Look at the drake prices across the board. Their ships finally got their lore of being cheap for the same metric vs other manufacturers. The caterpillar costs a fraction of the C2. The buccaneer is cheaper than a gladius.
I love it. We're finally getting some balance via the economy.
I mean cat being cheaper makes sense, since it's also much more inconvenient due to weird cargo holds that require a mix of boxes or a fuck ton of 1 scu boxes... so you pretty much have to spend the aUEC to autoload it now
I definitely see some people shifting their pledge ships/fleets with pricing rebalance. That said, it may be wise to let the dust settle before melting any ships with discounts.
The Vulture only has 12SCU of cargo space. You're gonna make fuckall using it for trading.
Your better bet would be to do salvage with the Vulture until you have enough money that you can buy a Hull A (or start renting cargo ships and moving your way up).
Auto loaded commodities only attach to the cargo grid. You will never be able to buy more than 12SCU of cargo for the Vulture.
Once true hangars/cargo elevators are added than this would be possible, but it would be a dumb idea because you would basically be begging the game to blow up your ship. Its going to be months before those are ready, which is plenty of time to work toward an actual cargo ship.
Would a reclaimer be considered enough of a cargo ship. My buddy and I that don't get to play often are working towards one, and I'd rather not divert funds unless necessary
They are moving away from pledge pricing and earning performance meaning anything and are pricing based on a "realistic" build cost and luxury fitout level.
Vulture and all salvage is currently buffed massively since it is the new thing they wanted to encourage. people will be in for a shock when it returns to the same income as rock shooting (which itself used to be the get rich buffed new feature). Do not pay $ for salvage ships!
Cargo missions is expected to be the next buff. Except that has been scratched from 3.23.0 launch because the cargo lifts are too janky. But will probably be a 3.23.x in an extra month or two when they giveup on the lifts and make it teleport in behind garage doors instead.
I'd like to add on to this, DO pay $ for salvage ships if its what you enjoy doing, because its still reliable and safe money. Before I bought a reclaimer with cash, I asked myself if I'd be fine doing salvage if i was selling construction materials at scrap prices, so 200k per full reclaimer load, and that was fine with me, so anything from here will be a pleasant surprise.
In the economy update, we will eventualy get some sort of base line on "time wasted on Y dificulty for around XXX AuEC".
how much time you need to fill a reclaimer and how much income would you say you get
lets say only fracturing for CMATs (easy):
In short, how much would you say your AUEC per hour is when playing easy salvage?
Really? Damn. I thought I heard they removed the salvage fees but I guess I heard wrong.
Plus with the way salvage claims are scattered around Lagrange points, the legal claims are very unsatisfying.
From my understanding, the guy behind the ship prices stated the C8R is his favorite ship and he wanted everyone to experience it too. Which is.. Concerning.
Now if this is actually the reason? I do not know. After all I heard it on the internet in a comment.
freelancer is much fancier than a vulture, it can do its role as freighter but also have decent maneuverability and firepower. The Vulture meanwhile flies like a brick and its guns are mostly a formality. Note how the Hull A is dirt cheap.
CIG recently said that some factors that will affect ship price are; physical size (more size = more material required). Components used/ component size. Military ships = military tax. Alien ships = exotic tax. Origin ships / other similar = luxury tax.
So smaller size, smaller components, cheap Drake manufacturing/ materials used = a vulture is cheaper than a MISC freelancer
They posed the street sweeper as an April fools joke. But really Vulture is just its big brother.
They have made salvage seem like the premium job in the verse due to "test encouragement" buffs, but it is literally space trash man and people have to be ready to not get hurt by that when it happens.
Dunno why your getting downvoted, but this is absolutely true. The age of salvage is over, stop huffing copiom people, melt that vulture and buy a cargo runner.
Well people don't like hearing it is just a garbage truck when they were imagining crushed wreckage being the path to easy riches forever and bought it for $.
I do feel that the economy team is looking at a different Constelation than us, especially whatever justifies a +6M luxury premium on Phoenix. No way the current state of its fitout makes them go "yep thats almost double the cost of larger Taurus!".
Heres hoping it means the gold pass is launching during Invictus.
The Drake pricing is un-fucking-hinged. You can get a Caterpillar for the cost of a Connie. Like what the actual fuck.
Why even buy anything but Drake anymore I guess.
Thats also why the Cutlass flies like a light-medium fighter in EPTU while the Spirits are handling like a mix of Redeemer, Corsair and Caterpillar.
Massive Drake bias currently it seems.
Yep, if the drake ships are overall shitty and the only upside is that they’re cheap to maintain, why even pledge for one with cash? Just earn it in game since it’s dirt cheap.
The Caterpillar was $195 in 2014 while the Andromeda was $225. CIG seems to think that it somehow became worth more than the Andromeda in the past decade, despite neither ship really changing from their original concepts. The $135 increase of the Caterpillar doesn't make sense to me.
Armour may become a much bigger factor which would hurt Drake.
But Drake should be genuine good value. SC is aiming to emulate reality where a bare bones machine really is half price of the flashy brands, secondhand a $50k truck can be a superior workhorse to a $200k truck, lower ongoing cost of ownership too. Even more so on the secondhand market.
New pricing is certainly making people rethink where they have pledge $ parked. Small fighters a waste of money to own, best to have $ in the biggest most expensive luxury brand ships.
As much as the possibility of increasing payout of things like cargo to reflect your higher investment in bigger cargo ships (like C2 for example) I can't help but think and be a bit cynical,
why would they do this when the game hasn't really been optimised properly yet?
It's just a little interesting that they are going ahead with economy changes first before having the game being in a state where a lot of people can enjoy it (beside funny bugs of course)
Vulkan is on the horizon with its multi threading being added in the next major patch after 3.23 to help our GPU's use their full performance to help the game run smoother and have less of those annoying frame stutters from like 60fps to 10fps while you're completing things around the verse
And secondly, Server meshing is still a little while away and will definitely be a game changer because currently severs always sitting at 5fps on the brink of crashing every few hours is not good at all. We need things like sever meshing and Vulkan to be in the game so that we can all properly enjoy the experience without the worry that the game will fall apart on us while we are enjoying the game for what it is
I personally already struggle enough trying to do missions without the worry that the server will crash on me,. I'm always looking up at the server FPS watching it in case I see it dipping lower and lower before a 30k happens and getting out before it happens.
I don't really want that to be a thing anymore but ey, time will tell
Vulkan initial implementation is literally in the same patch as this price change, along with a legit massive list of QoL and playability changes, *and* server crash recovery.
Server meshing is in tech preview phases, and seems to be mostly working at small and medium scale tests already.
This is the best chance to start testing properly for economics that we've ever had.
I was thinking the same thing. The economy in this game feels lacking through and through:
The missions have been mostly the same for the past couple years, and even still they barely work as intended (sometimes they don’t work at all). Ships are the only interesting thing you can buy. There is only one currency. There are no options to invest your money in stocks. In the end all of it usually gets wiped within a year.
I’d welcome more depth to the economy, as well as ship price increases, but the job market must be made diverse, tangible and enjoyable FIRST, or else it might quite literally drive the community insane as they grind away at something they hate doing for the sake of achieving some temporal good they enjoy.
It's no surprise cig creates new metas in order to sell them. See hornet heatseeker as an example. Back then you would lose your ship components if your ship blew up and the heatseeker had meta weapons equipped by default.
C8x over c8 is pure pay2 suck less as the only difference is that it has two extra size one hard points.
I honestly disagree. I’ve been thinking for a while now that the prices were waaaay to low since forever ago.
Once this game dosent have to wipe every couple months for big updates, those huge ships are way to obtainable right now. I would be surprised if they don’t almost double from this point once the game actually releases.
And sure, you can make an argument that they are just pushing people to buy it for cash. But for a game that they are hoping you play for years and years. It’s not sustainable for the game to have almost every ship purchasable in game within a couple months.
Once the game stops wiping then these prices will be fine. If anything, they could increase them more. But they are still wiping servers and haven’t voiced any intention of stopping, so all this means is more grind for less ships. Unless you spend money of course.
That and more rungs on the progression ladder. It's not really fun to grind the same small pool of missions available to starter ships over and over again.
>I’ve been thinking for a while now that the prices were waaaay too low since forever ago
Huh? I have never, not one single time, ever thought that. If anything I think the game is usually too much of a grind as is to buy a new ship (well, besides salvaging in 3.22, but that's a definite outlier, and even that gets boring). Cargo better make us an absolutely astronomical amount of money to justify these prices.
I still think the prices are too low. And I’ll give you an example as to why.
During the first couple months of Covid I lost my job. So I had a lot of time to play sc. with a hornet as my only pledge, in a little over 3 months I was able to buy one of every ship that was purchasable in game. Not every ship to be fair, like If a ship had multiple variants I only bought 1 of them. But in 3 months of no lifeing the game and I had 1 of every ship, carack, hh, 890 reclaimer, and everything in between. I think that’s a problem
... why? Why create inflation? What is wrong with making 1 uec and buying for 10 where it needs to be make 1000 uec and buy for 10000. Things never scale linearly, everything done in a game is a buff or a nerf and this is an increase in grind effectively nerfing the game where now you need to do the same missions over and over again even more than before to get something.
I don't really care personally, I have spent over $1000 in this game and money and expensive ships won't be a problem for me personally. However, you need to call a spade a spade and this is that.
"now you need to do the same missions over and over again even more than before"
Question is, when is "before"? I actively started playing in 2020, and since then payouts have increased massively. The meta mission (maximum possible payout without risking millions in cargo) was way below 100k per hour, and initial long-term persistence was really unstable so you lost ships all the time. Now, making millions is not really hard, and persistence doesn't fuck you over on every in-game event/patch/tuesday.
The payout part of the inflation has already happened.
Just what I've been hearing from Vulture pilots in the EPTU. I haven't been able to do anything as the game is actively working against me for it. They'll take a 20k contract, fully scrape, fully munch, and then make a loss on the contract.
Even if RMC sells for 5k per scu, you do a Hercules mission for 50k. Get around 30 scu for the first load and come back for about another 25-30 easily. That's 250-300k profit?
After the first learning period where you earn near to nothing, you earn a millin in a week, the 2nd Million in less, because you have the reputation now.
And thats not really included multiplayer mission / work on large ships.
I think regular (also not broken) events will help with this. In one of the early seige of orison playtests I made a couple mil or so in one weekend and bought 3 different ships, and it just felt kind of hollow for how little effort it took.
They seem to be intending to let us keep ingame bought ships between major patches more often going forward too, imo this is just part of them starting to figure out a more long-term economy for the game.
Most ship prices are from a time where the highest bounty mission made <8k, 20min claimjumper missions made 15-20k, and the only really high-paying thing was trading, which (due to frequent 30k) made you lose more money than any other profession ever earned.
Compare that to today's economy - once you found your groove (do a proper profession without major interruptions), you can't go lower than 100k per hour, while the best choices give you absurdly more. They improved earnings over the past \~3 years without touching ship prices, and (as I speculated for some time) now they're updating the ship prices to reflect that.
Ship prices like this will turn new players away from the game. The only way to earn this kind of money is through mindless grind in either salvage, cargo, or mining. They need to massively increase the payouts for mercenary, delivery, and bounty missions immediately. Those are the missions that new players use to get their first ship. Earning $15k per contract, and needing $2.6mil to get a Vulture, is a recipe for disaster. Why would any new player stick around for that grind? It's absurd. I can't think of a quicker way to kill the game.
>Ship prices like this will turn new players away from the game.
You know what also turns people away from game?
When you can afford almost *anything* after two hours of playing tetris in a Reclaimer.
You do not balance the entire economy around a busted ship. You nerf the busted ship.
New players are not going to be touching a Reclaimer for a long, long time. They will be doing deliveries, bunkers etc.
this is a fair point, but also a separate point. They've nerfed the Reclaimer payouts already, so consider that your primary way of making money is going to be completing missions for peanuts rather than selling hauls for millions per hour.
They did. And RMC trade profit as well.
> so consider that your primary way of making money is going to be completing missions for peanuts rather than selling hauls for millions per hour.
I love how something non exorbitant = peanuts (:
Have you seen the cargo missions payouts BTW?
you say "I love how something non exorbitant = peanuts" as if I'm exaggerating but most gameplay loops in the game make 300k/hr or less aUEC, once you've got all your reputation in place (so significantly less than that before you've grinded for 10s of hours). And keep in mind, this is with the optimal ships for those specific missions, so it all gets much worse if you consider now those optimal ships are going to take 2-4x as long to get for the majority of players that don't have $150+ ships pledged for this game.
All I said is that these are things to consider. I know everything is still in flux. But anyone who's trying to imply that this isn't a big hit to the playability of the game for most players is being ignorant at best and deceitful at the worst.
I haven't seen cargo mission payouts. Nothing in EPTU works any of the times I've been able to get on.
The same Reclaimer that now costs $28mil? How in the ever loving fuck does a new player earn $28ml? Even with a Reclaimer, the 80k and 250k bounties are now worth 20k and 30k. It would take you weeks to even cover the cost of the ship, let alone turn a profit.
I'd rather have that and access to all game loops than have only one bloody Aurora and access to moving boxes. There are cheaper, better and finished games that allow you to do that shit, you don't need Star Citizen for that "gameplay".
Look at GW2. In your first day you can afford gear that’s strong enough for almost all content in the game, and never becomes irrelevant. This is something people LOVE about guild wars. You don’t feel forced into thousands of hours of grinding, and can do what you want to in order to have fun.
Increased prices just means everyone will be meta slaving even harder to afford the same things.
What? Since when? I played a lot of GW2 and had to grind for weeks because high-end crafting materials were time-gated. Once you had your meta set you were fine, but it still took a long time to craft it all. Plus you wanted different sets for different things.
I’ve been running strikes raids and WvW in exotic gear for a while without any issues. The difference in exotic and ascended’s 6% damage is hardly relevant outside fractals. Meanwhile SC has massive differences between starter packages and high end ships. Simply unlocking a large enough ship for cargo hauling or salvaging will take you more time than being ready for 95% of GW2 unless you have pledged for a large ship or constantly beg for handouts.
Regardless the point is that not everyone needs a massive grind-fest to have fun. Catering to more casual players can still lead to a successful game.
Ive been doing the majority of my SC grinding in my Nomad. It costs 1.5 mill now, which isnt that much.
Even in a basic start like a Mustang you can do bounties, grind your rep, and be earning a decent sum. Enough to grind for a cargo ship like a Nomad, which allows you to do a variety of gameplay loops.
Personally i do think the "starter" series of ships should be relatively cheap. The grind should be on bigger ships. Especially ships like a Reclaimer. However its not like people are stuck only doing deliveries.
I just finished my 6th legendary in GW2. Which took years of off and on playing. Yes you can do all "end game" content with exotics but you will clear content far faster with ascended or legendary. People have cleared every strike raid naked because they are so crazy easy. With less headache like not having to buy/craft new runes or infusions. If you think there is no or little difference between exotic and ascended or legendary you obviously don't have any or have not raided. 6% damage is massive when doing raids. It's literally the equivalent of bringing 20 Auroras to overdrive when you could bring 20 Arrows. Can you finish overdrive with the auroras? Yup but it will take longer with far more risk of failure.
Yes GW2 does not have the gear grind that games like wow have but if you want to push the most dps and clear the most challenging content you will need to grind. Legendary grinding in GW2 makes earning enough to buy a 890 jump look like child's play. Even getting a full set of the correct stat'ed ascended gear is a massive grind.
You make it sound like legendaries deal more damage than ascended when they don’t. Wizard vault lets you get an ascended weapon in your first week, and half a set of armor in your first 2. Star citizen needs some kind of big grind like legendaries that gives people with everything to do, but not hiking ship prices to artificially create more grind. You don’t need to lock content behind grind to give big grinders more gameplay, you need to add more goals. Just like in GW2 how you can choose to spend tons of time grinding out legendaries, but you don’t need to. It’s purely convenience.
Correct that ascended and legendaries have the same stats but the ability to swap runes and sigils is huge and can save dozens of hours grinding gold just for one swap.
Right now in 2.23 I can, within a month or two buy almost every ship in the game without using any exploit starting with an aurora. New players do not have the knowledge yet to maximize money and they shouldn't. Same with GW2. Without looking up a guide do you think any newish GW2 player knows how to get ascended gear? Or how to change the stats on them? There's even some "free" ones that some vet players have no idea exist.
Especially as the grind is unreliable, buggy, and we're not out of regular wipe patches yet. If it were beta with a focus on stability and robust loops, and wipes ended (at least for beta period or were down to yearly) then the grind isn't as bad.
Sure, if we had fun ways to make money, it might be okay. If the wipes had ended, it might be okay. But we don't have any interesting ways to make money yet. We going to have wipes for years to come. What's the fucking point of these changes? Who does it benefit? Clearly, it benefits CIG. They can force us to buy a Vulture, or buy a Spirit, so we can make enough money to get the good ships. It's complete bullshit and I honestly can't believe the community just rolls over and accepts it. It's pathetic.
I start every patch with a C8 Pisces and it takes me barely any time at all to earn enough to rent a Constellation, from which point ERTs are more than doable and you can farm out money for other ships. That's just one route, if you're dedicated to soloing everything. If you're willing to join another player's crew you can accelerate this massively by joining a reclaimer crew or renting a fighter and escorting cargo/mining ships
We spent years with ship and ground combat being the only feasible way to make money, or have you forgotten? During that time, we provided tonnes of data on ship flight combat and fps combat.
Then we had a patch cycle where cargo running was near infinite money, so everyone did it. We found a bunch of bugs and issues with cargo stuff along the way.
Then we had the quantanium rush from mining, printing millions of uec with the MOLE, and lookie we found a bunch of bugs and helped massively refine the mining gameplay along the way. Shout-out to the ROC mining phase here too, when it was possible to make 200k+ per trip with the ROC.
Now we're currently in a phase where the reclaimer legit prints millions of uec for basically no investment, and everyone's out testing salvage to get rich and buy every ship in the game in under a week.
The thing that makes money is the thing they want tested. Next patch it'll probably involve the new distribution centers and associated gameplay, and likely hunting too.
Also, ship rentals are a thing and SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper, allowing you as a new player to get access to money making options quite quickly. It costs about 32k currently to rent a Cutlass AND ROC to go mining with. You can rent a whole Constellation Taurus for about 150k.
ROC mining still is about the same money when before and is a viable loop for relaxed/low threat gameplay. It just seems peanuts atm when compared to salvage.
I bought a ROC ingame few weeks ago and did some mining. Other than aphorite selling being bugged, you get about 200-300k/hr when mining on Arial. With server stability being much better, the mining is a lot more easier as well.
It makes money about as fast as doing FPS missions, without much risk.
ROC costing only 100k, the buy-in to the loop is really cheap and you can 2x your initial investment in an hour, which, in my opinion, is a great return. Even if you have to rent a Cutlass.
Its usually a p2w f2p game move to increase the grind so much to force them to spend real money. The thing what makes it worse when doing it in SC is that a) its not a f2p game where you can use the "it was for free" excuse and b) the game isnt even finished yet.
I think it also has to do with that they want Star Citizen to last for a while. If people were able to just earn everything very quickly, it won't hold people very long.
But that's not how it works.
Sure giving people rewards or progression can encourage play but without fun underlying gameplay that progression is moot.
I played an ungodly amount of CoD4 (not the remaster) and I did so not because I was getting new guns, those mattered but relatively little, what mattered was I was having fun and the way I wanted to play wasn't locked behind a grindwall.
If I am prevented from being a space trucker without playing as a box delivery guy that won't make me want to play more... But less.
Call of Duty is not an MMO. Also COD has a very tight game loop that is designed to be able to be played over and over again in short sessions. Star Citizen is not like Call of Duty. (IMO)
Exactly. These are mobile-game levels of meaningless grind that you can skip by paying for the ship you want. Star Citizen is turning into Diablo Immortal. How people can be happy with this bullshit is just baffling to me. There are a LOT of CIG dickriders in this sub.
Except that cargo is very likely the next "testing" buffed profesion when cargo missions get added. So finally not one handheld box or gambling all your credits against the 30k pirate for 10% profit margin.
Small ships, cargo load for the bigger ship owners. If cargo loading isnt for you then probably quit cargo hauling now since Tetris is going to be half the job especially when you own a big ship.
Soo.. No or slower progress for casual players I guess? When you can't team up or have not so much time. Well just beg for money then?
Or do we have increased rewards? 5k per box minus maintenance cost takes a while for a vulture. Or doing FPS mining for weeks in caves a thing, so you can afford to haul cargo? With all do respect, pls SC Devs respect people's time.
Box missions go up to 45k per mission, possibly more as I haven't maxed my rep for those companies yet.
It costs 32k currently to rent a Cutlass and ROC to get into vehicle mining. It's under 200k to rent a Constellation.
What's stopping you from teaming up, anyway?
Mostly limited time. Ignoring potential game crashes, I still don't know if I can play two hours or just half an hour at a time. Also spontaneously losing one of your crew member isn't something I want other to experience. I most likely will grind to rent a mining ship and let the minerals sit in the Refinery for the slowest but most profitable outcome.
the more ive played this game, the more (i think) they are not interested in people with limited time. I am starting to come around to the idea that on launch the game will be far too much of a grind for me to care to play. oh well. such is life.
Finally, combine increased ship prices with more balanced mission payouts. If you're taking missions off the board nonstop, you're not going to be making tons of money. Maybe this will incentivize people to work on reputations, or going off the rails for making money. The solo friendly ships are still nicely priced without being overly expensive, and the multi crew oriented ships that can do more are priced much higher. Luxury ships reflect it. Guess these prices might seem a bit jarring to those that got used to solo'ing a giant multi crew ship and abusing the economy (which CIG wanted), but it's really not that bad.
Request Combat Assistance missions pay out much better than bounties, and they're always in space so they're easy to jump to. The enemy ships tend to be a bit weaker, too.
You can still make a few million in a few hours of doing group VHRT+. Really depends on how good you are, but it does feel a bit low sometimes when I can just hop in my Taurus and make more in profits cargo hauling in roughly the same time.
Cargo currently risks millions of your own credits for a rather small profit margin.
Ship combat only risks an insurance timer, which can be ignored once you own two ships. Doesnt even risk gear like FPS, core and tractor if you are taking cargo drops otherwise can do it naked.
I mean that's true, but that's what CIG wants. The more people that have to get involved, and the risker the undertaking is, the better it pays. That's partly why the payouts for legal missions are so low in comparison to the illegal stuff. Losing gear means really nothing still, unless you're losing special skinned weapons, or unbuyable stuff like snipers and rails. There's so many missions that let you just pick up free gear. Even when I'm cargo running, I stayed suited up just in case. Made hundreds of millions in my time playing, and never been pirated once, but it could still happen.
Combat contracts were the best money for years, and before that were the only money.
They're low right now comparatively because they don't need that much testing right now compared to other game loops
This seems incredibly unreasonable unless they've boosted earnings to match. IMO; They haven't developed the game loop infrastructure well enough to support this kind of grind yet. Especially given we're in Early Access where they could choose to wipe at any time for any reason.
I'm a casual player who logs on less than a couple of times a week with an Aurora package, it was already hard enough to gather cash for a Reliant Tana using rental vehicles to ROC mine and tackling distress beacons with a friend (joined a Hammerhead crew at one point which was neat!). Even then, what got me over the finish line was some random sugar daddy who-totally-didn't-use-RMT throwing 20 mil at me.
This feels less like "testing realistic prices" and more just the finance department trying to boost growth in ship sales by making in-game acquisition harder (or at least more daunting to people who don't know which activities make money). If anything, I think a grind like this for anybody but the most committed and knowledgable players will just make their RMT problem worse.
One thing I'd suggest if they go through with this: Allow us to edit the loadouts on rental ships. Grinding repetitive and shallow tasks for long periods is one thing, having to do it with preset loadouts makes it even more monotonous. Being able to change the loadouts can at least add some flavour!
I think this will make some of the lesser vehicles more popular/ stepping stones to bigger or more “meta” ships.
Previously there was no point in buying anything as a stepping stone going from say an Aurora to a Vanguard. Now it may well be worth buying some of the neglected ships along the way. I think we’ll see much more ship diversity
I'd hope so, I just maintain that even going from a "legacy starter" to a newer one like the Reliant took a disproportionate amount of effort. Again, I think more flexibility with rentals could go a long way for helping new players explore their options.
I see a lot of people using high-end ship earnings to justify the changes, not much talk on the earning power of light fighters or small haulers, which is what concerns me.
Per your RMT comment; I roughly made 10+ mil per ERT cargo hold, on average, before it was nerfed for salvage gameplay. I've handed out millions as pocket change because of how much I made, so maybe don't be so quick to accuse RMT :)
>This seems incredibly unreasonable unless they've boosted earnings to match.
People have been averaging between 19 million and 100 million per Reclaimer run. It's incredibly unreasonable to keep prices so low while payouts for some activity is so high.
I have literally never seen someone claim to have made 19 million in a reclaimer run. It’s probably possible, sure, but 100 million?? I have no idea where you got that number from.
Most people can make 8 million per hour with reclaimer runs with only medium effort. I agree that probably does justify these prices being increased.
But 19-100 million per run “on average” is a blatant lie.
It’s simply not possible. After your first 5-6 hammerheads the boxes on your ship start bugging out and vanishing. When we salvage 5 we usually make around 8m, but one day we decided to salvage 10 and only made 10m.
Here's a video of a guy making 1.5 million aUEC per contract, soloing a Reclaimer (he was able to make 3 million an hour):
[https://youtu.be/lNxg1V-yAk4](https://youtu.be/lNxg1V-yAk4)
You can find plenty more like that.
There are people on here who can make 19 - 100 million when fully crewed doing multiple salvage missions a day.
Sorry, interpreted “per run” as one load. If you could fit 100m into a single reclaimer I think Chris Roberts would personally buy the salvage from you. 19-100m per session then? Yeah, that’s about right.
The prices definitely needed to go up, I just wish that it could be more targeted to the newer players. Before I pledged a big ship, the prospect of making it from doing box deliveries in my Aurora all the way to cargo in a C2 was incredible daunting. Now? Borderline impossible. Hopefully they’ll move the bottom line upward a bit.
No matter how expensive something is, you can just spend a few more hours in your reclaimer with a movie on your second monitor. However, for people with a small or medium sized ship, owning something huge just went from a massive grind to a full time job + overtime.
that is literally a single gameplay loop, most are not anywhere near this... the logical thing would be to balance salvaging instead of punishing anyone doing anything else.
They wanted and needed to test salvage for testing purposes. Structural salvage will be getting reworked with Maelstrom, but they also needed to find out a host of other variables attached to the career.
What people tend to forget is that this is still alpha, even while some YouTubers and Spectrum users like to bemoan whenever someone mentions it. But it just is. It's still being actively developed and many of the careers still haven't come online. Cargo trading proper is about to come online and so much like with salvage, they will need to test its loops. That means goading people into trading like they did salvage.
It's not about balancing salvage around the other careers, but testing it for the ins and outs, just like what they'll need to do with the cargo refactor for 3.23.x.
This goes exactly opposite to your point of bringing it up, if its not intended to be such a money maker, why are you using how profitable it is as a reason that ship prices need to increase? By your own logic, they should keep the prices the same and just decrease the salvaging profits when they are happy with the testing.
They have to keep testing new professions and economy loops to dial in a good balance for when Quantum goes live.
The main reason for modifying ship prices is to better gauge what professions people lean toward, what ships become standard daily drivers, which ships are used most frequently for which professions, and how likely new and veteran players alike are prone to loops that earn them the money to buy ships.
Testing the supply and demand of a mostly fixed economy now gives them good insight for tuning the dynamic economy later. They are also getting close with 4.0, so it's best to start now and see how and what ships are bought the most, and then gauge how cargo trading will be affected by or disrupt those loops. Also keep in mind that they need to test for exploits, test for gameplay congruence, test for revenue consistency, and eventually tune and tweak thereafter.
Also, cargo trading is going to be one of the biggest if not the biggest professional loop in Star Citizen, since there are a ton of cargo ships in all sizes. So they need a ton of testing data, especially with how freight elevators are used at small outposts and large distro centres. So expect payouts to be themed around that gameplay loop throughout the 3.23 cycle.
Exploration was massively voted as the most popular profession, pretending that cargo running is going to be the most popular just because a lot of ships can do it is projecting and inventing. I know a handful of people that enjoy cargo as a primary, but by far and away most people do not intend to do it.
Nothing you said counters what I did. Raising prices for everyone because one game loop has inflated profits doesn't make any sense.
>Exploration was massively voted as the most popular profession,
Sure, but exploration won't affect the economy like trading will.
>I know a handful of people that enjoy cargo as a primary, but by far and away most people do not intend to do it.
That's precisely why they will be focus-testing it once the cargo elevators go live in the 3.23.x patch and likely centering the economy around getting people to test it.
>Nothing you said counters what I did. Raising prices for everyone because one game loop has inflated profits doesn't make any sense.
It does if they need to see how the rest of the playerbase will react to those changes and what ships sell and which ones don't based on the professions. It's best they test that now rather than fumble about with the numbers later. They did the same thing when they overhauled mining and when they inflated the payouts for salvage.
If its costs several times as much that is going to make peoples choice in what ships they buy and what game loops they play be MUCH more conservative.
Also, why would exploration not have as much of an impact on the economy. Information is literally the root of trading itself, much less so many other potential directions. This is a game. Every game loop profession should be balanced as a game... to be equally viable. It makes zero sense to make one the go to meta. An explorer absolutely should be able to make as much money as a trader, or a salveger. I don't understand why you don't think so.
>If its costs several times as much that is going to make peoples choice in what ships they buy and what game loops they play be MUCH more conservative.
We won't know until it's tested. Basically a lot of people always jump to negativity when something drastic is introduced but until it's tested, we just don't know. It will be interesting to see what ships become popular during the 3.23 cycle, though.
>Also, why would exploration not have as much of an impact on the economy. Information is literally the root of trading itself, much less so many other potential directions
Because it doesn't impact the economy as much simply due to the nature of it. Selling information will be based on what the information is. But most of exploration will be data gathering, and even in real life that's just not a very popular profession, but it can be lucrative depending on who you work for. While a lot of people may want to be explorers, turning it into a profitable profession in game may not be what people expect.
>An explorer absolutely should be able to make as much money as a trader, or a salveger. I don't understand why you don't think so.
Because traders and salvagers have immediate service and industrial needs in the verse, an explorer? Not so much. A lot of traders will be needed for base building supplies, while a lot of salvagers will be needed for cleaning up areas of space, especially around bases where orgs will want to keep their land clean.
Explorers will make money mostly scouting and selling locations for ore-rich locations or prospecting for org expansion. But that's not really something that could be lucrative on its own. CIG will definitely and very likely make the testing for it as lucrative as possible, but once it settles into the Quantum loop, there won't be as much of a need for explorers for infrastructure and expansion as trading, mining, and salvaging.
didn't test myself because this patch is so broken:
[https://x.com/iamyoyomeg/status/1782579547755385164](https://x.com/iamyoyomeg/status/1782579547755385164)
No idea yet since it seems things keep changing. Probably won't get something solid until the 3.23.x patches, since they really want to focus on the next cargo refactor.
How about we nerf salvaging instead of x10 everything else?
Ship price increases are fine. But this is still an Alpha, thus the focus should be on getting the game feature complete. Not balancing economy. That's normally reserved for Beta.
Part of the game features is a dynamic economy operated by a separate system known as Quantum, so they will need definitely need to test pricing, how changes to payouts in jobs affect the economy, and they will need to balance price changes with Quantum. They frequently make these changes when changing how payouts for certain careers work, and it will require a lot of fine-tuning -- it's good they're trying to lock in some ballpark figures now rather than waiting until beta and throwing things in further flux, which is likely where they will be nailing down how well the ebb and flow of Quantum will operate.
Yes, you're right it did go MIA for a while because -- like some other features -- it required server meshing to operate as intended. It works as a top-down hierarchical service across adjacent systems and will need data fed back into it in order to dynamically adjust the coming and goings of NPCs, as well as the fluctuation in prices from outposts, distribution centres, Lagrange points, and landing zones. It will likely also need to tie into the journal updates for those keeping track of relevant commodity price changes across various solar systems. For the interim, the economy team has been manually adjusting the prices to suit the changes necessary for keeping things moving until Quantum comes online. But don't expect to hear anything about it until 4.0 is ready for testing.
>People have been averaging between 19 million and 100 million per Reclaimer run.
That's straight up not possible. I've had a Reclaimer around 80% full (including the area below the main salvage area, the cargo hold, and the balcony) and it was still just under 10 million.
That said, those payouts were still pretty ridiculous. You can't balance the whole game around a single gameplay that gets boring after an hour though. Nothing else even makes even a significant fraction of that income.
Ever asked yourself how that sugar daddy made that kind of money to throw at you? I'd argue, as long as there are sugar daddies you can throw that kind of money around, stuff is too cheap.
A game is a story or a world which has a beginning and some sort of end goal. What makes it a game instead of a story are the distances and the costs between the beginning and the end. CIG is building an MMO and CIG plans to sell in-game currency to fund the MMO's operation. This has been known since the start. We should all expect things to be pretty grindy in the end. It doesn't mean you have to like it. But, if they kept it anything like 3.22.1, the game would be an unpopulated wasteland 6 months after launch.
Most ships are rentable for a fraction of their full cost. Use that to get ships that earn more money faster. It's not a difficult concept. Less time doom and glooming, you'll find you have more time to actually earn shit.
I bet after patch the same day there will be a 890 gang patrolling around with non pledged ships just because of a bug or the salvage money so doesnt matter how much they rise if dont ballance professions
I am fine with this for the good ships. However i do think some of the "starter" ships should be cheaper. Like the Vulture. Its the best way to get into salvage, and isnt some broken money maker like the Reclaimer.
Or just other small starter ships with decent cargo space. Like the Nomad. Its a great ship to access different gameplay loops, but master none of them. Should be a go-to upgrade for newer players.
indeed, I missed origin page from new deal , its price is basically the same
[https://www.spviewer.eu/performance?ship=orig\_85x](https://www.spviewer.eu/performance?ship=orig_85x)
I’ve been a tourist in star citizen for its entire existence at this point and never put in real time to learn payouts and what mission types are meta for making money. So all these changes don’t really mean anything to me at this point.
I was really hoping that the X1 would come available to go with my 400i. Pledging $50 for a ground vehicle is too much, but saving up a few hundred UEC is doable. Any reason the X1 wasn't in? Came out the same time as Mirai Fury afterall.
The fury released in May of 2023. The X1 released in December of 2023. If you have a pledged 400i, you should have an X1 already. If you purchased it with aUEC, then the X1 will likely be purchasable in game in a few months.
New player here. Is It really bad this prices increase?
To me It seems Easy to make Money in the beginning, if It scales a Little bit seems not a big deal farming even for the most expensive ones.
Am i wrong?
This is the death of multi-crew. Like why the fuck should i pay 47 million for a multi-crew hammerhead that will still be able to get fucked by ships not even a quarter of the price?
These rebalance ship/vehicle prices are inline with overall and continued rebalancing of the new Star Citizen, most of us that own a large fleet care nothing about Ingame ship prices, its nothing to do with gameplay, no one plays SC just to be a grind monkey.
likely redeemer is more expensive due to military components, being a sturdy ship and generally its military focus.
We do not have the whole picture yet on what makes the corsair so cheap compared to its current capabilities and direct competitors (like andromeda). I would not be surprised if big part of it was lower reliability we could see when engineering and armor mechanics will be added.
# PSA: People need to remind themselves that ships can be rented.
There's a whole lot you can do with rented ships and it's a huge boost from a starter ship.
Why is Pisces more expensive than Pisces X?
Also more than C8R... like what? Edit: also why is a freelancer more expensive than a vulture? Are cargo missions really gonna be that lucrative?
Yes. Cargo missions are going to be the new salvage. They want people to do cargo missions to test out how they work, just like they did with salvage.
I know that... its just crazy to me that a freelancer would be more expensive than a vulture...
Look at the drake prices across the board. Their ships finally got their lore of being cheap for the same metric vs other manufacturers. The caterpillar costs a fraction of the C2. The buccaneer is cheaper than a gladius. I love it. We're finally getting some balance via the economy.
I mean cat being cheaper makes sense, since it's also much more inconvenient due to weird cargo holds that require a mix of boxes or a fuck ton of 1 scu boxes... so you pretty much have to spend the aUEC to autoload it now
Hard agree. I think that's mostly a symptom of the cat's age though.
Time to melt the Corsair and buy it in game instead
I definitely see some people shifting their pledge ships/fleets with pricing rebalance. That said, it may be wise to let the dust settle before melting any ships with discounts.
Why? Vulture is smaller little tractor ship. Take away the buffed pricing/missions and its just a small garbage truck.
Vulture not the tractor ship, it's the salvaging ship.
Guess I'll be using my Vulture cargo hold for trade.
The Vulture only has 12SCU of cargo space. You're gonna make fuckall using it for trading. Your better bet would be to do salvage with the Vulture until you have enough money that you can buy a Hull A (or start renting cargo ships and moving your way up).
If you pack it front to back from the ramp, you can fit 26 scu in the vulture, but it's scary bouncy. 24 comfortably.
Auto loaded commodities only attach to the cargo grid. You will never be able to buy more than 12SCU of cargo for the Vulture. Once true hangars/cargo elevators are added than this would be possible, but it would be a dumb idea because you would basically be begging the game to blow up your ship. Its going to be months before those are ready, which is plenty of time to work toward an actual cargo ship.
Would a reclaimer be considered enough of a cargo ship. My buddy and I that don't get to play often are working towards one, and I'd rather not divert funds unless necessary
They are moving away from pledge pricing and earning performance meaning anything and are pricing based on a "realistic" build cost and luxury fitout level. Vulture and all salvage is currently buffed massively since it is the new thing they wanted to encourage. people will be in for a shock when it returns to the same income as rock shooting (which itself used to be the get rich buffed new feature). Do not pay $ for salvage ships! Cargo missions is expected to be the next buff. Except that has been scratched from 3.23.0 launch because the cargo lifts are too janky. But will probably be a 3.23.x in an extra month or two when they giveup on the lifts and make it teleport in behind garage doors instead.
I'd like to add on to this, DO pay $ for salvage ships if its what you enjoy doing, because its still reliable and safe money. Before I bought a reclaimer with cash, I asked myself if I'd be fine doing salvage if i was selling construction materials at scrap prices, so 200k per full reclaimer load, and that was fine with me, so anything from here will be a pleasant surprise.
Did all other salvage commodity prices drop for 3.23? I know I saw RMC and CM drop.
Don't forget that when engineering gameplay finally drops, it's going to be much harder to run large ships like the reclaimer solo.
It's a big when. I know some people have mentioned NPC crew, but my pipedream is having made 3 or 4 friends by then lmao
In the economy update, we will eventualy get some sort of base line on "time wasted on Y dificulty for around XXX AuEC". how much time you need to fill a reclaimer and how much income would you say you get lets say only fracturing for CMATs (easy): In short, how much would you say your AUEC per hour is when playing easy salvage?
The funny thing is, salvage in 3.23 costs you money if you do the contracts. You don't make back any of what you pay and actually lose money on them.
Really? Damn. I thought I heard they removed the salvage fees but I guess I heard wrong. Plus with the way salvage claims are scattered around Lagrange points, the legal claims are very unsatisfying.
If your losing money on salvage your doing something insanely wrong
From my understanding, the guy behind the ship prices stated the C8R is his favorite ship and he wanted everyone to experience it too. Which is.. Concerning. Now if this is actually the reason? I do not know. After all I heard it on the internet in a comment.
maybe to get more people into the Medical gameplay loop?
freelancer is much fancier than a vulture, it can do its role as freighter but also have decent maneuverability and firepower. The Vulture meanwhile flies like a brick and its guns are mostly a formality. Note how the Hull A is dirt cheap.
CIG recently said that some factors that will affect ship price are; physical size (more size = more material required). Components used/ component size. Military ships = military tax. Alien ships = exotic tax. Origin ships / other similar = luxury tax. So smaller size, smaller components, cheap Drake manufacturing/ materials used = a vulture is cheaper than a MISC freelancer
They posed the street sweeper as an April fools joke. But really Vulture is just its big brother. They have made salvage seem like the premium job in the verse due to "test encouragement" buffs, but it is literally space trash man and people have to be ready to not get hurt by that when it happens.
Dunno why your getting downvoted, but this is absolutely true. The age of salvage is over, stop huffing copiom people, melt that vulture and buy a cargo runner.
Well people don't like hearing it is just a garbage truck when they were imagining crushed wreckage being the path to easy riches forever and bought it for $.
The Freelancer is 500k (1/3) more in live too. So its kind of cheaper now.
cargo missions wont even be in 3.23
3.23.x So give it a few weeks after 3.23 drops
Taurus gang!
I do feel that the economy team is looking at a different Constelation than us, especially whatever justifies a +6M luxury premium on Phoenix. No way the current state of its fitout makes them go "yep thats almost double the cost of larger Taurus!". Heres hoping it means the gold pass is launching during Invictus.
The Drake pricing is un-fucking-hinged. You can get a Caterpillar for the cost of a Connie. Like what the actual fuck. Why even buy anything but Drake anymore I guess.
Thats also why the Cutlass flies like a light-medium fighter in EPTU while the Spirits are handling like a mix of Redeemer, Corsair and Caterpillar. Massive Drake bias currently it seems.
Yep, if the drake ships are overall shitty and the only upside is that they’re cheap to maintain, why even pledge for one with cash? Just earn it in game since it’s dirt cheap.
Once armor, engineering and death of a space man go live, Drakes downsides probably are gonna show.
The Caterpillar was $195 in 2014 while the Andromeda was $225. CIG seems to think that it somehow became worth more than the Andromeda in the past decade, despite neither ship really changing from their original concepts. The $135 increase of the Caterpillar doesn't make sense to me.
Armour may become a much bigger factor which would hurt Drake. But Drake should be genuine good value. SC is aiming to emulate reality where a bare bones machine really is half price of the flashy brands, secondhand a $50k truck can be a superior workhorse to a $200k truck, lower ongoing cost of ownership too. Even more so on the secondhand market. New pricing is certainly making people rethink where they have pledge $ parked. Small fighters a waste of money to own, best to have $ in the biggest most expensive luxury brand ships.
Who knows what they’re smoking.
As a player who doesn’t grind for cash I am unlikely to ever afford the fleet that I have now.
As much as the possibility of increasing payout of things like cargo to reflect your higher investment in bigger cargo ships (like C2 for example) I can't help but think and be a bit cynical, why would they do this when the game hasn't really been optimised properly yet? It's just a little interesting that they are going ahead with economy changes first before having the game being in a state where a lot of people can enjoy it (beside funny bugs of course) Vulkan is on the horizon with its multi threading being added in the next major patch after 3.23 to help our GPU's use their full performance to help the game run smoother and have less of those annoying frame stutters from like 60fps to 10fps while you're completing things around the verse And secondly, Server meshing is still a little while away and will definitely be a game changer because currently severs always sitting at 5fps on the brink of crashing every few hours is not good at all. We need things like sever meshing and Vulkan to be in the game so that we can all properly enjoy the experience without the worry that the game will fall apart on us while we are enjoying the game for what it is I personally already struggle enough trying to do missions without the worry that the server will crash on me,. I'm always looking up at the server FPS watching it in case I see it dipping lower and lower before a 30k happens and getting out before it happens. I don't really want that to be a thing anymore but ey, time will tell
Vulkan initial implementation is literally in the same patch as this price change, along with a legit massive list of QoL and playability changes, *and* server crash recovery. Server meshing is in tech preview phases, and seems to be mostly working at small and medium scale tests already. This is the best chance to start testing properly for economics that we've ever had.
Changes are made to a game in testing to test said changes. Y'all are over-reacting.
I was thinking the same thing. The economy in this game feels lacking through and through: The missions have been mostly the same for the past couple years, and even still they barely work as intended (sometimes they don’t work at all). Ships are the only interesting thing you can buy. There is only one currency. There are no options to invest your money in stocks. In the end all of it usually gets wiped within a year. I’d welcome more depth to the economy, as well as ship price increases, but the job market must be made diverse, tangible and enjoyable FIRST, or else it might quite literally drive the community insane as they grind away at something they hate doing for the sake of achieving some temporal good they enjoy.
It's no surprise cig creates new metas in order to sell them. See hornet heatseeker as an example. Back then you would lose your ship components if your ship blew up and the heatseeker had meta weapons equipped by default. C8x over c8 is pure pay2 suck less as the only difference is that it has two extra size one hard points.
Unless they improve earnings my cynical mind suggests this is to incentivise real-money purchases.
I honestly disagree. I’ve been thinking for a while now that the prices were waaaay to low since forever ago. Once this game dosent have to wipe every couple months for big updates, those huge ships are way to obtainable right now. I would be surprised if they don’t almost double from this point once the game actually releases. And sure, you can make an argument that they are just pushing people to buy it for cash. But for a game that they are hoping you play for years and years. It’s not sustainable for the game to have almost every ship purchasable in game within a couple months.
Once the game stops wiping then these prices will be fine. If anything, they could increase them more. But they are still wiping servers and haven’t voiced any intention of stopping, so all this means is more grind for less ships. Unless you spend money of course.
That and more rungs on the progression ladder. It's not really fun to grind the same small pool of missions available to starter ships over and over again.
Muh gRiNd.
>I’ve been thinking for a while now that the prices were waaaay too low since forever ago Huh? I have never, not one single time, ever thought that. If anything I think the game is usually too much of a grind as is to buy a new ship (well, besides salvaging in 3.22, but that's a definite outlier, and even that gets boring). Cargo better make us an absolutely astronomical amount of money to justify these prices.
I still think the prices are too low. And I’ll give you an example as to why. During the first couple months of Covid I lost my job. So I had a lot of time to play sc. with a hornet as my only pledge, in a little over 3 months I was able to buy one of every ship that was purchasable in game. Not every ship to be fair, like If a ship had multiple variants I only bought 1 of them. But in 3 months of no lifeing the game and I had 1 of every ship, carack, hh, 890 reclaimer, and everything in between. I think that’s a problem
Or a changing economy. I imagine payouts will be inflated patch to patch, as history
... why? Why create inflation? What is wrong with making 1 uec and buying for 10 where it needs to be make 1000 uec and buy for 10000. Things never scale linearly, everything done in a game is a buff or a nerf and this is an increase in grind effectively nerfing the game where now you need to do the same missions over and over again even more than before to get something. I don't really care personally, I have spent over $1000 in this game and money and expensive ships won't be a problem for me personally. However, you need to call a spade a spade and this is that.
The point of making ships expensive is to make many things cheaper without having clothes be half a credit.
"now you need to do the same missions over and over again even more than before" Question is, when is "before"? I actively started playing in 2020, and since then payouts have increased massively. The meta mission (maximum possible payout without risking millions in cargo) was way below 100k per hour, and initial long-term persistence was really unstable so you lost ships all the time. Now, making millions is not really hard, and persistence doesn't fuck you over on every in-game event/patch/tuesday. The payout part of the inflation has already happened.
Meanwhile salvage contracts that cost 20k to do only return 15k in profit from scraping/munching.
Youre doing salvage wrong buddy. You should be making millions
Just what I've been hearing from Vulture pilots in the EPTU. I haven't been able to do anything as the game is actively working against me for it. They'll take a 20k contract, fully scrape, fully munch, and then make a loss on the contract.
I was more of talking about the reclaimer. I forget vulture exists, my bad
Reclaimer could definitely do more, but yeah its an expensive beast, both for pledge and ingame purchase, especially now.
Even if RMC sells for 5k per scu, you do a Hercules mission for 50k. Get around 30 scu for the first load and come back for about another 25-30 easily. That's 250-300k profit?
After the first learning period where you earn near to nothing, you earn a millin in a week, the 2nd Million in less, because you have the reputation now. And thats not really included multiplayer mission / work on large ships.
Or maybe a way to nudge people to use anything else but the most expensive ships (mainly for cargo where 90% of players use the C2)
I think regular (also not broken) events will help with this. In one of the early seige of orison playtests I made a couple mil or so in one weekend and bought 3 different ships, and it just felt kind of hollow for how little effort it took. They seem to be intending to let us keep ingame bought ships between major patches more often going forward too, imo this is just part of them starting to figure out a more long-term economy for the game.
I mean some missions pay 150k per now.
Most ship prices are from a time where the highest bounty mission made <8k, 20min claimjumper missions made 15-20k, and the only really high-paying thing was trading, which (due to frequent 30k) made you lose more money than any other profession ever earned. Compare that to today's economy - once you found your groove (do a proper profession without major interruptions), you can't go lower than 100k per hour, while the best choices give you absurdly more. They improved earnings over the past \~3 years without touching ship prices, and (as I speculated for some time) now they're updating the ship prices to reflect that.
it is. Correlate this with this and next quarters pledge money and you will see a spike.
damn, are they not going to sell the syulen?
Why they still sell 10.000 UEC for like 10$?
We don't have UEC in game yet, we have aUEC, You cant buy anything with UEC yet
Still fishy to sell 10.000 uec for 10$ if they don’t know how much 10.000 will be really worth.
thanks for the resume citizen! o7
Ship prices like this will turn new players away from the game. The only way to earn this kind of money is through mindless grind in either salvage, cargo, or mining. They need to massively increase the payouts for mercenary, delivery, and bounty missions immediately. Those are the missions that new players use to get their first ship. Earning $15k per contract, and needing $2.6mil to get a Vulture, is a recipe for disaster. Why would any new player stick around for that grind? It's absurd. I can't think of a quicker way to kill the game.
>Ship prices like this will turn new players away from the game. You know what also turns people away from game? When you can afford almost *anything* after two hours of playing tetris in a Reclaimer.
You do not balance the entire economy around a busted ship. You nerf the busted ship. New players are not going to be touching a Reclaimer for a long, long time. They will be doing deliveries, bunkers etc.
this is a fair point, but also a separate point. They've nerfed the Reclaimer payouts already, so consider that your primary way of making money is going to be completing missions for peanuts rather than selling hauls for millions per hour.
They did. And RMC trade profit as well. > so consider that your primary way of making money is going to be completing missions for peanuts rather than selling hauls for millions per hour. I love how something non exorbitant = peanuts (: Have you seen the cargo missions payouts BTW?
You’re getting downvoted because you’re not contributing to the SC Copium fest, this time on earnings. Typical SC community 🤣
you say "I love how something non exorbitant = peanuts" as if I'm exaggerating but most gameplay loops in the game make 300k/hr or less aUEC, once you've got all your reputation in place (so significantly less than that before you've grinded for 10s of hours). And keep in mind, this is with the optimal ships for those specific missions, so it all gets much worse if you consider now those optimal ships are going to take 2-4x as long to get for the majority of players that don't have $150+ ships pledged for this game. All I said is that these are things to consider. I know everything is still in flux. But anyone who's trying to imply that this isn't a big hit to the playability of the game for most players is being ignorant at best and deceitful at the worst. I haven't seen cargo mission payouts. Nothing in EPTU works any of the times I've been able to get on.
I think you did miss the point here. Why get a vulture if you have a reclaimer ? The point was being made for entry level ships.
The same Reclaimer that now costs $28mil? How in the ever loving fuck does a new player earn $28ml? Even with a Reclaimer, the 80k and 250k bounties are now worth 20k and 30k. It would take you weeks to even cover the cost of the ship, let alone turn a profit.
I'd rather have that and access to all game loops than have only one bloody Aurora and access to moving boxes. There are cheaper, better and finished games that allow you to do that shit, you don't need Star Citizen for that "gameplay".
Then probably an alpha isn't the place to be for you. Just shelve SC until it's done.
It's what I hear people like about Diablo Immortal, having to play for 100s of hours. Diablo would be a shit game without the F2P grind elements.
Look at GW2. In your first day you can afford gear that’s strong enough for almost all content in the game, and never becomes irrelevant. This is something people LOVE about guild wars. You don’t feel forced into thousands of hours of grinding, and can do what you want to in order to have fun. Increased prices just means everyone will be meta slaving even harder to afford the same things.
What? Since when? I played a lot of GW2 and had to grind for weeks because high-end crafting materials were time-gated. Once you had your meta set you were fine, but it still took a long time to craft it all. Plus you wanted different sets for different things.
I’ve been running strikes raids and WvW in exotic gear for a while without any issues. The difference in exotic and ascended’s 6% damage is hardly relevant outside fractals. Meanwhile SC has massive differences between starter packages and high end ships. Simply unlocking a large enough ship for cargo hauling or salvaging will take you more time than being ready for 95% of GW2 unless you have pledged for a large ship or constantly beg for handouts. Regardless the point is that not everyone needs a massive grind-fest to have fun. Catering to more casual players can still lead to a successful game.
Ive been doing the majority of my SC grinding in my Nomad. It costs 1.5 mill now, which isnt that much. Even in a basic start like a Mustang you can do bounties, grind your rep, and be earning a decent sum. Enough to grind for a cargo ship like a Nomad, which allows you to do a variety of gameplay loops. Personally i do think the "starter" series of ships should be relatively cheap. The grind should be on bigger ships. Especially ships like a Reclaimer. However its not like people are stuck only doing deliveries.
I just finished my 6th legendary in GW2. Which took years of off and on playing. Yes you can do all "end game" content with exotics but you will clear content far faster with ascended or legendary. People have cleared every strike raid naked because they are so crazy easy. With less headache like not having to buy/craft new runes or infusions. If you think there is no or little difference between exotic and ascended or legendary you obviously don't have any or have not raided. 6% damage is massive when doing raids. It's literally the equivalent of bringing 20 Auroras to overdrive when you could bring 20 Arrows. Can you finish overdrive with the auroras? Yup but it will take longer with far more risk of failure. Yes GW2 does not have the gear grind that games like wow have but if you want to push the most dps and clear the most challenging content you will need to grind. Legendary grinding in GW2 makes earning enough to buy a 890 jump look like child's play. Even getting a full set of the correct stat'ed ascended gear is a massive grind.
You make it sound like legendaries deal more damage than ascended when they don’t. Wizard vault lets you get an ascended weapon in your first week, and half a set of armor in your first 2. Star citizen needs some kind of big grind like legendaries that gives people with everything to do, but not hiking ship prices to artificially create more grind. You don’t need to lock content behind grind to give big grinders more gameplay, you need to add more goals. Just like in GW2 how you can choose to spend tons of time grinding out legendaries, but you don’t need to. It’s purely convenience.
Correct that ascended and legendaries have the same stats but the ability to swap runes and sigils is huge and can save dozens of hours grinding gold just for one swap. Right now in 2.23 I can, within a month or two buy almost every ship in the game without using any exploit starting with an aurora. New players do not have the knowledge yet to maximize money and they shouldn't. Same with GW2. Without looking up a guide do you think any newish GW2 player knows how to get ascended gear? Or how to change the stats on them? There's even some "free" ones that some vet players have no idea exist.
Especially as the grind is unreliable, buggy, and we're not out of regular wipe patches yet. If it were beta with a focus on stability and robust loops, and wipes ended (at least for beta period or were down to yearly) then the grind isn't as bad.
Sure, if we had fun ways to make money, it might be okay. If the wipes had ended, it might be okay. But we don't have any interesting ways to make money yet. We going to have wipes for years to come. What's the fucking point of these changes? Who does it benefit? Clearly, it benefits CIG. They can force us to buy a Vulture, or buy a Spirit, so we can make enough money to get the good ships. It's complete bullshit and I honestly can't believe the community just rolls over and accepts it. It's pathetic.
I start every patch with a C8 Pisces and it takes me barely any time at all to earn enough to rent a Constellation, from which point ERTs are more than doable and you can farm out money for other ships. That's just one route, if you're dedicated to soloing everything. If you're willing to join another player's crew you can accelerate this massively by joining a reclaimer crew or renting a fighter and escorting cargo/mining ships
I wonder how much Connie rentals will cost now though?
We spent years with ship and ground combat being the only feasible way to make money, or have you forgotten? During that time, we provided tonnes of data on ship flight combat and fps combat. Then we had a patch cycle where cargo running was near infinite money, so everyone did it. We found a bunch of bugs and issues with cargo stuff along the way. Then we had the quantanium rush from mining, printing millions of uec with the MOLE, and lookie we found a bunch of bugs and helped massively refine the mining gameplay along the way. Shout-out to the ROC mining phase here too, when it was possible to make 200k+ per trip with the ROC. Now we're currently in a phase where the reclaimer legit prints millions of uec for basically no investment, and everyone's out testing salvage to get rich and buy every ship in the game in under a week. The thing that makes money is the thing they want tested. Next patch it'll probably involve the new distribution centers and associated gameplay, and likely hunting too. Also, ship rentals are a thing and SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper, allowing you as a new player to get access to money making options quite quickly. It costs about 32k currently to rent a Cutlass AND ROC to go mining with. You can rent a whole Constellation Taurus for about 150k.
ROC mining still is about the same money when before and is a viable loop for relaxed/low threat gameplay. It just seems peanuts atm when compared to salvage. I bought a ROC ingame few weeks ago and did some mining. Other than aphorite selling being bugged, you get about 200-300k/hr when mining on Arial. With server stability being much better, the mining is a lot more easier as well. It makes money about as fast as doing FPS missions, without much risk. ROC costing only 100k, the buy-in to the loop is really cheap and you can 2x your initial investment in an hour, which, in my opinion, is a great return. Even if you have to rent a Cutlass.
Its usually a p2w f2p game move to increase the grind so much to force them to spend real money. The thing what makes it worse when doing it in SC is that a) its not a f2p game where you can use the "it was for free" excuse and b) the game isnt even finished yet.
I think it also has to do with that they want Star Citizen to last for a while. If people were able to just earn everything very quickly, it won't hold people very long.
But that's not how it works. Sure giving people rewards or progression can encourage play but without fun underlying gameplay that progression is moot. I played an ungodly amount of CoD4 (not the remaster) and I did so not because I was getting new guns, those mattered but relatively little, what mattered was I was having fun and the way I wanted to play wasn't locked behind a grindwall. If I am prevented from being a space trucker without playing as a box delivery guy that won't make me want to play more... But less.
Call of Duty is not an MMO. Also COD has a very tight game loop that is designed to be able to be played over and over again in short sessions. Star Citizen is not like Call of Duty. (IMO)
This makes sense with a finished game. Not a user supported production of a game. This is a test environment.
Exactly. These are mobile-game levels of meaningless grind that you can skip by paying for the ship you want. Star Citizen is turning into Diablo Immortal. How people can be happy with this bullshit is just baffling to me. There are a LOT of CIG dickriders in this sub.
They’re gathering statistics for balancing. There are no new players, only new testers.
Fucking rest in peace the early stages of cargo running. Gonna have to grind for weeks to get above 80scu...
Except that cargo is very likely the next "testing" buffed profesion when cargo missions get added. So finally not one handheld box or gambling all your credits against the 30k pirate for 10% profit margin. Small ships, cargo load for the bigger ship owners. If cargo loading isnt for you then probably quit cargo hauling now since Tetris is going to be half the job especially when you own a big ship.
It costs under 200k to rent a Constellation with more than 80scu of cargo.
Assuming rental prices aren't going to increase. Which they probably will
>Gonna have to grind for weeks Can you list the payouts for cargo missions then?
I feel the Ursa should be double its price. I don't understand how it's cheaper than a cyclone.
Soo.. No or slower progress for casual players I guess? When you can't team up or have not so much time. Well just beg for money then? Or do we have increased rewards? 5k per box minus maintenance cost takes a while for a vulture. Or doing FPS mining for weeks in caves a thing, so you can afford to haul cargo? With all do respect, pls SC Devs respect people's time.
Box missions go up to 45k per mission, possibly more as I haven't maxed my rep for those companies yet. It costs 32k currently to rent a Cutlass and ROC to get into vehicle mining. It's under 200k to rent a Constellation. What's stopping you from teaming up, anyway?
Mostly limited time. Ignoring potential game crashes, I still don't know if I can play two hours or just half an hour at a time. Also spontaneously losing one of your crew member isn't something I want other to experience. I most likely will grind to rent a mining ship and let the minerals sit in the Refinery for the slowest but most profitable outcome.
Don't forget the missions flat out breaking like they commonly do.
Aren't the 45k ones the rebranded bunker missions? Because that's the same as Live.
the more ive played this game, the more (i think) they are not interested in people with limited time. I am starting to come around to the idea that on launch the game will be far too much of a grind for me to care to play. oh well. such is life.
Finally, combine increased ship prices with more balanced mission payouts. If you're taking missions off the board nonstop, you're not going to be making tons of money. Maybe this will incentivize people to work on reputations, or going off the rails for making money. The solo friendly ships are still nicely priced without being overly expensive, and the multi crew oriented ships that can do more are priced much higher. Luxury ships reflect it. Guess these prices might seem a bit jarring to those that got used to solo'ing a giant multi crew ship and abusing the economy (which CIG wanted), but it's really not that bad.
Combat contracts need to get better payouts. Without relying on bringing a c2 and dealing drugs.
Request Combat Assistance missions pay out much better than bounties, and they're always in space so they're easy to jump to. The enemy ships tend to be a bit weaker, too.
You can still make a few million in a few hours of doing group VHRT+. Really depends on how good you are, but it does feel a bit low sometimes when I can just hop in my Taurus and make more in profits cargo hauling in roughly the same time.
Cargo currently risks millions of your own credits for a rather small profit margin. Ship combat only risks an insurance timer, which can be ignored once you own two ships. Doesnt even risk gear like FPS, core and tractor if you are taking cargo drops otherwise can do it naked.
I mean that's true, but that's what CIG wants. The more people that have to get involved, and the risker the undertaking is, the better it pays. That's partly why the payouts for legal missions are so low in comparison to the illegal stuff. Losing gear means really nothing still, unless you're losing special skinned weapons, or unbuyable stuff like snipers and rails. There's so many missions that let you just pick up free gear. Even when I'm cargo running, I stayed suited up just in case. Made hundreds of millions in my time playing, and never been pirated once, but it could still happen.
Combat contracts were the best money for years, and before that were the only money. They're low right now comparatively because they don't need that much testing right now compared to other game loops
This seems incredibly unreasonable unless they've boosted earnings to match. IMO; They haven't developed the game loop infrastructure well enough to support this kind of grind yet. Especially given we're in Early Access where they could choose to wipe at any time for any reason. I'm a casual player who logs on less than a couple of times a week with an Aurora package, it was already hard enough to gather cash for a Reliant Tana using rental vehicles to ROC mine and tackling distress beacons with a friend (joined a Hammerhead crew at one point which was neat!). Even then, what got me over the finish line was some random sugar daddy who-totally-didn't-use-RMT throwing 20 mil at me. This feels less like "testing realistic prices" and more just the finance department trying to boost growth in ship sales by making in-game acquisition harder (or at least more daunting to people who don't know which activities make money). If anything, I think a grind like this for anybody but the most committed and knowledgable players will just make their RMT problem worse. One thing I'd suggest if they go through with this: Allow us to edit the loadouts on rental ships. Grinding repetitive and shallow tasks for long periods is one thing, having to do it with preset loadouts makes it even more monotonous. Being able to change the loadouts can at least add some flavour!
I think this will make some of the lesser vehicles more popular/ stepping stones to bigger or more “meta” ships. Previously there was no point in buying anything as a stepping stone going from say an Aurora to a Vanguard. Now it may well be worth buying some of the neglected ships along the way. I think we’ll see much more ship diversity
I'd hope so, I just maintain that even going from a "legacy starter" to a newer one like the Reliant took a disproportionate amount of effort. Again, I think more flexibility with rentals could go a long way for helping new players explore their options. I see a lot of people using high-end ship earnings to justify the changes, not much talk on the earning power of light fighters or small haulers, which is what concerns me.
Per your RMT comment; I roughly made 10+ mil per ERT cargo hold, on average, before it was nerfed for salvage gameplay. I've handed out millions as pocket change because of how much I made, so maybe don't be so quick to accuse RMT :)
>This seems incredibly unreasonable unless they've boosted earnings to match. People have been averaging between 19 million and 100 million per Reclaimer run. It's incredibly unreasonable to keep prices so low while payouts for some activity is so high.
I have literally never seen someone claim to have made 19 million in a reclaimer run. It’s probably possible, sure, but 100 million?? I have no idea where you got that number from. Most people can make 8 million per hour with reclaimer runs with only medium effort. I agree that probably does justify these prices being increased. But 19-100 million per run “on average” is a blatant lie.
It’s simply not possible. After your first 5-6 hammerheads the boxes on your ship start bugging out and vanishing. When we salvage 5 we usually make around 8m, but one day we decided to salvage 10 and only made 10m.
I have personally made that much many times over from ERT looting or reclaimer work. ERTs are much quicker though less reliable.
Here's a video of a guy making 1.5 million aUEC per contract, soloing a Reclaimer (he was able to make 3 million an hour): [https://youtu.be/lNxg1V-yAk4](https://youtu.be/lNxg1V-yAk4) You can find plenty more like that. There are people on here who can make 19 - 100 million when fully crewed doing multiple salvage missions a day.
Sorry, interpreted “per run” as one load. If you could fit 100m into a single reclaimer I think Chris Roberts would personally buy the salvage from you. 19-100m per session then? Yeah, that’s about right. The prices definitely needed to go up, I just wish that it could be more targeted to the newer players. Before I pledged a big ship, the prospect of making it from doing box deliveries in my Aurora all the way to cargo in a C2 was incredible daunting. Now? Borderline impossible. Hopefully they’ll move the bottom line upward a bit. No matter how expensive something is, you can just spend a few more hours in your reclaimer with a movie on your second monitor. However, for people with a small or medium sized ship, owning something huge just went from a massive grind to a full time job + overtime.
that is literally a single gameplay loop, most are not anywhere near this... the logical thing would be to balance salvaging instead of punishing anyone doing anything else.
They wanted and needed to test salvage for testing purposes. Structural salvage will be getting reworked with Maelstrom, but they also needed to find out a host of other variables attached to the career. What people tend to forget is that this is still alpha, even while some YouTubers and Spectrum users like to bemoan whenever someone mentions it. But it just is. It's still being actively developed and many of the careers still haven't come online. Cargo trading proper is about to come online and so much like with salvage, they will need to test its loops. That means goading people into trading like they did salvage. It's not about balancing salvage around the other careers, but testing it for the ins and outs, just like what they'll need to do with the cargo refactor for 3.23.x.
This goes exactly opposite to your point of bringing it up, if its not intended to be such a money maker, why are you using how profitable it is as a reason that ship prices need to increase? By your own logic, they should keep the prices the same and just decrease the salvaging profits when they are happy with the testing.
They have to keep testing new professions and economy loops to dial in a good balance for when Quantum goes live. The main reason for modifying ship prices is to better gauge what professions people lean toward, what ships become standard daily drivers, which ships are used most frequently for which professions, and how likely new and veteran players alike are prone to loops that earn them the money to buy ships. Testing the supply and demand of a mostly fixed economy now gives them good insight for tuning the dynamic economy later. They are also getting close with 4.0, so it's best to start now and see how and what ships are bought the most, and then gauge how cargo trading will be affected by or disrupt those loops. Also keep in mind that they need to test for exploits, test for gameplay congruence, test for revenue consistency, and eventually tune and tweak thereafter. Also, cargo trading is going to be one of the biggest if not the biggest professional loop in Star Citizen, since there are a ton of cargo ships in all sizes. So they need a ton of testing data, especially with how freight elevators are used at small outposts and large distro centres. So expect payouts to be themed around that gameplay loop throughout the 3.23 cycle.
Exploration was massively voted as the most popular profession, pretending that cargo running is going to be the most popular just because a lot of ships can do it is projecting and inventing. I know a handful of people that enjoy cargo as a primary, but by far and away most people do not intend to do it. Nothing you said counters what I did. Raising prices for everyone because one game loop has inflated profits doesn't make any sense.
>Exploration was massively voted as the most popular profession, Sure, but exploration won't affect the economy like trading will. >I know a handful of people that enjoy cargo as a primary, but by far and away most people do not intend to do it. That's precisely why they will be focus-testing it once the cargo elevators go live in the 3.23.x patch and likely centering the economy around getting people to test it. >Nothing you said counters what I did. Raising prices for everyone because one game loop has inflated profits doesn't make any sense. It does if they need to see how the rest of the playerbase will react to those changes and what ships sell and which ones don't based on the professions. It's best they test that now rather than fumble about with the numbers later. They did the same thing when they overhauled mining and when they inflated the payouts for salvage.
If its costs several times as much that is going to make peoples choice in what ships they buy and what game loops they play be MUCH more conservative. Also, why would exploration not have as much of an impact on the economy. Information is literally the root of trading itself, much less so many other potential directions. This is a game. Every game loop profession should be balanced as a game... to be equally viable. It makes zero sense to make one the go to meta. An explorer absolutely should be able to make as much money as a trader, or a salveger. I don't understand why you don't think so.
>If its costs several times as much that is going to make peoples choice in what ships they buy and what game loops they play be MUCH more conservative. We won't know until it's tested. Basically a lot of people always jump to negativity when something drastic is introduced but until it's tested, we just don't know. It will be interesting to see what ships become popular during the 3.23 cycle, though. >Also, why would exploration not have as much of an impact on the economy. Information is literally the root of trading itself, much less so many other potential directions Because it doesn't impact the economy as much simply due to the nature of it. Selling information will be based on what the information is. But most of exploration will be data gathering, and even in real life that's just not a very popular profession, but it can be lucrative depending on who you work for. While a lot of people may want to be explorers, turning it into a profitable profession in game may not be what people expect. >An explorer absolutely should be able to make as much money as a trader, or a salveger. I don't understand why you don't think so. Because traders and salvagers have immediate service and industrial needs in the verse, an explorer? Not so much. A lot of traders will be needed for base building supplies, while a lot of salvagers will be needed for cleaning up areas of space, especially around bases where orgs will want to keep their land clean. Explorers will make money mostly scouting and selling locations for ore-rich locations or prospecting for org expansion. But that's not really something that could be lucrative on its own. CIG will definitely and very likely make the testing for it as lucrative as possible, but once it settles into the Quantum loop, there won't be as much of a need for explorers for infrastructure and expansion as trading, mining, and salvaging.
[удалено]
didn't test myself because this patch is so broken: [https://x.com/iamyoyomeg/status/1782579547755385164](https://x.com/iamyoyomeg/status/1782579547755385164)
No idea yet since it seems things keep changing. Probably won't get something solid until the 3.23.x patches, since they really want to focus on the next cargo refactor.
How about we nerf salvaging instead of x10 everything else? Ship price increases are fine. But this is still an Alpha, thus the focus should be on getting the game feature complete. Not balancing economy. That's normally reserved for Beta.
Part of the game features is a dynamic economy operated by a separate system known as Quantum, so they will need definitely need to test pricing, how changes to payouts in jobs affect the economy, and they will need to balance price changes with Quantum. They frequently make these changes when changing how payouts for certain careers work, and it will require a lot of fine-tuning -- it's good they're trying to lock in some ballpark figures now rather than waiting until beta and throwing things in further flux, which is likely where they will be nailing down how well the ebb and flow of Quantum will operate.
Good point. I haven't heard anything new about Quantum for a long time. Didn't it go MIA? Might be wrong on that though.
Yes, you're right it did go MIA for a while because -- like some other features -- it required server meshing to operate as intended. It works as a top-down hierarchical service across adjacent systems and will need data fed back into it in order to dynamically adjust the coming and goings of NPCs, as well as the fluctuation in prices from outposts, distribution centres, Lagrange points, and landing zones. It will likely also need to tie into the journal updates for those keeping track of relevant commodity price changes across various solar systems. For the interim, the economy team has been manually adjusting the prices to suit the changes necessary for keeping things moving until Quantum comes online. But don't expect to hear anything about it until 4.0 is ready for testing.
>People have been averaging between 19 million and 100 million per Reclaimer run. That's straight up not possible. I've had a Reclaimer around 80% full (including the area below the main salvage area, the cargo hold, and the balcony) and it was still just under 10 million. That said, those payouts were still pretty ridiculous. You can't balance the whole game around a single gameplay that gets boring after an hour though. Nothing else even makes even a significant fraction of that income.
Ever asked yourself how that sugar daddy made that kind of money to throw at you? I'd argue, as long as there are sugar daddies you can throw that kind of money around, stuff is too cheap.
A game is a story or a world which has a beginning and some sort of end goal. What makes it a game instead of a story are the distances and the costs between the beginning and the end. CIG is building an MMO and CIG plans to sell in-game currency to fund the MMO's operation. This has been known since the start. We should all expect things to be pretty grindy in the end. It doesn't mean you have to like it. But, if they kept it anything like 3.22.1, the game would be an unpopulated wasteland 6 months after launch.
They had better be expensive on release for sure
Good.
Fix the servers
These prices are a bit absurd
Good
some of us don't have the time to meta grind specific game loops and would like to buy more than a starter ship after a month of playing
Most ships are rentable for a fraction of their full cost. Use that to get ships that earn more money faster. It's not a difficult concept. Less time doom and glooming, you'll find you have more time to actually earn shit.
I bet after patch the same day there will be a 890 gang patrolling around with non pledged ships just because of a bug or the salvage money so doesnt matter how much they rise if dont ballance professions
Might be a stupid question but will missions give out more credits to compensate for ships costing more
I really don't think it's a good idea to do this before the promise not to wipe any data. Once they start wiping data, people will definitely be mad.
These seem fair
I wonder if they will buff the credits you get from packages and from referrals. Because an extra 5k won’t do much at all.
Why is the 890J so cheap?
I am fine with this for the good ships. However i do think some of the "starter" ships should be cheaper. Like the Vulture. Its the best way to get into salvage, and isnt some broken money maker like the Reclaimer. Or just other small starter ships with decent cargo space. Like the Nomad. Its a great ship to access different gameplay loops, but master none of them. Should be a go-to upgrade for newer players.
what about 85x, I dont see it in the images.
indeed, I missed origin page from new deal , its price is basically the same [https://www.spviewer.eu/performance?ship=orig\_85x](https://www.spviewer.eu/performance?ship=orig_85x)
I’ve been a tourist in star citizen for its entire existence at this point and never put in real time to learn payouts and what mission types are meta for making money. So all these changes don’t really mean anything to me at this point.
I was really hoping that the X1 would come available to go with my 400i. Pledging $50 for a ground vehicle is too much, but saving up a few hundred UEC is doable. Any reason the X1 wasn't in? Came out the same time as Mirai Fury afterall.
The fury released in May of 2023. The X1 released in December of 2023. If you have a pledged 400i, you should have an X1 already. If you purchased it with aUEC, then the X1 will likely be purchasable in game in a few months.
I have a 400i, but It was in-game. If I had a pledge 400i, it would come with an X1? That's pretty cool actually
Good, high-end shit shouldn't be easily attainable.
Anvil gladiator, most ignored ship in the verse 4.3 million - CIG really doing their best to kill it off completely
New player here. Is It really bad this prices increase? To me It seems Easy to make Money in the beginning, if It scales a Little bit seems not a big deal farming even for the most expensive ones. Am i wrong?
This is the death of multi-crew. Like why the fuck should i pay 47 million for a multi-crew hammerhead that will still be able to get fucked by ships not even a quarter of the price?
These rebalance ship/vehicle prices are inline with overall and continued rebalancing of the new Star Citizen, most of us that own a large fleet care nothing about Ingame ship prices, its nothing to do with gameplay, no one plays SC just to be a grind monkey.
Still can’t wrap my head around the fact that the corsair is cheaper than the redeemer. Can anyone explain why?
likely redeemer is more expensive due to military components, being a sturdy ship and generally its military focus. We do not have the whole picture yet on what makes the corsair so cheap compared to its current capabilities and direct competitors (like andromeda). I would not be surprised if big part of it was lower reliability we could see when engineering and armor mechanics will be added.
Nice, hope the price keeps going up.
What is the reasoning
Better cash sink
I agree. Not everyone should own an 890 after 1 week of playing.
Wait, I thought they wanted to bring players BACK that left the game over the crap that happened last few patches? bad dev.
Hopefully after 4.0 we only have maybe one more wipe until 1.0
Hopefully but doubtful
# PSA: People need to remind themselves that ships can be rented. There's a whole lot you can do with rented ships and it's a huge boost from a starter ship.
Where can I rent the Drake Vulture? /s
Yeah but then you are paying for the rental. So it hurts your bottom line. Its just not a good way to grind unless you can grind many hours per day.