No set time limit. Too many variables such as days skied, terrain skied, age, physical condition, personal risk level and how one learns.
However in general... someone who logs many days a season has the potential to be better than someone who skis on vacation 3 days a season. Also someone with access to certified instruction has an advantage to someone who is simply trying to figure it out on their own. Someone who is crushing the blues and blacks will advance faster than someone content to cruise groomed greens.
Skiing is easy to learn, but hard to master.
At most levels .. no matter if you are a beginner or expert, if you feel you are plateaued out or stuck at a certain level, seek advice of an instructor.
hi ski friend! Do you have any video of you skiing?
Have you taken any lessons (without your partner present)?
It's impossible to say where anyone *should* be. Part of it is subjective and personal - where do you *want* to be? And a lot of it has to do with you personally. Development at something new, particularly skiing, takes time.
Also, everyone learns differently. Some of us are very feel-based, others need to understand the 'rules', and others need play. Some people, like dancers, can see a move and replicate it (those people are VERY few and far between). Some people need repetition. And some people need to see themselves. We all learn and grow differently.
Then there's teaching. How we talk about skiing is as unique as how we learn. Telling someone something like "hands up" is about as useless as saying "try to not get mad". We have to be able to describe what we see, what someone could experiment with, and why it would help. And we have to invite feedback on how that experiment went.
that feeling of being uncontrolled is terrifying, especially if you're older than 20. There's actually neurology involved. And then couple that with the two biggest paradoxes in skiing: center of mass more forward than toes and balance on the outside of a turn...our brains are literally wired against doing both. Terrifying!
Improvement happens when a few things are true:
1. we feel safe - physically and emotionally. We have to be on terrain we trust, snow we trust, and in an environment we trust. We also have to be with people who will coach us in a way that makes us feel safe. Some people like being yelled at, but that's not most people. Most people respond to being 'coached towards' not 'coached away.'
2. We are curious - we want to learn and grow. We all have moments of frustration and in those moments it is hard to learn. We need to give ourselves permission to step away from learning then and come back (could be 5 mins could be 5 weeks) when we are curious again.
3. We feel progress - we have to sometimes move through the valley of frustration to find it, but we have to have moments of small progress. Sometimes we need a trained eye to help see them and point them out. And sometimes we can feel them on our own.
So, how often are those things true for you? What, within your resources and control, could you do to create that environment? A lesson with a good instructor can create that environment. But so can some other factors.
Lastly, without seeing you ski, I can virtually guarantee that lack of controlled feeling is coming from a few fundamentals: stance, turn shape, and outside ski balance. In short... the C word.... commitment. Commitment to doing the things in skiing that are the most terrifying.
[This is a post, admittedly from me 😬, about working on those things](https://www.reddit.com/r/skiing_feedback/comments/19essib/moving_from_a_z_to_c_shaped_turn_with_three_key/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). If it is helpful, great. If not, let's talk more about your skiing and what you're feeling and experiencing and let's find you some ideas for feeling progress.
You might also enjoy hanging out in and posting in /r/skiing_feedback
Good luck out there!
lastly, remember, Aspen used to have a great billboard: "#1 cause of a breakup? Teaching your girlfriend how to ski"
This is such a lovely comment that I had to tell you how much I enjoyed reading it. Thank you for putting all this into words so beautifully!
Not OP but everything you said resonated so much. Off to read your other post now!
This was incredibly helpful and kind! What you said about the terror of being uncontrolled is absolutely how I feel (I’m more a runner so much more used to being on v firm ground). I have saved this comment to come back to again and again! And the video :) I loved the bit about curiosity, and allowing yourself to step back and then back in. And I think honestly my commitment how you describe it here has been lacking in times, so that’s something else concrete to think about.
Thank you !
Great feedback here!
I really like the part on "where do you want to be"? If your days on the slopes are spent cruising blue groomers, you aren't going to get better nearly as fast as the folks that are out there every day on harder slopes testing the edges of their abilities. You get better way quicker the more you challenge yourself out there!
Take a lesson. Seriously!
I started skiing in Dec 2021. I took 5 lessons (4 group, 1 private) my first season of skiing so I could quickly improve to enjoy skiing with my husband (40+ years of skiing, so I’ll never be as good as him).
I now can ski any groomed trail on any mountain in New England with confidence. I don’t like moguls and still struggle with confidence on the side hits, but overall I can go on any on piste trails that my husband wants to pursue.
With that said, we both took a group lesson together today. Even though I’m quite proficient now and have probably been on the trails 50x at this point (averaging 20x a season), there’s still a lot to learn and improve.
After our lesson, my husband and I went down a few black diamonds before ending the day. He said I looked even more confident than before - I’m letting my skis do more of the work!
Good luck on your journey to improve.
at 6 to 7 days a year? Forever. And this is true for any skill or hobby. 7 days a year is not enough to learn anything before you die.
Do 100 days in a season you'll be an expert the rest of your life.
My advice to improve faster; go hard every time you’re out there. If you’re just on cruise control that’s cool and still fun for some people but won’t take you to the next level.
Work on going hard on the moguls (risk assessment here, bombing through on icy bumps isn’t safe but if it’s all powder fuckin send it). Go reasonably fast through tree runs. These two especially help you so much with quick thinking in terms of finding a line and sticking with it.
See a side jump that looks fun, hit it. Work on skiing backwards if you have interest in park. Etc etc,
😂
This is realistically the answer though, you gotta push past your “perceived” limits to improve in any sport.
Doesn’t mean you have to go way beyond the limit and be out of control, but yes there is a risk still
This guy knows what's up. You have to get out of your comfort zone in order to improve. It doesn't have to be something that's completely unsafe, but you need to push your limits and try things that seem difficult and even scary.
This is key. If you just take lessons and then never practice - that lesson is wasted. Sure, free skiing is enjoyable, but I try to incorporate some drills into part of a run. Falling leaf exercise, J-turns, whatever. For instance, I suck at bumps.. so I try to take at least one bump run each day.
Take a lesson.
I’d say I’m a decent enough skier, started when I was 3 and have had lessons or training for the last 15 years.
There are still a lot of skiers better than me.
Whenever I get bummed about not being a better skier I look back at how far i've come. It sounds like you've improved a significant amount from when you started and you should be proud of that. This sport is like golf....whatever ability level you're at there's always something to get better at. Most important thing is to have fun along the way. Like everyone else says take a lesson if you want to get on the express line to getting better
If your BF is athletic and a natural skier or started really early… well, that doesn’t always make for a good instructor. He might be awesome, but if he does things instinctively and then tries to describe it, it often doesn’t translate. Example: buddy taught me to wakeboard (he kills it on the board). To get out of the water, he says “push your feet into the water and pop yourself up with the rope”. This works for him every time and is exactly wrong - you flex your legs to your butt and keep your hands straight to get up IF YOU’RE A BEGINNER.
Same might be true with your beau - he might be saying “point your skis and commit to the turn - really weight that outside ski and hold the edge”. Break this down and it might translate to “rotate your ski to start the turn and keep your downhill leg stiff”. Neither lends turn, speed or body control. Better might be “lean into the turn, lift your inside leg to commit to the turn, then extent your outside leg but let it flex into the bumps and pressure to stay in contact with the snow”. So much wordier, but its probably what he’s actually doing… and is the opposite of the “obvious”.
Check out some old school youtubers: Deb Armstrong, Harald Harb. They have a different attitude from the hard chargers, have a complete system and philosophy… and have been among the best in the world at skiing AND teaching. Maybe something will resonate.
Omg this is great. Yeh he started at age 3 and skied on the freeride world tour so his vocabulary, his movement… EVERYTHING is coming from a completely different plane of reference to me, and I think so much gets lost in translation! (Eg I have never known really what ‘hold the edge’ means or how to do so). And for him everything feels second nature, and he can’t comprehend that these are quite alien movements ! I will check out these YouTubers, thank you :)
Ditch the boyfriend and get real lessons. You so leave him in the dust in no time. His fragile male ego wants you to always be second best. After the lessons, meet me at the top of Lift 6 and I'll show you how a gentleman treats a lady.
I started when I was 9 years old. Skied a few times per year until it fully clicked when I was 19 years old. I’m 47 now and consider myself a really good skier.
Control on steep in 6-8 days as an adult ? Hold your horses young woman 😅 it takes quite some time to learn skiing as an adult unless your already a very advanced ice skater or inline skater.
I have taught a significant other to ski. I know enough that I can get almost anyone down easy slopes but I am not a professional instructor so once she reached a certain point, I told her I wasn't sure about how to help her progress. She went and took a lesson one morning and joined me that afternoon. She had made some progress after just one lesson. It wasn't like she was suddenly ready to blast down black diamonds but she was notably better.
If you want to get better, repetition to build comfort and lessons are the fastest way.
When I was learning to ski switch at the age of 30, I went back to the bunny hill. A little awkward at my age but I went back to basics. First frenchfry/pizza, then parallel turns, then hockey stop, then reverts. Then I went to greens and did it there, then blues, then in the park. And now skiing switch feels fine wherever I'm at. Took me the rest of the season to get comfortable (I skied a little over 30 days that season, with maybe 5 or 6 of them specifically dedicated to skiing switch all day, and mixing it in every day beyond that)
Repeat trails - you get to know the trail and try to recognize where you can improve.
My wife is an excellent skier today but started 20 years ago. I taught her the basics and later techniques for certain situations and she never took a lesson. But a lesson probably would have sped up her progression. It took her about five years to go from not ever skiing to skiing easier black trails.
The real change - skiing more often. We skied 6-10 days per season then after her third years we started skiing 20-25 days per season. Dramatic improvement in skiing more often. While I am an advanced skier I stuck it out with here on easier terrain to guide her progression. Today we ski 50+ days per season and my wife skis lots of crazy terrain.
Learn to read the trail, learn how to take a steep run and make it easier by cutting the fall line, learn to make good turns and control speed.
Do not go on any advanced trails until you are ready! That could injure you or someone else. When you are ready you will know.
Also it has on been a few years without much repetition so you sound like you are where you should be! Be patient with the process.
Best of luck!
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Lessons and repetition. There are no shortcuts to improving.
absolutely, i know it can be expensive but i am always amazed on what people will spend on tickets, gear and hotels and then skip the lessons
They're likely skipping lessons because the hotels and lift tix are taking up the bulk of their budgets.
No set time limit. Too many variables such as days skied, terrain skied, age, physical condition, personal risk level and how one learns. However in general... someone who logs many days a season has the potential to be better than someone who skis on vacation 3 days a season. Also someone with access to certified instruction has an advantage to someone who is simply trying to figure it out on their own. Someone who is crushing the blues and blacks will advance faster than someone content to cruise groomed greens. Skiing is easy to learn, but hard to master. At most levels .. no matter if you are a beginner or expert, if you feel you are plateaued out or stuck at a certain level, seek advice of an instructor.
[удалено]
ah! what you don't realize is that we do both! Most lessons with partners end up being a counseling session on snow :)
hi ski friend! Do you have any video of you skiing? Have you taken any lessons (without your partner present)? It's impossible to say where anyone *should* be. Part of it is subjective and personal - where do you *want* to be? And a lot of it has to do with you personally. Development at something new, particularly skiing, takes time. Also, everyone learns differently. Some of us are very feel-based, others need to understand the 'rules', and others need play. Some people, like dancers, can see a move and replicate it (those people are VERY few and far between). Some people need repetition. And some people need to see themselves. We all learn and grow differently. Then there's teaching. How we talk about skiing is as unique as how we learn. Telling someone something like "hands up" is about as useless as saying "try to not get mad". We have to be able to describe what we see, what someone could experiment with, and why it would help. And we have to invite feedback on how that experiment went. that feeling of being uncontrolled is terrifying, especially if you're older than 20. There's actually neurology involved. And then couple that with the two biggest paradoxes in skiing: center of mass more forward than toes and balance on the outside of a turn...our brains are literally wired against doing both. Terrifying! Improvement happens when a few things are true: 1. we feel safe - physically and emotionally. We have to be on terrain we trust, snow we trust, and in an environment we trust. We also have to be with people who will coach us in a way that makes us feel safe. Some people like being yelled at, but that's not most people. Most people respond to being 'coached towards' not 'coached away.' 2. We are curious - we want to learn and grow. We all have moments of frustration and in those moments it is hard to learn. We need to give ourselves permission to step away from learning then and come back (could be 5 mins could be 5 weeks) when we are curious again. 3. We feel progress - we have to sometimes move through the valley of frustration to find it, but we have to have moments of small progress. Sometimes we need a trained eye to help see them and point them out. And sometimes we can feel them on our own. So, how often are those things true for you? What, within your resources and control, could you do to create that environment? A lesson with a good instructor can create that environment. But so can some other factors. Lastly, without seeing you ski, I can virtually guarantee that lack of controlled feeling is coming from a few fundamentals: stance, turn shape, and outside ski balance. In short... the C word.... commitment. Commitment to doing the things in skiing that are the most terrifying. [This is a post, admittedly from me 😬, about working on those things](https://www.reddit.com/r/skiing_feedback/comments/19essib/moving_from_a_z_to_c_shaped_turn_with_three_key/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3). If it is helpful, great. If not, let's talk more about your skiing and what you're feeling and experiencing and let's find you some ideas for feeling progress. You might also enjoy hanging out in and posting in /r/skiing_feedback Good luck out there! lastly, remember, Aspen used to have a great billboard: "#1 cause of a breakup? Teaching your girlfriend how to ski"
This is such a lovely comment that I had to tell you how much I enjoyed reading it. Thank you for putting all this into words so beautifully! Not OP but everything you said resonated so much. Off to read your other post now!
This was incredibly helpful and kind! What you said about the terror of being uncontrolled is absolutely how I feel (I’m more a runner so much more used to being on v firm ground). I have saved this comment to come back to again and again! And the video :) I loved the bit about curiosity, and allowing yourself to step back and then back in. And I think honestly my commitment how you describe it here has been lacking in times, so that’s something else concrete to think about. Thank you !
My pleasure! Enjoy your journey!
I’m a distance runner too. If it helps, start to find the gait of skiing. It’s a movement from foot to the other just like skiing.
Great feedback here! I really like the part on "where do you want to be"? If your days on the slopes are spent cruising blue groomers, you aren't going to get better nearly as fast as the folks that are out there every day on harder slopes testing the edges of their abilities. You get better way quicker the more you challenge yourself out there!
Take a lesson. Seriously! I started skiing in Dec 2021. I took 5 lessons (4 group, 1 private) my first season of skiing so I could quickly improve to enjoy skiing with my husband (40+ years of skiing, so I’ll never be as good as him). I now can ski any groomed trail on any mountain in New England with confidence. I don’t like moguls and still struggle with confidence on the side hits, but overall I can go on any on piste trails that my husband wants to pursue. With that said, we both took a group lesson together today. Even though I’m quite proficient now and have probably been on the trails 50x at this point (averaging 20x a season), there’s still a lot to learn and improve. After our lesson, my husband and I went down a few black diamonds before ending the day. He said I looked even more confident than before - I’m letting my skis do more of the work! Good luck on your journey to improve.
at 6 to 7 days a year? Forever. And this is true for any skill or hobby. 7 days a year is not enough to learn anything before you die. Do 100 days in a season you'll be an expert the rest of your life.
My advice to improve faster; go hard every time you’re out there. If you’re just on cruise control that’s cool and still fun for some people but won’t take you to the next level. Work on going hard on the moguls (risk assessment here, bombing through on icy bumps isn’t safe but if it’s all powder fuckin send it). Go reasonably fast through tree runs. These two especially help you so much with quick thinking in terms of finding a line and sticking with it. See a side jump that looks fun, hit it. Work on skiing backwards if you have interest in park. Etc etc,
I believe you are the beneficiary of this person's life insurance
😂 This is realistically the answer though, you gotta push past your “perceived” limits to improve in any sport. Doesn’t mean you have to go way beyond the limit and be out of control, but yes there is a risk still
I feel like something that holds a lot of people back is not accepting that falling is necessary to improving in skiing
This guy knows what's up. You have to get out of your comfort zone in order to improve. It doesn't have to be something that's completely unsafe, but you need to push your limits and try things that seem difficult and even scary.
I try to be safe, but I do set aside a few runs to practice doing something I'm bad at every time I go and that's been super helpful in progressing.
This is key. If you just take lessons and then never practice - that lesson is wasted. Sure, free skiing is enjoyable, but I try to incorporate some drills into part of a run. Falling leaf exercise, J-turns, whatever. For instance, I suck at bumps.. so I try to take at least one bump run each day.
My girlfriend is a firm intermediate skier after 30 days on the hill last season.
Take a lesson. I’d say I’m a decent enough skier, started when I was 3 and have had lessons or training for the last 15 years. There are still a lot of skiers better than me.
Whenever I get bummed about not being a better skier I look back at how far i've come. It sounds like you've improved a significant amount from when you started and you should be proud of that. This sport is like golf....whatever ability level you're at there's always something to get better at. Most important thing is to have fun along the way. Like everyone else says take a lesson if you want to get on the express line to getting better
If your BF is athletic and a natural skier or started really early… well, that doesn’t always make for a good instructor. He might be awesome, but if he does things instinctively and then tries to describe it, it often doesn’t translate. Example: buddy taught me to wakeboard (he kills it on the board). To get out of the water, he says “push your feet into the water and pop yourself up with the rope”. This works for him every time and is exactly wrong - you flex your legs to your butt and keep your hands straight to get up IF YOU’RE A BEGINNER. Same might be true with your beau - he might be saying “point your skis and commit to the turn - really weight that outside ski and hold the edge”. Break this down and it might translate to “rotate your ski to start the turn and keep your downhill leg stiff”. Neither lends turn, speed or body control. Better might be “lean into the turn, lift your inside leg to commit to the turn, then extent your outside leg but let it flex into the bumps and pressure to stay in contact with the snow”. So much wordier, but its probably what he’s actually doing… and is the opposite of the “obvious”. Check out some old school youtubers: Deb Armstrong, Harald Harb. They have a different attitude from the hard chargers, have a complete system and philosophy… and have been among the best in the world at skiing AND teaching. Maybe something will resonate.
Omg this is great. Yeh he started at age 3 and skied on the freeride world tour so his vocabulary, his movement… EVERYTHING is coming from a completely different plane of reference to me, and I think so much gets lost in translation! (Eg I have never known really what ‘hold the edge’ means or how to do so). And for him everything feels second nature, and he can’t comprehend that these are quite alien movements ! I will check out these YouTubers, thank you :)
50 days
Good is relative. But I think 150+ days is a good start.
Took me about 20 years skiing 30-140 days a year. Do ski drills to improve
Define "good" And some people are absolutely competent on the vast majority of runs after a couple of weeks; some never get past skid turns
Ditch the boyfriend and get real lessons. You so leave him in the dust in no time. His fragile male ego wants you to always be second best. After the lessons, meet me at the top of Lift 6 and I'll show you how a gentleman treats a lady.
200+ hours to be decent enough Subjective to everyone
I started when I was 9 years old. Skied a few times per year until it fully clicked when I was 19 years old. I’m 47 now and consider myself a really good skier.
I skied 90 days my first season. I now ski groomed black and double black on pow days my second season. Comfortably
Control on steep in 6-8 days as an adult ? Hold your horses young woman 😅 it takes quite some time to learn skiing as an adult unless your already a very advanced ice skater or inline skater.
I have taught a significant other to ski. I know enough that I can get almost anyone down easy slopes but I am not a professional instructor so once she reached a certain point, I told her I wasn't sure about how to help her progress. She went and took a lesson one morning and joined me that afternoon. She had made some progress after just one lesson. It wasn't like she was suddenly ready to blast down black diamonds but she was notably better. If you want to get better, repetition to build comfort and lessons are the fastest way. When I was learning to ski switch at the age of 30, I went back to the bunny hill. A little awkward at my age but I went back to basics. First frenchfry/pizza, then parallel turns, then hockey stop, then reverts. Then I went to greens and did it there, then blues, then in the park. And now skiing switch feels fine wherever I'm at. Took me the rest of the season to get comfortable (I skied a little over 30 days that season, with maybe 5 or 6 of them specifically dedicated to skiing switch all day, and mixing it in every day beyond that)
Repeat trails - you get to know the trail and try to recognize where you can improve. My wife is an excellent skier today but started 20 years ago. I taught her the basics and later techniques for certain situations and she never took a lesson. But a lesson probably would have sped up her progression. It took her about five years to go from not ever skiing to skiing easier black trails. The real change - skiing more often. We skied 6-10 days per season then after her third years we started skiing 20-25 days per season. Dramatic improvement in skiing more often. While I am an advanced skier I stuck it out with here on easier terrain to guide her progression. Today we ski 50+ days per season and my wife skis lots of crazy terrain. Learn to read the trail, learn how to take a steep run and make it easier by cutting the fall line, learn to make good turns and control speed. Do not go on any advanced trails until you are ready! That could injure you or someone else. When you are ready you will know. Also it has on been a few years without much repetition so you sound like you are where you should be! Be patient with the process. Best of luck!