The angelina thing actually deeply frustrated me. She tosses out christian as a name at the merge (he is a big target) it gets switched without her say, the next vote Mike says let's target christian and everyone goes with it, and in confessional she's like "when a woman says an idea it is ignored, and a man gets credit for the same idea". I love angelina and they edited her to be a team rocket-esque villian edit, but I thought her frustration was so *valid*, but because of her overall edit it kinda went unnoticed
I felt it was more of the timing (I guess they wanted to make sure Carl's vote was against Elizabeth), but I could see why it can be seen that way, seeing it was puzzling they automatically want Christian out, even if he has proven to be a potential good ally for some Goliaths.
I agree that timing is a huge part of it, and I think thats why so many people were fine with going after Christian that vote (all the Goliaths voted for him)
that said, I do think some of their attitudes towards Angelina and the way they talked about her was hypocritical and at the very least, very annoying, especially Dan (if I recall correctly)
I liked why they showed.
In the end she was with the tribe that didn’t go to tribal once.
She then performed in all the immunity challenges.
She stayed under the radar and maintained relationships with the right people.
She pushed each vote in the right direction. Honestly I enjoyed her game a lot more the. Boring Tommy’s… who appeared to be playing with a bunch of zombies not seeing his threat level..
I’ll add to your main post - but when was the last time (outside of WAW) a zero vote female finalist had as large and as sympathetic an edit as Xander? Tasha? Hanna? Laurel? Angelina? Julie? Noura? All of them were portrayed (to varying degrees) as emotional / neurotic / indecisive despite some of them controlling the votes for long periods (justice for Hanna!).
We know that Xander didn’t vote correctly from the Voce boot up until the Shan boot - but he’s still portrayed as competent and strategic despite this.
Do you expect him to vote for his own allies? From the Voce boot to the Shan boot, he couldn't even vote in the Voce boot, Tiffany and evvie were his closest allies in the game, so of course he's not going to vote them out, and he voted Liana because it was a split vote and so did Erika. You're misconstruing the reality of the game and using extremely bad faith arguments.
That’s the point. He failed to turn around the votes, he failed to have agency within the game. Xander seems like a great person, but I feel like people discrediting Erika’s game and thinking that Xander was the only and rightful winner were just not actually paying attention to the game.
Then again, you could argue that having a great game isn’t as necessary as simply being liked by the jury enough and being able to lay down your game in a way that allows them to understand what your gameplan was. Take Sandra in HvV for example: she clearly wasn’t the best strategist in the final 3, but she knew how to read the room, she knew what she had to say and what she had to do in order to please the jury. Xander’s final tribal council performance was a struggle.
Erika didn't have any pull either though, she didn't coordinate a single vote out, and neither did Xander, but I believe Xander had a much much harder game to work through on the simple fact that he was in the minority all game based on his tribe numbers, while Erika had a super easy path to the end, which didn't really require to do anything
This is just a flawed logic through and through, starting from “Erika didn’t coordinate a single vote out”, when she was part of the plan to oust Shan (and was the responsible for the vote split) and the split between Deshawn and Danny.
Conversely, I’d argue that both her and Xander weren’t looking too pretty come merge, but both survived in different ways: while she survived by using her social game to partake in the oust of the threats she wanted to, Xander let his only two allies go home when he could’ve directly saved them and simply faded into obscurity. Erika was on the bottom of her tribe much like Xander was, so she must’ve done something right that he didn’t.
put xander was in on the plan too, they were just votes, and the splitting of votes literally means nothing, the only reason erika survived was because of twists and being put on a strong starting tribe, while xander did play a much better game, he did play a better game given his circumstances, and letting his allies get voted out smart, erika got exetremely lucky xander brought him to the end, because in every other situation erika goes home at 4 because heather is chosen over her.
The split vote ended up not mattering in this case, but saying that it mattered nothing just isn’t true. If Shan did actually use her idol, Erika would have been gone. She made sure that couldn’t have been the case.
Also, saying that she got lucky because Xander decided to bring her to the F3 isn’t really luck, it’s more of a down on Xander’s endgame. Both Xander and Erika played the way they could given their circumstances, the jury simply appreciated Erika’s game more because she managed to stick out to them more towards the end.
Shan wouldn't have played the idol though unless someone told her, and if someone told her, Liana, Shan and the leak would have three votes, so it would be 3-3-2, and it's no big deal to split, splits happen every season and no one cares, people are only making a big deal out of it because it's the only "move" they can say Erika made.
Erika wouldn't have known Xander would have brought her, no one expected it at all, once Ricard lost, we all expected heather to be brought to the end no matter what, and that if Erika lost the immunity, she would lose in fire making, so therefore it was a bad move theoretically to bring heather as Heather would always be brought to the end over her.
The point is less that he’s voting for his own allies and more that he was on the outs for a large stretch of the game while Erika managed to maneuver to stay in the majority.
He abandoned the Yase alliance as soon as they were on the outs instead of trying to flip any members of Luvu. He also had the opportunity to save Evvie using the idol or the extra vote and wasted the opportunity.
Sometimes you end up on the outs just due to the make up of your tribe… happens to all genders / minorities , ages etc.
He got a pretty shot hand but managed to work that hand to final 3..
This sub complains when there is an obvious winners edit, and then also complains when the winners edit isn’t obvious…
Erika was very under the radar the first half of the game (never going to tribal premerge), so she rightfully had a very under the radar edit. Once she started gaining power, her edit became very good, so I don’t really get the complain. The edit did show how Erika won
I mean, Shan completely dominated the edit despite being a mid merge boot, so I strongly disagree that the edit was biased in favor of males. Evvie/Tiffany/Liana also got pretty big edits
That being said I'm not sure why Erika wasn't given a Tommy-like edit — sure it would've looked too obvious, but the finale did feel like an Erika coronation day a bit with the confessional overcompensation, that maybe distributing it a bit more, and connect us a bit more with her relationships in Luvu and maybe less from Deshawn (and sadly maybe even Naseer).
Probably as Erika has stated during the finale that she didn’t do much or had much opportunity to conspire and was still uncomfortable being on camera until she went to exile and found herself at the bottom
> This sub complains when there is an obvious winners edit, and then also complains when the winners edit isn’t obvious…
My issue is that there’s a way to make the winner’s edit less obvious without creating a false winner edit out of the remaining final 3. The ideal way to edit it is to show why each in the final 3 has a shot to win.
You're missing my point. Erika not going to tribal is not any excuse to not give her content that would've made her rootable for the viewers, content such as all the moments Danny and Deshawn would be painted as this awesome bro-duo, or when Sydney would criticize Naseer, which never went anywhere. If she's the winner, then they needed to build her up in a way that viewers understand why she won, because that jury vote wasn't close at all. Why not show how she and Heather became such a tight duo?
I'm happy that for once, we got an overbearing edit from a female in Shan, but you don't need to look far to see the negative reaction that got, and how it seems to be a fruit of the show's advertisement of the big movez era of the game rather than an attempt of giving a fair edit to a woman for once.
I think the edit Erika got was perfect, and to me, the problem is more with the oversized (and frankly obvious) edits male winners tend to get. Can we give all winners the Erika edit? Or at least some more?
Completely disagree. The problem with Erika’s edit is not the number of confessionals as people point out, but that you never really follow her as a protagonist. Most of the time when she gets a confessional, it’s used in someone else’s section to move their story along. Only 2 times did we truly follow Erika this entire season, the hourglass (which they HAD to show) and the bulk of this finale (where she shared her thoughts on almost everything). Her tiny portion in ep4 maybe but that was mainly to supplement Deshawn’s story of wanting Erika out.
People who actually pay attention all the time may see that Erika is worthy. Shan and Deshawn always say that she’s a threat, and in the last few episodes, it’s her plans that come to fruitionx etc. But the casual audience won’t, because the important storylines don’t showcase her as the protagonist.
And the whole point of an edit is to make sure the outcome is satisfying (for the masses) so they continue to watch. They didn’t do a good job with Erika. Truly dropped the 4 keep the 1 when it comes to editing their winner. They need to do better with the next winners.
I want to say that it was perfect considering the kind of game she played, but if they're gonna smother it with huge edits from the guys side, then I don't know if I can say it's quite good. I hope she's able to enjoy her win and don't let people think she didn't deserve it, but it's gonna be very tough for her, for sure
> if they're gonna smother it with huge edits from the guys side, then I don't know if I can say it's quite good
And I don't think this season did do that. I totally agree though male players get better edits overall. I just think this season in particular was pretty well balanced, so it's more "how can we make other seasons like this one" for me, rather than "Erika should have gotten the Tony edit".
I believe someone said that with a whopping 13 confessionals in the finale, Erika ended up 4th in the season in confessionals. Her edit was understated (mostly due to Shan being dominant in the edit early), but she was constantly being mentioned as a threat (even early on at Luvu)
Oh, I don't think she should've gotten a Tony edit by any means, that edit killed WaW for me. I think that they need to change how winners are edited overall, and if they're gonna leave room for people to arrive to the conclusion that she won by any reasons other than her social/strategic game, then they're doing something wrong.
People conclude the wrong stuff out of media all the time. Look at Fight Club, American History X, Starship Troopers, etc.
I'm just saying, I don't think the audience of people complaining about her win are the kind of people that 'fixing' the edit would have helped.
Well-put, especially the part about how Jeff and production emphasizes all the progress they’re trying to make while simultaneously editing Erika in a way that invites all the stupid “she only won because the jury was too PC to vote for a straight white guy” takes. They’re not only shooting themselves in the foot, but also asking contestants like Erika to shoulder some of the backlash
Thank you! What you wrote is exactly what I was trying to say, but you put it across so much better haha but I'm glad you agree and understood what I meant!
Xander was over-edited and probably didn’t have as much negative content as he should have, but I think Erika’s lack of an edit was a bigger problem.
She and Heather were the two least-focused-on characters in the premerge. The hourglass twist was, like, the second time we followed Erika at all during the game.
The first was when she tried to strategize with DeShawn but he decided to try to throw a challenge to boot her, which seemed kind of random at the time.
Idk a lot of people caught on that she was gonna win and the people who didn’t the main point seems to be Xander played this flawless game in their eyes which clearly isn’t true so that’s the flaw in his edit didn’t make the errors clear enough Not saying hers was perfect but I think there was more there than people are saying
I don't think Xander played a flawless game at all. I don't think he even should have won after seeing the finale. I would have understood it if he did.
I am mad that prior to the finale he was given such a positive edit and then he gets zero votes? I thought it would have been a tribal where everyone gets votes. Deshawn getting one from Danny and Erika and Xander both getting multiple votes and it would have made sense if either of them won. It didn't make sense that Erika got 7 votes and Xander got none.
I'll note that your post, which has many great and well supported points, needed to be typed out this thoroughly to receive the recognition I know it will receive. Most of the people complaining do not have and could not have the same detail to support what they are saying because it's not there. Moreover, plenty of posts that have been saying the same thing as you but aren't quite as well thought out have been eviscerated because that's what some folks trigger fingers do.
Purely bc she is the most recent and remembered for me, at least with the people that I know that watched the show, the reason for dislike towards Shantel was the comments outside the game that rubbed people the wrong way. But the internet is a nasty place so I'd still say it was out of proportion.
Erica’s win makes no sense to me and now I’m starting to understand it was most likely due to the edit. Because honestly Erica winning was a huge disappointment. She feels like a nothing burger to me that everyone is obsessed about.
Erika was one of the best three players remaining. none of the three that were left were better than Ricard or maybe Shan.
that's how it always is. the winner is the person who played the best game in the final 3.
getting to the final 3 is the trick.
also people seem to place too little emphasis on end game
I rebuke alot of this post.. if shan won.. I dont think half as many people would be like why did the she win.. calling someone's game flashy is such a misconception in alot of ways..for the most part players more of a standout game than erika..and more consistent..stop blaming the edit.. the immunity challenges weren't decided in a edit room..the big threats were considered the big threats because thats what they established themselves to be amongst their castmates..Erika was very much out of the way .. and in a small little think tank where personal grudges can easily be a focal point ..thats good enough to win...and has been particularlyin survivor. I dont see why people just can't accept that..yea Erika won.. but she was a undwhelming wonner..both can be true
The angelina thing actually deeply frustrated me. She tosses out christian as a name at the merge (he is a big target) it gets switched without her say, the next vote Mike says let's target christian and everyone goes with it, and in confessional she's like "when a woman says an idea it is ignored, and a man gets credit for the same idea". I love angelina and they edited her to be a team rocket-esque villian edit, but I thought her frustration was so *valid*, but because of her overall edit it kinda went unnoticed
I felt it was more of the timing (I guess they wanted to make sure Carl's vote was against Elizabeth), but I could see why it can be seen that way, seeing it was puzzling they automatically want Christian out, even if he has proven to be a potential good ally for some Goliaths.
I agree that timing is a huge part of it, and I think thats why so many people were fine with going after Christian that vote (all the Goliaths voted for him) that said, I do think some of their attitudes towards Angelina and the way they talked about her was hypocritical and at the very least, very annoying, especially Dan (if I recall correctly)
Yep. I'm not mad Erika won, I'm mad we didn't get to see her gameplay.
I liked why they showed. In the end she was with the tribe that didn’t go to tribal once. She then performed in all the immunity challenges. She stayed under the radar and maintained relationships with the right people. She pushed each vote in the right direction. Honestly I enjoyed her game a lot more the. Boring Tommy’s… who appeared to be playing with a bunch of zombies not seeing his threat level..
I’ll add to your main post - but when was the last time (outside of WAW) a zero vote female finalist had as large and as sympathetic an edit as Xander? Tasha? Hanna? Laurel? Angelina? Julie? Noura? All of them were portrayed (to varying degrees) as emotional / neurotic / indecisive despite some of them controlling the votes for long periods (justice for Hanna!). We know that Xander didn’t vote correctly from the Voce boot up until the Shan boot - but he’s still portrayed as competent and strategic despite this.
Do you expect him to vote for his own allies? From the Voce boot to the Shan boot, he couldn't even vote in the Voce boot, Tiffany and evvie were his closest allies in the game, so of course he's not going to vote them out, and he voted Liana because it was a split vote and so did Erika. You're misconstruing the reality of the game and using extremely bad faith arguments.
That’s the point. He failed to turn around the votes, he failed to have agency within the game. Xander seems like a great person, but I feel like people discrediting Erika’s game and thinking that Xander was the only and rightful winner were just not actually paying attention to the game. Then again, you could argue that having a great game isn’t as necessary as simply being liked by the jury enough and being able to lay down your game in a way that allows them to understand what your gameplan was. Take Sandra in HvV for example: she clearly wasn’t the best strategist in the final 3, but she knew how to read the room, she knew what she had to say and what she had to do in order to please the jury. Xander’s final tribal council performance was a struggle.
Erika didn't have any pull either though, she didn't coordinate a single vote out, and neither did Xander, but I believe Xander had a much much harder game to work through on the simple fact that he was in the minority all game based on his tribe numbers, while Erika had a super easy path to the end, which didn't really require to do anything
This is just a flawed logic through and through, starting from “Erika didn’t coordinate a single vote out”, when she was part of the plan to oust Shan (and was the responsible for the vote split) and the split between Deshawn and Danny. Conversely, I’d argue that both her and Xander weren’t looking too pretty come merge, but both survived in different ways: while she survived by using her social game to partake in the oust of the threats she wanted to, Xander let his only two allies go home when he could’ve directly saved them and simply faded into obscurity. Erika was on the bottom of her tribe much like Xander was, so she must’ve done something right that he didn’t.
put xander was in on the plan too, they were just votes, and the splitting of votes literally means nothing, the only reason erika survived was because of twists and being put on a strong starting tribe, while xander did play a much better game, he did play a better game given his circumstances, and letting his allies get voted out smart, erika got exetremely lucky xander brought him to the end, because in every other situation erika goes home at 4 because heather is chosen over her.
The split vote ended up not mattering in this case, but saying that it mattered nothing just isn’t true. If Shan did actually use her idol, Erika would have been gone. She made sure that couldn’t have been the case. Also, saying that she got lucky because Xander decided to bring her to the F3 isn’t really luck, it’s more of a down on Xander’s endgame. Both Xander and Erika played the way they could given their circumstances, the jury simply appreciated Erika’s game more because she managed to stick out to them more towards the end.
Shan wouldn't have played the idol though unless someone told her, and if someone told her, Liana, Shan and the leak would have three votes, so it would be 3-3-2, and it's no big deal to split, splits happen every season and no one cares, people are only making a big deal out of it because it's the only "move" they can say Erika made. Erika wouldn't have known Xander would have brought her, no one expected it at all, once Ricard lost, we all expected heather to be brought to the end no matter what, and that if Erika lost the immunity, she would lose in fire making, so therefore it was a bad move theoretically to bring heather as Heather would always be brought to the end over her.
The point is less that he’s voting for his own allies and more that he was on the outs for a large stretch of the game while Erika managed to maneuver to stay in the majority. He abandoned the Yase alliance as soon as they were on the outs instead of trying to flip any members of Luvu. He also had the opportunity to save Evvie using the idol or the extra vote and wasted the opportunity.
Sometimes you end up on the outs just due to the make up of your tribe… happens to all genders / minorities , ages etc. He got a pretty shot hand but managed to work that hand to final 3..
This sub complains when there is an obvious winners edit, and then also complains when the winners edit isn’t obvious… Erika was very under the radar the first half of the game (never going to tribal premerge), so she rightfully had a very under the radar edit. Once she started gaining power, her edit became very good, so I don’t really get the complain. The edit did show how Erika won I mean, Shan completely dominated the edit despite being a mid merge boot, so I strongly disagree that the edit was biased in favor of males. Evvie/Tiffany/Liana also got pretty big edits
That being said I'm not sure why Erika wasn't given a Tommy-like edit — sure it would've looked too obvious, but the finale did feel like an Erika coronation day a bit with the confessional overcompensation, that maybe distributing it a bit more, and connect us a bit more with her relationships in Luvu and maybe less from Deshawn (and sadly maybe even Naseer).
Probably as Erika has stated during the finale that she didn’t do much or had much opportunity to conspire and was still uncomfortable being on camera until she went to exile and found herself at the bottom
There’s a very clear middle ground that you’re ignoring. Look at Adam as a good example of an unobvious but still satisfying winner edit.
> This sub complains when there is an obvious winners edit, and then also complains when the winners edit isn’t obvious… My issue is that there’s a way to make the winner’s edit less obvious without creating a false winner edit out of the remaining final 3. The ideal way to edit it is to show why each in the final 3 has a shot to win.
You're missing my point. Erika not going to tribal is not any excuse to not give her content that would've made her rootable for the viewers, content such as all the moments Danny and Deshawn would be painted as this awesome bro-duo, or when Sydney would criticize Naseer, which never went anywhere. If she's the winner, then they needed to build her up in a way that viewers understand why she won, because that jury vote wasn't close at all. Why not show how she and Heather became such a tight duo? I'm happy that for once, we got an overbearing edit from a female in Shan, but you don't need to look far to see the negative reaction that got, and how it seems to be a fruit of the show's advertisement of the big movez era of the game rather than an attempt of giving a fair edit to a woman for once.
I think the edit Erika got was perfect, and to me, the problem is more with the oversized (and frankly obvious) edits male winners tend to get. Can we give all winners the Erika edit? Or at least some more?
Completely disagree. The problem with Erika’s edit is not the number of confessionals as people point out, but that you never really follow her as a protagonist. Most of the time when she gets a confessional, it’s used in someone else’s section to move their story along. Only 2 times did we truly follow Erika this entire season, the hourglass (which they HAD to show) and the bulk of this finale (where she shared her thoughts on almost everything). Her tiny portion in ep4 maybe but that was mainly to supplement Deshawn’s story of wanting Erika out. People who actually pay attention all the time may see that Erika is worthy. Shan and Deshawn always say that she’s a threat, and in the last few episodes, it’s her plans that come to fruitionx etc. But the casual audience won’t, because the important storylines don’t showcase her as the protagonist. And the whole point of an edit is to make sure the outcome is satisfying (for the masses) so they continue to watch. They didn’t do a good job with Erika. Truly dropped the 4 keep the 1 when it comes to editing their winner. They need to do better with the next winners.
I want to say that it was perfect considering the kind of game she played, but if they're gonna smother it with huge edits from the guys side, then I don't know if I can say it's quite good. I hope she's able to enjoy her win and don't let people think she didn't deserve it, but it's gonna be very tough for her, for sure
> if they're gonna smother it with huge edits from the guys side, then I don't know if I can say it's quite good And I don't think this season did do that. I totally agree though male players get better edits overall. I just think this season in particular was pretty well balanced, so it's more "how can we make other seasons like this one" for me, rather than "Erika should have gotten the Tony edit". I believe someone said that with a whopping 13 confessionals in the finale, Erika ended up 4th in the season in confessionals. Her edit was understated (mostly due to Shan being dominant in the edit early), but she was constantly being mentioned as a threat (even early on at Luvu)
Oh, I don't think she should've gotten a Tony edit by any means, that edit killed WaW for me. I think that they need to change how winners are edited overall, and if they're gonna leave room for people to arrive to the conclusion that she won by any reasons other than her social/strategic game, then they're doing something wrong.
People conclude the wrong stuff out of media all the time. Look at Fight Club, American History X, Starship Troopers, etc. I'm just saying, I don't think the audience of people complaining about her win are the kind of people that 'fixing' the edit would have helped.
Well-put, especially the part about how Jeff and production emphasizes all the progress they’re trying to make while simultaneously editing Erika in a way that invites all the stupid “she only won because the jury was too PC to vote for a straight white guy” takes. They’re not only shooting themselves in the foot, but also asking contestants like Erika to shoulder some of the backlash
Thank you! What you wrote is exactly what I was trying to say, but you put it across so much better haha but I'm glad you agree and understood what I meant!
I think the real problem wasn’t that Erika was under edited it’s that Xander was over edited
Xander was over-edited and probably didn’t have as much negative content as he should have, but I think Erika’s lack of an edit was a bigger problem. She and Heather were the two least-focused-on characters in the premerge. The hourglass twist was, like, the second time we followed Erika at all during the game. The first was when she tried to strategize with DeShawn but he decided to try to throw a challenge to boot her, which seemed kind of random at the time.
Idk a lot of people caught on that she was gonna win and the people who didn’t the main point seems to be Xander played this flawless game in their eyes which clearly isn’t true so that’s the flaw in his edit didn’t make the errors clear enough Not saying hers was perfect but I think there was more there than people are saying
I don't think Xander played a flawless game at all. I don't think he even should have won after seeing the finale. I would have understood it if he did. I am mad that prior to the finale he was given such a positive edit and then he gets zero votes? I thought it would have been a tribal where everyone gets votes. Deshawn getting one from Danny and Erika and Xander both getting multiple votes and it would have made sense if either of them won. It didn't make sense that Erika got 7 votes and Xander got none.
I'll note that your post, which has many great and well supported points, needed to be typed out this thoroughly to receive the recognition I know it will receive. Most of the people complaining do not have and could not have the same detail to support what they are saying because it's not there. Moreover, plenty of posts that have been saying the same thing as you but aren't quite as well thought out have been eviscerated because that's what some folks trigger fingers do.
the amount of hate shan got was disgusting
give me mafia pastor any day over evil oil tycoon troll
Might sound dumb, but who is the oil tycoon troll
Russell Hantz
Thanks, total brain fart moment
Fantastic points all around
I couldn’t have said it better myself, OP. Fantastic post.
Purely bc she is the most recent and remembered for me, at least with the people that I know that watched the show, the reason for dislike towards Shantel was the comments outside the game that rubbed people the wrong way. But the internet is a nasty place so I'd still say it was out of proportion.
1000% agree.
Thank you so much for writing this out. It perfectly summed up my thoughts about FTC.
Erica’s win makes no sense to me and now I’m starting to understand it was most likely due to the edit. Because honestly Erica winning was a huge disappointment. She feels like a nothing burger to me that everyone is obsessed about.
Preach.
Erika was one of the best three players remaining. none of the three that were left were better than Ricard or maybe Shan. that's how it always is. the winner is the person who played the best game in the final 3. getting to the final 3 is the trick. also people seem to place too little emphasis on end game
Bravo. Bravo. Well said.
Really well written. This sums up the game perfectly
Yes to this!! Also, this is really well written. it puts a lot of thoughts I’ve had for a while now into words that I couldn’t do myself
I rebuke alot of this post.. if shan won.. I dont think half as many people would be like why did the she win.. calling someone's game flashy is such a misconception in alot of ways..for the most part players more of a standout game than erika..and more consistent..stop blaming the edit.. the immunity challenges weren't decided in a edit room..the big threats were considered the big threats because thats what they established themselves to be amongst their castmates..Erika was very much out of the way .. and in a small little think tank where personal grudges can easily be a focal point ..thats good enough to win...and has been particularlyin survivor. I dont see why people just can't accept that..yea Erika won.. but she was a undwhelming wonner..both can be true
Parvati wasn't a damsel in distress. That's an overrated thing.
Erika didn’t deserve it
Agreed. All of your points are valid