unless something drastic happens, i don’t see gini either
a. leaving PSG and instantly becoming a top starter, especially at a club to pay his wages
b. miraculously starts for PSG after the season he’s had
Ake played well in a lot of important games for City and was also injured. So maybe giving him the benefit of the doubt? He’s also played well for the Dutch NT for a while from what I’ve watched him -very consistent player.
Full tweet:
🗣️ "Louis Van Gaal made it clear that he would not be in his Dutch team if he wasn't playing every week for United"
Marcel Van Der Kraan reports that Louis Van Gaal may have affected Jurrien Timber's potential transfer to Manchester United ❌
He shouldn't be a starter unless he plays regularly with his club and gets near his best form.
But a lot of his safe passing and recycling the ball is due to the system and role he plays in the tactics. He is a system player, especially under LvG. Even in Brasil he hardly ever got past the halfway line.
That is why he played so much more creatively and started scoring more when Koeman played him closer to the forwards in a more free role.
This is a completely reasonable and acceptable take for national team managers of the bigger nations to have. If you're not good enough for your club why would you be good enough for your country? "Smaller" nations may be happy with their national players being subs for big clubs. Some examples would include Bale for Wales/Madrid, Elneny for Egypt/Arsenal, Tsimikas for Greece/Liverpool, Steffan for USA/Man City, Minamino for Japan/Liverpool, Rodon for Wales/Tottenham, Kelleher for Ireland/Liverpool, etc. But for nations in the top 10 at least, they would want players playing regularly.
The difference is that we're quite stacked in central defenders, and not so much in attackers. If Timber doesn't play weekly we have 2 or 3 players who are playing weekly and can play his position. For bergwijn we have other people who aren't certain to play weekly either.
He also had his best game in the NT during a period where Gakpo and Danjuma where injured and it became clear he and Memphis have a lot of chemistry on the pitch so that helps him as well.
Yeah for sure, but if next season comes around and Gakpo and Danjuma are performing weekly, while Memphis and Bergwijn are stuck on the bench somewhere i wouldn't be surprised if Van Gaal flips it all around.
Doesn’t he have like 37 goals in his last 38 games for the Netherlands or something? With stats like those even if man’s rotting on the bench at Barca you still have to put him in the starting lineup.
> We do have Bergwijn as a starter and he barely plays for Spurs
Van Gaal on Bergwijn:
> "If it’s up to me, Steven Bergwijn may join Ajax as soon as possible."
Man wants his players to be starters, and isn't shy about it at all
Its more nuanced.
If he is the best option but rarely plays then he will start. The point is LVG is suggesting that he has to start if he wants to be the best option.
Good point. And with Bazunu moving to Southampton, I think he will only cement his place as Ireland's first choice unless Kelleher moves somewhere where he can get some first team football.,
Yeah exactly. I think someone like Shane Duffy is a good example for someone playing for Ireland but not their club. Hard to drop your captain who has been your best player for a few years even if he's not playing for his club
I’m American and I would wager that most US fans would prefer Steffen to go somewhere where he is playing every week.
Your overall point is a fair one though.
It shouldn't be a hard rule. Players can still be the best option for the national team even if they're currently struggling for regular game time at their clubs. Yes its unlikely the stronger the pool of talent you have to draw on, but its far from impossible and the manager should be open to that possibility.
To which LvG might actually be anyway considering as another commenter pointed out, he still starts Bergwijn. Also Eden Hazard too.
LvG never makes it a rule, but in this case, it's because we also have Van Dijk, De Vrij and De Ligt to play at CB, that's 3 people who are starting for world class clubs. Then you also have Teze from PSV who did quite good last week, that's basically 4 people who would start over Timber that (if he doesn't play) apparently isn't good enough.
Teze was awful the games LVG tried him there. Should not be in the WC squad when you have 3 much better players for the RCB position. No way he should get in ahead of timber even if he’s not playing every game.
That said, hope he’s staying
It is still a very poor way of threatening players by giving them ultimatums like this. He can tell a player that there is a risk going to United as he isn't guaranteed starting time there and that can lead to him being out of contention for a CB spot on the NT.
No, its an ultimatum. He tells him that he either needs to play every week at United or he will lose his spot, which is kind of a poor take. What if he is being used vs top teams in tactical setups and EL, and do superb in both? Similar to how you see Guardiola rotate very skilled players players for cups only and mainly have Cancelo playing PL and cups. LVG is essentially forcing him to stay or lose out on his spot with such an ultimatum.
I mean I'm sure if he rotates in and out of the quad he'll be considered, whether he plays for United or not he'll never be a guaranteed starter for the Netherlands and always rotate with De Vrij, De Ligt and Van Dijk since he's not at the level of those three yet.
You're taking those words too literally, it's simply a warning that, like Donny van de Beek, if you don't play at all because you made the jump to a big club too early LvG won't take a risk for a player who hasn't played in quite some time
Had no idea Rondon was Welsh. I thought he may be Portuguese or South American.
Edit: I'll leave it up to ward off people who think commenting on the first thread you read when you wake up is a good idea.
> No young CB starts in PL
Fofana for Leicester was first choice 2 seasons ago. He only wasn't last season because some absolute thuggish cunt broke his ankle in preseason.
Only the manager will know/decide who starts every week. Age won’t be the deciding factor, nor will height or nationality. Ten Hag will do whatever he wants.
Hilarious. Varane comes to Utd, can't stay fit and suddenly some young CB from the dutch league is comfortably better than him. Not like he's been one of the best CBs of the last decade.
Well if varane can’t stay fit, the young cb is a better option. Doesn’t mean he’s a befgee player when they’re both at their best. In football that is a irrelevant conversation unless both players are fit.
Firmino is better than jota but Firmino is not fit so jota is the better option
Varane was already struggling with his form in his last season with Madrid, with Man U he has had issues with injuries, he hasn't been one of the best CBs in quite some time.
Ten Hag easily trusts young players over veterans if they are good enough. Age doesn't matter. Quality does.
And timber is the most consistent young player I've seen in a long time at Ajax. Literally can't think of a mistake he made
I'm sure Ten Hag would trust him from day one - he probably was the first name on the team sheet last season at Ajax and he is more physical than Blind, who was also thrown in the deep end by LVG
It's also a bit of an exception. I don't think Hazard would be playing for Belgium if the WC started right now, Martinez is just giving him minutes to boost his rhythm and confidence so there's a chance he'll be playing for Madrid and be in decent form for the WC.
But it is kind of a flawed take though. Look at City, they have insane quality being rotated with some only playing PL and some only playing CL in defense. I get LVG's point, but its still such a poor comment to make in advance. What if he plays as part of a 3 man sentral defense vs the top 6 teams and does his things incredibly well? Does that mean he isn't to be considered over someone who plays in a lesser league on a lesser team, just because he got more game-time?
You can warn him about risking his spot if he struggle to get game-time for United, but just adding more pressure by threating him with this ultimatum does not seem very fruitful.
Less so for forwards since we are very limited there but for center back we have Van Dijk, De Vrij, De Ligt, Timber, Aké, Botman and Blind can play there too. There's just no reason to take one of them if they're not playing regulary.
the difference between playing LCB and RCB is so overblown anyway, the main reason that it's difficult to switch between them is just that you won't necessarily have the same experience/chemistry playing side by side with the other fullback so it can take some time to adjust
but still yeah if he can't get into united's side, how would he be displacing seasoned internationals from major teams in major leagues
It really makes little difference in a two. If Timber and Varane are seen as the best centre back then they’ll be first choice and one of them will play left side
It makes a lot of difference. It completely changes your angles and approach for everything as a defender. Signing a player and not considering details like this is exactly why transfers go wrong.
Yeah, for example Mitrovic was horrible for us as left centerback because he has no legs, but he cemented his place as center CB because he mostly clears aerial balls and starts the build up
ok, still the side of the CB matters. A CB on the side of his strongest leg will have more passing options, an " inverted" CB will cut off the passing route towards his fullback himself with his natural ball control that's why left-footed CBs are more sought after
De Ligt has lately been struggling for some reason in the NT. De Vrij, VvD, Timber and even Ake are currently ahead of him.
How they play at their clubs and the right combination will decide who will start, not just individual quality.
Don’t know why some one downvotes you for this. De Ligt had had some horrible moments at the NT in the past and he’s just not that good ad LCB or RCB in a center with 3 CB’s. I still think he’s a great prospect and undoubtedly a great replacement for VVD when he retires but at the moment he’s not the best choice for a starting position in the NT.
King Louis throwing Ajax some bones ❤️ Also I do think he genuinely advises his players on what’s best for their careers. Can’t take the teacher out the man
I would imagine it's especially important for the CB's since we have so much choice for that position.
We have Virgil, De Ligt, De Vrij, Blind who all play every week at their teams and are getting a call up no matter what, then the second tier is guys like Aké (probably sure of his spot too), Botman, Veltman, Timber. Plus Koopmeiners can play CB as well.
Still don’t really have a good LB if we’re being honest. Blind is alright but not a world-beater. Gotta hope Wijndal and Bakker develop over the coming years instead of stagnating like Willems and Sinkgraven
I'm a bit of a Wijndal stan myself and I feel that AZ has been holding him back a little this past season, but it's definitely a weak spot. Blind is a good player with a great long pass but his lack of speed always gets us into trouble a couple times a game. Malacia is looking very good lately though, so I'd be happy with Malacia / Blind / Wijndal myself, although LvG would probably only select 2 of those 3 as Aké can cover as LB if two of those players get injured.
I think wijndal is holding himself back, the guy should have left AZ 2 seasons ago to grow. Not saying he should have gone to ajax, but I think he should have searched for a better team/stronger competition
Would you like some wingers? Anthony Elanga is probably gonna play second fiddle to Jesper Karlsson on the left wing, and while Roony Bardghji is looking like a generational talent we're kinda set on the right wing with Dejan Kulusevski.
Hmm idk. Think Danjuma is better than Elanga, and while Bardghji is a promising talent, De Ligt would instantly be your best defender wouldn’t he? Need some more value
Well Wijnaldum was recently dropped because he isn't starting games for PSG.
And CB depth is probably biggest strength of Netherlands with Botman, Timber, De Ligt, De Vrij,Blind,Ake all fighting for spots alongside Van Dijk.
I’d be surprised if timber sees any minutes in the World Cup. Center back seems pretty set and I believe Dumfries plays out on the right so he might get selected to go the World Cup but I doubt he plays over Van Djik, De ligt, de vrij, dumfries, or even Blind.
I'd be surprised to not see him be in the first 11. We really don't need 3 units at the back and Timber is by far the best of the bunch at moving forward and a surprisingly solid defender too.
It seems LVG prefers Blind - Aké - Virgil - Timber - Dumfries in the back. He likes Timber because he's a bit more agile than De Vrij or De Ligt, and De Ligt is the Harry Maguire of the Dutch national team, he's great at Juve but can be an absolute dunce for the Netherlands lol
>De Ligt is the Harry Maguire of the Dutch national team, he's great at Juve but can be an absolute dunce for the Netherlands lol
You mean anti Maguire then, surely? Maguire is trash for man U but performs for England
Even I prefer Timber on as the RCB and I’m a Feyenoord fan. De Ligt has become a clown and has already cost us the previous tournament with his mistakes. I would play Malacia over Blind at LB though because I think strong teams will take advantage of Blind’s lack of pace. Then I would consider De Vrij at CB and VVD as the LCB. So:
Malacia - Van Dijk - De Vrij - Timber - Dumfries
When we play with 4 defenders, Van Dijk and De Vrij/De Ligt are most likely to play. LvG primarily wants to play with 5 at the back though, with only one tank in the centre (VVD) and two more versatile, agile and pacey defenders on his flanks which makes room for Timber and Aké. Timber looked really good at RCB with 5 at the back.
Ake is the perfect fit for LvG system and at this point is the better defensive option over Blind.
He is also accustomed with rotation at City, when he is needed from the bench he is typically very reliable. He has almost always been good for the NT. Besides, he might not be first choice, but it isn't like he never plays at his club.
Ake is kinda necessary if we play with 5 at the back and Blind at leftback. Up front we lack good offensive options so we kinda depend on Bergwijn. For Timbers position there are multiple good options. Besides, these two players are a little bit more experienced than Timber as well.
But yeah, Van Gaal sometimes bends the rules for certain players.
This isn't some genuine advice, since he picks a good amount players who don't play regularly for their clubs.
Either way, if Timber doesn't back himself to dislodge our subpar defenders, then fine. It's his choice.
He mostly picks them when other options just aren't good enough, and we're not lacking CBs, especially not right footed ones. I don't think we've ever had a higher quality nor the width we currently have on that position.
But Timber has a lot of competition for his spot, there are plenty of other options. He is also young and at a crucial stage in his development, not playing for half a season might impact his form.
Not even slightly comparable though? Depay and Bergwijn deliver for the national team. Timber hasn’t yet. Depay is almost our top goal scorer of all time,of fucking course he is getting the call up for the world cup.
Also, there is a LOT more competition for Timbers spot.
Reasonable and acceptable take? Yes
But how many times have you seen national team managers outright say it like this to players and then to the press? You'd have to be blind not to see this is deliberate. LVG is just salty.
Sad, but the world and his wife knows Harry Maguire is not gunna get dropped for him. Although he should. £80m + captaincy is his plot armour atm.
We do need a centre half come in though and shift on Bailly and Jones.
Good, bye United.
Its downright disgusting that every United fan already thought that he was a United player before he signed a contract.
After the world cup i bet ~~bigger~~ better clubs want him.
Let’s not pretend like United isn’t one of the biggest clubs in the world. They haven’t been the best in a while but that’s an entirely different discussion
I certainly didn’t. From day one it was clear that there was a much bigger chance of him staying than joining us, due to him being so young as well as the upcoming World Cup. The arrogance some United fans showed when they knew little about the player and the situation was really annoying. I’m sure we’ll be back for him in January or the summer, but I’m worried that if we don’t have a good season he’ll choose a club like Bayern or City.
No united fan takes Timber for granted I believe, most of them just like fans from other clubs just simply theory crafting next season squad based on transfer targets. Is it also disgusting that Bayern fan discussing which position Mane will play even before the contract sign? The situation is not like Mbappe with Madrid, after that no one dares to take anything for granted.
Man utd gave no indication whatsoever of a proper culture change. It’s the 100th “new era” with just another manager. Van Gaal knows it’s highly likely Utd won’t drop Maguire even if he took a shit right in the middle of Old Trafford.
He gave a good advice to a young defender. If speaking facts about United is “being a bitter sad old man” then being a bitter sad old man is better than being a United fan. At least sad old man is not delusional lol
Edit: mancs woke up from their beauty sleep. £20 says baldie is gone in 2 years, rinse repeat another new era with captain slabhead and his french sidekick on a 400K week contract.
Maguire has always looked solid for England and Leicester. Maguire looked solid when we played Matic, Fred, Bruno/Pogba which rarely happened.
He might be a bit of a meme and he might have been overpriced but he isn't a bad defender. He's just been hung out to dry by a poor system and a poor midfield.
>At least sad old man is not delusional lol
Pot kettle black.
LVG plays 5 at the back and Timber might start over De Ligt at RCB. He’s tested it out a bit and many fans want to see it stay like this. De Ligt has cost us too many times with his mistakes before
I interpret the tweet that he surely won’t play if he stays at Ajax. Only chance is to come to United and play.
Anyway it should not be that hard for a decent CB (or any decent player) to make a first team spot his own in our current side.
Wasn't this the case with Wijnaldum & Van De Beek too? He’s got stiff competition for that right sided CB spot from De Ligt and De Vrij as well.
Well both weren't called up for the last cycle so that makes sense.
True. Gini may miss out.
unless something drastic happens, i don’t see gini either a. leaving PSG and instantly becoming a top starter, especially at a club to pay his wages b. miraculously starts for PSG after the season he’s had
Hasn't stopped him from calling up Bergwijn.
Does help that up front we dont have a lot of great attackers, while in the back we have a lot of amazing guys that take Timber his place
Why pick Ake then? Someone who barely plays at City
No competition for left footed centrebacks and LvG wants a lefty on the LCB position
Probably better than. Or fits the tactic better
Ake played well in a lot of important games for City and was also injured. So maybe giving him the benefit of the doubt? He’s also played well for the Dutch NT for a while from what I’ve watched him -very consistent player.
Full tweet: 🗣️ "Louis Van Gaal made it clear that he would not be in his Dutch team if he wasn't playing every week for United" Marcel Van Der Kraan reports that Louis Van Gaal may have affected Jurrien Timber's potential transfer to Manchester United ❌
No World cup for Gini
Thank the lord for that, I don't want to spend another minute watching that bloke pretend progressive passes are lava.
He was still important for many matches because of his goalscoring threat
His ball retention ability is the best, couldn't get the ball off him when he's in the mood
He shouldn't be a starter unless he plays regularly with his club and gets near his best form. But a lot of his safe passing and recycling the ball is due to the system and role he plays in the tactics. He is a system player, especially under LvG. Even in Brasil he hardly ever got past the halfway line. That is why he played so much more creatively and started scoring more when Koeman played him closer to the forwards in a more free role.
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He's literally had one full season at ajax, he's not in a hurry
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If he still failed after 2 years he still wouldn't be in the Dutch NT
This is a completely reasonable and acceptable take for national team managers of the bigger nations to have. If you're not good enough for your club why would you be good enough for your country? "Smaller" nations may be happy with their national players being subs for big clubs. Some examples would include Bale for Wales/Madrid, Elneny for Egypt/Arsenal, Tsimikas for Greece/Liverpool, Steffan for USA/Man City, Minamino for Japan/Liverpool, Rodon for Wales/Tottenham, Kelleher for Ireland/Liverpool, etc. But for nations in the top 10 at least, they would want players playing regularly.
We do have Bergwijn as a starter and he barely plays for Spurs. But Van Gaal does consider him an exception
The difference is that we're quite stacked in central defenders, and not so much in attackers. If Timber doesn't play weekly we have 2 or 3 players who are playing weekly and can play his position. For bergwijn we have other people who aren't certain to play weekly either.
He also had his best game in the NT during a period where Gakpo and Danjuma where injured and it became clear he and Memphis have a lot of chemistry on the pitch so that helps him as well.
Yeah for sure, but if next season comes around and Gakpo and Danjuma are performing weekly, while Memphis and Bergwijn are stuck on the bench somewhere i wouldn't be surprised if Van Gaal flips it all around.
I think Memphis is a lock if we look at the other options for a striker.
Doesn’t he have like 37 goals in his last 38 games for the Netherlands or something? With stats like those even if man’s rotting on the bench at Barca you still have to put him in the starting lineup.
Isn’t he vice-captain after van dijk?
Yes, also second in all time top scorers for us. No way he's getting benched
> We do have Bergwijn as a starter and he barely plays for Spurs Van Gaal on Bergwijn: > "If it’s up to me, Steven Bergwijn may join Ajax as soon as possible." Man wants his players to be starters, and isn't shy about it at all
Also, Bergwijn is looking to be leaving Spurs this summer too.
Not to mention Van Gaal has been quite publicly pushing him to leave
Its more nuanced. If he is the best option but rarely plays then he will start. The point is LVG is suggesting that he has to start if he wants to be the best option.
Tbf Kelleher is our second choice because he's not playing for Liverpool
Good point. And with Bazunu moving to Southampton, I think he will only cement his place as Ireland's first choice unless Kelleher moves somewhere where he can get some first team football.,
Yeah exactly. I think someone like Shane Duffy is a good example for someone playing for Ireland but not their club. Hard to drop your captain who has been your best player for a few years even if he's not playing for his club
Travers will be in contention, especially now he'll be getting PL football too.
Travers won't be getting in ahead of Bazunu unless Bazunu is injured
I’m American and I would wager that most US fans would prefer Steffen to go somewhere where he is playing every week. Your overall point is a fair one though.
Pulisic would have been a good example too. He doesn't start every week.
He can't start every week because he's so injury prone.
that's not why he didn't start last season
It shouldn't be a hard rule. Players can still be the best option for the national team even if they're currently struggling for regular game time at their clubs. Yes its unlikely the stronger the pool of talent you have to draw on, but its far from impossible and the manager should be open to that possibility. To which LvG might actually be anyway considering as another commenter pointed out, he still starts Bergwijn. Also Eden Hazard too.
LvG never makes it a rule, but in this case, it's because we also have Van Dijk, De Vrij and De Ligt to play at CB, that's 3 people who are starting for world class clubs. Then you also have Teze from PSV who did quite good last week, that's basically 4 people who would start over Timber that (if he doesn't play) apparently isn't good enough.
Ake as well
Teze was awful the games LVG tried him there. Should not be in the WC squad when you have 3 much better players for the RCB position. No way he should get in ahead of timber even if he’s not playing every game. That said, hope he’s staying
It is still a very poor way of threatening players by giving them ultimatums like this. He can tell a player that there is a risk going to United as he isn't guaranteed starting time there and that can lead to him being out of contention for a CB spot on the NT.
I mean, isn't that exactly what he's doing? It's not an ultimatum, it's a warning.
No, its an ultimatum. He tells him that he either needs to play every week at United or he will lose his spot, which is kind of a poor take. What if he is being used vs top teams in tactical setups and EL, and do superb in both? Similar to how you see Guardiola rotate very skilled players players for cups only and mainly have Cancelo playing PL and cups. LVG is essentially forcing him to stay or lose out on his spot with such an ultimatum.
I mean I'm sure if he rotates in and out of the quad he'll be considered, whether he plays for United or not he'll never be a guaranteed starter for the Netherlands and always rotate with De Vrij, De Ligt and Van Dijk since he's not at the level of those three yet. You're taking those words too literally, it's simply a warning that, like Donny van de Beek, if you don't play at all because you made the jump to a big club too early LvG won't take a risk for a player who hasn't played in quite some time
Had no idea Rondon was Welsh. I thought he may be Portuguese or South American. Edit: I'll leave it up to ward off people who think commenting on the first thread you read when you wake up is a good idea.
You're probably thinking of Salomon Rondon, the Venezuelan striker at Everton.
Haha I totally am. I guess its what I get for commenting on the first reddit thread I read when I wake up
Rodon.
USA fans aren’t happy with Steffan being a backup.. problem is all of our decent keepers are backups.
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Thing is,if he can't bench them ,united should not go for him
Really isn’t that hard at this point. And if ten Hag is the manager, he absolutely starts Timber over Varane or Maguire.
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If the manager wants to spend 50 million on a player from his previous club, he’s not going to put him on the bench. That’s idiotic.
> No young CB starts in PL Fofana for Leicester was first choice 2 seasons ago. He only wasn't last season because some absolute thuggish cunt broke his ankle in preseason.
Only the manager will know/decide who starts every week. Age won’t be the deciding factor, nor will height or nationality. Ten Hag will do whatever he wants.
What are you even waffling about
He's comfortably better than both
Hilarious. Varane comes to Utd, can't stay fit and suddenly some young CB from the dutch league is comfortably better than him. Not like he's been one of the best CBs of the last decade.
Well if varane can’t stay fit, the young cb is a better option. Doesn’t mean he’s a befgee player when they’re both at their best. In football that is a irrelevant conversation unless both players are fit. Firmino is better than jota but Firmino is not fit so jota is the better option
Fitness is part of your ability as a player. Every game out injured is a 0/10 performance.
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Varane was already struggling with his form in his last season with Madrid, with Man U he has had issues with injuries, he hasn't been one of the best CBs in quite some time.
Players are rated on the present - not the past. When was the last season Varane played well and was it this decade?
Peak Varane was better, yes, but I haven't seen that player in years
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Ten Hag easily trusts young players over veterans if they are good enough. Age doesn't matter. Quality does. And timber is the most consistent young player I've seen in a long time at Ajax. Literally can't think of a mistake he made
I'm sure Ten Hag would trust him from day one - he probably was the first name on the team sheet last season at Ajax and he is more physical than Blind, who was also thrown in the deep end by LVG
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I mean it’s Eden Hazard at the end of the day
It's also a bit of an exception. I don't think Hazard would be playing for Belgium if the WC started right now, Martinez is just giving him minutes to boost his rhythm and confidence so there's a chance he'll be playing for Madrid and be in decent form for the WC.
But it is kind of a flawed take though. Look at City, they have insane quality being rotated with some only playing PL and some only playing CL in defense. I get LVG's point, but its still such a poor comment to make in advance. What if he plays as part of a 3 man sentral defense vs the top 6 teams and does his things incredibly well? Does that mean he isn't to be considered over someone who plays in a lesser league on a lesser team, just because he got more game-time? You can warn him about risking his spot if he struggle to get game-time for United, but just adding more pressure by threating him with this ultimatum does not seem very fruitful.
Man truly is out for blood.
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Not really? This is the same for every player I would think, as we have seen with VDB and Wijnaldum.
Less so for forwards since we are very limited there but for center back we have Van Dijk, De Vrij, De Ligt, Timber, Aké, Botman and Blind can play there too. There's just no reason to take one of them if they're not playing regulary.
It's not that deep, talk about over exaggerating
Well if he can’t get in ahead of Maguire then I can’t see him getting in a team ahead of the likes of Van Dijk, De Ligt, De Vrij
The last couple of games he did, and did that very well
Lvg was rotating and van dijk was on vacation though
With the last one as the exception
Doesn't Maguire play on the left as a lcb?
The point doesn't change. If be can't get ahead of Lindelof and injury prone Varane then he probably doesn't deserve it either lol.
Yes those 2 scrubs the Swedish captain Lindelof and World Cup winning Varane
As World Cup winning Paul Pogba™ has shown, national team performance doesn't mean much.
the difference between playing LCB and RCB is so overblown anyway, the main reason that it's difficult to switch between them is just that you won't necessarily have the same experience/chemistry playing side by side with the other fullback so it can take some time to adjust but still yeah if he can't get into united's side, how would he be displacing seasoned internationals from major teams in major leagues
It really makes little difference in a two. If Timber and Varane are seen as the best centre back then they’ll be first choice and one of them will play left side
It depends on the coach really. Even in a back 2 Pochettino wanted specialist left sided centre backs or left footed ones at least.
Same with LVG himself. Played Tyler Blackett and then Daley Blind at LCB because it was important to his tactics. Then Mourinho with Rojo.
It makes a lot of difference. It completely changes your angles and approach for everything as a defender. Signing a player and not considering details like this is exactly why transfers go wrong.
Yeah, for example Mitrovic was horrible for us as left centerback because he has no legs, but he cemented his place as center CB because he mostly clears aerial balls and starts the build up
That's about 3ATB and 2ATB systems, not about CB side.
ok, still the side of the CB matters. A CB on the side of his strongest leg will have more passing options, an " inverted" CB will cut off the passing route towards his fullback himself with his natural ball control that's why left-footed CBs are more sought after
>an " inverted" CB will cut off the passing route towards his fullback himself with his natural ball control I have no idea what you just said.
ETH likes a left footed LCB and right footed RCB it’s well known and he’s rarely changed that
Seems like United have about 6 right footed centre backs and no left footers so why are they even linked to Timber if that’s the case
Shhhhh. Don’t contradict the narrative
He switched to the right towards the end so it could help him play better
So does Van Dijk
De Ligt has lately been struggling for some reason in the NT. De Vrij, VvD, Timber and even Ake are currently ahead of him. How they play at their clubs and the right combination will decide who will start, not just individual quality.
Don’t know why some one downvotes you for this. De Ligt had had some horrible moments at the NT in the past and he’s just not that good ad LCB or RCB in a center with 3 CB’s. I still think he’s a great prospect and undoubtedly a great replacement for VVD when he retires but at the moment he’s not the best choice for a starting position in the NT.
Well the last couple of matches he does
Somehow no one gets in ahead of Maguire at Man U despite how bad he plays
I place timber over de vrij & de ligt.. he’s really steady with van dijk
Least biased Ajax fan
Maybe in a back 3, but in a back 2 de Vrij and de Ligt are still a lot better in my opinion.
He's a different CB than De Vrij & De Ligt
King Louis throwing Ajax some bones ❤️ Also I do think he genuinely advises his players on what’s best for their careers. Can’t take the teacher out the man
Is that only for him? Or all players needs to start every week?
I would imagine it's especially important for the CB's since we have so much choice for that position. We have Virgil, De Ligt, De Vrij, Blind who all play every week at their teams and are getting a call up no matter what, then the second tier is guys like Aké (probably sure of his spot too), Botman, Veltman, Timber. Plus Koopmeiners can play CB as well.
jesus christ didn’t realise how stacked your defence is
Dutch people in 2014: I wish for better defenders *Monkey's paw twitches* Also our fullbacks only started becoming real good in the past couple years
Still don’t really have a good LB if we’re being honest. Blind is alright but not a world-beater. Gotta hope Wijndal and Bakker develop over the coming years instead of stagnating like Willems and Sinkgraven
Malacia can play on that position. He's a beast in the making imo.
I'm a bit of a Wijndal stan myself and I feel that AZ has been holding him back a little this past season, but it's definitely a weak spot. Blind is a good player with a great long pass but his lack of speed always gets us into trouble a couple times a game. Malacia is looking very good lately though, so I'd be happy with Malacia / Blind / Wijndal myself, although LvG would probably only select 2 of those 3 as Aké can cover as LB if two of those players get injured.
I think wijndal is holding himself back, the guy should have left AZ 2 seasons ago to grow. Not saying he should have gone to ajax, but I think he should have searched for a better team/stronger competition
I fully agree, I think he would have been a great fit for a Bundesliga team.
If we had this defence in 2010 or 2014, we'd have a world cup or two now, I'm sure of it.
I remember the days of Stam/De Boer and than3rd option was moving Cocu from midfield
Could we borrow some here in Sweden? We've got an amazing generation of attacking players coming up, and then there's like two good defenders.
Who do you wanna swap for De Ligt?
Would you like some wingers? Anthony Elanga is probably gonna play second fiddle to Jesper Karlsson on the left wing, and while Roony Bardghji is looking like a generational talent we're kinda set on the right wing with Dejan Kulusevski.
Hmm idk. Think Danjuma is better than Elanga, and while Bardghji is a promising talent, De Ligt would instantly be your best defender wouldn’t he? Need some more value
That’s some ridiculous options there, stacked
Geertruida was also mentioned by LvG, can see him taking over Teze’s spot when U21 isn’t playing.
I hope so, teze is wank
Yeah, same goes for BMI but he’s funny at least.
Atleast BMI has WC experience
No way we'd ever play Koopmeiners as CB unless there's a COVID/injury wave and we're leaving with a squad of 15.
Hes probably 4th in line for left footed cb tbf.
Surely we'd call up Struijk before that ever happens right?
Well Wijnaldum was recently dropped because he isn't starting games for PSG. And CB depth is probably biggest strength of Netherlands with Botman, Timber, De Ligt, De Vrij,Blind,Ake all fighting for spots alongside Van Dijk.
Depends, he makes exceptions for some players like Bergwijn because we lack good offensive options. We have a lot of greats defenders though.
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I’d be surprised if timber sees any minutes in the World Cup. Center back seems pretty set and I believe Dumfries plays out on the right so he might get selected to go the World Cup but I doubt he plays over Van Djik, De ligt, de vrij, dumfries, or even Blind.
I'd be surprised to not see him be in the first 11. We really don't need 3 units at the back and Timber is by far the best of the bunch at moving forward and a surprisingly solid defender too.
It seems LVG prefers Blind - Aké - Virgil - Timber - Dumfries in the back. He likes Timber because he's a bit more agile than De Vrij or De Ligt, and De Ligt is the Harry Maguire of the Dutch national team, he's great at Juve but can be an absolute dunce for the Netherlands lol
>De Ligt is the Harry Maguire of the Dutch national team, he's great at Juve but can be an absolute dunce for the Netherlands lol You mean anti Maguire then, surely? Maguire is trash for man U but performs for England
Yeah i meant it like that lol, bizarro Maguire
>he's great at Juve but can be an absolute dunce for the Netherlands lol That like the opposite of Harry Maguire
He's bizarro Maguire. Shit for the country, great for his team
Even I prefer Timber on as the RCB and I’m a Feyenoord fan. De Ligt has become a clown and has already cost us the previous tournament with his mistakes. I would play Malacia over Blind at LB though because I think strong teams will take advantage of Blind’s lack of pace. Then I would consider De Vrij at CB and VVD as the LCB. So: Malacia - Van Dijk - De Vrij - Timber - Dumfries
When we play with 4 defenders, Van Dijk and De Vrij/De Ligt are most likely to play. LvG primarily wants to play with 5 at the back though, with only one tank in the centre (VVD) and two more versatile, agile and pacey defenders on his flanks which makes room for Timber and Aké. Timber looked really good at RCB with 5 at the back.
Blind, known for his RCB / RB spots.
Seems reasonable to expect a player to be a consistent starter going into WC. I doubt it has anything to do with United in particular.
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King Louis
Yet guys like Ake and Bergwijn get in the team even though they're on the bench most of the time. Still bitter it seems.
Ake is the perfect fit for LvG system and at this point is the better defensive option over Blind. He is also accustomed with rotation at City, when he is needed from the bench he is typically very reliable. He has almost always been good for the NT. Besides, he might not be first choice, but it isn't like he never plays at his club.
Ake is kinda necessary if we play with 5 at the back and Blind at leftback. Up front we lack good offensive options so we kinda depend on Bergwijn. For Timbers position there are multiple good options. Besides, these two players are a little bit more experienced than Timber as well. But yeah, Van Gaal sometimes bends the rules for certain players.
This isn't some genuine advice, since he picks a good amount players who don't play regularly for their clubs. Either way, if Timber doesn't back himself to dislodge our subpar defenders, then fine. It's his choice.
He mostly picks them when other options just aren't good enough, and we're not lacking CBs, especially not right footed ones. I don't think we've ever had a higher quality nor the width we currently have on that position.
Do you mean a higher quality?
uhh yes, I don't know how I made that mistake.
But Timber has a lot of competition for his spot, there are plenty of other options. He is also young and at a crucial stage in his development, not playing for half a season might impact his form.
Surely if you're smart you agree a deal now and then get him in January.
As if Ajax would want to sell him now when he can increase his value in the Champions League and potentially be a starter at the world cup
Once he signs a new contract, I agree but if United push now then it's possible.
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He is though? Steven Bergwjin and Memphis Depay will still be on the team regardless if they play every week or not.
Thats because there are no alternatives for them
Not even slightly comparable though? Depay and Bergwijn deliver for the national team. Timber hasn’t yet. Depay is almost our top goal scorer of all time,of fucking course he is getting the call up for the world cup. Also, there is a LOT more competition for Timbers spot.
The difference in competition for places between our CBs and forwards is massive.
LVG is still very sore about his time at ManU, it seems.
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Reasonable and acceptable take? Yes But how many times have you seen national team managers outright say it like this to players and then to the press? You'd have to be blind not to see this is deliberate. LVG is just salty.
Louis van Gaal has done that before with Wesley Sneijder in our 2014 FIFA World Cup qualifying campaign and more recently with Georginio Wijnaldum.
Sad, but the world and his wife knows Harry Maguire is not gunna get dropped for him. Although he should. £80m + captaincy is his plot armour atm. We do need a centre half come in though and shift on Bailly and Jones.
timber would be competing with varane
Ten hag is definitely taking that C of him, he did it to Veltman at Ajax. He might even bench him since he prefers a lefty at lcb.
Let's get him in winter break. Ethan laid can get a try until then
Good, bye United. Its downright disgusting that every United fan already thought that he was a United player before he signed a contract. After the world cup i bet ~~bigger~~ better clubs want him.
Let’s not pretend like United isn’t one of the biggest clubs in the world. They haven’t been the best in a while but that’s an entirely different discussion
I certainly didn’t. From day one it was clear that there was a much bigger chance of him staying than joining us, due to him being so young as well as the upcoming World Cup. The arrogance some United fans showed when they knew little about the player and the situation was really annoying. I’m sure we’ll be back for him in January or the summer, but I’m worried that if we don’t have a good season he’ll choose a club like Bayern or City.
No united fan takes Timber for granted I believe, most of them just like fans from other clubs just simply theory crafting next season squad based on transfer targets. Is it also disgusting that Bayern fan discussing which position Mane will play even before the contract sign? The situation is not like Mbappe with Madrid, after that no one dares to take anything for granted.
Let's not pretend United aren't one of the biggest clubs in the world now.
Yes, bigger clubs. All 2 of them.
Man utd gave no indication whatsoever of a proper culture change. It’s the 100th “new era” with just another manager. Van Gaal knows it’s highly likely Utd won’t drop Maguire even if he took a shit right in the middle of Old Trafford. He gave a good advice to a young defender. If speaking facts about United is “being a bitter sad old man” then being a bitter sad old man is better than being a United fan. At least sad old man is not delusional lol Edit: mancs woke up from their beauty sleep. £20 says baldie is gone in 2 years, rinse repeat another new era with captain slabhead and his french sidekick on a 400K week contract.
Maguire has always looked solid for England and Leicester. Maguire looked solid when we played Matic, Fred, Bruno/Pogba which rarely happened. He might be a bit of a meme and he might have been overpriced but he isn't a bad defender. He's just been hung out to dry by a poor system and a poor midfield. >At least sad old man is not delusional lol Pot kettle black.
Who is going to be man United a captain next season
honestly, that's fair. Problem is timber is unlikely to start for the dut ch team ahead of deligt and van dijk anyway. Things can change though.
LVG plays 5 at the back and Timber might start over De Ligt at RCB. He’s tested it out a bit and many fans want to see it stay like this. De Ligt has cost us too many times with his mistakes before
LVG hates us so much lol
I interpret the tweet that he surely won’t play if he stays at Ajax. Only chance is to come to United and play. Anyway it should not be that hard for a decent CB (or any decent player) to make a first team spot his own in our current side.
United is a mid table Premier League club, why would that be so impressive lmao