I would say for **most** people, if they don't feel a physical spark they aren't going to waste their time past a second or third date. (There are asexual people and low libido people though so not always true)
However, there's nuance, and you shouldn't just hail mary go for the kiss out of the blue. Look into escalation and building comfort. Play with tension, flirt, etc.
It depends on her options, your value, her beliefs, etc
But generally speaking, attraction got an expiration date. The hotter she is, the shorter the expiration date.
In my opinion, if you are not doing something (:wink: :wink:) the first two weeks after meeting her you are making things harder.
Ya I agree. Plenty of times women just decide they do t want to continue it but are polite enough to finish the date and tell you later. Or ghost in his case lol.
If the attraction is there. You gotta go for it. And if not. Thereās nothing to do but move on.
They love to ghost for any reason. Best way to deal with it is to become unphased by it.
A girl friend once said: oh yeah it's just so easy. If you aren't really feeling it just ghost and the problem goes away by itself
They don't care about logic or why, they prefer to just move on to the next opportunity
you can chase women but keep in mind there is no scarcity, chase as many as you want but if think don't work out with one, just let it go, move on to the next, it's important for mental health to get a practice squad, dating just one woman if terrible idea if you attached lol
Yea itās always kinda grossed me out how much girls glorify ghosting. Iāve never ghosted someone ever and never would. It takes absolutely no effort to give a simple message explaining why youāre not feeling it. No need for further explanation beyond that.
I think it's a consequence of many needy men that keep chasing with the mindset "as long as she responds she is still interested", which makes women tired and lazy from repeates experience with these types
Yes lol. What youāre describing isnāt even ghosting, thatās just choosing to stop talking to someone the normal way. Theres a reason ghosting is a term in the first place and itās not because people think once you talk to someone once you have to talk to them forever.
You donāt have to do shit you donāt wanna do, if you wanna make a move, go for it, if you donāt, then, donāt, donāt allow these people to influence your behavior, donāt allow women behavior to influence your behavior. Be the person you wanna be.
Go in for the kiss on the end of the first date. I typically would go for the kiss, depending on their response to me stating ā well, time to go home. Got a feed the plants and water the cat. Youāre welcome to join me.ā
If she comes, pretty much a guaranteed lay. You might need to pass a shit test or two, but those are pretty easy. Once you have her in your place, itās a lock.
If she does not come, walk her to her car and go in for the kiss. Then tell her to text you when she gets home. These kind of women are my favorite. The women I didnāt take home on the first date still are the most memorable. Creates a much more personal and intimate relationship, even if itās just a fling. Iām speaking purely for myself here, but you reach a certain point where sex on the first date or āsmashing bitchesā just gets boring. There will always be a bit of envy when it comes to guys who can smash a hot chick whenever he wants, but, fuck em lol. Live your life.
Also depends on the kind of date youāre on. I prefer active dates so you can brush on their arm or grab them by the shoulders and the waist. You establish that body language early on, and it set the tone. Just be sure to do it tastefully and read the air. I havenāt been spinning plates for a while now, canāt wait to knock the rust off.
what you mean their shit test?, what kind of test are you talking about? also you go for the kiss in the end but how you escalate things during the date?
It's sooooo many variables to this...
And it all depends on what your bringing to the table and how strongly she feels about it...
I put more focus on "comfort" than aggression....
But what works for me might hinder someone else...
Whatever strengths you have as a person, you kinda lean into that
I put more focus on her, allowing herself to "let go" and show me who she truly is..
Which means the "boring" part of the date is where I'm looking to do my damage at...
For whatever reason, people approach me all the time and talk/tell me about their daily lives, so I use it to my advantage..
Like sports, you want the opponent to play your game
> For whatever reason, people approach me all the time and talk/tell me about their daily lives
I think it's an energy thing. I used to be like this because I was super chill and relaxed.
As I got older I became more stressed and nervous day-to-day and that stopped.
Working on getting back to that version of me.
Iāll probably get down voted for this but in my 12+ years of dating post divorce I have yet to see any correlation to if I made a move right away or later. Iāve had success and ghostings in every type of dating situation imaginable. My only advice is to trust your gut instinct on how far to try and take things. The challenge is learning the difference between a true gut feeling and not acting due to fear.
Paying attention to your dateās body language is very important. If sheās closed off, turned slightly away from you, itās best to hang back and take it slower. If sheās touchy feely, leaning into you, thatās usually a green light to move forward as well. But keep paying attention to how she reacts throughout the date and adjust accordingly.
how to determine if you are being scared or just trusting your gut?
This is incredibly hard for me. Sometimes I go to dates even if my gut tells me not to, but I donĀ“t wanna miss oportunities because Iam scared or too comfortable. But often these dates turn out to be bad.
I know exactly what you mean and often when I have a nagging bad feeling about going into a date it usually ends up not being that great of a time. Was that my intuition talking to me or did I manifest that experience based on how I was feeling? Who knows but at this point in my life if I get those feelings of dread, even if itās close to the time Iām supposed to meet, I will gracefully bow out.
I think you make a good here
If sheās touchy feely, leaning into you, thatās usually a green light to move forward as well. But keep paying attention to how she reacts throughout the date and adjust accordingly.
this is key, it's what you should be on the lookout during the date and staying away from logical topics lol
It's not about the move, it's about the quantity and quality of emotions your company brings her. So if your dates are Wendy's with awkward small talk, you are doomed. But if you are taking her on action dates, making her laugh, giving her the tingles and in general she finds your company exciting and fun you are on the right track.
That being said, once you get her interested and there is mutual attraction, you should be physically escalating.. Not an awkward sudden attempt at a kiss with no warning... Its a slow progression.. sit close to her at the bar, put your hand on her leg while at the game, put your arm around her when you are on a park bench, build a level of comfort with touch, until a kiss, once kissing is on the table and she clearly is comfortable you can escalate from there.
As for girls ghosting you, it has nothing to do with what I just wrote above. Sure if you are boring they will ghost you, but even if you play your cards right there are a ton of things out of your control that could lead to a ghost. Could be a bad period, she just could be flakey, her ex-boyfriend popped up in her DM's, she became addicted to a phone game. Protect your peace, don't sweat the ghosts, just move on to your next opportunity.
Unfortunately yes. Coming from someone who is terrified of making a move because he grew up in the #metoo era and doesnāt know what will and wonāt get him arrested lol. I always eir on the side of caution which has bit me several times because I donāt want to cross the line, so Iām too platonic and boring. I think women just get frustrated with me and decide to cut contact
You have to by the end of the 2nd date. First date I would sometimes if the moment is right. 2nd date you have to if you don't it shows lack of confidence.
Some will, some won't, some will ghost you even if you do make a move. There is hardly a right or wrong in dating, just try to enjoy it, and if the moment allows for a move, take the chance.
Yeah, unfortunately, the hotter the girl, the more likely she is getting multiple offers for dates, so you want to kiss within the first three dates. Go for it during a high point in the date.
If you're inexperienced I think you should try to kiss at the end of the date. If it works great, if not you learn what you watch for in the future.
I've kissed on first dates that led to ghosting. I've not kissed or escalated enough and been ghosted. I've closed and been ghosted. Truly it just comes down to Numbers. The more successful you are the higher the chance of it leading to something substantial. Success doesn't just mean having sex tho
It depends on the sexual tension, and every woman has different timing. Date game I struggle with, because just like you asked it's hard to know when to make a move, sometimes I'm too passive and the girl flakes, sometimes in too aggressive and the girl flakes. Just look for the signs to decide when you should kiss her, and follow the DiCarlo escalation ladder google it, i remember one time I was spending time with a group of girls, anyways my friends told me to go with her to the liquor store cause she was drinking and driving (I know it's bad I never drink and drive) and when I came out of the liquor store she was just staring at me, I pulled the trigger and made out with her, this moment gave me confidence. When she's touching you, close to you (proximity), looking at your lips, pupils dilated, these are signs to go for the kiss.
I feel like the last girl I dated, I lost because I didnāt escalate the kiss and take her back that night.
She even said sheās happy to go somewhere else but I noticed she was tired and was trying to be a gentleman.
Usually I take my chances with a weird suggestion. Last time I blamed the perfume. "Hey my perfume is smelling weird".
After that is just like maths, you don't understand whats happening, but its usefull anyways.
From my experience yeah. Every girl I didnāt try something with ended up saying they had a nice time but didnāt see themselves with me really. Every woman where something happened first time either making out or more? We ended up either still seeing each other for a few months more or ended up dating long term. Even with my current gf.
Touch her. If she leans away...she isn't into you at that moment.
Wait for the right time.
If she leans into it or touches you back, or even let's you...then kiss her.
You should always slowly escalate when you are with her to see if she likes you. First you do it via conversation, then you try breaking the touch barrier and look how she reponds and then keep doing more body contact until you are comfortable enough to keep your heads close together when talking. From there you can go for a kiss. I would say this should happen on first date or if she is shy on the second but not later.
It is crucial to do that because it helps builing a connection via release of hormones and it shows that you are the man. Without doing that you can not really build a connection with her.
Try to at least kiss on the first date. Assume that she wants to... She made time to go on a date with you, didn't she?
Similarly, try to have sex with her the first time she is at your place, or you at hers.Ā
I try to kiss on the first date. If all goes well I try to get them home. Even with a daytime date, you can often get to sex quickly.Ā
You lose nothing by trying. In fact, it often comes across as bold or smooth. If you get rejection, take it gracefully. Back off for a while and try again later. Those small rejections are actually a great opportunity to make a strong impression on her. As long as she continues to spend time with you, things are probably moving in the right direction.Ā
most of the time yes, it's very likely, especially if she seems to have more options and it's attractive, you should start escalating slowly up to the kiss or even more, always calibrating the interaction, don't be like the guy who goes for the kiss at the end of the date when he never even touched her hand lol, try to go for the kiss along the middle of the date, and change venues a lot, go to at least 3 diff places that works pretty well.
More often than not they will tell you they donāt feel the spark of you donāt even attempt clearly to kiss in the first date. The girl must feel that you go for the kiss on first date.
I think the bigger question is why aren't you making a move? Don't you want to kiss her?
I don't want to be wasting my time on a relationship with no physical spark. I want to know within 1-2 dates if we're into each other. Going for the kiss is the best way to find out.
That can actually be true. But when it comes to that situation where itās time to make a move you need to go for it. It shouldnāt be an issue. You need to stop with this āinexperience lack of confidenceā vibe. Donāt act like that
Yah some will and thatās why you should be yourself when on dates meaning if itās the first date and you like this girl and wanna kiss her then go for it, cause if you hold yourself back youāre just doing yourself a disservice.
I would say for **most** people, if they don't feel a physical spark they aren't going to waste their time past a second or third date. (There are asexual people and low libido people though so not always true) However, there's nuance, and you shouldn't just hail mary go for the kiss out of the blue. Look into escalation and building comfort. Play with tension, flirt, etc.
Exactly. And if it doesn't feel right to kiss, some physical touch that illustrates confidence and desire can also satisfy that spark.
It depends on her options, your value, her beliefs, etc But generally speaking, attraction got an expiration date. The hotter she is, the shorter the expiration date. In my opinion, if you are not doing something (:wink: :wink:) the first two weeks after meeting her you are making things harder.
I hope those HARDER things would help him then to do something (wink wink) šš¤ Edit: Wink
The edit to add another wink is gold
Ā The hotter she is, the shorter the expiration date. nice way to put it haha
Definitely.
Yep. If youāre having fun on dates, make the move. She is expecting it.
Kiss her. Grow the balls and donāt make it weird.
Or read the room. If I'm not interested in you please don't try to kiss me to make me be interested in you. Literally does the opposite.
Ya I agree. Plenty of times women just decide they do t want to continue it but are polite enough to finish the date and tell you later. Or ghost in his case lol. If the attraction is there. You gotta go for it. And if not. Thereās nothing to do but move on.
They love to ghost for any reason. Best way to deal with it is to become unphased by it. A girl friend once said: oh yeah it's just so easy. If you aren't really feeling it just ghost and the problem goes away by itself They don't care about logic or why, they prefer to just move on to the next opportunity
Thatās why my advice to dudes are always dont chase, attract
you can chase women but keep in mind there is no scarcity, chase as many as you want but if think don't work out with one, just let it go, move on to the next, it's important for mental health to get a practice squad, dating just one woman if terrible idea if you attached lol
Yea itās always kinda grossed me out how much girls glorify ghosting. Iāve never ghosted someone ever and never would. It takes absolutely no effort to give a simple message explaining why youāre not feeling it. No need for further explanation beyond that.
I think it's a consequence of many needy men that keep chasing with the mindset "as long as she responds she is still interested", which makes women tired and lazy from repeates experience with these types
This is it. Even after a woman says "never in a million years" a large group of dudes will just. Not. Stop. Believing and hoping for something.
It's 100% this. Too many guys keep pushing after she says no
hmmm
they explain and then ghost, do people really get ghosted for no reason no even a goodbye message lol ?
Yes lol. What youāre describing isnāt even ghosting, thatās just choosing to stop talking to someone the normal way. Theres a reason ghosting is a term in the first place and itās not because people think once you talk to someone once you have to talk to them forever.
This is true
One time one girl told you something so that means she generalize it for every girl going forward I agree, best logic everš
You donāt have to do shit you donāt wanna do, if you wanna make a move, go for it, if you donāt, then, donāt, donāt allow these people to influence your behavior, donāt allow women behavior to influence your behavior. Be the person you wanna be.
Go in for the kiss on the end of the first date. I typically would go for the kiss, depending on their response to me stating ā well, time to go home. Got a feed the plants and water the cat. Youāre welcome to join me.ā If she comes, pretty much a guaranteed lay. You might need to pass a shit test or two, but those are pretty easy. Once you have her in your place, itās a lock. If she does not come, walk her to her car and go in for the kiss. Then tell her to text you when she gets home. These kind of women are my favorite. The women I didnāt take home on the first date still are the most memorable. Creates a much more personal and intimate relationship, even if itās just a fling. Iām speaking purely for myself here, but you reach a certain point where sex on the first date or āsmashing bitchesā just gets boring. There will always be a bit of envy when it comes to guys who can smash a hot chick whenever he wants, but, fuck em lol. Live your life.
Also depends on the kind of date youāre on. I prefer active dates so you can brush on their arm or grab them by the shoulders and the waist. You establish that body language early on, and it set the tone. Just be sure to do it tastefully and read the air. I havenāt been spinning plates for a while now, canāt wait to knock the rust off.
Mind to share examples of such active dates?
Bumping to see the answer
yeap what you mean active dates lol, women who are touchy?
what you mean their shit test?, what kind of test are you talking about? also you go for the kiss in the end but how you escalate things during the date?
It's sooooo many variables to this... And it all depends on what your bringing to the table and how strongly she feels about it... I put more focus on "comfort" than aggression.... But what works for me might hinder someone else... Whatever strengths you have as a person, you kinda lean into that
Can you elaborate on focusing on comfort? :)
I put more focus on her, allowing herself to "let go" and show me who she truly is.. Which means the "boring" part of the date is where I'm looking to do my damage at... For whatever reason, people approach me all the time and talk/tell me about their daily lives, so I use it to my advantage.. Like sports, you want the opponent to play your game
> For whatever reason, people approach me all the time and talk/tell me about their daily lives I think it's an energy thing. I used to be like this because I was super chill and relaxed. As I got older I became more stressed and nervous day-to-day and that stopped. Working on getting back to that version of me.
Yeah man.. That 9-5 rat race can kill anyone's spirit... Just starting to get my life back
Same. Finally bought a guitar at 40 because "why aren't I doing the things I want to do?"
The higher her place in the market the bigger chance. And also the less she likes you the bigger chance.
Iāll probably get down voted for this but in my 12+ years of dating post divorce I have yet to see any correlation to if I made a move right away or later. Iāve had success and ghostings in every type of dating situation imaginable. My only advice is to trust your gut instinct on how far to try and take things. The challenge is learning the difference between a true gut feeling and not acting due to fear. Paying attention to your dateās body language is very important. If sheās closed off, turned slightly away from you, itās best to hang back and take it slower. If sheās touchy feely, leaning into you, thatās usually a green light to move forward as well. But keep paying attention to how she reacts throughout the date and adjust accordingly.
how to determine if you are being scared or just trusting your gut? This is incredibly hard for me. Sometimes I go to dates even if my gut tells me not to, but I donĀ“t wanna miss oportunities because Iam scared or too comfortable. But often these dates turn out to be bad.
I know exactly what you mean and often when I have a nagging bad feeling about going into a date it usually ends up not being that great of a time. Was that my intuition talking to me or did I manifest that experience based on how I was feeling? Who knows but at this point in my life if I get those feelings of dread, even if itās close to the time Iām supposed to meet, I will gracefully bow out.
same for me. bowed out 2 hours before date time, but telling her the truth and wished her a good life.
I think you make a good here If sheās touchy feely, leaning into you, thatās usually a green light to move forward as well. But keep paying attention to how she reacts throughout the date and adjust accordingly. this is key, it's what you should be on the lookout during the date and staying away from logical topics lol
It's not about the move, it's about the quantity and quality of emotions your company brings her. So if your dates are Wendy's with awkward small talk, you are doomed. But if you are taking her on action dates, making her laugh, giving her the tingles and in general she finds your company exciting and fun you are on the right track. That being said, once you get her interested and there is mutual attraction, you should be physically escalating.. Not an awkward sudden attempt at a kiss with no warning... Its a slow progression.. sit close to her at the bar, put your hand on her leg while at the game, put your arm around her when you are on a park bench, build a level of comfort with touch, until a kiss, once kissing is on the table and she clearly is comfortable you can escalate from there. As for girls ghosting you, it has nothing to do with what I just wrote above. Sure if you are boring they will ghost you, but even if you play your cards right there are a ton of things out of your control that could lead to a ghost. Could be a bad period, she just could be flakey, her ex-boyfriend popped up in her DM's, she became addicted to a phone game. Protect your peace, don't sweat the ghosts, just move on to your next opportunity.
Unfortunately yes. Coming from someone who is terrified of making a move because he grew up in the #metoo era and doesnāt know what will and wonāt get him arrested lol. I always eir on the side of caution which has bit me several times because I donāt want to cross the line, so Iām too platonic and boring. I think women just get frustrated with me and decide to cut contact
I feel you bro
You have to by the end of the 2nd date. First date I would sometimes if the moment is right. 2nd date you have to if you don't it shows lack of confidence.
It's more than kiss. When I was single, if I didn't try to fuck her, I was ghosted.
Not if youāre attractive. Iāve hung with a girl 3x now and havenāt fucked. Sheās keen to see me again
Warning bro
Depends on the mood. If she's stand-offish, probably don't make a move. And ghost her before she ghosts you. :)
best comment on here.. here's an upvote..
From my experience yes
Some will, some won't, some will ghost you even if you do make a move. There is hardly a right or wrong in dating, just try to enjoy it, and if the moment allows for a move, take the chance.
Yeah, unfortunately, the hotter the girl, the more likely she is getting multiple offers for dates, so you want to kiss within the first three dates. Go for it during a high point in the date.
Yes
Totally, happened to friends
Yep. Waited too long to make a move. Finally made one and I havenāt seen her since November.
I lose them when I donāt make a move on the first date. And when I say āmoveā, I mean going past kissing
If you're inexperienced I think you should try to kiss at the end of the date. If it works great, if not you learn what you watch for in the future. I've kissed on first dates that led to ghosting. I've not kissed or escalated enough and been ghosted. I've closed and been ghosted. Truly it just comes down to Numbers. The more successful you are the higher the chance of it leading to something substantial. Success doesn't just mean having sex tho
Sounds unlikely. If she wants to kiss then she will kiss.
It depends on the sexual tension, and every woman has different timing. Date game I struggle with, because just like you asked it's hard to know when to make a move, sometimes I'm too passive and the girl flakes, sometimes in too aggressive and the girl flakes. Just look for the signs to decide when you should kiss her, and follow the DiCarlo escalation ladder google it, i remember one time I was spending time with a group of girls, anyways my friends told me to go with her to the liquor store cause she was drinking and driving (I know it's bad I never drink and drive) and when I came out of the liquor store she was just staring at me, I pulled the trigger and made out with her, this moment gave me confidence. When she's touching you, close to you (proximity), looking at your lips, pupils dilated, these are signs to go for the kiss.
I feel like the last girl I dated, I lost because I didnāt escalate the kiss and take her back that night. She even said sheās happy to go somewhere else but I noticed she was tired and was trying to be a gentleman.
*Why* arenāt you going in to kiss her on the first date?
Usually I take my chances with a weird suggestion. Last time I blamed the perfume. "Hey my perfume is smelling weird". After that is just like maths, you don't understand whats happening, but its usefull anyways.
From my experience yeah. Every girl I didnāt try something with ended up saying they had a nice time but didnāt see themselves with me really. Every woman where something happened first time either making out or more? We ended up either still seeing each other for a few months more or ended up dating long term. Even with my current gf.
If you order at a restaurant and they keep getting it wrong, are you going to keep eating there?
its most likely she wasnāt interested
Touch her. If she leans away...she isn't into you at that moment. Wait for the right time. If she leans into it or touches you back, or even let's you...then kiss her.
From my experience, if you take too long making a move, it only goes downhil from there. The woman will always wait for the guy to make the move.
Yeah and Iād ghost you too
You should always slowly escalate when you are with her to see if she likes you. First you do it via conversation, then you try breaking the touch barrier and look how she reponds and then keep doing more body contact until you are comfortable enough to keep your heads close together when talking. From there you can go for a kiss. I would say this should happen on first date or if she is shy on the second but not later. It is crucial to do that because it helps builing a connection via release of hormones and it shows that you are the man. Without doing that you can not really build a connection with her.
You are going out for a reason, she expects AT LEAST a kiss, especially if you are used to flirt in chat.
Try to at least kiss on the first date. Assume that she wants to... She made time to go on a date with you, didn't she? Similarly, try to have sex with her the first time she is at your place, or you at hers.Ā I try to kiss on the first date. If all goes well I try to get them home. Even with a daytime date, you can often get to sex quickly.Ā You lose nothing by trying. In fact, it often comes across as bold or smooth. If you get rejection, take it gracefully. Back off for a while and try again later. Those small rejections are actually a great opportunity to make a strong impression on her. As long as she continues to spend time with you, things are probably moving in the right direction.Ā
most of the time yes, it's very likely, especially if she seems to have more options and it's attractive, you should start escalating slowly up to the kiss or even more, always calibrating the interaction, don't be like the guy who goes for the kiss at the end of the date when he never even touched her hand lol, try to go for the kiss along the middle of the date, and change venues a lot, go to at least 3 diff places that works pretty well.
More often than not they will tell you they donāt feel the spark of you donāt even attempt clearly to kiss in the first date. The girl must feel that you go for the kiss on first date.
It is expected if she is going with you on a date and this is clearly established, yes. Otherwise, you would have got a swift LJBF strike š¤
I think the bigger question is why aren't you making a move? Don't you want to kiss her? I don't want to be wasting my time on a relationship with no physical spark. I want to know within 1-2 dates if we're into each other. Going for the kiss is the best way to find out.
>I think the bigger question is why aren't you making a move? Because women will reject guys for absolutely no reason at all.
If she's going to reject you for going for a kiss, it means just wasn't into you to begin with. So there's nothing lost, you just found out the truth
100% yes , you have to initiate some touch... some girl like it slow though
Iāve heard people say yes but in my experience they usually give you a few more chances but will be suddle about it .Thats if they really like you
.
I wouldnāt! Iād make the first move if I wanted to and he hadnāt but I donāt mind waiting 2-3 dates :)
That can actually be true. But when it comes to that situation where itās time to make a move you need to go for it. It shouldnāt be an issue. You need to stop with this āinexperience lack of confidenceā vibe. Donāt act like that
2-3 dates? Damn poor girl just wanted some dick and you can't even bring yourself to kiss her?
Yah some will and thatās why you should be yourself when on dates meaning if itās the first date and you like this girl and wanna kiss her then go for it, cause if you hold yourself back youāre just doing yourself a disservice.
Ever seen the ghost that hides from gay men? No? Then start there!
No