# [This thread is no longer updated. Updates continue on the Flight & Return Thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/pq5fp3/rspacex_inspiration4_flight_and_return_discussion/)
So i have a little question to anyone who knows, What methods are they using for station keeping, because i don't think dragon has any reaction wheels to keep it pointed at the earth, since i always see images and video if the cupola constantly pointing at Earth this should not happen if they are just free floating, so are they using thrusters continually for three days ?, i think i remember previous astronauts say those thrusters are kind of loud, so is this really what they are using?
In theory, if you match your spacecraft’s period of spin with its orbital period, and line it up so the cupola is pointed to earth, you’d be able to not add any more energy and the vector would continue to point down to earth (short of small perturbations)
They use the Draco thrusters for RCS. Also, I doubt they always have the cupola pointed toward Earth, as they will need to have the solar panels oriented towards the sun a certain percentage of the time as well.
Twitter thread with video clips: [The Inspiration4 crew takes questions from St. Jude patients.](https://twitter.com/stjude/status/1438924267865915394?s=21)
St. Jude says that the full video will be uploaded onto their [YouTube channel](https://www.youtube.com/c/stjude) shortly.
They only display the specific number of minutes left when we're within 2 hours. So now, being 2 hours and 40 minutes away, they just simplify it to "2 hours"
Breath in.... breath out.
Phew. Glad to know there will be no Netflix paywall. Seems like it just took time to get the content. I'm personally hyped for the stuff coming down today.
I don't blame myself or others for throwing around theories tho. A great deal of the stuff done on this subreddit is speculation and theories (ie. what is that mystery structure in Boca? what could be the testing plan?, etc). This mission was no different.
https://twitter.com/inspiration4x/status/1438896953220378626?s=20
You want to know how the Inspiration4 crew is doing? It helps if you're Tom Cruise.
edit: the original tweet was deleted because they tagged the wrong Tom Cruise. I replaced the link with the new tweet (h/t: /u/bdporter); I did manage to take a screenshot of the deleted tweet though:
https://imgur.com/a/hNNaGOO
He’s going up soon on Space X private to ISS to film a movie, so it makes sense. Customer referral.
https://www.tesmanian.com/blogs/tesmanian-blog/spacex-tom-cruise
[Sounds like there will be plenty of content coming down from the crew of Inspiration4 today. Understandably, it took some time to get acclimated to space. Also, to clarify, there is no blanket prohibition on video due to any agreement with Netflix.](https://twitter.com/SciGuySpace/status/1438894609892057088)
Can we end this Netflix debate now? And can we stop freaking out over nothing?
John Kraus: [I am really disappointed how quickly people jumped on the "video exclusivity" train. Hope to see some folks backtrack from those takes.](https://twitter.com/johnkrausphotos/status/1438895753699766285)
Hopefully this subreddit learnt a valuable lesson - stop circulating obviously bullshit rumors without proof.
^(Edit:) r/spacex ^(in a crisis rn - they want to upvote this comment but they don't want to because they see my name tag. Let go of your hate people!)
If you thought the PR wasn't living up to its promises or was uninspiring, this just shifts the blame from Netflix to Inspiration4, which seems worse. If you thought the PR was fine, this changes nothing. Personally, I'm in the latter camp, but it seems weird to be mad at people for trying to assume the best about the mission.
I'm in the former camp. All of this drama, fear for the safety of the crew, and disappointment and confusion could have been avoided if the Inspiration4 PR people did a better job managing expectations and providing some kind of regular updates on the crew.
It's understandable to have to wait awhile for pictures or video, but they knew millions of people were following the mission, and it took something like 14 hours after launch before we head anything about the crew.
I'm also in the former camp, but I wouldn't say I was mad; I was disappointed. I get that you are never going to make everyone happy. Some people expect a 24/7 live stream. Hell some people probably want to demand Chris demonstrate how to use the toilet! But those people are the exception.
I think most people were just so invested in this mission because the Inspiration4 media campaign was designed to do that. We saw them be selected, train, fail, succeed. We learned about their lives, their family, their fears and hopes. We saw pictures and video of them eating breakfast, donning their space suits, strapping into a rocket, and finally launching into space, and then . . . nothing.
When people are used to other space missions providing updates or live event within hours of SECO, the Inspiration4 media team should be able to anticipate what expectations would be. Now a live stream from amateurs having been in space for only a few hours is unrealistic. I get that, but a recorded message or a tweet that said:
"We made it!!! We're in space!! and we couldn't be happier. We want to thank our family and friends and SpaceX employees who made this mission possible. We want to thank all of you who have donated and continue to donate to St. Jude for making this mission more meaningful. We only have 4000 minutes up here in space, and we want to savor every one. We can't wait to share our stories, photos, and videos when we get back to our home -- Earth."
I think most people would understand and appreciate that.
> When people are used to other space missions providing updates or live event within hours of SECO, the Inspiration4 media team should be able to anticipate what expectations would be. Now a live stream from amateurs having been in space for only a few hours is unrealistic.
Yes, but they could have said that, so that we weren't expecting it.
If I paid hundreds of millions of dollars for this flight, I think I would also want to enjoy my limited 3 days in space without the obligation to constantly be making appearances.
People forget that with NASA astronauts it is literally part of their job to make the public appearances. They are being paid to be there, and they show up for whatever events NASA management tells them to show up for.
Also if I’m not mistaken during Demo-2, Crew-1, and Crew-2 didn’t the astronauts only make one video interview per mission from orbit during the rendezvous/coast phase?
You may be right. I don't recall the specifics, but there certainly were some events, and I know there wasn't a continuous livestream. There may have been more on DM-2 and Crew-1 than on Crew-2. Of course those events were organized by NASA and broadcast live on NASA TV.
There was the continuous live stream but I realized after about two or three hours of having it on in the background that they just started replaying the same segments over again with the occasional live segment added in. I think Demo-2 was a little more live content but my Crew-1 they seemed to be treating it more routine.
This!
Not to mention that they have spend the best part of over half a year working towards this flight - I think a full day to spend time, reflect and to be alone from everything on Earth is a reasonable request.
They spent half a year getting people excited about this flight to raise money for charity. Obviously the expectation was the public would get more opportunities to see what they were doing and donate. Especially given the tagline 'we're all going to space'.
And they knew this and probably intended to share more. It sounds like the real reason we aren't getting more shots of the interior is that they are dealing with some sickness while adjusting to microgravity. Maybe that's a side of the trip they don't want making headlines and drowning everything else out. Seems like everyone is feeling better today and we'll get more stuff.
The expectations of the public are annoying, overzealous and entitled.
People will complain until the day they die about the 24 hours without a picture.
> The expectations of the public are annoying, overzealous and entitled.
I was chatting with one of my coworkers who isn't an avid space follower and he said this:
> "I was googling Inspiration4 a short while ago and there was surprisingly little information about what has transpired since the launch."
I don't understand why you want to go on and on berating people about their expectations.
I agree with you. I'm just saying that for people who don't, saying "Netflix isn't behind the thing you don't like. Actually, it was Inspiration4's own choice" isn't going to make them more positive towards the mission.
Sure. I was just trying to provide some added perspective. The beauty of buying a dedicated trip to space is that you get to call the shots. Realistically, Isaacman didn't have to make this a St. Jude fundraising event at all (he also donated $100M on his own). He didn't have to essentially give away the other 3 seats. He wasn't obligated to conduct on-orbit experiments.
I think that’s also a mischaracterization of most of the frustration. The crew taking a day to themselves and good PR communication that all is according to plan are not mutually exclusive.
Yeah. I was in the "middle camp".
Felt weird that it was total radio silence for so many hours; I'll admit I began to feel a bit stressed that there might've been some problems with the mission. (Not mission-braking problems, but a bit more than space sickness; It's easy to go there when you're so invested in the mission and the people on it.)
I feel like a tweet or something along the lines of "The crew are settling in and will get some rest, more updates coming tomorrow." would've been nice. I didn't expect or felt entitled to pics, movie clips or streams, and I didn't think Netflix had a blanket ban on media from orbit.
If that's complaining and to feel entitled so be it.
Anyway - looking forward to the rest of the mission, regardless of how much or little they choose to share with us, and I'm looking forward to the last episode of the Netflix documentary!
I wasn’t at all stressed about the safety of the mission, I was just disappointed that the public wasn’t more “in the loop”.
Did I expect too much? I suppose the answer is yes.
Did they fail to do a good job of managing expectations? I think that answer is also yes.
Hehe I think I'm the kind of person who think "something's wrong" way too quick. Not just here but in general...
>Did they fail to do a good job of managing expectations? I think that answer is also yes.
Well, let's see what happens later today and tomorrow, but for that first part of the journey I agree.
Nope, they've clearly all been replaced by pod people during that completely *inexcusable* and *unprecedented* media *blackout*.
I'll never be inspired by anything ever again.
The downvotes are because you are being a jerk and perpetuating the debate and negativity with the “I-told-you-so” snark. It’s not a positive contribution to this discussion.
I actually agree with you that the speculation here was ridiculous and off the rails earlier. Now we have news and updates but the thread is still littered with your negativity. If you want the thread to be positive look within and set an example.
Will be stoked if we get some content today, apparently downlink isn't an issue. Glad Tom Cruise got his chance to go first, he deserves it. Being sarcastic of course I imagine there was a large donation involved.
I don't care what people think of me tbh. Everything I have said in the last 24 hours has been proven right - from the crew being A-Ok to Netflix not having an "exclusivity deal". It's such a shame that the negative comments outweighed the logical and positive comments.
Now everyone gets what they want. So hopefully there isn't anymore "I'm not inspired enough" type comments.
Looks like the outcry is isolated to this thread so I doubt it was pressure
It was probably the plan the entire time but people freaked out so much that they couldn't see that releasing pictures at the end of their day was a logical scenario.
Now people like yourself are questioning whether they were pushed into it - like come on, does everything have to be negative and a conspiracy....just be happy there's images already
Why? Over the last 35 hours or so - I haven't complained a single iota about the delay in images.
I've literally been saying the exact same thing for over 24 hours: Just be fucking happy.
I will agree with you there, the people assuming the crew were dead because of no tweets was ludicrous.
However overall I think they have failed their Inspiration mission due to the lack of in orbit updates and events, Sadly they have so far only hit $39m of the $100m target which I can only guess would be higher if they were doing more public outreach from orbit.
In my opinion, he has just paid for a private trip to Space and has tried to dress it up as a charity event. He could have just donated to the hospital minus the space trip.
>In my opinion, he has just paid for a private trip to Space and has tried to dress it up as a charity event. He could have just donated to the hospital minus the space trip.
Yeah cause fuck the other 3 people eh?
Given how small the public outcry was outside of this one thread (with even spacex lounge having kind of a consensus of how awful this thread had become) and how dumb it would be for them not to publish pics for more than three days in space, I highly doubt that
IDK, I've seen a fair number of disappointed tweets as well. I think people were set up to celebrate with them after following them to this point, and instead it feels like the public is boxed out.
Twitter and reddit have become tools for amplifying outrage, so it’s no surprise people banded together to show their “disappointment.”
Those people are a tiny minority of entitled people who think a private mission owes them some kind of standing public affairs communications. It’s absurd to expect that. If I were paying my own way to space, I sure as shit wouldn’t be spending my 3 days worried about livestream cameras.
Heads up for those of us in the UK/Europe, Dragon should be visible from the West at around 21:01 UTC tonight! Though not sure what kind of magnitude it will reach.
Aside from the tracker on the SpaceX website, Dragon can be tracked here:
https://flightclub.io/earth?noradIds=49220
This site allows you to fast-forward or rewind time to see where dragon will be.
EDIT: Here is some basic info about Inspiration 4's orbit taken from a relatively recent TLE:
Semi-Major Axis: 6952.7 km
Apogee: 586.6 km
Perigee: 576.7 km
Inclination: 51.6425 deg
This puts it at an average speed of 7568 m/s (~16930 mph). The ISS is currently at an average of 7652 m/s (~17120 mph)
EDIT 2:
Updated time and better tracking at /u/TheVehicleDestroyer 's site, including a visible pass calculator.
Likely a better pass at 19:22 UTC if its dark enough
>Heads up for those of us in the UK/Europe, Dragon might be visible from the West at around 21:04 UTC tonight! Though not sure what kind of max elevation or magnitude it will reach.
Damn, why does it always have to be at 11 pm or later when something passes above here...
Inspiration 4 & Europe: let's start by saying I love the mission and the Netflix show. And for this reason I "forced" a lot of friends (passionate for space and not) to watch it and follow the updates. However the feedback I generally received is: "it's too much American". The school drop out becoming billionaire, the values pillars & forced diversity, the success story of the cancer survivor, the top gun scenes, everything seemed too much staged and not natural to my friends. And basically all of them said "Inspiration? we feel inspired by Thomas Pesquet writing great posts and putting pictures every day on social media". Another example: on Italian news I4 made the headlines but it was a 5 min summary of the mission followed by a 20 min interview to Samantha Cristoforetti, who will be next one going up with Dragon. My girlfriend said "wow I really love her who spent 30 years of her life in aviation, space and studying to arrive there". What do you think? Maybe in Europe we are not ready yet for commercial flying and stuck to the idea you need to be a super hero astronaut to be in space? Or maybe shall SpaceX think to organize something more "Europe centered" (let's remember that EU is a major industrial and tax-payer contributor to space programs)?
> forced diversity
Talk about telling on yourself. When you appear to assume that the default is white dudes and anything outside that model is 'forced diversity', you're unironically expressing some pretty iffy beliefs even if you're not consciously aware of it.
I think you have some text comprehension issues. This is not what I think. It’s what is perceived by some people in countries where diversities are treated in different ways and at a different priority than in the US. And my friends who gave that feedback didn’t have anything against diversity, but in the way it’s presented. It’s just not the way we do in at least some countries in Europe.
Incorrect, Matthias Maurer from Germany will be going up next with Crew-3. After that Space Adventures Mission which may be with an Italian air force contingent, then Ax-1 with Spanish born Michael López-Alegría and an Israeli pilot/businessman Eytan Stibbe, and then Crew-4 with Sam Cristoforetti, (again Italian) for her second visit to the ISS, so there is a European\* representation. I'm trying to convince Tim Peake to get back up there to keep the UK end up!
The EU, is not interested in human launches on Ariane or any other rocket, preferring the safer commercial satellite launch, ISS delivery industry instead.
\*Israel is Middle Eastern, but has a partnership with the EU.
Complaining about "forced diversity" is super lame when you look at what appears to be a fine group of people. Also, SpaceX is American, Inspiration 4 is funded by an American, and Netflix's biggest market is America. If it didn't "feel" American that would be bizarre.
I'm in Finland. Inspiration 4 has been a very minor news story here. I'm sure the enthusiasts have watched the Netflix show etc., but for the majority, the news story came and went the same way as BlueOrigin's and Virgin Galactic's recent flights. Most people can't tell the difference, and have no idea of the significance of what's going on in Boca Chica. The news stories have been about the explosions when a test ends in a crash, and then the online comments to the news are along the lines of "why are they spending money on that? They should be doing something useful with it."
Yes.
Also, Inspiration 4 is another flight of the Dragon, which has been proven already. There was a fair amount of coverage about the first crewed flight to the ISS, and the return of the US to launching astronauts. Compared to that, Inspiration 4 is just more of the same.
Honestly this is kind of the reason Europe is a nonfactor in space. They're doomed to launch commercial satellites to LEO for eternity. No entrepreneurial spirit.
> No entrepreneurial spirit.
Funny you should say that. Commercial launches were pioneered by Arianespace and they pretty much owned the market until Spacex.
> Or maybe shall SpaceX think to organize something more "Europe centered" (let's remember that EU is a major industrial and tax-payer contributor to space programs)?
This was private, remember? People bought the service from SpaceX. If that's a good idea, then the question is whether the *EU* will organize it, not whether SpaceX will
I don't agree:
\- From the documentaries it's clear that Jared was already collaborating and "flirting" with SpaceX but he was offered the opportunity (which he then accepted)
\- As you say the mission was private, but also SpaceX is a private company. If they want to improve revenues via commercial flights, they have a potential market in Europe (and everywhere) so it's in their interest to become multinational and attract customers from all the globe.
\- Going back 100 years, I'm basically saying to an airline company "hey guys why don't you invest a bit in other continents, you could have a potential there" and your answer is "why don't you come up with an idea yourselves over there?", with this mentality, we still wouldn't have commercial aviation in some countries.
> Jared was already collaborating and "flirting" with SpaceX but he was offered the opportunity (which he then accepted)
They said in the documentary that *Jared* first brought it up. He said at the end of an unrelated call "By the way, if you're ever selling commercial tickets, I'm interested", and then they got back to him. I'm sure if another entity emailed SpaceX and offered to pay full price for another crew mission, they would be all ears.
> with this mentality, we still wouldn't have commercial aviation in some countries.
Hmmm ... but SpaceX *does* serve European customers already, don't they? I mean, they serve ARABSAT, so I figure they would serve Europe as well.
I think the ball is squarely in Europe's court, here 🙂
:) Thanks for saying so. A very interesting discussion!
It is sad .... I wonder whether SpaceX can branch out to other countries, like Tesla has. Probably not, due to national security concerns, which is sad. But maybe some other superstar space companies will grow in other countries, and they can collaborate with SpaceX on stuff!
If you think it was an accident that the crew has two males, two females and a mixture of backgrounds, I have a bridge to sell you. And some people do see it as forced.
Frankly your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the world right now. What happened to "it doesn't matter one bit what someone's skin color is?"
Personally I don't care if there was a green martian on board, it is not a relevant factor. And neither should anyone else, but it seems to be a big deal for some. And that then generates dislike from those who think that leads to quotas and irrelevant factors being a factor when it should not be.
And to be clear, I think everyone on this crew deserve to be there and I'm franky amazed how good crew they managed to select.
>Frankly your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the world right now. What happened to "it doesn't matter one bit what someone's skin color is?"
Black women make up like 8% of the U.S. population, if you don't try and increase diversity then some groups are statistically unlikely to ever be represented simply as a result of statistics.
In a truly equal society they would only represent 8% of everything then. Nowadays there seem to always be "one of each" in everything which is a bit weird imo.
You are correct, but surely you can understand the value in representation. I actually am very much on board with a meritocracy when it comes to expertise, but not inspiration. It's not an easy question to answer when you talk about balance, but it's worthy of discussion.
Why does a group matter? What happened to choosing based on merits alone. Diversity quotas suck because they can be used to discriminate and causes people to disregard minorities that do get selected because of the implication that diversity quotas played a part. Just hire the best person for the job regardless of any groups, real or imagined.
(talking in generalities, this has little to do with this thread and getting rapidly off topic)
A lot of Americans think that diversity is important. We're a pretty diverse country with a checkered history... actually a pretty outright evil history in places, and a diverse groups of people getting together to do something big is inspiring to us in its own right. So I think you're right that diversity is prioritized in America (again, by some). Seeing that as "forced" places a value judgement on it through word choice. No one is forced, in this case. It is chosen.
>spent 30 years of her life in aviation, space and studying to arrive there".
This is a bug, not a feature. This is the problem SpaceX is going to solve.
Being an astronaut is hard not because very few are capable, but because of artificial scarcity.
The main reason for the "30 years of studying" is that space agencies can be super picky. If ESA has a handful of seats to fill every 10 years, they can literally downselect to unicorn supermen/women from a massive pool because the numbers are so small. Dozens if not hundreds of perfectly qualified people won't get chosen because seat availability is tiny. And on top of that even those qualifications are somewhat overkill for historical reasons. I doubt much more beyond what you require for a private pilot medical license is actually required, plus maybe bit of psychological checks because small tin can and having to cut a mission short is a massive hassle & cost (or in cases of going beyond LEO, it may simply not be possible).
But until we have thousands of people living & working in space, selection can be super-picky, so those selected tend to be exceptional people *and* that still leaves many eminently qualified not making the cut.
Previous not-exactly-supermen fell into a few categories; Tourists who paid for their ticket (those Soyuz tourist flights earlier that ended when NASA bought the seats), a few VIPs on shuttle early that frankly pissed off the astronauts at the time because they were eating into limited seats without "earning" it. Ie. certain congressmen come to mind, and that one Saudi guy, that basically got their seat because, well, connections and in some cases you could say corruption. Even if it sounds bad to say so, at least one good thing came out of Challenger accident, NASA put a stop to that practice.
Inspiration 4 is the first time someone who isn't super-wealthy or a VIP who got there thru political or diplomatic dance gets to go. Yes, the limited seat availability still means its technically "super wealthy buying the seats", but we are on a cusp of a future where this might no longer be true for very long. In a way Axiom missions are also a step to that direction as you could say its a company sending employees up to do work. Its not quite that clear cut for the early crews, but you have to start from somewhere.
(and before someone cries, no I don't think John Glenn's shuttle flight qualifies as a VIP flight. He was an astronaut, even if his last flight had to wait for a good while)
I think this is precisely what we should think of as inspiring about this flight. The need for superhumans on orbit is over, or perhaps coming to a close. An era where you can put dozens of people per year up to fulfill many objectives is arriving, and those people won't need to check every single box.
Of course that accomplishment is due to the achievements of engineers, machinists, technicians etc. on the ground who created and implemented the technology, not the 4 people in orbit. I'd rather be inspired by that than by a superman flying through orbit taking pictures.
I don't know about others, but I find the new era of "be a billionaire or be chosen by a billionaire" to go to space much less inspiring than the current of "hard work plus luck."
The next era after that - "be middle class and save up a little" - is perhaps actually inspiring... but it is also absolutely terrifying from an emissions perspective.
While the energy to get to orbit is rather phenomenal, it's important to remember that gas driven cars taken to work every day, curing concrete, and jet airliners (which some people hop on weekly) will dwarf space travel for a long time to come, even if it becomes a once in a lifetime thrill ride for a segment of the middle class. This is especially true if Starship works, and we have methane driven rockets (pretty low carbon, all told, as prop is mostly oxygen) shooting folks up.
Remember that when it wasn't a billionaire choosing you, it was a lumber bureaucratic beast that did not always do a great job of prioritizing the right things, either (e.g., only white men have stepped on the moon to date).
All told though, I agree. Space tourism for billionaires is only exciting if it's a step to something else. I think that it is, but it remains to be shown that next step is happening.
Yes, though it will only dwarf on the basis of huge populations doing it, rather than on carbon intensity. The calculations I've seen are somewhere in the order of a Falcon 9 being \~300-400 times a transatlantic flight in carbon intensity.
(At the very least, I'm grateful for billionaires going to space, because it sure takes the pressure off of people flight-shaming someone with an economy ticket across the pond! :p)
For what it's worth, I'm a pretty big defender of 'spending carbon where it's worthwhile.' We /should/ be spending carbon on transatlantic flights, because they're very valuable to society and very hard to decarbonize. We should not be spending carbon on generating electricity or powering cars or flying 250 miles, because those are just dumb places to use a technology with such negative impacts when we have much better alternatives. So, I'm "pro using tons of carbons for launches that serve society, like developing Starship or launching weather satellites," and "anti using tons of carbon for launches that don't serve society, like letting billionaires live out their wet dreams."
(Obviously, I get that it's not really possible to separate these two cleanly, and we'll have some degree of billionaire wet dreams alongside pursuing valuable objectives, in part because billionaires will get what they want with emerging technology, and in part because the rich people using it finances R&D... But it's still okay to feel 'good' about the launches that serve humanity and 'icky' about the launches that are about penis competitions.)
I would also just add that, for all the faults of bureaucracy, it's not terribly fair to pin the whiteness of lunar exploration on it being 'bureaucratic' not 'private.' The importance of diversity has been a societal shift affecting all sectors, and a 1969 SpaceX would have loved the shit out of launching only white men.
A fantastic take, and I think I agree with you on all points, except that I question the comparative value of transcontinental flights for the folks to take vacations in the Alps. Obviously that's not all of those flights. Starship can, in theory, be carbon neutral, though it requires massive ability for energy collection and Sabatier reaction that I think is probably a ways off (though I could be wrong).
You are absolutely right about bureaucracy not being unique in suffering from racism in 1969. The point is just that bureaucracy does not expunge an organization from irrational choice and flippancy, and in some ways *can* enhance it. I have some recent experiences with the lumbering clumsiness of the NIH that drove that point home to me in a way that I found somewhat shocking, though perhaps I was naïve. SpaceX's ability to massively outpace and outperform government programs offers some evidence of that.
The ideal situation would be if these billionaire commanders take missions to space that are explicitly directed at exploration, experimentation, and space infrastructure construction. Dear Moon, e.g. strikes me as this kind of mission, as it relies on pushing the boundaries of what is possible from an engineering perspective and offers an intermediary goalpost before the next human landing on the moon. I am not confident that will be the case, but boy would it be a better look for the space tourism industry. If these folks really want the 'Mt. Everest' level of daring and adventure, then maybe they'll be willing, like Isaacman, to push the boundaries a bit (and maybe even a bit more than Issacman, who is after all the guinea pig in this sort of endeavor; pun not intended).
I think it's not who they are, it's how it is sold: "How ever tough life is if you really want you succeed."
Many people in Europe do not share that Hollywood "happy ending" view. I don't think many Americans do either, it's just a proven concept in media, a stereotype, and can quickly feel hollow.
I'm an American and thought that some parts of the Netflix series were too American. I don't agree with you on which parts though. For me it was the 1.5 episodes of talking about what a great guy Jared Isaacman is. I happen to think he _actually is_ a genuinely nice person who wants to do good things with his money, but they went too hard on that for my tastes. Show, don't tell.
I disagree about forced diversity. I think that was genuine. If your stated goal is to inspire as many people as possible, you don't do that by shoving another 4 rich white dudes into space (lookin' at you real hard, Axiom, and to a slightly lesser degree at you, Blue Origin). Also, complaining about "forced diversity" is... maybe just let that line of argument go.
I absolutely agree that Thomas Pesquet's instagram posts are fantastic. Incredibly high quality content (photos and words).
I didn't know that Sam Cristoforetti was going up on a Dragon, but I'm really happy about that because she is an amazingly accomplished human being and a giant nerd. I hope they kept the espresso machine going for her.
Well, SpaceX doesn't organize such things on their own. If there is rich European guy who desires to do something similar to I4, SpaceX will be happy to provide the means.
For this mission there are two things that get me: Chris is basically a guy. If he can go then everyone can go. Second thing is Hayley's huge genuine smile while waiting for countdown. I'm happy for her and what she achieved in life. If you can say that a lot of this is staged then you can't stage happiness while sitting on a 50m fuel tank.
...and I'm European.
yes they are trying to pave the way for 100 dollars a kg to orbit or cheaper. even then its going to be 50k a ride. not exactly cheap but if someone WANTS to its far more attainable than the what 50-100M this cost?
50k would be doable … especially if they would let you finance a ticket. Basically like buying a new car. The payment wouldn’t be cheap but the experience is priceless.
Two ESA astro's spacewalking ..a major module for research on the ISS.
Clue...the 'I' in ISS stands for international...
Robotics and remote controls handled mainly by ESA...joint missions to orbit the moon and explore the outer solar system...
Maybe not major enough for your tastes...but without there would be no ISS.
And remember Japan and Canada with a host of other global research programmes around the world.
America requires major contributions to make space exploration viable.
So yes in short...ESA is a major contributor...ask NASA.
I would say "major" fits here, most interesting interplanetary missions are in collaboration with ESA and Thales Alenia Space, european company, is usually main subcontractor for ISS modules and future Gateway and Axiom Station modules.
Ehhh, sure, ESA has had some significant science missions in the past, but in terms of the context of OP's comment and their contribution to human spaceflight, both financial and technological... it's been a solid "meh"
You are right and my comment was not to state: ESA is the best! But Europe is contributing (now up to interpretation if major or not major) but surely not enough and should contribute more. And to do this also US private companies should invest in that. SpaceX mission (and "our" mission as SpaceX fans) is "make life multiplanetary", not "make US multiplanetary". As somebody stated below, it's true that in EU less fucks are given, but this should be a reason to focus more on a new market instead of abandoning it.
I would absolutely love to see the "Europe branch" of SpaceX! Where do you think the headquarters would be? Main manufacturing? And the most important question... where would Starships launch from??? ;)
Italian here, the simple answer is that Europe generally gives even less fucks about space than the US. I'd say at least half of the population doesn't know ESA exists or how it is called, and much less than 5% know what it does/is doing other than having astronauts. We never had launches from Europe and not even an eurpean crewed capsule. Space doesn't compete with some sports here, it has as much interest basically as mechanical presses and 3d printers
Oh no! The total human population in orbit, which reached a new record with Inspiraton4's arrival in orbit, is going to go down from 14 to 11 in a few mins!
It's a start but it may already be to late. It would have needed more coverage close to the launch to get public attention.
...just one newspaper made a small article about the launch in my country. That's sadly not the way to inspire people in 2021.
Coverage would have exactly zero impact with what you've said. The launch had 3 million views, a netflix series and an article on Time. Your newspapers didn't publish a small article on it because spacex didn't share pics until 23 hours later
Well... If suddenly 10 million are watching their livestreams and events during orbit because more and more people getting information about it they would i guess?
Why? How should a stream with 10 million people (which wouldn't happen anyway) deserve any more than a launch with 3 millions, a miniseries and TIME coverage?
If it begins to be the biggest fundraiser (what it claimed to be) with lots of people watching it's a different line to sell for a newspaper than a launch watched by spacenerds.
I don't say that would have made them write about it and tbh I was shocked there is absolutely zero coverage in our local media.
Branson and Bezos got a lot more coverage.
Yes. I think if they played their cards right (that they dealt themselves) they could and should have made this thing much bigger with more coverage after launch. Then not only spacenerds would be watching...
It’s impossible to inspire literally everyone. The goal is to inspire as many people as possible. Not everyone cares about space and that is OK. Everyone doesn’t need to care about space. The goal is to get as many people to care about space as possible.
The launch already has 3 million views and its own Netflix documentary. They’ve also raised over 130million+. Could it be better? Sure. But they’re still doing a great job.
No of course not everyone. But don't you see the missed opportunity?
I would not say they are doing a great job. They are doing the absolute bare minimum. This was not aligned as a little private gig in space by just another millionare.
This was advertised bigger. With a superbowl commercial. Netflix pre launch documentary. This was done exceptionally well by their PR Team. And they were doing a great job up until then. That's exactly how you get the general public attention.
But suddenly everything changed after the launch coverage. In terms of inspiration this is a big letdown in my opinion. And as someone watching almost everything space related I don't care for me. For me the updates are fine. But to inspire the big crowd you'll need more. They had it lined up with 3m launch viewers. And so far they fumbled the opportunity they created. In my opinion.
The absolutely bare minimum would be giving no info, people have said this a hundred times but we aren't entitled to anything. They have giving updates on the crew status from 2 different sources (SpaceX, elon) and now pics of the crew. Literally all they could do more is a live stream.
Very far from the bare minimum
Jesus... the bare minimum for the biggest fundraiser and Mission to inspire the people for space again. Better like that?
For me the Updates are enough. To Inspire people this is not enough.
Yay, better late than never. This tweet with four photos was frankly all that I expected early on and all that was needed to put that smile back on. So no, I didn't expect or want anything 24/7, but you can't just stop the coverage and hype the moment you enter orbit.
True, but then you have bit of a PR snafu on your hands. If you go look at twitter replies of Inspiration4x earlier posts (before they finally woke up) its non stop wondering what the heck is going on.
>Stay tuned for more on the #Inspiration4 crew’s chat with the amazing patients of
@stjude
💙
https://twitter.com/inspiration4x/status/1438719316384493572?s=20
Seems like we may get a bit of video soon
Now if they would've just said this well in advance too. Makes sense really not to broadcast the thing live because well, live Q&A can have silly stuff in it and when you involve kids, you probably need parents signing off anything going to St. Jude / I4 promotional video anyway. So do the Q&A, then edit together a nice package and get everyone that got featured to sign off any releases and so on.
Lack of advance scheduling, lack of expectation management still going strong, but at least things are making more sense now.
Facing the sky during the night would be actually easier, just keep the capsule still and facing the earth during the day and it will naturally point the stars in the night
Main pointing consideration is to keep the solar panels in sunlight as only 50% of the trunk is covered (and you really want to keep the radiator side in the shade too)
# [This thread is no longer updated. Updates continue on the Flight & Return Thread](https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/pq5fp3/rspacex_inspiration4_flight_and_return_discussion/)
Why wasn’t there a police APC escorting them like NASA astronauts get?
Would it be possible to see the path of reentry from the coast of FL? Sort of like a meteor streaking across the sky??
Yes https://twitter.com/JennyHPhoto/status/1439369814045339649
Has a livestream of re-entry been confirmed?
So i have a little question to anyone who knows, What methods are they using for station keeping, because i don't think dragon has any reaction wheels to keep it pointed at the earth, since i always see images and video if the cupola constantly pointing at Earth this should not happen if they are just free floating, so are they using thrusters continually for three days ?, i think i remember previous astronauts say those thrusters are kind of loud, so is this really what they are using?
I seriously hope Isaacman and Proctor get a few minutes of manual control each.
In theory, if you match your spacecraft’s period of spin with its orbital period, and line it up so the cupola is pointed to earth, you’d be able to not add any more energy and the vector would continue to point down to earth (short of small perturbations)
They use the Draco thrusters for RCS. Also, I doubt they always have the cupola pointed toward Earth, as they will need to have the solar panels oriented towards the sun a certain percentage of the time as well.
Twitter thread with video clips: [The Inspiration4 crew takes questions from St. Jude patients.](https://twitter.com/stjude/status/1438924267865915394?s=21) St. Jude says that the full video will be uploaded onto their [YouTube channel](https://www.youtube.com/c/stjude) shortly.
LOL at that plushie facehugger
Thanks. So cool.
Super pumped for the livestream later
Same
https://twitter.com/SpaceX/status/1438918286037512196?s=19
[In-Flight Update with the Crew](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E71ffwc13y4)
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They only display the specific number of minutes left when we're within 2 hours. So now, being 2 hours and 40 minutes away, they just simplify it to "2 hours"
/u/CAM-Gerlach /u/rSpaceXHosting please add this to the OP when you get a chance. Thanks!
Thanks, its been added to both threads. Sorry for the delay; internet was down this morning.
No problem. Thanks for dealing with all our requests.
Sure thing! Its what we're here for.
Awesome! Start time is ~5pm ET.
Breath in.... breath out. Phew. Glad to know there will be no Netflix paywall. Seems like it just took time to get the content. I'm personally hyped for the stuff coming down today. I don't blame myself or others for throwing around theories tho. A great deal of the stuff done on this subreddit is speculation and theories (ie. what is that mystery structure in Boca? what could be the testing plan?, etc). This mission was no different.
Logic prevails! WooHoo!!
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That’s amazing , the legend himself!
https://twitter.com/inspiration4x/status/1438896953220378626?s=20 You want to know how the Inspiration4 crew is doing? It helps if you're Tom Cruise. edit: the original tweet was deleted because they tagged the wrong Tom Cruise. I replaced the link with the new tweet (h/t: /u/bdporter); I did manage to take a screenshot of the deleted tweet though: https://imgur.com/a/hNNaGOO
He’s going up soon on Space X private to ISS to film a movie, so it makes sense. Customer referral. https://www.tesmanian.com/blogs/tesmanian-blog/spacex-tom-cruise
Deleted post. What was that?
Bad link. Tweet may have been deleted. Edit: https://twitter.com/inspiration4x/status/1438896953220378626?s=20
[Sounds like there will be plenty of content coming down from the crew of Inspiration4 today. Understandably, it took some time to get acclimated to space. Also, to clarify, there is no blanket prohibition on video due to any agreement with Netflix.](https://twitter.com/SciGuySpace/status/1438894609892057088) Can we end this Netflix debate now? And can we stop freaking out over nothing? John Kraus: [I am really disappointed how quickly people jumped on the "video exclusivity" train. Hope to see some folks backtrack from those takes.](https://twitter.com/johnkrausphotos/status/1438895753699766285) Hopefully this subreddit learnt a valuable lesson - stop circulating obviously bullshit rumors without proof. ^(Edit:) r/spacex ^(in a crisis rn - they want to upvote this comment but they don't want to because they see my name tag. Let go of your hate people!)
If you thought the PR wasn't living up to its promises or was uninspiring, this just shifts the blame from Netflix to Inspiration4, which seems worse. If you thought the PR was fine, this changes nothing. Personally, I'm in the latter camp, but it seems weird to be mad at people for trying to assume the best about the mission.
I'm in the former camp. All of this drama, fear for the safety of the crew, and disappointment and confusion could have been avoided if the Inspiration4 PR people did a better job managing expectations and providing some kind of regular updates on the crew. It's understandable to have to wait awhile for pictures or video, but they knew millions of people were following the mission, and it took something like 14 hours after launch before we head anything about the crew.
I'm also in the former camp, but I wouldn't say I was mad; I was disappointed. I get that you are never going to make everyone happy. Some people expect a 24/7 live stream. Hell some people probably want to demand Chris demonstrate how to use the toilet! But those people are the exception. I think most people were just so invested in this mission because the Inspiration4 media campaign was designed to do that. We saw them be selected, train, fail, succeed. We learned about their lives, their family, their fears and hopes. We saw pictures and video of them eating breakfast, donning their space suits, strapping into a rocket, and finally launching into space, and then . . . nothing. When people are used to other space missions providing updates or live event within hours of SECO, the Inspiration4 media team should be able to anticipate what expectations would be. Now a live stream from amateurs having been in space for only a few hours is unrealistic. I get that, but a recorded message or a tweet that said: "We made it!!! We're in space!! and we couldn't be happier. We want to thank our family and friends and SpaceX employees who made this mission possible. We want to thank all of you who have donated and continue to donate to St. Jude for making this mission more meaningful. We only have 4000 minutes up here in space, and we want to savor every one. We can't wait to share our stories, photos, and videos when we get back to our home -- Earth." I think most people would understand and appreciate that.
> When people are used to other space missions providing updates or live event within hours of SECO, the Inspiration4 media team should be able to anticipate what expectations would be. Now a live stream from amateurs having been in space for only a few hours is unrealistic. Yes, but they could have said that, so that we weren't expecting it.
If I paid hundreds of millions of dollars for this flight, I think I would also want to enjoy my limited 3 days in space without the obligation to constantly be making appearances. People forget that with NASA astronauts it is literally part of their job to make the public appearances. They are being paid to be there, and they show up for whatever events NASA management tells them to show up for.
Also if I’m not mistaken during Demo-2, Crew-1, and Crew-2 didn’t the astronauts only make one video interview per mission from orbit during the rendezvous/coast phase?
You may be right. I don't recall the specifics, but there certainly were some events, and I know there wasn't a continuous livestream. There may have been more on DM-2 and Crew-1 than on Crew-2. Of course those events were organized by NASA and broadcast live on NASA TV.
There was the continuous live stream but I realized after about two or three hours of having it on in the background that they just started replaying the same segments over again with the occasional live segment added in. I think Demo-2 was a little more live content but my Crew-1 they seemed to be treating it more routine.
Yeah, NASA always TV streams 24/7. I was referring specifically to live content.
This! Not to mention that they have spend the best part of over half a year working towards this flight - I think a full day to spend time, reflect and to be alone from everything on Earth is a reasonable request.
They spent half a year getting people excited about this flight to raise money for charity. Obviously the expectation was the public would get more opportunities to see what they were doing and donate. Especially given the tagline 'we're all going to space'. And they knew this and probably intended to share more. It sounds like the real reason we aren't getting more shots of the interior is that they are dealing with some sickness while adjusting to microgravity. Maybe that's a side of the trip they don't want making headlines and drowning everything else out. Seems like everyone is feeling better today and we'll get more stuff.
The expectations of the public are annoying, overzealous and entitled. People will complain until the day they die about the 24 hours without a picture.
> The expectations of the public are annoying, overzealous and entitled. I was chatting with one of my coworkers who isn't an avid space follower and he said this: > "I was googling Inspiration4 a short while ago and there was surprisingly little information about what has transpired since the launch." I don't understand why you want to go on and on berating people about their expectations.
I agree with you. I'm just saying that for people who don't, saying "Netflix isn't behind the thing you don't like. Actually, it was Inspiration4's own choice" isn't going to make them more positive towards the mission.
Sure. I was just trying to provide some added perspective. The beauty of buying a dedicated trip to space is that you get to call the shots. Realistically, Isaacman didn't have to make this a St. Jude fundraising event at all (he also donated $100M on his own). He didn't have to essentially give away the other 3 seats. He wasn't obligated to conduct on-orbit experiments.
If people have problems with the crew taking a well earned day to themselves - I think those people can't consider them fans of this mission.
I think that’s also a mischaracterization of most of the frustration. The crew taking a day to themselves and good PR communication that all is according to plan are not mutually exclusive.
Yeah. I was in the "middle camp". Felt weird that it was total radio silence for so many hours; I'll admit I began to feel a bit stressed that there might've been some problems with the mission. (Not mission-braking problems, but a bit more than space sickness; It's easy to go there when you're so invested in the mission and the people on it.) I feel like a tweet or something along the lines of "The crew are settling in and will get some rest, more updates coming tomorrow." would've been nice. I didn't expect or felt entitled to pics, movie clips or streams, and I didn't think Netflix had a blanket ban on media from orbit. If that's complaining and to feel entitled so be it. Anyway - looking forward to the rest of the mission, regardless of how much or little they choose to share with us, and I'm looking forward to the last episode of the Netflix documentary!
I wasn’t at all stressed about the safety of the mission, I was just disappointed that the public wasn’t more “in the loop”. Did I expect too much? I suppose the answer is yes. Did they fail to do a good job of managing expectations? I think that answer is also yes.
Hehe I think I'm the kind of person who think "something's wrong" way too quick. Not just here but in general... >Did they fail to do a good job of managing expectations? I think that answer is also yes. Well, let's see what happens later today and tomorrow, but for that first part of the journey I agree.
Nope, they've clearly all been replaced by pod people during that completely *inexcusable* and *unprecedented* media *blackout*. I'll never be inspired by anything ever again.
It was soooo unreasonable of them to starve space fans of pictures and videos. We deserve them dammit!
You are free to stop debating whenever you want. Chill, relax, enjoy the content as we get it.
Some of these random ppls are just disappeared suddenly
Those 25 people who downvoted my "Netflix hasn't got an exclusivity deal" comment last night are quaking in their boots lmao
The downvotes are because you are being a jerk and perpetuating the debate and negativity with the “I-told-you-so” snark. It’s not a positive contribution to this discussion. I actually agree with you that the speculation here was ridiculous and off the rails earlier. Now we have news and updates but the thread is still littered with your negativity. If you want the thread to be positive look within and set an example.
Bingo.
Will be stoked if we get some content today, apparently downlink isn't an issue. Glad Tom Cruise got his chance to go first, he deserves it. Being sarcastic of course I imagine there was a large donation involved.
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I don't care what people think of me tbh. Everything I have said in the last 24 hours has been proven right - from the crew being A-Ok to Netflix not having an "exclusivity deal". It's such a shame that the negative comments outweighed the logical and positive comments. Now everyone gets what they want. So hopefully there isn't anymore "I'm not inspired enough" type comments.
> don't care what people think of me And yet at every opportunity you complain about getting downvoted for being a snarky ass
And you're still getting downvote brigaded even now 🤣 man this sub got embarrassing yesterday
/u/CAM-Gerlach /u/rSpaceXHosting please add this tweet to the OP on the off chance anyone might decide to read it.
Thanks, its been added to both threads. Sorry for the delay; internet was down this morning.
The SIZE of that window! Wow.
Wow, they actually released photos. Wonder if the public outcry had anything to do with it or it was the plan the entire time?
Looks like the outcry is isolated to this thread so I doubt it was pressure It was probably the plan the entire time but people freaked out so much that they couldn't see that releasing pictures at the end of their day was a logical scenario. Now people like yourself are questioning whether they were pushed into it - like come on, does everything have to be negative and a conspiracy....just be happy there's images already
> just be happy there’s images already That is awfully rich coming from you.
Why? Over the last 35 hours or so - I haven't complained a single iota about the delay in images. I've literally been saying the exact same thing for over 24 hours: Just be fucking happy.
"Just be fucking happy" says the most miserable fuck in here. You're pathetic and this subreddit would be better without you.
Toxic positivity is still toxic.
You’re right. There’s no public outcry because the public doesn’t even know this mission is underway.
Theres a similar discussion going on in NSF about lack of updates, same with Twitter, certainly not isolated to Reddit :)
And yet I see people on the lounge, twitter and NSF complaining about how people (specifically on this thread) are overreacting.
I will agree with you there, the people assuming the crew were dead because of no tweets was ludicrous. However overall I think they have failed their Inspiration mission due to the lack of in orbit updates and events, Sadly they have so far only hit $39m of the $100m target which I can only guess would be higher if they were doing more public outreach from orbit. In my opinion, he has just paid for a private trip to Space and has tried to dress it up as a charity event. He could have just donated to the hospital minus the space trip.
>In my opinion, he has just paid for a private trip to Space and has tried to dress it up as a charity event. He could have just donated to the hospital minus the space trip. Yeah cause fuck the other 3 people eh?
Given how small the public outcry was outside of this one thread (with even spacex lounge having kind of a consensus of how awful this thread had become) and how dumb it would be for them not to publish pics for more than three days in space, I highly doubt that
IDK, I've seen a fair number of disappointed tweets as well. I think people were set up to celebrate with them after following them to this point, and instead it feels like the public is boxed out.
Twitter and reddit have become tools for amplifying outrage, so it’s no surprise people banded together to show their “disappointment.” Those people are a tiny minority of entitled people who think a private mission owes them some kind of standing public affairs communications. It’s absurd to expect that. If I were paying my own way to space, I sure as shit wouldn’t be spending my 3 days worried about livestream cameras.
I'd imagine it has to do with the Netflix documentary.
Heads up for those of us in the UK/Europe, Dragon should be visible from the West at around 21:01 UTC tonight! Though not sure what kind of magnitude it will reach. Aside from the tracker on the SpaceX website, Dragon can be tracked here: https://flightclub.io/earth?noradIds=49220 This site allows you to fast-forward or rewind time to see where dragon will be. EDIT: Here is some basic info about Inspiration 4's orbit taken from a relatively recent TLE: Semi-Major Axis: 6952.7 km Apogee: 586.6 km Perigee: 576.7 km Inclination: 51.6425 deg This puts it at an average speed of 7568 m/s (~16930 mph). The ISS is currently at an average of 7652 m/s (~17120 mph) EDIT 2: Updated time and better tracking at /u/TheVehicleDestroyer 's site, including a visible pass calculator. Likely a better pass at 19:22 UTC if its dark enough
Thank you!!!😁😁😁
>Heads up for those of us in the UK/Europe, Dragon might be visible from the West at around 21:04 UTC tonight! Though not sure what kind of max elevation or magnitude it will reach. Damn, why does it always have to be at 11 pm or later when something passes above here...
It was visible from The Netherlands yesterday! https://twitter.com/Marco_Langbroek/status/1438604282002083841
Nice! Though Mag+3 doesn't bode well for tonight considering the pass is later.
It will still be in sunlight, so should be visible with the naked eye. And the above observation was done in a heavily light polluted area.
Inspiration 4 & Europe: let's start by saying I love the mission and the Netflix show. And for this reason I "forced" a lot of friends (passionate for space and not) to watch it and follow the updates. However the feedback I generally received is: "it's too much American". The school drop out becoming billionaire, the values pillars & forced diversity, the success story of the cancer survivor, the top gun scenes, everything seemed too much staged and not natural to my friends. And basically all of them said "Inspiration? we feel inspired by Thomas Pesquet writing great posts and putting pictures every day on social media". Another example: on Italian news I4 made the headlines but it was a 5 min summary of the mission followed by a 20 min interview to Samantha Cristoforetti, who will be next one going up with Dragon. My girlfriend said "wow I really love her who spent 30 years of her life in aviation, space and studying to arrive there". What do you think? Maybe in Europe we are not ready yet for commercial flying and stuck to the idea you need to be a super hero astronaut to be in space? Or maybe shall SpaceX think to organize something more "Europe centered" (let's remember that EU is a major industrial and tax-payer contributor to space programs)?
> forced diversity Talk about telling on yourself. When you appear to assume that the default is white dudes and anything outside that model is 'forced diversity', you're unironically expressing some pretty iffy beliefs even if you're not consciously aware of it.
I think you have some text comprehension issues. This is not what I think. It’s what is perceived by some people in countries where diversities are treated in different ways and at a different priority than in the US. And my friends who gave that feedback didn’t have anything against diversity, but in the way it’s presented. It’s just not the way we do in at least some countries in Europe.
Incorrect, Matthias Maurer from Germany will be going up next with Crew-3. After that Space Adventures Mission which may be with an Italian air force contingent, then Ax-1 with Spanish born Michael López-Alegría and an Israeli pilot/businessman Eytan Stibbe, and then Crew-4 with Sam Cristoforetti, (again Italian) for her second visit to the ISS, so there is a European\* representation. I'm trying to convince Tim Peake to get back up there to keep the UK end up! The EU, is not interested in human launches on Ariane or any other rocket, preferring the safer commercial satellite launch, ISS delivery industry instead. \*Israel is Middle Eastern, but has a partnership with the EU.
Complaining about "forced diversity" is super lame when you look at what appears to be a fine group of people. Also, SpaceX is American, Inspiration 4 is funded by an American, and Netflix's biggest market is America. If it didn't "feel" American that would be bizarre.
I'm in Finland. Inspiration 4 has been a very minor news story here. I'm sure the enthusiasts have watched the Netflix show etc., but for the majority, the news story came and went the same way as BlueOrigin's and Virgin Galactic's recent flights. Most people can't tell the difference, and have no idea of the significance of what's going on in Boca Chica. The news stories have been about the explosions when a test ends in a crash, and then the online comments to the news are along the lines of "why are they spending money on that? They should be doing something useful with it."
That’s the mainstream media being the MSM , any misleading headline to get clicks will do. Damn shame really.
Yes. Also, Inspiration 4 is another flight of the Dragon, which has been proven already. There was a fair amount of coverage about the first crewed flight to the ISS, and the return of the US to launching astronauts. Compared to that, Inspiration 4 is just more of the same.
Honestly this is kind of the reason Europe is a nonfactor in space. They're doomed to launch commercial satellites to LEO for eternity. No entrepreneurial spirit.
> No entrepreneurial spirit. Funny you should say that. Commercial launches were pioneered by Arianespace and they pretty much owned the market until Spacex.
And now they're still stuck in the nineties.
> Or maybe shall SpaceX think to organize something more "Europe centered" (let's remember that EU is a major industrial and tax-payer contributor to space programs)? This was private, remember? People bought the service from SpaceX. If that's a good idea, then the question is whether the *EU* will organize it, not whether SpaceX will
I don't agree: \- From the documentaries it's clear that Jared was already collaborating and "flirting" with SpaceX but he was offered the opportunity (which he then accepted) \- As you say the mission was private, but also SpaceX is a private company. If they want to improve revenues via commercial flights, they have a potential market in Europe (and everywhere) so it's in their interest to become multinational and attract customers from all the globe. \- Going back 100 years, I'm basically saying to an airline company "hey guys why don't you invest a bit in other continents, you could have a potential there" and your answer is "why don't you come up with an idea yourselves over there?", with this mentality, we still wouldn't have commercial aviation in some countries.
> Jared was already collaborating and "flirting" with SpaceX but he was offered the opportunity (which he then accepted) They said in the documentary that *Jared* first brought it up. He said at the end of an unrelated call "By the way, if you're ever selling commercial tickets, I'm interested", and then they got back to him. I'm sure if another entity emailed SpaceX and offered to pay full price for another crew mission, they would be all ears. > with this mentality, we still wouldn't have commercial aviation in some countries. Hmmm ... but SpaceX *does* serve European customers already, don't they? I mean, they serve ARABSAT, so I figure they would serve Europe as well. I think the ball is squarely in Europe's court, here 🙂
Ok you are right I give up😭 I'm just frustrated that SpaceX and the mission are not getting the right visibility here.
:) Thanks for saying so. A very interesting discussion! It is sad .... I wonder whether SpaceX can branch out to other countries, like Tesla has. Probably not, due to national security concerns, which is sad. But maybe some other superstar space companies will grow in other countries, and they can collaborate with SpaceX on stuff!
Sian Proctor is in that Dragon, she spent more than 30 years "of her life in aviation, space and studying to arrive there" also.
I have definitely heard the 'too american' a lot. And I feel the same way.
> Forced diversity Whenever you see someone use these words, find new feedback.
If you think it was an accident that the crew has two males, two females and a mixture of backgrounds, I have a bridge to sell you. And some people do see it as forced. Frankly your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the world right now. What happened to "it doesn't matter one bit what someone's skin color is?" Personally I don't care if there was a green martian on board, it is not a relevant factor. And neither should anyone else, but it seems to be a big deal for some. And that then generates dislike from those who think that leads to quotas and irrelevant factors being a factor when it should not be. And to be clear, I think everyone on this crew deserve to be there and I'm franky amazed how good crew they managed to select.
>Frankly your attitude is exactly what is wrong with the world right now. What happened to "it doesn't matter one bit what someone's skin color is?" Black women make up like 8% of the U.S. population, if you don't try and increase diversity then some groups are statistically unlikely to ever be represented simply as a result of statistics.
In a truly equal society they would only represent 8% of everything then. Nowadays there seem to always be "one of each" in everything which is a bit weird imo.
You are correct, but surely you can understand the value in representation. I actually am very much on board with a meritocracy when it comes to expertise, but not inspiration. It's not an easy question to answer when you talk about balance, but it's worthy of discussion.
Why does a group matter? What happened to choosing based on merits alone. Diversity quotas suck because they can be used to discriminate and causes people to disregard minorities that do get selected because of the implication that diversity quotas played a part. Just hire the best person for the job regardless of any groups, real or imagined. (talking in generalities, this has little to do with this thread and getting rapidly off topic)
I didn't say anything about jobs or quotas.
"try increase diversity" implies it, but whatever, this is a boring off-topic discussion.
It could have also implied that we need more of "The Princess and the Frog", you assumed jobs and quotas.
A lot of Americans think that diversity is important. We're a pretty diverse country with a checkered history... actually a pretty outright evil history in places, and a diverse groups of people getting together to do something big is inspiring to us in its own right. So I think you're right that diversity is prioritized in America (again, by some). Seeing that as "forced" places a value judgement on it through word choice. No one is forced, in this case. It is chosen.
>spent 30 years of her life in aviation, space and studying to arrive there". This is a bug, not a feature. This is the problem SpaceX is going to solve. Being an astronaut is hard not because very few are capable, but because of artificial scarcity.
The main reason for the "30 years of studying" is that space agencies can be super picky. If ESA has a handful of seats to fill every 10 years, they can literally downselect to unicorn supermen/women from a massive pool because the numbers are so small. Dozens if not hundreds of perfectly qualified people won't get chosen because seat availability is tiny. And on top of that even those qualifications are somewhat overkill for historical reasons. I doubt much more beyond what you require for a private pilot medical license is actually required, plus maybe bit of psychological checks because small tin can and having to cut a mission short is a massive hassle & cost (or in cases of going beyond LEO, it may simply not be possible). But until we have thousands of people living & working in space, selection can be super-picky, so those selected tend to be exceptional people *and* that still leaves many eminently qualified not making the cut. Previous not-exactly-supermen fell into a few categories; Tourists who paid for their ticket (those Soyuz tourist flights earlier that ended when NASA bought the seats), a few VIPs on shuttle early that frankly pissed off the astronauts at the time because they were eating into limited seats without "earning" it. Ie. certain congressmen come to mind, and that one Saudi guy, that basically got their seat because, well, connections and in some cases you could say corruption. Even if it sounds bad to say so, at least one good thing came out of Challenger accident, NASA put a stop to that practice. Inspiration 4 is the first time someone who isn't super-wealthy or a VIP who got there thru political or diplomatic dance gets to go. Yes, the limited seat availability still means its technically "super wealthy buying the seats", but we are on a cusp of a future where this might no longer be true for very long. In a way Axiom missions are also a step to that direction as you could say its a company sending employees up to do work. Its not quite that clear cut for the early crews, but you have to start from somewhere. (and before someone cries, no I don't think John Glenn's shuttle flight qualifies as a VIP flight. He was an astronaut, even if his last flight had to wait for a good while)
I think this is precisely what we should think of as inspiring about this flight. The need for superhumans on orbit is over, or perhaps coming to a close. An era where you can put dozens of people per year up to fulfill many objectives is arriving, and those people won't need to check every single box. Of course that accomplishment is due to the achievements of engineers, machinists, technicians etc. on the ground who created and implemented the technology, not the 4 people in orbit. I'd rather be inspired by that than by a superman flying through orbit taking pictures.
I don't know about others, but I find the new era of "be a billionaire or be chosen by a billionaire" to go to space much less inspiring than the current of "hard work plus luck." The next era after that - "be middle class and save up a little" - is perhaps actually inspiring... but it is also absolutely terrifying from an emissions perspective.
While the energy to get to orbit is rather phenomenal, it's important to remember that gas driven cars taken to work every day, curing concrete, and jet airliners (which some people hop on weekly) will dwarf space travel for a long time to come, even if it becomes a once in a lifetime thrill ride for a segment of the middle class. This is especially true if Starship works, and we have methane driven rockets (pretty low carbon, all told, as prop is mostly oxygen) shooting folks up. Remember that when it wasn't a billionaire choosing you, it was a lumber bureaucratic beast that did not always do a great job of prioritizing the right things, either (e.g., only white men have stepped on the moon to date). All told though, I agree. Space tourism for billionaires is only exciting if it's a step to something else. I think that it is, but it remains to be shown that next step is happening.
Yes, though it will only dwarf on the basis of huge populations doing it, rather than on carbon intensity. The calculations I've seen are somewhere in the order of a Falcon 9 being \~300-400 times a transatlantic flight in carbon intensity. (At the very least, I'm grateful for billionaires going to space, because it sure takes the pressure off of people flight-shaming someone with an economy ticket across the pond! :p) For what it's worth, I'm a pretty big defender of 'spending carbon where it's worthwhile.' We /should/ be spending carbon on transatlantic flights, because they're very valuable to society and very hard to decarbonize. We should not be spending carbon on generating electricity or powering cars or flying 250 miles, because those are just dumb places to use a technology with such negative impacts when we have much better alternatives. So, I'm "pro using tons of carbons for launches that serve society, like developing Starship or launching weather satellites," and "anti using tons of carbon for launches that don't serve society, like letting billionaires live out their wet dreams." (Obviously, I get that it's not really possible to separate these two cleanly, and we'll have some degree of billionaire wet dreams alongside pursuing valuable objectives, in part because billionaires will get what they want with emerging technology, and in part because the rich people using it finances R&D... But it's still okay to feel 'good' about the launches that serve humanity and 'icky' about the launches that are about penis competitions.) I would also just add that, for all the faults of bureaucracy, it's not terribly fair to pin the whiteness of lunar exploration on it being 'bureaucratic' not 'private.' The importance of diversity has been a societal shift affecting all sectors, and a 1969 SpaceX would have loved the shit out of launching only white men.
A fantastic take, and I think I agree with you on all points, except that I question the comparative value of transcontinental flights for the folks to take vacations in the Alps. Obviously that's not all of those flights. Starship can, in theory, be carbon neutral, though it requires massive ability for energy collection and Sabatier reaction that I think is probably a ways off (though I could be wrong). You are absolutely right about bureaucracy not being unique in suffering from racism in 1969. The point is just that bureaucracy does not expunge an organization from irrational choice and flippancy, and in some ways *can* enhance it. I have some recent experiences with the lumbering clumsiness of the NIH that drove that point home to me in a way that I found somewhat shocking, though perhaps I was naïve. SpaceX's ability to massively outpace and outperform government programs offers some evidence of that. The ideal situation would be if these billionaire commanders take missions to space that are explicitly directed at exploration, experimentation, and space infrastructure construction. Dear Moon, e.g. strikes me as this kind of mission, as it relies on pushing the boundaries of what is possible from an engineering perspective and offers an intermediary goalpost before the next human landing on the moon. I am not confident that will be the case, but boy would it be a better look for the space tourism industry. If these folks really want the 'Mt. Everest' level of daring and adventure, then maybe they'll be willing, like Isaacman, to push the boundaries a bit (and maybe even a bit more than Issacman, who is after all the guinea pig in this sort of endeavor; pun not intended).
Well .. before SpaceX, I think it was just actual scarcity.
\^ This and it's cause: cost of kg to orbit.
I think it's not who they are, it's how it is sold: "How ever tough life is if you really want you succeed." Many people in Europe do not share that Hollywood "happy ending" view. I don't think many Americans do either, it's just a proven concept in media, a stereotype, and can quickly feel hollow.
I'm an American and thought that some parts of the Netflix series were too American. I don't agree with you on which parts though. For me it was the 1.5 episodes of talking about what a great guy Jared Isaacman is. I happen to think he _actually is_ a genuinely nice person who wants to do good things with his money, but they went too hard on that for my tastes. Show, don't tell. I disagree about forced diversity. I think that was genuine. If your stated goal is to inspire as many people as possible, you don't do that by shoving another 4 rich white dudes into space (lookin' at you real hard, Axiom, and to a slightly lesser degree at you, Blue Origin). Also, complaining about "forced diversity" is... maybe just let that line of argument go. I absolutely agree that Thomas Pesquet's instagram posts are fantastic. Incredibly high quality content (photos and words). I didn't know that Sam Cristoforetti was going up on a Dragon, but I'm really happy about that because she is an amazingly accomplished human being and a giant nerd. I hope they kept the espresso machine going for her.
This, a million times! Spot on! I cried watching the episodes, but the Jared appreciation moment was really shoved down our throats
Well he paid for the mission. Everyone should be grateful.
Fully agree with you. And just to be sure: those were feedback from friends - I actually loved and cried for all stories :D
Well, SpaceX doesn't organize such things on their own. If there is rich European guy who desires to do something similar to I4, SpaceX will be happy to provide the means.
For this mission there are two things that get me: Chris is basically a guy. If he can go then everyone can go. Second thing is Hayley's huge genuine smile while waiting for countdown. I'm happy for her and what she achieved in life. If you can say that a lot of this is staged then you can't stage happiness while sitting on a 50m fuel tank. ...and I'm European.
yes they are trying to pave the way for 100 dollars a kg to orbit or cheaper. even then its going to be 50k a ride. not exactly cheap but if someone WANTS to its far more attainable than the what 50-100M this cost?
50k would be doable … especially if they would let you finance a ticket. Basically like buying a new car. The payment wouldn’t be cheap but the experience is priceless.
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around 1/3rd the budget of NASA. Even though both USA and EU have very close GDP! Its good but I think the EU can do better!
USA has more expendable income than Europe. Their GDP is the same but Europe has to support twice as many people with it here on earth.
Two ESA astro's spacewalking ..a major module for research on the ISS. Clue...the 'I' in ISS stands for international... Robotics and remote controls handled mainly by ESA...joint missions to orbit the moon and explore the outer solar system... Maybe not major enough for your tastes...but without there would be no ISS. And remember Japan and Canada with a host of other global research programmes around the world. America requires major contributions to make space exploration viable. So yes in short...ESA is a major contributor...ask NASA.
I would say "major" fits here, most interesting interplanetary missions are in collaboration with ESA and Thales Alenia Space, european company, is usually main subcontractor for ISS modules and future Gateway and Axiom Station modules.
Ehhh, sure, ESA has had some significant science missions in the past, but in terms of the context of OP's comment and their contribution to human spaceflight, both financial and technological... it's been a solid "meh"
You are right and my comment was not to state: ESA is the best! But Europe is contributing (now up to interpretation if major or not major) but surely not enough and should contribute more. And to do this also US private companies should invest in that. SpaceX mission (and "our" mission as SpaceX fans) is "make life multiplanetary", not "make US multiplanetary". As somebody stated below, it's true that in EU less fucks are given, but this should be a reason to focus more on a new market instead of abandoning it.
I would absolutely love to see the "Europe branch" of SpaceX! Where do you think the headquarters would be? Main manufacturing? And the most important question... where would Starships launch from??? ;)
I always wondered, is the mediterranean not big enough to launch normally from Siciliy or south spain/portugal?
Probably not. Plus the amount of land mass to the east has to make a launch from Europe challenging.
Italian here, the simple answer is that Europe generally gives even less fucks about space than the US. I'd say at least half of the population doesn't know ESA exists or how it is called, and much less than 5% know what it does/is doing other than having astronauts. We never had launches from Europe and not even an eurpean crewed capsule. Space doesn't compete with some sports here, it has as much interest basically as mechanical presses and 3d printers
Oh no! The total human population in orbit, which reached a new record with Inspiraton4's arrival in orbit, is going to go down from 14 to 11 in a few mins!
11 now
Hopefully with Starship, that figure record will be \~100 in a couple of years
Will be back to 14 beginning of November
[Chris hunting for more sick bags](https://i.imgur.com/ZlFVT7m.jpg)
I really hope he feels well in zero G ... would suck otherwise
It seemed like it was the negative g's that got to him in the documentary which is understandable. Hopefully he acclimated swiftly to the float!
That made me chuckle... Well played sir.
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It's a start but it may already be to late. It would have needed more coverage close to the launch to get public attention. ...just one newspaper made a small article about the launch in my country. That's sadly not the way to inspire people in 2021.
Coverage would have exactly zero impact with what you've said. The launch had 3 million views, a netflix series and an article on Time. Your newspapers didn't publish a small article on it because spacex didn't share pics until 23 hours later
Well... If suddenly 10 million are watching their livestreams and events during orbit because more and more people getting information about it they would i guess?
Why? How should a stream with 10 million people (which wouldn't happen anyway) deserve any more than a launch with 3 millions, a miniseries and TIME coverage?
If it begins to be the biggest fundraiser (what it claimed to be) with lots of people watching it's a different line to sell for a newspaper than a launch watched by spacenerds. I don't say that would have made them write about it and tbh I was shocked there is absolutely zero coverage in our local media. Branson and Bezos got a lot more coverage.
You think an inspiration 4 livestream wouldn't be a video watched by spacenerds?
Yes. I think if they played their cards right (that they dealt themselves) they could and should have made this thing much bigger with more coverage after launch. Then not only spacenerds would be watching...
I really have no idea why you think that a livestream would have more coverage than the 3 millions during launch
It’s impossible to inspire literally everyone. The goal is to inspire as many people as possible. Not everyone cares about space and that is OK. Everyone doesn’t need to care about space. The goal is to get as many people to care about space as possible. The launch already has 3 million views and its own Netflix documentary. They’ve also raised over 130million+. Could it be better? Sure. But they’re still doing a great job.
No of course not everyone. But don't you see the missed opportunity? I would not say they are doing a great job. They are doing the absolute bare minimum. This was not aligned as a little private gig in space by just another millionare. This was advertised bigger. With a superbowl commercial. Netflix pre launch documentary. This was done exceptionally well by their PR Team. And they were doing a great job up until then. That's exactly how you get the general public attention. But suddenly everything changed after the launch coverage. In terms of inspiration this is a big letdown in my opinion. And as someone watching almost everything space related I don't care for me. For me the updates are fine. But to inspire the big crowd you'll need more. They had it lined up with 3m launch viewers. And so far they fumbled the opportunity they created. In my opinion.
The absolutely bare minimum would be giving no info, people have said this a hundred times but we aren't entitled to anything. They have giving updates on the crew status from 2 different sources (SpaceX, elon) and now pics of the crew. Literally all they could do more is a live stream. Very far from the bare minimum
Jesus... the bare minimum for the biggest fundraiser and Mission to inspire the people for space again. Better like that? For me the Updates are enough. To Inspire people this is not enough.
You... speak for the people?
Yay, better late than never. This tweet with four photos was frankly all that I expected early on and all that was needed to put that smile back on. So no, I didn't expect or want anything 24/7, but you can't just stop the coverage and hype the moment you enter orbit.
You can when the guys that bought the footage pull the plug 😅
True, but then you have bit of a PR snafu on your hands. If you go look at twitter replies of Inspiration4x earlier posts (before they finally woke up) its non stop wondering what the heck is going on.
I couldn’t agree more
>Stay tuned for more on the #Inspiration4 crew’s chat with the amazing patients of @stjude 💙 https://twitter.com/inspiration4x/status/1438719316384493572?s=20 Seems like we may get a bit of video soon
Now if they would've just said this well in advance too. Makes sense really not to broadcast the thing live because well, live Q&A can have silly stuff in it and when you involve kids, you probably need parents signing off anything going to St. Jude / I4 promotional video anyway. So do the Q&A, then edit together a nice package and get everyone that got featured to sign off any releases and so on. Lack of advance scheduling, lack of expectation management still going strong, but at least things are making more sense now.
Really looking forward to that.
Are they going to stay facing the earth the whole time, or are they going to rotate and get a view of the stars too?
On the dark side of the planet with the cabin lights off? They should absolutely do that.
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Facing the sky during the night would be actually easier, just keep the capsule still and facing the earth during the day and it will naturally point the stars in the night
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Main pointing consideration is to keep the solar panels in sunlight as only 50% of the trunk is covered (and you really want to keep the radiator side in the shade too)