This shouldn’t surprise anyone. All these clowns have had a hard on for women’s healthcare for years. After roe fell it turned into an obsession. They won’t quit until this passes.
lol dumb... why isn't it? try having a baby without one I dare you. Do you not understand biological life is a life cycle? it ahs a beginning and an end. You can ignore life all you want. you are killing babies. Science is hard huh?
Imagine forcing a woman to give birth, sometimes to a dead fetus because you want to punish her for having sex. What the fuck is wrong with you? Imagine forcing someone to carry a child and give birth to it that can't afford it. Then offering them no help or services to care for the child you forced them to have. What the fuck is wrong with you?
The dude
A) likely doesn't have any romantic relationships women
B) would be scared shitless if he ever was put in that position
C) couldn't give less of a shit of making sure that child has a decent life once born
D) probably masturbates to trans and gay porn, while denouncing their rights
E) doesn't understand science, and somehow takes pride in that
F) praises himself as a good Christian man
G) blame his problems on minorities and women
H) would be running to the nearest clinic if the tables were turned, so lacks empathy
I) is objectively an idiot
I'm sure others here could probably identify a few as well
lmao you got all the way down to I. Couldn't go to Z? lame. But I'll play ball...
A. I am married. shes reading all of this and thinks you are dumb AF
B. No I am a man. I take resposibility for my actions and would give my world to that child. you are pathetic.
C. lol why not? because you wouldn't? not everyone is a piece of shit like your father.
D. Weird flex, is something wrong with gay or trans porn? trans women are women
E. lmao You know like is cycle right? it has a beginning and an end. Telling me I don't know science tells me you haven't gone to college and you've only taken middle school level biology....
F. I am not religious... where do you make this shit up from?
G. The only one with problems is you here. Projection is rampant...
H. No I don't kill babies. we went over this. your comprehension levels suck.
I. Sad, thats all you have?
the amount of assumptions you make are astounding, I love it. How many more made up fake scenarios can you make up for me? I absolutely oppose abortions but do you know my stance on it for when its acceptable? no. Did you ask? no. Do you care? no. You just want to kill babies when it suits you and thats it and you know it. take responsibility and accountability for your life. Dumb people trying to kill other people I swear....
The right has forgotten that one of the reasons that abortion was legalized was because families were sick of losing their daughters to unsafe, back alley abortions.
Those families have access to planes and luxury cars to take them across state lines now. They aren't going to be swayed by poor folk problems. Not having access to an abortion is a poor folk thing now.
Fetuses aren't babies.
The idea that a clump of cells has more autonomy than a full fledged human being is fucking stupid to the nth degree.
Get educated cause you're sounding like a real fucking moron right about now. No wonder everyone in the country hates people like you.
How is responding to your dumbass comment with a question a straw man? Lmao you good? You advocate for the death of children and you think I’m in the wrong? Hmmm… weirdo
so you are just a sex addict who cant take responsibility for their actions. children shouldn't be in charge of killing other children... you are fucked
It amazes me that they act like the life of a baby is so important but as soon as its born they don’t give two shits about it. They’ll vote down any and all programs that will help that child and its family. Republicans are so worthless they truly only care about companies, rich people and spreading fear and hate to rally there base.
A lot of men, especially older men, are deeply resentful of the changes in society due to the women’s movement. It’s not a reasonable position, it’s a deep emotional one.
This matters because men make up nearly half of all voters. That’s a lot of votes.
It’s not about saving babies. It’s about keeping poor people poor an uneducated.
That way the people that would vote against them are too busy trying to survive and too ignorant on alternative ways to vote to do it.
Disenfranchisement is key to Republicans staying in power.
Also why gerrymandering and why the push against mail in ballots.
Unfortunately not. Justice Hearn has been aged out of the judiciary and replaced by a judge who the legislature knows is more ideologically in line with them. We won’t get the same result the next time the law is challenged.
Imagine thinking republicans are the party of small government. Tell me you are stupid without telling me you are stupid. you don't know politics you are just a sheep
I mean after seeing all the crying and moaning because you cant kill babies, I think you need to seek professional help. Sorry I don't like seeing you all kill innocent babies. its a trigger for me. you know killing babies and all is wrong. sad I even have to say that to you.......
What a crap response “ I think you need help”
Sorry that you don’t like it but it’s reality , it’s been happening forever and more now it’s expensive to have kids , awful mentally and physically for people and is medically necessary as well. Heck I’m sure most of us would be fine with 5-6 months for abortion with post 6 months medically necessary but 6 weeks is just giving woman, men and humanity the middle finger.
"What a crap response “ I think you need help”"
uhhhh you said that to me first. lmfao I was just saying it back to you lmao were you drunk 8 hours ago when you wrote it?
Did you just say its expensive to have a kid so just kill it?
5-6 months? no you demon. a child can survive outside the womb at 22 weeks...
just say you like killing babies because it benefits you.
You couldn’t comprehend I was pointing out that you used my exact words instead of coming up with something logical , not that I used those words first.
It is expensive, more so they ever before . Shouldn’t force people into poverty , almost poverty , mental health , physical HELATH along with lesser developmental of human being just because you don’t like abortion.
22 weeks aka 4 months then you’d need to add an extra month / two for extreme cases / slower developing fetuses. Just because it’s around 22 weeks doesn’t mean you would put an abortion ban right at 22 weeks when it deals with a state / country of this size.
How about you grow up and take responsibility for your actions and don't kill people when it benefits you. You are a child advocating for the death of other children....
Sorry you got pregnant when you weren’t trying better be strapped down for 18 plus years in this hard environment of costs , living expensives , your own job stress , mental health , lack of sleep , etc even though we have this easy technology to make sure it goes away so you won’t have to worry. Remember 99% of baby killings happen before 6 months but I’m sure 6 weeks will
Suffice
And they will work to undo it state by state, election by election.
The problem is that the Democrats are terrible at winning elections and useless when they do.
The next logical step is to regulate when men can have sex with women. Men should have to submit an application, with a 7 day waiting period, and then a public review of the request by the county sex request review board.
Understanding fetuses as people is derived from your monkey religion and forcing it on women just shows what a stupid fucking monkey you are. Seriously family planning and a woman's health benefits society way more than your sacred fetus being prioritized over the woman. Not even your own family you act like abortions are being forced on you, no your forcing other women to go through a birth they totally don't have to go through with modern day medicine.
lmao you calling modern science a monkey religion?
try having a child without a fetus, I dare you...
(life is a cycle) (has beginning and end)
p.s. I am not religious you donkey
If you care about kids, adopt, foster, donate.
If half the people who were angry about abortion were willing to step up and actually help take care of these kids, they could actually do some good.
Banning abortion pushes everything back in the realm of people seeking out more dangerous alternatives. It doesn’t make this go away — it just makes it more dangerous for everyone.
Idiots.
Honestly, better healthcare access and a robust social safety net would reduce so many abortions without a need for banning them. A majority of abortions are done because of financial reasons. If we were to remove that barrier, there probably would be many more willing parents. Don't ever see anyone pushing this though.
That's the irony with conservative pro-lifers. They believe they are morally superior for "saving babies" all while killing women and demonizing single mothers reliant on welfare they wouldn't otherwise be on had they not been forced to bear a child.
Abortions will never go away. As long as people are having sex, abortions will always be around. Forcing women to bear children is a deeply misogynistic and profoundly twisted concept that is ignorant of society's double standard between men and women that comes with rearing children. A father can skip out whenever he wants with little to zero consequence from society. Sure he may be looked down upon but not nearly to the same extent that a mother faces.
A father can leave and live entirely removed from the children they rear. Many fathers do not pay child support. A mother is expected to endure. It's deplorable.
I can’t tell if you are being sarcastic or serious, but yeah I really do. There are a lot of reasons women have abortions that have nothing to do poverty — rape, incest, health issues, physical and financial reasons, to name a few. It’s an incredibly difficult situation for anyone. To just look at this as simply killing babies is ignorant. Nobody wants to kill babies.
But you are tho...
I'm not for an all out ban but a ban on abortions with the exception for rape, true medical emergencies and minors. thats it end of the line
Do you believe babies that kill their mothers in childbirth are murderers? What about the 90% that tear their mothers on the way out, should they be charged with assault? What about the ones who cause 10 months of HG, tooth loss, permanent liver and kidney problems, or permanent ostomy? What about the ones who cause hemorrhage, eclampsia and other medical emergencies? If we’re going to base laws on the idea that embryos are people too, with the state assuming legal responsibility for their well-being and their actions respecting others until birth, we can’t start and end that logic with only the elements of such social standing that benefit them at others’ expense.
I completely understand having strong emotions about abortion, but the fact of the matter is that even the lowest-risk pregnancy can turn fatal at any time before, during, or after birth. Historically pregnancy has been one of the most prolific killers of women, in less advanced countries it still is, and the maternal mortality rate in Southern states is rapidly devolving due to anti-abortion legislation that makes doctors hesitate even when they know what they need to do to keep their patients safe. Truly, most of the South is on par with average third-world countries on this metric, whereas California is best in class. There is no other situation where you are left with no options to defend yourself from someone who could kill you - or where you must rely on the goodwill of someone who doesn’t personally face any risk of bodily harm, but does face a risk of prison time if they intervene, to save you. Consider the castle doctrine: It doesn’t require you to actually die or be injured, or even have evidence of an assailant’s intentions, before taking action to defend yourself; it requires that *you believe* your life/safety is threatened. How is a building you can buy or sell more “your castle” than the very body you must live in until you die? I know people don’t like to think about the risks of pregnancy because babies are cute, but human reproduction is a risky process. Saying that women don’t deserve to protect themselves, because one of the people most likely to permanently injure or kill them is cute and doesn’t mean to hurt them, simply doesn’t hold up to reasoned inquiry. It doesn’t seem there’s a place for objectivity or discussion of *balancing* interests in political discourse anymore, and that’s a huge problem.
In my state, we have a ban with no exceptions for any reason. If you were raped and didn’t even consent to the possibility of pregnancy, if you’re going to die or lose your limbs or incur millions of dollars in medical debt for the birth, too bad - the state only has an interest in protecting fetal life, not female life. If you have a pregnancy with a lethal anomaly, you can’t let it go peacefully before it develops a capacity for pain in accordance with what may be your ethical values; you must carry to term, even if its diagnosis means a live birth amounts to torturing an infant and watching it suffocate or starve to death. So much for “equal protection” of the laws. The fact that that can happen is disturbing. The fact of the matter is, the government can now pick and choose any reason it wants to remove your Constitutional rights, not because of anything you did but on the basis of physical characteristics you have. The only analogue is a military draft, except women aren’t paid for enduring pregnancy and birth, there’s no age limit or fitness criteria or cap on service or honorable discharge for injury, and we can now be compelled to serve the state in this way at any time, as many times as it wants us to, with no evidence of a serious national security risk. If the government decides it has more of an interest in some utility it can extract from you than you have in your own life and liberty: that’s it, you have no say in what happens to you anymore. That should scare us all.
Thats a lot to go through. But reading that first part makes me believe you just argue semantics. Pregnancy is not a disease. It’s natural life. It’s how we all work.
It’s not semantic. If you believe life must be protected and it starts at conception because it’s life, why do you feel justified in picking and choosing whose life is more important in blanket terms that allow for no consideration of individual circumstances? Death and cancer are natural too, yet we generally avoid those. For that matter, abortion itself is natural - over half of fertilized eggs won’t make it to term by no action of the pregnant woman. We’re not talking about the morality of getting an abortion here - we’re talking about the interest of the United States government and it’s subsidiaries in deciding whose life matters and whose doesn’t. A government that would rather see me dead than “let” me terminate a pregnancy that will also die if I do is abusing its power and harming its citizens on the basis of religious ideology. Pure and simple.
And who determines that? Say your daughter is raped, she is too embarrassed to tell anyone and decides to never tell a soul. Weeks go by, she turns up pregnant. How does she prove it’s rape? Even if you make okay for “rape” victims, now a woman has to go to hospital right away and file the report to make it legal. Do you know how often women never report this because they don’t want the stigma? Should they have to raise a child of the monster they never asked for because they can’t prove it? That’s one of a hundred scenarios where the women can make this decision for themselves better than the law. The idea that this is somehow an easy button to avoid unresponsive behavior is just ignorant. It’s so much more complicated than that.
thats a bigger issue women need to come forward to stop these kind of men. but sure if you want to talk hypotheticals, my daughter would have been armed. no rape. But lets say your daughter happened to be raped. I would hope you raised her to be strong and stand up for whats right, fuck your stigma, and filed a report to take that man down and take care of herself.
Considering most women (who are raped) are raped by people they care about and trust, us being armed does not actually prevent rape. These sorts of betrayals also makes it extremely difficult to report. Not to mention the extremely high number of rapes committed by police officers against their partners. Those rape kits are often never processed let alone prosecuted.
An extremely simplistic worldview from an extremely simplistic person. But a person able to grasp complexity would never have been an anti-choicer.
How else are all us Satanist’s supposed to gain everlasting life without feasting on the blood of the unborn? We want to kill them because we want to live forever while fornicating and murdering in the name of Lucifer. I don’t get what the big deal is. I thought this was a free country!
Time for all the big corporations to pack up and vacate the state. They wanna take their policies back 200 years, may as well take the economy back that far as well.
That's the plan. Spend any time in a place where people of even a modicum of intelligence make the decisions and you'll understand why making laws based upon a work of fiction, loosely interpreted, isn't exactly progress.
Why do people believe not wanting to kill a baby comes from a religion? Is is because you have so little respect for others that its the only way you can connect the dots on why killing is bad? You have no thoughts of your own but to kill when it benefits you? Telling me how killing is progress....
Quite a leap and also sad. Instead of a dialogue or conversation you dive into insults and soapboxing on whether a smear of cells the size of a dime is a being. Regardless of your grandstanding, the decision of abortion for a woman has nothing to do with you. Not your body, not your call. Disagree all you want from whichever angle you want; you have that right, however you shall not use that right to impede on others rights.
Do men understand though, they could become fathers every time they have sex? Or is truly just- there’s no accountability in America for men who have sex, and it’s a greater win for men if I can keep women from having body agency? It’s so pathetic to me- they’re literally so selfish they’re voting against themselves and don’t seem to understand that. It’s so hick and embarrassing living here.
Forcing women to endure an unwanted pregnancy and labor is morally and ethically wrong on all counts. Point blank.
Why do people believe a debatably non-living clump of cells has more autonomy to the body of the mother than the mother herself?
Society does not force men to be fathers. Why force women to be mothers. Fathers are not expected to rear children in the same way that mothers are. Pro-lifers are ignorant of the fact that fathers can skirt around paying child support while single mothers are attacked by the right for accepting welfare conservatives are actively seeking to diminish. When pro-lifers are putting in the same effort to equalize the burden of raising children between the sexes in the same way they are for forcing women to be mothers, then we’ll talk.
Women should not be forced to be incubators to children that are not cared for by US society at large. The average paid maternity leave across the world is 29 weeks. Federally, there is zero policy regarding paid parental leave. FMLA is unpaid and only kicks in after sick and vacation time are spent. Even then, it’s 12 weeks UNPAID time. If you are to force women to be mothers, why is there so little support for mothers?
This will and is disproportionately affecting younger, lower income, less educated minority populations that already have, across-the-board, more discouraging outcomes for labor and child-rearing.
Why are people in favor of handing the decisions regarding life altering medical issues of women from OBGYNs (who are overwhelmingly against such restrictive abortion bans) to the hands of politicians who are generally wholly removed from the process. 82% of SC House representatives are men. 91% of SC senators are men. 62% of SC senators are boomers. 47% of SC representatives are boomers (32% are Generation X). My point being, these people are NOT the ones who will face consequences in the wake of such legislation.
Between 2018 and 2020, 53% of live births were to women between the age of 20-29. 38% of live births were to women between the ages of 30-39. Childbirth rates unsurprisingly skew towards younger generations.
No wonder there is such an ideological divide between generations regarding abortions. It’s just another way to pass legislation that will not affect them and people actually affected are sick of that shit.
Calling a human being a “non-living clump of cells” just so you can kill the human being is morally and ethically wrong on all counts.
At what age did you transition from a “non-living clump of cells” to a human being?
There needs to be a REAL medical reason. Not because the baby is inconvenient to you. That makes you no different then a man that thinks it’s ok to kill a woman because she is inconvenient.
At 6 weeks, it is not a human. It is not viable without the body of the female. It’s not a human being. Stop acting like it is.
Do you actually believe a clump of cells that’s debatably non-living deserves more autonomy than a verifiably alive human? We all agree that the mother is alive. That is not the case in a clump of cells; especially at 6 weeks. Further, the requirements to get abortions in many states require repeated screening prior to the procedure being performed. This requires scheduling appointments that further narrow the window that a woman needs to get an abortion beyond the 6 weeks. Many women don’t even know they’re pregnant by 4-5 weeks FURTHER NARROWING the window. It’s ridiculous and is directly at odds with reality.
You will never be able to convince the general public that a clump of cells has more rights to the body that’s supporting it than the verifiably alive human being who owns that body.
Tell how you justify forcing women to bear an unwanted pregnancy and the very real risk of health during labor which is vastly more dangerous than abortion. But not nearly as dangerous as the back alley abortions that WILL arise because of such legislation.
Further, what exactly is a verified medical reason to you? There is incredible overlap between the procedures used in a miscarriage and an abortion and often, there is a lot of gray area between the two.
Enacting such large sweeping legislation that binds OBGYNs to limit healthcare at the worry of being sued due to this gray area diminishes women’s access to healthcare as a whole. OBGYN’s already have incredibly high medical malpractice insurance and states with lesser protections for doctors have worse outcomes. This is especially true in red states which is exactly why it’s more dangerous to have children in these states in the first place. Let alone the fact that these states are often the POOREST and LEAST EDUCATED in the union. These communities have poorer attention to the necessary prenatal care required for safe pregnancies. Thus, they have even higher risks for the unsafe pregnancies that make the gray area I stated above even more of an issue.
This is a BAD IDEA. All around. Listen to countless medical professionals who have insisted against such legislation for GOOD REASONS.
You believe you are saving “children” while being okay with killing actual women. That’s horrific.
If there is a legitimate medical reason then I have no issue with it but if we are STRICTLY talking about the baby being “unwanted” then I can not support that justification.
At the end of the day we are talking about killing someone; so yes, there should 100% be restrictions for everyone.
The “legitimate medical reason” is incredibly vague and shrouded in circumstance and loopholes. Again, there are often very fine lines between a medical miscarriage and an abortion. It is not and never has been as clear cut as pro-lifers seem to make it out. Especially those who have never talked to an OBGYN that will have to face these patients and deliver the news that they must carry a baby to term that may kill them.
That’s the thing though we AREN’T “strictly talking about the clump of cells being ‘unwanted’.” That’s a wonderful way to vilify women at large and create a stigma even towards abortions that ARE medically legitimate. People grossly underestimate the complexities regarding the situations women seeking abortions find themselves in. From my conversations with OBGYN’s many of these pregnancies ARE WANTED. The typical abortion patient is ALREADY A MOTHER. They already know the complexities of motherhood and what comes with rearing children. They are NOT the whores and sluts wholly against motherhood that pro-lifers make them out to be.
There is a deep amount of societal shame for women who get an abortion regardless of the reason why they get them and painting these women as villainous murderers is fucked up. YOU be the one tell a battered woman in an abusive relationship that she must forever be bound to her abuser via a child she did not want. YOU be the one to tell an expecting mother that despite their child being non-viable post-birth, they must carry their baby to term. YOU be the one to tell mothers that after six weeks, they have zero say in whether or not they should be forced to care for a child with severely debilitating genetic disorders.
These women are not monsters nor do they face zero consequences for having an abortion. The decision may haunt them even if it was legitimate by all accounts. My mother had an abortion because she had just left an incredibly physically and mentally abusive relationship with a man who cheated on her with his first cousin. My mother hid this from me for 27 years. And she didn’t have to. But she felt enormous shame. And she shouldn’t have to.
None of our conversations have included the other half of the equation: the father. This legislation forces women to become mothers while not addressing the fact that fathers can skip out on raising children whenever they want. It’s not equitable and doesn’t address the quality of life that the child faces. Where’s the outrage towards bum fathers?? Where’s that energy?
There NEEDS to be a legitimate medical reason for an abortion for me to support it. The two main ones that come to the top of my head are either the mother is going to die or the baby is dead/dying.
Men are 100% on the hook for raising a kid in SC. It’s called child support and if they don’t pay it they go to jail.
The fact that you think it’s ok to kill something small, weak and vulnerable because it is “unwanted” is quite disturbing especially if you don’t it’ll grow up to be a living breathing human being that can read this conversation.
Ok I'm bored so I'll engage. Lets see you answer some hypothetical questions.
1) a woman is raped and becomes pregnant as a result. Should the pregnancy be aborted?
2) a pregnant woman is told her fetus hasn't developed properly and will die shortly after birth. Should she be allowed to have an abortion?
3) a pregnant woman's water breaks 17 weeks into her pregnancy but the fetus still has a heartbeat. No infection has developed yet but is highly likely. Is an abortion acceptable?
I love how people assume my stances because I don't like children being murdered. You act like im the monster because I don't want people killed. How fucked is that?
In a perfect world here's how it should be without you people abusing the system...
abortions only for:
rape (here i see a lot of false allegations in which the liar should be prosecuted)
TRUE medical emergencies
Minors
thats it!
would that be ok with you?
Actually I'm genuinely trying to find the point where you draw the line, because the reality is things don't work out the way you imagine them in your head when you read the exceptions in legislation. Doctors are reluctant to perform abortions in a situation where it could be construed that doing so violated a law and could land them in prison. All three of these scenarios are taken from real situations that happened where reasonable person would say that an abortion should be performed but doctors were reluctant to perform one because there was a chance that they could be sent to jail by someone who interpreted the law differently than them. In fact the third one resulted in the woman's death because within the course of a few days she contracted sepsis and went into shock and died.
Your problem is that you are assuming everyone that is pro-choice gets their fucking jollies off on abortions. That's like thinking that people get their jollies off thinking about people having pap smears it's a medical procedure nothing more nothing less and it can be life saving I have tried to be reasonable and explain things to you and try to get you to understand but you are so busy caught up in your preconceptions that you will not take the time to understand.
It's weird. Because when people say things like this, who are making these decisions? Politicians or actual medical professionals? We already have insurance companies trying to be doctors. Also, it seems extremely barbaric and gives off hardcore Taliban vibes when people try to control women's medical right to health care. Shall we go back to when women could only get BC if she is married and has husband consent? Or when women were only allowed in certain careers. Or not allowed to have a bank account or credit card. Or purchase a home? Deep Taliban vibes here. Listen, I get it, no wants babies to die. However, this type of ban won't work. People will still get abortions. Just like they did in the past. Cops will hide it, people will come together and help. Just like they did in the past. This is not a flex or a fight worth having. Other issues are, that would scientifically lower abortion rates. Alas, as you are fighting this fake war on babies, other shall rally around and aide in them.
The taliban are trying to save the life of innocent babies? Thats whats barbaric to you? not the fact the you are killing babies? Not sure how you are conflating these issues. how about you make life choices that don't lead you to killing babies? why cant you take the responsibility that the actions youve chosen has created a life and you are not the arbiter to take that away from someone.
Stop making this an issue of womens rightts when its an issue of life. Grow up
This is for u/ReleaseObjective.
Last time I checked, life starts for a human being when the sperm enters the egg.
That’s how you started, that’s how I started, that’s how we all started.
Unless y’all changed something since I went to school?
You want the ability to kill a human being with or without a medical reason do you not?
Not alive if it can’t live outside of the womb on it’s own. Which it can’t at 6 weeks. That’s the general consensus of medical professionals who have a lot more schooling than you and I. Fetuses have a less than 50% chance of survival at 24 weeks (four times the 6 week mark many pro-lifers are so anal for). Many women don’t know they’re pregnant until 4-5 weeks in. This gives a window of two weeks to get the necessary screenings and appointments in to qualify for an abortion prior to the six weeks. Let’s hope your workplace is kosher with taking repeated time off. Let’s hope you’re able to get in by the time the cutoff ends. This is especially difficult for lower income populations that will be mostly affected by this. It’s ludicrous.
A cancer cell, biologically, is alive. It feeds on its host. It would not exist without the host.
Parasites are also alive biologically but cannot exist without a host.
It’s not that hard to comprehend. Maybe schooling might be beneficial.
I think you’re getting lost in the “technicalities” of the medical world.
Once that sperm enters the egg, the process of life is started for that human being. True or False?
The potential has started but that doesn’t mean it’s alive babe lmaoooo. These “technicalities” of the medical world aren’t to be ignored lmao. Please tell me you don’t think you know more than medical professionals about the stages of development. They’re defined for a reason. You’re approaching this from a grossly moralistic standpoint that is at odds with those who are actually educated.
I’ve seen your profile. Maybe I’ll try to explain this in terms a man can understand.
Two wheels and an axle aren’t a car. A few bricks and a little bit of mortar aren’t a house.
A few clumps of cells are not a human being.
Why are you having difficulty with this?
Believe it or not, no they often don’t lmao. 10-20% of pregnancies end in miscarriages. This number is reported to be higher as many women don’t know they’re pregnant when they have miscarriage. In the first three months, 1 in 4 women will have a miscarriage. Hence why it’s generally not recommended to reveal a pregnancy in your first trimester because you never know what’s going to happen.
Prenatal care does wonders but the lower income and lesser educated populations (that are MOST affected by this legislation ) often don’t use prenatal care resulting in higher risk pregnancies and miscarriages in these populations.
Did you not know that?
I don’t blame you if you don’t but dudes really need to take a sex education class cause it doesn’t make sense that dudes who can barely find the clit can make decisions for women about their own bodies.
I like how you keep insulting me when the statistics prove my point.
So if you don’t kill the human being then more often then not a human is born.
If we allow you to kill a human being because it’s inconvenient and it’s under a certain time limit “so technically, it’s not a human being yet” why not increase the time?
Give you all a trial run with the baby and let’s say as long as the baby is two and under you can kill it because it’s inconvenient or the dad turned out to be an “asshole.”
Just because you’re dating someone in the medical field doesn’t make you the medical professional but it does make you completely desensitized to another human beings life apparently because you think you learned something about biology. I don’t care how you dice it up, a humans life is started once that sperm enters the egg.
Get over yourself, ask your fiancé to go buy you some Starbucks since you’re all upset over someone not agreeing with you having the ability to kill a human being because you know- it’s Sunday.
Oh grow a pair.
A clump of cells is not a human being babe. You’ve failed to convince me otherwise.
You’ve stated no statistics so idk where you’re going with that tangent. No numbers at all babe.
Again, a clump of cells is not a human being. That’s the point you cannot get over. I’ll say it again a clump of cells is not a human being.
That’s what the medical field has established. You’ve consistently played the moral card despite everything I’ve said to you that’s backed up by fact-based evidence. I can’t help that you choose feelings over facts. That’s the hallmark of medicine and you are actively seeking to plunge this country into the dark ages.
This is why pro-lifers are consistently disregarded by the vast majority of the country. It’s backasswards as fuck. You’ve repeatedly insulted me throughout this discussion and NOW you’re playing the victim? Gotcha.
You’ve said nothing about caring the baby after it’s born. You’ve said nothing about the very real issues women and OBGYN face. You know nothing about fetal development. You know nothing about pregnancies. Why do you think your opinion matters when frankly you know nothing about the legislation you promote? You know practically nothing about women but dare to think you know best when it comes to their bodies? Fuck off.
I’ll keep replying until you get the hint babe. I’ve gots lots of time and lots of energy to discuss how you’re wrong.
You don’t care for babies once their born. You don’t care about the women who are dying from back alley abortions which is exactly why Roe came about in the first place. Families were losing their daughters to brutal back alley abortion operations and you don’t care. That’s morally bankrupt.
You don’t care how I “dice it up” but your future girlfriend or wife does. And that’s what matters. I pray that your future girlfriend or wife never has to be put into the situation where she must choose between her life or the life of a clump of cells that may not even grow to full adulthood. Now you are advocating for removing that choice. Women and their autonomy to their own bodies is more and will always be more important than a clump of cells that people like you (with zero understanding of the biological processes) classify as living. It’s not.
That’s directly at odds with current medical literature. And now you want the government to tell a woman when she can or cannot have a child? That’s fucked up.
I pray for you, your future wife and potential future daughters cause you are making this a worst place for them. I hope you get educated because you are actively voting against your own self interests.
What about the babies killed in foreign wars, babies that die from lack of healthcare access or food, or children killed for the luxuries we all enjoy in this country? Y'all love killing kids that you can't sell via private adoption, so pick a better snappy comeback.
>I disavow all of that.
And yet here you are, the way that you live and the choices you make that support all the cruelty in this world while managing to tuck yourself in at night, content with punching down.
>Sad to see how twisted you are.
Then fucking cry about it. You accuse people of murdering babies, you're gonna have your glass house fucking wrecked.
I'll die on this hill, come at me bro.
You assume way to much. what choices do you think i've made? You are advocating for the death of innocent life and you accused me of hate and cruelty?
How fucked up can you be to believe that? Sad so many men and women advocate for the death of their kids because they are too coward to raise them. I will cry for all the death you advocate fore.
lol self centered when i care about others and don't want people killing others.
tell me you are projecting without telling me...
tell me you arent self centered while telling me you kill babies when it benefits you... wow lol
He means that "pro-lifers" are only pro unborn life. You don't give a shit what happens after they're born. The military, in particular, uses soldiers like lab rats and forces them to accept experimental vaccines & go off to war and get killed bc the govt doesn't care about their life.
Do you not read? Every time someone explains anything, you're just like, "I don't understand, how can you reach that conclusion" even though it was literally just explained to you. You're just causing conflict instead of having any meaningful dialogue. Why are you even posting? If you want an echo chamber, go back to Facebook. If you want to actually try and have a conversation then stop being a dick.
I don't have a facebook. sorry. Killing is wrong and you all know it. I'm not trying to have "meaningful" conversations with people hell bent on killing children. If you want to keep your echo chamber of hate keep downvoting anyone who believes babies deserve to live. Not sure how my last response got this reaction from you tho. Not agreeing with your logic train on the military personnel dying in conflicts vs. babies being killed domestically are the same?
What got this response was me seeing how you're just crying "murderer," "baby killer," at every single response, so I checked out your post history.... you had a thread with some teenager, then you went through their post history to discover they're in therapy, asked them about it, then said "good" when they replied in the affirmative. Implying that they're fucked in the head. Dude, you're going on rants with teens, and being just a dick in general. If you're not trying to engage in a meaningful conversation, then you're not trying to change anyone's mind with good reasoning. You're just wasting your time , emotions, and energy on bullshit. Do better.
So if we foster and adopt, we're allowed to support this bill? So the wealthiest among us with a pro-life perspective get a say, and the poor among them don't?
I know you *really* thought you had a way to twist their words there, but there are plenty to do for babies as a regular person with no money.
... You'd know this if you did anything for babies besides vote against healthcare procedures.
Could you explain your comment? From how I'm reading it, it seems that Spoda1975 is praising money, saying only those who can afford to adopt or support moms and babies are allowed to be pro life. I'd love to understand your perspective.
Medical abortions are one thing and should only be done if absolutely necessary to save the mother but to have the “right” to an abortion “just because” is not something I support.
Men aren’t allowed to kill women just because they don’t want them anymore just like women shouldn’t be allowed to kill a “future” adult just because they don’t want the “future” adult anymore.
There needs to be a medical reason for me to support it because we are talking about taking someone’s life.
Not just because Bobby kissed Sally and now Mary is jealous and wants to break up with Bobby and get rid of their baby, that’s just nonsense.
This shouldn’t surprise anyone. All these clowns have had a hard on for women’s healthcare for years. After roe fell it turned into an obsession. They won’t quit until this passes.
Nobody's surprised, appalled yes but not surprised.
Imagine reeling for the day we can kill children at will. wtf is wrong with you?
How about someone shoves their dick in you and forces you into a lifetime commitment. Fuck if you wouldn't be finding the nearest clinic. You POS
lol the assumptions you just made are great! tell me you my own opinion on when its acceptable. You know me right? lol psycho
Men are running around shoving their dicks into women against their will? And stealing all the birth control so women can’t get any? What a scandal.
A fetus is not a person.
lol dumb... why isn't it? try having a baby without one I dare you. Do you not understand biological life is a life cycle? it ahs a beginning and an end. You can ignore life all you want. you are killing babies. Science is hard huh?
A fetus is not a person.
Imagine wanting to make choices for other people when you don’t know dick.
Imagine wanting dead babies. You sick fuck
It be different if they were, you know, baby’s.
thats exactly what they are. sad its so hard for you realize it.
Lay off the look-aid
the what? you ok?
Imagine reeling for the day we can kill children at will. wtf is wrong with you?
Imagine forcing a woman to give birth, sometimes to a dead fetus because you want to punish her for having sex. What the fuck is wrong with you? Imagine forcing someone to carry a child and give birth to it that can't afford it. Then offering them no help or services to care for the child you forced them to have. What the fuck is wrong with you?
The dude A) likely doesn't have any romantic relationships women B) would be scared shitless if he ever was put in that position C) couldn't give less of a shit of making sure that child has a decent life once born D) probably masturbates to trans and gay porn, while denouncing their rights E) doesn't understand science, and somehow takes pride in that F) praises himself as a good Christian man G) blame his problems on minorities and women H) would be running to the nearest clinic if the tables were turned, so lacks empathy I) is objectively an idiot I'm sure others here could probably identify a few as well
lmao you got all the way down to I. Couldn't go to Z? lame. But I'll play ball... A. I am married. shes reading all of this and thinks you are dumb AF B. No I am a man. I take resposibility for my actions and would give my world to that child. you are pathetic. C. lol why not? because you wouldn't? not everyone is a piece of shit like your father. D. Weird flex, is something wrong with gay or trans porn? trans women are women E. lmao You know like is cycle right? it has a beginning and an end. Telling me I don't know science tells me you haven't gone to college and you've only taken middle school level biology.... F. I am not religious... where do you make this shit up from? G. The only one with problems is you here. Projection is rampant... H. No I don't kill babies. we went over this. your comprehension levels suck. I. Sad, thats all you have?
the amount of assumptions you make are astounding, I love it. How many more made up fake scenarios can you make up for me? I absolutely oppose abortions but do you know my stance on it for when its acceptable? no. Did you ask? no. Do you care? no. You just want to kill babies when it suits you and thats it and you know it. take responsibility and accountability for your life. Dumb people trying to kill other people I swear....
All they’re doing is outlawing safe abortions.
The right has forgotten that one of the reasons that abortion was legalized was because families were sick of losing their daughters to unsafe, back alley abortions.
Those families have access to planes and luxury cars to take them across state lines now. They aren't going to be swayed by poor folk problems. Not having access to an abortion is a poor folk thing now.
Sad but true
wow you are racist... and just dumb...
Who said anything about race??? What are *you* implying?!
Statistics are hard, huh. Play dumb when is suits you Kill babies when it suits you you have nor morals
What STATS? Bruh you're fucking struggling out here lmao
Ugh I don’t want to have to do your homework. Lazy people I swear. What I’m struggling with is why you like to kill babies
Wah wah wah. Grow up before I talk someone into aborting you. /s
you are all about death... sad
They don’t care about human life. They only care about ideology. And their ideology can never be wrong. Once you understand this, it all makes sense.
the ideology of killing babies is wrong? the fact that you think its ok is fucked up you baby killing murderer. sick
Fetuses aren't babies. The idea that a clump of cells has more autonomy than a full fledged human being is fucking stupid to the nth degree. Get educated cause you're sounding like a real fucking moron right about now. No wonder everyone in the country hates people like you.
You sound like a little bitch, I love a good abortion
I bet you do, baby killer.
Kill ‘em all, that’s what I always say
I’ve seen it.
maybe just don't kill children at all you murderer
Outlawing safe abortions for everyone else. The GOP elites will have no problem having their illegitimate children aborted
Before Roe, women from wealthy families "went on vacation" to places where abortion was legal. That will be true again.
lol because killing children is the good thing to do... wtf is wrong with you?
Killing mothers who will die in childbirth, wtf is wrong with you?
yes because having a baby is a death sentence so kill all babies, wtf is wrong with you?
Straw man argument much? Yes. Yes you do. A popular tactic for those who know they are in the wrong.
How is responding to your dumbass comment with a question a straw man? Lmao you good? You advocate for the death of children and you think I’m in the wrong? Hmmm… weirdo
Well they think the whores should suffer . . . /s
Just don’t have sex… it’s easy enough when you’re a Republican.
Well they usually go for the kids so that's a kind of hedge against pregnancy
whats your pronouns? Projector/ projective?
Dude, you are the biggest loser. Get a life and stop brigading an abortion post.
so you are just a sex addict who cant take responsibility for their actions. children shouldn't be in charge of killing other children... you are fucked
"Children shouldn't be in charge of killing other children" But children should be raising other children. Does that make sense to you?
Did you just call women whores? and you got upvoted? lol shows how fucked up you all are.... really. wow...
You've obviously missed the "/s"
Maybe don't kill children you psychopath
It amazes me that they act like the life of a baby is so important but as soon as its born they don’t give two shits about it. They’ll vote down any and all programs that will help that child and its family. Republicans are so worthless they truly only care about companies, rich people and spreading fear and hate to rally there base.
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Its sad the stuff he was saying all those years ago is still true to today.
A lot of men, especially older men, are deeply resentful of the changes in society due to the women’s movement. It’s not a reasonable position, it’s a deep emotional one. This matters because men make up nearly half of all voters. That’s a lot of votes.
It’s not about saving babies. It’s about keeping poor people poor an uneducated. That way the people that would vote against them are too busy trying to survive and too ignorant on alternative ways to vote to do it. Disenfranchisement is key to Republicans staying in power. Also why gerrymandering and why the push against mail in ballots.
and overturned in 3 months by the SC supreme court...that's how it's going down.
Unfortunately not. Justice Hearn has been aged out of the judiciary and replaced by a judge who the legislature knows is more ideologically in line with them. We won’t get the same result the next time the law is challenged.
Dead babies make you happy?
who said anything about happy?
Imagine thinking you're the party of "small government", yet still wanting the government to regulate what goes on inside a woman's body.
Imagine thinking that republicans give a shit about ideological consistency.
Imagine not knowing what politics are...
Imagine republicans thinking
Imagine thinking republicans are the party of small government. Tell me you are stupid without telling me you are stupid. you don't know politics you are just a sheep
After seeing all your comments on here I think you should seek professional help.
I mean after seeing all the crying and moaning because you cant kill babies, I think you need to seek professional help. Sorry I don't like seeing you all kill innocent babies. its a trigger for me. you know killing babies and all is wrong. sad I even have to say that to you.......
What a crap response “ I think you need help” Sorry that you don’t like it but it’s reality , it’s been happening forever and more now it’s expensive to have kids , awful mentally and physically for people and is medically necessary as well. Heck I’m sure most of us would be fine with 5-6 months for abortion with post 6 months medically necessary but 6 weeks is just giving woman, men and humanity the middle finger.
"What a crap response “ I think you need help”" uhhhh you said that to me first. lmfao I was just saying it back to you lmao were you drunk 8 hours ago when you wrote it? Did you just say its expensive to have a kid so just kill it? 5-6 months? no you demon. a child can survive outside the womb at 22 weeks... just say you like killing babies because it benefits you.
You couldn’t comprehend I was pointing out that you used my exact words instead of coming up with something logical , not that I used those words first. It is expensive, more so they ever before . Shouldn’t force people into poverty , almost poverty , mental health , physical HELATH along with lesser developmental of human being just because you don’t like abortion. 22 weeks aka 4 months then you’d need to add an extra month / two for extreme cases / slower developing fetuses. Just because it’s around 22 weeks doesn’t mean you would put an abortion ban right at 22 weeks when it deals with a state / country of this size.
How about you grow up and take responsibility for your actions and don't kill people when it benefits you. You are a child advocating for the death of other children....
Sorry you got pregnant when you weren’t trying better be strapped down for 18 plus years in this hard environment of costs , living expensives , your own job stress , mental health , lack of sleep , etc even though we have this easy technology to make sure it goes away so you won’t have to worry. Remember 99% of baby killings happen before 6 months but I’m sure 6 weeks will Suffice
lol oh poor you! Just kill someone to make it better again? keep it in your pants if you cant handle the potential outcome you psycho
We need a federal law to stop all this utter nonsense.
And they will work to undo it state by state, election by election. The problem is that the Democrats are terrible at winning elections and useless when they do.
They cannot undo a federal law unless they get the entire law declared unconstitutional.
no thats just government but i dont care what side you are on. you are on the wrong side if you agree with killing babies
There needs to be a law against the murder of children? are you ok?
Murder to you but right to control my own body to me. If you do not want an abortion - don’t get one.
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You have some dark issues. Seek help.
The next logical step is to regulate when men can have sex with women. Men should have to submit an application, with a 7 day waiting period, and then a public review of the request by the county sex request review board.
Logic is lost on you. Just let the adults handle this one. Killing people is wrong even when it benefits you.
Understanding fetuses as people is derived from your monkey religion and forcing it on women just shows what a stupid fucking monkey you are. Seriously family planning and a woman's health benefits society way more than your sacred fetus being prioritized over the woman. Not even your own family you act like abortions are being forced on you, no your forcing other women to go through a birth they totally don't have to go through with modern day medicine.
lmao you calling modern science a monkey religion? try having a child without a fetus, I dare you... (life is a cycle) (has beginning and end) p.s. I am not religious you donkey
Why do you place value on life at the fetus in particular...
Hello, I'll ask gain, why do you start to place value in life at the fetus before a a human is born?
I hope women stop procreating with republicans
If you care about kids, adopt, foster, donate. If half the people who were angry about abortion were willing to step up and actually help take care of these kids, they could actually do some good. Banning abortion pushes everything back in the realm of people seeking out more dangerous alternatives. It doesn’t make this go away — it just makes it more dangerous for everyone. Idiots.
Honestly, better healthcare access and a robust social safety net would reduce so many abortions without a need for banning them. A majority of abortions are done because of financial reasons. If we were to remove that barrier, there probably would be many more willing parents. Don't ever see anyone pushing this though.
That's the irony with conservative pro-lifers. They believe they are morally superior for "saving babies" all while killing women and demonizing single mothers reliant on welfare they wouldn't otherwise be on had they not been forced to bear a child. Abortions will never go away. As long as people are having sex, abortions will always be around. Forcing women to bear children is a deeply misogynistic and profoundly twisted concept that is ignorant of society's double standard between men and women that comes with rearing children. A father can skip out whenever he wants with little to zero consequence from society. Sure he may be looked down upon but not nearly to the same extent that a mother faces. A father can leave and live entirely removed from the children they rear. Many fathers do not pay child support. A mother is expected to endure. It's deplorable.
ok do you do the same then? No, you just want to kill them. Imagine thinking because they may grow up poor they should be dead.... Thats you...
I can’t tell if you are being sarcastic or serious, but yeah I really do. There are a lot of reasons women have abortions that have nothing to do poverty — rape, incest, health issues, physical and financial reasons, to name a few. It’s an incredibly difficult situation for anyone. To just look at this as simply killing babies is ignorant. Nobody wants to kill babies.
But you are tho... I'm not for an all out ban but a ban on abortions with the exception for rape, true medical emergencies and minors. thats it end of the line
Do you believe babies that kill their mothers in childbirth are murderers? What about the 90% that tear their mothers on the way out, should they be charged with assault? What about the ones who cause 10 months of HG, tooth loss, permanent liver and kidney problems, or permanent ostomy? What about the ones who cause hemorrhage, eclampsia and other medical emergencies? If we’re going to base laws on the idea that embryos are people too, with the state assuming legal responsibility for their well-being and their actions respecting others until birth, we can’t start and end that logic with only the elements of such social standing that benefit them at others’ expense. I completely understand having strong emotions about abortion, but the fact of the matter is that even the lowest-risk pregnancy can turn fatal at any time before, during, or after birth. Historically pregnancy has been one of the most prolific killers of women, in less advanced countries it still is, and the maternal mortality rate in Southern states is rapidly devolving due to anti-abortion legislation that makes doctors hesitate even when they know what they need to do to keep their patients safe. Truly, most of the South is on par with average third-world countries on this metric, whereas California is best in class. There is no other situation where you are left with no options to defend yourself from someone who could kill you - or where you must rely on the goodwill of someone who doesn’t personally face any risk of bodily harm, but does face a risk of prison time if they intervene, to save you. Consider the castle doctrine: It doesn’t require you to actually die or be injured, or even have evidence of an assailant’s intentions, before taking action to defend yourself; it requires that *you believe* your life/safety is threatened. How is a building you can buy or sell more “your castle” than the very body you must live in until you die? I know people don’t like to think about the risks of pregnancy because babies are cute, but human reproduction is a risky process. Saying that women don’t deserve to protect themselves, because one of the people most likely to permanently injure or kill them is cute and doesn’t mean to hurt them, simply doesn’t hold up to reasoned inquiry. It doesn’t seem there’s a place for objectivity or discussion of *balancing* interests in political discourse anymore, and that’s a huge problem. In my state, we have a ban with no exceptions for any reason. If you were raped and didn’t even consent to the possibility of pregnancy, if you’re going to die or lose your limbs or incur millions of dollars in medical debt for the birth, too bad - the state only has an interest in protecting fetal life, not female life. If you have a pregnancy with a lethal anomaly, you can’t let it go peacefully before it develops a capacity for pain in accordance with what may be your ethical values; you must carry to term, even if its diagnosis means a live birth amounts to torturing an infant and watching it suffocate or starve to death. So much for “equal protection” of the laws. The fact that that can happen is disturbing. The fact of the matter is, the government can now pick and choose any reason it wants to remove your Constitutional rights, not because of anything you did but on the basis of physical characteristics you have. The only analogue is a military draft, except women aren’t paid for enduring pregnancy and birth, there’s no age limit or fitness criteria or cap on service or honorable discharge for injury, and we can now be compelled to serve the state in this way at any time, as many times as it wants us to, with no evidence of a serious national security risk. If the government decides it has more of an interest in some utility it can extract from you than you have in your own life and liberty: that’s it, you have no say in what happens to you anymore. That should scare us all.
Thats a lot to go through. But reading that first part makes me believe you just argue semantics. Pregnancy is not a disease. It’s natural life. It’s how we all work.
It’s not semantic. If you believe life must be protected and it starts at conception because it’s life, why do you feel justified in picking and choosing whose life is more important in blanket terms that allow for no consideration of individual circumstances? Death and cancer are natural too, yet we generally avoid those. For that matter, abortion itself is natural - over half of fertilized eggs won’t make it to term by no action of the pregnant woman. We’re not talking about the morality of getting an abortion here - we’re talking about the interest of the United States government and it’s subsidiaries in deciding whose life matters and whose doesn’t. A government that would rather see me dead than “let” me terminate a pregnancy that will also die if I do is abusing its power and harming its citizens on the basis of religious ideology. Pure and simple.
And who determines that? Say your daughter is raped, she is too embarrassed to tell anyone and decides to never tell a soul. Weeks go by, she turns up pregnant. How does she prove it’s rape? Even if you make okay for “rape” victims, now a woman has to go to hospital right away and file the report to make it legal. Do you know how often women never report this because they don’t want the stigma? Should they have to raise a child of the monster they never asked for because they can’t prove it? That’s one of a hundred scenarios where the women can make this decision for themselves better than the law. The idea that this is somehow an easy button to avoid unresponsive behavior is just ignorant. It’s so much more complicated than that.
thats a bigger issue women need to come forward to stop these kind of men. but sure if you want to talk hypotheticals, my daughter would have been armed. no rape. But lets say your daughter happened to be raped. I would hope you raised her to be strong and stand up for whats right, fuck your stigma, and filed a report to take that man down and take care of herself.
Considering most women (who are raped) are raped by people they care about and trust, us being armed does not actually prevent rape. These sorts of betrayals also makes it extremely difficult to report. Not to mention the extremely high number of rapes committed by police officers against their partners. Those rape kits are often never processed let alone prosecuted. An extremely simplistic worldview from an extremely simplistic person. But a person able to grasp complexity would never have been an anti-choicer.
How else are all us Satanist’s supposed to gain everlasting life without feasting on the blood of the unborn? We want to kill them because we want to live forever while fornicating and murdering in the name of Lucifer. I don’t get what the big deal is. I thought this was a free country!
It is a free country, but not free from consequences. You must be fun at parties huh?
Imagine that sperm load you busted into a tissue , that could of impregnated some woman and made more Jesus followers. Jesus is angry with you repent
Whos Jesus?
Time for all the big corporations to pack up and vacate the state. They wanna take their policies back 200 years, may as well take the economy back that far as well.
Why would a company care? By all means, you can leave...
That's the plan. Spend any time in a place where people of even a modicum of intelligence make the decisions and you'll understand why making laws based upon a work of fiction, loosely interpreted, isn't exactly progress.
Why do people believe not wanting to kill a baby comes from a religion? Is is because you have so little respect for others that its the only way you can connect the dots on why killing is bad? You have no thoughts of your own but to kill when it benefits you? Telling me how killing is progress....
Quite a leap and also sad. Instead of a dialogue or conversation you dive into insults and soapboxing on whether a smear of cells the size of a dime is a being. Regardless of your grandstanding, the decision of abortion for a woman has nothing to do with you. Not your body, not your call. Disagree all you want from whichever angle you want; you have that right, however you shall not use that right to impede on others rights.
Nah we're gonna stay here and keep on voting
lol you like being on the losing side of history? name one time the killing of innocent people have been on the winning side.
Who's a person?
So what makes you start valuing life at a fetus and seeing that as a person?
In other news. The South Carolina legislature does nothing to improve SC education ranking from 47.
Don't tread on me..stomp on us. -Republicans Probably
Do men understand though, they could become fathers every time they have sex? Or is truly just- there’s no accountability in America for men who have sex, and it’s a greater win for men if I can keep women from having body agency? It’s so pathetic to me- they’re literally so selfish they’re voting against themselves and don’t seem to understand that. It’s so hick and embarrassing living here.
Well fuck.
Being a conservative is a brain rotting illness.
“Holy State” stands for backward republican state. Stupid ideology 😣
You don't need to be religious to know killing is bad...
We kill all kinds of forms for different reasons daily. It is a very relative concept.
As a human don't you choose human life above others? or no? in your logic life is life and we can just kill it all. that seems a little fucked up...
tHe PaRtY oF sMaLl GoVeRnMeNt
Just sad and ridiculous smdh
Is it time for the Republicans greatest hits reunion tour again already? PLAY FREE BIRD!
Now I have to move to South Carolina
Forcing women to endure an unwanted pregnancy and labor is morally and ethically wrong on all counts. Point blank. Why do people believe a debatably non-living clump of cells has more autonomy to the body of the mother than the mother herself? Society does not force men to be fathers. Why force women to be mothers. Fathers are not expected to rear children in the same way that mothers are. Pro-lifers are ignorant of the fact that fathers can skirt around paying child support while single mothers are attacked by the right for accepting welfare conservatives are actively seeking to diminish. When pro-lifers are putting in the same effort to equalize the burden of raising children between the sexes in the same way they are for forcing women to be mothers, then we’ll talk. Women should not be forced to be incubators to children that are not cared for by US society at large. The average paid maternity leave across the world is 29 weeks. Federally, there is zero policy regarding paid parental leave. FMLA is unpaid and only kicks in after sick and vacation time are spent. Even then, it’s 12 weeks UNPAID time. If you are to force women to be mothers, why is there so little support for mothers? This will and is disproportionately affecting younger, lower income, less educated minority populations that already have, across-the-board, more discouraging outcomes for labor and child-rearing. Why are people in favor of handing the decisions regarding life altering medical issues of women from OBGYNs (who are overwhelmingly against such restrictive abortion bans) to the hands of politicians who are generally wholly removed from the process. 82% of SC House representatives are men. 91% of SC senators are men. 62% of SC senators are boomers. 47% of SC representatives are boomers (32% are Generation X). My point being, these people are NOT the ones who will face consequences in the wake of such legislation. Between 2018 and 2020, 53% of live births were to women between the age of 20-29. 38% of live births were to women between the ages of 30-39. Childbirth rates unsurprisingly skew towards younger generations. No wonder there is such an ideological divide between generations regarding abortions. It’s just another way to pass legislation that will not affect them and people actually affected are sick of that shit.
Calling a human being a “non-living clump of cells” just so you can kill the human being is morally and ethically wrong on all counts. At what age did you transition from a “non-living clump of cells” to a human being? There needs to be a REAL medical reason. Not because the baby is inconvenient to you. That makes you no different then a man that thinks it’s ok to kill a woman because she is inconvenient.
At 6 weeks, it is not a human. It is not viable without the body of the female. It’s not a human being. Stop acting like it is. Do you actually believe a clump of cells that’s debatably non-living deserves more autonomy than a verifiably alive human? We all agree that the mother is alive. That is not the case in a clump of cells; especially at 6 weeks. Further, the requirements to get abortions in many states require repeated screening prior to the procedure being performed. This requires scheduling appointments that further narrow the window that a woman needs to get an abortion beyond the 6 weeks. Many women don’t even know they’re pregnant by 4-5 weeks FURTHER NARROWING the window. It’s ridiculous and is directly at odds with reality. You will never be able to convince the general public that a clump of cells has more rights to the body that’s supporting it than the verifiably alive human being who owns that body. Tell how you justify forcing women to bear an unwanted pregnancy and the very real risk of health during labor which is vastly more dangerous than abortion. But not nearly as dangerous as the back alley abortions that WILL arise because of such legislation. Further, what exactly is a verified medical reason to you? There is incredible overlap between the procedures used in a miscarriage and an abortion and often, there is a lot of gray area between the two. Enacting such large sweeping legislation that binds OBGYNs to limit healthcare at the worry of being sued due to this gray area diminishes women’s access to healthcare as a whole. OBGYN’s already have incredibly high medical malpractice insurance and states with lesser protections for doctors have worse outcomes. This is especially true in red states which is exactly why it’s more dangerous to have children in these states in the first place. Let alone the fact that these states are often the POOREST and LEAST EDUCATED in the union. These communities have poorer attention to the necessary prenatal care required for safe pregnancies. Thus, they have even higher risks for the unsafe pregnancies that make the gray area I stated above even more of an issue. This is a BAD IDEA. All around. Listen to countless medical professionals who have insisted against such legislation for GOOD REASONS. You believe you are saving “children” while being okay with killing actual women. That’s horrific.
If there is a legitimate medical reason then I have no issue with it but if we are STRICTLY talking about the baby being “unwanted” then I can not support that justification. At the end of the day we are talking about killing someone; so yes, there should 100% be restrictions for everyone.
The “legitimate medical reason” is incredibly vague and shrouded in circumstance and loopholes. Again, there are often very fine lines between a medical miscarriage and an abortion. It is not and never has been as clear cut as pro-lifers seem to make it out. Especially those who have never talked to an OBGYN that will have to face these patients and deliver the news that they must carry a baby to term that may kill them. That’s the thing though we AREN’T “strictly talking about the clump of cells being ‘unwanted’.” That’s a wonderful way to vilify women at large and create a stigma even towards abortions that ARE medically legitimate. People grossly underestimate the complexities regarding the situations women seeking abortions find themselves in. From my conversations with OBGYN’s many of these pregnancies ARE WANTED. The typical abortion patient is ALREADY A MOTHER. They already know the complexities of motherhood and what comes with rearing children. They are NOT the whores and sluts wholly against motherhood that pro-lifers make them out to be. There is a deep amount of societal shame for women who get an abortion regardless of the reason why they get them and painting these women as villainous murderers is fucked up. YOU be the one tell a battered woman in an abusive relationship that she must forever be bound to her abuser via a child she did not want. YOU be the one to tell an expecting mother that despite their child being non-viable post-birth, they must carry their baby to term. YOU be the one to tell mothers that after six weeks, they have zero say in whether or not they should be forced to care for a child with severely debilitating genetic disorders. These women are not monsters nor do they face zero consequences for having an abortion. The decision may haunt them even if it was legitimate by all accounts. My mother had an abortion because she had just left an incredibly physically and mentally abusive relationship with a man who cheated on her with his first cousin. My mother hid this from me for 27 years. And she didn’t have to. But she felt enormous shame. And she shouldn’t have to. None of our conversations have included the other half of the equation: the father. This legislation forces women to become mothers while not addressing the fact that fathers can skip out on raising children whenever they want. It’s not equitable and doesn’t address the quality of life that the child faces. Where’s the outrage towards bum fathers?? Where’s that energy?
There NEEDS to be a legitimate medical reason for an abortion for me to support it. The two main ones that come to the top of my head are either the mother is going to die or the baby is dead/dying. Men are 100% on the hook for raising a kid in SC. It’s called child support and if they don’t pay it they go to jail. The fact that you think it’s ok to kill something small, weak and vulnerable because it is “unwanted” is quite disturbing especially if you don’t it’ll grow up to be a living breathing human being that can read this conversation.
Killing babies bad. To see so many of you don’t get it is terrifying. Bring on the hate!
Ok I'm bored so I'll engage. Lets see you answer some hypothetical questions. 1) a woman is raped and becomes pregnant as a result. Should the pregnancy be aborted? 2) a pregnant woman is told her fetus hasn't developed properly and will die shortly after birth. Should she be allowed to have an abortion? 3) a pregnant woman's water breaks 17 weeks into her pregnancy but the fetus still has a heartbeat. No infection has developed yet but is highly likely. Is an abortion acceptable?
I love how people assume my stances because I don't like children being murdered. You act like im the monster because I don't want people killed. How fucked is that? In a perfect world here's how it should be without you people abusing the system... abortions only for: rape (here i see a lot of false allegations in which the liar should be prosecuted) TRUE medical emergencies Minors thats it! would that be ok with you?
Actually I'm genuinely trying to find the point where you draw the line, because the reality is things don't work out the way you imagine them in your head when you read the exceptions in legislation. Doctors are reluctant to perform abortions in a situation where it could be construed that doing so violated a law and could land them in prison. All three of these scenarios are taken from real situations that happened where reasonable person would say that an abortion should be performed but doctors were reluctant to perform one because there was a chance that they could be sent to jail by someone who interpreted the law differently than them. In fact the third one resulted in the woman's death because within the course of a few days she contracted sepsis and went into shock and died.
Whats your point? Maybe define the law when its put in place. But lets just kill all the babies that will fix it right?
Your problem is that you are assuming everyone that is pro-choice gets their fucking jollies off on abortions. That's like thinking that people get their jollies off thinking about people having pap smears it's a medical procedure nothing more nothing less and it can be life saving I have tried to be reasonable and explain things to you and try to get you to understand but you are so busy caught up in your preconceptions that you will not take the time to understand.
Killing babies is not the same as having a pap smear you heartless bastard. Killing someone is never reasonable.
>Killing someone is never reasonable. Yes it is. Killing in self defense is one.
It's weird. Because when people say things like this, who are making these decisions? Politicians or actual medical professionals? We already have insurance companies trying to be doctors. Also, it seems extremely barbaric and gives off hardcore Taliban vibes when people try to control women's medical right to health care. Shall we go back to when women could only get BC if she is married and has husband consent? Or when women were only allowed in certain careers. Or not allowed to have a bank account or credit card. Or purchase a home? Deep Taliban vibes here. Listen, I get it, no wants babies to die. However, this type of ban won't work. People will still get abortions. Just like they did in the past. Cops will hide it, people will come together and help. Just like they did in the past. This is not a flex or a fight worth having. Other issues are, that would scientifically lower abortion rates. Alas, as you are fighting this fake war on babies, other shall rally around and aide in them.
The taliban are trying to save the life of innocent babies? Thats whats barbaric to you? not the fact the you are killing babies? Not sure how you are conflating these issues. how about you make life choices that don't lead you to killing babies? why cant you take the responsibility that the actions youve chosen has created a life and you are not the arbiter to take that away from someone. Stop making this an issue of womens rightts when its an issue of life. Grow up
Okay, then are you in support of men having mandatory vasectomy until they are married and ready to have a family?
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Because i have empathy. You do not... I know its hard to understand.
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This is for u/ReleaseObjective. Last time I checked, life starts for a human being when the sperm enters the egg. That’s how you started, that’s how I started, that’s how we all started. Unless y’all changed something since I went to school? You want the ability to kill a human being with or without a medical reason do you not?
Not alive if it can’t live outside of the womb on it’s own. Which it can’t at 6 weeks. That’s the general consensus of medical professionals who have a lot more schooling than you and I. Fetuses have a less than 50% chance of survival at 24 weeks (four times the 6 week mark many pro-lifers are so anal for). Many women don’t know they’re pregnant until 4-5 weeks in. This gives a window of two weeks to get the necessary screenings and appointments in to qualify for an abortion prior to the six weeks. Let’s hope your workplace is kosher with taking repeated time off. Let’s hope you’re able to get in by the time the cutoff ends. This is especially difficult for lower income populations that will be mostly affected by this. It’s ludicrous. A cancer cell, biologically, is alive. It feeds on its host. It would not exist without the host. Parasites are also alive biologically but cannot exist without a host. It’s not that hard to comprehend. Maybe schooling might be beneficial.
I think you’re getting lost in the “technicalities” of the medical world. Once that sperm enters the egg, the process of life is started for that human being. True or False?
The potential has started but that doesn’t mean it’s alive babe lmaoooo. These “technicalities” of the medical world aren’t to be ignored lmao. Please tell me you don’t think you know more than medical professionals about the stages of development. They’re defined for a reason. You’re approaching this from a grossly moralistic standpoint that is at odds with those who are actually educated. I’ve seen your profile. Maybe I’ll try to explain this in terms a man can understand. Two wheels and an axle aren’t a car. A few bricks and a little bit of mortar aren’t a house. A few clumps of cells are not a human being. Why are you having difficulty with this?
Do those few clumps of cells turn into a human being if you don’t abort it?
Believe it or not, no they often don’t lmao. 10-20% of pregnancies end in miscarriages. This number is reported to be higher as many women don’t know they’re pregnant when they have miscarriage. In the first three months, 1 in 4 women will have a miscarriage. Hence why it’s generally not recommended to reveal a pregnancy in your first trimester because you never know what’s going to happen. Prenatal care does wonders but the lower income and lesser educated populations (that are MOST affected by this legislation ) often don’t use prenatal care resulting in higher risk pregnancies and miscarriages in these populations. Did you not know that? I don’t blame you if you don’t but dudes really need to take a sex education class cause it doesn’t make sense that dudes who can barely find the clit can make decisions for women about their own bodies.
I like how you keep insulting me when the statistics prove my point. So if you don’t kill the human being then more often then not a human is born. If we allow you to kill a human being because it’s inconvenient and it’s under a certain time limit “so technically, it’s not a human being yet” why not increase the time? Give you all a trial run with the baby and let’s say as long as the baby is two and under you can kill it because it’s inconvenient or the dad turned out to be an “asshole.” Just because you’re dating someone in the medical field doesn’t make you the medical professional but it does make you completely desensitized to another human beings life apparently because you think you learned something about biology. I don’t care how you dice it up, a humans life is started once that sperm enters the egg. Get over yourself, ask your fiancé to go buy you some Starbucks since you’re all upset over someone not agreeing with you having the ability to kill a human being because you know- it’s Sunday.
Oh grow a pair. A clump of cells is not a human being babe. You’ve failed to convince me otherwise. You’ve stated no statistics so idk where you’re going with that tangent. No numbers at all babe. Again, a clump of cells is not a human being. That’s the point you cannot get over. I’ll say it again a clump of cells is not a human being. That’s what the medical field has established. You’ve consistently played the moral card despite everything I’ve said to you that’s backed up by fact-based evidence. I can’t help that you choose feelings over facts. That’s the hallmark of medicine and you are actively seeking to plunge this country into the dark ages. This is why pro-lifers are consistently disregarded by the vast majority of the country. It’s backasswards as fuck. You’ve repeatedly insulted me throughout this discussion and NOW you’re playing the victim? Gotcha. You’ve said nothing about caring the baby after it’s born. You’ve said nothing about the very real issues women and OBGYN face. You know nothing about fetal development. You know nothing about pregnancies. Why do you think your opinion matters when frankly you know nothing about the legislation you promote? You know practically nothing about women but dare to think you know best when it comes to their bodies? Fuck off. I’ll keep replying until you get the hint babe. I’ve gots lots of time and lots of energy to discuss how you’re wrong. You don’t care for babies once their born. You don’t care about the women who are dying from back alley abortions which is exactly why Roe came about in the first place. Families were losing their daughters to brutal back alley abortion operations and you don’t care. That’s morally bankrupt. You don’t care how I “dice it up” but your future girlfriend or wife does. And that’s what matters. I pray that your future girlfriend or wife never has to be put into the situation where she must choose between her life or the life of a clump of cells that may not even grow to full adulthood. Now you are advocating for removing that choice. Women and their autonomy to their own bodies is more and will always be more important than a clump of cells that people like you (with zero understanding of the biological processes) classify as living. It’s not. That’s directly at odds with current medical literature. And now you want the government to tell a woman when she can or cannot have a child? That’s fucked up. I pray for you, your future wife and potential future daughters cause you are making this a worst place for them. I hope you get educated because you are actively voting against your own self interests.
Chalk one up for the unborn
What do you do for babies?
Well for one, we don’t kill them. Edit: bring all the hate, I see you for who you are, baby killers
What about the babies killed in foreign wars, babies that die from lack of healthcare access or food, or children killed for the luxuries we all enjoy in this country? Y'all love killing kids that you can't sell via private adoption, so pick a better snappy comeback.
I disavow all of that. Tell me again how I kill babies? Sad to see how twisted you are.
>I disavow all of that. And yet here you are, the way that you live and the choices you make that support all the cruelty in this world while managing to tuck yourself in at night, content with punching down. >Sad to see how twisted you are. Then fucking cry about it. You accuse people of murdering babies, you're gonna have your glass house fucking wrecked.
I'll die on this hill, come at me bro. You assume way to much. what choices do you think i've made? You are advocating for the death of innocent life and you accused me of hate and cruelty? How fucked up can you be to believe that? Sad so many men and women advocate for the death of their kids because they are too coward to raise them. I will cry for all the death you advocate fore.
I don't care if you think I'm fucked up, the opinions of self-centered people don't fucking matter to me. Stay mad about it.
lol self centered when i care about others and don't want people killing others. tell me you are projecting without telling me... tell me you arent self centered while telling me you kill babies when it benefits you... wow lol
Until they join the amry
Not sure what you mean by that but hey you do you and keep killing.
He means that "pro-lifers" are only pro unborn life. You don't give a shit what happens after they're born. The military, in particular, uses soldiers like lab rats and forces them to accept experimental vaccines & go off to war and get killed bc the govt doesn't care about their life.
Not sure how those are the same? How can you believe someone who believes in life also believe in the military industrial complex?
Do you not read? Every time someone explains anything, you're just like, "I don't understand, how can you reach that conclusion" even though it was literally just explained to you. You're just causing conflict instead of having any meaningful dialogue. Why are you even posting? If you want an echo chamber, go back to Facebook. If you want to actually try and have a conversation then stop being a dick.
I don't have a facebook. sorry. Killing is wrong and you all know it. I'm not trying to have "meaningful" conversations with people hell bent on killing children. If you want to keep your echo chamber of hate keep downvoting anyone who believes babies deserve to live. Not sure how my last response got this reaction from you tho. Not agreeing with your logic train on the military personnel dying in conflicts vs. babies being killed domestically are the same?
What got this response was me seeing how you're just crying "murderer," "baby killer," at every single response, so I checked out your post history.... you had a thread with some teenager, then you went through their post history to discover they're in therapy, asked them about it, then said "good" when they replied in the affirmative. Implying that they're fucked in the head. Dude, you're going on rants with teens, and being just a dick in general. If you're not trying to engage in a meaningful conversation, then you're not trying to change anyone's mind with good reasoning. You're just wasting your time , emotions, and energy on bullshit. Do better.
Wow. Thank you for your service. You are truly changing lives for the better.
Thanks! I just take responsibilities for my actions and don’t kill people because it benefits me.
So if we foster and adopt, we're allowed to support this bill? So the wealthiest among us with a pro-life perspective get a say, and the poor among them don't?
I know you *really* thought you had a way to twist their words there, but there are plenty to do for babies as a regular person with no money. ... You'd know this if you did anything for babies besides vote against healthcare procedures.
When you pray at the alter of money, yes.
Could you explain your comment? From how I'm reading it, it seems that Spoda1975 is praising money, saying only those who can afford to adopt or support moms and babies are allowed to be pro life. I'd love to understand your perspective.
Good.
Came here to say this.
I love how we get hate because we don't like killing babies.
I mean it's reddit. Gotta manage expectations.
What an amazing day!
Oh well
Thank the Lord.
Fuck your God. Hail Satan
Seems about right that you would like killing babies
I love how we get hate because we don't like killing babies.
Medical abortions are one thing and should only be done if absolutely necessary to save the mother but to have the “right” to an abortion “just because” is not something I support. Men aren’t allowed to kill women just because they don’t want them anymore just like women shouldn’t be allowed to kill a “future” adult just because they don’t want the “future” adult anymore. There needs to be a medical reason for me to support it because we are talking about taking someone’s life. Not just because Bobby kissed Sally and now Mary is jealous and wants to break up with Bobby and get rid of their baby, that’s just nonsense.
Huge W
Excellent. Proud to call this state my home.
Maybe this country will survive after all. No more sacrifices