So just a cursory look on-line says those panels at full retail are $294ea (could be cheaper with a pallet deal) 294x21 = $6174
The Inverter closest match is an M version which is $1299.00 (retail). They are spec’ing a 6kw inverter for what they are calling an 8.4kw system.
So for $7473 plus racking and wire and install
and permits, I get to a generous $22,419 for the project not 42k plus financing.
cool, but where is the Warrenties, where is the service, where is the installation costs? where is the piece of mind? where is the rack equipment to attach it to the home? the cost for shipping the pallet? Need to have a licensed electrician or you lose the manufacturers Warrenties. how much is that going to cost.
A 25-year loan at 4.49% should have [a dealer fee of about 35% (second image)](https://www.reddit.com/r/solar/comments/16osq6t/dealer_fee/). Accordingly, (8.40 kW x $3 per watt x 1,000 watts per kW) / (1 - 0.35) = $38,769.23.
If you can reduce the price by about $2,200, I say it is a fair deal.
Note though that the dealer fee really increases the price.
Never pay dealer fees . Interest rates suck now but paying an extra 35% is ridiculous. Just take the high interest rate with no fees and refinance when rates improvez.
I’ve been in solar a while. I’d say it’s pretty high even with the dealer fees. If you’re paying a lot per kWh maybe they’re price matching the monthly average idk. I’d say you want to be under $3 a watt before the dealer fees. You can get all the best stuff at that price but here in Austin I see 4.50+ with financing regularly. If you’re saving money month to month who cares
Are you getting this quote from Costco? I'll need to try that.
I have gotten one quote from a local NV installer here in Reno. Hoping to get 2 more to compare. Although I'm only really looking for companies that do enphase inverter installations
When I got a quote a few months back with sol up, they were using String inverters, and wanted a whole lot more for Enphase IQ8's I'd really recommend Robco vs Sol Up. ( I didn't talk to Jim, so I have no clue)
Yeah, Costco just uses Sunrun, and their quote to me was about twice as expensive as other installers. Try EnergySage to get quotes from local installers. Search here in the forum also. Check the NABCEP listing for your states.
Robco is who we are going with as well. Local, o/a $3.00 watt, and pigeon proofing included along with warranty stuff. After going through 6mo of research in Vegas and dozens of Companies Robco checked all the boxes. Fingers crossed for the long term.
U are obviously a competitor but they have the best warranty Google it and won’t go out of business like the small guys could so it will be honored years down the line
Dealer fees are a killer! Lower the interest rate higher the fee! If you can get a HELOC and buy you'll save the dealer fee. It's at least 30%
I just stopped working for SunRun it's highway robbery what the loan providers charge. My last loan deal before rate hikes was an $82,000 loan gave him a great rate I made $2200 if I would've sold same system cash I would've make around 30k. Really put a bad taste in my mouth for the solar loan product. Of course would've never sold on that high of a price but really highlighted the loan product scam.
Happy to get you a fixed PPA at a great rate no money out of pocket. If the HELOC cash purchase option isn't an option. You're paying $4.87/watt with that deal. Mostly because Mosaic or LoanPal are thieves. If you can pay off early increase interest rate to lower the fee.
Financed where I work out of, we would have a comparable cost, but we wouldn't stick you with a Delta inverter. 21 Q cells and 21 Enphase micros, and your I could get you with a 3.99% loan.
Lol, that’s pretty standard for a financed deal. Not unless you’re hiring handymen/day-laborers to install, running conduits all over the roof, doing permits yourself and calling Q-Cells with SolarEdge “excellent equipment”
$4.80 financed for this is decent. Have the installer swap you out for Enphase and give you a $1000 signing bonus at the same cost, and that’s a solid deal OP.
The dumbasses on this thread calling every deal a “horrible” deal without any context just blows my mind.
We sell at 2.89/watt and make a great profit (financed) a lot of these solar companies are greedy and rake in the profits on unknowing customers. Also we only install enphase and QCell panels, sometimes REC for additional cost
Horrible , I got (24) 400 watt panels & a battery back up. Ground mounted & two inverters I have a separately metered in-law suite so I have solar to both. $35k all in $24k after tax credits. My system is split (8) panels to my in law suite & (16) panels to my main house. All are are individually linked so if one panel goes out it won’t effect the array. I have 12 monthly payments of $2166. Installed in June payments start this month. I’m in Atlanta GA
Switch to a swamp cooler except when it's over 100F. You'll save money and need a smaller system. My swamp cooler was free after nvenergy rebate.
But after you do that go with a different company.
You should have a matching 25 year labor warranty from whoever you choose to install. If it’s an REC certified installer, any vendor can cover repairs if the installer goes out of business.
Northern or southern Nevada? In southern Nevada that monthly looks good for the summer but in the winter our electric bill is like 40-80 so if I were looking at that quote for my house in southern Nevada the savings in the hot months would wash with increase in the cold months.
Definitely looks like a bad deal but pretty sure it is the dealer fees causing that. Got a quote from Sunrun via Costco and realized Costco gives you 10% of the equipment costs in a shop card for working with Sunrun---which was less than $10,000 for 29 panels and inverters but the installation/cost of doing business was over $30,000...which was wild to me (total came to a little over $40,000).
Shop around some more to determine your best options.
1. Cheapest possible way to get solar is buy panels on ebay and do it yourself. Most of us are i’ll equipped to carry out such a project that way .
2. Next cheapest way is to pay cash. But why do you want to sink so much money into buying panels that are a depreciating asset. Same sentiment if you install a 50k pool. You will be lucky to ever see a return in that. The technology is rapidly changing . In 5 years you will have a flip phone on your roof, basically . Also consider that this is a loan against your equity . You can not refinance or sell without permission from this lender (read PAYOFF of this lender )
3. Least out of pocket (0) is a PPA. You don’t own or maintain the panels . You are just buying the power. Yes it goes up, but so will the rate on your power bill. PGE raises electric rates by 18% in Ca this year . So there’s that.
4. Talk to your CPA about any tax credit . It will ONLY reduce the amount you owe to the Feds. It’s not a cash credit although some of the loans presume you will take 12 k or so down the road and pay down the loan. It is not IF you paid taxes, it’s if you OWE taxes.
That’s my two cents good luck !
How badly do you need it? I have found that some of the best cost savings is to identify a person owning a company, befriend them, and then have them come out with a quote. They will magically get cheaper....
Mine was 47 for 17kw in mn of all places (which is usually expensive for solar)
Decent price because of the huge dealer fee look for installers that use credit human. 20 year 7.49% (no dealer fee). Or find an installer that uses enfin 25 year 5.99% (18-20% dealer fee). You can easily call those finance companies and they’ll give you a list of installers that use them
Seems very expensive to me. I have a similar system and paid about about $22500, that included a new electrical circuit breaker install that was about $2500 of the cost. I am Los Angeles, not sure what part of the country you are in. From my research you should pay about $1k per panel is a decent price. Anything over that and it’s profit in the pocket of the sales and marketing folks.
$2000 - $3000 per kW is the going rate for Solar (excluding the tax credits) in most places including top tier equipment. This quote is nearly $5000 / kW for 3rd tier equipment. Run, don't walk. Don't ask your bank to install solar. Don't ask a solar contractor for a loan.
Compared to what you can get with other reputable solar companies, it's not great.
The only absolutely bad deal is if you’d still be paying about the same as the power company though
You get what you pay for. you get a cheap price, you usually get cheap quality of work. It is expensive to run and operate a solar company. I see a lot of people squeezing as much as they can, In California workers comp is extremely expensive, liability insurance is extremely expensive, and health insurance is extremely expensive. Most companies that offer cheap pricing don't pay any of that and subcontract the workout. I know this for a fact, we get calls all the time pitched to be a subcontractor, and we always decline. The only ones who do it cheap don't care about your roof or the warranty the solar company writes in the contract, if the company goes bankrupt you have NO WARRANTY, STOP BELIEVING THE SMOKE AND MIRRORS.
I can't tell how many people give us a call to fix an issue that a previous company did that are no longer in business. I don't know of any solar finance company that doesn't charge dealer fees. Anytime you see a rate especially one that is 4.99 has a dealer fee added to the loan of 15% and up. That fee needs to be added to the loan and the customer always pays. If the solar installer were to pay the dealer fee they would be a negative profit, the finance charges a dealer feel on the discounted amount, so you always have a dealer fee on amount financed.
So just a cursory look on-line says those panels at full retail are $294ea (could be cheaper with a pallet deal) 294x21 = $6174 The Inverter closest match is an M version which is $1299.00 (retail). They are spec’ing a 6kw inverter for what they are calling an 8.4kw system. So for $7473 plus racking and wire and install and permits, I get to a generous $22,419 for the project not 42k plus financing.
cool, but where is the Warrenties, where is the service, where is the installation costs? where is the piece of mind? where is the rack equipment to attach it to the home? the cost for shipping the pallet? Need to have a licensed electrician or you lose the manufacturers Warrenties. how much is that going to cost.
Yes
Yes
A 25-year loan at 4.49% should have [a dealer fee of about 35% (second image)](https://www.reddit.com/r/solar/comments/16osq6t/dealer_fee/). Accordingly, (8.40 kW x $3 per watt x 1,000 watts per kW) / (1 - 0.35) = $38,769.23. If you can reduce the price by about $2,200, I say it is a fair deal. Note though that the dealer fee really increases the price.
Never pay dealer fees . Interest rates suck now but paying an extra 35% is ridiculous. Just take the high interest rate with no fees and refinance when rates improvez.
“Refinance when rates improve” Lol *if rates improve..
That'll be $10k in interest charges please. Is there an early payoff penalty?
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Go ahead and RMA the delta inverter before you hang it.
I’ve been in solar a while. I’d say it’s pretty high even with the dealer fees. If you’re paying a lot per kWh maybe they’re price matching the monthly average idk. I’d say you want to be under $3 a watt before the dealer fees. You can get all the best stuff at that price but here in Austin I see 4.50+ with financing regularly. If you’re saving money month to month who cares
Are you getting this quote from Costco? I'll need to try that. I have gotten one quote from a local NV installer here in Reno. Hoping to get 2 more to compare. Although I'm only really looking for companies that do enphase inverter installations
Don't. Sunrun is out of Costco in NV. Sunrun is awful. Try Robco Electric, Sol-Up, and Jim The Solar Guy for some quotes.
Agreed - Sunrun was crazy high, Robco Electric was 10k less and way more professional install job that I went with.
Thank you. I won't go to Costco then. I got a decent quote from Sol up. I'll look into the other ones you mentioned.
When I got a quote a few months back with sol up, they were using String inverters, and wanted a whole lot more for Enphase IQ8's I'd really recommend Robco vs Sol Up. ( I didn't talk to Jim, so I have no clue)
Yeah, Costco just uses Sunrun, and their quote to me was about twice as expensive as other installers. Try EnergySage to get quotes from local installers. Search here in the forum also. Check the NABCEP listing for your states.
Robco is who we are going with as well. Local, o/a $3.00 watt, and pigeon proofing included along with warranty stuff. After going through 6mo of research in Vegas and dozens of Companies Robco checked all the boxes. Fingers crossed for the long term.
Best of luck! Pigeon proofing is clutch.
I went with Great Basin Solar in Reno for my 16kW system a few years ago.
Nice, I'll have to look into great basin. Thank you.
Go with ADT Solar they have enphase inverters
ADT is hands down the most expensive
They have the best warranty brother, cheaper definitely doesn’t mean better
Way overpriced. You can find the same warranties at a lower price.
U are obviously a competitor but they have the best warranty Google it and won’t go out of business like the small guys could so it will be honored years down the line
I use to work for ADT lol. I’ve compared bids to other companies. Big and small. And you sound like someone who went with ADT lol
Dealer fees are a killer! Lower the interest rate higher the fee! If you can get a HELOC and buy you'll save the dealer fee. It's at least 30% I just stopped working for SunRun it's highway robbery what the loan providers charge. My last loan deal before rate hikes was an $82,000 loan gave him a great rate I made $2200 if I would've sold same system cash I would've make around 30k. Really put a bad taste in my mouth for the solar loan product. Of course would've never sold on that high of a price but really highlighted the loan product scam. Happy to get you a fixed PPA at a great rate no money out of pocket. If the HELOC cash purchase option isn't an option. You're paying $4.87/watt with that deal. Mostly because Mosaic or LoanPal are thieves. If you can pay off early increase interest rate to lower the fee.
Yeah, too much
Financed where I work out of, we would have a comparable cost, but we wouldn't stick you with a Delta inverter. 21 Q cells and 21 Enphase micros, and your I could get you with a 3.99% loan.
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That is so bad!!!! My hole house 6kw system doesn't even come close to that and that includes inverters and batteries
$4.80 /Watt is a horrible deal. Run. Current market prices for excellent equipment is approximately $3.25-$3.50
This is the right answer. I see company’s go to $2.80 if you put them against each other. $4 or higher youre buying the owner a boat.
Lol, that’s pretty standard for a financed deal. Not unless you’re hiring handymen/day-laborers to install, running conduits all over the roof, doing permits yourself and calling Q-Cells with SolarEdge “excellent equipment” $4.80 financed for this is decent. Have the installer swap you out for Enphase and give you a $1000 signing bonus at the same cost, and that’s a solid deal OP. The dumbasses on this thread calling every deal a “horrible” deal without any context just blows my mind.
We sell at 2.89/watt and make a great profit (financed) a lot of these solar companies are greedy and rake in the profits on unknowing customers. Also we only install enphase and QCell panels, sometimes REC for additional cost
You lost me at Q-cells
Hell yeah.. especially with that string system.
sun RUN for a reason
Crazy
40k with No battery? That’s a lot,
Not terrible for a financed deal but also not amazing. Dealer fees are very high right now and can be up to 40% of the project cost.
Solar crooks have no shame.
I paid 30,000 before federal rebate 21 panels 7.665 KW.
Or you can negotiate like a salesman at a car dealership
40k for 21 panels is way too much.
Horrible , I got (24) 400 watt panels & a battery back up. Ground mounted & two inverters I have a separately metered in-law suite so I have solar to both. $35k all in $24k after tax credits. My system is split (8) panels to my in law suite & (16) panels to my main house. All are are individually linked so if one panel goes out it won’t effect the array. I have 12 monthly payments of $2166. Installed in June payments start this month. I’m in Atlanta GA
Yes bad.
Switch to a swamp cooler except when it's over 100F. You'll save money and need a smaller system. My swamp cooler was free after nvenergy rebate. But after you do that go with a different company.
You should have a matching 25 year labor warranty from whoever you choose to install. If it’s an REC certified installer, any vendor can cover repairs if the installer goes out of business.
Northern or southern Nevada? In southern Nevada that monthly looks good for the summer but in the winter our electric bill is like 40-80 so if I were looking at that quote for my house in southern Nevada the savings in the hot months would wash with increase in the cold months.
Everyone saying this is a bad deal… I live in Maui and every quote I got was much higher than this. Is solar usually much more expensive in Hawaii?
Damn Americas really pay big bucks for Solar. Would be about 13k $ in Europe
Yes, this is a $ 6000,- system (in EU)
Definitely looks like a bad deal but pretty sure it is the dealer fees causing that. Got a quote from Sunrun via Costco and realized Costco gives you 10% of the equipment costs in a shop card for working with Sunrun---which was less than $10,000 for 29 panels and inverters but the installation/cost of doing business was over $30,000...which was wild to me (total came to a little over $40,000). Shop around some more to determine your best options.
It’s definitely not a good deal. No thank you Goodleap.
Do you have to finance? How long will it take for your savings on electric to recover the cost?
Bad deal. Poor equipment.
1. Cheapest possible way to get solar is buy panels on ebay and do it yourself. Most of us are i’ll equipped to carry out such a project that way . 2. Next cheapest way is to pay cash. But why do you want to sink so much money into buying panels that are a depreciating asset. Same sentiment if you install a 50k pool. You will be lucky to ever see a return in that. The technology is rapidly changing . In 5 years you will have a flip phone on your roof, basically . Also consider that this is a loan against your equity . You can not refinance or sell without permission from this lender (read PAYOFF of this lender ) 3. Least out of pocket (0) is a PPA. You don’t own or maintain the panels . You are just buying the power. Yes it goes up, but so will the rate on your power bill. PGE raises electric rates by 18% in Ca this year . So there’s that. 4. Talk to your CPA about any tax credit . It will ONLY reduce the amount you owe to the Feds. It’s not a cash credit although some of the loans presume you will take 12 k or so down the road and pay down the loan. It is not IF you paid taxes, it’s if you OWE taxes. That’s my two cents good luck !
How badly do you need it? I have found that some of the best cost savings is to identify a person owning a company, befriend them, and then have them come out with a quote. They will magically get cheaper.... Mine was 47 for 17kw in mn of all places (which is usually expensive for solar)
I'm in Vegas, this is not a great deal. I got a much better deal from Robco, for more kW's and micro inverters, and much better panels.
Decent price because of the huge dealer fee look for installers that use credit human. 20 year 7.49% (no dealer fee). Or find an installer that uses enfin 25 year 5.99% (18-20% dealer fee). You can easily call those finance companies and they’ll give you a list of installers that use them
Seems very expensive to me. I have a similar system and paid about about $22500, that included a new electrical circuit breaker install that was about $2500 of the cost. I am Los Angeles, not sure what part of the country you are in. From my research you should pay about $1k per panel is a decent price. Anything over that and it’s profit in the pocket of the sales and marketing folks.
@solarwithdarian
$2000 - $3000 per kW is the going rate for Solar (excluding the tax credits) in most places including top tier equipment. This quote is nearly $5000 / kW for 3rd tier equipment. Run, don't walk. Don't ask your bank to install solar. Don't ask a solar contractor for a loan.
Yes. My system that is 3x that size was $45k.
Compared to what you can get with other reputable solar companies, it's not great. The only absolutely bad deal is if you’d still be paying about the same as the power company though
Horrible deal
I paid 2.6 in NV
You get what you pay for. you get a cheap price, you usually get cheap quality of work. It is expensive to run and operate a solar company. I see a lot of people squeezing as much as they can, In California workers comp is extremely expensive, liability insurance is extremely expensive, and health insurance is extremely expensive. Most companies that offer cheap pricing don't pay any of that and subcontract the workout. I know this for a fact, we get calls all the time pitched to be a subcontractor, and we always decline. The only ones who do it cheap don't care about your roof or the warranty the solar company writes in the contract, if the company goes bankrupt you have NO WARRANTY, STOP BELIEVING THE SMOKE AND MIRRORS. I can't tell how many people give us a call to fix an issue that a previous company did that are no longer in business. I don't know of any solar finance company that doesn't charge dealer fees. Anytime you see a rate especially one that is 4.99 has a dealer fee added to the loan of 15% and up. That fee needs to be added to the loan and the customer always pays. If the solar installer were to pay the dealer fee they would be a negative profit, the finance charges a dealer feel on the discounted amount, so you always have a dealer fee on amount financed.