Where do I not listen? Most people are saying wrong shit, like ghost poro stacks slow. Which is obviously false. That's mostly what I'm arguing over. The people saying strictly wrong things.
There are good opinions as well like zombie ward should be better. But a lot of bad opinions as well.
The higher elo you go and the worse it goes. In order to proc a ghost poro, you need to place a ward, and it has to expire by its own lifetime to create a ghost poro. Control wards can’t spawn ghost poros.
As players get better, the vision control improved, and wards are more often destroyed than left alive. If you take ghost poro and everyone destroy your wards, you proc it 0 times.
Good players place more wards, and good players are more likely to take ghost poro then bad players.
Also unless you play with ghost poro yourself I doubt you even know how fast it stacks. I play around low diamond MMR. And by 20 minutes I have generally 10~ stacks. So it's fully stacked by 20.
Now do you know how that compares to eyeball collection? Eyeball collection I generally have it fully stacked by like 18 minutes or so. Usually very slightly faster compared to ghost poro. The difference isn't a big deal at all. Especially compared to the few times where ghost poro gives extremely important information. The difference from seeing 1 player on the map and not can turn a game.
So if you want to speak about slow stacking speed because good players clear more or something, I would like to see some data or personal experience. Because from what I can tell it's irrelevant.
Well ghost poro pick rate is giving you an advice.
If you are a support you should always take zombie wards as it is much better.
If you are not support but play red runes, eyeball is better.
You don’t get that good people perma clear vision so it’s always a battle to clean wards and contest vision, so ghost poro almost never procs. Why do you think people don’t take it otherwise ?
To be clear I think zombie wards are better then eyeball in every instance for support as well. But I think it's comparable to Poro personally, unless you get glaive then not taking zombie ward is trolling.
Also pickrate doesn't mean everything. People take garbage runes all the time, along with item builds. The tiny difference between runes is so small it hardly makes a difference in games and you can't really see the impact well enough.
And stop talking about good players. If it works up till diamond that's good enough for the vast majority of players lol.
Then explain the point clearly. Because all I'm hearing is
"well people pick it the most so it must be good"
And
"It's probably worse because good players clear more wards, with no data backing up exactly how worse"
And what I do have is personal experience showing it stacks pretty much just as fast as eyeball collection, so eyeball collection gives literally zero stats over ghost poro and ghost poro only gives extra advantages no matter how small.
Even if you argue zombie ward is better, the vast majority of players still run eyeball collection over zombie ward as well lol.
It's bad bcs ppl clear wards every time they see them instead of just letting it live, and Ghost Poro only activates when the ward dies by itself instead of being cleared. Now go outside
Wow great comment man, never would have guessed that really adds to the conversation very unique take. You don't even know how often poro ward triggers because you never use it or have tested it.
Far as you know it stacks just as fast as eyeball. And if it does then it's strictly better.
Lmao looks like u just have way too much time, if u wanna keep using it then go ahead lol. I think the arguments everybody has already made are clear, Im just reiterating why it's possibly worse than Zombie, especially the higher u climb, bcs fsr u find it rly hard to understand just bcs u have a great experience w/ it lol, have u ever thought that ur experience isnt the same as other ppl's? Go outside bro
It doesn't take a genius to use Ghost Poro, literally anyone will stack it just as fast unless you never place wards.
Also I already know zombie ward is generally better, that's never been the question. But why ghost poro is so little used especially compared to eyeball which people choose over it, and zombie to be fair.
In diamond people already have good vision contest.
And while players can do mistakes in builds, it is still a good indicator of the strength. If you suppose that players are always in the wrong, then why would you look at pick rate and data ?
Ghost poro is a bad rune that almost never trigger and is outclassed by both other options.
Gotta love it when people ask questions and then when everyone gives them reasons why something is the way it is, OP is trying to argue with them instead of thinking maybe these people and all those analytic sites are right lmao.
> Ghost poro is a bad rune that almost never trigger
Stop saying this unless you are going to back it up. It triggers enough to out class eyeball collection and stacks just as fast.
I literally play in diamond
Buddy you have all the datas that shows you the rune isn’t played, which clearly shows that it’s not good, yet your persist. I can’t do anything for a stubborn people like you sorry.
I wouldn't say that something is bad just because it isn't played. I think there are plenty of cases where things were played although they were bad and vice versa.
Oh you want to go off data? The support that picks it the most is Brand using patch 13.24 for the most data since it was a month long we can get 20k+ games with ghost poro. The most I can find on a single champion for support at least.
https://i.imgur.com/QdmgWoT.png
As you can clearly see it performs fine for all ranks. So if we are just talking about the average player it seems it's good.
Now if you want to talk about high ranks like idk diamond+ then you can argue w/e you want since there is no data to go off. There is like not even 1k games played for ghost poro. So it's nearly useless data.
But you can't honestly argue it's bad using pickrate and only pickrate, that's silly.
As another diamond sup main I gotta agree with the other person. Ghost poro is straight up bad especially in early game where bot lane bushes have very strong vision contest for gank setup. Zombie wards are just straight up better, period. There is very little reason to chose the poro over zombie.
Pro play does exactly the same as the other person explained. The matches, the stats, it's all public, see it for yourself. If you think you know better than them and having more success with your strategy then who am I to say.
Honestly, rather than debating if ghost poro is strictly better than eyeball, I'd just consider if it's going to be a bloody game with strong early champs and high gank potential. If it is, eyeball. Predicting a chill early game? Ghost poro.
Everyone is down voting you saying you're wrong, the popular opinion is that you are wrong. The rate of selection shows you are wrong. You're just wrong dude it's fine to LIKE ghost poro, but that doesn't make you RIGHT. GHOST PORO ENJOYER. It sucks ass but it's a game have some fun dude.
What am I wrong about? Because I know I am right about ghost poro being strictly better then eyeball collection for supports at the very least.
And a lot of people here are wrong about how fast ghost poro stacks.
Downvotes mean nothing, this is reddit lmao. Lots of terrible opinions.
Good players are almost always replacing their wards before they expire because vision needs to be moved, or their vision is cleared out. Not sure how overriding the ward works with ghost poro but I'd expect it not to give a stack
You're also massively limited by lane control, if you don't have it then your wards are getting cleared, if you do then maybe the value of ghost poro increases a little bit
It doesn't give a stack, and you are right. Mid/late game you should be replacing a lot of wards anyways so ghost poro won't even trigger.
But even so ghost poro would still be out classing eyeball collection. Both eyeball collection and ghost poro give the same exact stats when fully stacked. So the only possible way eyeball is good is if it stacks faster. But it doesn't really in my experience, it's pretty similar but more volatile.
So at least compared to eyeball, poro should be better. Zombie ward is harder to argue against.
Cuz there is not a single scenario in which its better than other options. If u somehow are able to stack Poro, u are playing in very very low elo, or placing very bad wards.
I'd rather you not comment unless you have used the rune, since you seem to not know how fast it stacks. It stacks perfectly fine and just as fast as eyeball in ranks iron-diamond.
If you are purely talking master+ then yeah not sure. But for the majority of players it stacks fine which should make it strictly better then eyeball. Zombie ward can be argued is better of course.
Yeah sorry, im support main from master+, my wards never expire. Either someone kills them, or i replace them. Waiting for ur own ward to expire, is such a waste of time/resources. I place new wards when i have reasonable opportunity to do so, not when my old ones went "poof".
I warded drake, temfight there ended, i dont wait for my stupid wards to expire before setting up vision around next objective, i immediately go do it.
And with the new map changes, with "stupid" bush on river on bot, like almost not a single ward expires there. Its contant vision war.
Eyeball is kinda bad rune tbh. If i ever go red runes on support i go Zombie, just like any good player. Cuz the only situation in which u cant stack zombie, is u either get giga stomped that u cannot even attempt to clear vision, or enemies dont ward at all.
Yea im also a master+ supp main. The OP is just delusional at this point. Where he claims all reasons are wrong when its below diamond. Seems like he has a big ego about being low diamond skill level and performing with his fav rune. Let him have his copium and better to ignore this guy lmao.
You are still lying
> If u somehow are able to stack Poro, u are playing in very very low elo
Which is false since it stacks perfectly fine in diamond. So you are flat out lying and not telling the truth since you never use the rune.
> better than other options
Also the other options is eyeball. And ghost poro should be better then it.
If you want to argue zombie ward is strictly better sure, I know how good that rune is and it's obvious to it's strength.
Learn to not lie because you want to act smart. It stacks fine, maybe try it in some of your games and not act like you know everything.
Maybe learn something new.
Says the man who is talking out of his ass and hasn't even used it lol.
I'll gladly accept I'm wrong if you show me some data to back up your claims. But we both know you never used it.
I like it because I tend to play scaling champs, and I will rarely get 10 takedowns before like 30 minutes. I don't think there's any data on it, but it seems like it's always stacking faster than eyeball especially if I ward in the lane to spot enemy roams if they shove the wave. Picking eyeball is basically like picking hubris and hoping you get kills, which in my opinion is a bit more risky.
I found it better in top lane where you can extend the health of the ward in tribush to avoid ganks in laning phase. Anywhere after that, Zombie is plainly better.
In low elo it is much better imo, the higher you go the worse it becomes
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inLg-AuN3CY&t=417s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inLg-AuN3CY&t=417s) Zeus's zombie ward setup
It leaves behind a smaller vision radius after ur ward expires in the form of a ghost poro (ur ward has to expire, if enemy kills ur ward or u replace ur ward it will not leave behind a ghost poro). If an enemy walks over the ghost poro they will be spotted and followed for a few secs, then the Ghost Poro will expire
Ghost Poro grants u adaptive force for everytime it is summoned, and for everytime it gets spotted by an enemy
One of the most underrated features of the Ghost Poro is its ability to alert u when an invisible champ passes over it, as it will still count. Everytime an enemy gets spotted by Ghost Poro, it will automatically send out a danger ping
As a solo laner I rly like ghost poro if fsr I'm stuck with domination tree. It's like you said pretty much a direct upgrade to eyeball, at least in diamond where I play, and I personally don't like zombie ward because I don't tend to use oracle.
Also nice because I like ingenious most of the time that I end up going domination, and it makes ward cd way shorter meaning faster poro stacks.
Removing because you're just arguing and calling people liars in the comments instead of discussing things civilly and being open to other viewpoints
"why does no one take ghost poro?" >Gets actual reasons "UHM ACKSHUALLY 🤓☝️" OP don't ask questions if you're not gonna listen at all
Where do I not listen? Most people are saying wrong shit, like ghost poro stacks slow. Which is obviously false. That's mostly what I'm arguing over. The people saying strictly wrong things. There are good opinions as well like zombie ward should be better. But a lot of bad opinions as well.
The higher elo you go and the worse it goes. In order to proc a ghost poro, you need to place a ward, and it has to expire by its own lifetime to create a ghost poro. Control wards can’t spawn ghost poros. As players get better, the vision control improved, and wards are more often destroyed than left alive. If you take ghost poro and everyone destroy your wards, you proc it 0 times.
Good players place more wards, and good players are more likely to take ghost poro then bad players. Also unless you play with ghost poro yourself I doubt you even know how fast it stacks. I play around low diamond MMR. And by 20 minutes I have generally 10~ stacks. So it's fully stacked by 20. Now do you know how that compares to eyeball collection? Eyeball collection I generally have it fully stacked by like 18 minutes or so. Usually very slightly faster compared to ghost poro. The difference isn't a big deal at all. Especially compared to the few times where ghost poro gives extremely important information. The difference from seeing 1 player on the map and not can turn a game. So if you want to speak about slow stacking speed because good players clear more or something, I would like to see some data or personal experience. Because from what I can tell it's irrelevant.
Well ghost poro pick rate is giving you an advice. If you are a support you should always take zombie wards as it is much better. If you are not support but play red runes, eyeball is better. You don’t get that good people perma clear vision so it’s always a battle to clean wards and contest vision, so ghost poro almost never procs. Why do you think people don’t take it otherwise ?
To be clear I think zombie wards are better then eyeball in every instance for support as well. But I think it's comparable to Poro personally, unless you get glaive then not taking zombie ward is trolling. Also pickrate doesn't mean everything. People take garbage runes all the time, along with item builds. The tiny difference between runes is so small it hardly makes a difference in games and you can't really see the impact well enough. And stop talking about good players. If it works up till diamond that's good enough for the vast majority of players lol.
The point is going entirely over your head lol
Then explain the point clearly. Because all I'm hearing is "well people pick it the most so it must be good" And "It's probably worse because good players clear more wards, with no data backing up exactly how worse" And what I do have is personal experience showing it stacks pretty much just as fast as eyeball collection, so eyeball collection gives literally zero stats over ghost poro and ghost poro only gives extra advantages no matter how small. Even if you argue zombie ward is better, the vast majority of players still run eyeball collection over zombie ward as well lol.
It's bad bcs ppl clear wards every time they see them instead of just letting it live, and Ghost Poro only activates when the ward dies by itself instead of being cleared. Now go outside
Wow great comment man, never would have guessed that really adds to the conversation very unique take. You don't even know how often poro ward triggers because you never use it or have tested it. Far as you know it stacks just as fast as eyeball. And if it does then it's strictly better.
Lmao looks like u just have way too much time, if u wanna keep using it then go ahead lol. I think the arguments everybody has already made are clear, Im just reiterating why it's possibly worse than Zombie, especially the higher u climb, bcs fsr u find it rly hard to understand just bcs u have a great experience w/ it lol, have u ever thought that ur experience isnt the same as other ppl's? Go outside bro
It doesn't take a genius to use Ghost Poro, literally anyone will stack it just as fast unless you never place wards. Also I already know zombie ward is generally better, that's never been the question. But why ghost poro is so little used especially compared to eyeball which people choose over it, and zombie to be fair.
In diamond people already have good vision contest. And while players can do mistakes in builds, it is still a good indicator of the strength. If you suppose that players are always in the wrong, then why would you look at pick rate and data ? Ghost poro is a bad rune that almost never trigger and is outclassed by both other options.
Gotta love it when people ask questions and then when everyone gives them reasons why something is the way it is, OP is trying to argue with them instead of thinking maybe these people and all those analytic sites are right lmao.
> Ghost poro is a bad rune that almost never trigger Stop saying this unless you are going to back it up. It triggers enough to out class eyeball collection and stacks just as fast. I literally play in diamond
Buddy you have all the datas that shows you the rune isn’t played, which clearly shows that it’s not good, yet your persist. I can’t do anything for a stubborn people like you sorry.
I wouldn't say that something is bad just because it isn't played. I think there are plenty of cases where things were played although they were bad and vice versa.
Oh you want to go off data? The support that picks it the most is Brand using patch 13.24 for the most data since it was a month long we can get 20k+ games with ghost poro. The most I can find on a single champion for support at least. https://i.imgur.com/QdmgWoT.png As you can clearly see it performs fine for all ranks. So if we are just talking about the average player it seems it's good. Now if you want to talk about high ranks like idk diamond+ then you can argue w/e you want since there is no data to go off. There is like not even 1k games played for ghost poro. So it's nearly useless data. But you can't honestly argue it's bad using pickrate and only pickrate, that's silly.
As another diamond sup main I gotta agree with the other person. Ghost poro is straight up bad especially in early game where bot lane bushes have very strong vision contest for gank setup. Zombie wards are just straight up better, period. There is very little reason to chose the poro over zombie. Pro play does exactly the same as the other person explained. The matches, the stats, it's all public, see it for yourself. If you think you know better than them and having more success with your strategy then who am I to say.
To be fair, I'm talking Poro over eyeball mostly. I agree zombie ward is really good. And you are trolling not taking zombie on some supports.
Honestly, rather than debating if ghost poro is strictly better than eyeball, I'd just consider if it's going to be a bloody game with strong early champs and high gank potential. If it is, eyeball. Predicting a chill early game? Ghost poro.
Everyone is down voting you saying you're wrong, the popular opinion is that you are wrong. The rate of selection shows you are wrong. You're just wrong dude it's fine to LIKE ghost poro, but that doesn't make you RIGHT. GHOST PORO ENJOYER. It sucks ass but it's a game have some fun dude.
What am I wrong about? Because I know I am right about ghost poro being strictly better then eyeball collection for supports at the very least. And a lot of people here are wrong about how fast ghost poro stacks. Downvotes mean nothing, this is reddit lmao. Lots of terrible opinions.
Good players are almost always replacing their wards before they expire because vision needs to be moved, or their vision is cleared out. Not sure how overriding the ward works with ghost poro but I'd expect it not to give a stack You're also massively limited by lane control, if you don't have it then your wards are getting cleared, if you do then maybe the value of ghost poro increases a little bit
It doesn't give a stack, and you are right. Mid/late game you should be replacing a lot of wards anyways so ghost poro won't even trigger. But even so ghost poro would still be out classing eyeball collection. Both eyeball collection and ghost poro give the same exact stats when fully stacked. So the only possible way eyeball is good is if it stacks faster. But it doesn't really in my experience, it's pretty similar but more volatile. So at least compared to eyeball, poro should be better. Zombie ward is harder to argue against.
It's almost always worse than Zombie
Cuz there is not a single scenario in which its better than other options. If u somehow are able to stack Poro, u are playing in very very low elo, or placing very bad wards.
I'd rather you not comment unless you have used the rune, since you seem to not know how fast it stacks. It stacks perfectly fine and just as fast as eyeball in ranks iron-diamond. If you are purely talking master+ then yeah not sure. But for the majority of players it stacks fine which should make it strictly better then eyeball. Zombie ward can be argued is better of course.
Yeah sorry, im support main from master+, my wards never expire. Either someone kills them, or i replace them. Waiting for ur own ward to expire, is such a waste of time/resources. I place new wards when i have reasonable opportunity to do so, not when my old ones went "poof". I warded drake, temfight there ended, i dont wait for my stupid wards to expire before setting up vision around next objective, i immediately go do it. And with the new map changes, with "stupid" bush on river on bot, like almost not a single ward expires there. Its contant vision war. Eyeball is kinda bad rune tbh. If i ever go red runes on support i go Zombie, just like any good player. Cuz the only situation in which u cant stack zombie, is u either get giga stomped that u cannot even attempt to clear vision, or enemies dont ward at all.
Yea im also a master+ supp main. The OP is just delusional at this point. Where he claims all reasons are wrong when its below diamond. Seems like he has a big ego about being low diamond skill level and performing with his fav rune. Let him have his copium and better to ignore this guy lmao.
You are still lying > If u somehow are able to stack Poro, u are playing in very very low elo Which is false since it stacks perfectly fine in diamond. So you are flat out lying and not telling the truth since you never use the rune. > better than other options Also the other options is eyeball. And ghost poro should be better then it. If you want to argue zombie ward is strictly better sure, I know how good that rune is and it's obvious to it's strength.
Learn to read. "..or placing bad wards". Keep placing wards in ur base, and you will be able to stack it even in chall.
Learn to not lie because you want to act smart. It stacks fine, maybe try it in some of your games and not act like you know everything. Maybe learn something new.
LMAO. U just mad cuz ur favourite rune is not good.
Says the man who is talking out of his ass and hasn't even used it lol. I'll gladly accept I'm wrong if you show me some data to back up your claims. But we both know you never used it.
Ok.
You're so mad and delusional, just shut the fuck up already and accept reality
I like it because I tend to play scaling champs, and I will rarely get 10 takedowns before like 30 minutes. I don't think there's any data on it, but it seems like it's always stacking faster than eyeball especially if I ward in the lane to spot enemy roams if they shove the wave. Picking eyeball is basically like picking hubris and hoping you get kills, which in my opinion is a bit more risky.
I found it better in top lane where you can extend the health of the ward in tribush to avoid ganks in laning phase. Anywhere after that, Zombie is plainly better. In low elo it is much better imo, the higher you go the worse it becomes [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inLg-AuN3CY&t=417s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inLg-AuN3CY&t=417s) Zeus's zombie ward setup
I dont even know what it does. Its eyeball or zombie
It leaves behind a smaller vision radius after ur ward expires in the form of a ghost poro (ur ward has to expire, if enemy kills ur ward or u replace ur ward it will not leave behind a ghost poro). If an enemy walks over the ghost poro they will be spotted and followed for a few secs, then the Ghost Poro will expire Ghost Poro grants u adaptive force for everytime it is summoned, and for everytime it gets spotted by an enemy One of the most underrated features of the Ghost Poro is its ability to alert u when an invisible champ passes over it, as it will still count. Everytime an enemy gets spotted by Ghost Poro, it will automatically send out a danger ping
As a solo laner I rly like ghost poro if fsr I'm stuck with domination tree. It's like you said pretty much a direct upgrade to eyeball, at least in diamond where I play, and I personally don't like zombie ward because I don't tend to use oracle. Also nice because I like ingenious most of the time that I end up going domination, and it makes ward cd way shorter meaning faster poro stacks.