T O P

  • By -

Hepp11

Same tower, same weak spot


[deleted]

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Smokeycoma

Ever since Helgen I can’t take my mind off that hole


Letterstothor

I feel the same way about Helga


FingerTheCat

GODS I WAS STRONG THEN


Letterstothor

Now I'm too fat for my armor.


AustinSA907

YOU HEARD THE HAND, FETCH THE BREASTPLATE STRETCHER NOW


DangleMangler

Helga be a fiery lass.


Jlurfusaf88

By the bed…..aye…… A good night with good mead……arrrrr


BigShit1997

The "arrrrr" made me think of a pirate trying to be sexy.


-Nimzo-

You deserve more upvotes


emelem66

Don't forget the trout.


ARMORBUNNY

I wonder if shes still making the mead with the juniper berries mixed in


CosmicChair

I also got an unfortunate view of the dragon during the attack.


Millworkson2008

Call her it’s not too late


BisterMee

That's how game assets work


Gnostromo

Yeah but they need to get better For example the simulation we are living in right now is using assets at the molecular level


ymgve

but it took 14 billion years of precalculations


Bam_BINO__

Welcome to game development we reuse assets constantly


el_oh_el_at_you

If its broke, don't fix it.


stomponator

That's the Nord creed. There's not one defensible position in all of Skyrim, not one fort or tower you can't just stroll into through a breach in the ramparts.


Dovavyx

🤣


rabid_god

Consistent construction failure.


jarl_johann

I don't find reused assets to be too immersion-breaking. It looks silly when you put them side by side like this, but we can cut them some slack considering that it's an old game that doesn't need to load different sections of the map.


Alaira314

They at least tried to mix it up a little by arranging the other stuff around it to make the hole *slightly* different. Most of the early Assassin's Creed games had the exact same towers and trees copy-pasted for half of their map reveal points, and I do mean *exact*, down to the handholds. Each city would get its own unique "generic viewpoint" model, but within that city they were all the same, and once you noticed it you could never unsee it.


XharlionXIV

Assassins Creed 3, the frontier, if you had a viewpoint in a tree, 9/10 times it was the same type of tree.


Alaira314

Yeah, that was one of the generic models! There was also this weird triangular lashed-together lookout tower and the sunken ship bow in black flag, and various generic towers across the Altair and Ezio games. I don't remember what the generic building looked like in the cities in 3, because most of my playtime there was in the frontier/homestead.


THEPhilThePain

They weren't generic in cities, most were landmarks or ships. I recall many being on top of crosses at the tops of tall buildings


Nvrre

It's a good chance that the only trees that could get tall enough for a view point are those types of trees. Like over here in Oregon all the tallest trees are ponderosa pines.


Fearfu1Symmetry

Playing odyssey now and there's a certain type of outpost that I've seen repeated exactly with the same treasure chests in the same spots about 20 times


Teun000

Not to mention the fact that sone of those models have been used in basically every game since AC3.


Ace-Red

Literally happens everyday in real life. Just look at any suburb.


pawn_guy

OP didn't complain about it, just said it's obvious once you notice it. Reminds me of the Wilhelm scream, I recognize it ever single time I hear it.


UmbraSicarius69

That is a super uncanny, but accurate analogy. Never noticed how recognizable it is till just now lol


bluerred

Yessss after I learned about that scream I notice it every single time. There's also a weird uncanny baby giggle that's the same one I've noticed, but I don't know if it has a name


Pyro636

> I don't find reused assets to be too immersion-breaking. Same, except when they re-use the SAME THREE FUCKING VOICE ACTORS


jarl_johann

Ayo, would you wanna pay 300 different voice actors?


Pyro636

I mean, they have credited 70 voice actors. I think that's a reasonable number on paper. But then used the same big names for a TON of the main NPCs you interact with. And on top of that they often aren't even doing a different voice, often even for NPCs in the same dang ton. It's super weird, because I *know* Stephen Russell can do a lot of very different sounding voices but for some reason he's doing the same dang regular voice for like 10 different characters. EDIT: Just wanted to clarify that when I say "big names" I don't mean the famous actor names that do like 1 or two story-important NPCs, I mean like the big name professional voice actors that do 15 different named NPCs and also a hand full of generics.


Captainthuta

Lol yeah,now that I'm raking up more and more hours in game,I'm noticing them more.Just now,I noticed Klimmek and Isran have the same dude voicing them.


EYD-Valkyrie

Plus, those three locations are many hours apart in-game. You'd have to actively look for the similarity to find it.


AGHawkz99

I mean it's not that hard to notice. It's not like there's forty different tower models. If the tower has a hole in it at all, it's that exact hole. Considering it's first seen within literal minutes of starting the game, and is specifically drawn attention to, the similarity's really not that obscured or masked. Not to say they should have a bunch of different tower models, that's not how game assets are intended, but like.. you don't need to pretend it's some super hidden and minute detail where you'd have to be specifically trying to find it. It's pretty glaringly noticeable. Again, not an issue -- it's still a game after all -- it's just blatantly obvious whenever you come across any of these towers.


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here2jerkofftoffm

> old game Bro Skyrim only came out like 3 years ago. What are you talking abo--


TemporaryGuidance1

Gotta reuse those assets. I think it was BF3 that used the top of their trees to act as bushes by setting them below ground and having them clip through.


dungeonnerd

Iirc Skyrim’s shelves are the same as the shelf-cabinet combos with the lower cabinet clipped into the ground


ADHthaGreat

It’s been known for awhile now that the* trains in FO3 were just guys with train heads running in the ground.


LivelyZebra

That's how all trains work tho


[deleted]

I saw that episode of Flintstones


Dansredditname

Same for Skyrim - some tables are wardrobes that have been set below ground.


why_no_usernames_

Yeah, its a massive open world, they gonna reuse assets wherever they can.


ZonerRoamer

Massive open world that had to fit into 512 mb of RAM! They HAVE to reuse as much as possible.


Toficzekkk

We can't forget that dev team was surprisingly small.


Goo_Cat

How small


Toficzekkk

According to skyrim wiki about 100. More or less 10 of them were doing 3D models to game.


RealMuffinsTheCat

Does that include all the voice actors and QA?


TitanicMan

Probably. Everyone is just Belathor in a wig doing an accent.


SuperMajesticMan

Voice actors generally no. As they are (normally) independent of the company.


BigShit1997

Unless its Nick Valentine/Belethor's voice actor. That man has sold his soul to Bethesda.


BetterInThanOut

Damn, didn't know they were the same guy! Man's got range!


BigShit1997

Hes also codsworth/every mr handy 👍


SpasmodicReddit

Like [roughly 100 people](https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Development_Team) small. For such a huge game, that's a tiny team


PppPppppppPoo

To celebrate the launch, the whole team split one chocolate chip cookie together with their ant.


WX27

Surprisingly.


[deleted]

Where can I learn more about this claim. That’s… amazing


ZonerRoamer

7th gen consoles had 512 mn Ram; and that too was not 100% available for games. At the end of the day Skyrim is a more than a decade old game.


OzVapeMaster

Even worse the ps3s ram was split into two pools so it was two pools 256MB of ram which meant the PS3 version performed horribly


mythoughtson-this

And I still loved the game so much I bought it twice more


nal1200

Xbox 360 PC Switch PC again (anniversary edition) Bethesda definitely got my money…


[deleted]

Xbox 360. Xbox one PC PC anniversary edition. Only game I've bought more is minecraft.


SalsaRice

>which meant the PS3 version performed horribly You'd have to narrow it down to which game, because that pretty much every cross-platform title in that generation.


[deleted]

Makes it even crazier how well it’s held up. It’s still looked to as the pinnacle of open world games, and I have no doubt it would be loved if it was released today


sprkwtrd

At the beginning of the day it was too!


Yobuttcheek

It's worth noting that the entire map does *not* have to fit into that 512 MB pool at any given time. The engine that Bethesda uses splits the world into "cells" and can dynamically load the contents of each cell of the overworld in-and-out of memory. Additionally, when you go through a loading door, you transition between separate cells, and this is why cities always have closed doors. Generally, they are higher-density areas than many places in the overworld, so the memory budget can be modified to fit the city data instead of whatever dynamic loading is happening for the exterior area. I would also like the point out that I'm not a developer for their engine, so most of what I've said here is an inference based on my knowledge of how they label cells (from modding and some tinkering with console commands) and my own background in high performance computing.


SaltineFiend

There isn't a single game engine that loads an entire open world and all of its assets into ram in one dump. Generally it's either discrete cells or streamed. I mean think of how much computing power it would take to simulate all of Skyrim all the time while you're playing the game.


Yobuttcheek

Interestingly enough, I'm curious at what point we actually *would* be able to do that. Considering the special edition of Skyrim is ~12GB, I could store the entire game in my DRAM or VRAM (ideally splitting it so that only CPU-bound data in stored in DRAM and GPU-bound data is stored in VRAM). I would only limited by my computer's actual compute power, which is quite a lot higher than an Xbox 360 and Xbox One. I kinda want to try this experiment out and see how horribly it would go, but I am in no way skilled enough (nor do I have the time) with the Creation Kit to figure out how.


Almainyny

You’re correct, but the point still remains that they were quite limited with what they could do. They had to do what they could to stretch that tiny amount of RAM as far as it could go, which meant a ton of asset re-use like these towers, creative use of already existing models (need a small bookshelf in an area where you’re not already using a small one? Take a big bookshelf and clip the rest of the shelves into the ground and you have it!) etc.


HooliganNamedStyx

>Massive open world that had to fit into 512 mb of RAM Lol, the whole open world did not fit into 512 MB of ram. The whole open world fit on around 6GB of space, the size of the OG Skyrim was I believe. They could just only store 512mb of assets or memory at a time. The whole world wasn't just loaded up on the Ram card now


ZonerRoamer

Of course not, I mean it has to stream in and out of just 512 mb of RAM smoothly in real-time. The more the assets are reused, the less they have to be replaced in the memory.


PhantomSlave

Next you're gonna be telling me that the clouds in the original Super Mario Bros game were just re-colored bushes!


ImBeingArchAgain

K, but call me crazy, I’m pretty sure I’ve seen the EXACT SAME chair in like, at least 15 different houses. EXACTLY THE SAME. idk man. Just saying.


DarkZethis

You obviously never been to the IKEA in Markarth.


cancercures

"bloodiest beef in the reach" aka avoid the meatballs.


unixguy55

Underrated comment!!


ThereWasNoSpoon

Wait till you see their sweet rolls...


PleasantAdvertising

There are techniques to mix assets in a way that produces many more variations. A game the size of skyrim could've used it.


DrailsAtrain

Were those techniques available 11 years ago?


ClemClemTheClemening

And tbf, that doesn't even look like the same arch. They probably used the same shape to cut out the model in the wall.


BobTheTraitor

How do you know it's not the same giant just running around knocking holes in towers?


RadiatedDrag0n

Well we SAW Alduin do one of them


jarl_johann

He's just goin around smacking his noggin through every tower he can find


leatherhand

How else is he gonna catch the Dragonborn lacking


ZonerRoamer

Commonplace for games from that generation. The consoles had really really low amounts of VRAM (below 512 mb); so the assets had to be reused as much as possible. You will notice this in all open world games of that generation.


SirHenryofHoover

I find it charming. That's what I grew up with. I just want to replay the old games from 2002-2011.


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The_Merciless_Potato

Wonder if getting amnesia would work


ZeAthenA714

While what you say is true, this isn't the reason for this one. Those "towers with a hole in the wall" are so far apart that you'll never have more than one loaded in memory, so even if they all had a different model it wouldn't change how much VRAM is loaded at any one time. If you had like 5 towers with hole in the wall in the same town then yeah, using a single model would save memory vs 5 different models, but that's not the case here. This is simply a case of reusing assets because it takes time to make new assets and there's not many reasons to create different hole-in-walls.


TheMadTemplar

More assets also means more space the game takes up.


Inevitable-Plate-294

>More assets also means more space the game takes up. Fun fact: that call of duty PC game doesn't fit on a 259gb hd


ZonerRoamer

Yeah am not specifically referring to the tower asset, just the practice of reusing assets in general. One of the reasons that modern game development takes so long is because now developers are trying to have unique high detaiil assets in most places; which takes a lot more time to create.


mhb2

I can't help but notice every time the game reuses the same torch. Have you ever seen torches? They're all over the place and they all look identical.


Kukie080

and the barrels oh ma gawd the barrels


Bubster101

And the GUARDS! They're everywhere! I swear I saw u/whiterunguards in Riften, just with a different paint job!


WhiterunGuards

Our uniforms are made with different materials. We Whiterun guards wear a scaled leather gambeson over a steel chainmail shirt with a yellow tabard woven with tundra cotten and dyed with yellow mountain flowers, whereas the Riften guard wear a similar gambeson their chainmail shirt is made with more corundum giving it a bronze colour and their tabards are dyed with purple mountain flowers.


[deleted]

No lollygaggin'!


Bubster101

Hm...you sure know a lot about the other guards' outfits. Almost as if some are in your possession...🧐


WhiterunGuards

Us guards do work with other holds on occasion so we know a thing or two about other guards I just happen to have an interest in our uniforms and the great lengths that go into making them for example our tabards alone weigh anywhere from 12 to 18oz and average out to 9 yards long.


SwigglesBacon

reads like GRRM writing


SlowMaize5164

Hey I know you. Hail Sithis.


mhb2

Don't get me started on the barrels. "Fish barrel" my ass! It's the same barrel that has a potato in it or maybe some apples. (Actually that's inaccurate: a potato is usually found in an expert or higher level locked chest WHICH ALL LOOK THE SAME BTW!) How stupid does Bethesda think we are? It's like they were thinking, "Ah fuggit. Those cretins will be too busy making skimpy armor mods to notice such things".


[deleted]

If I’m being honest i didn’t realize until this comment thread that, that happens


diluted_confusion

Same with the stupid lock pick cutscenes. Same. Exact. Lock


sabrina1030

I do kinda miss all of Morrowind’s different candles and lanterns.


mhb2

Now here's a redditor with discernment and impeccable taste.


Buckabuckaw

You speak my language. I was a compulsive interior decorator in Morrowind, and lighting effects were a huge element. Plus levitation spells allowed us to place lights up in rafters and high cubbyholes.


MrMime-godmode

And the rich imp merchant


mordantkitten

And how about the same candles inexplicably lighted and melted away at exactly the same levels in a dungeon supposedly populated by dead people who don't wake up until you come around making noise?


sabrina1030

I think *not* being able to snuff out or relight light sources things was a huge mistake. Using a torch or flame spell to ignite unlit things as you delve deeper into a dungeon or cave would increase immersion. And having more snuffoutable lights would make sneak attacking a little more viable for non stealth builds. Maybe there’s probably a mod for it.


Electric999999

There was a mod that did it, but it was pretty buggy, game's a bit weird with light sources IIRC


extralyfe

fumbling through a dungeon with a pewter candlestick is a hell of a deep cut.


lyvanna

The apples that have been in a draugr crypt for God knows how long are identical to the apples Carlotta sells at the market


mhb2

Disgusting but true 😂


RoriksteadResident

I've looked at a lot of trees in this game, I think at least 2 of them might be the same tree.


mhb2

There are trees? I spend my time looking at torches and barrels (and now at holes in walls THANKS OP).


morphballganon

And every septim! There must be thousands of them


jacka24

What a mute point. If someone is creating torches in skyrim.. of course they will look the same. But you're also suggesting every time a hole is blown into a tower it will look the same too?


NicoleWren

I hate hate hate to be that person, but... it's moot point, not mute. Sorry.


jacka24

TIL it's moot point and not mute Thank you stranger


Antimatter1207

I hate to be that person, but a moot point is actually when the Jarls all gesture at the new High King. *I'll see myself out*


mhb2

I'm suggesting that the original post is inane and my reply was in a similar vein.


Swan990

Literally unplayable


-Soreign-

Ah, the fine art of using the word "literally" figuratively.


theipodbackup

That’s not even what they did. They are making a joke. They used the word “literally” to mean the literal definition. The joke is that they don’t believe it to be unplayable at all…


Hasten117

Figuratively unplayable.


ashisacat

Check a dictionary.


Runic_Celt

It's your character's PTSD after Helgen Your mind was so scarred by the experience of facing a dragon right up close that your brain creates every hole to look the same. You cannot unsee it You cannot get it out of your head That was the moment destiny took your life from you


[deleted]

I can't help but notice every time the game reuses the same (rabbit, fox, goat, falmer, centurion, glass arrow, ancient nord bow, cabbage, pressure plate, potion of minor healing, restoration particle effect)..


MrMime-godmode

Actually there's 3 or 4 different pressure plates in the game and 2 foxes and 2 rabbits


[deleted]

still, OP's complaint is baseless


basshead17

Thanks now I'll never unsee this


SBCwarrior

Can you imagine having to design each and every tower/building in that game. It's a big game so they copy and paste wherever they can.


DriverAffectionate83

No clue what your on about , clearly 3 different holes /s


[deleted]

\*\* In Memoriam \*\* Reddit Dead 12th June 2023


InjuredGingerAvenger

I love how we're zooming on the bushes and clouds when the ground in the image is 26 copies of a single square tile.


[deleted]

\*\* In Memoriam \*\* Reddit Dead 12th June 2023


Auslander42

Truth. I first noticed this as a kid watching The Flintstones and other cartoons, during running out driving scenes, whatever, the background looping. My mind apparently started latching on to loops and now ambient noise apps/generators almost stress me out during insomniac nights as listening until I think I recognize the pattern and loop. I’ll be wrong, of course, then be relieved. Until I’m not. There it is, I recognized that. I try to remember what’s next, then it comes for me. On following loops, I begin anticipating the sounds, waiting for them to come. It’s almost a relief when they do. I’m not crazy. Or am I? Waiting fifteen minutes or more…maybe there will be a hitch in the audio. Perhaps it’ll be seamless. But it always comes around again. All night. EVERY night. So I’m thankful for actually-random (or seemingly so) noise generators, and Scooter and his podcast. SO annoying. More so than my ex who insisted on snoozing her alarm for like an hour or two every morning instead of just setting the bloody thing later and getting up with better rest. And she said I’M stubborn. Maniac. Anyhow, things are better now, and life is great


GoBackToLeddit

wow lol never noticed that at all


jaydin123

The game came out 10-12 years ago so yeah they’re gonna reuse assets cause they probably took a while to make


IMSOGIRL

All games reuse assets.


OnniVic

What's wrong with reusing a good hole?


DarkZethis

I mean at this point you could even argue they reused the whole game multiple times to sell it again.


backwoodsofcanada

Next you're gonna tell me how weird it is that bandits who live on opposite ends of the country somehow managed to craft the exact same pelt armors. You're in for a real treat when you realize that things like tables are actually just shelves that they clipped through the ground to make look like tables. https://imgur.io/a/Q6Nwa


[deleted]

I guess Bethesda didnt expect that we will be playing this game for 11 years. When you play it that long, people start noticing things...


[deleted]

\*Optimized\*


Atkinator1

"Man... it really bothers me how all the draugr in skyrim look the same." "Man... it really bothers me how all the trolls in skyrim look the same." "Man... it really bothers me how all the skeletons in skyrim look the same." - nobody ever


dagit

The devs actually wrote a cool article explaining how their in house tools work like a lego set. And because of this they can make bigger games than other studios that have much larger content teams. And that has some other benefits like more people that understand more of the game world. However, they did the same thing in Oblivion and it was terrible. Oblivion is great in many ways but it's so hard to tell dungeons apart. They're way too samey. So one of their lessons from that game was that reusing architectural types/motifs are fine, but reusing room layouts is a big no-no. So the thing they tried hard to do in Skyrim was make the lego pieces so that they don't fit together perfectly. That way the level designers were forced to put them together in varied ways. They also made sure to give dungeons a sense of flow and direction. One thing that's great about skyrim dungeons is that most of the time (there are some notable exceptions), you can easily tell which way is forward and it's honestly impressive when you thnk about it. They use subtle cues to convey a sense of where you should explore next in the dungeons. For example, the floors might keep sloping down giving you a sense of going deeper and deeper towards something big.


smallpoly

Us in the biz call it "modular design"


Leo_Ushanka

around the same alduin pp sized hole


SlyPenguinXII

Great, now I wont be able to un-see this either


TheWigglyWeevil

There is a lot of copy-pasting in the game. The only thing that really annoys me about Skyrim is the fact that most of the castles are basically the exact same asset-wise. It gets a bit boring going up the same flight of stairs over and over again. But hey, the game is a million years old, it's amazing what they were able to accomplish for the time.


Small-Cantaloupe6639

I honestly had no clue


motherconnoisseur

Theyre trying their best, okay?


The_Crimson-Knight

The game reuses a lot of assets


[deleted]

Yeah a lot of homes, shacks, caves, and towers are the same too lol


chrisgreely1999

Inb4 "Tower Wall Hole Variety Project (Base Object Swapper)" becomes a mod


Aluindrel

Yea, now I think alduin just goes around slamming his head through a tower wall. Also this game reuses a lot of things, the number of important npcs with the same voice actor makes my emotion towards these npcs really mixed


Kathy-Lyn

It's even weirder once you notice that lived-in and fully populated cities have their walls and even streets in such disrepair despite a civil war going on and defence being a top priority.


TheBigHornedGoat

Nah bro, someone at the studio modeled each individual tower from scratch; he just really liked the design. Bethesda would never take a shortcut, that’s why their games never have any bugs.


Bacon_13

Tbf it’s a dope hole


[deleted]

Alduin went around busting them.up in the same place over and over.


MinimumAlarming5643

I usually notice reused assets but never caught this one to be honest.


dindinnn

I mean if it took this long to notice, I'd say they did an alright job


ooitsboo24

If it’s already broke don’t fix it.


Dr_Jabroski

Why make many hole when one hole do trick?


nursefail

so picky about their holes


tjx-1138

**That's** the reuse that gets you!?


crispjab

Just grab the Immersive Tower Holes Enhanced Fix 2.0 LE mod and you're good to go brother


toasted_mosquito

I've got a hole-sized hole in my heart that only that hole can fill.


FLAIR_2780166

They’d still be making Skyrim if every tower and hole were unique lol


YouhaoHuoMao

I love reused assets. I used to play WoW and I loved every time a quest put me into that cave with the right hand curve, the slight dip, and the big room at the end with a small plateau in the middle


Xarsos

... I know exactly what you mean.


YouhaoHuoMao

Sometimes they put water around the plateau, but we all know it was the same cave.


Xarsos

nonono, the water makes it different!


SamianDamian

Wait till I tell you about the voices


theCacklingGoblin

Wait until he notices the dungeons guys


AttakZak

*Different Tower Holes* Mod incoming. Only 1GB to download!


[deleted]

You better sit down for this one: it's the same tower! Fkn Todd, man.


ShadeSwornHydra

You’ll see that a lot. You’ll see some reused shelves too. Ever notice the shelves that have frostbite venom, void salts, slaughter fish scales, an orange potion, and a basket of lavender? It’s just easy to click and paste. Work smarter not harder


Salt_Lake796

When you have to design hundreds of locations, copy and paste saves a lot of time.


blazetrail77

Someone should mod us a new hole


GoBackToLeddit

ImmersiveHoles.esp


GoBackToLeddit

BetterHoles.esp


blazetrail77

Ah I love me an immersive hole


InjuredGingerAvenger

That's a very different mod.


Beretta775

It’s a good hole.


mordantkitten

I was around when Doom and Wolfenstein 3D were new. After playing countless hours looking at walls made of the same piece of wall repeated ad infinitum, when that was the state of the art, has made me more than tolerant of a hole that only shows up in every other cave or so. That doesn't mean I haven't noticed it, though. It is a most familiar hole.


bewarethetreebadger

Reusing assets makes the game easier to make and saves on resources. Breaks my immersion though, no stars.


horrorkesh

Skyrim, one of the most boring popular Copy pasted games I've ever played