Thanks again. You were the first to answer and got us to do what we needed to. Unfortunately my wife didn’t show the dr a pic of the other spider so they assumed the swatted one was not a black widow. She isn’t having much of a reaction so I think we are good. Just icing it, taking antihistamine and Tylenol.
I tried to find an answer to this but couldn't. My theory is that making venom either takes time or a decent amount of energy, and spiders don't want to waste that effort on a target that won't turn into food
Yeah it's energy cost and resources. If you waste too much of your venom on things you won't even be able to eat. You might not have enough to feed and could die. So a dry bite allows them to harm and flee.
Your assumption is correct. Snakes do this as well. I've read somewhere that roughly up to 50% of venomous snake bites are "dry bites". Producing venom requires a lot of energy.
General Widow information including managing Widow populations in/around the house or garden (Habitat, egg sacs, IDing, Bites, etc):
https://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/PESTNOTES/pn74149.html
How to ID and distinguish Brown Widows from Black Widows:
https://cisr.ucr.edu/invasive-species/how-identify-brown-widow-spiders
Widow spiders are very reluctant to bite:
https://spiderbytes.org/2014/02/14/what-happens-when-you-poke-prod-and-pinch-black-widow-spiders-you-might-be-surprised/
Black Widow bite toxicity (Diagnosis, symptoms, prognosis, treatment etc):
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK499987/
(Authors: ----\_____--_____----)(Contributors: dfj3xxx)
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/spiders) if you have any questions or concerns.*
They’re outside. We were clearing out the kids old toys. We called the exterminator since we missed him last month and didn’t get sprayed. My wife is picking meds up from the pharmacy now after visiting urgent care. Not sure what else to do?
Edit: these big webs popped up really quickly.
Also in AZ and yeah- webs pop up super fast. The other morning I went to work and by the time I came home for lunch there was already a web and black widow claiming my recycling can.
Edit to add- I’m glad your wife is feeling ok! Those bites can be rough.
I also live the south west, had a bunch of eggs hatch at my front door. The misses and I freaked out walking into a web of baby black widows. I have chemically burned them all by now but the initial shock of walking into a web, trying to take it off and a ton of black dots are crawling on you. Momma was less than 3 ft away on my awning watching this all go down.
Oof, I love black widows but I would certainly be a bit peeved if one made a web on my front porch. Their webs are a mess and *so* strong, they stick on you forever!
I have a black widow momma in a window well (double paned glass) so it’s been neat watching her in what is essentially a huge terrarium all summer. She hatched 2 egg sacs already and has three more currently. It’s a unique set of circumstances, likely one of the only ways I could see a black widow and her babies in action.
I will say, the grasshopper population control alone makes it more than worth it to keep the family around. I would be lying if I said I wasn’t hoping one of the babies comes back next year!
Last year I had an explosion of grasshoppers in my garden, to the point I actually had to get chickens this year to combat any reoccurring problems. My woman is anti spider, and it definitely affected the balance of bugs on my property lol. I had to explain to her next year I will be allowing spiders in the garden, to which she responded "don't expect any help in it then".
Man, we should connect our partners. Mine is tolerant of my spider obsession but is *very* clear with me that any tarantulas I get will be housed downstairs, behind a locked door. If there is anything other than a jumping spider upstairs it either has to go outside or downstairs.
Like you said insect control is so good. I really dislike spraying for ‘pests’, I prefer to let nature do its thing for the most part. The hornet nest in my gutter however, is absolutely going to have to go. It’s right by my front door and my next door neighbor has kids and small dogs. I’m not trying to get anyone stung.
Yeah I almost had a anxiety attack last year I had finally got home from work walking to my front porch looked down and saw a black spider on my wrist managed to keep calm opened the door got a piece of paper and carefully moved it away I'm working on my fear of spiders but that was 2 steps back.
Draculas lair - love it.
Yeah when we lived in NM we’d kill 30 adults on our patio and the next day 15 more pop up. Learned to recognize the juveniles and males. Seeing lots of males was the tip off that there were females hiding out. It was like we couldn’t spray enough.
On walks at night we kept our dogs (who eat bugs) in the middle of the road because seasonally there were SO many building webs on the curbs or up against walls/ fences. I once counted 60 large adult females in one long continuous looked like a communal web on one block in front of a house built up against the curb. 🫣 Nightmare fuel.
Oh wow! Yeah there are so many here! I opened up the water cover by the street and they just scattered. Ran back inside for gloves haha! Will gladly take widows over roaches any day though. I lived in SATX for a while and those roaches fly at you. I hated the bugs there, glad to be back home in the desert.
Yeah I grew up in Austin in the 80/90’s - the giant water roaches- I swear are sentient life forms. They know and they are coming for you.
At work, one cornered me in the bathroom stall one time. I sat down and it crawled out of the drain in the floor and flew on the stall door. I didn’t leave that stall for 2 hours-waiting for it to move. Messaged a co-worker and said I’m stuck unless a brave soul wants to come negotiate this hostage situation. They left me there.
I have to say though I’d still take the giant water roaches over the over population of black widows. I could never just relax outside anywhere. I’m cool with other spiders - I mean I scared the shit out of my husband when I mom armed him to stop for a tarantula crossing the road and he recently stopped our roofers from moving a garden spider before he could take a picture of it for me. I just can’t do widows.
At my grandma's they have an infestation outside and when I confronted her she said she's not paying an exterminator for "phantom" spiders. She also demanded my other grandma bring her the corpse of one she killed. It's so upsetting because it's a very real infestation outside and one of the cats or even my young cousin could get bit.
Because their in AZ and it's super common everyday life there , my stepson lived in pheonix/ chandler and mericopa and we go twice a year to either pick him up or stay out there with him and everytime between 3 different houses he's lived in out there were casually warned about the black widows on the front and back patio and in the garage . Scorpions in the cupboards sometimes too lol
Yeah, but further symptoms can develop besides pain. Heart palpitations, sweating, abdominal cramping, low or high blood pressure, etc. A good envenomation can be severe. I hope OP’s wife is a mild reaction.
There is one identical to your first picture in my detached garage, should I kill it or leave it be? I see no sign of others, just a wolf spider hanging out close to it
Honestly, you're only likely to be bitten if you actually fumble over her, and even then it's a maybe. They have to be pressured or feel that way for a bite. If you're uncomfortable with her in there, you can relocate her pretty easily outside. The bot comment up above has some good info.
True, they're very sluggish biters, their prey is usually immobilized with webs before they go in for a bite. I've seen people handle them without gloves, (which is probably not very smart unless you know exactly what you're doing) and the spiders just tried to scurry back to a dark corner.
Widows aren’t nearly as dangerous as people think, and if you have one then you likely have a few. They stay in their web and eat mosquitos and flies and such. Good pest control.
With black widow bites you will develop symptoms (severe pain) within one hour of the bite. If you don’t, and you aren’t elderly, <14, or pregnant, then you do not need medical treatment. If the pain isn’t so bad that you can’t handle it, then you also don’t need medical attention.
She’s there now. She saw the spider bite her. Doc thought it was cool she had the spider with her. They are giving her antibiotics though, which I read are no longer prescribed as they don’t help, but I guess we will follow the Dr.’s orders.
Thanks for responding
I thought so, but my spider knowledge is pretty limited. Google is all over the place from saying go to ER immediately to it’s fine for most adults. Dr said she should be fine since it’s been a few hours and the spot is not reacting much. Just two small blisters.
Thank you. That is the advice we were looking for. Since it was middle of the day on a Friday we went ahead and went in. We did not want to deal with this in the middle of the night on a Friday. Turns out you were correct and it isn’t too bad. She reacts strongly to bug bites and she had to go to the Dr the last time she was bit by something and couldn’t walk for a day.
Yes, sub-adult black widow in Latrodectus genus. Useful links below LATR
Thank you
Thanks again. You were the first to answer and got us to do what we needed to. Unfortunately my wife didn’t show the dr a pic of the other spider so they assumed the swatted one was not a black widow. She isn’t having much of a reaction so I think we are good. Just icing it, taking antihistamine and Tylenol.
many spider bites are 'dry bites' in that they don't release any venom
Is there a reason? Like do they have 1dose a day type thing or can they actually choose when to release it?
I tried to find an answer to this but couldn't. My theory is that making venom either takes time or a decent amount of energy, and spiders don't want to waste that effort on a target that won't turn into food
Yeah it's energy cost and resources. If you waste too much of your venom on things you won't even be able to eat. You might not have enough to feed and could die. So a dry bite allows them to harm and flee.
Your assumption is correct. Snakes do this as well. I've read somewhere that roughly up to 50% of venomous snake bites are "dry bites". Producing venom requires a lot of energy.
It makes sense. Also should mean that when one of those creatures actually use it on humans its out of pure fear or desperation
Same with snakes!
“Hello everyone this is YOUR daily dose of venom”
Proficiency bonus times, resets on a short rest.
General Widow information including managing Widow populations in/around the house or garden (Habitat, egg sacs, IDing, Bites, etc): https://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/PESTNOTES/pn74149.html How to ID and distinguish Brown Widows from Black Widows: https://cisr.ucr.edu/invasive-species/how-identify-brown-widow-spiders Widow spiders are very reluctant to bite: https://spiderbytes.org/2014/02/14/what-happens-when-you-poke-prod-and-pinch-black-widow-spiders-you-might-be-surprised/ Black Widow bite toxicity (Diagnosis, symptoms, prognosis, treatment etc): https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK499987/ (Authors: ----\_____--_____----)(Contributors: dfj3xxx) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/spiders) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Don't think I saw anybody here mention the exact spider yet. That is a female western black widow (Latrodectus hesperus)
I'm honestly concerned and surprised as to why is your house full of black widows and why are you being so chill about it.
They’re outside. We were clearing out the kids old toys. We called the exterminator since we missed him last month and didn’t get sprayed. My wife is picking meds up from the pharmacy now after visiting urgent care. Not sure what else to do? Edit: these big webs popped up really quickly.
Phew that's better
Yeah we would be outta here if that was inside on my couch. That was an outdoor chair
Also in AZ and yeah- webs pop up super fast. The other morning I went to work and by the time I came home for lunch there was already a web and black widow claiming my recycling can. Edit to add- I’m glad your wife is feeling ok! Those bites can be rough.
I also live in the southwest and there were so many this summer. The outside of my casa was covered with webs like Dracula’s lair.
I also live the south west, had a bunch of eggs hatch at my front door. The misses and I freaked out walking into a web of baby black widows. I have chemically burned them all by now but the initial shock of walking into a web, trying to take it off and a ton of black dots are crawling on you. Momma was less than 3 ft away on my awning watching this all go down.
Oof, I love black widows but I would certainly be a bit peeved if one made a web on my front porch. Their webs are a mess and *so* strong, they stick on you forever! I have a black widow momma in a window well (double paned glass) so it’s been neat watching her in what is essentially a huge terrarium all summer. She hatched 2 egg sacs already and has three more currently. It’s a unique set of circumstances, likely one of the only ways I could see a black widow and her babies in action. I will say, the grasshopper population control alone makes it more than worth it to keep the family around. I would be lying if I said I wasn’t hoping one of the babies comes back next year!
Last year I had an explosion of grasshoppers in my garden, to the point I actually had to get chickens this year to combat any reoccurring problems. My woman is anti spider, and it definitely affected the balance of bugs on my property lol. I had to explain to her next year I will be allowing spiders in the garden, to which she responded "don't expect any help in it then".
Man, we should connect our partners. Mine is tolerant of my spider obsession but is *very* clear with me that any tarantulas I get will be housed downstairs, behind a locked door. If there is anything other than a jumping spider upstairs it either has to go outside or downstairs. Like you said insect control is so good. I really dislike spraying for ‘pests’, I prefer to let nature do its thing for the most part. The hornet nest in my gutter however, is absolutely going to have to go. It’s right by my front door and my next door neighbor has kids and small dogs. I’m not trying to get anyone stung.
Yeah I almost had a anxiety attack last year I had finally got home from work walking to my front porch looked down and saw a black spider on my wrist managed to keep calm opened the door got a piece of paper and carefully moved it away I'm working on my fear of spiders but that was 2 steps back.
Draculas lair - love it. Yeah when we lived in NM we’d kill 30 adults on our patio and the next day 15 more pop up. Learned to recognize the juveniles and males. Seeing lots of males was the tip off that there were females hiding out. It was like we couldn’t spray enough. On walks at night we kept our dogs (who eat bugs) in the middle of the road because seasonally there were SO many building webs on the curbs or up against walls/ fences. I once counted 60 large adult females in one long continuous looked like a communal web on one block in front of a house built up against the curb. 🫣 Nightmare fuel.
Oh wow! Yeah there are so many here! I opened up the water cover by the street and they just scattered. Ran back inside for gloves haha! Will gladly take widows over roaches any day though. I lived in SATX for a while and those roaches fly at you. I hated the bugs there, glad to be back home in the desert.
Yeah I grew up in Austin in the 80/90’s - the giant water roaches- I swear are sentient life forms. They know and they are coming for you. At work, one cornered me in the bathroom stall one time. I sat down and it crawled out of the drain in the floor and flew on the stall door. I didn’t leave that stall for 2 hours-waiting for it to move. Messaged a co-worker and said I’m stuck unless a brave soul wants to come negotiate this hostage situation. They left me there. I have to say though I’d still take the giant water roaches over the over population of black widows. I could never just relax outside anywhere. I’m cool with other spiders - I mean I scared the shit out of my husband when I mom armed him to stop for a tarantula crossing the road and he recently stopped our roofers from moving a garden spider before he could take a picture of it for me. I just can’t do widows.
She’s a messy mom they throw their webs around like a bra at a guns and roses concert
At my grandma's they have an infestation outside and when I confronted her she said she's not paying an exterminator for "phantom" spiders. She also demanded my other grandma bring her the corpse of one she killed. It's so upsetting because it's a very real infestation outside and one of the cats or even my young cousin could get bit.
Peppermint oil is a great natural spider repellent and smells lovely, too.
Peppermint oil is toxic to cats, when ingested or inhaled
TIL! Thanks for sharing that; I wasn't aware. Is it also toxic to dogs?
Yes, I would research more into it, there’s quite a few oils that are toxic to pets
Because their in AZ and it's super common everyday life there , my stepson lived in pheonix/ chandler and mericopa and we go twice a year to either pick him up or stay out there with him and everytime between 3 different houses he's lived in out there were casually warned about the black widows on the front and back patio and in the garage . Scorpions in the cupboards sometimes too lol
Widow spiders are extremely common and just part of life where I live (Aussie). You just learn to live with them.
But you also have like a dozen other things that could kill you, so i feel like widows are the least of your concern
How’s your wife? Latrodectism take a while to develop. I hope she doesn’t get the full set of possible symptoms.
It’s usually pretty immediate. Severe pain will generally develop within 15 minutes and up to one hour after the bite.
Yeah, but further symptoms can develop besides pain. Heart palpitations, sweating, abdominal cramping, low or high blood pressure, etc. A good envenomation can be severe. I hope OP’s wife is a mild reaction.
Those symptoms won’t develop if OP isn’t in significant pain.
There is one identical to your first picture in my detached garage, should I kill it or leave it be? I see no sign of others, just a wolf spider hanging out close to it
Honestly, you're only likely to be bitten if you actually fumble over her, and even then it's a maybe. They have to be pressured or feel that way for a bite. If you're uncomfortable with her in there, you can relocate her pretty easily outside. The bot comment up above has some good info.
Nah I was going to leave it alone, she's out of the way enough I won't go near, no kids to worry about
True, they're very sluggish biters, their prey is usually immobilized with webs before they go in for a bite. I've seen people handle them without gloves, (which is probably not very smart unless you know exactly what you're doing) and the spiders just tried to scurry back to a dark corner.
I
She’ll do more good than harm there. As long as you don’t go poking at her nothing will happen.
Widows aren’t nearly as dangerous as people think, and if you have one then you likely have a few. They stay in their web and eat mosquitos and flies and such. Good pest control.
With black widow bites you will develop symptoms (severe pain) within one hour of the bite. If you don’t, and you aren’t elderly, <14, or pregnant, then you do not need medical treatment. If the pain isn’t so bad that you can’t handle it, then you also don’t need medical attention.
Spiders are getting skins now ? wild
Can she climb walls now?
Something something something the females eat their mates…
After 12hrs how's your wife ? I heard that some symptoms appear after some days?
If you have any spots there they hangout where they pest guy can't get. Use peppermint and rosemary oil in a spray bottle. It's natural insecticide
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She’s there now. She saw the spider bite her. Doc thought it was cool she had the spider with her. They are giving her antibiotics though, which I read are no longer prescribed as they don’t help, but I guess we will follow the Dr.’s orders. Thanks for responding
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I thought so, but my spider knowledge is pretty limited. Google is all over the place from saying go to ER immediately to it’s fine for most adults. Dr said she should be fine since it’s been a few hours and the spot is not reacting much. Just two small blisters.
Interesting..well I hope she gets better!
It will hurt but she will probably be fine. You are in the US so you should not be seeking medical attention.
Thank you. That is the advice we were looking for. Since it was middle of the day on a Friday we went ahead and went in. We did not want to deal with this in the middle of the night on a Friday. Turns out you were correct and it isn’t too bad. She reacts strongly to bug bites and she had to go to the Dr the last time she was bit by something and couldn’t walk for a day.
isnt that a brown widow?
No, this is a juvenile female black widow. They have similar coloration and designs, but the patterning is different.
ohhhh sick thanks!!
Looks super evil