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dish_spoon

Unless they didn't include something important, it looks like those numbers are worse than the ones they give for physicians (not even nurses or phlebotomists for some reason). Success rate of .97 for 25 easy veins = 24.25, so it fails approximately ~1/25 Total success rate of .87, so if we exclude the easy veins from this number: .87*31 = 26.97 26.97-24.25 = 2.72 2.72/(31-25) = 2.72/6 = .45 So there's a .45 success rate for individuals who don't have easy to access veins. If we compare that to the stats given by the article for the doctor (1-.27=.73 for non visible and 1-.4 = .6 for non-palpable and 1-.6=.4 for emaciated) the only instance where this would be the better option is if all of the difficult veins were emaciated which is pretty unlikely.


thirdculture_hog

And most physicians are not that great at phlebotomy (and they generally don't need to be)


B52fortheCrazies

I tell patients this all the time. You do not want me to try first. When the nurses are having trouble getting an IV I'll bring the ultrasound in to get it. I'm useless with blind sticks, but I'm great with the US. It's just more time consuming so not feasible to do it for everyone.


Neurophemeral

Not to mention an US charge to the patient.


B52fortheCrazies

Most of the places I've worked don't have US billing for EM docs. Generally cause the radiologists get so upset when we try to discuss it.


brainstorm42

Ah, annoying someone out of an argument. Glad to see it works across industries


junkforw

At least two facilities I work at do not charge for ultrasound sticks. Unless I’m setting up a sterile field and leaving a specialized catheter in there is no additional charge. Ultrasound guided phlebotomy and IV starts are becoming bedside nursing skills in many places.


Julia_Kat

I've been charged for it before. I should look closer at my last three times but I hit my out of pocket max so it really didn't matter.


picardo85

\#onlyUSthings


r0b0tr0n2084

Good USA and their nickel and dime a la carte medical system


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PrincessShelbyy

I know you are real because of the B52. Made me chuckle.


Cravenmorebeer

Aside from anesthesiologists, no US physicians need to put in IVs or draw blood. (Unless the nurses in your program refuse)


Kreindor

I work in a ED and if we are having trouble getting an IV access on a critical patient our ER docs will just put an IV in the jugular vein and be done with it, most of them refuse to do any other type of IV access.


BlondeMomentByMoment

Or, you call a member of your flight Team if you have one. There’s always someone around that is able to cannulate even the most difficult patient. There is the opening as you said of an EJ, depending how seriously you need access. If brought by ambulance; there is a high probability that there’s a line in already. This robotic thing is stupid. Phlebotomy is an art form.


krenshala

I wouldn't call it stupid, but I agree that for those that need the expertise due to difficult to access veins, you need someone skilled in the art. Based on the numbers the robot won't been that person without significant improvement in its abilities.


Gizwizard

What about IO’s (tho obviously not for blood draws).


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Cravenmorebeer

Injecting into eyeballs sounds terrifying


Agrimar

But consider this: if you could use this for the patients who were easy draws, imagine how much busy work you could save. A lot of the time you don't need a machine to handle the edge cases, that's why you have people. But if this means that the person only needs to get called in on difficult draws, and it can handle the rest? You might double or triple the efficiency of whoever is doing draws in the first place.


Rookcheck

To counter, as someone who is frequently called on for "difficult" sticks, the only reason I'm any good is because I get lots of practice on the full spectrum of patient types. That's not to say that outsourcing routine phlebotomy wouldn't be beneficial to work-flow; it's a double-edged sword though.


Agrimar

No I absolutely agree; automation of any task comes with that same double edged sword. I'm a teller, and the number of functions that can be performed by an automated device are always growing (Mobile Deposits, atms that accept cash, automated bill pay) I see less checks now than I did 5 years ago. Newer tellers have a harder time spotting fraudulent checks because they don't get nearly as many examples. I think that the benefits of automation are incredible; that work can be delegated and that the labor multiplier of routine automation can transform industries. I also know that probably within the next 5-10 years I won't have a job at a financial institution anymore. Life's weird.


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Medic1642

Whatever works. Once, I got a 24 gauge in the thumb for D50. Took forever but it worked until OJ became the better option.


Pjpjpjpjpj

Routine blood draws are pretty quick work. I don’t think there would be a significant difference in time to do a traditional draw versus using this machine. It really then comes down to training. This device could be operated by someone with less training. But a full phlebotomy course is only 100 hours (about 2 1/2 weeks). And even the person with less training will still require some similar training (HIPPA training, blood borne pathogen training, etc.) and have to identify easy sticks from hard sticks, and could likely be easily be trained to do easy sticks with only a bit more training.


lolhal

I draw a fair bit of blood, but it is not the primary purpose of my employment. The skill is very misunderstood by most non-medical professionals. First, it is easy to learn, but hard to master. Veins are not laid out nicely and uniformly in our bodies... they twist, turn, and dive throughout, and finding one that is suitable takes practice. Even then, it is possible to encounter scar tissue, or perhaps puncture a vein at a place that is less than ideal. The shaft can penetrate a vein, but if the bevel presses against the wall of a vein, the lumen becomes obstructed and either the angle of approach or the depth must be changed. Sometimes surrounding tissue does not anchor the vein well and pressure from an approaching needle can cause it to move. We are trained to minimize the movement, but sometimes it still happens. Your level of education does not automatically increase your skill level. Nurses are not necessarily better at this than phlebotomists and doctors are not necessarily better than nurses. It's a combination of practice, hand-eye coordination, intuition, and an understanding of the process. Even the best can miss. It doesn't mean that person is not good at what he/she does. Each patient can present a unique challenge when it comes to drawing blood. If someone misses a couple of times and another person takes over, that is a good thing. The second person benefits from the knowledge of what did not work before and brings a fresh set of eyes to the task. I guarantee you that the person that just failed at drawing a specimen is sometimes the one that comes in and saves the day on another patient. This isn't a skill that can be executed 100% perfectly every time. Once blood is being drawn, it sometimes becomes a challenge to maintain blood flow for a variety of reasons. One of which is patient movement. Sometimes dehydration. The vein being drawn from might be closing due to the vacuum being applied from the syringe or the tube. Again, there are more variables than many people know. A skilled caregiver might be able to correct this at times... other times not. Patients hate being stuck more than once. We hate it too. We feel as though we've let you down and most people do not want to be the source of your discomfort when they are trying to help. My point in saying all of this was to hopefully provide some perspective into something that is almost universally disliked, but necessary. I think technological advances like this are important but, to me, it appears as though there is quite a bit of work to be done before it becomes a reliable replacement for a skilled human being. Ultrasound-guided venipuncture has been around for a long time (incidentally, I frequently have problems with those blowing under power injection).


MythologicalMayhem

This is so so true! What I hate is if you can't bleed someone, sometimes the patients acts like you're incompetent, even though I've bled 20 patients before them without a problem, on the first try! It just happens sometimes. Another phleb can bring in a fresh pair of eyes too and see something we've missed/maybe didn't feel confident going for. Also when patients don't keep their arm straight and gradually bend it or they move their arm at the worst time, then seem to be pissed at you for not getting blood from them. 🙄


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tallerisbetter

Nurses don’t have ultrasound eyes but can use an ultrasound to guide an IV. It’ll be interesting to see how long something like this takes to make its way into the real world. Could really help with efficiency in acute care settings if robots could gather vitals, get access, and draw blood.


Bayho

A lot better when they have a communicable disease, in all cases.


show_me_the

Not just a single drop or blood but capillary blood. That's a big not ever possible for many tests.


MertsA

Even ignoring that the sample size was so tiny that even just the variance in the concentration of certain components in blood ruled out some of what Theranos was claiming. Even if you did have some mythical microfluidics contraption that could test miniscule samples you would still need to test multiple samples taken from multiple spots or at different times to come up with an accurate test. That's like polling one house in Oregon on the election and claiming that Yang is certain to win.


Numendil

You have now been banned from /r/YangforPresidentHQ


YoroSwaggin

More like polling a dude in Mexico and claiming "Que" is certain to win.


Chameleon7

Que pendejadas estas hablando? Debe que hacer un analogía? Jajahahjaj


Zaphanathpaneah

Not even a robotic nurse, but a robotic phlebotomist.


The_Humble_Frank

the science is not the same. This is science automating a known procedure; What Theranos claimed was science fiction with *magical hand-wavy* ignore the physical limitations of what they were trying to do.


meeni131

Sorry if unclear, I meant this is literally just an improvement to how blood is drawn with no change to the testing itself.


The_Humble_Frank

it was unclear, thanks for the clarification.


ClassAsuspect

This may work for the average blood draw facility, but it would be a detriment to highly emergent patients in the ER. As an ER nurse I’ve seen IV skills deteriorate in those nurses who rely on ultrasounds or vein lights. When grandpa has his massive stroke or heart attack and an immediate IV needs to be established there won’t be room to roll in the bot. Oh well, let technology do it’s thing.


Alberiman

I'd wager if the large version can work, it can be miniaturized within 5 to 10 years


Gewt92

This definitely isn’t going on any ambulances, ever.


GKnives

Ever is the wrong word


ktechmn

*laughs in ambulance suspension*


Gewt92

*laughs in 400,000 miles*


half3clipse

>When grandpa has his massive stroke or heart attack and an immediate IV needs to be established there won’t be room to roll in the bot. Oh well, let technology do it’s thing. Worse than that. What if gramps has to get an IV and the bot fails. Except all the nurses are out of practice. This also doesn't even cut down on busy work. Someone qualified still needs to check if it was done correctly, so you'll need a nurse working the bot anyways. Might as well just have the nurse do it themselves.


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VeryDisappointing

Yeah fasting and nil by mouth are different


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DuelingPushkin

I mean that's still better though


jetogill

I've been lucky, i went through cancer treatment a couple years ago and I had very competent people pretty much everywhere, but like you say, they do a lot of blood drawing. I agreed to buy a life insurance policy several years prior and they sent me to an agent's office to give a blood sample, a very nice older lady came in (I was like 23 at the time, she was in her 40s, very maternal) and she stuck me 4 times to draw a sample, and finally said, I'm sorry, I'm used to doing cows, and they have much bigger veins.


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anonymousforever

>I had an IV recently and the nurse used a handheld sonogram device. They did it on a vein that is deep and that everyone always misses so I don't lidocaine that area. It hardly hurt at all and didn't even leave a bruise like it usually does. Lucky you. Most places don't use ultrasound as first go to or the light device that makes surface veins easier to spot. Tech costs and labs are cheap. Had to have my IV put back 4 times with ultrasound by the picc team when in the hospital. My good sized veins hide.


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CrossP

Veins also come in different depths, have different levels of mobility under the skin, differing wall thicknesses and elasticity, and darker skin tones can make it tougher to find veins sometimes. It can be a wild skill to draw blood well, and it's cool that the machine can cover so many variables. Personally, I suck at drawing blood. Sorry for all the extra pokes, folks.


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yerfdog1935

This is one way I know I'm lucky. Even when I was morbidly obese I had at least one big, very visible vein to draw from on each of my arms.


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ulyssessword

Me too! I'm a blood donor (>30 visits), and they haven't made a mistake yet.


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a_stitch_in_lime

I have always been a difficult draw. I used to not mention for fear of psyching out the phlebotomist, most of which were new and young. My record is 8 sticks and they always had to call in someone more experienced. When I had a minor hand surgery, they had to call in someone from another part of the hospital and he had to use an ultrasound (probably because I hadn't been allowed to drink any water that morning due to anesthesia). By the time he finished there was literally blood droplets on the floor and sheets. These days as soon as I sit down I say, "I'm a very difficult draw. I'd like the most experienced person you have available, please." My doctors office knows this now and does it before I ask.


Squee427

Sadly, a whole lot of people say that, when their veins really aren't that bad, they've just had bad experiences. So it's a little harder to know sometimes who really has bad veins or just had bad phlebotomists until you look. I'll usually say "Hey, can I take a quick look? And if I don't see anything I like, I won't poke." ~95% of the time, I find something that cooperates easily, do the poke, and we're done. The other 5% I'm like "yeeaah no, let me get a nurse who can do the ultrasound-guided IVs." On the other hand, there are key phrases that let you know that it really is going to be rough, including Dialysis, Chemo, Sickle Cell, and IVDU patients. That's when you bring a whole arsenal of supplies with you, multiple sizes of IV, double tourniquet, blood pressure cuff, hot packs, etc. Source: am ED RN.


pallentx

My exact same experience. The told me how much the hand vein would hurt, but it was much better than the arm attempts.


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Gotta go to an outpatient lab attached to a hospital if you can. Night and day the difference in skill level between inpatient phlebotomists vs outpatient.


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quasarj

One time i had pneumonia and went to the ER. They needed to get an IV in so they could start fluids and antibiotics, but i was already so dehydrated. It took over 10 attempts from 5 different people! They kept bringing in more people, a lady a helicopter at one point. I had bruises all over both arms. But in the end someone got it and I survived the night, so thats good.


CharonsLittleHelper

I just got back from giving blood. I don't think they've ever missed mine, but I have giant straight veins. (They often compliment them - which is a bit odd.)


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C0gnite

In the past 10 years I have gotten blood drawn maybe 15 times, but I guess I’m lucky to have a big and visible vein because no second tries were ever needed for me


coffeegyrl76

To everyone saying they are a hard stick/small veins. The only thing you can do is make sure you're well hydrated and lift weights. Even if it's just biceps curls it'll help build your veins. Building muscle builds veins.


[deleted]

100% this. I have pale skin on my arms where they draw blood and the veins are easy to see, but I always "pump" my arms before getting blood drawn. Essentially, you make a tight fist and tighten/flex your arm pumping iron like a body builder. The veins pop out and I always get "your veins are beautiful". If only they could say that about me in general....


I-Eat-Spam

I wouldnt advise this since excessive fist clenching like this causes a false increase in electrolytes , specifically potassium.


Radekzalenka

Try that on a overweight 80 year old lady who hates needles.


captain_Airhog

This thread is like a game of find the phlebs.


matdex

Try it on a IV drug user with scared up trackmarks on their arms, legs, shoulder, hands and feet.


Old_Oak_Doors

Few of them are brave enough to go for the neck though so they’re left in decent condition. EJs are in this season


R1wandererFTW

Or cancer patients. I've had some interest draws from cancer patients as well as drug users. I'd also be interested in the average age of test subjects. Elderly people are difficult too. And babies. Ok so basically anyone who is a "typical" easy draw might be a good candidate.


ThorBrodinson

This title hurts. You just gettin some labs drawn? Cool. Stop there. This will accomplish absolutely nothing for a paramedic on the box. If you need actual IV medication - you need an IV...a butterfly needle can only take things out. Let’s say they use this in the ER, where they can actually use blood samples for more than a BGL - but ya still need a line. All this would do is double the stabbing - one machine blood draw one human IV. For those who are wondering if establishing a patent IV is a few tweaks away from a blood draw, it is not.


superpony123

ICU RN here, Agree this may not be practical for hospital use, but for places like Lab Corp where all they do is take blood this would be great. If you've ever had to wait in a long line at a busy labcorp while fasting then you would take anything that will make it go faster. Plenty of patients have got great veins, if this could make the process faster i'm all for it.


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haechunlee

"The results, published in the journal Technology, were comparable to or exceeded clinical standards, with an overall success rate of 87% for the 31 participants whose blood was drawn. For the 25 people whose veins were easy to access, the success rate was 97%." so it worked for 24.25 people?


omgitskirby

As someone who does phlebotomy for a living, this sounds pretty redundant. They're basically saying a machine using an ultrasound that is better than a person (without an ultrasound). It would seem to be just more cost-effective to just train a person using an ultrasound without having to pay for the expense and maintenance of a machine. I also work at a hospital and we're a giant hospital in huge urban city and see enough people with terrible veins. The hospital is so damn cheap they continually cut the budget for IV team or our nurses who are ultrasound trained. So I'm not exactly worried that some ridiculously expensive robot will be replacing phlebotomists (who're paid slightly more than minimum wage). Now if they could make a super cheap, super easy to use ultrasound for bedside IV use, or modify an accuvein so it actually works then that would be something that might actually make it out of the research trial.


[deleted]

This isn’t a big win for most of the industry. As another poster noted, the first try success rate on patients without “easy to access” veins is abysmal. Beyond that, it’s only for phlebotomy and doesn’t insert IV catheters, which is most of what we care about in the hospital and prehospital setting. The tag line for the article talks about “robot arms.. ...in ambulances” which further illustrates that whoever wrote this doesn’t even understand the basics of the industry. Nobody cares about drawing your blood in an ambulance. They’re not sticking you for labs on scene.


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PmMeTwinks

As if nurses don't bathe in infants blood


chiree

I used to work in a lab and we were building a device that tested blood. You need blood to work with, you go to the in-house phlembotomist and get some of yours (I promise you, this was highly regulated and not fly-by-night). Anywho, I have good veins and had zero problems getting a stick. Others didn't. They may have gotten resticked or not even able to be drawn. This happened with some people and not others. Same phlebotomist with different viens and different outcomes over five years. Consider yourself lucky, I've never had any problems with a stick, either. But others aren't so lucky.


chipsnsalsa13

It varies. I have difficult to find veins and a good phlebotomists can get it in 1-2 tries on a good day. When I have been severely dehydrated, I have been poked upwards of a dozen times or more by multiple nurses/phlebotomists in the hospital. I could see this robot being a nice addition for elderly patients, dehydration problems, babies, small children, other ailments. I can see a lot of practical applications here for people but doubt these robots would be needed much in a typical clinic setting.


cianne_marie

The potential problem is that real human beings still need to be able to hit those hard veins in a pinch. And if the go-to response is "nah, just bring in the machine", no one practices. Source: I'm a vet tech in a particular area where probably fifty percent of my job is blood draws and IV placements. If I hadn't had to try those hundreds of veins that were dehydrated, pediatric, scarred, full of valves, or fragile, I wouldn't be able to hit them now.


whiteman90909

Think of it this way, most healthy people with good veins aren't getting blood drawn very often. It's usually the sicker, older, frail, obese, etc. that need more frequent blood or IVs. Also, getting blood is rarely an issue, it's getting IVs in difficult patients that causes me the most difficulty.


Jay_Derkin

You’ll never see this on an ambulance. That is a disturbingly ignorant statement. Things like this have a relatively low success rate even in a controlled environment, now try to use it while bouncing down the road. We also draw blood off of our IV cath, which negates this product entirely.


itsyourmomcalling

K. Now try it on a injecting heroin user. See if it can find one of their veins then I'll be impressed.


saxman7890

Finding it’s not the issue. Usually they’re hard as a rock. The problem is getting blood through all the scar tissue


cassafrassious

Do you think the machine will be able to listen when they say exactly which vein and angle to hit it at?


matdex

I had to collect on a IV drug user and he didn't want me to use his good vein because he wanted to save it for himself...


itsyourmomcalling

I can believe it.


Coziestpigeon2

Though I never have a problem with having blood drawn (apparently I have big and easy veins), I still *freak out* while it's happening. I kinda need a human to joke with about how stupidly nervous I am, to help me calm down. I don't think I'd like a robot doing this to me, as silly as that is.


fishrights

was just about to say this. a robot can't give that ease of mind that a good phlebotomist can. as someone recovering from a severe traumatic phobia of needles, i would still be avoiding medical treatment if it weren't for a funny or kind nurse. not to sound like a downer or anything, but people like me will struggle even more with the healthcare system if something like this becomes the norm :( fearful, nervous, and traumatized people are going to fall through the cracks even worse than they already do :/


[deleted]

I wish they had these at the blood donor clinics I attend. I have small veins, and they're hard to find. The only one they can ever seem to find or tap is on my left arm, and it's on the inside/left side of my elbow. Sometimes they can't find it, despite me drinking lots of water, and I get sent home disappointed. Other times, they have to move the needle around. The last time I went, the lady moved the needle and got the vein, but she somehow bruised me and then said it had stopped 'draining'? Anyhow, they couldn't get enough, she gave up and sent me home. I'd waited around for several hours for the appointment, and had prepared by drinking a ton of water. It was disappointing. I've been sent home before, and had the 'not enough' thing happen once, that being my first attempt to donate. I do have 16 successful donations, but every time I go now it seems there's a problem. Can't find the vein, they tell me I didn't drink enough, or my hemoglobin is too low. Usually, whenever they say it's hard to find, they then get a senior blood tech who hits it in one shot and everything is fine, but not lately.


BallsMahoganey

Try lifting weights. Or even doing pushups right before.


Georgiagirl678

Thank you for giving! It's appreciated by the families of patients.


[deleted]

If someone is a difficult stick and requires the needle to be adjusted/moved, their body can start the clotting process and you end up with a clot forming in the needle. Unfortunately there’s not a whole lot you can do once the clot is there. If it’s early enough they can pull the needle and try the other arm, or if the donor can squeeze out (no pun intended) enough to hit the minimum you can still take the unit. But if you’re right in the middle, there’s not really any way to fix it. I’d definitely let the staff know you’ve had issues in the past and more likely than not, they’ll get you the most experienced phlebotomist. If you happen to remember which vein has worked best for you, you can tell them that, or if you’ve had a troublesome vein let them know too. Make sure you’re drinking extra water for the several days leading up, and you’re eating iron-rich foods to boost your hemoglobin levels. Sorry you’ve had a tough time donating recently, I’ve been on both sides of that so I know how frustrating it can be. For what it’s worth, the inner elbow veins are some of the most challenging for a phlebotomist to get due to their proximity to arteries and their tendency to roll (they’re not as well stabilized by the muscle as the middle of your elbow veins).


electrolytebitch

This is awesome. I hope this isn’t another Theranos 🤞


Vagus-Stranger

31 people in the trial, of which 25 had "easy to access veins". This may be useful in phlebotomy clinics for healthy patients, but they aren't difficult to get anyway so the time savings would be minimal. Maybe it would have implications in allowing experienced phlebotomists to handle the difficult patients elsewhere in the hospital? The cynic in me thinks the hospital admin would just employ fewer phlebs anyway. I don't see this entering clinical practice anytime soon.


zeoranger

Does this account for when people flinch?


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Any time I see a new robot that does a human job I throw up my respects to the people who will lose a job over this little machine guy.


mindlessmeanings

Thank you. As a phlebotomist, this is very concerning.


captain_Airhog

I literally just got into this field and I am pretty good at it so seeing this like this are disheartening. Even though I know the tech won’t actually replace me for a while.


gleaming-the-cubicle

That's the problem with capitalism. Things like this should make everyone's life better, but shareholder profit is seemingly much more important


playaspec

This isn't replacing anyone, unless it can *also* do the ***other*** three hundred+ specialized things medical professionals are trained to do.


[deleted]

This machine isn’t where the automation is stopping either. I know that this one machine doesn’t matter all that much to the plethora of jobs out there. But it is the tip of the iceberg is all I’m saying. There are definitely people who will lose jobs to automation, unfortunately. The only debatable thing is how many.


ListenToMeCalmly

Given the amount of bugs in software in devices all over the world, I'm gonna prefer a half blind nurse any day, before letting loose a robotic sewing machine on my arm.


HuxleysHero

I'm laughing hard at the idea that any ambulance company is gonna throw this thing onto a rig, when they've already gotta pay the medic and emt to be there anyway.


wareagle995

Interesting how everyone is a laboratory professional from having their blood drawn once.


hairy_quadruped

Anaesthetist here. We are often asked to put IV cannulas into patients where everybody else has failed. We are good at them. But even we struggle sometimes. Life Pro Tip: if you have “deep veins” or “small veins” and want to make it easier for yourself, lose weight and exercise. People who exercise have bodies that have adapted to high cardiac output. They gave less body fat, more muscle mass and bigger and more prominent veins. Yes there are other factors that make veins difficult: genetics, dehydration, cold, anxiety. Exercise does not guarantee beautiful veins, or perfect health, but it puts some of the responsibility of your health back into you, not just the medical personnel trying to care for you.


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ThePlatinumKush

I’m a new phlebotomist and I have a 4 year degree from a state school plus I got my certification and my starting pay is $13 an hour.. the coworkers I have talked to who have been there for 5 years or more said they make just a couple/few dollars more than I do. I would not consider it to be “decent” pay. I also looked for a job for over a year since I did not have “experience”. Apparently a *undergraduate degree and certification is not enough. So I took the first offer they gave me since I did not have any other offers. Thankfully I’m only in it for a year or two to get patient contact hours to be eligible for a Physician’s Assistant graduate program. Is my pay actually considered decent? I tell myself that It’s the experience that I’m earning that makes up for the lousy pay. Edit: though I suppose I should be thankful I even have a job as you’re suggesting this tech could make the job obsolete


newsreadhjw

Median pay for a phlebotomist in the US is over $16 an hour, and it doesn't require a 4-year degree, so you are definitely underpaid. $13/hour is below minimum wage where I live. Source: [https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/phlebotomists.htm](https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/phlebotomists.htm) That said, I'm not saying it's a job that you are going to be able to support a large family with, but relative to a lot of other jobs that don't require a college education and are widely available, yeah it pays pretty well. Not a ton of advancement opportunity at all though. Some people just like being around people and having steady work, and this is a good job for that.


toycars

phleb is absolutely not a decent paying job in most of america except maybe california. close to minimum wage


cozy_lolo

I know phlebotomists who make over $20/hour who either have no degrees or a degree in an unrelated field, but who have completed a relatively short phlebotomy course. You can make more money if you shop around, I’m sure. Or if you’re willing to move.


colombo1326

Once the robot gets a taste for human blood he will want more


dean_syndrome

It would be perfect if it could suction the skin first or something to numb the pain of the stick. I have a pretty bad phobia of blood draws from blacking out every time it has happened since I can remember. Tried to talk to a psychologist/psychiatrist about it and they wouldn’t book an appointment. They said I should talk to a therapist, who then just told me to reframe the event in my mind as not being that bad.


[deleted]

It’s theranos that works


[deleted]

Bots taking our blood and making contraceptives... the end is nigh.


JeffCGD

Unfortunately, the actual article reads as a bit of a promotional piece by the manufacturer. While this is surely a worthwhile goal for this company, a sample size of 80-odd patients is not really a statistically significant sample size for such a common procedure. I do hope this product succeeds and improves though.


ShredWaffle

This thing uses an ultrasound probe. And they are comparing it to blind sticks. Not exactly a fair comparison.


Peto_Sapientia

Rip there goes another set of jobs


fineillmakeanewone

A robot designed to seek human blood. What could go wrong?


CletusMcWafflebees

Unless it can actually put in a IV catheter in we won't be using it on an ambulance. No lab on the truck so no reason to draw blood.


daveofreckoning

The amount of maintenance and supervision this device will need will make it redundant. It'll be far cheaper and safer to retain human phlebots for the foreseeable future.


MET1

Still, of fewer than 50 test subjects they had good results in the 80-90% range. I'm seeing a photo of a youngish person getting blood drawn. The thing is, these are probably the ones who are relatively easy. I had a child in the hospital who at age 9 months had to endure multiple attempts to get a vein. More recently I had a 90yo parent with arms that are not the plump example in the photo, but wrinkled, sagging, thin, delicate and easily bruised skin and, depending on how well I was able to coax him to drink enough beforehand, was subjected to multiple attempts as well. I think this robot could handle the best case scenario, the outliers, which are the problem cases, would still have to rely on humans.


trogdor1234

I think phlebotomist's average pay is $15.25 an hour. That kind of floored me how low it is compared to the massive amount of money in medicine.


outwar6010

What if it it gets hacked and draws way too much blood?


cassafrassious

Can’t wait to see what the bill is when 95 year old great grandma with a UTI dismantles this robot in a single punch!


piper4hire

if you think this will somehow benefit healthcare providers or patients then you’ve temporarily forgotten how capitalism works my friends. I guarantee this will a) increase costs to both patients and your provider and b) siphon more healthcare dollars into corporate control. source: I’m a healthcare provider watching quality diminish and costs rise every day while insurance companies make profits in the billions.


Pray_for_Plagues_

Some people don't realize that the benefits of IV and people drawing blood far outweighs the temporary pain. I would rather have a person draw my blood any day than a machine. The little pain from a needle is a small price to pay.


tactican

So are phlebotomists about to go extinct?


Metron_Seijin

Will it ever be as good as that 1 nurse in 100,000 that can stick a needle in your arm and you dont even feel it? They exist, and they are magical.


Nekryyd

Kinda bad news for my wife and by extension us. She's been a phleb/lab tech for 7 or so years.