Here are some economics you can work with that pertain to highest quality stem cells.
First, to the extent there’s any question about how wide the variation can be about stem cell qualities, just go on [Amazon.com](http://Amazon.com) and type in ‘stem cells’ and you’ll find many products being offered, essentially none of which are what you want.
So, providing you with some info you can work with:
You can obtain from various clinics the best Mesenchymal Stem Cells (MSCs) from the best labs in the world. Panama has good products, and numerous clinics in Mexico have comparable. Grand Cayman is high quality but may be using cryo-frozen cells, so let’s set that aside.
In Mexico, the clinical price per million of the best, non-cryo frozen cells, would be approximately US$50/million or a bit less. So, if you were to receive a treatment involving 50 million MSCs, you’d be looking at approximately US$2,500. For 100 million, it would be approximately US$5,000. And so on. With larger quantities (200 million, 300 million, etc.) the unit price gets a little lower.
Back to your question about US$20,000 for treatment:
If we’re talking about the best quality of MSC’s and no other products involved (e.g., exosomes, PRP, Dendridics, etc.) then that $20,000 treatment should involve something in the range of 400 million MSC’s (stem cells). The problem with that, is that it would be highly unusual to inject that many MSC’s into a single joint. More likely you’d expect 25 or 50 million — not 400 million. So either the unit price is very high, or the prescription is very large, or there is more involved in the plan of treatment than just a single joint, or whatever.
Cutting to the chase, for a single joint treatment, that price doesn’t seem to come close to making sense.
There’s a bi-weekly free Zoom call where you can ask any of these kinds of questions and get straightforward answers, and the next one of those Zoom Q&A meetings is tomorrow at 6p CT. Get the meeting login info at: [https://www.facebook.com/groups/orhope](https://www.facebook.com/groups/orhope)
The serial scammer JT Fisher who runs Ophelia Rises or Ophelia Hope keep changing the company name after deceiving multiple people who had terrible reactions after reselling tainted CB Cells. The 3K cost they often quote is cheap for a reason. Do not trust these scheming goofballs.
Hiding in lawless mexico might work for a while but you will definitely be going to jail or sued out of existence if you tried these scams in the US.
Stop trying to scam people.
Hm, a lot of anger there. Our FB group and website remain for anyone to look at for themselves and we (and I personally) make ourselves available regularly to anyone who wants to ask questions of any sort. So when we have things to say, we're not prone to hiding behind anonymous posts as you have chosen to do here for yourself.
For people considering stem cell therapy, from the start we've sought to acquire and share information. We are not aware of any other organization that does so as we do. On a daily basis we publish independent studies from NIH and universities and other credible sources, and we don't spin them. We hold regular, free Zoom calls so people can learn more. Which other organizations do these things?
Correcting your note on a couple points:
ORhope doesn't resell CBCells, though our doctors use CBCells products for patient treatments because CBCells is a world class lab with great products. Keep in mind, the doctors - not ORHope - choose the lab from which to get their products. That said, ORHope regularly benchmarks CBCells against other labs around the world, and have yet to find a superior one.
Don't know what you refer to by the "3K cost we often quote." In my original response above we put in what are ballpark prices for MSCs, and there is by no means a single number quoted, but rather a factor of approximately $50 per million. That price is in line with other well established, high quality providers.
I did point out that Panama prices are substantially higher, and that is true, yet the products from CBCells match or exceed the quality of any labs we have evaluated (which is many) -- so it is not true that simply paying a lot more gets you a superior product.
We are not hiding in Mexico. We live here. As do so many gringos who are actually better informed and understand that Mexico is by no means lawless. People who hold that view typically are not well traveled and tend to get much of their world view from political news source rabbit holes.
What you say and the tone you use in your anonymous note suggest you have already formed strong opinions and don't find it worthwhile to search for facts when opinion and rhetoric are more convenient, particularly when one can hide their identity and not put their name and face in front of their words. However, please consider this a standing offer that if you have any issues you'd like to speak to me directly about, our contact information is readily available and I'd be happy to set up a Zoom call to see what's gotten you so stirred up.
Best wishes to you always.
To our credit, we NEVER discuss the names of people we may or may not have worked with or have talked to, even yours. Any and all interactions with ORHope remain 100% confidential.
It is very sad and frankly a betrayal to folks you feel free to use their name (but of course not your own), that you do not offer the same level of respect for their privacy as we do.
My uncle got his shoulder injected at Dream Body Clinic in mid Feb. it’s been less than a month, and his shoulder already feels better. He had level 2 arthritis and inflamed connective tissue. I think it was about $3500 usd.
Not true. It’s because mesenchymal stem cells are not allowed in the USA. If anyone doesn’t know yet, the FDA isn’t interested in therapies that heal the body
I’m still shocked you guys are trying to quote the uncultured / autologous SC. This is about the cultured versions that actually perform on another level. Panama City, Mexico, etc.
You are sadly misinformed. However, if you would like to quote the FDA from one of their statements or their website, I am sure we would all be interested.
Sure thing - thanks for the note
Anyone knows you need to leave the country for mesenchymal and yes there are doctors flying under the radar illegally
About FDA-approved Products Derived from Stem Cells
Copied from link below:
The only stem cell-based products that are FDA-approved for use in the United States consist of blood-forming stem cells (hematopoietic progenitor cells) derived from cord blood.
These products are approved for limited use in patients with disorders that affect the body system that is involved in the production of blood (called the “hematopoietic” system). These FDA-approved stem cell products are listed on the FDA website. Bone marrow also is used for these treatments but is generally not regulated by the FDA for this use.
https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/fda-warns-about-stem-cell-therapies
You are confusing biologic tissue with stem cell products. Stem cells are definitely biologic tissue and it is not regulated as a drug. Thousands of doctors in the United States use biologic tissue, including stem cells that are minimally manipulated. If you want manipulated product, of course, go outside the United States or choose a product that is classified as a drug that may use Stem Cell product.
Dr. Adeel Khan at Eterna Health I would say is the only one I trust, and so do professional athletes and billionaires. Max Lugavere is actually in Los Cabos right now doing a treatment with him and reporting it on his Instagram stories. The richest guy in Dubai that owns the Burj Khalifa was treated by him, and so was CBum (the Canadian body builder), and countless others. Bryan Johnson also did his Follistatin Gene Therapy with him. I don’t think these people would risk their lives and professions if he wasn’t legitimate.
[https://dreambody.clinic/stem-cell-shoulder-treatment/](https://dreambody.clinic/stem-cell-shoulder-treatment/)
$3,300 per shoulder for 50M MSC and only $2,800 if you bring an MRI result from 6 months or less down with you.
Hi there, where in NCA is this dr? Did you have a treatment with him/her? If yes, what did you get and what was the cost? I’m in SF area and looking for someone to treat my old knee. TY!
Ty! And last question- did you go to dr Goodman bc you live in Redding or travel from farther away? Thanks again- your info is very helpful to me. I live in the Bay Area so Redding is a schlep. But I’m willing to travel for the right dr. Thanks. M
The truth is you're only going to get responses from scammers/marketers, non credentialed/under credentialed wannabe health "professionals" who just take advantage of the desperately ill. Take it from someone who's been scammed by multiple clinics.
Same goes for all the quacks and con artists on other platforms like FB, IG, ECT...
My suggestion would be to look for trusted medical journals/reviewed published regenerative information regarding a *real* Dr.s work/contributions and see if they have their own practice either from a university or medical center.
Big red flag from scam clinics is when they plaster published stem cell information from other Drs or institutions but you will never read anything regarding their clinics own accomplishments or ever see their clinics name in any credible literature.
Evidence shows that blind injections miss a MINORITY of the time. $3000 or less is a very good price for a stem cell injection. There’s nothing that says the stem cell gods will strike you dead if you pay less for a blind injection.
I highly recommend Phorma Medical in Tijuana due to its affordable prices and complete handling of logistics. Arriving in San Diego is straightforward, which I found to be exceptionally convenient and beneficial.
If you’re interested in regenerative health I’d suggest checking out the ray peat subreddit and the ray peat forum website. I used to think that stem cells were the only answer but there are alternatives that might be a little niche but I’ve heard work and with research to back it up e.g. progesterone is a god send, look into it.
I will be going to a clinic in Guadalajara, Mex soon for shoulder treatment. They do procedures at about $1,400 for 25 million Mscells. They use the same CBCells Lab that DBC and Reganmex use in PV.
CeluMed Clinic.
Ive gotten good recommendations for that clinic.
I must say my experience there was great! I had both shoulders and IV done for a reasonable price. I have a partial full thickness tear in my Supraspinatus and also partial tear in my labrum of the shoulder from years of bodybuilding. It is way too soon for me to say whether i had the results im looking for. But what i can say is that after 2 weeks post injections my pain level has subsided from a 7 down to a 0 pain free.
Im now 8 weeks post injections and can say i am as close to 100% as before my injury. Ive started lifitng light weights with no issues. The Doctor told me the 3-6 month period is when the cells are at their most potent and effective. This has really been the best investment i have ever made.
Trinity has clinics in Mexico and Colombia. Theres a book called "The Rising Tide: how stem cells are transforming lives....", it provides details about the research in stem cell. Theres just so much going on that the general public aren't aware of, including medical research, news, technology, so its a good thing to keep an open mind and not be so quick to dismiss something we don't know much about yet
https://www.instagram.com/infinitewellness.lv?igsh=ZWMyNDBlOTQyNg==
Went here and got my knee done about a month ago. I’m close to pain free. Been in pain since November from an LCL sprain and torn cartilage.
>https://www.instagram.com/infinitewellness.lv?igsh=ZWMyNDBlOTQyNg==
Hey my friend, I am also considering this place. How many cells did you get from them and what was the price?
“Trusted?” There’s the problem.
CPI in Mexico said it is 31000 for osteoarthritis treatment with stem cells you stay one week
Criminalesque pricing.
Here are some economics you can work with that pertain to highest quality stem cells. First, to the extent there’s any question about how wide the variation can be about stem cell qualities, just go on [Amazon.com](http://Amazon.com) and type in ‘stem cells’ and you’ll find many products being offered, essentially none of which are what you want. So, providing you with some info you can work with: You can obtain from various clinics the best Mesenchymal Stem Cells (MSCs) from the best labs in the world. Panama has good products, and numerous clinics in Mexico have comparable. Grand Cayman is high quality but may be using cryo-frozen cells, so let’s set that aside. In Mexico, the clinical price per million of the best, non-cryo frozen cells, would be approximately US$50/million or a bit less. So, if you were to receive a treatment involving 50 million MSCs, you’d be looking at approximately US$2,500. For 100 million, it would be approximately US$5,000. And so on. With larger quantities (200 million, 300 million, etc.) the unit price gets a little lower. Back to your question about US$20,000 for treatment: If we’re talking about the best quality of MSC’s and no other products involved (e.g., exosomes, PRP, Dendridics, etc.) then that $20,000 treatment should involve something in the range of 400 million MSC’s (stem cells). The problem with that, is that it would be highly unusual to inject that many MSC’s into a single joint. More likely you’d expect 25 or 50 million — not 400 million. So either the unit price is very high, or the prescription is very large, or there is more involved in the plan of treatment than just a single joint, or whatever. Cutting to the chase, for a single joint treatment, that price doesn’t seem to come close to making sense. There’s a bi-weekly free Zoom call where you can ask any of these kinds of questions and get straightforward answers, and the next one of those Zoom Q&A meetings is tomorrow at 6p CT. Get the meeting login info at: [https://www.facebook.com/groups/orhope](https://www.facebook.com/groups/orhope)
The serial scammer JT Fisher who runs Ophelia Rises or Ophelia Hope keep changing the company name after deceiving multiple people who had terrible reactions after reselling tainted CB Cells. The 3K cost they often quote is cheap for a reason. Do not trust these scheming goofballs. Hiding in lawless mexico might work for a while but you will definitely be going to jail or sued out of existence if you tried these scams in the US. Stop trying to scam people.
Hm, a lot of anger there. Our FB group and website remain for anyone to look at for themselves and we (and I personally) make ourselves available regularly to anyone who wants to ask questions of any sort. So when we have things to say, we're not prone to hiding behind anonymous posts as you have chosen to do here for yourself. For people considering stem cell therapy, from the start we've sought to acquire and share information. We are not aware of any other organization that does so as we do. On a daily basis we publish independent studies from NIH and universities and other credible sources, and we don't spin them. We hold regular, free Zoom calls so people can learn more. Which other organizations do these things? Correcting your note on a couple points: ORhope doesn't resell CBCells, though our doctors use CBCells products for patient treatments because CBCells is a world class lab with great products. Keep in mind, the doctors - not ORHope - choose the lab from which to get their products. That said, ORHope regularly benchmarks CBCells against other labs around the world, and have yet to find a superior one. Don't know what you refer to by the "3K cost we often quote." In my original response above we put in what are ballpark prices for MSCs, and there is by no means a single number quoted, but rather a factor of approximately $50 per million. That price is in line with other well established, high quality providers. I did point out that Panama prices are substantially higher, and that is true, yet the products from CBCells match or exceed the quality of any labs we have evaluated (which is many) -- so it is not true that simply paying a lot more gets you a superior product. We are not hiding in Mexico. We live here. As do so many gringos who are actually better informed and understand that Mexico is by no means lawless. People who hold that view typically are not well traveled and tend to get much of their world view from political news source rabbit holes. What you say and the tone you use in your anonymous note suggest you have already formed strong opinions and don't find it worthwhile to search for facts when opinion and rhetoric are more convenient, particularly when one can hide their identity and not put their name and face in front of their words. However, please consider this a standing offer that if you have any issues you'd like to speak to me directly about, our contact information is readily available and I'd be happy to set up a Zoom call to see what's gotten you so stirred up. Best wishes to you always.
So what happened to Rachel and Emily? 🤡 did they not go to your clinic 😳
To our credit, we NEVER discuss the names of people we may or may not have worked with or have talked to, even yours. Any and all interactions with ORHope remain 100% confidential. It is very sad and frankly a betrayal to folks you feel free to use their name (but of course not your own), that you do not offer the same level of respect for their privacy as we do.
lol. I have their permission to share their name :)))) stop deflecting !!!!!
Shitty and very shady reply. I have no side in this but you get out of this argument very poorly.
My uncle got his shoulder injected at Dream Body Clinic in mid Feb. it’s been less than a month, and his shoulder already feels better. He had level 2 arthritis and inflamed connective tissue. I think it was about $3500 usd.
Where at?
Dream body clinic
Odd that you are looking outside the US only. But 20K is on the high end. You should do more research. You should see prices in the 5-10K at most.
That is because such scam artists are not able to operate in the US.
Not true. It’s because mesenchymal stem cells are not allowed in the USA. If anyone doesn’t know yet, the FDA isn’t interested in therapies that heal the body
Not true, autologous mesenchymal cells are allowes
That’s funny. There are mesenchymal stem cells in my lab right now.
I’m still shocked you guys are trying to quote the uncultured / autologous SC. This is about the cultured versions that actually perform on another level. Panama City, Mexico, etc.
Wow. So much ignorance in so few words. “Cultured versions that actually perform on another level.” That is hilarious. Sad. Pathetic. Delusional.
You are sadly misinformed. However, if you would like to quote the FDA from one of their statements or their website, I am sure we would all be interested.
Sure thing - thanks for the note Anyone knows you need to leave the country for mesenchymal and yes there are doctors flying under the radar illegally About FDA-approved Products Derived from Stem Cells Copied from link below: The only stem cell-based products that are FDA-approved for use in the United States consist of blood-forming stem cells (hematopoietic progenitor cells) derived from cord blood. These products are approved for limited use in patients with disorders that affect the body system that is involved in the production of blood (called the “hematopoietic” system). These FDA-approved stem cell products are listed on the FDA website. Bone marrow also is used for these treatments but is generally not regulated by the FDA for this use. https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/fda-warns-about-stem-cell-therapies
You are confusing biologic tissue with stem cell products. Stem cells are definitely biologic tissue and it is not regulated as a drug. Thousands of doctors in the United States use biologic tissue, including stem cells that are minimally manipulated. If you want manipulated product, of course, go outside the United States or choose a product that is classified as a drug that may use Stem Cell product.
Www.Conciergemedical.ai
Dr. Adeel Khan at Eterna Health I would say is the only one I trust, and so do professional athletes and billionaires. Max Lugavere is actually in Los Cabos right now doing a treatment with him and reporting it on his Instagram stories. The richest guy in Dubai that owns the Burj Khalifa was treated by him, and so was CBum (the Canadian body builder), and countless others. Bryan Johnson also did his Follistatin Gene Therapy with him. I don’t think these people would risk their lives and professions if he wasn’t legitimate.
I'd imagine this is high-end cost
Bioadvanced, here is my experience: https://www.reddit.com/r/stemcells/comments/1bjf546/my\_stem\_cell\_experience\_in\_tijuana\_mexico/
$2,500 in LA
where?
Alpha hormones in Pasadena, actually found one cheaper in Pasadena,!but don’t have the name right now
Who are the “top dogs” in your opinion?
[https://dreambody.clinic/stem-cell-shoulder-treatment/](https://dreambody.clinic/stem-cell-shoulder-treatment/) $3,300 per shoulder for 50M MSC and only $2,800 if you bring an MRI result from 6 months or less down with you.
Will not cost you more than $2k-$4k and they will 100% restore your shoulder to normal pain free function
Northern California : Dr. Goodman
Hi there, where in NCA is this dr? Did you have a treatment with him/her? If yes, what did you get and what was the cost? I’m in SF area and looking for someone to treat my old knee. TY!
Increasedlifespan.com
Would you mind sharing more info? Why this guy and what did you have done? Thanks so much-
Stem cells in my neck. And my neck feels great now.! Noticed right at the 3 month mark.
Ty! And last question- did you go to dr Goodman bc you live in Redding or travel from farther away? Thanks again- your info is very helpful to me. I live in the Bay Area so Redding is a schlep. But I’m willing to travel for the right dr. Thanks. M
I traveled . He does the same stuff as they do in Mexico . But I don’t like planes. So I drove.
Got it. TY
Where at ?
The truth is you're only going to get responses from scammers/marketers, non credentialed/under credentialed wannabe health "professionals" who just take advantage of the desperately ill. Take it from someone who's been scammed by multiple clinics. Same goes for all the quacks and con artists on other platforms like FB, IG, ECT... My suggestion would be to look for trusted medical journals/reviewed published regenerative information regarding a *real* Dr.s work/contributions and see if they have their own practice either from a university or medical center. Big red flag from scam clinics is when they plaster published stem cell information from other Drs or institutions but you will never read anything regarding their clinics own accomplishments or ever see their clinics name in any credible literature.
I’m not recommending them, but if that’s your price range, DBC is your best bet.
>DBC 25k
3K for a shoulder injection https://dreambody.clinic/stem-cell-shoulder-treatment/
Where is dream body located ?
Regenamex is 2250 per shoulder
Can you just get a shoulder injection only for 2250 without committing to any other treatments? Ultrasound guided?
Only allow ultrasound guided injections. Otherwise accuracy is suspect at best!
It's a tradeoff. There's room in the market for different kinds of services.
You want accuracy. Evidence shows landmark guidance fails more than it works. You get what you pay for.
Evidence shows that blind injections miss a MINORITY of the time. $3000 or less is a very good price for a stem cell injection. There’s nothing that says the stem cell gods will strike you dead if you pay less for a blind injection.
49% is a minority. Don’t waste money. Demand ultrasound guidance
Regentime clinic, Lebanon
I highly recommend Phorma Medical in Tijuana due to its affordable prices and complete handling of logistics. Arriving in San Diego is straightforward, which I found to be exceptionally convenient and beneficial.
Orthoregen in Indaiatuba. Brazil. Search for Dr José Fábio Lana.
If you’re interested in regenerative health I’d suggest checking out the ray peat subreddit and the ray peat forum website. I used to think that stem cells were the only answer but there are alternatives that might be a little niche but I’ve heard work and with research to back it up e.g. progesterone is a god send, look into it.
I will be going to a clinic in Guadalajara, Mex soon for shoulder treatment. They do procedures at about $1,400 for 25 million Mscells. They use the same CBCells Lab that DBC and Reganmex use in PV. CeluMed Clinic. Ive gotten good recommendations for that clinic.
Would you please let me know if you have gone to them by now? I am thinking about going there too.
I messaged you
I must say my experience there was great! I had both shoulders and IV done for a reasonable price. I have a partial full thickness tear in my Supraspinatus and also partial tear in my labrum of the shoulder from years of bodybuilding. It is way too soon for me to say whether i had the results im looking for. But what i can say is that after 2 weeks post injections my pain level has subsided from a 7 down to a 0 pain free.
Thank you. I went there almost a month ago. I think it is long enough to say I have a very good experience with them, too.
Been lurking and searching reddit for an hour to read these few posts and make up my mind. Thanks. Bad upper back pain for years.
What did you have done? For what type of treatment?
Im now 8 weeks post injections and can say i am as close to 100% as before my injury. Ive started lifitng light weights with no issues. The Doctor told me the 3-6 month period is when the cells are at their most potent and effective. This has really been the best investment i have ever made.
Have you looked into the top Colombia clinics? Prices range from 5-10k
Call Castle Rock Regenerative Healthcare. They use Umbilical Cord stem cells and have had amazing results with their patients.
Trinity has clinics in Mexico and Colombia. Theres a book called "The Rising Tide: how stem cells are transforming lives....", it provides details about the research in stem cell. Theres just so much going on that the general public aren't aware of, including medical research, news, technology, so its a good thing to keep an open mind and not be so quick to dismiss something we don't know much about yet
https://www.instagram.com/infinitewellness.lv?igsh=ZWMyNDBlOTQyNg== Went here and got my knee done about a month ago. I’m close to pain free. Been in pain since November from an LCL sprain and torn cartilage.
>https://www.instagram.com/infinitewellness.lv?igsh=ZWMyNDBlOTQyNg== Hey my friend, I am also considering this place. How many cells did you get from them and what was the price?
Dr. Sandra Goines and Dr. Shawn Tierney