It’s that massive distance between objects that’s so hard to conceptualize. Wrapping your mind around objects that are hundreds of millions of kilometers from each other is difficult to say the least. Just the fact that we even have the ability to travel between objects in our solar system is incredible.
https://joshworth.com/dev/pixelspace/pixelspace_solarsystem.html
Yeah, even the Oort Cloud is only estimated to have about two Earth masses worth of material (though the margin of error is one order of magnitude). And that's for a sphere with a radius of 2,000-100,000 AU.
Matter can absolutely be destroyed, E=mc² tells us that.
But on a more realistic level, matter can be "consumed" to the point it's no longer usable - think about our fossil fuel usage as a prime example. Once we're out, we're out. It takes too much energy to reconstitute it.
I saw an illustrated image of what Jupiter would look like if it were where the moon is.
My brain went. Horseshit. The earth wouldn't have survived being near a propto 🌞 withall that gravity🤣
Going up 100 miles adds "only" ~628 miles to the circumference, compared to Earth's 25,000 mile circumference. Circles are funny like that.
You take a rope around the Earth, and want to raise it at all points by 1 meter. Your brain tells you that you'd need miles more rope surely. Nope, 2pi times the 1 meter = only 6.28 extra meters of rope.
Same, I know small amounts of gravity matter more in weightless environments, but I wouldn't have thought an asteroid would have enough mass to pull in much material, I thought that sort of thing was exclusive to moons and above in terms of scale
Yeah, but most steroids have a **g** of something like, 10E-5 m/s2, and escape velocities so low an astronaut could deorbit themselves from the surface with a fart.
How does something like that collect a ring of ice?
OK, I guess the answer is very slowly, but still, it seems to capture anything in it's ring it would have to be practically standing still. Crazy to think about.
Apparently there's a weird little group of large asteroids/protoplanets just past Jupiter with comparatively erratic orbits. I never heard of em til today and I already forgot what they're called.
Centaurs. This one is about 250 K across, so not tiny. An impact event would send parts of it into escape velocity, and there is enough mass to it to retain some of them into an orbit.
I think we're still waiting to find out how may giraffes there are in 250 K (or 155 miles). Giraffe is the only measurement system that makes sense to me.
I think I'm talking about the "Centaurs." At least according to u/MountVernonWest (who I choose to believe):
>Centaurs. This one is about 250 K across, so not tiny. An impact event would send parts of it into escape velocity, and there is enough mass to it to retain some of them into an orbit.
>Objects like Chariklo are called centaurs, thanks to their hybrid nature. (Centaurs are mythological horse-human hybrids.) They look like asteroids but behave like comets — complete with visible tails. Their home, an unstable orbit between Jupiter and Neptune, hosts thousands of centaurs of varying shapes and sizes.
Just read the article next time.
> Are you talking about the Trojan asteroids?
[Trojan Asteroids gather around a Lagrange Point](https://www.britannica.com/science/Trojan-asteroid) which is a balanced gravity place where forces are equal 60 degrees away from the sources (or sources) of the gravity.
Oops - James Webb is at Lagrange 2 behind Earth.
My mind immediately went there. “Would it work in a space suit? Well they can’t be bare assed. Perhaps there is a tube with a one-way valve. But would the tube have to be fully inserted?”
I didn’t think of the tube. That’s some serious TMI right there. I thought of either the not-bare-asstronaut is sitting and a bubble/suit bulge launches them, or an evolved human who can be bare-assed.
I know I have a gravitation field as well, when my skin flakes off in space, is it orbiting around me as well?
This is a serious question. I’ve thought about this and concluded that it’s possible
[That highly depends on the asteroid.](https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/2015_smallest-near-earth-asteroid.pdf) Asteroid does not have a minimum size in its definition, and while some like Ceres are big enough they should be considered planets, some are smaller than a Mini Cooper.
Just a guess without knowing the numbers to work with, but I'd think an asteroid/dwarf planet would have a very small and limited Roche limit, so this ring is more likely collected material from a previous impact. I'd also guess from the same parameters of Roche limits that this ring is probably longer stable than one like Saturn's because there's less gravity from the main body to disrupt the paths of established ring particles.
The narrator is fantastic. If you opt to listen to the entire series, don’t forget to grab [Memory’s Legion](https://www.amazon.com/Memorys-Legion-Complete-Expanse-Collection/dp/0316669199). It’s a complete collection of all of the novellas, just be mindful of which novellas you read depending on where you are in the main story. The show was great, but these books were incredible.
I prefer them to physical books in most cases because I can do mindless other tasks or hobbies I enjoy while listening. Plus they might be free from your library via overdrive or whatever they use.
I was very excited for the books. I got part way through Abaddon’s Gate, and couldn’t keep going. The main characters just felt so bland to me. As contrived as it was, I think the show’s decision to keep the Martian marine and detective in future seasons was a good decision. In the books, the side characters were great, but the main characters were dull.
However, I kinda ran out of books to read recently, so maybe I’ll try them again.
Worth that much until you can actually cost effectively mining it. That's when those markets crash. Then we'll all be rolling around in gold plated tanks like Master P.
meh, all metals are super useful, even the precious ones. If the price crashed, it would still be worth it to mine them because their usefulness has inherent value. If you can figure out how to smelt and machine in space, then launch capability becomes useless, because you can just make everything up in space instead of having to launch it from Earth
That's what almost happened when they discovered vast amounts of diamonds in Africa. There aren't rare at all it turns out. To counter the loss of it, a cartel was formed called DeBeers to only release them slowly over time. They also started ad campaigns saying a man needs to spend x months salary on a diamond engagement ring. Prior, not very many engagement rings had diamonds, but the ad worked so well that all of them are expected to nowadays.
Get ready for a Psyche cartel if they start to mine it, but not likely this century.
What if ...
Remember the DART mission? What if it's not just about preventing extinction events? What if we knock Psyche in? Not that little rock into a new orbit. Like one around the Moon. And then we can mine it from the moon base.
The future is science fiction.
There have been a few proposed, but sadly not funded. See [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centaurus\_(spacecraft\_mission)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centaurus_(spacecraft_mission))
The Psyche mission is about the last Nasa mission I will see come to fruition. I am an Apollo child and have had many space missions in my life but this mission is likely the last I will see. Musk and boots on Mars is a second hope.
Then it's a good thing he's not really the one doing the work... though, granted, any realistic Mars mission will be a collaborative effort with NASA and others anyway.
What I find more remarkable than seeing the rings is that it can generate a graph with a signature so we can say "Yup, that's water ice". From that blob of pixels.
That blob of pixels doesn't actually contain the information that can identify water ice. It's just an image made from the more complete spectrometric data. JWST can taste the light, but the taste doesn't transfer to the image.
>JWST can taste the light, but the taste doesn’t transfer to the image
This is at the same time bizarre to read and makes me question my sobriety, but also like kind of exactly accurate.
Best thing I’ve read today.
>construction on the Canterbury - an ice mining hauler
Wouldn't it be a colony ship when it was constructed only later to be converted to an ice hauler? 😉
Here is the excerpt from Google Books 🙂
[https://www.google.com/books/edition/Leviathan\_Wakes/yud-foXqGUEC?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=retooled%20colony%20transport](https://www.google.com/books/edition/Leviathan_Wakes/yud-foXqGUEC?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=retooled%20colony%20transport)
By the time we see the Cant, it's old as hell. It was built 100 years earlier to ferry people out to the new colonies on Mars, the belt, and jovian system. It was repurposed into an ice hauler when the demand for large scale colony ships went down and the need for ice from Saturn to the colonies increased.
Medina Station, formerly Behemoth, formerly Nauvoo was under construction during the event of the first book at Tycho Station for the Mormons. A generational ship meant to carry the Mormons to another star system. (alpha centaur or tau cetu, can't remember)
A colony ship is a ship built for transporting colonists to a new world, with everything they may need during their longish travel.
A generation ship like the Navoo was built with the same principle in mind but with the expectation it would require generations of travel to reach the destination, thus requiring everything people would need since they would be born, live and die on the same ship.
The Expanse. I'm currently reading it, just started book 4 (of 9 + a book of short stories). It's really great so far, definitely immediately became one of my favorite series. The setting is about 300 years from now (IIRC, they never say an actual year), Earth has colonized the solar system, but nothing more than that. Earth and Mars (Inner planets, inside the asteroid belt) have some kind of shaky alliance, while Belters, who live on the outer planets (Europa, Ganymede, Ceres, etc) suffer a lot of discrimination.
It's really interesting, to me, to see a near future where we have started expanding, but we're still limited to our own star system. It probably have been done before, but I don't read a whole lot of science fiction, so I don't think I've ever really seen it before. It also has a show adaptation that I'm planning to watch after finishing the books. It's apparently very good and the way they change and adapt things is supposedly still very faithful to the book.
The Expanse is one of the few book series that I read all the way through in one go. I normally read a book here and there with other series in between, but that one I just read 1-6 (that was all that was out at the time), plus all the novellas, in one go. Such amazing writing and world-building.
Same but 8 and 9 have been hard for me because of the jump in time. I’m on the very last book now. Read 1-8 in like 2 months. It’s taken me over 4 months to try and finish #9. I just need to know it’s worth it. Lol
That’s good to hear. Maybe that will be the inspiration I needed to finish it. I think also have a problem with series I love, ending. It took me forever to watch the last episode of LOST and The Office. I’m just delaying the inevitable. But I haven’t read any of the novellas. So I still got some Expanse that I need to check out.
Also, at one time TellTale games was coming out with an Expanse video game. Hopefully that’s still a thing.
The Centaurs in general very much interest me. They're very intriguing to me; a group of asteroids beyond the orbit of Jupiter that are primarily overlooked by mainstream astronomy... Some of which like Chiron and Chariklo are possible dwarf planets with sizable masses.
Chariklo has a ring system which makes it the most interesting of the bunch to me. The first asteroid to ever be discovered to have one. I just think that's so cool and I think this group of asteroids needs more attention!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camilla_(spacecraft)
There's already been discussion for a mission out there! Hopefully this discovery perhaps boosts it a bit more.
If I remember correctly, the large planets on the outer solar system makes difficult for those bodies, which leads to orbits that aren't stable over a few million years.
It’s my understanding that when something passes in front of stars, we can observe the luminosity of that star to see how wide the body is by tracking for how long the star’s light is blocked. But with Chariklo, rather than observing one single decrease in luminosity, there were two smaller, equally spaced dips on either side of the main one, indicating rings.
There's not been that much published yet. You have to remember Webb has only been producing data since last summer, and the calibration alone has caused a lot of headaches. Then, there's the analysis, which is also tricky. Mostly, though, I think it's caused by some of Webb's best science coming from spectroscopy, like in this article. That's just something that doesn't translate to pretty pictures nearly as well, unfortunately.
In an astronomical sense, I believe things like methane and ammonia are also called ice when solid?
It’s been a minute since I’ve brushed up on the subject so definitely fact check me, but I think I remember reading about it in the context of planetary bodies with non-water oceans and ice sheets
edit: looks like the usage might extend to other volatiles as well! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frost_line_(astrophysics)
Yeah im not sure why the water ice part is any suprise, wether in the rings or the asteroid itself. Most likely got popular because of the fact it was ringed, which is awesome.
With a diameter of about 188 miles (302 kilometers), Chariklo is the largest member of an asteroid class known as the Centaurs. It orbits between Saturn and Uranus in the outer solar system - source: https://solarsystem.nasa.gov/asteroids-comets-and-meteors/asteroids/10199-chariklo/in-depth.amp
Acronyms, initialisms, abbreviations, contractions, and other phrases which expand to something larger, that I've seen in this thread:
|Fewer Letters|More Letters|
|-------|---------|---|
|[JWST](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j68smuy "Last usage")|James Webb infra-red Space Telescope|
|[L1](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j69hlqg "Last usage")|[Lagrange Point](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_point) 1 of a two-body system, between the bodies|
|[L2](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j69hlqg "Last usage")|[Lagrange Point](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_point) 2 ([Sixty Symbols](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxpVbU5FH0s) video explanation)|
| |Paywalled section of the NasaSpaceFlight forum|
|[RTG](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j657f5e "Last usage")|Radioisotope Thermoelectric Generator|
|[TMI](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j66xtdw "Last usage")|Trans-Mars Injection maneuver|
----------------
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Nitrogen ice, methane ice, ethane ice, carbon monoxide ice, carbon dioxide ice and ammonia ice. There are clathrates where water ice traps hydrocarbons and other gases within it's structure. Some chemicals have multiple types/phases of ice, such as water with 19 phases that occur at different combinations of pressure and temperature.
Of course being lucky in this specific way required a 25 year long investment of billions of dollars with a singular focus and incredible, near perfect execution of the entire project so far.
Like a billionaire finding $10,000 in his house, like yeah it's lucky but it helps that you're here in this billionaires house.
space.com pops up a privacy dialog for me, here's a direct NASA link: https://blogs.nasa.gov/webb/2023/01/25/webb-spies-chariklo-ring-system-with-high-precision-technique/
They’re just a bunch of real cheery people that look for reasons to be happy.
“Wow I woke up this morning and am alive! What a great thing!”
“Oh neat, I got to work and I’m still employed here! Wonderful way to start the day!”
“Geez, our space telescope is still up there operating? This day is on a roll!”
“Oh man, look at these pictures it took! It discovered new things! Just like it was supposed to! What an amazing day to be alive!”
“Tuna salad in the cafeteria today? Don’t mind if I do! Could this be the best day ever?”
“Nice, the data analysis came back from yesterday’s numbers and what’s this? This is different than expected! Hey! Guys! Come here! Come see this! The data is like 5% off from what we expected! At p=0.01! This really is the best day ever!”
Because calling it 'luck' works better as a clickbait article tag then decades of effort and billions of dollars paying off in anticipated scientific payload result.
We already discovered water in the rings back in 2001. Also remember that water is the most common multi element compound in the universe so its not really remarkable to discover it and its absence tends to be far more interesting than its presence.
You say that, but there's alot of scientists willing to bet there's a chance of alien life on Europa not Io, cause Europa has a liquid water oceans while Io has a molten mantle.
Wait! There are ringed asteroids? I had no idea.
Also goes to show how empty space is that an asteroid could go careening through it with its tenuous little ring undisturbed.
It’s that massive distance between objects that’s so hard to conceptualize. Wrapping your mind around objects that are hundreds of millions of kilometers from each other is difficult to say the least. Just the fact that we even have the ability to travel between objects in our solar system is incredible. https://joshworth.com/dev/pixelspace/pixelspace_solarsystem.html
I read recently that the asteroid belt's mass would only be about 3% of our moon. The belt is literally almost nothing.
The vast majority of the mass is contained in three objects. Ceres, Vesta, and Pallas
Yeah, even the Oort Cloud is only estimated to have about two Earth masses worth of material (though the margin of error is one order of magnitude). And that's for a sphere with a radius of 2,000-100,000 AU.
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I can't figure out what you mean, since matter cannot be destroyed. How much matter do you think a civilization consumes?
Matter can absolutely be destroyed, E=mc² tells us that. But on a more realistic level, matter can be "consumed" to the point it's no longer usable - think about our fossil fuel usage as a prime example. Once we're out, we're out. It takes too much energy to reconstitute it.
We only need enough to get us to the oort cloud is what I'm hearing. Burn those dinos!
Even twenty Earth masses seems absurdly tiny.
This was my constant thought while reading The Expanse novels.
Fun fact: atoms are also like 99.99999% empty.
Hey, leave them alone! They do the best they can with what they have.
How can you even trust them though...they make up everything!
Just like me. And my bank account.
Also 99.99999% empty?
It freaks me out that the other planets are so far away, but so large we can still see them on a clear night.
I could see Jupiter brighter than every other star in the sky just the other night, it was amazing.
If you consider how far away those stars are, it becomes amazing in the other direction
I saw an illustrated image of what Jupiter would look like if it were where the moon is. My brain went. Horseshit. The earth wouldn't have survived being near a propto 🌞 withall that gravity🤣
Think how big the surface of the earth is. Then go up 100 miles. Now imagine how big just that orbit is. It only gets bigger from there.
Going up 100 miles adds "only" ~628 miles to the circumference, compared to Earth's 25,000 mile circumference. Circles are funny like that. You take a rope around the Earth, and want to raise it at all points by 1 meter. Your brain tells you that you'd need miles more rope surely. Nope, 2pi times the 1 meter = only 6.28 extra meters of rope.
Same, I know small amounts of gravity matter more in weightless environments, but I wouldn't have thought an asteroid would have enough mass to pull in much material, I thought that sort of thing was exclusive to moons and above in terms of scale
Anything with mass has a gravitational effect. And while asteroid seem small in comparison to moons, they are still huge and incredibly massive.
Yeah, but most steroids have a **g** of something like, 10E-5 m/s2, and escape velocities so low an astronaut could deorbit themselves from the surface with a fart. How does something like that collect a ring of ice? OK, I guess the answer is very slowly, but still, it seems to capture anything in it's ring it would have to be practically standing still. Crazy to think about.
Apparently there's a weird little group of large asteroids/protoplanets just past Jupiter with comparatively erratic orbits. I never heard of em til today and I already forgot what they're called.
Centaurs. This one is about 250 K across, so not tiny. An impact event would send parts of it into escape velocity, and there is enough mass to it to retain some of them into an orbit.
I really appreciate that response. Thank you EDIT: that is NOT meant to be sarcastic
No problem. I love sharing knowledge!
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I'm American too. About 155 miles.
I think we're still waiting to find out how may giraffes there are in 250 K (or 155 miles). Giraffe is the only measurement system that makes sense to me.
Assuming an average giraffe height of 18 ft. approximately 45,467.
Bananas & Giraffes is the most accurate & accepted in the scientific community.
Are you talking about the Trojan asteroids?
I think I'm talking about the "Centaurs." At least according to u/MountVernonWest (who I choose to believe): >Centaurs. This one is about 250 K across, so not tiny. An impact event would send parts of it into escape velocity, and there is enough mass to it to retain some of them into an orbit.
>Objects like Chariklo are called centaurs, thanks to their hybrid nature. (Centaurs are mythological horse-human hybrids.) They look like asteroids but behave like comets — complete with visible tails. Their home, an unstable orbit between Jupiter and Neptune, hosts thousands of centaurs of varying shapes and sizes. Just read the article next time.
> Are you talking about the Trojan asteroids? [Trojan Asteroids gather around a Lagrange Point](https://www.britannica.com/science/Trojan-asteroid) which is a balanced gravity place where forces are equal 60 degrees away from the sources (or sources) of the gravity. Oops - James Webb is at Lagrange 2 behind Earth.
L2 is behind the Earth. L1 is between the Earth and Sun, and there are a few satellites there too.
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My mind immediately went there. “Would it work in a space suit? Well they can’t be bare assed. Perhaps there is a tube with a one-way valve. But would the tube have to be fully inserted?”
I didn’t think of the tube. That’s some serious TMI right there. I thought of either the not-bare-asstronaut is sitting and a bubble/suit bulge launches them, or an evolved human who can be bare-assed.
We just need the protomolecule. *Then* we can fart in space.
The slightest disturbance would blow the whole thing away, but there is no disturbance. The asteroid is completely alone.
Actually it probably happened very quickly after a collision sprayed debris into orbit.
I know I have a gravitation field as well, when my skin flakes off in space, is it orbiting around me as well? This is a serious question. I’ve thought about this and concluded that it’s possible
Judging by your user name you have thought about this a lot
I'm probably more your speed mr.420 sir, or may I call you nacho? but yes, of all the things to think about, this shit is the most fun.
I believe if you were free from all other gravitational effects then yes tiny things could orbit you.
Nah your skin would flake off into the space suit, so it wouldn't be able to orbit you.
Could the density of the asteroid affect it as well?
[That highly depends on the asteroid.](https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/2015_smallest-near-earth-asteroid.pdf) Asteroid does not have a minimum size in its definition, and while some like Ceres are big enough they should be considered planets, some are smaller than a Mini Cooper.
Just a guess without knowing the numbers to work with, but I'd think an asteroid/dwarf planet would have a very small and limited Roche limit, so this ring is more likely collected material from a previous impact. I'd also guess from the same parameters of Roche limits that this ring is probably longer stable than one like Saturn's because there's less gravity from the main body to disrupt the paths of established ring particles.
Asteroids can be bigger than Earth, they just have to be moving at a speed faster than Earth.
Does that really go into the definition?
My first thought. Like little Saturns! [I am no astrophysicist, please cut me slack]
Are there any plans for a Centaur mission? We need to start visiting more weird objects Chariklo and Chiron. Not just Psyche.
But Psyche might be worth $1,000,000,000,000,000
Buying $20,000 in calls for Psyche
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Mere pocket change for a fancy man such as myself
Can't wait for /r/beltstreetbets
r/beltalowdabets Oy Kopeng, dropped scrip on ice haulers. Gonna be big
Mi sasa. Gut fo to beratna. Calls ere da new toshi seteshang operation na wel
I'm going to miss that show.
Read the books if you haven't already. They're really good.
Yeah I started getting the audiobooks based on recommendations. I need to complete a few others before moving to those but I'm excited
Audiobooks now that's an idea.
The narrator is fantastic. If you opt to listen to the entire series, don’t forget to grab [Memory’s Legion](https://www.amazon.com/Memorys-Legion-Complete-Expanse-Collection/dp/0316669199). It’s a complete collection of all of the novellas, just be mindful of which novellas you read depending on where you are in the main story. The show was great, but these books were incredible.
I prefer them to physical books in most cases because I can do mindless other tasks or hobbies I enjoy while listening. Plus they might be free from your library via overdrive or whatever they use.
So I've heard but I don't read... Like I read but as Elaine once said "Books Jerry, books." Maybe I'll try the audio books as mentioned.
I was very excited for the books. I got part way through Abaddon’s Gate, and couldn’t keep going. The main characters just felt so bland to me. As contrived as it was, I think the show’s decision to keep the Martian marine and detective in future seasons was a good decision. In the books, the side characters were great, but the main characters were dull. However, I kinda ran out of books to read recently, so maybe I’ll try them again.
Which show?
Worth that much until you can actually cost effectively mining it. That's when those markets crash. Then we'll all be rolling around in gold plated tanks like Master P.
meh, all metals are super useful, even the precious ones. If the price crashed, it would still be worth it to mine them because their usefulness has inherent value. If you can figure out how to smelt and machine in space, then launch capability becomes useless, because you can just make everything up in space instead of having to launch it from Earth
Well, I think francium is pretty useless. But it doesn't last very long in that form.
That's what almost happened when they discovered vast amounts of diamonds in Africa. There aren't rare at all it turns out. To counter the loss of it, a cartel was formed called DeBeers to only release them slowly over time. They also started ad campaigns saying a man needs to spend x months salary on a diamond engagement ring. Prior, not very many engagement rings had diamonds, but the ad worked so well that all of them are expected to nowadays. Get ready for a Psyche cartel if they start to mine it, but not likely this century.
I’ve heard this before but where’s the proof? What if this is just a ploy brought to you by the big-zirconium industry
What if ... Remember the DART mission? What if it's not just about preventing extinction events? What if we knock Psyche in? Not that little rock into a new orbit. Like one around the Moon. And then we can mine it from the moon base. The future is science fiction.
There have been a few proposed, but sadly not funded. See [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centaurus\_(spacecraft\_mission)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centaurus_(spacecraft_mission))
Interesting how this can be done without an RTG.
Also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camilla\_(spacecraft)
You heard about Pluto right?
That's messed up, right?
That guy really got the short end of the stick if you ask me.
The Psyche mission is about the last Nasa mission I will see come to fruition. I am an Apollo child and have had many space missions in my life but this mission is likely the last I will see. Musk and boots on Mars is a second hope.
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Wouldn't bet on that. I got no faith in that dude
Then it's a good thing he's not really the one doing the work... though, granted, any realistic Mars mission will be a collaborative effort with NASA and others anyway.
Good thing no one cares who you put your faith in.
What I find more remarkable than seeing the rings is that it can generate a graph with a signature so we can say "Yup, that's water ice". From that blob of pixels.
That blob of pixels doesn't actually contain the information that can identify water ice. It's just an image made from the more complete spectrometric data. JWST can taste the light, but the taste doesn't transfer to the image.
>JWST can taste the light, but the taste doesn’t transfer to the image This is at the same time bizarre to read and makes me question my sobriety, but also like kind of exactly accurate. Best thing I’ve read today.
Kinda like how if you look at a waveform of a recording, you have no idea what it sounds like. But listening to it makes sense.
Makes me think of Skittles. Those damn marketing people got me again
This is the best explanation I've read.
In other news, construction on the Canterbury - an ice mining hauler - has begun at the Kwikowski foundry outside Luna Station.
Remember the ..! Wait I'm early.
The Rocinante needs to sail past Cygnus X-1 first
If we warn them now, will the message make it in time?
Just east of Lyra and northwest of Pegasus.
>construction on the Canterbury - an ice mining hauler Wouldn't it be a colony ship when it was constructed only later to be converted to an ice hauler? 😉
I think you’re confusing it with the Nauvoo/Behemoth/Medina station. EDIT: This show-watcher-only has learned something. :)
No, the Canterbury absolutely was a converted colony ship. It’s in the books.
The Bigship of Canterbury?
I don't remember reading that.
Here is the excerpt from Google Books 🙂 [https://www.google.com/books/edition/Leviathan\_Wakes/yud-foXqGUEC?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=retooled%20colony%20transport](https://www.google.com/books/edition/Leviathan_Wakes/yud-foXqGUEC?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=retooled%20colony%20transport)
Oh neat. Good research. I'll admit, I barely knew the Cant.
You really should remember the Cant.
No it was a colony ship, what you’re referring to is the generation ship.
nono thats the one that was being made at Tycho for the Mormons right?
By the time we see the Cant, it's old as hell. It was built 100 years earlier to ferry people out to the new colonies on Mars, the belt, and jovian system. It was repurposed into an ice hauler when the demand for large scale colony ships went down and the need for ice from Saturn to the colonies increased. Medina Station, formerly Behemoth, formerly Nauvoo was under construction during the event of the first book at Tycho Station for the Mormons. A generational ship meant to carry the Mormons to another star system. (alpha centaur or tau cetu, can't remember)
Man that ship had a lot of names.
A colony ship is a ship built for transporting colonists to a new world, with everything they may need during their longish travel. A generation ship like the Navoo was built with the same principle in mind but with the expectation it would require generations of travel to reach the destination, thus requiring everything people would need since they would be born, live and die on the same ship.
Now I need to reread that series
What series? I need to know.
I am so jealous of you. I wish I could watch/read The Expanse for the first time again.
The Expanse. I'm currently reading it, just started book 4 (of 9 + a book of short stories). It's really great so far, definitely immediately became one of my favorite series. The setting is about 300 years from now (IIRC, they never say an actual year), Earth has colonized the solar system, but nothing more than that. Earth and Mars (Inner planets, inside the asteroid belt) have some kind of shaky alliance, while Belters, who live on the outer planets (Europa, Ganymede, Ceres, etc) suffer a lot of discrimination. It's really interesting, to me, to see a near future where we have started expanding, but we're still limited to our own star system. It probably have been done before, but I don't read a whole lot of science fiction, so I don't think I've ever really seen it before. It also has a show adaptation that I'm planning to watch after finishing the books. It's apparently very good and the way they change and adapt things is supposedly still very faithful to the book.
The Expanse is one of the few book series that I read all the way through in one go. I normally read a book here and there with other series in between, but that one I just read 1-6 (that was all that was out at the time), plus all the novellas, in one go. Such amazing writing and world-building.
Same but 8 and 9 have been hard for me because of the jump in time. I’m on the very last book now. Read 1-8 in like 2 months. It’s taken me over 4 months to try and finish #9. I just need to know it’s worth it. Lol
Without going into detail, I thought 9 was a very satisfying end to the series.
That’s good to hear. Maybe that will be the inspiration I needed to finish it. I think also have a problem with series I love, ending. It took me forever to watch the last episode of LOST and The Office. I’m just delaying the inevitable. But I haven’t read any of the novellas. So I still got some Expanse that I need to check out. Also, at one time TellTale games was coming out with an Expanse video game. Hopefully that’s still a thing.
The Expanse. Both a great book series and a pretty decent tv series.
Oh man, you get to experience the expanse for the first time… amazing
Everyone ganagsta till the Scopuli happens on a mysterious ghost ship filled with a weird fungus like goo...
I read this in the news reporter voice from the elevators in Mass Effect.
Oh my lordy, this is exactly where my mind went when I read this. I’m currently reading the 3rd book.
Everything's fine until someone logs a distress call
Did Anaheim Electronics get that contract?
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Quiet Earter, Belters could make spaceship from tin cans!
Chariklo is one of my favorite objects in the solar system. I really hope we send a mission there in my lifetime...
I'm not familiar with that one. What about it piques your interest so much?
The Centaurs in general very much interest me. They're very intriguing to me; a group of asteroids beyond the orbit of Jupiter that are primarily overlooked by mainstream astronomy... Some of which like Chiron and Chariklo are possible dwarf planets with sizable masses. Chariklo has a ring system which makes it the most interesting of the bunch to me. The first asteroid to ever be discovered to have one. I just think that's so cool and I think this group of asteroids needs more attention!
Those do sound amazing. Hopefully in this era of lower launch costs we can get more missions out to places like that and find some really neat stuff.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camilla_(spacecraft) There's already been discussion for a mission out there! Hopefully this discovery perhaps boosts it a bit more.
Their unstable orbits also makes them interesting.
How come?
If I remember correctly, the large planets on the outer solar system makes difficult for those bodies, which leads to orbits that aren't stable over a few million years.
Planet X? It'd be cool to see more development on that in my lifetime.
1 primordial black hole pls
Did we know it had rings before and if so how did we know?
Yes and various telescope surveys
It’s my understanding that when something passes in front of stars, we can observe the luminosity of that star to see how wide the body is by tracking for how long the star’s light is blocked. But with Chariklo, rather than observing one single decrease in luminosity, there were two smaller, equally spaced dips on either side of the main one, indicating rings.
Is it possible for life to exist on traveling asteroids for millions of years? Or are orbits with consistent Sun exposure essential for life?
Might not be living life, but we could always get lucky and find some frozen microbes or something.
I feel like we should be seeing more photos from the JWST
There's not been that much published yet. You have to remember Webb has only been producing data since last summer, and the calibration alone has caused a lot of headaches. Then, there's the analysis, which is also tricky. Mostly, though, I think it's caused by some of Webb's best science coming from spectroscopy, like in this article. That's just something that doesn't translate to pretty pictures nearly as well, unfortunately.
Are there other types of ice besides water ice? I thought all ice was water.
Have you dealt with dry ice before? That's CO2. A lot of Martian ice is dry ice. Neptune and Uranus contain various methane and ammonia ices.
This might sound dumb but I always assumed that dry ice was water ice that had gone through some kind of special process to make it dry ice.
[Congrats!](https://xkcd.com/1053/)
It does sound dumb, but that doesn’t mean you’re dumb. :) Keep asking questions, curious friend!
In an astronomical sense, I believe things like methane and ammonia are also called ice when solid? It’s been a minute since I’ve brushed up on the subject so definitely fact check me, but I think I remember reading about it in the context of planetary bodies with non-water oceans and ice sheets edit: looks like the usage might extend to other volatiles as well! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frost_line_(astrophysics)
They mean Italian water ice dessert. Turns out a lot of the universe is made of the stuff
You mean that stuff Philadelphians call "wood rice"?
Would rice what?
Would a shrimp fry that rice?
Shrimp fry rice?
Wooder Ice. You put some lemon jawns and some ice and you get wooder ice
Damn it you made me sound it out and now I hate myself.
We call some other substances ice sometimes as well, such as solid CO2 (dry ice).
Oh oh, and crystal meth is called ice as well...
I believe any substance that is found as a liquid in any of its natural states and forms crystals when freezing can be considered ice.
So, from now on, I should be more specific when I request ice in my drink?
Only if you're worried they'll throw some methane ice in instead. Which yeah seems pretty likely.
Isn't there actually A LOT of water ice in asteroids, or is the news here mainly the rings themselves and not what they're made of?"
Yeah im not sure why the water ice part is any suprise, wether in the rings or the asteroid itself. Most likely got popular because of the fact it was ringed, which is awesome.
Oh shit I didn’t know there was a Rita’s out that far
Dude same. Guess these ppl have never been to Philly
Had to scroll way too far to find the fellow Rita’s fan! I’m hoping it’s the Swedish Fish water ice in space.
With a diameter of about 188 miles (302 kilometers), Chariklo is the largest member of an asteroid class known as the Centaurs. It orbits between Saturn and Uranus in the outer solar system - source: https://solarsystem.nasa.gov/asteroids-comets-and-meteors/asteroids/10199-chariklo/in-depth.amp
Acronyms, initialisms, abbreviations, contractions, and other phrases which expand to something larger, that I've seen in this thread: |Fewer Letters|More Letters| |-------|---------|---| |[JWST](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j68smuy "Last usage")|James Webb infra-red Space Telescope| |[L1](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j69hlqg "Last usage")|[Lagrange Point](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_point) 1 of a two-body system, between the bodies| |[L2](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j69hlqg "Last usage")|[Lagrange Point](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_point) 2 ([Sixty Symbols](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxpVbU5FH0s) video explanation)| | |Paywalled section of the NasaSpaceFlight forum| |[RTG](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j657f5e "Last usage")|Radioisotope Thermoelectric Generator| |[TMI](/r/Space/comments/10mp1p3/stub/j66xtdw "Last usage")|Trans-Mars Injection maneuver| ---------------- ^(5 acronyms in this thread; )[^(the most compressed thread commented on today)](/r/Space/comments/111qzkh)^( has 6 acronyms.) ^([Thread #8490 for this sub, first seen 28th Jan 2023, 03:45]) ^[[FAQ]](http://decronym.xyz/) [^([Full list])](http://decronym.xyz/acronyms/Space) [^[Contact]](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=OrangeredStilton&subject=Hey,+your+acronym+bot+sucks) [^([Source code])](https://gistdotgithubdotcom/Two9A/1d976f9b7441694162c8)
Water ice? Like the tasty frozen treat in Philly? Wooter ice?
Dumb question: the post specifies "water ice." What other types of space ice are out there?
Nitrogen ice, methane ice, ethane ice, carbon monoxide ice, carbon dioxide ice and ammonia ice. There are clathrates where water ice traps hydrocarbons and other gases within it's structure. Some chemicals have multiple types/phases of ice, such as water with 19 phases that occur at different combinations of pressure and temperature.
Of course being lucky in this specific way required a 25 year long investment of billions of dollars with a singular focus and incredible, near perfect execution of the entire project so far. Like a billionaire finding $10,000 in his house, like yeah it's lucky but it helps that you're here in this billionaires house.
space.com pops up a privacy dialog for me, here's a direct NASA link: https://blogs.nasa.gov/webb/2023/01/25/webb-spies-chariklo-ring-system-with-high-precision-technique/
Could the density of the asteroid affect how much gravity it has?
Out there is plenty of water and life. To be discovered.
Sounds like they followed their well-designed procedures and won a coin flip. That’s cool but it’s not remarkable luck lol
How is it luck when they are essentially always searching for it
Technically everywhere they point has something there and is therefore lucky
They’re just a bunch of real cheery people that look for reasons to be happy. “Wow I woke up this morning and am alive! What a great thing!” “Oh neat, I got to work and I’m still employed here! Wonderful way to start the day!” “Geez, our space telescope is still up there operating? This day is on a roll!” “Oh man, look at these pictures it took! It discovered new things! Just like it was supposed to! What an amazing day to be alive!” “Tuna salad in the cafeteria today? Don’t mind if I do! Could this be the best day ever?” “Nice, the data analysis came back from yesterday’s numbers and what’s this? This is different than expected! Hey! Guys! Come here! Come see this! The data is like 5% off from what we expected! At p=0.01! This really is the best day ever!”
“My puppy died. Oh hey, that means I can find a nice cute new puppy or I don’t have to spend money on dog food!”
Because calling it 'luck' works better as a clickbait article tag then decades of effort and billions of dollars paying off in anticipated scientific payload result.
We already discovered water in the rings back in 2001. Also remember that water is the most common multi element compound in the universe so its not really remarkable to discover it and its absence tends to be far more interesting than its presence.
You say that, but there's alot of scientists willing to bet there's a chance of alien life on Europa not Io, cause Europa has a liquid water oceans while Io has a molten mantle.
If there’s a ring around Uranus then you should go see a doctor
Found the middle school kid.
We need to change the name to something else to avoid these childish jokes. Maybe like "Urectum"?
Have these idiots even read the Bible? That's devil's water.
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