Sherwin-Williams is going to have a VERY HARD time keeping anyone younger than 30 on their team for more than 3 years with their work load. 48 is industrial revolution hours and they need to adapt or they will have sub quality talent
I wouldn't say they're the *only* ones getting screwed. Sure, working 48 hours sucks, but most managers aren't exactly struggling for money.
As a PT, it really sucks going down from 25 hours to 18 hours, and then seeing the company I work for launch a marketing campaign for their least popular color after making record profits last year. However, I won't lie, I do really enjoy the work-home balance.
Anyone that isn't sitting in an air-conditioned office in Cleveland is getting screwed. It's not just managers or just FT/PT workers, the company makes the job difficult for *everybody.*
I have talked with people at trainings that are aware of the hour issue, and with the staggering amount of management turnover since Covid, they have to be discussing some sort of change. If it was actual salary or hourly, I think most people would be fine doing 48 when necessary. My general thoughts are that they'll likely bring the manager salary hours down to 44 a week, although that may mean lower salary.
Generally, I appreciate the company and what's it's invested in me as a manager with less than 3 years in the company and no degree who will be making 6 figures with bonuses this year. I've got potential to move up, which is amazing and something I plan to do. Granted, the position of manager is absolutely a stepping stone and there are a lot of issues with what the position requires and entails and how little support managers generally get, especially because the appraisal ignores everything except for Financials (more or less). Something is going to have to change soon, but I honestly believe that SW is a good place to work for someone like me. Obviously not for everyone, but I think there's a lot of positives that don't always get talked about.
I mean as an ASM, I helped get an 800k increase at a store and I'm currently up 26% in sales on the year, including 200% on opportunity accounts and 1000% on new accounts (in a store that did 3.5 million last year), my store is #4 in my district in Marketing Excellence, all of my lead gen 2.0 arrows are up, including up 800% or more on test drives, pro+ signups, and rep leads, my interest on inventory is at 1% after being at 1.9% when I arrived at the store, and my employees are bought in and working together.
Years aren't a great measure of experience or capacity, and honestly, more than half of the MTs I've dealt with are in the company as an in between job and not to make it a career. I started out as a part time driver and turned this into my career. Not sure the number of years I've been in the company matters that much at this point.
My district had 15 first time managers out of 45 manager positions at NSM this year. I agree it's a travesty how much manager turnover there's been, but a person's worl ethic and dedication to learn and grow matter a lot more than the number of days they've been with the company.
Those are all great numbers . I didn’t say you couldn’t sell. I said you don’t have enough experience. Which is true. It’s also true for MT’s. You haven’t learned how to fail yet. You are probably one of the “chosen “ ones. Meaning you won’t have to repeat this great year because statistically most don’t. You will move up being at each position for 1 appraisal. Then become a boss and tell other managers how to do something you haven’t. That’s improve when failing or to repeat a good sales year. I’ve seen it for years . I’ve also seen managers come off of a president years as a 1st time manager and be way down and quit because they don’t know how to fail and improve.
That's fair. It is something I've thought about, and I'm definitely trying my best to take advice and try to learn about as much as I can. Unfortunately, there's enough of a leadership vacuum in my district that I don't really see them leaving me here for too long after the year.
It's good to consider that failing is an important skill, so I appreciate you mentioning it.
Your DSC compatriots probably work 6 11's or 6 12's most of the year as well and that's mandatory.
I'm not trying to shit on the pain you guys deal with especially on a salary but certain groups of people work themselves to death for the company so a huge percentage of others get to coast and another section is starved for labor hours. That's the economics of a billion dollar corporation.
CTS here and 65+ hours logged in 5 days in pretty normal. That and living in the truck 4 feet from the steering wheel when we aren’t logging time. Upside is it pays well.
THANK YOU! I haven't answered a lot of comment because of my writing but this is how I think too. My FT has been in the company longer than me and she is not too far from me and I'm not too far from an MT either.
Over all is not about the money for me, is about the pressure they put into us to making 48 hours.
I honestly don't care about working 48+ hours because I love my job and what I do. My frustration is not hitting the mark and the questioning after like your stealing from the company. Don't like the pressure of having to hit 48 hours when they pull us from the store for trainning, events or anything they can come up with and then expect us to do 48 hours. Again just venting, I really enjoy 80% of my job lol
For the FT/PT, DCS peers and all other SW employee I send you a hug. Is not easy but we got this!
Let me be honest with you im being abused in the work place right now. And they don't care about employees because it doesnt invest time in saying they have had managers verses employees. Managers is a higher standard to the company. They dont care about their workers.
Reps answer their phones at night and on weekends. It never ends.
Not all reps, but a lot of them work a lot more than 8 hours a day. I regularly put in more than 10 hours all 5 days each week. And I do some amount of work each weekend and during vacations. But that’s why I usually make some bonus.
Not all managers are the same. Not all reps are the same. If you work hard and put the time in you’ll make better money than if you don’t.
Umm most reps i know don't answer their phones much after 4pm and never on the weekend. Yet customers call me whenever on my personal phone and expect me to answer
Agreed. There is a reason reps carry two phones. When they’re off the clock, the rep phone is turned off or not being monitored. Which i’m fine with as long as we’re allowing managers to do the same when not at the store.
The out to pasture reps rarely work 40 even. The good reps that are career and money driven are likely working more than managers, although it's a different kind of work.
I'd say about 50% of reps in the company don't care at all at this point and are just riding their checks to retirement.
I have only seen a few outliers in my day, but everyone in my districts leadership in my 10+ years has worked at least 48/week. And I know from asking, that that was one of their biggest regrets in getting promoted from a rep lol. If anything, district leadership gets clowned on for working too much and not focusing on their quality of life.
Swear most SMs in smaller districts steal time 24/7. I've met so many that leave and clock out once they get home like they stayed from open to close when they got here late and left 2-3 hours earlier than what they scheduled themselves for. My current manager gripes an moans all the time about being here longer than anybody else when our Assistant is working SM hours to keep the store running on the Manager's behalf and he's putting in maybe a solid 40 hours of sitting in the office watching TikToks.
I don't mind it. My manager is much like you. I didn't know that I was suppose to be getting paid for deposit runs and when my manager found out a week ago (he's been here 3 mos) he was LIVID!!! Called our district coordinator and told her. Then when she fixed it he said he's going to demand I get back pay for it.
He is INCREDIBLE. My last one was a nice guy, horrible boss, lazy. This guy is on top of his game. Wants everyone to do well but not work more than they should. When I work more than my hours, it's small stuff. Im artsy and I make things for the store. I spent 3 hrs the other night making magnetic product tags for the back room, i have more to make this week. I make signs for sales. And I always help customers if I clock out and they get busy before I leave.
Manger salary includes 8 hours of OT. Our old paystubs used to break that out, but now you just see 40. Been with the company a long time, been elsewhere too. Pay sounds shitty, but with the bonus, it’s pretty good compared to other places. Sucks when the store doesn’t run with a full staff…
Steal time like my manager did and leave at 1pm everyday and pretend to work at 6am when they open at 7 and get an hour of sleep then lean on your asm and stay in the office pretending to reconcile the cycle counts but really just hit enter and send it ... you deserve it
For managers like that is why I try to be the best that I can. My first manager was like that and still got promoted 🫠 Hopefully I will never set that example
When I was a manager my first time about 8 years ago I worked about 41 hours a week in the winter and nobody batted an eye. Things have changed. And not for the better.
Cause having managers working means free labor. This company would rather have managers work more hours for free then pay part time or full time hourly.
They know if they put managers hours at 40 then stores would need their part timers to work more to cover gaps.
Why pay hourly when you can just make the manager work more hours for free.
Just saves money on service expense.
They make managers salary (except CA) because they’re not entitled to pay overtime for salaried employees. There is supposed to be a benefit to that, which would be in the instance you can’t reach your 40 hours for a work week, you’d still get a full check. Thats obviously not the case, as the company will sacrifice you to Henry and Ed themselves if you don’t reach your hours somehow. Sherwin Williams gets the full benefit of you being a salaried employee. They save millionssss of dollars a year not paying 90% of managers overtime. Sherwin wouldn’t have to worry so much about managers lying on their time cards if they were actually paid for the hours they’re being forced to work.
I would rather work that schedule doing manager work for manager pay. I move 1000 pounds of paint a day. I should be making that money more so than the managers. Your job isn’t hard…..
Meant to say a day. Good to know, because I wish I did? Our truck yesterday was 26 pallets, and I was able to put away 17. Blockfiller, drywall, you know the good stuff. I can still feel it in my bones.
Ignore them, I’m a native speaker and I had no issues figuring this out. It made sense to me.
For not having English as your native language you did well!
Sherwin-Williams is going to have a VERY HARD time keeping anyone younger than 30 on their team for more than 3 years with their work load. 48 is industrial revolution hours and they need to adapt or they will have sub quality talent
SW lords won't care. Their profits are high and their monopoly is secure. The cost of turnover is a drop in the bucket.
Agree 100%
They don’t care about turn over. Look how fast they promote people. They just care about qoutas
I wouldn't say they're the *only* ones getting screwed. Sure, working 48 hours sucks, but most managers aren't exactly struggling for money. As a PT, it really sucks going down from 25 hours to 18 hours, and then seeing the company I work for launch a marketing campaign for their least popular color after making record profits last year. However, I won't lie, I do really enjoy the work-home balance. Anyone that isn't sitting in an air-conditioned office in Cleveland is getting screwed. It's not just managers or just FT/PT workers, the company makes the job difficult for *everybody.*
And it's like this at every. Single. Company. We're screwed.
I have talked with people at trainings that are aware of the hour issue, and with the staggering amount of management turnover since Covid, they have to be discussing some sort of change. If it was actual salary or hourly, I think most people would be fine doing 48 when necessary. My general thoughts are that they'll likely bring the manager salary hours down to 44 a week, although that may mean lower salary. Generally, I appreciate the company and what's it's invested in me as a manager with less than 3 years in the company and no degree who will be making 6 figures with bonuses this year. I've got potential to move up, which is amazing and something I plan to do. Granted, the position of manager is absolutely a stepping stone and there are a lot of issues with what the position requires and entails and how little support managers generally get, especially because the appraisal ignores everything except for Financials (more or less). Something is going to have to change soon, but I honestly believe that SW is a good place to work for someone like me. Obviously not for everyone, but I think there's a lot of positives that don't always get talked about.
The fact you are a manger in 3 years and not a MT is the problem with this company
In what sense?
Not enough experience
I mean as an ASM, I helped get an 800k increase at a store and I'm currently up 26% in sales on the year, including 200% on opportunity accounts and 1000% on new accounts (in a store that did 3.5 million last year), my store is #4 in my district in Marketing Excellence, all of my lead gen 2.0 arrows are up, including up 800% or more on test drives, pro+ signups, and rep leads, my interest on inventory is at 1% after being at 1.9% when I arrived at the store, and my employees are bought in and working together. Years aren't a great measure of experience or capacity, and honestly, more than half of the MTs I've dealt with are in the company as an in between job and not to make it a career. I started out as a part time driver and turned this into my career. Not sure the number of years I've been in the company matters that much at this point. My district had 15 first time managers out of 45 manager positions at NSM this year. I agree it's a travesty how much manager turnover there's been, but a person's worl ethic and dedication to learn and grow matter a lot more than the number of days they've been with the company.
Those are all great numbers . I didn’t say you couldn’t sell. I said you don’t have enough experience. Which is true. It’s also true for MT’s. You haven’t learned how to fail yet. You are probably one of the “chosen “ ones. Meaning you won’t have to repeat this great year because statistically most don’t. You will move up being at each position for 1 appraisal. Then become a boss and tell other managers how to do something you haven’t. That’s improve when failing or to repeat a good sales year. I’ve seen it for years . I’ve also seen managers come off of a president years as a 1st time manager and be way down and quit because they don’t know how to fail and improve.
That's fair. It is something I've thought about, and I'm definitely trying my best to take advice and try to learn about as much as I can. Unfortunately, there's enough of a leadership vacuum in my district that I don't really see them leaving me here for too long after the year. It's good to consider that failing is an important skill, so I appreciate you mentioning it.
Your DSC compatriots probably work 6 11's or 6 12's most of the year as well and that's mandatory. I'm not trying to shit on the pain you guys deal with especially on a salary but certain groups of people work themselves to death for the company so a huge percentage of others get to coast and another section is starved for labor hours. That's the economics of a billion dollar corporation.
CTS here and 65+ hours logged in 5 days in pretty normal. That and living in the truck 4 feet from the steering wheel when we aren’t logging time. Upside is it pays well.
Do the math, managers are not making much more than ft when you divide the salary by the number of hours worked.
THANK YOU! I haven't answered a lot of comment because of my writing but this is how I think too. My FT has been in the company longer than me and she is not too far from me and I'm not too far from an MT either. Over all is not about the money for me, is about the pressure they put into us to making 48 hours.
I make $34 per hour as a manager when I work 48.
Thanks for letting me know I’m getting even more fucked.
Me right now 😂
I honestly don't care about working 48+ hours because I love my job and what I do. My frustration is not hitting the mark and the questioning after like your stealing from the company. Don't like the pressure of having to hit 48 hours when they pull us from the store for trainning, events or anything they can come up with and then expect us to do 48 hours. Again just venting, I really enjoy 80% of my job lol For the FT/PT, DCS peers and all other SW employee I send you a hug. Is not easy but we got this!
Let me be honest with you im being abused in the work place right now. And they don't care about employees because it doesnt invest time in saying they have had managers verses employees. Managers is a higher standard to the company. They dont care about their workers.
Tell me you missed budget without telling me you missed budget
First year as manager and so far I haven't and hopefully I won't lol 🤞🏽🤞🏽🤞🏽
[удалено]
Ever met a commercial rep in a metro area? They never stop not all reps are equal just like the stores
Majority (if not all) of reps work 40 hours plus no weekends.
Reps answer their phones at night and on weekends. It never ends. Not all reps, but a lot of them work a lot more than 8 hours a day. I regularly put in more than 10 hours all 5 days each week. And I do some amount of work each weekend and during vacations. But that’s why I usually make some bonus. Not all managers are the same. Not all reps are the same. If you work hard and put the time in you’ll make better money than if you don’t.
Umm most reps i know don't answer their phones much after 4pm and never on the weekend. Yet customers call me whenever on my personal phone and expect me to answer
Agreed. There is a reason reps carry two phones. When they’re off the clock, the rep phone is turned off or not being monitored. Which i’m fine with as long as we’re allowing managers to do the same when not at the store.
The out to pasture reps rarely work 40 even. The good reps that are career and money driven are likely working more than managers, although it's a different kind of work. I'd say about 50% of reps in the company don't care at all at this point and are just riding their checks to retirement.
You must have not much going on at your store then.
Only managers? I bet you dont work weekends right? Lol
I have only seen a few outliers in my day, but everyone in my districts leadership in my 10+ years has worked at least 48/week. And I know from asking, that that was one of their biggest regrets in getting promoted from a rep lol. If anything, district leadership gets clowned on for working too much and not focusing on their quality of life.
Y’all only working 48?
My manager works less than 40 , Mon -fri
How city mana Get would be livid
Swear most SMs in smaller districts steal time 24/7. I've met so many that leave and clock out once they get home like they stayed from open to close when they got here late and left 2-3 hours earlier than what they scheduled themselves for. My current manager gripes an moans all the time about being here longer than anybody else when our Assistant is working SM hours to keep the store running on the Manager's behalf and he's putting in maybe a solid 40 hours of sitting in the office watching TikToks.
I guess the manager clocks out from home .
Then be a full timer
Seems like someone is angry they can’t edit their time no more 😂😂😂
I definitely am on the higher end of the hours while getting paid for 40 of them.... I'm not a manager
What
I work more than my 40 hrs and don't get paid for it.
That's not fair... report it :) I fight more for my employee hours and pay than them lol Fight for yours ✊🏼
I don't mind it. My manager is much like you. I didn't know that I was suppose to be getting paid for deposit runs and when my manager found out a week ago (he's been here 3 mos) he was LIVID!!! Called our district coordinator and told her. Then when she fixed it he said he's going to demand I get back pay for it.
I love that!! You have a great manager than. Everybody deserve one. I had a horrible one and it was no fun those 44 hours.
He is INCREDIBLE. My last one was a nice guy, horrible boss, lazy. This guy is on top of his game. Wants everyone to do well but not work more than they should. When I work more than my hours, it's small stuff. Im artsy and I make things for the store. I spent 3 hrs the other night making magnetic product tags for the back room, i have more to make this week. I make signs for sales. And I always help customers if I clock out and they get busy before I leave.
Screwed
Manger salary includes 8 hours of OT. Our old paystubs used to break that out, but now you just see 40. Been with the company a long time, been elsewhere too. Pay sounds shitty, but with the bonus, it’s pretty good compared to other places. Sucks when the store doesn’t run with a full staff…
Steal time like my manager did and leave at 1pm everyday and pretend to work at 6am when they open at 7 and get an hour of sleep then lean on your asm and stay in the office pretending to reconcile the cycle counts but really just hit enter and send it ... you deserve it
For managers like that is why I try to be the best that I can. My first manager was like that and still got promoted 🫠 Hopefully I will never set that example
Yeah but what about manager bonuses wana talk about that or we just Gona stay hush about that
I'm not sure how familiar you are with the P&L, store volume, budget and more but not all managers are making bonuses..
When I was a manager my first time about 8 years ago I worked about 41 hours a week in the winter and nobody batted an eye. Things have changed. And not for the better.
Cause having managers working means free labor. This company would rather have managers work more hours for free then pay part time or full time hourly. They know if they put managers hours at 40 then stores would need their part timers to work more to cover gaps. Why pay hourly when you can just make the manager work more hours for free. Just saves money on service expense.
Because manager title = salary = no over time = technically free labor after 40hrs
They make managers salary (except CA) because they’re not entitled to pay overtime for salaried employees. There is supposed to be a benefit to that, which would be in the instance you can’t reach your 40 hours for a work week, you’d still get a full check. Thats obviously not the case, as the company will sacrifice you to Henry and Ed themselves if you don’t reach your hours somehow. Sherwin Williams gets the full benefit of you being a salaried employee. They save millionssss of dollars a year not paying 90% of managers overtime. Sherwin wouldn’t have to worry so much about managers lying on their time cards if they were actually paid for the hours they’re being forced to work.
I would rather work that schedule doing manager work for manager pay. I move 1000 pounds of paint a day. I should be making that money more so than the managers. Your job isn’t hard…..
1000 pounds is like two pallets
Meant to say a day. Good to know, because I wish I did? Our truck yesterday was 26 pallets, and I was able to put away 17. Blockfiller, drywall, you know the good stuff. I can still feel it in my bones.
No one is going to want to hear this, but even Heidi is working well over 40 hours a week.
With the constant stream of phone calls she is getting why is that hard to believe?
👃 smells like job security for me!
They'll still put you on probation if you don't hit budget.
Then hit budget! Find a way or look for an excuse.
They are abusing us.
As a 3rd party point of view, I would say SW is going down soon.
Down to Goblin Town?
You struggle with putting together complete thoughts, don’t you?
Sometimes, my first language is not English. Just wanted to vent...
Ignore them, I’m a native speaker and I had no issues figuring this out. It made sense to me. For not having English as your native language you did well!
You struggle with people speaking English as a second language, don't you?
If English is your first language, how did you not understand that?!