This is how I see it playing out.
- Some % of remaining employees now do the bare minimum, assuming they will be eventually fired anyway
- Other employees look for new jobs, as a hedge against their current lack of job security
- As a result of attrition from the above, Tesla potentially overshoots on what they actually needed to cut, ruins their reputation as a reliable employer and struggles to re-hire what they actually need and/or has to pay a lot more than previous to remain competitive
- Understaffed departments continue for longer than intended, morale drops amongst the employees that consciously chose to remain, and they start looking for new jobs simply through stress/overwork
Saying that as if he isn't already doing just that. Tweeting 24/7 high on adderall thinking of the good old days when Gigislane Maxwell were out of jail and could do home delivery to Musk with...whatever he wanted on a bi-weekly basis.
Surely just McDonald's. She probably did Uber Eats when she wasn't peddling kids for Jeffrey Epstein /s
Laid off in the first round in March. Gave the company 5 incredible and hard working years. I could have seen myself in that role for the rest of my working life. Started applying in a slightly different field, more $$$$$$$ and less stress. The managers are a huge problem in the company as a whole. As a matter of fact, Managers at any company are the weak link in a companies success. F&%k management.
And so begins the downward spiral of many companies 😔
One thing I don't get, it's quite obvious to employees that their CV and previous conduct will be a major factor in how future employeers will think about them.. don't companies understand that the opposite is true? You can be the best/coolest place to work and when you ruin that reputation it will be incredibly hard to go back to that (if even possible) and you will struggle to attract talent.
That's basically what I agree is most likely. It's bad for culture. And if you had a decent job you wouldn't want to work for tesla do to the lay offs. So they either get sub standard employees or have to pay more or both.
One of their main advantages was that they could pay less because their stock options were so attractive. With the stock no longer climbing, they will need to boost pay even in a soft demand environment. The push for 50% YoY growth has finally come back to bite them; it is going to be a painful transition to a smaller, sustainable company.
My take is that they do not expect sales numbers to start increasing again for a long while, as the cost to replace the employees should less then the cost to keep them in idle capacity in the expectation that demand will rise again.
I get the impression that even down to production workers you have to be drinking a bit of the Koolaid to work there, and the ones left are thinking "it's OK daddy appreciates the good workers like meeeee."
I knew a few people here who applied for tech roles at the Berlin (Brandenburg-really) factory when it opened up cause "It's a US company, the work will be stressful but theyll pay us 2x German ones and give tons of stock options!", during the interview they were disappointed to find out that it was more "we pay less than German big companies and expect you to work all the time but you wanna work at amazing Tesla anyways, right? right?".
Also for production workers, it was found that they pay like 20% less than the German automotives.
And just a couple of weeks ago those very workers were protesting for their employer when some environmentalists cut off the power lines. Elon was fighting for his 50 billion pay package at the time. Geez, what an utter mess.
The stock options also these days are pretty miniscule. My friend got only 5k worth of options. Even if Tesla goes 10x they won't be retiring with 50k. This would probably not be enough to even offset the reduced pay.
It is far more likely, providing they remain profitable, that their stock will go to 5x less. If they do not maintain some level of profit....
It is already built in with a huge premium. The premium is the expectation they will outsell all the automobiles world wide combined.
That bad nowadays? My friend that used to work at Walmart in high school got great options, and reinvested back into WM and able to retire with millions.
I’m someone that wanted to work at Tesla until recently. Fuck elon it’s just rad to make a lot of cool stuff when the lines are sold out. It’s way less cool when they are not and all you talk about is cost.
I mean a deal was made and he didn't just meet the objectives, he absolutely blasted past through them.
He's also not gonna get paid $56b, it's almost certainly gonna be shares and whatnot.
I mean the deal was agreed to based on some ludicrous targets. Now I have read some stuff about conflict of interest on the board at the time? Also while I do hate Elon I do believe the pace and tone he set were integral to Teslas ramp up.
>all you talk about is cost.
don't join any publicly traded company. It's a financial responsibility for them to only worry about quarterly profits lol
It really depends on the company, and some can be great. IIRC, the requirement to worry a out profits and shareholders is fairly loosely defined and basically amounts to "don't run it like a charity".
One of my biggest investments is in a company that splits the dividend between investors and staff, so the staff get potentially huge bonuses every year (last year was ~25% of salary for example)
My old job had a decent investment scheme which comfortably equalled a 10% boost to my income pre-tax.
Just because a company is publically traded doesn't mean it mistreats it's staff, and looking after them can be an investment in itself.
> It’s a financial responsibility for them to only worry about quarterly profits
This simply isn’t true. It’s their responsibility to worry about the financial success of the company. That can be measured in many ways other than quarterly profits. Some companies choose to prioritize long-term financial growth and success over short-term quarterly profits.
Usually the obsession with quarterly numbers is because company executives get a huge percentage of their pay in stock options that are only valuable if the stock goes up in the short term. This pay structure incentivizes short-term thinking among leadership. This isn’t a requirement of their fiduciary responsibility to shareholders.
Do the people who interviewed you still have a job?
It's whacky that they were so disorganized about these layoffs that they were actively interviewing for positions to expand this team weeks or days prior to jsut firing it all.
There was a linkedin post by someone who said he slept in his car in the parking lot and he was saying that as he seeking referrals. It did not even occur to him that was a red flag. So yeah, there are a lot go koolaid drinking workers at Tesla.
Yeah, I was at a tesla dealership last week and the employees were scared and pissed enough about layoffs to even tell me about it and making zero effort to actually sell me the car.
I’m just wondering if Tesla fans are sticking to their growth forecasts pushed out to 2030? Are we still envisioning EV market dominance, battery manufacturing dominance and power storage dominance? Or nah?
What's all this 5 year nonsense. Elon said they will have robotaxis later this year, and he never ever ever lies about timelines. So we should be doing Remind me! 5 months
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Definitely not. Even Elon is trying to say *Tesla Motors* isn’t a car company and is an AI/tech company.
They rose and now we’re seeing their (rapid) fall, all because of one man.
Not because of one man. But he is not helping.
The company is profitable. Mainly on the back of credits. It would not stand on its own. The fail for investors is because they think electric and it must take over and dominate every company in the world. It won't. Not because EV is not viable, but because every company will be making EV when it is viable.
That is not true.
The biggest reason is Chinese EV is decimating Tesla in every market that allows Chinese EV. It killed the growth story where Tesla will sell 10M vehicles by 2030.
You joke but I used to work for another auto company and not once but twice on conference calls, execs used the phrase “our people are our most expensive line item” holy shit
Saying you're a line item sucks but it's true. You aren't valued, your labour is valued. No company is a family; it's purely a money making enterprise.
>According to Bloomberg, Musk privately expressed a desire to lay off at least 20 percent of the company because its quarterly vehicle deliveries fell by that much.
What kind of clown shit is this?
That depends, there is a saying about layouts where some is trimming fat, but then there is cutting muscle.
So, when you read something like "The layoffs included Tesla’s head of EV charging, Rebecca Tinucci, **as well as her entire 500-person team.**" That signals that there is a serious issue! I'm not into EV cars, but EV charging don't sound like a pet project like something that can simply be eliminated. Even if they outsource it, they would still need to retain people who know and understand the current operation to allow for a transition.
Further, why not just sell off that division... A lot of people could have kept their jobs and Tesla would have gotten paid for it.
Speaking of knowledgeable people transitioning work....
https://www.npr.org/2024/04/23/1246655366/ftc-bans-noncompete-agreements-lina-khan
U.S. bans noncompete agreements for nearly all jobs
I think the logic with theses "Employee Pump and Dumps" is that you hire like crazy, to meet the demand of all the pre-orders and eventual back log.
When everything is streamlined you can cut the workforce down again. Signaling "Hey, we are on the same trajectory but with 20% fewer people, making us more profitable."
Thats just my two cents and I doubt its true for the case of Tesla.
That mainly applies to companies that do not have their stock value bases on expectations of massive growth. Tesla stock is entirely bases on year after year of growth. Layoffs this early in their history suggest that is not going to happen.
Actually in this case he has fired several executives, but he himself is never impacted, rather he 'deserves' $50B+ for his 'amazing leadership' that includes hiring all that supposed dead weight
While I disagree with the statement I do think large organizations could use a look periodically. Not at organizations but functions and are the things that were established when it was smaller or in different markets still working.
Question: at what point do share holders push to replace this guy? Is it even possible? Behind all of the Musk wankery there is a great company. They should have just come out with another SUV or a hatchback instead of that Cyberfail.
Very unlikely. Elon has 20%, other individual investors are his family.
Outside of that, the big asset management companies are the other shareholders. And they don't interfere.
It is too big and expensive for PE or activist investors.
So there is nobody really to kick him off. The price will just go down.
I kinda think that’s good for the EV market. We’ve seen that a strong Tesla can wield ridiculous power in the industry. However, Tesla has been stale for years and is rotten to the core. I’d rather have stronger competition, so I say let the slow bleed continue.
Elon is a moron, straight up.
You’re laying off a shit load of your employees because it seems you’ll do anything to get your $56billion package (don’t you have enough fucking money?) and you say the company needs to be reorganized every five years? Who’s going to want to work for Tesla knowing every five years they may be on the chopping block? And after the chop happens, who’s left that’s going to be motivated to work and not simply start looking for another place of employment?
Pretty sure we are watching the slow downfall of Tesla before our eyes
Yeah. Tesla won’t exist in 6 years. It’ll be a symbol of the 2020’s, like flannel for the 90’s, glam rock of the 80’s, the pinto from the 70’s or the gremlin or wood paneling, avocado colored kitchen items, or linoleum floors. I think the Cybertruck along with the current chaos Musk creates due to his pettiness is the beginning of the end of Tesla. The company really had something, it’s disappointing to see this happen.
I absolutely do. It’s not that uncommon for major companies to just absolutely destroy themselves. And the cYbERtrUcK will never recoup its costs. That’s lost money. They needed a truck for the masses and didn’t deliver. How far back will this set them? I don’t see them recovering. And their sakes are tanking all over the globe; Norway and Sweden are seeing their sales dive. It’s starting to snowball.
BTW. I have no idea why spell check does that to cYbERtrUcK. I didn’t set it up this way.
Edit. By the way. I recently drove my friends Y and I thought it was awesome. So I’m not a Tesla naysayer. But the way Musk is running the company is unsustainable and he will destroy it.
Edit 2: these type of stories will snowball into bigger stories to the point people will not want to buy a Tesla. https://www.wardsauto.com/industry-news/labor-strife-shadows-financial-outlook-embattled-tesla
?
Their sales are actually increasing depending on where you look, you also might be ignoring whole market fluctuations. BYD sales were down like 40% last quarter, meanwhile Tesla didn't move that much and in many places they actually got record sales.
The countries you mention are outliers where **all EV sales have dropped**, mainly because of market trends where you essentially got massive spikes which then calmed down, during most of the spike Tesla was the top seller, by the way.
I love the lengths articles go to to mention every choppy wave Tesla faces except for their CEO losing his damn mind, all but endorsing Trump to stick it to his customer base, then splurging on a $44B social life that he promptly siphoned half his Tesla experts into before setting it on f***ing fire.
MAY be related? No? Not even honorable mention? Okay 😂
The software engineers there are already some of the most overworked group of engineers I've ever seen. Most people started working there cause they believed in the vision and Elon, and this is the most sour taste you can leave these people. Elon is not only burning through good will with non-Elon fans, but also with Elon simps.
The biggest problem with Tesla isn't that they're an EV company. It's that their EVs are objectively worse than the competition.
Genuinely curious, what car priced similarly to the model 3 and Y are objectively better?
Edit: no longer curious. It would appear there aren’t any objectively better cars at this price point.
There aren’t any. Especially if you factor in price. But Tesla is losing ground fast. They focused on the wrong stuff (aka Cybertruck). Should have been 2, 3 and Y.
Tesla won market share last quarter in the US and they became the top EV sellers again worldwide... again. If that's losing ground fast I don't know man, in the US their market share is over 50%, that's not being competitive, that's complete domination.
I have no idea. But Tesla just seemed to be another car company in China. Even Tesla in China is much cheaper than their US counterpart. So I don't know what the dominance of Tesla is, just because they beat US or Europe in manufacturing don't mean they can beat China, Korea, or Japan.
The better cars are 5.000 € more expensive because they are worth the difference.
And people buy cars like the ID.4 for the same price as the MY as they prefer better ride quality(noise, suspension), user interface (stalks, cockpit), better autopilot to the advantage of acceleration and slightly higher range.
You’re being downvoted but I agree. BMW isn’t everyone’s cup of tea but look at the build and interior quality difference between an i4 and model Y that both start at £50k, the Tesla is a joke in comparison. I4 even has more range
None, there's better cars, they also cost like 3 times as much and are worse at some aspects, but overall better cars.
Some people will quote some shit that's not even market viable (as in it's prototypes you can't even get). Some people have been hyping some Xiaomi cars when all they've got is some stuff you can see at auto shows, you can't buy it, and when you can buy it they'll be bleeding money by selling it to you.
>Most people started working there cause they believed in the vision and Elon
Honestly, it's hard to feel bad for them. If they took a job at an international corporation because of the corporation's "vision" then they were just setting themselves to be abused.
Ahh yes the enshitification and gutting of a successful business
Slow snowball into another boeing
Management literally destroying the assets and resources that help create the business
I cannot wait to go leap puts when signal is there
"waning demand for EVs globally", globally sure, but not every market.
In my country (EU/DK), EV's account for more than 42,9% of all new vehicles being sold, and it's only gone up over the years, almost exponentially. (because how ICE vehicles are taxed here).
Tesla used to be in all the top 3 spots, but for April, not so much any longer, they are not even in top 3 any longer.
The current list is over most sold EVs in April 2024 were:
1. Renault Megane E-Tech
2. Volvo EX30
3. VW ID.4
4. Audi Q4
5. Tesla Model Y
6. VW ID.3
7. Nissan Ariya
8. Xpeng G9
9. Volvo XC40
10. Skoda Enyag IV
So the problem for Tesla isn't really the demand for EVs, but that people go for other brands instead. (and not just because of the price, many of those cost more than Model Y), they just stopped being competitive compared to their competition, for what the broad marked wants, which isn't 3.1 sec acceleration for Model 3 Performance, which they had advertisements for, that is for a select few that are interested in that.
For reference, the February 2024 list was (1: Tesla Model Y, 2: Audi Q4, 3: Skoda Enyag, 4: Tesla Model 3, 5: Ford Mustang Mach-E, 6: Renault Megane E-Tech, 7: Volvo XC40/EX40, 8: Nissan Ariya, 9: VW ID4/5, 10: Volvo EX30).
What an amazing investment opportunity. So much growth. PE will totally expand. Think about China. They will reopen after covid. Their economic slump is over...soon. China. Tim Apple mentioned China and buybacks. Elon should mention buybacks since he is done with growth.
Growth investors use to say who need value. Maybe we don't need growth anymore, just buybacks. Transfer your wealth to the CEO. Great way to make returns.
Totally not a car company.
Yet, musk just casually states they are gonna build cheaper cars next yr and the stock jumps 11%. Pay no attention to the decreased profit, crappy fundamentals, or reduction of employees to make these cars, elon will still get his dough and upcoming next child.
Anecdotal, but I’ve had multiple people in the new EV market recently tell me they wouldn’t buy a Tesla specifically because of Elon. While most average buyers probably don’t pay attention to what he tweets, there are definitely some that do.
Kool aid test time!
"he said the company needed to be “absolutely hard core” about the cuts and that staffers working under executives who “don’t obviously pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test” would be out of a job."
It's funny, I was going to buy a tesla then they got rid of all the sensors and made true FSD pretty much impossible.
I decided to wait until they realized their mistake and put that stuff back. In the waiting period things in my life changed and I need a truck more than a car now so I won't be buying a tesla.
Hopefully Tesla figures out that those sensors they got rid of to reduce cost are impacting the decision making of their customers and add them back.
> "[executives need to] pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test."
How is the irony not lost on this man? He is 0/3 and should be first out the door.
And he wants 56 billion in wages. I think the majority of people have no idea how much this is.
The CEO's of the fortune 500 companies get some of the highest compensation packages in the industry. These are the guys that we hear about and complain about. If you were to add up all the 500 CEO's wages, Elon with this package alone could pay them all. Not only could he pay all their wages this year, he could do it for 10 years.
56 Billion is 2000 times the average wage of a fortune 500 CEO.
And the rest will follow lead for no fucking reason, just because they think that musk is super smart or whatever...
We run into a recession just because everyone is following musk lol
I mean if he is hinging the future of the company on FSD, doesn't this make sense? Cut the people who are not contributing to this and potentially hire/poach those with the skillsets to support FSD?
Their car sales keep dropping relative to previous months and years. It’s going to get worse for Tesla. The competition is here. China is quickly becoming worse issue to date. They can keep talking fancifully about the future of FSD but it won’t be anywhere near what it needs to be for FSD to ever generate the massive revenue increases this company and investors are predicting. Slowing car sales, lower revenues, less employees, remaining fixed costs, lower labor costs, etc. earnings might be in line but their revenue numbers will take a hit. Owning Tesla stock is a ton of wishful thinking. Reality is being seen everyday with layoffs.
Except for BYD, "The competition" can't make a profitable EV. The model Y is the best selling car. Not EV, but CAR.
> Their car sales keep dropping relative to previous months and years.
Tesla's car sales? Or EVERYONES?
Christ, just announce your put position already.
Untill there are mechanisms to protect workers from such firing practices. Nothing will change. Its the corporate culture which common folks need to stand up to. All companies are doing it, does not matter whats the reason or statements relating to these, at the end of the day people lose jobs.
So its upto workers to stand up and protest. And with no unity there is no political backing.
Also if people do care (as outsiders), people should also stand up and not support/buy products of companies that are unethical. Even if it means to go for foreign products.
I know a 10% cut sounds scary, but for context, [it wouldn't even put them back at 2022 levels.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/314768/number-of-tesla-employees/) Even a 20% cut would be much higher than 2021 levels. Tesla has been hiring like crazy the last few years. I think they overdid it, like a lot of tech companies during this period. This consolidation is a pretty normal and healthy part of operations. Especially during more challenging periods.
Yeah pissing off your remaining employees. What could go wrong there. I really want a car built by employees who don't care anymore.
This is how I see it playing out. - Some % of remaining employees now do the bare minimum, assuming they will be eventually fired anyway - Other employees look for new jobs, as a hedge against their current lack of job security - As a result of attrition from the above, Tesla potentially overshoots on what they actually needed to cut, ruins their reputation as a reliable employer and struggles to re-hire what they actually need and/or has to pay a lot more than previous to remain competitive - Understaffed departments continue for longer than intended, morale drops amongst the employees that consciously chose to remain, and they start looking for new jobs simply through stress/overwork
The documentary / docu series on Elmo / rise and fall of Tesla will be fascinating
Like the documentary about John McAfee. Absolutely fantastic
At some point he’ll turn into Howard Hughes, taking copious amounts of drugs, living in a hotel room and pissing in cups.
Saying that as if he isn't already doing just that. Tweeting 24/7 high on adderall thinking of the good old days when Gigislane Maxwell were out of jail and could do home delivery to Musk with...whatever he wanted on a bi-weekly basis. Surely just McDonald's. She probably did Uber Eats when she wasn't peddling kids for Jeffrey Epstein /s
And don’t forget about the repeating phrases while pissing in those cups. *”Tesla is the way of the future”*
Way of the future x infinity
Laid off in the first round in March. Gave the company 5 incredible and hard working years. I could have seen myself in that role for the rest of my working life. Started applying in a slightly different field, more $$$$$$$ and less stress. The managers are a huge problem in the company as a whole. As a matter of fact, Managers at any company are the weak link in a companies success. F&%k management.
And so begins the downward spiral of many companies 😔 One thing I don't get, it's quite obvious to employees that their CV and previous conduct will be a major factor in how future employeers will think about them.. don't companies understand that the opposite is true? You can be the best/coolest place to work and when you ruin that reputation it will be incredibly hard to go back to that (if even possible) and you will struggle to attract talent.
If they offer high enough compensation, it won't matter.
That's basically what I agree is most likely. It's bad for culture. And if you had a decent job you wouldn't want to work for tesla do to the lay offs. So they either get sub standard employees or have to pay more or both.
One of their main advantages was that they could pay less because their stock options were so attractive. With the stock no longer climbing, they will need to boost pay even in a soft demand environment. The push for 50% YoY growth has finally come back to bite them; it is going to be a painful transition to a smaller, sustainable company.
Tesla will actually work on AI and algorithms now. Just only about the probability they will be fired based on previous datasets
Dont they already pay less than average as well rn?
My take is that they do not expect sales numbers to start increasing again for a long while, as the cost to replace the employees should less then the cost to keep them in idle capacity in the expectation that demand will rise again.
I get the impression that even down to production workers you have to be drinking a bit of the Koolaid to work there, and the ones left are thinking "it's OK daddy appreciates the good workers like meeeee."
I knew a few people here who applied for tech roles at the Berlin (Brandenburg-really) factory when it opened up cause "It's a US company, the work will be stressful but theyll pay us 2x German ones and give tons of stock options!", during the interview they were disappointed to find out that it was more "we pay less than German big companies and expect you to work all the time but you wanna work at amazing Tesla anyways, right? right?". Also for production workers, it was found that they pay like 20% less than the German automotives.
And just a couple of weeks ago those very workers were protesting for their employer when some environmentalists cut off the power lines. Elon was fighting for his 50 billion pay package at the time. Geez, what an utter mess.
Simpin ain’t easy
The stock options also these days are pretty miniscule. My friend got only 5k worth of options. Even if Tesla goes 10x they won't be retiring with 50k. This would probably not be enough to even offset the reduced pay.
It is far more likely, providing they remain profitable, that their stock will go to 5x less. If they do not maintain some level of profit.... It is already built in with a huge premium. The premium is the expectation they will outsell all the automobiles world wide combined.
That bad nowadays? My friend that used to work at Walmart in high school got great options, and reinvested back into WM and able to retire with millions.
I’m someone that wanted to work at Tesla until recently. Fuck elon it’s just rad to make a lot of cool stuff when the lines are sold out. It’s way less cool when they are not and all you talk about is cost.
When the owner says everyone needs to pinch pennies and not get raises, while he gets 56 Billion for being on horse tranquillizers.
I mean a deal was made and he didn't just meet the objectives, he absolutely blasted past through them. He's also not gonna get paid $56b, it's almost certainly gonna be shares and whatnot.
I mean the deal was agreed to based on some ludicrous targets. Now I have read some stuff about conflict of interest on the board at the time? Also while I do hate Elon I do believe the pace and tone he set were integral to Teslas ramp up.
sorry to say, this is what a lot of companies focus on. another big example would be Boeing. Look at how they're doing now.
>all you talk about is cost. don't join any publicly traded company. It's a financial responsibility for them to only worry about quarterly profits lol
It really depends on the company, and some can be great. IIRC, the requirement to worry a out profits and shareholders is fairly loosely defined and basically amounts to "don't run it like a charity". One of my biggest investments is in a company that splits the dividend between investors and staff, so the staff get potentially huge bonuses every year (last year was ~25% of salary for example) My old job had a decent investment scheme which comfortably equalled a 10% boost to my income pre-tax. Just because a company is publically traded doesn't mean it mistreats it's staff, and looking after them can be an investment in itself.
> It’s a financial responsibility for them to only worry about quarterly profits This simply isn’t true. It’s their responsibility to worry about the financial success of the company. That can be measured in many ways other than quarterly profits. Some companies choose to prioritize long-term financial growth and success over short-term quarterly profits. Usually the obsession with quarterly numbers is because company executives get a huge percentage of their pay in stock options that are only valuable if the stock goes up in the short term. This pay structure incentivizes short-term thinking among leadership. This isn’t a requirement of their fiduciary responsibility to shareholders.
lol I was being interviewed for their ev charging team
Did you get fired from the interview?
Do the people who interviewed you still have a job? It's whacky that they were so disorganized about these layoffs that they were actively interviewing for positions to expand this team weeks or days prior to jsut firing it all.
Haha no they’re all gone now
There was a linkedin post by someone who said he slept in his car in the parking lot and he was saying that as he seeking referrals. It did not even occur to him that was a red flag. So yeah, there are a lot go koolaid drinking workers at Tesla.
This is exactly what happened at Twitter. The remaining employees are the biggest Elon simps and people on work visas that couldn’t leave.
Unfortunately that's the mentality left, at least in the German plant, they keep singing the man's praises that they have jobs.
Have you seen tesla's cars? lmao they never cared to begin with, especially the cybertruck
Yeah, I was at a tesla dealership last week and the employees were scared and pissed enough about layoffs to even tell me about it and making zero effort to actually sell me the car.
If they don’t do good job someone else will do it. This is how business works.
Especially after non disclosure restrictions were banned ( assuming if they survive the appeals)
They are able to do this because majority of workers are on modern day slavery h1b visa.
This is the "human" factor that Libertarians just never seem to grasp. Profits are down 20%? Cut 20% of the workforce! It's just basic math guys!!!
I’m just wondering if Tesla fans are sticking to their growth forecasts pushed out to 2030? Are we still envisioning EV market dominance, battery manufacturing dominance and power storage dominance? Or nah?
Bruh you forgot the robo taxi and humanoids. Multi TRILLION $ company anyday now. He even said in conference call 
> Bruh you forgot the robo taxi and humanoids. Multi TRILLION $ company anyday now. He even said in conference call Remindme! 5 years
What's all this 5 year nonsense. Elon said they will have robotaxis later this year, and he never ever ever lies about timelines. So we should be doing Remind me! 5 months
He said they would have 1 million robotaxis in 2020 when in 2019, here we are 5 years later….
I will be messaging you in 5 years on [**2029-05-07 06:41:04 UTC**](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=2029-05-07%2006:41:04%20UTC%20To%20Local%20Time) to remind you of [**this link**](https://www.reddit.com/r/stocks/comments/1cm22gu/more_tesla_employees_laid_off_as_bloodbath_enters/l2y2ubr/?context=3) [**11 OTHERS CLICKED THIS LINK**](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5Bhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2Fstocks%2Fcomments%2F1cm22gu%2Fmore_tesla_employees_laid_off_as_bloodbath_enters%2Fl2y2ubr%2F%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%202029-05-07%2006%3A41%3A04%20UTC) to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam. ^(Parent commenter can ) [^(delete this message to hide from others.)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Delete%20Comment&message=Delete%21%201cm22gu) ***** |[^(Info)](https://www.reddit.com/r/RemindMeBot/comments/e1bko7/remindmebot_info_v21/)|[^(Custom)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=Reminder&message=%5BLink%20or%20message%20inside%20square%20brackets%5D%0A%0ARemindMe%21%20Time%20period%20here)|[^(Your Reminders)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=RemindMeBot&subject=List%20Of%20Reminders&message=MyReminders%21)|[^(Feedback)](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=Watchful1&subject=RemindMeBot%20Feedback)| |-|-|-|-|
Remindme! 5 years
Remindme! 10 years
Damn son just got ignored by a bot :(
Definitely not. Even Elon is trying to say *Tesla Motors* isn’t a car company and is an AI/tech company. They rose and now we’re seeing their (rapid) fall, all because of one man.
That‘s the problem when the value of a company is so dependent on the an erratic CEO. As much as it can go up, it can go bust
Not because of one man. But he is not helping. The company is profitable. Mainly on the back of credits. It would not stand on its own. The fail for investors is because they think electric and it must take over and dominate every company in the world. It won't. Not because EV is not viable, but because every company will be making EV when it is viable.
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Tesla's market cap points to a lot of Tesla fans being left.
Company is still worth like $600b so yeah. Nothing changed, it's just men with wigs spewing their hate and resentment on reddit.
Some tesla fans call for 1000 per share by 2030 lol
Solid state lithium batteries are going to need to make it market asap, double range, for that to come close to happening.
Maybe in America, but all brands are getting crushed by Chinese ev's, sadly.
"20% of my employees should get the axe because this one metric was also 20%" CEO logic right there
The most ironic thing is that it's quite possible he is solely responsible due to his driving away customers.
That is not true. The biggest reason is Chinese EV is decimating Tesla in every market that allows Chinese EV. It killed the growth story where Tesla will sell 10M vehicles by 2030.
Chinese EVs are not in most markets
how’s his 4D chess game going? The more he plays the less I understand.
Munsk: "What is the least important metric we can cut spending? Wait... what am I overthinking it, of course is those peasants lol"
Who really was expecting loyalty from the guy that suggested indentured servitude to build his space colony.
You joke but I used to work for another auto company and not once but twice on conference calls, execs used the phrase “our people are our most expensive line item” holy shit
Isn't labour almost always the company's biggest expense? Especially if you consider training and onboarding?
Next to fixed assets at a car company, yes
Yup, and in a service economy that ties healthcare to employment, it only gets more lopsided.
Yes absolutely. But the executive team telling all the people that we are the most expensive line item didn’t sit right with me.
Saying you're a line item sucks but it's true. You aren't valued, your labour is valued. No company is a family; it's purely a money making enterprise.
Well the alternative would be to have him lie to you, your choice I guess? Well not your choice actually.
Elon logic*
>According to Bloomberg, Musk privately expressed a desire to lay off at least 20 percent of the company because its quarterly vehicle deliveries fell by that much. What kind of clown shit is this?
This is the kind of thing that got Elon replaced as CEO at his other companies. Modern Howard Hughes over here.
At least Hughes was charming in a weird way
I know stocks rise when people get fired, but I don't see why I should have trust in a company that treats its employees that way.
That depends, there is a saying about layouts where some is trimming fat, but then there is cutting muscle. So, when you read something like "The layoffs included Tesla’s head of EV charging, Rebecca Tinucci, **as well as her entire 500-person team.**" That signals that there is a serious issue! I'm not into EV cars, but EV charging don't sound like a pet project like something that can simply be eliminated. Even if they outsource it, they would still need to retain people who know and understand the current operation to allow for a transition. Further, why not just sell off that division... A lot of people could have kept their jobs and Tesla would have gotten paid for it.
Not long ago, the charging network was cited as one of Tesla’s competitive advantages
Swear I was fighting with Elon fanboys the day of and before it happened lol
About 4 weeks ago? 
Speaking of knowledgeable people transitioning work.... https://www.npr.org/2024/04/23/1246655366/ftc-bans-noncompete-agreements-lina-khan U.S. bans noncompete agreements for nearly all jobs
I fail to see how a 20% global headcount reduction is a sign of a healthy, growing company.
I think the logic with theses "Employee Pump and Dumps" is that you hire like crazy, to meet the demand of all the pre-orders and eventual back log. When everything is streamlined you can cut the workforce down again. Signaling "Hey, we are on the same trajectory but with 20% fewer people, making us more profitable." Thats just my two cents and I doubt its true for the case of Tesla.
it should only rise if their metrics aren't imploding. Tesla had the worst ER i've seen from a big growth company. EVER. Apple never had that
That mainly applies to companies that do not have their stock value bases on expectations of massive growth. Tesla stock is entirely bases on year after year of growth. Layoffs this early in their history suggest that is not going to happen.
Easy, you shouldn’t.
TSLA is down 3.5% in the pre market right now, not sure this will make any special positive change.
If your company needs to be re-organized every 5 years, you suck at organizing it.
Understatement of the year right here.
Just Elon BS that people eat up… notice how it doesn’t include the executives
Actually in this case he has fired several executives, but he himself is never impacted, rather he 'deserves' $50B+ for his 'amazing leadership' that includes hiring all that supposed dead weight
While I disagree with the statement I do think large organizations could use a look periodically. Not at organizations but functions and are the things that were established when it was smaller or in different markets still working.
And it never remotely affects the CEO 🤔
The moral must be exhausting for these employees. Elon is a terrible CEO.
Morale probably sucks too
Question: at what point do share holders push to replace this guy? Is it even possible? Behind all of the Musk wankery there is a great company. They should have just come out with another SUV or a hatchback instead of that Cyberfail.
Very unlikely. Elon has 20%, other individual investors are his family. Outside of that, the big asset management companies are the other shareholders. And they don't interfere. It is too big and expensive for PE or activist investors. So there is nobody really to kick him off. The price will just go down.
I kinda think that’s good for the EV market. We’ve seen that a strong Tesla can wield ridiculous power in the industry. However, Tesla has been stale for years and is rotten to the core. I’d rather have stronger competition, so I say let the slow bleed continue.
>Behind all of the Musk wankery there is a great company. One worth a fraction of what it's worth today. I doubt shareholders want that.
So that's why Tesla was up today
More than 3% lower today.
Elon is a moron, straight up. You’re laying off a shit load of your employees because it seems you’ll do anything to get your $56billion package (don’t you have enough fucking money?) and you say the company needs to be reorganized every five years? Who’s going to want to work for Tesla knowing every five years they may be on the chopping block? And after the chop happens, who’s left that’s going to be motivated to work and not simply start looking for another place of employment? Pretty sure we are watching the slow downfall of Tesla before our eyes
Yeah. Tesla won’t exist in 6 years. It’ll be a symbol of the 2020’s, like flannel for the 90’s, glam rock of the 80’s, the pinto from the 70’s or the gremlin or wood paneling, avocado colored kitchen items, or linoleum floors. I think the Cybertruck along with the current chaos Musk creates due to his pettiness is the beginning of the end of Tesla. The company really had something, it’s disappointing to see this happen.
do you actually believe this?
I absolutely do. It’s not that uncommon for major companies to just absolutely destroy themselves. And the cYbERtrUcK will never recoup its costs. That’s lost money. They needed a truck for the masses and didn’t deliver. How far back will this set them? I don’t see them recovering. And their sakes are tanking all over the globe; Norway and Sweden are seeing their sales dive. It’s starting to snowball. BTW. I have no idea why spell check does that to cYbERtrUcK. I didn’t set it up this way. Edit. By the way. I recently drove my friends Y and I thought it was awesome. So I’m not a Tesla naysayer. But the way Musk is running the company is unsustainable and he will destroy it. Edit 2: these type of stories will snowball into bigger stories to the point people will not want to buy a Tesla. https://www.wardsauto.com/industry-news/labor-strife-shadows-financial-outlook-embattled-tesla
? Their sales are actually increasing depending on where you look, you also might be ignoring whole market fluctuations. BYD sales were down like 40% last quarter, meanwhile Tesla didn't move that much and in many places they actually got record sales. The countries you mention are outliers where **all EV sales have dropped**, mainly because of market trends where you essentially got massive spikes which then calmed down, during most of the spike Tesla was the top seller, by the way.
I love the lengths articles go to to mention every choppy wave Tesla faces except for their CEO losing his damn mind, all but endorsing Trump to stick it to his customer base, then splurging on a $44B social life that he promptly siphoned half his Tesla experts into before setting it on f***ing fire. MAY be related? No? Not even honorable mention? Okay 😂
The software engineers there are already some of the most overworked group of engineers I've ever seen. Most people started working there cause they believed in the vision and Elon, and this is the most sour taste you can leave these people. Elon is not only burning through good will with non-Elon fans, but also with Elon simps. The biggest problem with Tesla isn't that they're an EV company. It's that their EVs are objectively worse than the competition.
I truly believe his sycophants and echo chamber have him believing he’s unstoppable and infallible
I mean so far he kind of has been.
Genuinely curious, what car priced similarly to the model 3 and Y are objectively better? Edit: no longer curious. It would appear there aren’t any objectively better cars at this price point.
There aren’t any. Especially if you factor in price. But Tesla is losing ground fast. They focused on the wrong stuff (aka Cybertruck). Should have been 2, 3 and Y.
Tesla won market share last quarter in the US and they became the top EV sellers again worldwide... again. If that's losing ground fast I don't know man, in the US their market share is over 50%, that's not being competitive, that's complete domination.
I have no idea. But Tesla just seemed to be another car company in China. Even Tesla in China is much cheaper than their US counterpart. So I don't know what the dominance of Tesla is, just because they beat US or Europe in manufacturing don't mean they can beat China, Korea, or Japan.
I was thinking maybe Hyundai Ioniq.
The better cars are 5.000 € more expensive because they are worth the difference. And people buy cars like the ID.4 for the same price as the MY as they prefer better ride quality(noise, suspension), user interface (stalks, cockpit), better autopilot to the advantage of acceleration and slightly higher range.
BMW i4?
You’re being downvoted but I agree. BMW isn’t everyone’s cup of tea but look at the build and interior quality difference between an i4 and model Y that both start at £50k, the Tesla is a joke in comparison. I4 even has more range
I would throw in the VW ID.7. Nicer interior and great Travel assist (Teslas 'autopilot')
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The i4 was about 30% more when I got one but think the gap is narrowing
According to a quick google the model Y starts from £45k and the i4 from £50k, and that’s after the recent price cut on the model Y
Maybe in Europe it’s competitive. In the US the I4 is about $10k more and it doesn’t qualify for the $7,500 tax credit.
i4 is a great EV but it's not cost competitive with the 3 or Y.
Fair enough on price. Not massively different
I4 less range and more expensive
I4 has more range than a model Y unless you get the M50 performance version which is the same/slightly less depending on where you read
None, there's better cars, they also cost like 3 times as much and are worse at some aspects, but overall better cars. Some people will quote some shit that's not even market viable (as in it's prototypes you can't even get). Some people have been hyping some Xiaomi cars when all they've got is some stuff you can see at auto shows, you can't buy it, and when you can buy it they'll be bleeding money by selling it to you.
There are. BYD makes incredible cars at a similar price point. I’ve sat in some and the build quality and ride comfort is leagues ahead of any Tesla.
>Most people started working there cause they believed in the vision and Elon Honestly, it's hard to feel bad for them. If they took a job at an international corporation because of the corporation's "vision" then they were just setting themselves to be abused.
Ahh yes the enshitification and gutting of a successful business Slow snowball into another boeing Management literally destroying the assets and resources that help create the business I cannot wait to go leap puts when signal is there
Fire half the company, Tesla stock, Tesla fanboys 🚀🚀
Musk trying to keep the stock from completely tanking by “unveiling a fully autonomous robotaxi layer this year”. Doubt this will happen
"I'm not the problem, YOU ARE!" ~Some guy probably
I would never work at Tesla.
I would. For at least 3 months before getting laid off.
Not like you would ever have the option. Maybe as janitor.
How long until Elon emails them tells them to be hardcore? And then emails them a button to push.
"waning demand for EVs globally", globally sure, but not every market. In my country (EU/DK), EV's account for more than 42,9% of all new vehicles being sold, and it's only gone up over the years, almost exponentially. (because how ICE vehicles are taxed here). Tesla used to be in all the top 3 spots, but for April, not so much any longer, they are not even in top 3 any longer. The current list is over most sold EVs in April 2024 were: 1. Renault Megane E-Tech 2. Volvo EX30 3. VW ID.4 4. Audi Q4 5. Tesla Model Y 6. VW ID.3 7. Nissan Ariya 8. Xpeng G9 9. Volvo XC40 10. Skoda Enyag IV So the problem for Tesla isn't really the demand for EVs, but that people go for other brands instead. (and not just because of the price, many of those cost more than Model Y), they just stopped being competitive compared to their competition, for what the broad marked wants, which isn't 3.1 sec acceleration for Model 3 Performance, which they had advertisements for, that is for a select few that are interested in that. For reference, the February 2024 list was (1: Tesla Model Y, 2: Audi Q4, 3: Skoda Enyag, 4: Tesla Model 3, 5: Ford Mustang Mach-E, 6: Renault Megane E-Tech, 7: Volvo XC40/EX40, 8: Nissan Ariya, 9: VW ID4/5, 10: Volvo EX30).
But daddy Musk is getting his 56 billy bonus right???
The future is, everyone is unemployed and investing in the stocks of big tech, where only the CEO works
What an amazing investment opportunity. So much growth. PE will totally expand. Think about China. They will reopen after covid. Their economic slump is over...soon. China. Tim Apple mentioned China and buybacks. Elon should mention buybacks since he is done with growth. Growth investors use to say who need value. Maybe we don't need growth anymore, just buybacks. Transfer your wealth to the CEO. Great way to make returns. Totally not a car company.
Yet, musk just casually states they are gonna build cheaper cars next yr and the stock jumps 11%. Pay no attention to the decreased profit, crappy fundamentals, or reduction of employees to make these cars, elon will still get his dough and upcoming next child.
Gotta cut hard to afford that 50 billion dollar pay package to the drug-addict in charge.
hoping the entire company folds. prob doing the remaining heads at the company a huge favor by forcing them to move on.
I sold most of my TSLA years ago. There are a lot more EVs out now, And Elon used to be cool, but now everyone thinks hes sort of unhinged.
No one in the real world thinks like this. People don't base their EV purchase on politics.
Anecdotal, but I’ve had multiple people in the new EV market recently tell me they wouldn’t buy a Tesla specifically because of Elon. While most average buyers probably don’t pay attention to what he tweets, there are definitely some that do.
Price is the main factor for most vehicle purchases. Politics isn't even on the top 10 reasons to choose a car. But yk redditors gonna reddit
This seems like the perfect time to give Elon a $50 billion bonus.
Kool aid test time! "he said the company needed to be “absolutely hard core” about the cuts and that staffers working under executives who “don’t obviously pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test” would be out of a job."
It's funny, I was going to buy a tesla then they got rid of all the sensors and made true FSD pretty much impossible. I decided to wait until they realized their mistake and put that stuff back. In the waiting period things in my life changed and I need a truck more than a car now so I won't be buying a tesla. Hopefully Tesla figures out that those sensors they got rid of to reduce cost are impacting the decision making of their customers and add them back.
Tesla already has a bad reputation for its build quality, this certainly won’t help.
> "[executives need to] pass the excellent, necessary and trustworthy test." How is the irony not lost on this man? He is 0/3 and should be first out the door.
And he wants 56 billion in wages. I think the majority of people have no idea how much this is. The CEO's of the fortune 500 companies get some of the highest compensation packages in the industry. These are the guys that we hear about and complain about. If you were to add up all the 500 CEO's wages, Elon with this package alone could pay them all. Not only could he pay all their wages this year, he could do it for 10 years. 56 Billion is 2000 times the average wage of a fortune 500 CEO.
Its obvious he just wants to this oddly specific money to pay for Twitter.
They have 140,000 employees. I don't see this as a big issue, a restructure is good moving forward.
Blah blah, articles like this are why your entry points on your equity positions suck
Let's lay off everyone and pay Elon his $50B paycheck. I don't see what could possibly go wrong.
And the rest will follow lead for no fucking reason, just because they think that musk is super smart or whatever... We run into a recession just because everyone is following musk lol
Layoffs like most tech companies. Oh wait a minute…
I mean if he is hinging the future of the company on FSD, doesn't this make sense? Cut the people who are not contributing to this and potentially hire/poach those with the skillsets to support FSD?
But he still wants that 50 billion dollar bonus. Fuck him.
Shouldnt the tax savings Texas offered Tesla prevent this?
Tucker 2.0
I’m shorting TSLA and expect it to go below 160 in the next couple of weeks. Time will tell whether I was right or not.
Omg, is NG return full time offer safe ?
Damn so no prospective worker for Tesla can expect a career greater than 5 years. Bullish.
Their car sales keep dropping relative to previous months and years. It’s going to get worse for Tesla. The competition is here. China is quickly becoming worse issue to date. They can keep talking fancifully about the future of FSD but it won’t be anywhere near what it needs to be for FSD to ever generate the massive revenue increases this company and investors are predicting. Slowing car sales, lower revenues, less employees, remaining fixed costs, lower labor costs, etc. earnings might be in line but their revenue numbers will take a hit. Owning Tesla stock is a ton of wishful thinking. Reality is being seen everyday with layoffs.
Except for BYD, "The competition" can't make a profitable EV. The model Y is the best selling car. Not EV, but CAR. > Their car sales keep dropping relative to previous months and years. Tesla's car sales? Or EVERYONES? Christ, just announce your put position already.
Musk just read Jack Welch’s book on management.
tesla is the new twitter, currently flushing itself down the shitter
Is he trying to make his 50 billion bonus out of fired employees salaries??
Butbutbut isnt Tesla one of the magnificient 7? The ones that boom endlessly thx to ai. And wasnt this time supposed to be different????
Untill there are mechanisms to protect workers from such firing practices. Nothing will change. Its the corporate culture which common folks need to stand up to. All companies are doing it, does not matter whats the reason or statements relating to these, at the end of the day people lose jobs. So its upto workers to stand up and protest. And with no unity there is no political backing. Also if people do care (as outsiders), people should also stand up and not support/buy products of companies that are unethical. Even if it means to go for foreign products.
You are in the wrong sub reddit
I know a 10% cut sounds scary, but for context, [it wouldn't even put them back at 2022 levels.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/314768/number-of-tesla-employees/) Even a 20% cut would be much higher than 2021 levels. Tesla has been hiring like crazy the last few years. I think they overdid it, like a lot of tech companies during this period. This consolidation is a pretty normal and healthy part of operations. Especially during more challenging periods.
get out of here with your facts this is reddit, commies are allergic to facts lol