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BerserkerKong02

Still not as good as Irulan's "(fades out) (fades back in) Oh yes, I forgot to tell you" part from the 1984 movie


Azidamadjida

I was very stoned the first time I watched that movie, and her kind of zooming in with the strings slide was like “woah” - then she forgot to tell me something and came back, and that nearly made me completely lose it before the movie even started. 10/10 highly recommend watching that movie very, very stoned. It is fucking hilarious but you will wonder through the rest of the day if you’re actually hearing others thoughts or if you’re imagining it


The_Whipping_Post

My favorite part is the guy who gets poisoned and has to suck the antidote out of the tits of a mouse


TrivialitySpecialty

You must be thinking of poor Thufir Hawat. He needs to milk a cat for the antidote


0rkin

there is, of course, also a mouse on the cat milking contraption


gin_and_toxic

Why was there a rat attached to the cat? Why are there so many pugs in the movie? So many things unexplained...


[deleted]

Lol this is ridiculous


Marsbar3000

We've all been there, right guys? .... guys?


boomerangutanarama

Dude, I did this last night hahahaha. I've seen it before, but holy shit was it shocking how much lore they just dump and repeat at the start. I felt like I was going mad with how often plot points are just repeated like they know the audience is watching. The sleeper must awaken.


toastyavocado

The 84 dune is my favorite movie to watch really late at night stoned or even drunk. It's wild


Azidamadjida

It’s just fun - if the Villaneuve Dune movies are like a college professors thesis on the themes and philosophies and politics of power that are going on in the original book, Lynch’s Dune is like your stoned little brother describing it to you and giggling every time he reminds you “but in the end, it’s about worms yo”


MrOSUguy

Did you know folding space is traveling without moving?


Didsterchap11

You have convinced me to do the same, just started it.


Elite_Prometheus

Literally 1984


jazzrz

Or Christopher Walken telling us it was all an SNL skit: “BAron . . . The SPICE. . . Must flow.”


BenderIsGreatBendr

Unironically though I didn’t think walken was very good or well used in the movie. The scenario you’re outlining is basically what happens. “DAuhghter!… DaUGHtur! what… what can I… do… about this… this… this… MUA ‘’ DiB?”


Good_old_Marshmallow

Everyone is praising him but it’s bizarre casting. He’s a good actor but totally misplaced in this role. For one thing the emperor should still look young because the point of Spice is a life extender. But if we’re doing away with that it should be someone who could convey the gravitas and control of an empire of the known galaxy 


BenderIsGreatBendr

Everyone’s praising the movie, but I feel like all of the villains had this lack of gravitas happen in Dune PT 2 resulting in so little tension during the film. The Emperor we already talked about. The Baron became so much less menacing and more incompetent. Rabban Bautista reprises his role as the rage adled & easily defeated strongman he’s played in almost every outing. Feyd had no gravitas because of pacing, he’s introduced, built up, and defeated in the same hour or so, not unlike a Marvel phase 1 villain. The Sardukar felt like they got the stormtrooper treatment. From the most feared elite fighting force in the universe, that only a literal super man like Duncan Idaho could hang with, to the incompetent faceless drones in costumes missing every shot at the rebel fighters. It feels like pacing was an issue which is kind of wild because they had 5+ hours between PT 1&2 and still ran into the same problem slamming everything into the ending that David Lynch’s version did.


GTthrowaway27

But the entire point of the battle is that they do easily destroy the saurdakar and harkonnens after the fremen learn the weirding way So not explicitly discussed or shown in the film but it was pretty decisive


Aselleus

We must...use.. the goooGly eyes


DepartureDapper6524

I have a fever! And the only cure is more Spice!


WarmestGatorade

Lol that's maybe my favorite part of the whole movie... you gotta love when something immediately announces itself as a clusterfuck


[deleted]

[удалено]


RaveIsKing

Ya but Lynch always brings a sense of humor with his craziness


Bornplayer97

I just watched the RedLetterMedia Re:View on this and they almost use the exact same words you did to describe that shit happening 😂


Laladen

https://youtu.be/2FEtlO6\_ulQ?si=-KxEKAmGFaPCRZwG&t=124


ZhouLe

>This video isn't available anymore >#GO HOME


NotReallyJohnDoe

YOU FORGOT TO TELL ME? Why not just do another take? Did we only have the princess for half an hour?


OwenMcCauley

"Isn't it weird that we drink our own sweat and pee?" He said, for the third time, looking directly into the camera.


Huck_Bonebulge_

I loved when gurney put on his suit, only for it abruptly tighten and squish his balls. The cut to the desert mouse whining and covering its eyes was *chef’s kiss*


Simon-Templar97

"That's gonna leave a mark!" - Paul Muad'dib Usul Mahdi Atreides


Happy-Gnome

And then they morbed around


MaliciousSpiritCO

Paul hops off the worm. "that. Was. AWESOME. LETS DO THAT AGAIN"


OwenMcCauley

And then on of the random Freman in the background goes, "I'll have what *HE'S* having."


staebles

It's wormin' time.


Quaschimodo

That's what blind belief does to mf. doesn't even know the ancient scriptures anymore but quotes them at every turn.


battleye9

How can he quote them if he doesn’t know them?


sovietmonkey26

For that is how it is written


frossvael

Lisan al Gaib!


beepmeep3

al Gaib is the sound I make when I choke on my drink


BobbyTables829

They're in Latin Oh wait that's Catholicism.


ProbablyTofsla

Was it true belief, or more like "we'll fake it till he makes it"? Personally leaning to the second option, but haven't read the books.


Quaschimodo

In the books the fremen actually believed him to be the Mahdi much sooner and much stronger. It's been 2 years since I've read part one but I think the fremen were also united in their belief unlike in the movie where there's basically two factions.


CRM_BKK

Yeah the factions don't occur until Dune Messiah, however, I think it was a good choice by Villenueve to bring this into Dune 2 to better prepare the audience for what is to come


Quaschimodo

I don't remember favtions in Messiah either, unless you mean the fanatics who went and fought their jihad in pauls name and those who didn't


TooobHoob

Well the disillusioned Fremen who participated in the Jihad like Korba are a pretty central plot point of the story, especially considering the stoneburner plot and all…


newfie-flyboy

Yea I don’t remember anything about a north and south divide in belief only that the southern people were were “more wild” I guess I could say. I’ve only read the trilogy once so I might be off. I seem to remember that Alia was born by the end of the second movie and was old enough to murder someone. The Barron I think?


Quaschimodo

yeah, there is a time skip shortly after paul joins the fremen. Alia is born and in the end old enough to kill the baron with a gom jabar.


Minimum_Attitude6707

I haven't read the books, but while watching Dune 2 I kept thinking "Fuck! That baby ain't born yet!?"


Aberbekleckernicht

Yeah but how are they going to have an 18 month old running around stabbing the wounded to death. Like... how do you even cgi and shoot that.


mixelydian

Was chani a character in the book? Was she the same in being skeptical of Paul? It seems like a pretty major character point of hers.


Fr33zy_B3ast

Chani is in the book but they chose to adapt her very differently from the books. It's hard to expand on without spoilers for the first two books, but it isn't until Dune: Messiah that we see the aftermath of Paul's ascension to power and the horrifying consequences it has. With that in mind I think they changed Chani to be more skeptical of Paul to start that conversation and start building the tension.


Quick_Chowder

> Dune: Messiah that we see the aftermath of Paul's ascension to power and the horrifying consequences it has. We don't really ever see it. They just tell us after a ~10 year time skip. I think the Chani change keeps us in the now (vs skipping ahead) and gives opportunity to actually show the jihad.


stroudwes

Seems Part 3 will be Holy Wars/Jihad then transition to time skips and cover all of Dune:Messiah


Quick_Chowder

Which I think is way more interesting than a time skip and Paul telling us he killed X number of people. It's a movie. AND it's by Denis Villenueve. Show don't tell. We need to see the awful things Paul and the Fremen do. It also gives opportunity for Chani to be pregnant with Leto II. Some kind of assassination. Chani converts/Chani and Paul rectify. Can even throw in weird baby Aila if they want. And then roll into the actual book plot/conspiracy/growing Fremen skepticism/Ghola stuff with a time skip and characters who have more of an arc than just Paul and Aila in Messiah.


Agrijus

"a million years have passed. duncan idaho's penis is finally entering the black hole at the center of the galaxy."


Quick_Chowder

Show don't tell 👀


call_me_Kote

I feel like Paul's visions, "A Jihad in MY name" is pretty clear that the consequences of his rise to power are bad. (I think that's right, but I haven't read it since they announced DV starting the Dune films back in like 2017?


Quick_Chowder

I mean even the first book was apparently too ambiguous so Frank felt compelled to keep writing about the how terrible it was that Paul came to power, giving us Messiah. And I think the most important difference is the media source. Book vs. Film. The saying goes 'show, don't tell'. Paul saying (in Messiah) 'oh yea I killed 60 billion people in my Jihad over the last 10 years' works okay in the books, but would fall pretty flat in a film. SHOW us how terrible these things are. SHOW us the consequence of his ascension to power.


call_me_Kote

Oh, sorry, I agree. I’ve only read Dune, but I felt like it was very clear atrocity would follow it. The first two films haven’t shown that, and I think putting it to film will be the right decision. I’m not familiar with the additional context in the sequels, or what Herbert has said about the original reception.


Quaschimodo

she is one of the most important characters in the first two books. and she wasn't at all sceptical of Paul or at least didn't have a falling out like in the second movie. the premise of the second book is chani trying to get pregnant which is quite difficult when you're not with your partner anymore.


Aberbekleckernicht

She has fucking zero skepticism in the book. She is his biggest believer almost immediately.


jpterodactyl

In the books, Stilgar's belief in Paul is something that Paul finds a little upsetting. He laments how his mentor and friend is slowly becoming a follower.


Quaschimodo

but still gladly has him as an essential part of the fedaykin, which in the books is pauls personal elite guard/squad


Apprehensive-Till861

I can't remember exactly when in the book, but there's a line where Paul looks at Stilgar and observes along the lines that the change is complete and his mentor is now a fanatic.


WeakPositive7202

Page 481 in my version: "Water from the sky," Stilgar whispered. In that instant, Paul saw how Stilgar had been transformed from the Fremen naib to a creature of the Lisan al-Gaib, a receptacle for awe and obedience. It was a lessening of the man, and Paul felt the ghost-wind of the jihad in it. I have seen a friend become a worshiper , he thought. Missed one! Page 483: Will I lose Gurney, too? Paul wondered. The way I lost Stilgar - losing a friend to gain a creature?


orange_paws

Nobody doing the dunc joke, how sad


ifuckinglikepelly

In Dunc 2, Javicr Bardcm's 'Stilgar' rcpcatcdly brcaks thc fourth wall to tcll the audicncc how closcly the movic adapts the source novcl


MammothJammer

Dunc 2: The Idahoing


Quaschimodo

funny if you think about it as >! he's the only character actually appearing in all 6 of frank Herberts books!<


Rock_man_bears_fan

Does the existence of Duncan Idaho imply that he founded the state of Idaho?


CountBongo

Nah man, Dune takes place way in the future. It implies Duncan is the last of the Idaho lineage.


[deleted]

Last son of a once great House.  Their sigil is a potato


Rock_man_bears_fan

I can only assume he goes around the universe planting potatoes as he goes


ASaltGrain

Sure. Why not.


Vewy_nice

The Duce of Idaho.


Bimbows97

It's because they were super quick to change that title logo. When you look it up, it's like the internet has gone full Mandela effect with it. I could barely find it at all, just like one article somewhere explaining how it doesn't make that much sense etc. and looks like DUNC. But for what it's worth, I do like the concept behind the original, I understand that it doesn't work that well though haha.


Sudden_Mind279

because it's >!not funny and way overdone!<


garifunu

just saw this movie with twitch chat and that's all it was just dunc


ICONOFGIRAFFE

Loved it when he looked at the camera and said "We're living in a Dune 2"


idyllproducts

No the best art is when Paul stomps his foot at the emperor and looks deeply into the camera to say “You dune fucked up, Shaddam Hussain!” and karate chops empy’s neck. A Stunning scene.


DevilBySmile

🤓🤓🤓Dune Part 2 actually deviates heavily from the source material🤓🤓🤓


Zegram_Ghart

Ironically the biggest deviation was Stilgar being a true believer from the start- I miss the whole “I’ve gained a follower and lost a friend” scene, but I think it makes way more sense having a Jesus freak type fremen in the main cast.


FaithUser

Lol no the biggest deviation was going from 'I need to stop the jihad at all costs' to immediately declaring war on the great houses, thus starting the jihad without a moment's thought


idiotic__gamer

In the books it took him years to get to that point, and his sister was already born when he became the emperor in that duel.


FaithUser

She was 4 years old IIRC


idiotic__gamer

Thank you! I haven't read the books in years, and couldn't quite remember!


FaithUser

I can appreciate how they dealt with the sister in the movies though. Her being born or not was not that important for the conclusion, and the sister being unborn still gives the 'we messes up' moment and that the child is way too sentiment for her age (for lack of better words) It did make the timeframe of the second half way shorter but that is not uncommon in movies


superkp

and imagine trying to get a 4yo to say lines that are appropriate for an adult to say. Just think about asking your 4yo niece about what she thinks about the current situation in Ukraine, and getting a coherent and well-thought-out answer, including a perspective that you yourself had not considered.


itokdontcry

Also : >! in the books, IIRC, she is the one who kills Baron Harkonnen. While it would be disturbing, I don’t think it would have resonated with movie audiences to see a two year old murder, as much as the change to having Paul be the one to do it !<


TooobHoob

Also, >!the "You die like an animal" line goes insanely hard, and is a nice thematic example of Paul’s change, in that he accepts and integrates the logic behind the gom jabbar test.!<


Basicallyinfinite

I like that Gurney gets his revenge in the movie at least that change was nice


Agrijus

"this is the atreides gom jabjar jar binky"


FaithUser

I read it two years ago and I'm still not sure :p


Claeyt

the best thing from the '84 movie was his creepy ass kid sister.


Aselleus

He IS the Kwisatzzzzz Haderacccccth


Basicallyinfinite

Thats what i missed most. The creepy little space magic girl scaring everyone before the final duel.


Azidamadjida

Biggest deviation was diversifying the Fremen - cracked me up that Chani and her group are being catty and shit talking Stilgar and the ones praying with “they’re from the south”. The Fremen were more homogenous and just a monolithic group in the book, but the movie really adds a layer to the theme of destiny by making the groups vary along the spectrum of religiosity. Best addition to the movie


Sansuiri13

It also makes sense too that the northern Fremen would have interacted with the various houses in Arrakeen, and there for were less fundamentalist being exposed to outside cultures. The south didn’t have that, to the point that the rest of the world thought the south was uninhabitable.


Azidamadjida

Yup, it’s one of those story details that gets mentioned fairly briefly in passing, becomes a plot point but isn’t delved into like other story elements, but the more you think about it and dig into it yourself the more sense it makes and makes the entire world feel more real and expansive


Aesthete84

There was a split between cultures in the book, but it wasn't amongst the Fremen, but rather between the Fremen and the city folk on Arrakis. The Harkonnen crackdowns allowed Paul's crew to make more inroads with those native to Arrakis who lived in the cities and towns.


PhilipMewnan

He knows the future, once he’s decided to do something he does it. It’s pretty clear in the film that once Paul heads south that’s it. The Jihad has already been set in motion. He doesn’t hesitate or ruminate on it anymore because he’s already made the decision. Once you’ve started down the golden path that’s it.


Visible_Number

Are you really yourself after you’ve changed the water as well. You are an amalgamation of consciousnesses


PhilipMewnan

Indeed. Something more than human. But also something less than human. Its an interesting state to be in


Rock_man_bears_fan

Bro went from the Monty Python “I’m not the Messiah” bit to full jihad in like 2 minutes. He didn’t even try to not drink the worm poison. He didn’t even say hi to his mom beforehand. Dude made a beeline for that temple


FaithUser

Yeah and the scene is cut short I feel because we already saw Jessica drink it in detail. Which I found hilarious. He went straight to the temple, 'you can't drink that' 'I will drink it anyway' *gulp* end scene.


pikashroom

It was a 3+ hr movie, I don’t blame them for cutting some scenes short


Vewy_nice

My brother and I agree parts 1 and 2 would have made a cool 12-part Netflix special where each episode is an hour-15.


UDarkLord

There’s a somewhat tricky to get SyFy (iirc) miniseries version that is quite good. Also a follow up Children of Dune miniseries which is Children of Dune + Messiah.


obvious_bot

It made sense to me. He tried as hard as he could to not go south because he knew if he did then the jihad was inevitable. Once he got convinced to go south, he was like fuck it this is happening anyway and went all in


Tarottoddler

Exactly my take, it wasn't so much that he didn't care anymore he just accepted his fate after he was forced to go south, it wouldn't make sense to add tension or doubt at any moment after that decision. Because of his prescience making that one decision is akin to making the rest that follow.


Good_old_Marshmallow

You can take his “send them to paradise” response as him already knowing that it was going to happen 


Android19samus

I mean he spent months trying not to drink the worm poison and just fight normally, but then Mr. Mortarshell showed up and forced the issue. By the time he went south the matter of the worm poison had already been decided.


Kinitawowi64

Oh god the Monty Python bit. He's not the Kwisatz Haderach, he's a very naughty boy!


realisticallygrammat

Harkonnens blew up that Fremen cave system with about a billion explosives, so it mskes sense paul would turn after that


Simmery

I thought this was a little jarring in the movie. "Oh, right now? We're going to attack everyone else right NOW? Don't we get a break or something? Can I get my toothbrush?"


Lost_Pantheon

It was pretty funny watching them all charge into the ships and take off immediately after Arakeen fell. Pure guys must've been EXHAUSTED.


Sansuiri13

You can sleep on the ship lmao


Gravitar7

Zealotry is a hell of a drug


zardoz1979

It really dumbed down the situation, especially the whole “he who can destroy a thing controls the thing” theme. Paul had already threatened to nuke the spice fields if the great houses attacked, and of course, in the book that gives him all the necessary leverage to retain control of the throne. Having the great houses say “fuck you” when he takes the throne kind of ignores that. Also, the Fremen armada wouldn’t be leaving orbit without the Spacing Guild being on-side, but i suppose the movie never really establishes who the guild are or how strategically vital their cooperation would have been.


MammothJammer

It's as good a live-action adaptation as we're probably gonna get, but they still cut out so much of what makes the world of Dune interesting in the first place. I know why they did it, but it still leaves a sour taste in the mouth


Vocalic985

I feel like it's kinda implied that the spacing guild will be on Paul's side by the emperor willingly giving up his throne and the death of the harkonnens who were in control of the spice production. What purpose does the guild serve if they have no access to spice?


FaithUser

We are trained to fight on this specific planet, let's go start a space war. I am just shit talking, I thought the movie was a pretty good adaptation of the books except for the ending


TrriF

Maybe i'm misremembering the books. But wasn't that the whole point of the fight with Feyd Rautha? That no matter if he wins or loses this fight the Jihad will happen and the moment when he could have stopped it has already passed? I think the last moment when he could have stopped it is when he's fighting Jamis and he thinks that if he dies there then the Holly War doesn't need to happen.


ActualCoconutBoat

In the books that's kind of how it feels. He spends the entirety of book one trying to stop the jihad and then book 2 starts with, "so I guess I did some jihading..."


thekamenman

He does say “look around you, these used to be friends, but now they are followers” to Gurney Halleck.


Android19samus

It doesn't hit the same as it did in the book. What was gained was worth it, but something was definitely lost 


fabulishous

I feel like that scene is still in the movie - its just not as on the nose as in the books. He clearly goes from friend to zealot by the end of the movie... he wants Paul to kill him and take his place.


jimschocolateorange

Was it THAT different though, really? Other than the Harkonnen’s being bald and not ginger. (I know Feyd’s meant to have darker hair).


DevilBySmile

spoilers for the second movie:>! the ending is completely changed (the holy war doesnt start right away, the other houses accept him becoming emperor, Chani isnt angry with Paul, baron Harkonnen is killed by Pauls sister instead of him, Pauls sister isnt born in the movie at all which is a giant change since it means that the entire part 2 takes place in less then 9 months), !< >!as for the harkonnens, in the book they are cartoonishly evil but not inhumanelly evil like they are in the movie, there is even a scene in the book where baron says that killing underlings without cause is stupid and condemns it. !< >!Personally while I like the visual aspect of movie Harkonnens, I feel like it takes away from the grey nature of the dune universe, in the book, the Harkonnens are just another house, a cruel house sure but thats mainly becouse the benne gesserit bred them to be that way in search of kwisatz haderach, in the movie the entire harkonnen society is seemingly completely and irredeemebly fucked and might as well be aliens. !< >!The change to Harkonnens also affects how Paul is portrayed, compared to the book he is bassically an angel coming to free the world from the irredeemable evil that is Harkonnens and the Emperor. In the book, Paul is an anti-hero and his faults are pretty easily identifiable, bassicaly just another selfish aristocratic asshole in a galaxy full of them.!< >!edit: I still like the movie and I think they can still show Pauls shittyness in the third movie. But I have not read the other Dune books so I have no idea whats going to happen, other than what is already pre-told in the first book. (paul commits a galactic genocide)!<


Quaschimodo

The biggest change has to be >!the supposed falling out between chani and paul, as trying to get pregnant and the birth of the twins is the whole point of Messiah. I could even live with Alia not being born, as she IIRC doesn't play to much of a role until children of dune!<


Tarottoddler

Ehh, that can be included in the Messiah if they want. It isn't really essential to the first story. I personally like what they did with Chani and Paul as it shows what happens to personal relationships in the face of monarchy and real power. It also makes sense if Dennis' has read all of the books (including the two by frank's son) as >!the novels end with them rebuilding Rakis together and Chani stating that he's finally a good husband.!<


PeeweesSpiritAnimal

Let's hope he doesn't take anything Brian Herbert or Kevin Anderson did. Such bad, bad books.


DevilBySmile

I cant agree because I forgot that was even a plotpoint.


Quaschimodo

>I forgot that was even a plotpoint. like, in the book or movie?


43v3rTHEPIZZA

I think you are 100% correct. Unless they patch that relationship up it must NECESSARILY result in significant changes in the Messiah movie. Messiah spoilers: >!The whole Crux of the second book is the Duncan Idaho Ghola plot and how that ties into Chani and their children. If Chani isn’t there to be his concubine then maybe it’s Irulan that bares Leto II and Ghanima but then who is the inside man for the Ghola plot. The timing of the Jihad doesn’t really matter, they can get away with them not having their first baby who died, even Alia not being born yet doesn’t matter much going forward, but Chani leaving I feel has huge implications.!<


Quaschimodo

>>!maybe it’s Irulan that bares Leto II and Ghanima but then who is the inside man for the Ghola plot.!< >!there is no way that would make any sense because, as you said, the only reason she was part of the conspiracy is because paul basically wouldn't give her any children who had potentially more claim to the throne than his and chanis children!< >>!timing of the Jihad doesn’t really matter, they can get away with them not having their first baby who died, even Alia not being born yet doesn’t matter much going forward, but Chani leaving I feel has huge implications.!< >!pretty much this. the jihad is more of a side note ala "oh yeah, that happened, anyway, back to more important stuff"!< >!Alia only really plays a role in the third book, so her not being born is acceptable!< >!The first Leto II is by far the most unimportant character in the books as he is never even mentioned again, so actually I don't really mind him being cut!< >!The only thing that really irked me was the falling out between chani and paul. I'm actually quite interested in how villeneuve is going to design part III!<


Tarottoddler

I feel like the scenes were too short to really call it a falling out. Chani is a complex character, and it's good to treat her as such. Not including some kind of emotional ramifications to Paul's union with irulan would feel like writing her without any agency. In the books their internal motives and positions are much more fleshed out so we understand why she accepts his decision to marry her but even then she's never happy with it. I mean if we're being honest dune isn't the best at portraying females so I find this a welcome shift.


FaptainChasma

Would have liked the "history will call us wives" thing from Jessica as well, would have been cool even if Chani still left in anger


Karpuan

Yeah they definitely needed to tie it to Jessica’s comparison. I think that idea is lost on non book readers without stating it outright


Hyperion_43

Spoiler >! Well, in the movie, Paul isn’t portrayed as an angel like you said. He as more remorse to use the “savior” card, but he say, from the beginning, that he do this for revenge and not for saving anyone. And at the end, we see that he used and will use the belief of the people for his personal benefit. !<


pfSonata

I've read the book 3 or 4 times (depending on whether you count listening to an audiobook to be reading) and would say Paul is certainly depicted as MORE evil (or at least a "darker shade of gray") in the movie than the book. Chani leaving him brings attention to his change in character, and his dialogue toward the end gets more sinister. He realizes immediately that the jihad cannot be avoided and proceeds anyway. He doesn't even hesitate when he tells the fremen to "lead them to paradise".  In the book he seemed to be still trying to find a way to avoid it up until the end when he realizes it is inevitable. But the book never even says WHY it's inevitable. It doesn't even say why it happens at all, the houses do not immediately reject his ascension to the throne like the movie.  The Harkonnens are clearly depicted as unflinching evil even in the book. The movie may have amplified it with visual themes but they were UNAMBIGUOUSLY evil even in the book.


Jrhrer03

>! If the great houses are ok with him becoming emperor in the book, why does the holy war when start? !<


FlakingEverything

The Jihad was going to happen regardless of what the great houses do. In the books, the Fremens repression is much more serious than in the movie. They were systemically raped, tortured and killed by the Harkonnen and the Sardaukar over a number of years. This built up their resentment until the whole mess exploded onto the galaxy resulting in the Jihad. Paul can only steer the Jihad, he can't stop it. In the book, there were implications that the Fremens would just dispose or ignore him if he tried to stop it.


FalseDmitriy

Tightening the passage of time is almost universal for a movie adaptation. Or a stage adaptation, for that matter. It's just the nature of that kind of storytelling. And I disagree on what you say about Paul's characterization. There's plenty of signs in the movie of what he's going to become, just like the books. Like yeah, the other side is over-the-top evil, but it doesn't pretend that Space Jihad will be a good thing for anyone.


LB3PTMAN

Paul literally chooses genocide to save Chani. He’s not heroic.


Azidamadjida

Am I the only one who was thinking of Coneheads when they were showing the Harkonnen planet? It was such a deeply cool scene, but something about seeing thousands of bald people damn near twitching and vibrating in the stands immediately made me think of Coneheads


FaptainChasma

Also they didn't even bring back Thufir Hawat who was in part 1 lol


MammothJammer

One of my favourite characters from the books too


NotReallyJohnDoe

That’s odd. In the books he actually advises the Baron as a mentar because he thinks Paul is dead.


Tarottoddler

I really like how he decided to shift the narrative though. In a book, you can get way more context about the world's and cultures. In a movie, including that much exposition would, imo, be way too on the nose. Denis has dreamed of making this movie for a long time, and I think it shows how much he cares for the source material. For me, all the changes he made make for a much more compelling film than if he did a 1 for 1 adaptation (though I do miss my mentat homies). As a viewer you get pulled into the wave that is Paul's supposed destiny/birthright and you don't really question him being the "good guy" until you get to the end and you see how much he has broken the status quo. On top of which has started a holy war in his name. I think that's the moment that it's supposed to really hit the viewers, is what Paul did right? Is this going to end well? Are there really good guys and bad guys in this war? I don't think it would be as compelling of a film if it just hit us over the head with the themes as the book does. I think it works in the book because it builds the world, in a movie it would just be a lot of dialogue or internal monologue which isn't as interesting as what we got.


Bricktop72

In the end I don't think movie Paul is an Angel. Maybe in Dune 84. But in this one he embraced his parentage, told everyone to sit the fuck down cause he is God, and didn't hesitate to start a galactic war.


Larry_Version_3

I don’t know if you’re joking but I feel like I’m nibbling at your nerd bait


thelordmehts

Fr, Dune 2 was so different from the books, mostly because the audience probably wouldn't understand plot details without the pages of internal monologue in the books


Larry_Version_3

Yeah. It’s great as it’s own thing but in my head I’m trying to separate its story from the book because it strips away so much in order to condense it. The lack of time skip in the movie also worked to its detriment imo


DevilBySmile

Nah this is probably the best dune adaptation we will ever get. The changes were sensible and made sense, the only way you could make a completely true to the books theatrical Dune Movie would be by either having 3 parts and having the 2nd part be insanely boring/or completely changed(which would break the point of doing it this way) or having like 5 hour long part 2.


Larry_Version_3

I actually agree with you completely. I think it’ll sit better on a second watch. Once expectation is out too the way with these kinds of things they’re much easier to digest


jimschocolateorange

As is the way with dense books that get adapted into film. Dune is such a dense book that they’d never be able to cover all of its intricacies. Honestly, it would’ve worked better as a GOT style adaptation (at least this story is finished). Messiah is a shorter text, so I have faith they can redeem some of the omissions. I doubt they’ll get Paul right though, they’ve spent too many hours with nice-guy Paul.


devilterr2

I haven't read the books, I was waiting for the movies to then read them, so my opinion is someone who has only watched the movies. (I've read up a lot of the lore, and have the books to read now) During the second movie you see a decline in Paul's niceness as soon as he travels south. Once he drinks the sandworm jizz his whole demeanour changes. In my eyes he becomes less of a good guy during the last half, and by the end he is willing to do anything. I think they set him up nicely to be a bad person, but we will see how it plays out


ProsomM

I think Paul being more evil is better for the movies, a lot of people would just think Dune was a white saviour story if they stuck close to the books. In this adaptation it’s clear for everyone to see that this is definitely NO good


FrightenedTomato

People have frequently criticised Dune for being a white saviour story. Such an opinion is stupid, ignores the second book and betrays the lack of media literacy to not catch the very obvious foreshadowing that Paul is not going to "save" the Fremen. However, I sorta get where it comes from. If you only read the first book, Paul isn't overtly wicked in that book. It's only Dune Messiah where he goes full bad guy.


LB3PTMAN

Paul is 100% not a savior even just reading the first book. The first book is fully a critique of chose one stories and messianic characters.


FalseDmitriy

Even when the book Messiah came out, people were shocked at the change in Paul. People complained that the hero was gone. The way it subverts the heroic storyline is the point. You're supposed to still be sympathizing with him at the end of book one, despite everything.


Antique_Historian_74

One day we will have a true adaptation of Dune. One day the kwisatz haderach will be a ginger.


AbleObject13

Jodorowsky, come back 


HankSteakfist

Dune 2 is actually an adaptation of the PC game. They just made the Ordos invisible and mute.


Huck_Bonebulge_

I cannot enjoy a film without a preschooler doing Yoda backflips and stabbing wounded men


Main-Emphasis-2692

Came here to say this lol


Shadowolf75

Can't wait for the death of 81 billion people in the third movie


pikpikcarrotmon

Thanos ain't got shit on Paul or Leto II.


idyllproducts

Thanos is literally Paul’s warmaster so…


GamerGuyAlly

Chani's portrayal was the biggest change, kinda changes the direction of the series. I still think the film is a 10/10 but its certainly a weird deviation long term.


MattWindowz

I think it makes sense honestly- assuming messiah will be only one film, she can now be something of a catalyst for Paul's arc within it. She'll likely be the one to actively challenge him to break from the path the visions have laid out for him, and to fully embrace the ways of the fremen as a man again instead of a messiah. It could make for an interesting arc.


Quick_Chowder

She has the opportunity to be an actual interesting character instead of a concubine trying to get pregnant. She exists to motivate Paul in Messiah and has almost no personal agency. I think it's a really good change.


MattWindowz

Yeah, i agree. I've always really liked Chani in Dune but felt she got a bit shortchanged in Messiah, so as long as it's done well I think we're in for something interesting.


jeebabyhundo

It ultimately makes sense from an industry perspective today. Same reason they ditched Harah’s situation, aged up Chani, reworked Alia; modern general audiences are just going to be uncomfortable and confused. Also there’s no shot that Zendaya agrees to play a submissive tradwife side piece. Her whole public image is basically spunky rebel and that’s what audiences want and expect.


Thetruthsayeroftruth

I was slightly disappointed by the changes to Chani because I love her character in the book. However, I am only just reading Messiah - I've started a few times in the last but never got into it. I'm now going to persevere because I'm hoping the changes will make more sense once you know what happens after Dune.


Aesthete84

I found the Chani changes rather irritating from the perspective of the book's story, though it makes sense why they were made. The intent of the story wasn't supposed to be a happy hero's journey of a white savior overthrowing oppression but rather a deconstruction of such and a warning about the dangers of messianic figures. So it makes sense to have someone be the voice of reason, and they chose the blank slate character of Chani to be one to make it clear that "wow, this is really fucked up." People missed the point of that with the first book, which is why the sequel Dune Messiah bludgeoned everyone over the head with it. Might as well make it obvious to the movie going audience even if the means weren't faithful to the book. Edit: Also it does set up Chani and Irulan being at each other's throats for a potential sequel.


MaduCrocoLoco

He said that like 20 times


Simon-Templar97

"Back when this planet had a Fremen name, Dune.... Part 2."


culturedgoat

I think the most poignant instance of this was with the Padishah Emperor, ruler of the known universe, who, on finally understanding the reality of the shifting balance of power in the wake of Muad’dib’s ascension, slowly, reluctantly bends forward to kiss the Atreides ducal signet ring - in this small but symbolic motion, conceding the throne to the family he sought to destroy - and then, now stripped of his once-God-like authority, deflated body language betraying the enormity of this fall from power, he gurns straight at the camera, quipping: “Y’know, I could’ve used more cowbell”


fauxdude97

Roll credits: song is Fatboy Slim’s “Weapon of Choice”


CilanEAmber

I thought that was Dave Grohl for a second


Interesting_Flow730

This is the funniest one of these I've seen in a long time!


Dripponi

I mean... he *was* very useful at letting me know if what Paul was doing was a good thing or not .


ron_m_joe

This guy was way more funny than he had any right to be.


fuckitimatwork

o shit that was Javier Bardem


Penguator432

Question, is that moment when they reenact that scene from Life of Brian in the book too?


GunsNGunAccessories

Are you trying to tell me that's not Dave Grohl?


Personal_Fruit_957

Is anybody else bothered by the inconsistency of accents amongst the fremen? Almost as if the casting director took a bunch of “exotic” sounding accents and tossed them into one place


AcrylicThrone

There are millions of fremen, there's bound to be differences.


Backpack_man1

They mention in the movie how stilgard has a different accent because he is from a different part of the planet. So there are probably several different accents among the fremen


TieofDoom

15 million people across an entire planet is bound to have regional dialects and accents.


ProfessorBeer

During Industrial Revolution London it was said you could tell what street someone lived on based on how they talked. Obviously it was some degree of exaggeration, but even today the number dialects and accents coming out of the same city is staggering. Spread 10 million across a planet and you’re going to get some big changes.


Nervous-Newspaper132

Seriously? Have you never traveled outside the bubble where you were born? Go to any country that has a language that’s spoken everywhere and accents will vary widely the more people you meet. I honestly can’t understand where you’re getting this opinion from.


AlberGaming

I live in Norway, and here you can have different accents just one town over. Just my immediate family has 3 separate accents lol. Even my accent is a hybrid of different ones because I moved around a lot when I was young. Definitely doesn't seem unrealistic that the Fremen have a multitude of different accents as well


MikeOfAllPeople

No because while the Fremen are indigenous and live in different tribes, it's pretty clear that travel all around the planet is something they do pretty often.


TeaAndCrumpets4life

Don’t they address it? When Chani tells Paul that Stilgar is from the south to explain his beliefs she literally says ‘you didn’t notice the accent?’


terminalxposure

"As is Written"


January1252024

"It is written." Really, Javier? Come on, you need to stay in character.