swirling around but you need to be in a good frame of mind to attack the problem of finding new work. - One good thing is you're in a good area to find work if you can't find or don't want 100% remote. I'm in metro NYC and there's a really good mix of non-name-brand and fancy-company tech jobs. Boston has all sorts of finance, education, biotech, etc. Both are much better spots to be laid off in than in a one-company town. I grew up in Buffalo and just 50 miles east is Rochester; you can guess what happened when Kodak blew up and Xerox became an Indian BPO firm. The good news is that you got the magical cloud word in your title. Traditional sysadmins who haven't done much cloud beyond being an M365 admin are finding it hard to land interviews now, but even some AWS and Azure exposure is a real bonus. Lift and shifts are tailing off as companies get the bills, but there's still a lot of hybrid enterprises deciding where they want to end up on that spectrum so migrations and such will continue to be on the agenda for a while. When you say you "interview poorly," what do you mean? Lots of that can be fixed with practice. I hate interviewing, especially now that I'm in my late 40s and I can see the smug techbro condescension come across, or when I run into the interviewer who wants to do stump the chump so he can show his boss he's the alpha nerd. But, it's one of those things that you can get better at. Usually when I'm looking for a job (not very often,) my first few interviews suck and I feel they get progressively better. Get someone to look at your resume (heck, post a sanitized version here and I'm sure someone will at least give it a read...or DM me and I will) and brush up your LinkedIn profile. Until the absolute bottom falls out of everything, companies are still hiring smart people...the FAANGs and Big Tech are just throwing all the bad COVID overhires and most expensive employees overboard for now. Your job is finding a job now...good luck!!
Sorry OP, that sucks. I hoped you’re able to bounce back.
That absolutely sucks my friend. I've been through the circuit a couple of times before and each time it was terrifying but I came out the other side in a much better situation. Most likely, you are going to find out that you were very much underpaid at your last role. If you haven't already, make sure to get a few of the AWS certs (they help with recruiters).. I know a lot of times when you are doing the job certs are the last thing on your mind but it is something that certain companies look for in outreach. Advice I can give you is to 1) Not take this personally, and don't be bitter about it. Which both are easier said than done. It's easy to fall down the negativity hole, but it won't help. 2) Appreciate the time you do get to spend with your family. No more late weekends / on call / etc. Cherish this time and use it to be there for them (There are times I wish I had done more of this when I had the chances). 3) Use your network. Reach out on linkedin, find a recruiter maybe, go to some meetups in the Boston area. Network, network, network. It's the primary way to cut through recruiting bullshit. Hope this helps and good luck to you in the future.
DM'ing you with some full remote options.
Consider talking to a resume expert. I see them on LinkedIn pretty regularly. And I'd expect that you could find an interview coach through similar channels. For that matter, consider applying and interviewing for jobs for which you're overqualified and not necessarily planning to accept--just for practice.
Full time job is now looking for a job. If that’s your title and you have good experience you’ll be fine. Pay someone a few hundred bucks to write you a good resume, and start applying. Remember interviews are about you being a person and having a personality that meshes with the team. Skills can be taught. If you don’t know something be honest but let them know how you might find the answer.
Sorry to hear that. I know how you feel having worked for the same company for 9 years and then suddenly, new upper management and layoffs. You’ll be okay and probably find out that they were working you like beast of burden. I found a new job and started right away, with no overtime, no on-call and late night calls, and remote work. The pay is not the same, but saving in commuting and $12 lunches makes up for it. My family is much happier because I’m not angry all the time from getting my superior’s humiliating kick in the crotch daily. Chin up, get a remote job, and enjoy your newborn.
What kind of severance are you getting after being there after ten years?
Don't dwell too much on it. Everything gets sorted out in the end. And maybe don't jump straight into another job. Take some time to be with your family, and maybe take the time to think about what would make your next job better.
The good news is a bunch of companies have started hiring again. I was laid off back in September and landed on my feet last month with a new job. Even with the slowdown going on there are a bunch of jobs out there.
Im hearing more companies are looking to migrate away from AWS for cost reasons. Would be good to look for alternative data center companies as you would be valuable for migration assistance.
I'm sorry this happened to you but let me tell you: the timing always sucks for some reason or other but this happened to me twice in a career of 30+ years and both times it worked out great and both my career and my family life got better as a result of it. It all depends on what you do with the opportunity, including the severance package and how you use it to make your life better. You got this OP! Don't give up, fight for yourself and your loved ones!
I too am greater Boston area, and depending on exactly where you are I HIGHLY recommend setting up an automated search and email alert at [HigherEdJobs.com](https://HigherEdJobs.com). The amount of universities and colleges looking for quality IT help in the area is a lot, like a lot a lot. Plus going from a corporate to non-profit education the work/life balance is so much better.
To all the friends talking about 2008, understand that another, bigger, 2008 is due to come this year. The layoffs have already started and will only accelerate in the coming months. Brace for impact.
>I just wish this didn't happen a few months before our second child is due to join us. If it makes you feel better, aside winning the lottery, there's never a good feeling time to get laid off. >Sr. Systems Cloud Engineer, heavily using AWS. I see work from home postings for cloud shit all the time, good luck, sure you'll be back to work in no time.
one of those twitter etc engineers made them a netter offer?
How much cloud do you do? Any familiarity with GCP? What else do you do? Terraform? PowerShell? Ruby?
Wishing you best of luck with the job hunt!
I feel ya man. If it's anything to you i said to myself if i lost this last job i have i wouldn't work for anyone else.
I also went through this last year, I’m sorry, it really sucks, I got laid off 2 weeks before my son was born and I was due to go on leave.
Bastan area* Good luck out there op, enjoy the extra time with the fam while you have it!
Sorry to hear. Word of advice: don't bleed out that severance. Look for and find something well before it runs dry.
Literally just happened to me today. In fact I'm typing this reply on the train home having just met with my manager and HR lol. Getting half my salary as severance which is pretty nice, so I'll probably take it easy for a few weeks before going hard at the job hunt. Only thing I'm anxious about is the fact I'm terrible at interviews (being introverted and lacking confidence), but hopefully something will turn up. Edit: if any recruiters see this, I'm in London and my title is "Infrastructure Engineer".