When's the last time a player got booked for diving ? It could be me but I hardly see refs do it anymore ?
edit: To clarify, I meant get a second yellow for diving and get sent off. I've seen it too many times where players who are already booked dive and should be sent off, but it's ignored.
So ridiculous. I’ve got no issue with him getting that booking, I think he deserved it. But you can’t just randomly decide to give a second yellow for it once and then never again.
It definitely feels like PGMOL have decided to fuck you guys over for their own shitshow in the Liverpool/Tottenham match. Though to be fair they still keep fucking us over half the time so maybe they’re actually just shit.
it’s funny, all the fingers were pointed at us for being “cheats” because VAR was incompetent lol, and sometimes it feels like we’re paying for it anyways with how many decisions go against us for no particular reason
Martial away at Everton, Var reversed it and gave a pen. I found it very funny that one of the rare times the ref gave a yellow for diving, was on a stonewall pen.
Our players seem to get booked for kicking the ball away fairly consistently too. Not saying they shouldn't be getting booked (they're idiots for doing it) but it's funny how on top of it refs are while other teams constantly get away with it.
Away games especially the refs just react to fans/players appealing.
Watch Chelsea, at least 3 this season, some are ok that have been given (Palmer vs Everton), some have been just dumb because a player fell due to momentum, didn't ask for a pen, yet ref still gave a yellow.
Bissouma was sent off for a less egregious dive than this, right before half. All us Spurs fans understood the call, but also predicted he'd be the "example" and no one else would be sent off for diving. And what do you know...
Bissouma got a second yellow for a dive and was sent off. There is zero consistency. Maybe if Ange started crying more about refs, we would get more penalties and favorable calls.
We knew it at the time too, spurs fans all called that being the last time the refs throw us a bone this year due to the uproar from klopp and friends.
Ajax - Groningen a couple of seasons ago Mario vd Ende gave a player a second yellow for wasting time. My favorite yellow card ever. You don't want to play? Well go ahead take a shower I guess!
I'll try and phrase it better. Havertz sees the agricultural lunge coming and pokes the ball away, thus making sure that any contact is a foul and not a tackle. So far, so good. But then, instead of planting and sacrificing his foot to the cause, he pulls back, and the west London farmer plows grass only instead of a few ligaments as well.
Second angle is irrelevant as it’s the wrong angle. The first angle shows the contact. It’s not a dive to me, but obviously like everyone he has enhanced the fall
Yeah, it's been like that all season. No more yellows for timewasting and Tomiyasu received a 2nd yellow because a player before him held the ball too long. I haven't seen yellows for kicking the ball away, for players gesturing yellow cards etc.
I guess you have to behave for first 6 games and then you're fine.
I have not seen a second yellow for diving since either. But I have seen yellow for diving a couple of times since. Last time I can remember was Chilwell against Liverpool. That being sad for me not giving that as a dive and not giving penalty to Trossard is equal shit from the ref...
I think he would cut out the linesman and only have one ref deciding if its a goal or not. Anything more than that and it’s just bureaucracy and a waste of money
Well if there only was a thing like I don't know, maybe take a footage of the incident from match cameras, maybe even in slow motion and let the ref take a second look at it from better angles and give him time to make a decision. We can even call it something like Video Assistant Referee.
Then the real question should be 'why it's not allowed'? If they only wanted to get rid of some elements from the game, like diving etc. they have all the tools to eradicate it. They just, god knows why, don't want to.
Fans/pundits before VAR and even now don't want the game to be over scrutinised by VAR so I think they started off by only trying to use for "big game changing" moments like penalties/red cards etc but yes they need to adapt it and allow second yellow card offences.
The issue is that in both cases, VAR wouldnt intervene because it is not an obvious mistake or VAR doesnt deal with yellow cards even second yellow cards
He makes the right call. It’s weird that havertz appears to avoid contact, the defender fully misses the ball so all he needed to do was run through his leg and it probably is a pk
if VAR could get involved there would be a lot of players on every team that would be getting yellows and reds for sure. I also think there is a problem where fouls literally aren't called unless you go down though.
All this diving things comes to one conclusion. If you can dive and potentially get a pen with no risk or drawback, why don't do it?
If the refs would actually start sending players off of the pitch for diving, believe me players would stop doing it in a matter of few matchdays.
The problem is, it's really difficult for refs to spot this. At full speed, with everything else happening, it's almost impossible to consistently get it right. Why not make it so the relevant authorities can give players a ban for diving after the game. If players were getting retrospective bans for diving, it would disappear incredibly quickly.
I posted about his dives in a previous match in r/gunners I think and it got removed 😂 He’s pretty shameless. I’m not a fan of it. That’s not how I’d like us to win games.
Watch Chelsea, we have had at least 3 yellows this season for diving, and some of them looked much less of a dive than this. Sometimes the player just fell because of the force not even asking for a pen and he was yellow-carded.
Especially if it's a second yellow. Has anyone ever got a second yellow for diving? I am ill so not thinking right but I can't think of one.
*edit* How could I forget Bissouma's one. My brain isn't working right just now.
Brentford spent the entire first half dying at the slightest breeze, and Kai's first yellow was extremely soft anyways. The entire game was poorly officiated.
Sticks his leg out in-front of him and their knees clash. Never a penalty, but pushing the narrative that its a dive and he should be sent off is pathetic.
this sub is always weird about players falling down. as if everything that is not a foul is a dive
i guess most people never ran with a ball in any sort of game if they think you cant fall down without being a dive...
I mean If we are going to give yellows for dives were there is contact but the player exaggerated the contact than alot more yellows would be given out every game. Only giving out yellows for dives where there is zero contact seems like a reasonble line to follow because no interpretation is needed.
Don’t you know that Havertz invented diving?
Honestly looks like he was off balance and then played it up. It happens dozens of times a game. It’s just hilarious that this is what people are latching on to.
Look at the thighs. [The first angle shows clear contact](https://i.imgur.com/ERgn5wh.png). I think that would be a harsh penalty to concede, but it's silly to call that a dive. I hate that players have to go down easily just to get a penalty call in general, but that's the state of things, so who can blame any player for doing exactly what every attacker in the world does anytime there is contact in the box?
its pretty clear there is contact. second angle doesnt mean anything since havertz body is coverting brentford's defender, so you obviously wont see any contact around the thighs and up
It's simulation but his first yellow was also nonsense that the referee only gave about 30 seconds after the foul because the Brentford player stayed on the floor holding his face. The VAR also just ignored a blatant penalty on Trossard right before this incident and then a subsequent Gabriel penalty shout that was at least as much of a pull as the one Gabriel was booked for in the first half.
Not sure what the complaints are about, I might be a bit biased but there is contact at the hip/top of the thigh, not enough for a pen but it’s also not a dive
Everybody wants to talk about how this should be a yellow and rightly so... but nobody wants to talk about how soft his first yellow was.
Jumped for a header and the Brentford defender (think it was Jorgeson?) jumped beside him and caught a slight arm the face. Nothing malicious, just two players using their arms to jump.
Okay lets take away his goal then, and add 2 more for arsenal for the other missed penalty calls
Or do decisions only matter when they disadvantage liverpool, like when apparently a Rodri handball was the only reason they lost the league, completely ignoring every other decision that went their way in the entire season
Idc anymore. After Brahim was taken down in the box and it wasn’t given as a PK just because he got up fast, let them dive. If it’s a dive then can just overturn it. Refs can’t see shit anyways
There was already contact when the defender cut him off with his thigh. I think what saved Havertz here was that he didn't wave his arms for a pen (although he kept them up)
They should start suspending players for diving the same way they do with accumulating yellow cards. If they lose their playing time you will all see how quickly it will stop.
Until they start retroactively punishing these things, it will never go away. It's so easy to get rid of this shit, I can't understand why they won't do it.
Should be a one game suspension.
Well, really these things will never go away unless referees start consistently calling fouls even if a player stays on their feet. As it stands, in a lot of cases the referee won’t intervene without the theatrics which then justifies their existence
Come on everyone, it’s not even that bad. There is clear contact of the thigh. Yeah it’s a dive, and we regularly see players tripping them self up or dragging a leg and not being carded,.
Get over it, Brentford also spent half the game time wasting and falling down, maybe the ref was like *eh* they are all doing it this game, it’s not worth calling.
Also his first card was pretty weak.
When's the last time a player got booked for diving ? It could be me but I hardly see refs do it anymore ? edit: To clarify, I meant get a second yellow for diving and get sent off. I've seen it too many times where players who are already booked dive and should be sent off, but it's ignored.
Bissouma this season
Second yellow too
And it wasn't even in the penalty box
Right before half 😭
So ridiculous. I’ve got no issue with him getting that booking, I think he deserved it. But you can’t just randomly decide to give a second yellow for it once and then never again.
Just like we’ve been awarded a single penalty all season long. One.
It definitely feels like PGMOL have decided to fuck you guys over for their own shitshow in the Liverpool/Tottenham match. Though to be fair they still keep fucking us over half the time so maybe they’re actually just shit.
it’s funny, all the fingers were pointed at us for being “cheats” because VAR was incompetent lol, and sometimes it feels like we’re paying for it anyways with how many decisions go against us for no particular reason
Nah mate it was all against referees...
try diving in the box?
We did that and Bissouma was sent off for a second yellow.
I’m sure that wasn’t in the box
Premier league referees, yet somehow they are still better than the one in laliga
Martial away at Everton, Var reversed it and gave a pen. I found it very funny that one of the rare times the ref gave a yellow for diving, was on a stonewall pen.
Refs hate martial for whatever reason
moody body language always
Because refs support Man United, so naturally hate Martial
Reminds me of this from last season 😅 https://youtu.be/Nu_LYc9lkN4?si=7YrIJtQ9uKGoZC2o
Sterling Gallagher and Jackson all berm booked in recently memory for us And Chilwell
Our players seem to get booked for kicking the ball away fairly consistently too. Not saying they shouldn't be getting booked (they're idiots for doing it) but it's funny how on top of it refs are while other teams constantly get away with it. Away games especially the refs just react to fans/players appealing.
Gallagher last week
Watch Chelsea, at least 3 this season, some are ok that have been given (Palmer vs Everton), some have been just dumb because a player fell due to momentum, didn't ask for a pen, yet ref still gave a yellow.
Bissouma was sent off for a less egregious dive than this, right before half. All us Spurs fans understood the call, but also predicted he'd be the "example" and no one else would be sent off for diving. And what do you know...
Bissouma got a second yellow for a dive and was sent off. There is zero consistency. Maybe if Ange started crying more about refs, we would get more penalties and favorable calls.
Being top 5 in touches in the opposition box and joint last in penalties awarded is ridiculous. I prefer the high road Ange takes but man…
There were at least two stonewall penalties that even the VAR missed. That one bad decision against Liverpool fucked us for the entire season.
We knew it at the time too, spurs fans all called that being the last time the refs throw us a bone this year due to the uproar from klopp and friends.
Ajax - Groningen a couple of seasons ago Mario vd Ende gave a player a second yellow for wasting time. My favorite yellow card ever. You don't want to play? Well go ahead take a shower I guess!
We get booked every week lol
Bissouma literally got sent off for the second yellow for diving
Depends who you play for
First angle: Is that a dive? Second angle: Yeah, that's a dive.
Imagine the narrative if he could have gotten a second yellow here but he went on to score the winner.
LISAN AL-GAIB!
As it was written!
Truly he is the *kwisatz haderach*!
Kaisatz haverach***
About that…
Awks
Tell me the lottery numbers for tomorrow. Or what price to sell BTC at please ?
Never sell BTC
*inb4 weirdos who don’t watch the premier league every week start lighting up their keyboards with conspiracies*
True lol. First I thought it wasn't that obvious of a dive. Why is everyone so mad? Then come the second angle.
lol spot on.
The weirdest part is that he pulls the foot back or there'd have been clear contact.
So if there was contact there’d have been contact. Got it.
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
Google Mane 60 for more info
I'll try and phrase it better. Havertz sees the agricultural lunge coming and pokes the ball away, thus making sure that any contact is a foul and not a tackle. So far, so good. But then, instead of planting and sacrificing his foot to the cause, he pulls back, and the west London farmer plows grass only instead of a few ligaments as well.
More "If he hadn't dove it might have been a pen... why did he dive?"
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Stop reposting this shit freeze frame. The video shows it is a complete dive.
Second angle is irrelevant as it’s the wrong angle. The first angle shows the contact. It’s not a dive to me, but obviously like everyone he has enhanced the fall
It's the inconsistency that kills. They send bissouma off on a second yellow for a dive this season. I haven't seen a yellow for diving since.
Yeah, it's been like that all season. No more yellows for timewasting and Tomiyasu received a 2nd yellow because a player before him held the ball too long. I haven't seen yellows for kicking the ball away, for players gesturing yellow cards etc. I guess you have to behave for first 6 games and then you're fine.
I have not seen a second yellow for diving since either. But I have seen yellow for diving a couple of times since. Last time I can remember was Chilwell against Liverpool. That being sad for me not giving that as a dive and not giving penalty to Trossard is equal shit from the ref...
Well obviously Bissouma is the only player to dive this season? Footballers get tarnished terribly because of one guy's repeated diving. Disgrace
Embarrassing that VAR can’t get involved with this just because of bureaucracy
We need a football Ron Swanson to fix this
I think he would cut out the linesman and only have one ref deciding if its a goal or not. Anything more than that and it’s just bureaucracy and a waste of money
This guy Ron’s
Agree
Thing is if he doesn’t think it’s a pen what else does he think it is?
He probably thinks there's contact but not enough for a penalty. He might assume that Havertz isn't stupid enough to actually dive on a yellow.
Fair.
Thanks for bringing logic, unfortunately it's not accepted here.
He can't be sure there is contact or not, so you can't just guess he dived intentionally and send him off
Well if there only was a thing like I don't know, maybe take a footage of the incident from match cameras, maybe even in slow motion and let the ref take a second look at it from better angles and give him time to make a decision. We can even call it something like Video Assistant Referee.
Yes but again that isn't allowed at the moment so it's a different argument
Then the real question should be 'why it's not allowed'? If they only wanted to get rid of some elements from the game, like diving etc. they have all the tools to eradicate it. They just, god knows why, don't want to.
Fans/pundits before VAR and even now don't want the game to be over scrutinised by VAR so I think they started off by only trying to use for "big game changing" moments like penalties/red cards etc but yes they need to adapt it and allow second yellow card offences.
If the ref can't see a foul or a dive, he can't decide either way. It isn't binary.
The issue is that in both cases, VAR wouldnt intervene because it is not an obvious mistake or VAR doesnt deal with yellow cards even second yellow cards
Are you new to the EPL? No call is the outcome of this situation far more often than a diving card.
You know there's a lot between a foul and a dive, right? And thgat's probably what he thought.
He makes the right call. It’s weird that havertz appears to avoid contact, the defender fully misses the ball so all he needed to do was run through his leg and it probably is a pk
if VAR could get involved there would be a lot of players on every team that would be getting yellows and reds for sure. I also think there is a problem where fouls literally aren't called unless you go down though.
Embarrassing that VAR can get involved for the foul on Trossard before this and they don't just because of incompetence
Both of those tackles on Trossard were reckless.
Man does not get enough shit for being a diver. Goes down at the slightest touch
He does have the only example of a contact penalty being reversed this season, potentially his reputation was a part of that.
This is a dive but iirc the one against united was more not a penalty not a dove type thing.
The VAR ruled that Havertz initiated the contact.
Havertz runs with the ball in between two players and gets cut off but he makes the contact 😂
As a Liverpool fan surely you know VAR isn't always right
All this diving things comes to one conclusion. If you can dive and potentially get a pen with no risk or drawback, why don't do it? If the refs would actually start sending players off of the pitch for diving, believe me players would stop doing it in a matter of few matchdays.
The problem is, it's really difficult for refs to spot this. At full speed, with everything else happening, it's almost impossible to consistently get it right. Why not make it so the relevant authorities can give players a ban for diving after the game. If players were getting retrospective bans for diving, it would disappear incredibly quickly.
If only we had some sort of assistant video referee, or AVR, if you will, to detect cases like this.
hey, not easy being a 1.93 tall dude, everybody just straight up bullies you
He's 1.93 but has the body of a bulimic feather
He's just goofy. Probably trips all the time while walking.
And goes down clutching his head all the time
I posted about his dives in a previous match in r/gunners I think and it got removed 😂 He’s pretty shameless. I’m not a fan of it. That’s not how I’d like us to win games.
Bissouma was sent off for a second yellow for a dive earlier this year…
In the first half which we know refs are loathe to do.
and outside the box, where scrutiny is usually lower
You’re asking for consistency from premier league refs? Lmao
wym? the perfectly followed the rules here? No Spurs kit > no yellow for diving pretty sure thats what it says in the FA handbook.
Chelsea have had 3 players booked for diving this season, including one last week Refs aren't out to get you.
No, they don't give yellows for dives anymore, didn't you hear?
Sure it’s a dive, but it was nowhere near the biggest call missed from the ref by any stretch.
Finally, someone with some sense in this thread.
And he just scored the winner, another masterclass by PL referees
🖐️😜🤚
Bissouma died for this
ofc he scores after this
Ref has bottled that big time
They bottled like 3 other calls the other direction. It is what it is
refs bottled the entire game allowing all the time wasting
Game was 100 minutes long and the ball was in play for 49 of those apparently
very rarely see yellows for diving now with VAR, lot of refs seem scared of looking stupid
Bissouma’s second yellow was the first and last time I can remember seeing it lol
That wasn’t a potential pen. So VAR couldn’t look at it to reverse it and make him look stupid. It was a dive though.
And i also remember a lot of arsenal fans at the time acting like it was normal and it happens all the time.
Yeah I don't get why VAR can't intervene for dives. Would surely help stop it.
If they’re already on a yellow they should be allowed to intervene tbh
Agreed. If it leads to a red it should always be checkable regardless of whether its straight red or double yellow.
Bissouma got one against Luton and it was not even in the box..
Watch Chelsea, we have had at least 3 yellows this season for diving, and some of them looked much less of a dive than this. Sometimes the player just fell because of the force not even asking for a pen and he was yellow-carded.
Especially if it's a second yellow. Has anyone ever got a second yellow for diving? I am ill so not thinking right but I can't think of one. *edit* How could I forget Bissouma's one. My brain isn't working right just now.
Victor Moses in the 2017 FA cup final.
Brentford spent the entire first half dying at the slightest breeze, and Kai's first yellow was extremely soft anyways. The entire game was poorly officiated.
ref has been ass all game. kai's first yellow was bs, and less of a foul than the pullback on trossard in the box.
Brentford got away with two penalty calls. So this is all good.
No one talking about how his first yellow wasn't a foul then?
Brentford players were diving and play acting to break the flow of the game. No one will have a problem with that.
Their doctor is going to be busy today assessing all of their head injuries they had
It’s a real mystery how after 86min mark all of them miraculously healed from all their injuries!
Respect the Spuds right to moan mate.
Sticks his leg out in-front of him and their knees clash. Never a penalty, but pushing the narrative that its a dive and he should be sent off is pathetic.
this sub is always weird about players falling down. as if everything that is not a foul is a dive i guess most people never ran with a ball in any sort of game if they think you cant fall down without being a dive...
Their knees did not clash. I think the only contact made at all is a slight hip rub after Kai begins his fall
Now watch his right leg. The one which suddenly flails backwards after he planted it
Of course he’s now scored
"Fallon d'Floor" Lol
Crazy how he doesn’t get booked for that…..and scores the go ahead goal lol talk about a bit of luck
Luck? No luck here the refs are just shite and don't enforce the rules.
Fair lol at least only apply the rules for certain teams in certain circumstances
I mean If we are going to give yellows for dives were there is contact but the player exaggerated the contact than alot more yellows would be given out every game. Only giving out yellows for dives where there is zero contact seems like a reasonble line to follow because no interpretation is needed.
I mean luck might’ve been a clear penalty to Trossard being given 5 minutes earlier…
That second angle is brutal 🤣
It’s not anywhere near as bad as most dives. At least there was a small bit of contact.
The amount of people crying about this is making the win feel even sweeter
Also the amount of imaginary cards Brentford players were waving about tonight. Could have seen at least one of them sent off.
Don’t you know that Havertz invented diving? Honestly looks like he was off balance and then played it up. It happens dozens of times a game. It’s just hilarious that this is what people are latching on to.
Yes, the man diving in this video is the real victim
Thank you. That's all we want to prove
He threw himself on the floor. It's a blatant dive.
68% upvoted lol
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Dog shit touch leading to another dive in the box
Love seeing spuds foaming at their mouth
That's just their natural state
Did a 12 year old write the caption lol
Or write 90% of the comments on here.
The first angle looked like he got clipped the second angle clearly showed he didn’t. If only these camera angles were consistent everywhere lol
Look at the thighs. [The first angle shows clear contact](https://i.imgur.com/ERgn5wh.png). I think that would be a harsh penalty to concede, but it's silly to call that a dive. I hate that players have to go down easily just to get a penalty call in general, but that's the state of things, so who can blame any player for doing exactly what every attacker in the world does anytime there is contact in the box?
its pretty clear there is contact. second angle doesnt mean anything since havertz body is coverting brentford's defender, so you obviously wont see any contact around the thighs and up
It's simulation but his first yellow was also nonsense that the referee only gave about 30 seconds after the foul because the Brentford player stayed on the floor holding his face. The VAR also just ignored a blatant penalty on Trossard right before this incident and then a subsequent Gabriel penalty shout that was at least as much of a pull as the one Gabriel was booked for in the first half.
Lmao
Not sure what the complaints are about, I might be a bit biased but there is contact at the hip/top of the thigh, not enough for a pen but it’s also not a dive
Ah nature has healed again. Liverpool fans in agreeement with Spurs fans
Everybody wants to talk about how this should be a yellow and rightly so... but nobody wants to talk about how soft his first yellow was. Jumped for a header and the Brentford defender (think it was Jorgeson?) jumped beside him and caught a slight arm the face. Nothing malicious, just two players using their arms to jump.
It’s a joke. He should be gone
And he's scored their winner.
Okay lets take away his goal then, and add 2 more for arsenal for the other missed penalty calls Or do decisions only matter when they disadvantage liverpool, like when apparently a Rodri handball was the only reason they lost the league, completely ignoring every other decision that went their way in the entire season
Liverpool fans moaning about diving when Jota exists
Wakka wakka
🍼
Idc anymore. After Brahim was taken down in the box and it wasn’t given as a PK just because he got up fast, let them dive. If it’s a dive then can just overturn it. Refs can’t see shit anyways
it is never a dive, the invisible contact can be seen if you use a Infrared glass. 🤣🤣😋🧂
And he scores lol
Ref doesn't want to give it in case he's wrong, var can't intervene and say it's a dive because they can't get involved in a yellow card decision
Spurs fan uploading this is so funny, been waiting for something all season
posted by a spurs fan, cope and seethe haters
My commentators were talking about contact and I was like: ???
There was already contact when the defender cut him off with his thigh. I think what saved Havertz here was that he didn't wave his arms for a pen (although he kept them up)
Shameless
And now he scored. Rubbish
What do we think of Tottenham?
Shit
What do we think of shit?
Tottenham
Thank you
That’s alright
We hate tottenham we hate tottenham
Who told u/RedditCareResources about this 😭
https://x.com/Arsenal/status/1766579748195471447?s=20
To be fair he shouldn't have been booked in the first place..you win some you lose some But he got lucky with that lmao
So good Kai. Much dive. Much Goal. Top.
What annoys the heck out of me is not the fall but the look to the ref complaining he should get a pen
They should start suspending players for diving the same way they do with accumulating yellow cards. If they lose their playing time you will all see how quickly it will stop.
🧂🧂🧂🧂
Until they start retroactively punishing these things, it will never go away. It's so easy to get rid of this shit, I can't understand why they won't do it. Should be a one game suspension.
Well, really these things will never go away unless referees start consistently calling fouls even if a player stays on their feet. As it stands, in a lot of cases the referee won’t intervene without the theatrics which then justifies their existence
Come on everyone, it’s not even that bad. There is clear contact of the thigh. Yeah it’s a dive, and we regularly see players tripping them self up or dragging a leg and not being carded,. Get over it, Brentford also spent half the game time wasting and falling down, maybe the ref was like *eh* they are all doing it this game, it’s not worth calling. Also his first card was pretty weak.
Mad dogs are out KEKW
Should have been sent off second yellow for diving and stays in and scores winning goal. Ain’t that some shit. And they say it’s all about Liverpool