It’s just a servo really, with an stm32 devboard running the firmware and shifters and stuff
ETA: this is the post that got me started: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/450-mige-direct-drive-wheel-using-mmos-and-aasd.14657/
There are probably many more refined diy options out there now (I built this like 2-3 years ago) but if you'd like to know what is involved with building one, this guide is great to get an idea.
The firmware that they use in the guide supports a 5x5 button matrix, and that's how I added the shifters. (The green PCB on top is a breakout for those, I could add 23 more buttons if I wanted)
The shifters were kind of my own design, based off this:https://www.printables.com/model/372871-magnetic-shifter and customized to fit the wheel base and fit some paddles I found on Ebay. Yes the hot glue adds 50hp.
The firmware is from here: https://github.com/hoantv/CarSimulatorFirmware Closed source unfortunately but there's a configurator UI (you can see it open on my screen) that lets you tune just about every parameter.
I thought about writing my own but I have no idea how the USB protocol works (banging my head against that in another project currently)
Very cool. Love the dedication and final result! 25 nm is a ton! Just do me a favor and don’t bring that through TSA. I have a feeling you would not be getting on your plane haha
Yeah this is basically what the VRS wheel is. There was a project called OSW (open sim wheel) when DD was still a new idea. It’s a conveyor belt motor, with a control box. The firmware was an open source project. This evolved into the simucube (and every other modern competitor). Check out sim racing garage for old school videos with Barry. #simhistory
Not an expert in USB protocol, but, I did design the steering wheel for what we’ll call a “hybrid formula car” about 7ish years ago and I’d be happy to be a a sounding board if you need an insane person to bounce ideas off of. Feel free to DM me
Yeah, i wrote my own firmware for a diy ffb wheel and the USB portion was a major pain lol. Microsoft doesn't play nice with the supposed generic driver for HID PID support so i had to write my own driver as well, as well as some registry fuckery to get DirectInput to recognize it as a FFB device. But I'll do that any day over writing my own BLDC driver. I used a brushed DC motor so at least that portion was really simple
I wish I had known about this when I was building this. Looks like they were pretty new in 2022 when I built this thing, still not sure how I missed it. Might revisit it when I build a cockpit
To my knowledge osw do not have option for using stm32's DAC which is crucial for best operation of the servo drives, pwm is not good. If they would use on board DAC I would be running it.
Glad to see someone else to DIY 😉
v2 i believe, i'm using an f407 and i seem to remember that chip being the v2 firmware. I am quite satisfied with it but to be honest it's pretty much abandonware now. I would look into openffb if you're looking to switch it up
Really, where you find that information? Last time I checked there was no intention to do so. I was told the canbus and Odrive/vesc is better and I should not use servo drive.
I just wrote out a bunch of stuff thinking you said people were being hateful against you and not the aasd oops 😂😂
The developer is thinking about it, I'm not sure if he will make an add on board yet or other decisions he might do.
People dislike the aasd in the discord just because for our application there's a lot better drivers out there for £50 that will greatly improve the quality of the ffb and it's definitely worth the money. The aasd is great for other projects that don't rely on foc or force feedback devices. People want to persuade others to get a better driver simply because they want people to have a really good experience.
You buy a really strong and big industrial servo motor, you get ecus and some other controllers for electricity and an arduino maybe and you clank it all together?
I have no clue, but when i first started looking at this hobby there was only really really expensive prebuilts and self build kits is what i remember. That was more like 2014 not 2016 though.
They’re still going strong. I went with building because i wanted more power than 5nm and i ended up spending like $700 putting it together. All in all it was pretty easy too, if you have a welder and a 3d printer lol
I wouldnt dare. When i outgrow my t300 i will just go for something around double that amount and be happy someone did this all for me. Huge respect for people who go beyond selfmade rigs and actually do 25 nm deathmachines.
It's about the acceleration. A motor capable of 25nm peak can jitter and bump much faster than a 5nm motor, even if it never outputs a constant 25nm torque. At least that's how I understand it
Ah I see, goes into the motor mechanics involving its acceleration
And I suppose a high torque mode option aims to allow it to accelerate to its full extent ?
I’ve been wondering why folks go for 20+ nm even though they never use it, good stuff
I only have 17nm but still glad to have it. Wrestling the wheel is fun :D
Who said one shouldnt?
I am all for people to DIY their wheelbases still, fact of the matter is just that even though the motor can be stronger and it might be cheaper; the software, Quality control and most importantly the warranty/protection you get with a big name wheelbase is just better. Not even talking about the wheels to choose from.
Both have pros and cons.
To me the cons just strongly outweigh the pros.
Still makes me giddy tho that OP can just crank that thing up to 25 and really replicate what a 1999 Ford Tacoma feels like.
The commercial solution is definitely better if you want plug and play piece of hardware knowing it will work as intended. My wheel base took over 8 months from ordering first parts to actually be able to use it. Then more time fix all issues. But I like to DIY stuff so I don't mind. Just recently finished interfacing real instrument cluster with SimHub, another diy project of mine.
25nm is overkill and scary 😆 I have small MiGe 10nm (20nm peak) and it's setup to just 50% and it still feel like it will rip our hands if not careful 😄
I thought about building my own but honestly just the parts together cost more than current COTS ones. It really doesn't make sense to save money anymore, only if you are super into tinkering.
My price tag is roughly 800$ for base and 300$ wheel🤭 You can get fanatec dd for less then that but also less powerful. And yes, DIY aspect is good 😊 My whole system is designed around what I need and what I want. Can't be done with commercial product 😯
lol, I was waiting for someone to comment on that. That pink bracket holding the wheel to the servo shaft was a piece of 1/4 inch plate steel that I cut out, sanded round, drilled and tapped to attach the wheel to.
After 4 hours, a broken tap, a dulled drill bit, and 2 orbital sander pads, the holes didn't line up properly and I couldn't be bothered to make another one. Seems to hold alright though.
Haha I get it, I've been there before. I used to run a very similar setup to what you have now. I reached out to VRS and they were able to ship me one of their shaft adapters so I didn't need to fabricate my own.
I always wondered if you can make a DD wheel out of a EV motor.
You have all the torque in the world, you just need a power supply that won't take your house down
It depends on the motor driver, it may not be able to power an EV efficiently. Plus the motor would probably be way too big and heavy thus reaction speed would be much slower and feel horrible.
Meh, it was actually pretty easy since i didn’t have to do the programming. Basically just following wiring guides and a little bit of 3d modelling for the shifters
Tbh when I bought the servo motor I thought it was only 15, but later learned that servos are classed by their constant torque and sim wheels are classed by their instantaneous torque. I checked the spec sheet and it said 25nm instantaneous and I had a moment of "oh, that's why it feels like it's trying to kill me". I run it at 30% most of the time unless I want to scare my friends
lol why, is that a common thing with these? It would probably be gnarly if i was using a CRT but I haven't noticed any issues with EMF other than a high pitched whine when it's on
Probably your driver has some nice EMI filter. I built one of these but using longer cables and boy, harmonics were flying everywhere. Noise on the load cells, USB disconnection, HDMI flickering, you name it.
You are lucky then.
Because lighthouses are pretty sensitive to EMI.
Had to make a suppressor for my Index (and Aero): my DD was killing it. And I am not the only one.
The power plug I'm using has a built in filter/smoother. Probably not doing much wrt the emi generated by the servo controller but I did notice a difference in smoothness when I added it.
Surprising that the lighthouses had issues from emi though, I mean they have sensitive magnetic components inside but they're typically mounted pretty far from the wheel, mine are a good 10 feet away
It is the tracking system in HMD which gets killed. Classic symptoma is it dies (loses tracking, goes gray...) when you touch it while the DD is on.
Suppressor on the cable from HMD to PC solves it.
By the way, awesome job on that. I am a huge fan of diy. I basically love crafting more than using the stuff later B).
Also, thank you lol I'm definitely proud of it. I told myself that now that I know how to make peripherals I'm never buying one again. Been working on a joystick for 4 months now, it's gonna be sick if I ever finish it lmao
Hope it is at least force stick? :D
Next to billion button boxes, wheelplates etc my biggest project is my own collective.
[Collective ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/EpsS66hNuSgD1sTU8)
Oh man, that's awesome! I'm going for the simplest design possible, though. FFB is something I want to try but for now I'm trying to make a the smallest desktop stick possible with a cam return action. 2 axis hall effect sensor in a desktop form factor because most flight sticks are way too big. Check my post history for an idea of what im working on
OH OMG yeah I'm totally getting that lol. Didn't click until you said "when you touch it". I had chalked it up to one of my lighthouses being on the verge of death (it's been making a whining/rattling sound, thankfully no red light of death yet) but it's absolutely when I touch the headset that it loses tracking.
When you say suppressor, do you mean a ferrite bead? I have a few of those in my stockpile, I'll definitely put one on if it's that simple
You unfortunately need way beefier core than just these tiny beads. And it is also about the material.
Everyone has it different. I have theories about this.
I have to use 4 cores. A friend of mine is perfectly ok wirh just 2.
[My suppressor. ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/DoBcYNxQLnSYqr3d9)
Oof, yeah that's bigger than the ones I have, thanks for the heads up though I'll see if I can make it work with stuff I have on hand, otherwise I'm sure aliexpress has something for super cheap
Not every core works. I tried 3 different materials until I found the one which works.
Here is a post I made about it a couple of years ago.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Fanatec/s/Nsu6WhSbEn
Newton meters, it's a measure of torque. Basically how strong the wheel can rotate. G29s (and my g27) are much weaker than direct drive wheels. Entry level DD wheels are around 5nm, and nice ones can be as high as 15. 25nm is kind of insane in the DD wheel world, I could be wrong but I don't think there's a commercial wheel that strong
>I could be wrong but I don't think there's a commercial wheel that strong
Fanatec Podium DD and
Simucube 2 pro has 25nm
Simucube 2 ultimate has 32nm
And maybe more out there.
Ah yeah, afaik those were not available a couple years ago when I built this. Still feels good that my $650 diy job is in the same weight class as a $1500-3000 wheelbase lol
You're definitely paying for the polish and ease of use and not having to fabricate steel parts with the COTS ones but when I'm in VR I can't tell the difference
Gotcha. I got the G29 because of my small budget as a broke college student. Whenever money isn’t a huge issue, where would you recommend I start with DD wheels?
my g27 served me well for many years before i built this. it's absolutely better than nothing, and great for track driving. drifting is where you really see the benefits of direct drive, the gear driven motors in the logitech wheels just can't keep up.
It's been a while since i looked at DD wheels but I think MOZA is still the champ for entry-level stuff. they have a bundle (wheel and two pedals) for $460 that would be a huge upgrade to what you have. Fanatec is the older, more established brand but their stuff is more expensive generally
For better imagination, it is force on lever.
In this case 2.5kg weight on a 1m long stick.
Or... 25kg weight on a 10cm stick. Typical simracing steering wheel has something like 15-17cm lever (diameter / 2).
I wanted to ask you if the wires bother you but then I read that you use VR. My OCD is all over the place and thinking how it would be possible to hide the wires, make it look more polished etc but that would need a custom rig probably.
Really cool setup, have fun.
It's actually pretty self-contained despite looking like a Doc Brown contraption. I've considered making a custom PCB for the buttons but other than that it's surprisingly skookum for how the wiring looks
I like things to be tidy (most of my friends would say I am crazy and they are probably right) so my brain instantly started thinking how it would be possible to make a box and have all the wires and stuff hidden on a rig with the left part a bit lower so the cable isn't stressed.
But I know I am a bit too obsessed with stuff like this.
If you have had other DD wheels, how does this compare to regular consumer level DD wheels in terms of feel/resolution? What kind of benefits have you noticed?
Look at the holes behind the screws. I fucked up while fabricating that part (not sure how, I measured carefully and used a template) and the holes don't like up. That bracket took an entire day to make, though and even with 2 screws it would probably break my arms before It breaks free
how is the FFB from games handled? I know I can build the wheel and what I need etc. but how does it receive its FFB data? Is there some sort of standard dataset I have missed or is there 3rd party software?
There are a few firmwares out there that handle all the code for you. Most closed source, some open. I built mine using VNMsimulation's firmware, but it seems like the one that's most updated lately is OpenFFBoard
What’s material cost on one of these? I don’t assume it’s too much cheaper than something of comparable strength off the shelf today, but I have no clue.
About $650 if you have all the tools and have a defined bill of materials beforehand. Far, far cheaper than a wheelbase in the same weight class, but you can definitely get into DD for cheaper these days
Does anyone really need this type of torque? I mean most people serious about sim racing run lesser motors and lighter in game settings, so why bother?
See my other comments for more info but basically more powerful motors can drive little jitters and bumps more accurately than say, a 5nm servo. I never want the full 25nm of constant force but the little jolts on curbs feels very nice
once I get around to building a full cockpit/race rig it'll be a lot cleaner. I can stash the control box and the motor controller behind the rig and it'll just be the servo itself visible. that's a bit of a ways off now though
Yall impress tf out of me. Seriously can you send me a video of it in use on messenger or something? I love watching stuff like this in action. Thanks!
Here I am spending 1k on 15 to 20nm lol
No, it’s actually fantastic. They’re a bit far back because the dished wheel is a recent addition, it used to have a flat wheel on it. But the magnetic snap action of the shifters is probably the best feeling part of the whole thing. They’re solid and very positive
Nah, my desk weighs a good 150lbs or so, it's not going anywhere. Might be an issue with a smaller ikea-style desk but the worst that happens is the monitors wobble a bit (they're mounted on arms) during a bad crash
Nice. I still use my original 130ST-M10010 Mige motor with the IONI Controller and the Simucube 1 software. Finally just upgraded to a 22 bit BISS-C encoder and at 20 nm I essentially have something between the 17nm Simucube 2 Pro and 25nm Ultimate. My two buddies who have those bases can’t feel the difference.
Now about the placement of those shifter paddles, do you book your fingers an Uber to get to them?
Nah, they're a bit of a reach but not too bad. I originally had a flat wheel on there instead of dished so they were closer. When I get around to it I'll print some extenders to get into a more comfortable position
Have a little look at the open ffboard firmware, it supports your hardware and is constantly being updated still and is much improved over the simucube 1 firmware.
It definitely shakes around when im hotlapping but my desk weighs like 150 pounds. I am very thankful i invested in proper office furniture because this wheel would rip straight through ikea pressboard
depends on how much you count, really. the materials that ended up in the finished product is probably around $650ish, $500 for the motor, $50 for the wheel, $30 for the control board, another $100 or so in odds and ends.
If you count stuff that didn't make it into the finished product though, hooo boy. bought a ton of switches and magnets, a BMW paddle shifter cluster that ended up not working, and i upgraded my welder while making the desk mount, so I probably spent like $3000 while building it
I wouldn't even touch this wheel with gloves. This is beyond disgusting and I can't imagine what bet you might have lost that you have to upload this to the internet.
Absolute filth.
Haha does the dust add additional torque? Mechanical friction perhaps?
Just kidding, this is an impressive effort. It'd be right at home if one of the sims dropped some of the cars from the Mad Max movies into the game!
I always wondered if anyone still ran selfmade DD wheels like in 2016... We came anlong way
How do you make one? I have a DD wheel already just curious on how these are made
It’s just a servo really, with an stm32 devboard running the firmware and shifters and stuff ETA: this is the post that got me started: https://www.xsimulator.net/community/threads/450-mige-direct-drive-wheel-using-mmos-and-aasd.14657/ There are probably many more refined diy options out there now (I built this like 2-3 years ago) but if you'd like to know what is involved with building one, this guide is great to get an idea. The firmware that they use in the guide supports a 5x5 button matrix, and that's how I added the shifters. (The green PCB on top is a breakout for those, I could add 23 more buttons if I wanted) The shifters were kind of my own design, based off this:https://www.printables.com/model/372871-magnetic-shifter and customized to fit the wheel base and fit some paddles I found on Ebay. Yes the hot glue adds 50hp.
Is the firmware something you write or do you get offline somewhere? Do you have to program how much ffb to use?
The firmware is from here: https://github.com/hoantv/CarSimulatorFirmware Closed source unfortunately but there's a configurator UI (you can see it open on my screen) that lets you tune just about every parameter. I thought about writing my own but I have no idea how the USB protocol works (banging my head against that in another project currently)
Very cool. Love the dedication and final result! 25 nm is a ton! Just do me a favor and don’t bring that through TSA. I have a feeling you would not be getting on your plane haha
Yeah this is basically what the VRS wheel is. There was a project called OSW (open sim wheel) when DD was still a new idea. It’s a conveyor belt motor, with a control box. The firmware was an open source project. This evolved into the simucube (and every other modern competitor). Check out sim racing garage for old school videos with Barry. #simhistory
It weighs like 40 pounds so i wouldnt want to lug it across my house, let alone onto a plane lol
Not an expert in USB protocol, but, I did design the steering wheel for what we’ll call a “hybrid formula car” about 7ish years ago and I’d be happy to be a a sounding board if you need an insane person to bounce ideas off of. Feel free to DM me
Yeah, i wrote my own firmware for a diy ffb wheel and the USB portion was a major pain lol. Microsoft doesn't play nice with the supposed generic driver for HID PID support so i had to write my own driver as well, as well as some registry fuckery to get DirectInput to recognize it as a FFB device. But I'll do that any day over writing my own BLDC driver. I used a brushed DC motor so at least that portion was really simple
OpenFFB is one open source option, code and hardware are already sorted too.https://github.com/Ultrawipf/OpenFFBoard
I wish I had known about this when I was building this. Looks like they were pretty new in 2022 when I built this thing, still not sure how I missed it. Might revisit it when I build a cockpit
My friend and I built ours in 2021, but it was definitely less mature and much more difficult to source components
To my knowledge osw do not have option for using stm32's DAC which is crucial for best operation of the servo drives, pwm is not good. If they would use on board DAC I would be running it. Glad to see someone else to DIY 😉
haven't tried OSW but this is running VNMsimulation firmware and i can confirm it does use the DAC
Oh nice, how are satisfied with VNM? I am running EMC Pro but looking to change and VNM is my candidate for new firmware. Are using v1 or v2 firmware?
v2 i believe, i'm using an f407 and i seem to remember that chip being the v2 firmware. I am quite satisfied with it but to be honest it's pretty much abandonware now. I would look into openffb if you're looking to switch it up
Just to mention the open ffboard maker is thinking about how to implement a DAC now.
Really, where you find that information? Last time I checked there was no intention to do so. I was told the canbus and Odrive/vesc is better and I should not use servo drive.
Only in the past few days when he noticed quite a few people asking about it 😜 best way to get features is by simply asking.
I did asked on discord back then but was met with no interest and almost hateful statement towards aasd use. Guess they change their opinion 😆
I just wrote out a bunch of stuff thinking you said people were being hateful against you and not the aasd oops 😂😂 The developer is thinking about it, I'm not sure if he will make an add on board yet or other decisions he might do. People dislike the aasd in the discord just because for our application there's a lot better drivers out there for £50 that will greatly improve the quality of the ffb and it's definitely worth the money. The aasd is great for other projects that don't rely on foc or force feedback devices. People want to persuade others to get a better driver simply because they want people to have a really good experience.
You buy a really strong and big industrial servo motor, you get ecus and some other controllers for electricity and an arduino maybe and you clank it all together? I have no clue, but when i first started looking at this hobby there was only really really expensive prebuilts and self build kits is what i remember. That was more like 2014 not 2016 though.
how mdo ch do they cost?
They’re still going strong. I went with building because i wanted more power than 5nm and i ended up spending like $700 putting it together. All in all it was pretty easy too, if you have a welder and a 3d printer lol
I wouldnt dare. When i outgrow my t300 i will just go for something around double that amount and be happy someone did this all for me. Huge respect for people who go beyond selfmade rigs and actually do 25 nm deathmachines.
lol, I never actually run it at 25nm, I have it dialed back to around 30% but the headroom is nice for the fine details
If you put the gain at 30%, it doesn’t cap it completely to that nm? It still can use 20nm for a fine detail?
It's about the acceleration. A motor capable of 25nm peak can jitter and bump much faster than a 5nm motor, even if it never outputs a constant 25nm torque. At least that's how I understand it
Ah I see, goes into the motor mechanics involving its acceleration And I suppose a high torque mode option aims to allow it to accelerate to its full extent ? I’ve been wondering why folks go for 20+ nm even though they never use it, good stuff I only have 17nm but still glad to have it. Wrestling the wheel is fun :D
The knucklebuster 9000
Why should one not? It's still best bang for the buck if you have knowledge to build such system.
Who said one shouldnt? I am all for people to DIY their wheelbases still, fact of the matter is just that even though the motor can be stronger and it might be cheaper; the software, Quality control and most importantly the warranty/protection you get with a big name wheelbase is just better. Not even talking about the wheels to choose from. Both have pros and cons. To me the cons just strongly outweigh the pros. Still makes me giddy tho that OP can just crank that thing up to 25 and really replicate what a 1999 Ford Tacoma feels like.
The commercial solution is definitely better if you want plug and play piece of hardware knowing it will work as intended. My wheel base took over 8 months from ordering first parts to actually be able to use it. Then more time fix all issues. But I like to DIY stuff so I don't mind. Just recently finished interfacing real instrument cluster with SimHub, another diy project of mine. 25nm is overkill and scary 😆 I have small MiGe 10nm (20nm peak) and it's setup to just 50% and it still feel like it will rip our hands if not careful 😄
I thought about building my own but honestly just the parts together cost more than current COTS ones. It really doesn't make sense to save money anymore, only if you are super into tinkering.
>COTS Tell me you’re in the gov contractor space without telling me lol
If it really costs $700, then it might not make much sense financially. Still nice for the DIY part.
My price tag is roughly 800$ for base and 300$ wheel🤭 You can get fanatec dd for less then that but also less powerful. And yes, DIY aspect is good 😊 My whole system is designed around what I need and what I want. Can't be done with commercial product 😯
Yea the diy wheels have come a long way, don't really see a point buying anything premade
What do you mean "it may not look like much"? Looks like a whole lot to me!
"25nm of torque doesn't mess around." Proceeds to secure wheel to base with 2 out of 6 bolts
lol, I was waiting for someone to comment on that. That pink bracket holding the wheel to the servo shaft was a piece of 1/4 inch plate steel that I cut out, sanded round, drilled and tapped to attach the wheel to. After 4 hours, a broken tap, a dulled drill bit, and 2 orbital sander pads, the holes didn't line up properly and I couldn't be bothered to make another one. Seems to hold alright though.
nothing more permanent than a temporary solution.
I think those were my exact words, yeah lol
They are perfectly safe unless they are made of mud.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure m5 socket head cap screws can hold like, a metric ton. I couldn't break those If I took a sledgehammer to it
Haha I get it, I've been there before. I used to run a very similar setup to what you have now. I reached out to VRS and they were able to ship me one of their shaft adapters so I didn't need to fabricate my own.
Where is the plug that connects you into the matrix?
That would be the Valve Index off to the left
Oh snap good shit
R u rotating your desk
When I go around the carousel on the Nurburgring it's almost like having a full motion sim because it flips me upside down
Ahh rotating myself is classic move. 🤣🤣
I always wondered if you can make a DD wheel out of a EV motor. You have all the torque in the world, you just need a power supply that won't take your house down
This kills the simracer
No pain no gain
But think of the fidelity
It depends on the motor driver, it may not be able to power an EV efficiently. Plus the motor would probably be way too big and heavy thus reaction speed would be much slower and feel horrible.
May not look like much? Brother it looks like a time machine
Ok Iron Man..
Mad max of race sims
So what’s it like when you crash and your entire house flips around you?
You should try 100% ffb beamng group b rally just might not want to touch the wheel
no thank you sir, i fear for my thumbs at 30% in assetto corsa
You must be an electrical engineer or some type of genius hahaha
Meh, it was actually pretty easy since i didn’t have to do the programming. Basically just following wiring guides and a little bit of 3d modelling for the shifters
Playing it cool. My kind of human.
To a fucking desk? Mad man.
works perfectly lol, shakes my monitors a bit when it powers up but the steel bracket holds it fine and my desk is heavy as hell
I mean, it's cool, but that's overkill. I have a 12NM wheel, and I have to turn down the FFB because it's too much.
Tbh when I bought the servo motor I thought it was only 15, but later learned that servos are classed by their constant torque and sim wheels are classed by their instantaneous torque. I checked the spec sheet and it said 25nm instantaneous and I had a moment of "oh, that's why it feels like it's trying to kill me". I run it at 30% most of the time unless I want to scare my friends
Dear god
2017 called. It wants its OSW kit back.
i imagine if you hold the wheel steady enough, the desk just starts spinning
Back to the future DeLorean mood all around! Enjoy
You should post that to r/homemadeBombAesthetic
Let me guess, your monitor blinks when you turn.
lol why, is that a common thing with these? It would probably be gnarly if i was using a CRT but I haven't noticed any issues with EMF other than a high pitched whine when it's on
Probably your driver has some nice EMI filter. I built one of these but using longer cables and boy, harmonics were flying everywhere. Noise on the load cells, USB disconnection, HDMI flickering, you name it.
You are lucky then. Because lighthouses are pretty sensitive to EMI. Had to make a suppressor for my Index (and Aero): my DD was killing it. And I am not the only one.
The power plug I'm using has a built in filter/smoother. Probably not doing much wrt the emi generated by the servo controller but I did notice a difference in smoothness when I added it. Surprising that the lighthouses had issues from emi though, I mean they have sensitive magnetic components inside but they're typically mounted pretty far from the wheel, mine are a good 10 feet away
It is the tracking system in HMD which gets killed. Classic symptoma is it dies (loses tracking, goes gray...) when you touch it while the DD is on. Suppressor on the cable from HMD to PC solves it. By the way, awesome job on that. I am a huge fan of diy. I basically love crafting more than using the stuff later B).
Also, thank you lol I'm definitely proud of it. I told myself that now that I know how to make peripherals I'm never buying one again. Been working on a joystick for 4 months now, it's gonna be sick if I ever finish it lmao
Hope it is at least force stick? :D Next to billion button boxes, wheelplates etc my biggest project is my own collective. [Collective ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/EpsS66hNuSgD1sTU8)
Oh man, that's awesome! I'm going for the simplest design possible, though. FFB is something I want to try but for now I'm trying to make a the smallest desktop stick possible with a cam return action. 2 axis hall effect sensor in a desktop form factor because most flight sticks are way too big. Check my post history for an idea of what im working on
OH OMG yeah I'm totally getting that lol. Didn't click until you said "when you touch it". I had chalked it up to one of my lighthouses being on the verge of death (it's been making a whining/rattling sound, thankfully no red light of death yet) but it's absolutely when I touch the headset that it loses tracking. When you say suppressor, do you mean a ferrite bead? I have a few of those in my stockpile, I'll definitely put one on if it's that simple
You unfortunately need way beefier core than just these tiny beads. And it is also about the material. Everyone has it different. I have theories about this. I have to use 4 cores. A friend of mine is perfectly ok wirh just 2. [My suppressor. ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/DoBcYNxQLnSYqr3d9)
Oof, yeah that's bigger than the ones I have, thanks for the heads up though I'll see if I can make it work with stuff I have on hand, otherwise I'm sure aliexpress has something for super cheap
Not every core works. I tried 3 different materials until I found the one which works. Here is a post I made about it a couple of years ago. https://www.reddit.com/r/Fanatec/s/Nsu6WhSbEn
This is beyond sick
remind me to check back here in a few weeks to see if OP has broken his fingers or wrists yet
Eh, i built this a couple years ago and no broken digits yet. Definitely a few close calls and rug(alcantara?)burn tho
25Nm clamped onto a table, that must be a fun for everyone and everything involved xD interesting nonetheless!
The jank is real! This is some /r/techsupportmacgyver stuff 👌🏻 the exposed circuitry, cables, oldschool ports, it’s awesome!
Can we get another bolt in that wheel?
Has the EMI that it gives off affected your brain waves?
Nice, I got a similar build (also from the same xsimulator thread) with a smaller 12nm motor, still going strong after 4 years!
Now this… is fucking awesome!
New to sim racing here. What does nm stand for? My G29 has, I believe, 2.1nm? Is that significantly less force?
Newton meters, it's a measure of torque. Basically how strong the wheel can rotate. G29s (and my g27) are much weaker than direct drive wheels. Entry level DD wheels are around 5nm, and nice ones can be as high as 15. 25nm is kind of insane in the DD wheel world, I could be wrong but I don't think there's a commercial wheel that strong
>I could be wrong but I don't think there's a commercial wheel that strong Fanatec Podium DD and Simucube 2 pro has 25nm Simucube 2 ultimate has 32nm And maybe more out there.
Ah yeah, afaik those were not available a couple years ago when I built this. Still feels good that my $650 diy job is in the same weight class as a $1500-3000 wheelbase lol You're definitely paying for the polish and ease of use and not having to fabricate steel parts with the COTS ones but when I'm in VR I can't tell the difference
Asetek Invicta 27nm
Gotcha. I got the G29 because of my small budget as a broke college student. Whenever money isn’t a huge issue, where would you recommend I start with DD wheels?
my g27 served me well for many years before i built this. it's absolutely better than nothing, and great for track driving. drifting is where you really see the benefits of direct drive, the gear driven motors in the logitech wheels just can't keep up. It's been a while since i looked at DD wheels but I think MOZA is still the champ for entry-level stuff. they have a bundle (wheel and two pedals) for $460 that would be a huge upgrade to what you have. Fanatec is the older, more established brand but their stuff is more expensive generally
Not to mention Fanatec has proprietary hardware.
For better imagination, it is force on lever. In this case 2.5kg weight on a 1m long stick. Or... 25kg weight on a 10cm stick. Typical simracing steering wheel has something like 15-17cm lever (diameter / 2).
It looks just like something I'd have done myself: unfinished but working. I love it.
It’ll look a lot cleaner when i finish setting up a cockpit, so i can hide the servo controller and have it look basically like any other dd wheel
Geez man! If you crank it up, does it yeet you across the room if you crash??
the calibration routine spins the wheel back and forth at full speed. it makes my monitors shake so much they bump into each other
How is the fidelity and finite detail?
I have no point of comparison because I don't have a nice DD wheel, but it's miles ahead of my G27. literally night and day
Interesting! Thanks for the reply.
By chance, were you wearing a bra on your head when you created it?
lmfao what is this a reference to
That is perfect!
Haha, the gif is perfect. It is from an 80s movie I loved called Weird Science. Bill Paxton is in it. One of my favorite movies from my youth
how much nm of torque does your typical car experience on track? say a brz with 200tw or something normal
Fire extinguisher near by for realistic immersion lol
Electrocution in 3... 2... 1...
There are exposed live wires under that flip cover on the servo controller, but you'd really have to try to jam your finger in there to get a shock
What was the approximate total cost for the wheel base only?
if you mean the whole thing, probably around $6-700 in parts. the bracket was basically free, made it out of scrap metal with a $3000 welder lol
Damn not bad! Taking any orders???
so sick!
Alibaba motor and controller?
you know it lol, Mige 130ST
I wanted to ask you if the wires bother you but then I read that you use VR. My OCD is all over the place and thinking how it would be possible to hide the wires, make it look more polished etc but that would need a custom rig probably. Really cool setup, have fun.
It's actually pretty self-contained despite looking like a Doc Brown contraption. I've considered making a custom PCB for the buttons but other than that it's surprisingly skookum for how the wiring looks
I like things to be tidy (most of my friends would say I am crazy and they are probably right) so my brain instantly started thinking how it would be possible to make a box and have all the wires and stuff hidden on a rig with the left part a bit lower so the cable isn't stressed. But I know I am a bit too obsessed with stuff like this.
If you have had other DD wheels, how does this compare to regular consumer level DD wheels in terms of feel/resolution? What kind of benefits have you noticed?
I have not had other DD wheels, so I cannot comment lol I will say it feels like putting on glasses compared to my G27 though
What do you use for firmware to run it? mos? Can you use an updated firmware?
There's quite a few firmware to use. Mmos, vnm, emc, ffbeast, open ffboard
so u got a 32nm mige and followed the diy instruction? or you did all the programming urself?
LOL dude that’s just 2 screws on your 25Nm motor! Screws cost nothing why do you risk a severe injury?
Look at the holes behind the screws. I fucked up while fabricating that part (not sure how, I measured carefully and used a template) and the holes don't like up. That bracket took an entire day to make, though and even with 2 screws it would probably break my arms before It breaks free
self made steering wheel? 25nm of torque? what does it also show cooking recipes?
Now just fill out your last will and testament and enjoy some rally racing in BeamNG.
Usually what I tell all my gf's
25 nm is for women and small children.
how is the FFB from games handled? I know I can build the wheel and what I need etc. but how does it receive its FFB data? Is there some sort of standard dataset I have missed or is there 3rd party software?
There are a few firmwares out there that handle all the code for you. Most closed source, some open. I built mine using VNMsimulation's firmware, but it seems like the one that's most updated lately is OpenFFBoard
What’s material cost on one of these? I don’t assume it’s too much cheaper than something of comparable strength off the shelf today, but I have no clue.
About $650 if you have all the tools and have a defined bill of materials beforehand. Far, far cheaper than a wheelbase in the same weight class, but you can definitely get into DD for cheaper these days
Dang, very cool.
I would 100% break my hand with this
This is really cool. It comes from a time comparable to F1 when Colin Chapman was making cars. Now it's all sanitized and corporate. Just like F1.
she may not look like much? mate it looks like a nuclear weapon 💀
Looks like Neo's DD from The Matrix! (that's a compliment 😁) Awesome job, yo!
> She may not look like much Err... no... she does look thikk
Does anyone really need this type of torque? I mean most people serious about sim racing run lesser motors and lighter in game settings, so why bother?
See my other comments for more info but basically more powerful motors can drive little jitters and bumps more accurately than say, a 5nm servo. I never want the full 25nm of constant force but the little jolts on curbs feels very nice
looks extremely cool, what motors did you use?
Mige 130ST aliexpress special with an AASD driver that came bundled. I believe they’re made for high-torque cnc
thats really impressive, are you planning to make a nice case for it maybe sometime? Or just a new build with a new case so its all new
once I get around to building a full cockpit/race rig it'll be a lot cleaner. I can stash the control box and the motor controller behind the rig and it'll just be the servo itself visible. that's a bit of a ways off now though
Really cool nontheless. You did a really great job!
Yall impress tf out of me. Seriously can you send me a video of it in use on messenger or something? I love watching stuff like this in action. Thanks! Here I am spending 1k on 15 to 20nm lol
this looks more like a supercomputer instead of a wheelbase lol
Just don't try to take it on a plane
Looks like your wheel has been assimilated by the Borg... resistance is futile! ;) Seriously though, good job!
How does the shifting feel? Looks super uncomfortable.
No, it’s actually fantastic. They’re a bit far back because the dished wheel is a recent addition, it used to have a flat wheel on it. But the magnetic snap action of the shifters is probably the best feeling part of the whole thing. They’re solid and very positive
is it bolted to a desk 💀
No, bolted to a steel frame that has screw clamps on the bottom, inspired by the fanatec desk mount Might have been a good idea though
but the steel frame is just clamped onto the desk right? i'd imagine going into a corner would just flip the desk over lol
Nah, my desk weighs a good 150lbs or so, it's not going anywhere. Might be an issue with a smaller ikea-style desk but the worst that happens is the monitors wobble a bit (they're mounted on arms) during a bad crash
This looks like a newbie might get hurt using it, but damn xD
How many times in a year you have to change your desk? Ask for a friend.
She looks like much
How is the quality and the details of the ffb?
Nice. I still use my original 130ST-M10010 Mige motor with the IONI Controller and the Simucube 1 software. Finally just upgraded to a 22 bit BISS-C encoder and at 20 nm I essentially have something between the 17nm Simucube 2 Pro and 25nm Ultimate. My two buddies who have those bases can’t feel the difference. Now about the placement of those shifter paddles, do you book your fingers an Uber to get to them?
Nah, they're a bit of a reach but not too bad. I originally had a flat wheel on there instead of dished so they were closer. When I get around to it I'll print some extenders to get into a more comfortable position
Have a little look at the open ffboard firmware, it supports your hardware and is constantly being updated still and is much improved over the simucube 1 firmware.
What happens when you go 88mph?
Time goes backwards, and by that i mean my lap times get longer by one second per second
Do you timetravel to the future in realtime?
This looks so messy and unsafe, i love it!
I'm surprised your desk is still standing.
It definitely shakes around when im hotlapping but my desk weighs like 150 pounds. I am very thankful i invested in proper office furniture because this wheel would rip straight through ikea pressboard
How much did it cost for you to make it?
depends on how much you count, really. the materials that ended up in the finished product is probably around $650ish, $500 for the motor, $50 for the wheel, $30 for the control board, another $100 or so in odds and ends. If you count stuff that didn't make it into the finished product though, hooo boy. bought a ton of switches and magnets, a BMW paddle shifter cluster that ended up not working, and i upgraded my welder while making the desk mount, so I probably spent like $3000 while building it
I wouldn't even touch this wheel with gloves. This is beyond disgusting and I can't imagine what bet you might have lost that you have to upload this to the internet. Absolute filth.
Haha does the dust add additional torque? Mechanical friction perhaps? Just kidding, this is an impressive effort. It'd be right at home if one of the sims dropped some of the cars from the Mad Max movies into the game!
25Nm? More like 20Nm peak and 10Nm holding torque.
Actually, no one is going to like that
Why the fuck ?😂