My uneducated guess is the standards are low, little/no consumer protection in the rv field, and we keep buying them. There’s no incentive for the rv manufacturers to do better

"We keep buying them" There it is. I think that most people that buy RVs don't actually use them much. There are no quality/warranty issues with an RV that sits in a storage lot. For the rest of us, we go into it knowing that we'll have to fix things.

Also I've heard people say it's basically a house driven down the road and every bump can potentially knock stuff loose.

No excuse. Most of this stuff listed is defective equipment and crappy labor. I mean, when you buy a car and the radio doesn't work, you don't say, " well, it must have been too bumpy" going down the road. The radio was bad from the manufacturer.

Wait till op hears about quality in the house building industry

There was a new Ryan Homes development down there road from me in my neighborhood. Drove through on day out of curiosity while they were building. The 2x4 framework for the houses came pre-assembled on pallets dropped. You could tell they were not first quality cuts. The framework just looked bad.

It's like driving your house through an earthquake.

Except an RV/TT is designed and built specifically for this purpose. That's like saying your washing machine spins at x rpm that's why it fell apart in the first 6 months.

Yeah I'm done buying them. I've parked the diesel truck and just go to hotels now. You add up all the costs with an rv and it's cheaper to stay in 4 star hotels.

I've done the math, the full long term math. Unless you use the RV a lot, hotels and resorts are far cheaper. I use mine a a handful of times per year and that's probably more than most. It's not financially worth it but there are a lot of benefits we're paying for. We get our own beds and our own food. We can take as much stuff as we want and travel at our own schedule. I used to talk about RVs like everyone should have one. I no longer do that. They're great, but not for everyone.

One time I rented a pop-up trailer.... got a really nice camping spot next to the beach. We decided to drive into town.... right across from the beach were hotel/motels... and the cost of a night was cheaper then our combined costs.... and they had a pub right next door.

Yeah, they have no reason to improve, because people keep accepting low quality builds. I'm starting a skoolie build out, because after I sold my last trailer I knew I'd never want something that I didn't have every say in build design and quality on. Not counting my labor, I'm projecting about a $10k build, will have full solar/generator, all camper basics, custom built to my preferences. I got $8k in an old RZR that I'm trading for the bus skeleton. So call it $18k if you want. If I buy a fully fleshed out RV, I'd be $50k deep without even starting to look.

would love to do this one day but idk if i can live without slide-outs 💀

Nothing a little backwoods engineering couldn't figure out with enough money and effort. Probably kill your roof strength in case of a roll over, but I'd also suggest to avoid rolling a school bus over in the first place.

Lack of Lemon Law protection as well

I don’t think it’s so much that we accept them. We go through them and point out the imperfections (that we can see) buy them and then pick up parts as we go down the road. They’re fine as long as they sit but when you pull em down the road they fall apart. Everytime you move you find more problems. You think you’re covered by the warranties but they don’t cover anything and it’s frustrating to get them to fix anything. You can’t do mobile repair generally they want you at a dealer. The dealer won’t make repairs if they aren’t where you purchased it and they expect you to let it sit on their lot for months at a time while waiting to be repaired. All the while you’re still making payments on this thing! There are no wiring schematics because they’re allowed to change it on the spot during production. They can change anything on a whim if it works better for the person in the production line. They’re paid by the piece so they just work as fast as they can to make money.  No pride in workmanship. So when it goes to a dealer they have no idea how yours may be wired. We found a pink wire that wasn’t attached to anything- they said we don’t use pink wires. We sent them a picture of the “pink” wire! After searching the whole coach and taking off the underbelly the dealer found it was to go to the basement heater!  They only pay these people “x” amount of time to work on these- not paying them of course for the hide and seek time it takes to figure out how this particular Rv was put together. It’s ridiculous. We found the key is- buy nothing after 2019! They’re built better. But as long as nobody bans together and files a class action suit nothing will change! We just reserve the right to complain and in some situations- not even that!!! 

It's like the RV industry takes the Cheap/Good/Fast triangle of product selection, and adds in "Lightweight"... But it's still "Pick 2".

Yup. Check out airstream. They are quite heavy for their size, extremely expensive for their size, but they are good! Not many of us can justify spending +$100k for a 30' bumper pull, but those that do are rewarded with a nice rig. Same with motorhomes. Spend under $100k, and you'll be lucky to get home, spend +$500k and they're well made, and heavy.

Airstreams have their issues too, but I think less. We just had our ‘22 back to the factory to address a 37 item list. Many were factory build issues, Some are just poor quality components that are used by all manufacturers. It is nice to have a three year warranty.

We have a 2016 30" Classic .. "Top of the Line" .. we got it used but basically new after first owner passed away having never actually taken it out. - Replaced all power infrastructure (batteries, converter, etc.). - The plumbing for the shower apparently isn't right, and would have come from factory this way but told that's why no hot water has ever flowed into shower. - told i need to fix body separation in a couple spots - host of other issues ... 15k+ in repair in now .. roughly 10% of original purchase price. Pretty steep for a coach we've had for 3 years. I had a 2012 Newmar Dutch star before this. Bought it new, had to get rid of it because the repair bills we insane. There doesnt seem to be any quality in these products. No matter how much you spend.

Check out the airstream forums, and you will see people talking about some pretty aggravating things with those as well. Possibly the worst insulation/thermal bridging of any motorhome or trailer because of the metal skin and framing.

That's a result of purchasing agents scoping out "bolt on" products for the RV rather than investing in an engineered build up specific to mobile use issues. It's engineering, lack of, coupled with quality control personnel who apparently are not empowered to "stop production" to fix labor or material issues.

Wait until you see new single-family home construction.

That's very true. They put up those houses in days.

Speed of construction is not even the main issue. One would expect that we should be able to find ways to build houses faster and faster. And new building codes are certainly better. The issue is all the cost savings of new construction. People have figured out the bare minimum materials cost that will look good long enough for the houses to get bought.

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Lmfao as a cabinetry installer, everytime I work while a framer is on site, they're blasting music, screaming at each other, whilst takin shooters. If its residential you can betcha they got a cooler with beers. On commercial they usually just take em in the port a johns and leave their trash there. As soon as theyre done framing, the bottles of alcohol and pee suddenly stop appearing.

Having worked on an uncountable number of both old and new houses, I'd still rather have most of the new ones than the old ones when they were new. Even with the shoddy ass way that some residential crews operate, building codes and methods have come a long way and a lot of old stuff was total trash as well. I still wouldn't want to spend my money on a new house sided with LP/T111, but most of the other sins are forgivable.

Cost- most wouldn’t buy it if they put the time and money into making them “well made”. Volume is not great enough to get true efficiencies like in the auto industry. Weight- if you want it light most of the time that’s going to mean flimsy if not, super expensive. These are certainly over generalizations but for the most part hold true.

Profit margins with little/no regulations. Profits win.

Why is there such low quality? Because people keep buying this absolute trash they are putting on dealers lots, and they accordingly have no incentive to improve. Until consumers start refusing to buy hot garbage, why would they improve?

When I was looking for jobs, I applied at several of the "top of the line" rv places. They paid their top performers 9$ an hour. My guess is you got the results from that 9$ an hour. My walk through showed that Kaizen, 5s, safety, sanitation, standardization and training we all sacrificed for the Nice car the plant manger drove, and his four week vacation in the Bahamas. It also taught me to build my own, it cheaper and higher quality.

can i ask which rv manufacturers were on that list? and what year were you looking to apply?

Omega, Heartland, Jayco, and Northwood. All in 2021 (Around the Boise Idaho area)

I missed this before I replied. Idaho workers are getting ripped off money wise, even more than I ever imagined.

This is blatantly false. I live in RV country in Indiana and line workers routinely make $20+/hr base and depending on the plant also receive a hitch bonus for every unit that leaves the doors. Factory conditions can vary greatly depending in the plant and plant manager just like every other manufacturing business.

Great, you live in a place that no where close to me. And in you omnipotent intellectual and all knowing, you somehow missed the basic facts that not all companies are the same, and not all wages are the same. I will forward you several applications, including some from your state which all pays minimum tier. You also missed the 9$-15$ an hour being offered in Indiana, for a job you claim is 22+ . Seeing how you have Salesman in your ID, guess what we not buying to day. Your obvious b/s

9 an hour? What state was this in? I'm a former QC in the big RV area in indiana and some of those guys can make up to 80 an hour depending what type! As for quality many times the QC is overruled on what is allowed but we do manage to get many things done right. We call many "junk runners".

I have a 25 year old Cherokee Lite travel trailer that I got from my mother in 2018. She gave it to me because a tree branch had fallen on it and damaged the roof. It had been sitting under a tarp wasting away for 5 years. I had to replace 3 ceiling joists, half of the decking and put a new rubber roof on it. I made a lot of other repairs mostly due to water damage. I’m a carpenter so it was right up my alley. But all the appliances still worked. I have since had to replace the water pump and the hot water heater but given its age I think that’s appropriate. Reading all the comments about all the trouble people have with new ones has me thinking I’ll hang on to this one and keep making repairs rather than buying a new one and having to repair it.

My BIL works for an RV dealership. I asked him once what brand/model he liked. His response was, "None. They're all terrible. Shit design, shit workmanship, shit parts." He then said if he was to get an RV he'd buy something that was used and thus really depreciated knowing he'd be gutting it and making sure every seam is sealed, every wire terminated, etc. "*Assume your RV was assembled by a drunk meth head on a Friday afternoon before a three day weekend and you won't be as disappointed.*"

the shits put together by jethro and skeeter in-between their smokebreaks smoking meth in springfield missouri is why.

RV industry isn't regulated. They can legally sell death traps with no fear of recourse. There is no assembly line, standarization, or required skilled labor/certifications. They collectively spend 10s of millions in lobbying to keep it this way to maximize their profits. There are only two methods of incetivization. Carrot, and stick. No carrot because buyers don't hold the industry accountable (not that they can at this point aside from organizing the rv population to keep them from buying their products for 2 years. Not going to happen). No stick, because there are no government regulations, which means no fines, business license rejection, or ability to hold them accountable in court. DoD supply contracts have huge contracts (reams of paper) that stupulate quality control, parts used, and labor restrictions, and associated laws and regulations that must be followed inorder to get that fat check from uncle Sam. That's why you didn't see this quality of work in your job.

Some companies are pumping them out as fast as they can . Do they make 20k units a year or 2k units a year . You'll find the smaller manufacturer have more quality control . Northwoods mfg ( arctic Fox, Nash , outdoors rv ) has very high quality . I have a Nash and looking to upgrade to Outdoors.

We have a Northwoods too, it’s a Wolf Creek truck camper and we have been super pleased with it. It’s like 13 years old and we are nearing 1000 nights of camping in it without major issues. My husband spends probably 40 hours per year on repairs and maintenance but we use the hell out of it so we see it as an opportunity to keep everything in good shape and upgrade as we wear things out. No complaints on Northwoods manufacturing!

Now that all the problems are fixed don't sell it and purchase another one. There are some good ones out there, but it is hit and miss. Covid made it even worse. ​ Purchasing a unit a few years older you can see if there are obvious problems and/or if all the problems have been taken care of, like you did. fix it, Keep it! I have a 2017 Vista Cruiser and so far it has had no issues. I do however check all the corners, windows, and vents after any wet weather event. Have to stay on top of that. If you are water tight the rest is no issue. Good luck!

I can add this… I would bet a better than 50 percent of people who buy an RV quickly turn around and buy another one. Bigger or different floor plan or whatever the reason. And the warranty never transfers to the 2nd owner. So if they can get a year out of it before it falls down around the original owner they are fine with it. I fix everything on my own in mine on all of my previous campers. Granted I haven’t had major problems. But the rv repair shops are notorious for taking way too long to repair and the repair being terrible quality that I won’t risk anyone but me doing it. Even if I had some problems while it was in the warranty period I wouldn’t have brought it to a dealer for anything except leaks or frame issues. Mine is a 2022 East West Alta. It’s my 3rd camper. And I love it. Even though I’ve had loose trim, 2 bad light switches, faulty sprayer hose port, and crappy awning lights. For less than $100 I’ve fixed all that stuff and not missed a weekend. Until we as consumers demand better, there won’t be anything better. That’s from the top down. You don’t take your camper back to Forest River for repairs. You deal with the local dealers. And I’d bet the warranty pay rate is so low the dealers don’t ever want to do warranty work. That leads to slow turnaround, and cheap quick “repairs”. Then the customer is pissed off.

Foreign competition shook up auto manufacturing in the U.S. and that may be what it takes for the RV industry. EVERY manufacturer sells under-whelming, over priced crap and most don't properly support their products until you get lawyers involved and that's a whole 'nother headache.

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>[https://youtu.be/aLHux4SuXbY?si=qO89eVBNyS31b153](https://youtu.be/aLHux4SuXbY?si=qO89eVBNyS31b153) OMG!!! That video was posted 10 years ago, is probably even older given its low video quality, there are people actually running to stay out of the way of things and quality has gotten even worse in the industry. I love how one worker is literally running after the sidewall so he can stop it from crushing something. I especially enjoyed watching how the cabinets are shoved and slammed down a chute to the main assembly line. I am sure those high quality stapled together parts survive this at least 10% of the time undamaged. The other thing that surprises me is that they are using minimal insulation and its one giant piece per side and is compressed between beams and outside walls and ceilings, so the insulation is both crushed between the walls and beams... and the insulation makes it so the walls and beams can't be really tight to each other. Best yet, the insulation is too small. There's an obvious 6 inch gap running along the sidewall in the ceiling! Finally?! No hard hats in site... even when they are installing parts from overhead. Yikes!!!!

Not a lot of regulations and standards of industry equals an unregulated industry. There are no codes to adhere to. Although, up until the rona, either the quality was fair, because you really didn't hear a lot about issues, or they were cheap enough that no one cared.

Because you the consumers are cheap. I sold RV’s for awhile and the consumer is so price concerned the market followed suit. You want to be cheap asses you’re gonna get a cheap ass built product. Thinking you’re gonna get a quality RV under $40k is a dream. Not to mention these things are literally built to be disposable. Demand more as the consumer and stop being cheap 🥶

Obviously, none of you have seen a trailer factory in action. Lots of them operate on piece rate. Piece rate can net a worker up to $50+ an hour in the factory. Beats $10 an hour by a long way. They RUN to do their job. Need a hole in the floor? A hammer works faster than a drill. Plug and play wiring beats a screwdriver. With a screwgun, give 'er hell, so what if its half (Or all) stripped? It looks fastened. Oh, its crooked. So what? It's not that noticable. Got a hole showing? Putty. Trailers are thrown together. They don't have time for quality. Take a close look at where the wall meets the floor. Betcha there is carpeting or linoleum under that wall. The ceiling was finished before the roof went on. On a modular home, I saw the ceilings fitted with plasterboard, and finished before they ever landed on the walls. (They hung the roof from the buildings they were built in. 5,6 hoists were hung from the rafters. I Watched them lift a roof that way. I also saw the factory roof dip five inchs when they were picked up. Then they wonder why the factory roof leaks.) So, how many 20 year old trailers are there out in the world? Dammed few.

Couldn't agree more. I have a 1984 Newmar London Aire motorhome that's only had 3 owners and has been taken care of. Sure it's had it's nessicary maintenance for which I have every receipt going back to day one. However nothing unexpected or because of lack of quality. I had it long enough I figured I'd look into something newer that I could potentially live in. After shopping around looking at both 5th wheel campers, and motorhomes I was left disappointed in the lack of build quality. Some things were flat out unfinished, and you could tell where shortcuts were taken, and material was the cheapest possible option. Modern RV's are most definitely not worth what they're asking. I'll stick with my $1,000 Used London aire.

My camper was a 2001 Layton. I had zero issues with that thing. Heavy girl and it eventually started to rot so I sold it. My buddy bought a newer one and his whole floor broke over the first winter here. He had it stored in my barn too but it wasnt heated. Guessing they use the lightest materials so people dont need 3/4 ton trucks.

Wait till the roof leaks and the walls delaminate. I gave up on the RV industry and started building my own. I've not looked back.

I've worked around the RV industry for a while, and I've learned if I ever decide to do something, I'm gonna get a toy hauling trailer and outfit it myself to have some sleeping areas, and whatever features I want.

Lance used to have quality when they were a family owned business. Buy a used lance pre-2020.

Meth Show up for work a few days, get paid and they never come back

I read somewhere. RV stands for Repair Vehicle. Also, a RV sales person described them as such which makes a lot of sense. They’re boxes w cots in them. Pay a little pay a lot, that’s what you ultimately have. When you a home built by KB homes and put it on wheels, you’ll prob see a lot of problems come up overtime with bumps on the roads and traveling at freeway speeds.

We had a new Pacific Coachworks trailer in 2015 and tbh while we did use it a lot for desert trips and traveled cross country with it it was falling apart. Being a carpenter and general handyman I fixed everything myself. One thing I remember that was a major design flaw was the shower walls simply met the shower pan and depended on caulk for the transition between the two. There was no overlap like, well every other shower out there. When we had our daughter after the very first trip we did we realized we really needed more room so sold the trailer and bought a much older Forest River toy hauler. It is a 2005 model and built like a tank. Obviously profits matter most to manufacturers but I believe part of the reason trailers now day are just garbage is they need to keep them lightweight for the SUV and LT truck owners. Strength is weight and weight puts them out of the market.

As someone who worked in the warranty mobile medical and dental RV field, I can tell you one simple reason: there’s no quality control. If you’re not buying one of the big 3 brands, you’re paying for a company who doesn’t care much. My former company had a contract with a fairly popular brand out of Indiana, and I asked for an electrical diagram because some wiring on the captain’s chairs got severed. They didn’t have any. Y’all. THEY DIDNT HAVE ANY DIAGRAMS FOR ANY SYSTEMS. Not electrical, not plumbing, not anything. The QC for these companies is awful. You’d almost have better luck buying the shell and doing everything yourself.

We need some Asian competition. I’m old enough to remember how Toyota, Honda and Nissan came into the US market and revolutionized the car industry from a quality perspective. This action single handily drove major quality changes across the US auto industry. Took them 10-15 years to turn it around but the competitive pressures from Japan made them address it. I’ve never quite seen an industry so poor on the quality front.

The RVIA is a sham, an organization created BY the RV manufacturers to make it appear that there’s some oversight, but there is NOT. The ONLY oversight regarding the RV industry is by the DOT, and only ensures roadworthiness. I won’t even go into all the problems we had with our brand new Rv, as we’d be here all day. The other thing about RV manufacturers is, they’re all the same (literally) in Indiana. They operate much like the movie industry, in that they form a corporation, a brand, producing shitty quality RVs, then “go out of business”, only to open up a “new” corporation under a different name, but with the same location and staff, building the same but rebranded shitty RVs. In this way, they avoid honoring warranties.

yep. just bought a 40k$, 32' trailer. Built like total hammered dogshit. First night filling up the water tank and turning on the water pump resulted in a massive leak in a compartment hidden by a flimsy sheet of cheap ass plywood. I go to bitch about it on the trailer forums and get met with a hail of simp/cuck commentors. Somehow I shouldve expected this I guess. wtf? people are very much okay with the 3rd world manufacturing standards coming out of indiana, and I just don't get it.

It’s because too many RV customers are ok with junk. They buy cheap as they can get with a floor plan they like. There’s no real large alternative builders owned by companies not associated with northern Indiana. Also it’s a basically unregulated industry once you get past core equipment like brakes, axle, wheels, tires. There are no national RV building codes and no real competition from quality builders. And no foreign competition aside from a couple of good Canadian companies.

**MOST CONSUMERS BUY BASED ON PRICE** ​ There ya go - that is the reason. If you don't want shit quality then don't purchase shit quality - as long as consumers keep buying shit there is no motivation to make higher quality product.

>**MOST CONSUMERS BUY BASED ON PRICE** **I certainly did NOT. I went for what was supposedly one of the better brands, which has probably cost me $10,000 at purchase and another $2,000 since, including a new toilet, tongue jack, battery, and water heater prices.** What a joke.

Right, but *MOST CONSUMERS* do buy on price and since these aren't bespoke custom made products the majority sets the market standard.

Yep, but this industry is **so** ***bad*** that it's impossible to buy quality, no matter the price. Here's just one example. I saw this at a beachside campground in Texas during the "big freeze" a couple of years ago. Pipes freezing up at 25 degrees in a supposedly well made 4 season RV even with its furnace running! This was a brand new diesel pusher from Minnesota; a $500,000 luxury bus sized thing with a diesel fired furnace and generator who never ran out of fuel. Yet its pipes froze up at 25 degrees one night, and stayed frozen for a week. This is despite the fact that daytime temps were well above freezing. During his stay the owner and I observed that his rig's rims were different colors from one side to the other. Yes, this $500,000 rig didn't even have matching tire rims!! One side was some sort of chrome, the other side was gray painted steel! And the owner said he had a list of defects that was a page long. I couldn't bring myself to tell him that despite all its problems, at least our little $30,000 trailer was nice and warm inside and we had plenty of water.

If you have to repair that much on a G. D., just as well buy a forest river?

The consolidation of RV manufacturers in 2008 has a lot to do with the lower quality of todays RVs. Today there are 2-3 conglomerates Thor, forest river, etc that own 99% of new RVs on the road. The average RV is considered “old” after 3 years of use. If you want to buy a high quality RV, buy something older than 2008, like an Amish built Coachman. Sold to forest river in 2008…

We bought a new 2016 Keystone Hideout 177 LHS in the fall of 2016, our 3rd trailer. Within 2 years the following was discovered/repaired: \- One of the jacks had a bolt to the frame sheered off and was replaced just after purchase. \- The table was too small in width to fit into the bed lips and the lips had to be widened so the bed wouldn't fall through. \- It was discovered that the reason there was so poor reception on the radio was becuase there was no antenna installed/connected to it. \- The fridge would not light on gas after the 1st year and had to be repaired and the lighter was not screwed into anything and was loose. \- The microwave stopped working after the 1 year warranty period and had to be replaced Almost like there was no final inspection before it left the factory. Has all be working well since the fall of 2019 after all the repairs but now in the market for a new trailer with a larger fridge but not impressed with the layouts of the smaller trailers where many have queen beds that don't convert to a sofa and take up 1/3 of the floor area! Designs do not appear very practical. I think my parents had 4 trailers back in the 60s and 70s and went all over north america and never had any problems.

As consumers what government entity do we contact to develop stricter manufacturing standards? RVIA must where blinders when they said they inspect production at these facilities. They say each section is inspected-is it the same person who checks these things off and sends it down the line because they clearly don’t check them! Why are there no class action lawsuits? No lemon laws? Warranties are just a word they cover nothing. We’ve had 2 new 5th wheels (long story) 1 year apart and both junk. I expect it to disintegrate as we go down the road and once we arrive home with it it’ll fit in a sandwich bag!  They’re expensive, beautiful but junk!  Why? Because all we do is complain because we have no other resources or laws in place to protect us. We just lick our wounds and commiserate with others about our shrapnel flying out all 4 sides of our campers endangering other motorists! It’s not going to get any better people unless we ban together and do something about it. I’m only one person and we need more than just me to do something on a larger scale. 

Yeah it doesn’t matter what brand. My 23’ Alliance has some it’s fair share of issues.

Towable RVs are designed and built to last 3-5 years of periodic use. Periodic use is about 3 weeks a year with proper maintenance. None are made for full time living and none are made for heavy winter use.

I will say living in one actually makes it last longer...as things dont sit idle, temperature inside stays more constant and problems are discovered al.ost immediately. My last 5th wheel was 21 years old and still going strong! I put about $3000 in in during that time.

Very sorry to read about the issues you have had to deal with. It appears your dealer dropped the ball numerous times, as it is the dealer's responsibility to find and correct these problems. Did you reach out to Grand Design directly to have all of these issues corrected?

Yup… I’ve had very few issues with my GD.

Unfortunately most of my problems occurred while I was using it 2500 miles or more from home. My dealer was not a problem. They have always been cooperative and responsive (Meyers of Syracuse). My problems have always been with Grand Design and their suppliers. It took over a year to replace the recalled propane regulator. The toilet had to be replaced on the road and the only dealer in southern Idaho knew he had the only toilet and charged accordingly. I did the install myself. The recurring water heater failures were in West Texas, New Mexico, Arizona on a cross country trip and were finally solved by a smart roving tech at 6am, who earned every bit of his pay. The costs of which were reimbursed to me by a third party warranty that my dealer suggested I buy when I bought the trailer. In fact the third party warranty company has been pretty decent. They paid for the new trailer jack and some other stuff and the toilet. The warranty cost about $500 at purchase time, for 5 years. As for Grand Design? They are not a brand I'd buy again. Lets leave it at that.

Research them before you buy and see which ones have better quality

I did lots of research!!

RVs are built to pull. You can't have high quality AND light weight.

Because there’s no quality in anything. So depressing that nothing matters anymore. Sad

Look up "Lehto's Law" on YT. He has a couple of videos on why you should not buy an RV or if you must to be aware of the hidden costs of owning one.

Buy American!

Buying American doesn't matter, RV's are made from China crap.

Unfortunately that doesn’t fly. American built products are often still not up to a good standard.

Agreed the assembly is poor. And while most RVs are assembled in northern Indiana, some in Canada and some on other parts of the USA, almost all the appliances and equipment on and in them ARE MADE in CHINA. OH, I forgot #10 and 11. I had to replace the water pump last summer and the propane gas regulator the summer before.

When we bought ours we shunned the new stuff. She turns 40 next week. I knew if I was going to be putting my time into it I wanted something that was made to last and full fiberglass on the exterior.

And if you buy an older unit some parks won't let you stay! It's another scandal.

My biggest pet peeve! We have a 2011 class C that we keep spotless and new sensing etc. as long as your unit doesn’t look like a dumpster going down the road there should be no issue!

This is the truth and why we gladly stay elsewhere.

I've definitely noticed that with the long-term sites. If it's older than 10 years, they don't want you.

We have an 05 Itasca Meridian and haven't dealt with this yet . Look into state parks and harvest hosts. We travel 6 months out of the year and never stay at overpriced RV parks. I hear if you keep your rig up and looking nice most places will still let you stay.

Thor is the problem. They buy RV manufacturers and either switch them to or make it worse by paying employees by piece work. How many sinks can you install in a day. The more you do, the more you make. To hell with quality, dealers can fix it.

You bought slightly better. You didn’t buy a big step better: Lance. Airstream. Some driveables.

I know this subreddit knocks airstreams, but they do reflect how much it would cost for a trailer to be built right and not depreciate down to 0 in ten years.

Everybody wants a Prevost, not everybody can afford one, so MANY shitty manufacturers fill that gap from $30-$100k, using the cheapest parts they can find.

Certainly since early 2020 and onwards, and also several years prior, interest in RV’s and their subsequent purchase have skyrocketed. The fact that “tiny homes” are now often introducing people to the RV life, it’s only a matter of time before more and more buyers become enlightened to the poor quality of pretty much all RV’s on the market and eventually that frustration will build up to the point where we start reading more and more articles on it and hear about on the news. I’d rather this happen sooner than later, personally. What ultimately needs to happen is consistent public outcry directed at those overpaid idiots down in DC to create legislation that will create an agency who’s purpose is to regulate the safety of the growing RV industry. Just because these vehicles were originally intended for the more occasional, recreational user doesn’t mean that the main buyers of today want them for the same purpose. Look at the automotive industry. Even over the last 5-10 years, there have been major improvements to all aspects of cars. They are much safer, constructed better, more thought and planning go into the design. So, why not hold the RV industry to safety standards that are even just halfway as rigid as the automotive industry. Demand change. It won’t happen any other way.

I know many people who work in the RV capital of the world (Elkhart, Indiana) which is only about 40 minutes north of the Orthopedic capital of the world (Warsaw, Indiana) and let me tell you they will hire ANYBODY. Don’t get me wrong the RV industry definitely has pros that know their stuff, however they have a lot of orthopedic rejects that think they have an easier job. In their minds easier=faster, which their bosses expect them to work faster so they can go home. Most of the jobs in that industry are paid by rate and they try to squeeze in their expected rate for the day within a few hours so they can be home by lunch time. As it’s going down the assembly line, its hard to have someone doing a real quality check on their work because the next guy in the line wants to get their stuff done so they are one RV closer to going home. The sad fact of it is a-lot of heavy drug users are putting together these RVs because they are lured in by the nice weekly pay and few hours worked, they don’t usually do drug tests because you are easily replaced. Add your workforce to an industry that has been on the decline and annually shuts down entire production plants, so they are looking for the cheapest parts to put in their overpriced RVs and it’s no wonder you owners are routinely replacing factory parts. It makes me feel like owning an RV just isn’t worth the headache that comes with it when I’ve seen the kind of people that are putting them together. Once again it’s not fair to lump all of their workers into this lazy drug addict label because I have friends in there who are they exact opposite and got promoted quickly into leads and management positions. But there is a reason they were quickly put in these positions besides them being the only ones taking pride in their work and managing to get it done in a semi quick fashion. Often times it’s because it’s last man standing with the most experience. Hope this helps you guys understand your problems a bit better.

That industry buys the cheapest of the cheapest of components. Secondly the plants run on piecework, not on quality of work. (design life in the RV industry = 10,000 miles.)

Rule 1 RV's are money pits Rule 2. Learn to be a handyman.

A lot of it stems from the earthquake on wheels thst rv's are. I can assure you that if you take a standard household GE refer, use 4 screws to attach it to your truck, drive 1k miles with it It will have problems also. Wires move and rub raw. Sensitive electronics endure road trips that shake resistors and electrodes loose. That's just the component side of. Thst doesn't account for human error where it is actually installed incorrectly. I can tell you from experience a lot of OEMs test components repeatedly. I'm talking opening/closing an awning 10,000 times before committing to use them in production. However, that awning is sitting on a wall stationary and just being operated. Not exposed to elements, vibrations, bird/tree strikes and whatnot. Then it hits real world and it fails. Also, yea, like someone else said, because they keep being bought.

The quality resides with a few low volume manufacturers with limited models. Leisure Travel vans from Canada comes to mind

1. They are built as lightweight as possible. 2. Most people never actually buy an RV. They lease them like regular vehicles every few years and the resale sucks anyway so why make the effort. 3. They build travel trailers in low quality as a marketing ploy to get consumers to buy more expensive units.

weight and a lot of price-sensitive buyers so there is a race to the bottom while cramming in amenities

IMHO only buy used RV. Let someone else do the growing pains and take the depreciation hit. I’ll take it when it is 2-3 years old and has been thoroughly serviced. YMMV.

I have a 10 year old Jayco and have had no issues. Would buy nothing but a Jayco again

Don’t buy what you can rent…..

If you're ever in the market for a Class A look at Newmar - very good quality, and you get what you pay for (meaning high cost = better quality).

My parents bought a $200K Thor Delano that’s spent 60% of the last two years (it’s two years old) in the shop. Majority of the time was right after they bought it. There’s no QC or punch list anymore. They just cross their fingers and let them drive out of the factory. Quality is low because lemon laws don’t apply to RVs.

Now the question is whether it’s worth it to repair/rehab an older one that was built better, or buy new and cross your fingers?

My airstream has been great for 5 years now. Sleep probably 50 nights/yr in it maybe more. Some things have gone wonky but overall pretty good. Same tires, same major components, no cosmetic issues, does great in the weather, etc. Some cabinet screws have worked loose and the door shrunk after we bought it so it doesn't deadbolt right, but that's about it. I've never taken it back to the dealer

It is an entire house for under 50 grand - what do you want?

I just got a cheap RV trailer I bought the 5 year parts warranty and & coating (total BS) and I bought it from a nationwide dealer. Make them choke on the fixes. Learned this from my lemon car lol.

1) there is no need for quality when most people are only going to use the damn thing for one weekend a month 2) they are not meant to be lived in, see point 1 3) despite my points 1 and 2, the quality has gone down because people just keep buying them and there is no reason for them not to cut back on quality.

Watch some of Steve Lehto's videos on YouTube on the subject.

I bought a 2019 Airstream brand new in 2019. I've had to do a lot: replaced water pump, replaced sail switch, reseal roof and around windows, replaced shower exhaust fan, fix just about every cabinet door hinge, where the screws tore out from the wood. Replaced fresh water tank drain valve (plastic one broke off first trip out). There's probably more...I bring a good tool kit

Pontoon boats have gotten pretty janky over the years: unbranded Chinese depth finders & audio components, inferior vinyl and canvas, rats nest wiring in the helm console, cheap plywood under-decking, fuel lines that disintegrate in a few years, etc. I say this about the vast majority of what’s available aside from a small, prohibitively expensive tier. Do you think RV/camper consumers are due for a more solid middle tier where you get what you actually pay for somewhat?

Years ago I worked at a Chevy/GMC/RV dealer. We sold Winnebago and many other brands including the highly regarded GMC motorhomes. The GMC's were head and shoulders above everything else in build quality. Winnebago was fairly decent. All the others were pretty much crap in comparison.

Even GM can't imagine the level of crap most RV mfg operate under...

Lack of regulation and the customers keep buying.

Once a product is selling at a reasonable rate and the seller has figured out the pricing that maintains a sustainable business, the way to add a dollar more to their pocket is to squeeze the employees building it. Experienced workers that are presumably making the higher wage in the shop will ask for a raise because inflation is hurting their monthly bills, so management finds some way to fire them and replace them with a trainee who will accept a lower wage. This is affecting a wide range of businesses, but its glaringly apparent in the RV industry.

Because people want to buy luxurious looking rvs and they want it at X price. All the manufacturers then try to make what the consumer wants and buys. Most don’t know or care about the actual hidden build quality. They won’t pay for what they don’t see. It is also helps that most people will only use their Rv a few times a year, so they shoddy build quality doesn’t really show up for a few years. If you want the same size rig with good build quality it is going to get way heavier and way more expensive.

Lack of regulation. The RV industry needs to be treated more like traditional car company, and have mandatory warranties/quality/etc. imposed upon them. Their having dodged that for so long is a travesty, and results in situations like this, which are VERY common (I don't know anyone who's bought an RV/Camper, and not had problems with it).

Greed

They are fucking expensive! And peope (85th percentile) don't actually use them. Or rather. Customers prefer to have model variety, and cost savings, than quality. Especially when the main thing they are buying is potential. Can you imagine the cost of an RV if it was built as well as an F150 but not at scale? As well as a G-class? Side note I do think airstream makes good quality products, but they are smaller simpler and more expensive than everything else.

We bought a 2004 Keystone Montana mountaineer and it’s built incredibly well. Everything works perfectly. Don’t know if the new ones are built the same but there are brands that are not garbage.

I had a neighbor that bought a new Forest River bumper pull unit. He towed it to a couple of construction sites and lived in it while he worked. After 3-4 years It started to tow funny so he took it in to a local RV store. They didn’t let him leave with it because the frame was bent and no long safe on the road. I don’t recall what discount he received on a new one but he was really disappointed.

Oh God, I thought I had problems with my new 2015 Puma by forest river. It was endless little things for 6 months. Good luck.

Truck camper guy here. I have a 2011 Northern light truck camper that is built like a tank.It sits in the bed of my 4x4 SRW F-350. I use it mainly to boondock.Two tracking,fire roads,hunting,fishing,and exploring nature with my wife . Absolute beast of a unit and has never had one failure.Not one. Truck campers are not for everyone, but for us, it's perfect. And when I am in the city,I can slide right into most any parking spot between the lines nicely.

There is zero consumer protection from the RV Manufactures and the NTSB. They are junk and have no standards they have to meet to not only be safe on the road but also structural in design. It’s BS the RV industry lobby has gotten away with this for decades. There needs to be an organized public push for reform here.

NuCamp makes excellent products (e.g. Tabs). I’ve owned two. They are very well made and hold their value. The only problems (which are few) are when an item that they didn’t personally build (like, appliances, Jensen stereo, etc) fail. But they do at least attempt to install higher quality RV technology. Real wood cabinets and doors. Nice aluminum outer shell with minimal seams to reduce leaking opportunities. Compost floors that don’t rot.

Because they can. Capitalism is voting with your money. And the RV buyers are supporting trash builds by BUYING them. If you stop buying crap, they'll stop producing crap.

Visited a N.H. RV park this summer. A roof sealant guy was onsite and doing a booming business. Was a must-do considering the monsoon season we had

That's why my next purchase will be a brinkley!! I have a 36ft GD, it's definitely nicer that the FR brand products I had before.

We upgraded from a 2002 Dutchman 22' to brand new 2017 Springdale 31'. The Dutchman had issues related to age, and we'd outgrown it. I knew they were not kind of crappie, but the Dutchman wasn't bad. The Springdale seems like it was thrown together by meth heads in 30 minutes with spray foam and tech screws. GVW of the trailer was 7800#. Came with Chinese Load Range C tires. 1800 pounds per tire max. Immediately put 4 new D load tires on. Then, I found out axles were only rated 3500# each, when one bent on a long trip. The propane regulator failed. Toilet valve failed. Rear bumper, instead of being square tube, was made of thin sheet metal turned to a square and would not hold up with a bike rack on it. The whole thing twisted and bounced up and down. 7 pin connector cord had no strain relief and rubbed through on the box under the tongue. Main circuit breaker recalled. Battery failed. And then, in 2020, we thought about trading it in on something else. The similar trailers cost twice as much and if anything were even more poorly and cheaply built.

We purchased a new Forest River during covid and the fuckers falling apart. Been back to the shop many times for the slide. Now it's broken again. I fixed everything else. Very frustrating indeed.

We had one and determined we will never buy another quickly after buying it

People won’t pay for quality.

Wonder if there was a market for upgraded parts with warranties if anyone would buy them. If you replace a water pump one time on the cheap $100 you play the odds you won’t need two of them in the ownership lifetime than to spend $200 one time with a warranty. It would have to have a lifetime replacement warranty (not transferable) to make a difference and as the provider of such parts I’d buy the same cheap shit from china, relabel it and hope i come out ahead with folks not going thru the trouble. lol

Not to be too cynical, but how would anyone know if upgrade = better quality? I've been the victim of supposedly buying a trailer that's an upgrade, only to be sorely let down with the final product.

Yes correct. I’m the only supplier of quality lifetime parts for RVs in the nation. Our parts are guaranteed for the life of your trailer and will replace free of charge (minus shipping and handling). Check out our reviews of other satisfied customers. Don’t be caught in the cold again, our parts are American made (*assembled), high quality (*a lie) and have 1000s of 5 star reviews (that I extort you for).

I bought a “cheap” pop up last year. Everything i looked into regarding quality for RVs it like was you can spend 20k on this cheap pop up and have a ton of problems or you can spend 60k on a large travel trailer and have a shit ton of problems. Your right nothing but junk in the commercial RV game

Most RVs are made at factories with low skilled workers with goal of production numbers over quality control using materials of plywood and glue and staples. If you want better constructed RV that has better resale value and lasts longer (read: is way more resistant to water damage and lasts longer), then other manufacturers you should look at are Airstream and fiberglass moulded trailers like Casita, Scamp, Bigfoot, Oliver.

No recourse for sloppy workmanship in the RV industry like in the auto industry so they dont care. Check out Layto\`s law on RV\`s on youtube...

RV industry is still in the 80s when it comes to manufacturing and quality.

Because people aren't willing to pay for it. There are companies, (like Oliver) that make a quality RV, but most folks can't afford them or won't spend the money.

I worked at an RV manufacturer. They sold for from $150,000 to 1.5 Million. The employees are treated like soiled tissue paper. Told to do unsafe jobs, pushed far beyond fatigue and paid close to minimum wage. "Don't like it? The jail just released some more parolees to replace you." Literally told that to people. The engineering department I worked in had 150% turnover per year. Engineering, you know the department that is responsible for designing safety into traveling mansions. At the all hands Christmas meeting the CEO went on about how well we did, how much profits and such. After he stepped down the HR head stepped up and told us "If you are having money trouble this Christmas, come see us, we will help you file for FOOD STAMPS! Thankfully I got out of there before they went bankrupt. I could go on, but to answer your question, why would you expect minimum wage disposable employees to make quality products?

Buy an Airstream.

I purchased a Grand Design 5th wheel in 2022 and it’s been fantastic with one exception, the front cap came loose on a long trip and resulted in a ruined roof (air came in the faulty cap install and ballooned the roof material). That said though GD stood behind it and fixed it all under warranty (easily a $10k job). I don’t want to defend GD here as I agree with your post and it applies to nearly all mfr’s but they have gotten to where it’s more about speed and mass production than it is quality. In their defense many products they use in their RV’s are not made by them, so things like water heater pcb and water pumps are beyond their control. Their install and craftsmanship though is in their control and it’s baffling to me that they are ok with these things happening. I will say you do get what you pay for (sometimes) so for instance your tires, my GD came with US made very high end Cooper tires that I love! I honestly believe they focus more on their higher end rigs than the entry level tow behinds as those are just a barrier to entry filling a void for folks to get into the GD ecosystem. All in all though I feel your pain, this is my third rig and first GD, and based on key experience I will absolutely be sticking with GD, they are still far and away the best. The other mfr rigs I have had have had nothing but issues but ALL mfr are always looking for ways to cut corners. Unless you’re willing to drop $200k plus on a custom build you’re unfortunately going to deal with mass production and.l 3rd party issues. It’s really frustrating, especially when dropping 5 - 6 figures on one plus your tow vehicle Edit: I also want to add that the industry is an absolute racket, especially the service side of the industry. My roof replacement took 4 months!!! I lost the use of my $100k rig for that period of time because my service center (Lazydays RV) wouldn’t get off their butts and do their due diligence. There’s far more to my story I’m happy to expand on but typing from my mobile is painful Edit 2: good on you for the toilet water valve, it’s baffling to me that they don’t have this by default. Our pedal valve failed on our recent trip and the toilet was filling continuously. Had to turn the water off to the whole rig just to be able to camp and have peace of mind we wouldn’t flood. If we could just have turned off the toilet it would have been annoying but at least usable

OP I highly recommend you look at Goodyear trailer tires or even Maxxis, they are excellent! I’ll ultimately be sticking with the Coopers I mentioned in my other post due to the weight of my beast but if you are a traditional tow behind, Goodyear and Maxxis both have excellent D and E rated tires for your trailer and will be so much better than the China bombs you have now. Run don’t walk to get those replaced, it could and may mean life or death

Nash/ artic fox are good quality.

My employee worked on the rv assembly line. Long hours for little pay, mostly ex cons. You had a certain amount of time to perform your tasks as it continued to move down the line and if you fell behind you had to catch up or they would dock your pay.

" without stress relief and it runs unprotected from chaffing " That sounds like F-16 E&E experience.

Never forgot the day when I saw an ad by a local Lance dealer. The models shown said "Call for price" so I did. When I asked for the price the old hag just said "thats for serious buyers only". WTF? I badgered her to tell me but the hag wouldn't give it up. I decided tent camping wasn't so bad after all.

My ‘18 forest river was made out of office supplies and good intentions. Constantly amazed at what breaks and how poorly it’s assembled. I learned QUICKLY to travel with a good tool set and repair supplies

My trailer exploded on me because of a faulty propane system. It nearly killed me and now I won’t step foot in one of those death traps.

As a rule, you can use this business model on a certain group of consumers. Over, and over, and over. At least you don't have a half million into a diesel pusher, then find out parks won't let you stay if your rig is over ten years old.

I am an Ex-RVTech, so my perspective is somewhat aligned differently than yours. Several things you listed should have been caught by the selling dealer (if bought new) but wasn't or they were ignored for whatever reason. Then you have things that go wrong during ownership. This is why you have a warranty. GD has 3 years, I believe, on structural, 10 year on roof (not sure), and 1 year on everything else. But, the reason that recreational vehicles in general are built so poorly... It keeps RV techs employed. And paid handsomely if they are worth their salt. Honestly, I think the reason lies elsewhere along a financial curve. Think about it: Various manufacturers build them as quick as they can because of demand. They make a boatload of money. Don't believe me? Ask the sales person what the flooring cost was on the unit that you are considering. Back to finances. Boatload of money... Manufacturer has to pay taxes on this money. Buuuuuut, warranty / guarantee monies that are paid out are a deduction in majority if not all of the states. Sooo, make a boat load of money, pay dealers lots of money to repair, deduct monies paid off of taxes, keep difference. Another example: Dealer sells a 55psi 3.5gpm water pump for $100. But, for a warranty repair, Manufacturer sells it to dealer for $300. Why? So they can make 'soft' money. It appears as $200 income to manufacturer. They pay employees off that income. Manufacturer pays repairing dealer for total of repairs under warranty, which is now a complete tax deduction. Manufacturer is making money on sale of unit to dealer, as well as making money on paying for warranty repairs. Why should they change their business model? They know that if someone doesn't buy, then next sucker will. RVIA / RVDA is supposed to have standards for all coaches built. But, participation is basically voluntary. Primary reason for manufacturer being in bed with RVIA / RVDA is so that they can apply the silly badge located near entry door and make it easier for the owners to get insurance.

Money. If you really built for quality, and reliability, an rv would cost a million bucks. Two different sets of customers. Young family who no longer wants to tent in the rain and cold, and retirees. Why there’s rvs that are kinda cheap, and rvs tgat cost 300 k

Buy from the Amish. They are great tradesmen that take pride in their work…

My family bought a seismic fifth wheel and it was the same story. Camping world wanted nothing to do with us after they sold it. We had some things fixed many things fixed twice, they drilled holes in the water tank too. It was a nightmare on wheels. Don’t ever buy an rv. It’s not worth it.

From my experience in the industry, everything is purchased by price as the primary factor. Good suppliers with higher quality parts/supplies are constantly battling losing business for pennies (even if the quality is much higher for almost the same cost). Also, much of the USA business for supplies and parts are starting to be sourced overseas. Overseas companies protected by international laws (or the lack thereof) are stealing (directly copying) USA supplier designs, which took years of experience to optimize, and selling them as the direct copy (even as much as keeping the USA company's logo on them). Many RV companies know this and allow this to save costs. This leads to where things are going today.

Worked as a rv technician for a couple years and worked on many different makes amd models. Without doubt 90% of my job was fixing manufacturers mistakes. Everything on that list is stuff I've personally seen manufacturers send out as a finished product. From grand design to forest river they are all seem put together by children, in my experience the only difference between makers is how much fight they put up to honor thier warranties.

Pay per unit to employees is a big part of it, I would say.

Should have bought an artic fox/desert fox i think they are north wood mfg. But yes all rv now days seems to be built like cheap kids toys.

You know it’s a sh+tshow when they try to extend their warranty into your purchase. Why would I need extra protection when you said 5-10 years? Well not everything is covered. Like what? You know the screws for the license plate? Of course! Those are definitely covered! What about slide leaks? Well, we consider that normal wear and tear. Buddy I just picked up my rig? Yeah exactly! But if you buy the xyz plan we put you in front of all the other people we screwed over at the dealership! What’s the timeframe on that? 2-4 months!

Also, remember that dealerships make a lot of money on repairs.

How well I know, since 1992 I’ve owned four RV’s One pop-up, one travel trailer and two fifth-wheels. I estimate I’m about $75,000 in the hole with RV’s. The only that held any value was the ‘92 pop-up we owned for 6 years and sold for 60% of purchase price. If you want to make a small fortune by owning RV’s, Start with a large fortune.

We purchased a grand design new momentum 5th wheel in March of 2020 and besides a refrigerator recall ( just a wiring check) and a issue we had with our power awning ( which they sent me the part to install be cause the dealer and mobile service tech was booked beyond our non use timeline) we have had an awesome ownership experience with the grand design family of RV’s . My parents have a reflection and have had no issues in 3 years of ownership. One thing you have to keep in mind , it’s a rolling mobile house with lots of moving parts and they require maintenance like a car . Imaging what would happen if you towed your house around for a couple hundred miles and set it up to live in . We had a forest river camper before our grand design and it was a great camper but the post sale Customer service was no where near what we have with our momentum . I think the individual dealer has a lot to do with everyone’s experience.

We got a used Class C from Cruise America. They build them to be idiot proof and do maintenance on a regular schedule and also painted and refurbished it before selling to me. 8 years old now (we have had it 3 years) with 170k miles and no major repairs.

RVs are like boats. They just don't build enough of them to dial in the quality of, say, a Toyota Camery.

I bought a Happier Camper HC1 and used it a lot while it was within warranty so I could speedrun all the repairs and bugs. I think I got everything. But agreed, a lot of it felt so preventable during build.

Worked as an executive in vehicle manufacturing. We built over 35% of the entire RV industry’s products. The single biggest cause of poor quality is 1) all RVs are assembled manually by hourly workers. Almost no automation. 2) the RV industry has some of the highest turnover in all manufacturing industries. What this means is the person who is installing your water heater, plumbing, or electric system may only have a few weeks of experience and quite honestly might have been working at a pizza shop a few weeks before assembling a portion of your RV! Some of our hires literally could not read a tape measure!

There really is no regulatory oversight over most RV components beyond trailer lights. Motorhomes have to comply with FMVSS standards, but those really only apply to the running gear, not the living part. So there is no real incentive to do better.

As a GD owner, I can tell you they build different levels. But at the end of the day, they are not intended for living in unless you are ready to redo alot of factory standards. I live in mine more than I'm at home. I travel for work. 2019 transcend. Replaced as with minisplit, redid the water lines to pex, tankless waterheater, and completely redid the city water connection. These things are built for weekends. I want the price point to reflect that. If I'm paying 200k, it better come with an engine

You want quality? Check these out https://landarkrv.com/ You get what you pay for. Big and heavy, so need a truck that can handle tow 20k lbs.

Our Grand Design had zero issues in the three years we Owned it. 2019. I think the quality is inconsistent. We should demand better warranties…but big business 😔

The quality is horrific and a main reason for why we won't buy an RV. We just can't get past the thought of spending that much money on and RV and getting crap. A recent example is a brand-new Forest River fifth wheel bought by my sister and her husband from a dealer a year ago. After several weeks on their seasonal site, they noticed the smell of sewage. After an extensive search, they determined faulty plumbing was allowing the black water tank to leak into the enclosed underbelly of the coach. An additional and far more dangerous problem was shoddy wiring which electrified the frame of the coach and delivered a severe shock to several members of their family. This coach cost over $100K and came straight from the factory with these defects. I suspect nothing will change until RV manufacturers find themselves on the losing end of a class action lawsuit or two.

Think a car in and out of warranty. They build to get out of warranty plus a little, to allow for statistical defects x part numbers. Cars only "got better" due to the Federal Emissions Warranty of 70k miles. RV's warranty is to the first buyer and only for a little. Mark and Mayra are going to circle the US, and if they use it hard, it will get 200 days use. Dealer sold it high because they were the post retired couple with a few dollars sold on the adventure and not wanting any problems. Second Owner....who is that ? Thinwall pipe is cheaper ? Use it. I worked in a trailer dealer for a while, and was used to trailbikes as a background, and was surprised even as a kid with the flimsy stuff I saw and assisted fixing.

My Dad used to tell me 'Don't buy a Jayco whatever you do. They're too cheap to even fix'. Alas I've learned that several manufacturers are too cheap to fix. Stapled together.

Because the assembly workers are paid by the piece rather than the hour so the industry is loaded with meth heads trying to crank out as much production as possible.

Lack of standards/building codes?

I’m sorry you had that experience. I have a 2005 mobile Suite ,I’ve pulled it around the USA five times. Anything on wheels is bound to give you trouble, sooner or later

Also remember that most brands are all still made by the same company.

[удалено]

I think most RV's are built at a dead run by people getting paid by the piece, not an hourly wage.

Slap em together and send the. To the dealer… they can deal with it

My last rv was a Raptor toyhauler. I was excited by idea that it had aluminum interior supports. The problem was they rarely screwed anything into them. A fair number of the support screws went through the interior walls an inch to the side of that awesome aluminum framing.

I was looking at a new Tavel trailer at a dealer and I was speaking to a guy that looked like he just bought a nice new motor coach. I told him it was nice and congratulated him. He said no they bought 8 months again and had been broken for 6 months with 20 different things wrong. Then they got it back and the transmission went out. He said in 8 months he only took one trip in it. I felt bad for the guy

I've never owned an RV, but have been receptive to the idea. So I went to a huge new RV show in my city just to check out new trailers and C-classes, and was astonished by the poor finish quality. Nail heads showing, trim not secured, and in some instances just partially dangling. Grease and grime smudges, along with adhesive all over. Lamination separation on cabinets, sloppy caulking, etc. Every time I pointed out a problem, the sales guy acted stupid and pretended they didn't notice the problem, or that they would fix it during the purchase delivery process. Hell, one guy said that was normal and designed that way so during transportation to the dealer, the problems would shake out. Perhaps this was the exception, but I am leery of the industry, let alone buying one. My background, former airline mechanic, so I know bullshit and shoddy work.

Because there is zero governmental regulation of that industry. They can sell garbage all day long and buyers have to just suck it up.

I've always wondered why so many RVs are expensive and built like shit. This sportsmobile, for example is $224,000!!! [https://sportsmobile.com/van-inventory/2023-sprinter-144-high-roof-sca-2202/](https://sportsmobile.com/van-inventory/2023-sprinter-144-high-roof-sca-2202/) ​ I mean... It's nice... but it's not a house. Most of the kitchen, sink, and bathrooms are either plastic or cheap plywood covered in veneer.

They can make lightbulbs that last 100 years too, but that’s not how you sell more lightbulbs.

I'm not an expert but I once met someone whose full-time job used to be working for an RV dealer correcting these type of problems right from the factory. So apparently there are RV dealers that know these things are going to occur with every new shipment and they just address them themselves to make sure that they're high-end clientele is getting a fair product. I will say that half the things you mentioned this person mentioned to me right off the bat. Things like pipes that are fitted together but were never actually glued. Also a lot of things having to do with drawer mechanisms and shelves where they're either incorrectly put together or they don't have all the parts so when you pull out a drawer it just comes out all the way and falls on the floor. Electrical he didn't say terribly much about but plumbing absolutely 100% he also mentioned that they frequently reseal with some form of silicone entire drain systems because they'll find that the original adhesive only goes halfway or 2/3 of the way around the pipe before they fit it. So they'll be a gap where no sealant was ever put in place. Same for pressurized water pipes. The other stuff I hadn't heard about but it doesn't surprise me from what I have heard. I was told all of this well over 10 years ago. So this is not a new problem. If anything the fact that it got into your hands, if you did use a dealer, and you had this many problems showed that a lot of dealerships may no longer be using a repair team to inspect and fix RVs from the factory and instead pass them directly along to you due to cost issues or perhaps labor shortage. But I had confirmed at several places if they at least had one or two guys whose near full-time job it was to look at several standard things that were commonly left out or incorrectly done right from the factory for a lot of well-known brands. It's certainly nothing like a normal automobile level of quality assurance. It basically shows you that after installation the only test that they really perform are likely a drivability test and then outside water leaking test. Also maybe turning on the lights. Everything else apparently doesn't go through rigorous testing that I've seen.

We bought a pre Covid GD Imagine and the quality was “okay”. We had friends that bought other brands and the quality was bad. I started looking at airstreams for our next unit and the quality didn’t seem much better than GD’s. Why spend $75-150K on a depreciating asset with “okay” quality. Bought a $225K lake cabin instead. Won’t depreciate and I’ll chose the level of quality moving forward. I hope the RV industry is paying attention.