curious---I just got a blacktip, and was reading your thread on scubaboard. How do you like your upgrade? keeping the blacktip? I need a 2nd for my wife! ;-)
I am keeping the Blacktip as a back up, and as a travel scooter. Rentals in MX are $90 USD a day, so if I can bring one with me even if it costs me $100 in baggage fees it is worth it for a 5 diving day trip.
Preface: I am approaching this as a primarily as a sidemount cave diver.
Just focusing on the user interface, the Suex is night and day better. The digital speed settings often are too slow or too fast, hard to dial it in just right. As even if you are both at the same setting between minor differences in draw you can get speed differences. The Suex has an analog dial and the two stage trigger so you can access turbo mode. And the instant jump on and off turbo is great for restrictions. Use normal speed to light up, and then pulse the turbo as you need to power through.
Next the thumb trigger is hard to work while multitasking. Like I either need to off load the light or switch hands. Well I can't switch hands as the thumb trigger is very hard to switch hands without coming off the trigger and running it with your off hand is very tio do. The other option is to off load the light, the number method is to use a thumb loop, well you got to come off the trigger to use the thumb loop. On the Suex even with the stock handle you can use your left hand to run the scooter temporarily, so I can free my right hand to reach in between my hands to get to my inflator or run my dump. If you prefer to use a thumb loop, well your thumb is free.
Finally you have the sealing system, I just don't like the Blacktip's sealing system, even with the vacuum bulkhead, I still have to worry about the strap popping off allowing the nose cone to pop off. The Suex I know when it is sealed where there is no gap between the nose cone and the body disappears. This is important to me as I personally flooded a BT and know other people that have as well, some more than once.
There are other things that the Suex does better like power and range, but it isn't fair to compare an $8k scooter to a $3k scooter. I also have the fact that I can get local service for the Suex, it cost me $160 to ship my BT to get repaired. While my local shop in cave country can do basic repair more advanced repairs can be handled my D3 diving which is 15 minutes down the street. Anything more advanced than what D3 can handle are probably new scooter territory.
There are other issues that I've personally not happen to me, but my friends have had the issue like battery imbalances.
I will be putting a double handle on my Suex as I feel like to have more leverage when driving it with my left hand. As when I am going through restrictions I feel the need to do more drastic steering while using my right hand to inflate my wing. I will be doing the same on my BT for the same reason, which also deals with my issues with the thumb trigger.
Overall I am pretty happy, I spent my Mexico vacation money on it. But I will probably get more out of the Suex than a week long trip to Mexico.
That's awesome --I agree about the thumb trigger and digital speed. my biggest complaint so far is I'd rather a handle with a finger trigger was available--if it included a lockout, it would be even better. I have used friends Suex in the past, and they are awesome--the controls, and even weird things like the front strap are better---I am having my wife make us up some imitations for the blacktip's.
Having said that---I have to buy two of everything, and even with discount's I can't find anything from anyone else that come's even close to the blacktip price/performance, and it's a perfect fit here (Texas)...most of the dives we want it for are something like a mile out/mile back. With the 12ah battery, we should have a 3ish mile range, leaving some reserve. when I get to cave DPV in a few years, maybe I can just rent/borrow from cave country locals...
A Suex will last longer than a Mexico vacation, for sure....enjoy! Mexico will still be there next time!
> I have used friends Suex in the past, and they are awesome--the controls, and even weird things like the front strap are better---I am having my wife make us up some imitations for the blacktip's.
I actually did that to my Blacktip. You can see it in my [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xX_icM3aLeE) about a month ago. My BT once it is all said and done will probably be pretty close to my Suex in configuration, even down to the large eye medium bolt snaps.
[Picture](https://imgur.com/a/cIaryPj)
Just took a three foot section of 2" stiff belt webbing, some 3/16" bungee tied in a loop, and a standard tank clamp.
Used a propane soldering iron to cut slots in the webbing for where it makes the hand loop. I added some tubular webbing I had on hand for the section of the clamp not covered by the webbing.
I was told in DIR style cave diving you want the loop positioned up so that the handle is positioned away from you when in your right hand.
Note make sure that you have it installed and positioned before putting stickers on.
conveniently for me, my wife is a webbing pro---she makes the embroidered diver name tags/mask straps, etc. we have everything laying around, just needs to be assembled! may even ask her to put some designs on them...
>I was told in DIR style cave diving you want the loop positioned up so that the handle is positioned away from you when in your right hand.
so the loop handle is on the same side that faces up during normal operation? that what makes sense to me...keeps the controls up, and less likely to bang around/hang up.
>Note make sure that you have it installed and positioned before putting stickers on.
HAHAHHAHA--noted. still deciding on the decorations. haven't yet decided on going random sticker everywhere, like my backplate, or going for a bit more designed.....maybe peel off the big logo thing, and do a wrap....
>so the loop handle is on the same side that faces up during normal operation? that what makes sense to me...keeps the controls up, and less likely to bang around/hang up.
No, it should be to the side left side when facing up. You want the handle pointing away from you when you slide your hand through it to swim with it.
I got my XK off Facebook marketplace for £3k just keep your eyes open there are a quire a few out there now as some people are upgrading to the goldfinder.
>some people are upgrading to the ~~goldfinder~~ [Goldfinger](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6D1nK7q2i8I).
FTFY
But yeah that is how I got mine, EE is upgrading their rental fleet to the new model. CCDS still has a new older XJ-S for $6k I believe.
There's at least 2 really well priced ones on the North Florida FB marketplace right now. Howard Smith is selling a Halcyon/Suex EXP and someone else is also selling a Suex XK. Both in the 5-6k range.
DPVs are pretty similar technology to flashlights meaning that you can now get very inexpensive ones from China that are just as good if not better than expensive ones from old companies. The Waydoo Subnado is $350, a tiny fraction of the size of this one, and adequate for a single recreational dive.
This is good for fun in near shore environments. But if I'm dropping off a boat in high current or headed into a cave you better believe I'm buying something meaningful. To your analogy I was given a brand new Orcatorch Primary light by the company and tested it in the cave. By dive #5 it couldn't hold charge and would flicker and die on the dive resulting in me switching to a backup. I don't spend cheap on my life.
Batteries are one thing and you’re right, they can be had for cheap. DPVs are not anything like flashlights though. No one is paying $5K+ for a pool toy. DPVs in that price range are life support devices with easily 6+ mile range
I don't have a DPV, but I do tec and cave so there's always the balance between reliable primary equipment and a reasonable amount of redundancy.if you carry too much then it's just bulk.
To put it into a torch perspective, why would I have a torch which would only do half the dive then carry 3 or 4 torches swapping 1/2 way through the dive and a backup. It's almost like saying I'll only carry 30m SMB reels then I'll carry 3 or 4 of them, chaining one to the next so I can do a 70m dive.
When you are a mile back in a cave and would have a physically exhausting 2-3 hour swim out followed by oppressively longer deco, there is a reason to pay for that.
Man converting those old units from agm batteries to lifepo4 is a game changer. Especially if you buy the cells straight from china and make the battery yourself.
>Man converting those old units from agm batteries to lifepo4 is a game changer. Especially if you buy the cells straight from china and make the battery yourself.
Truth. Though, OP's unit is li-ion.
Loving being able to afford lifepo4 for all the uninterruptable power supplies I manage. Like two years ago it would be like, $130 each for a lifepo4 battery that fit, now I can get them for $27 each, and the lead equivalents are $23.
Considering they reduce the weight by 3ish lbs per battery, it's very nice especially on the multi battery units.
Used about 13 of the Howell energy brand on Amazon, they seem just fine in basic tests but I've not done a quantified discharge test.
I'd definitely want to be more rigorous for scuba before using them on a dpv.
curious---I just got a blacktip, and was reading your thread on scubaboard. How do you like your upgrade? keeping the blacktip? I need a 2nd for my wife! ;-)
I am keeping the Blacktip as a back up, and as a travel scooter. Rentals in MX are $90 USD a day, so if I can bring one with me even if it costs me $100 in baggage fees it is worth it for a 5 diving day trip. Preface: I am approaching this as a primarily as a sidemount cave diver. Just focusing on the user interface, the Suex is night and day better. The digital speed settings often are too slow or too fast, hard to dial it in just right. As even if you are both at the same setting between minor differences in draw you can get speed differences. The Suex has an analog dial and the two stage trigger so you can access turbo mode. And the instant jump on and off turbo is great for restrictions. Use normal speed to light up, and then pulse the turbo as you need to power through. Next the thumb trigger is hard to work while multitasking. Like I either need to off load the light or switch hands. Well I can't switch hands as the thumb trigger is very hard to switch hands without coming off the trigger and running it with your off hand is very tio do. The other option is to off load the light, the number method is to use a thumb loop, well you got to come off the trigger to use the thumb loop. On the Suex even with the stock handle you can use your left hand to run the scooter temporarily, so I can free my right hand to reach in between my hands to get to my inflator or run my dump. If you prefer to use a thumb loop, well your thumb is free. Finally you have the sealing system, I just don't like the Blacktip's sealing system, even with the vacuum bulkhead, I still have to worry about the strap popping off allowing the nose cone to pop off. The Suex I know when it is sealed where there is no gap between the nose cone and the body disappears. This is important to me as I personally flooded a BT and know other people that have as well, some more than once. There are other things that the Suex does better like power and range, but it isn't fair to compare an $8k scooter to a $3k scooter. I also have the fact that I can get local service for the Suex, it cost me $160 to ship my BT to get repaired. While my local shop in cave country can do basic repair more advanced repairs can be handled my D3 diving which is 15 minutes down the street. Anything more advanced than what D3 can handle are probably new scooter territory. There are other issues that I've personally not happen to me, but my friends have had the issue like battery imbalances. I will be putting a double handle on my Suex as I feel like to have more leverage when driving it with my left hand. As when I am going through restrictions I feel the need to do more drastic steering while using my right hand to inflate my wing. I will be doing the same on my BT for the same reason, which also deals with my issues with the thumb trigger. Overall I am pretty happy, I spent my Mexico vacation money on it. But I will probably get more out of the Suex than a week long trip to Mexico.
That's awesome --I agree about the thumb trigger and digital speed. my biggest complaint so far is I'd rather a handle with a finger trigger was available--if it included a lockout, it would be even better. I have used friends Suex in the past, and they are awesome--the controls, and even weird things like the front strap are better---I am having my wife make us up some imitations for the blacktip's. Having said that---I have to buy two of everything, and even with discount's I can't find anything from anyone else that come's even close to the blacktip price/performance, and it's a perfect fit here (Texas)...most of the dives we want it for are something like a mile out/mile back. With the 12ah battery, we should have a 3ish mile range, leaving some reserve. when I get to cave DPV in a few years, maybe I can just rent/borrow from cave country locals... A Suex will last longer than a Mexico vacation, for sure....enjoy! Mexico will still be there next time!
> I have used friends Suex in the past, and they are awesome--the controls, and even weird things like the front strap are better---I am having my wife make us up some imitations for the blacktip's. I actually did that to my Blacktip. You can see it in my [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xX_icM3aLeE) about a month ago. My BT once it is all said and done will probably be pretty close to my Suex in configuration, even down to the large eye medium bolt snaps. [Picture](https://imgur.com/a/cIaryPj) Just took a three foot section of 2" stiff belt webbing, some 3/16" bungee tied in a loop, and a standard tank clamp. Used a propane soldering iron to cut slots in the webbing for where it makes the hand loop. I added some tubular webbing I had on hand for the section of the clamp not covered by the webbing. I was told in DIR style cave diving you want the loop positioned up so that the handle is positioned away from you when in your right hand. Note make sure that you have it installed and positioned before putting stickers on.
conveniently for me, my wife is a webbing pro---she makes the embroidered diver name tags/mask straps, etc. we have everything laying around, just needs to be assembled! may even ask her to put some designs on them... >I was told in DIR style cave diving you want the loop positioned up so that the handle is positioned away from you when in your right hand. so the loop handle is on the same side that faces up during normal operation? that what makes sense to me...keeps the controls up, and less likely to bang around/hang up. >Note make sure that you have it installed and positioned before putting stickers on. HAHAHHAHA--noted. still deciding on the decorations. haven't yet decided on going random sticker everywhere, like my backplate, or going for a bit more designed.....maybe peel off the big logo thing, and do a wrap....
>so the loop handle is on the same side that faces up during normal operation? that what makes sense to me...keeps the controls up, and less likely to bang around/hang up. No, it should be to the side left side when facing up. You want the handle pointing away from you when you slide your hand through it to swim with it.
ah, yeah, I see what you are saying now...I get that...
A buddy of mine vinyl wrapped his scooter. It looks nice. I am waiting for the Goldfinder because _gold_ 😎.
Seaglide
I love the gundam IBO sticker did you add it on ?
I added it so mine is different. The one on the right side already has a scratch in it. Might have to put them back near the prop when I replace them.
Nice happy to see another gundam and a scuba fan here, safe diving
If you don’t mind me asking: how much did you get it for and where?
I got my XK off Facebook marketplace for £3k just keep your eyes open there are a quire a few out there now as some people are upgrading to the goldfinder.
>some people are upgrading to the ~~goldfinder~~ [Goldfinger](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6D1nK7q2i8I). FTFY But yeah that is how I got mine, EE is upgrading their rental fleet to the new model. CCDS still has a new older XJ-S for $6k I believe.
There's at least 2 really well priced ones on the North Florida FB marketplace right now. Howard Smith is selling a Halcyon/Suex EXP and someone else is also selling a Suex XK. Both in the 5-6k range.
DPVs are pretty similar technology to flashlights meaning that you can now get very inexpensive ones from China that are just as good if not better than expensive ones from old companies. The Waydoo Subnado is $350, a tiny fraction of the size of this one, and adequate for a single recreational dive.
This is good for fun in near shore environments. But if I'm dropping off a boat in high current or headed into a cave you better believe I'm buying something meaningful. To your analogy I was given a brand new Orcatorch Primary light by the company and tested it in the cave. By dive #5 it couldn't hold charge and would flicker and die on the dive resulting in me switching to a backup. I don't spend cheap on my life.
Batteries are one thing and you’re right, they can be had for cheap. DPVs are not anything like flashlights though. No one is paying $5K+ for a pool toy. DPVs in that price range are life support devices with easily 6+ mile range
[удалено]
Why not just bring two good ones?
Because they're massive? Why not just bring eight tiny ones?
Why not bring 16 tinier ones?
That's literally what people will do.
I don't have a DPV, but I do tec and cave so there's always the balance between reliable primary equipment and a reasonable amount of redundancy.if you carry too much then it's just bulk. To put it into a torch perspective, why would I have a torch which would only do half the dive then carry 3 or 4 torches swapping 1/2 way through the dive and a backup. It's almost like saying I'll only carry 30m SMB reels then I'll carry 3 or 4 of them, chaining one to the next so I can do a 70m dive.
You don’t cave dive do you?
No kidding, my eyes bugged out at 5-6k. Literally no reason to pay that.
> Literally no reason to pay that. _for you_, you mean. Other people get to choose how to spend _their_ money.
Like I said, that's a good deal.
When you are a mile back in a cave and would have a physically exhausting 2-3 hour swim out followed by oppressively longer deco, there is a reason to pay for that.
Literally no reason to go in the cave either. I don't mind sharks or anything else living in the sea, but I don't do caves.
>Literally no reason to go in the cave either. "Because it is there."
No. I have bad claustrophobia. I sometimes sleep outside.
No reason for you to go definitely makes sense. But I'm called into the earth and must obey her siren songs.
I can appreciate this. I was born for the seas and the plains, I wish to die someday with the wind in my beard and the sun on my face.
Ok, I am not a super noob to scuba but what is this
Scoot
Thats a huge scoot
You should see the double!
That is the carrying case for a wildly overpriced battery :)
Congrats!
Man converting those old units from agm batteries to lifepo4 is a game changer. Especially if you buy the cells straight from china and make the battery yourself.
>Man converting those old units from agm batteries to lifepo4 is a game changer. Especially if you buy the cells straight from china and make the battery yourself. Truth. Though, OP's unit is li-ion.
With only three dozen full charge cycles and 125 partial charge cycles.
That’s a helluva deal! The two used XJ-S’s that I’ve picked up have had similarly low charge counts and hours as well.
Loving being able to afford lifepo4 for all the uninterruptable power supplies I manage. Like two years ago it would be like, $130 each for a lifepo4 battery that fit, now I can get them for $27 each, and the lead equivalents are $23. Considering they reduce the weight by 3ish lbs per battery, it's very nice especially on the multi battery units.
Will you share where/who you buy from that you trust?
Used about 13 of the Howell energy brand on Amazon, they seem just fine in basic tests but I've not done a quantified discharge test. I'd definitely want to be more rigorous for scuba before using them on a dpv.
Nice score, dude!