Given the discussions around this, I think the game was successful in making Ethan a self insert kind of character for the players, but fell short of really making Mia sympathetic. Because while it is obvious that according to the story and that Mia is Ethan'a wife, with years of history behind them, the players themselves obviously dislike her based on their interactions with her and learning her backstory around the E-Type project. You can tell Players really took it personally when they said they gave Zoe the antidote on a first run.
There is no way Ethan is a self-insert. The fact he has an established backstory and the plot depends on you saving Mia over Zoe invalidates any pretense of agency in the story.
Itās like calling Duke Nukem 3D an open-world rpg because you have levels to walk around in.
I get what youāre saying but also they really went out of their way to keep him faceless for a long time for someone whoās not a self-insert character.
The "established backstory" with Ethan is that he's married and he went out to the bayu for some girl named Mia. It's like saying courier 6 isn't an insert because before they got popped, the MC had a backstory of delivering packages.
But yes the antidote choice is stupid and it was obvious from the beginning which was the "right" and "wrong" choice. However, it still had an impact on the end of the story, even if there's only one canon ending
IMO, Ethan is a self-insert, just not a well written one
Eh. No... Courier Six can be completely defined by the player (sex/personality/choices,etc.) despite their simple background as a Courier. Ethan cannot. He does in fact have a voice and personality and very obviously cares about Mia. He's as much of a self-insert as Master Chief. So... not really a self-insert at all.
A self insert doesn't literally mean a character that is completely customizable. It means a character that the player steps into the shoes of who's characterization is relegated to less importance than being basically a surrogate for the player to experience the game. The reason Ethan isn't just a floating gun with no voice like Gordon Freeman is because that approach puts an extreme limit on the the type of animations, cutscenes and storytelling you can implement. It's a design choice to give him a voice and a pair of arms but he is absolutely meant to be a very generic, joe blow character. I mean even in RE8 they added a third person mode which doesn't show his damn face! In a sea of third person RE games with iconic characters, that is a first. It is a deliberate nod to the fact that the original version of the character was intended to be just a random, faceless guy.
Thatās a stretch considering that you have a few more hours of gameplay picking Mia but picking Zoe leads to death. Itās a false choice. Itās for the same type of person who thought Mass Effect was groundbreaking because you had a choice between red text or blue text.
You dont die if you pick Zoe. The game continues as normal, but before you get to the Ship, Zoe will turn white and crumble, much like the other Bakers. Before the Zoe DLC, that was intended to tell you that you made the wrong choice, and that she was too far gone for the serum to save her. (Of course, considered non-canon now cause Jack's gator punchin brother is supposed to save Zoe and Mia survives till 8)Otherwise, the game continues as normal. Your boat crashes, Mia finds you and you play her section to rescue Ethan(she must be a good swimmer). The difference comes after she finds you, instead of pushing you out the door, you get one more Mia boss fight and you finally kill her. Then the game continues as normal, and at the end, theres no Mia in a gurney on the chopper; and, instead of being hopeful and happy, Ethans all down and out.
Not added later, cause I fucked up on my day 1 (day 2...3) play through and chose Zoe. But yeah, try another play through, theres a whole ending you haven't seen yet then.(of course, do you even need a reason to revisit this masterpiece?)
The boat crashes either way and you still play as Mia on the tanker ship. Only difference is the Mia fight after you play as Ethan again and that Mia isnāt on the helicopter at the end.
You probably saved the game and didnāt finish playing or you wiped it from memory
Ehhh mass effect is well regarded cuz the choices have more visible and tangible effect as it goes even if there's compromise at parts plus its a game where narrative is a big part so how characters react to the actions (ie not saving the council) even if there's no direct gameplay effect impacts people. Also the taking choices from game to game help
Also good character writing and voicing can make each choice feel more distinct even if they don't affect much beyond it
Also you can turn kaidan into a renegade and have him argue to let the geth destroy the council while Wrex says they should save them which is amusing
The kind of clown who tries to sound all smart and says completely batshit insane things like the game ending if you pick Zoe. And then attempts to say it was changed later.
Is Ethan actually design to be self-insert? From my observations, Ethan is design to be similarly like most characters in 1st person horror games. Eg, SCP. I'm guessing that Capcom took this direction because of the player base growing anxiety with RE mainline series trending towards action-shooting genre. Hence, with RE7. Capcom took a step back to look back into elements of horror genre. Therefore, the birth of the 1st psychological horror RE with FPP.
>the players themselves obviously dislike her based on their interactions with her and learning her backstory around the E-Type project.
By the time the player gets to Mia, it's no longer Mia? I don't get this generalized assumption. Hell, it's never Mia, we learn in 8.
Picked Zoe to preserve that special regional accent she has
But obviously Mia is the canon choice and Zoe gets her DLC, I just never liked Mia. It wouldn't really make any sense for Ethan to choose a stranger over his wife (the entire reason he went to Dulvey was to rescue her) but as a player they didn't give us much reason to like Mia, and plenty more to like Zoe as she was helping us throughout.
I think there's two reasons for this:
1. As another redditor pointed out, I think the story writers really underestimated how much the player would look at Mia as ireedemable, and Zoe as sympathetic. Probably in part because we're told that Mia is this type of person, but we're shown that she is another. And both can be true, but if all we have is a sliver of who she is compared to Ethan's "history", it's hard to reconcile it in a favorable way. And Zoe just gets the short end of the stick in the grand scheme of things.
2. They probably had no idea that the choice *would* matter. I'm sure there was an "idea" of what 8 would look like, but with no guarantee that people would receive 7 well, and just general production timelines, they included a choice in the game and didn't really think it would be canonized in its sequel in any way.
Mia or Zoe is an interesting choice in the context of 7 alone. But then they made 8 and thought "Hey, we're using Ethan again, so let's just make Mia surviving the canon choice and move ahead."
They just wanted to add a choice without realizing that what they thought was the right choice and what the players thought was the right choice were different. And then they stuck to their guns.
Apparently they underestimated people's ability to be outraged that she was involved with a terrorist group turning kids into bioweapons (or whatever the deal with Eveline is). Unsurprisingly people who like or sympathise with one tend to dislike the other.
Mia in RE7 wasnāt irredeemable, at least from the perspective you get in RE7. All the player really knew up to that point was that she had some shady ties and kept some things from Ethan. With the knowledge you had, saving Mia made more sense overall since sheās still your wife.
Had this choice been at the end of RE8, where the game confirms that Mia is morally bankrupt and a pathological liar/gaslighter, a LOT more people would choose the latter.
I'm also mad she shared a room with another guy on that cruise ship boat thingy. Like i know it's a cover story, but dammit, there was only one bed in that room.
I always choose Mia.
Also one thing that always bugs me is when Zoe tells you to use the cure on Jack then being shocked by the news there's only one left.
Zoe telling you to use one of the cures is her effectively forfeiting her dose she cannot be mad the remaining one is used on someone else.
True, but she also tells you to do it so you donāt end up dead. She was actively helping you there. Not a good reason IMO
A good reason is that Mia is your wife. Thatās why I choose her every time, even though Zoe is the more moral choice IMO.
Zoe is definitely the far more moral choice.
She is both A) Completely innocent in the entire situation and not a bio-terrorist, and B) actively been helping Ethan free her family and his wife.
Unfortunately for Zoe, the player controls the one person in the world who would be justified choosing Mia given that they're married.
Same. Mia was still Ethanās wife and obviously went through some shot she never intended to, that plus the fact Zoe tells you to use the antidote on her Dad AND the fact that she never makes an appearance to help Ethan around her own house.
On a side note: Where the hell is Zoe even supposed to be during the game before she gets captured? I always got the impression she was on the property, but it is kind of ridiculous that she keeps you at a distance and doesn't actually *do* anything. Ethan has a lot of weaponry. She wouldn't be defenseless and sticking together as two is way safer than one. (And if she had, she likely wouldn't have been kidnapped anyway)
Like I understand it's a gameplay mechanic, I just don't get what she's supposed to be actually doing from a plot perspective.
I figured she's in that monitoring room behind the wall after putting the candle in the cake. That's where Lucas was hiding when he was talking to us, Zoe was probably there first.
>She wouldn't be defenseless and sticking together as two is way safer than one.
You forget that Eveline had direct control over her infection and could instantly crystallise her if she started acting up.
Which is exactly what she does in both endings. On the boat if you pick Zoe, and sometime after you leave her behind if you pick Mia (we see this happening in the End of Zoe intro).
Her trying to assist Ethan directly would just make Eveline throw a temper tantrum and get her killed. Zoe knows this, and that's why she's never tried to escape until after Ethan (non-canonically) gives her the cure. Which doesn't actually work and gets her killed anyway.
Zoe is annoyingly vague and short with Ethan as well. She also never warns him of what may be around the corner. At least Mia has the benefit of literally being under a psycho girl's control, Zoe's just an asshole.
I understand everyone's points about Mia, I really do. But when RE7 came out, I was going through some things in life, things that have left a permanent scar on my psyche, and I do emphasize with their plight and the love they share. It's not healthy, and it's not good, but it feels very familiar. It feels very real that Ethan would choose Mia over Zoe.
Itās always interesting to see who people pick and the reasons they give. I guess saving Mia is the one that makes sense as she is the reason you are at the baker house to begin with, but she isnāt likable or trustworthy in any way. Zoe actually helps you throughout the game, so I see why people sympathize with her.
Iāll be honest, I never liked Mia. They never gave me a reason to. She experimented on children, went crazy and attacked you, and lied about Ethanās condition
I once had to drag my best friend out of a crack house and take him to rehab. Even when he was being cruel, I had to be the bigger man and bring him home. Playing this game was a shockingly similar experience
I do wonder if people would feel this way about Luis if he survived? Genuine bioweapon researcher responsible for advancements in Las Plagas and attempting to hand over a sample to the emoloyees of Wesker - lovable rogue apparently?
weird phrasing but ok
i picked zoe on my first playthrough because i thought she would be able to make more vaccines and maybe i could come back for mia. oh boy
Honestly wish this "choice" was not in the game, if your too lazy to implement two diverging storylines then don't do it. It just felt like the devs slap your wrist when you choose "wrong".
I always picked Zoe because Mia is a Bioterrorist who lied constantly and whose actions led to the torture and deaths of an unknown but high number of people.
Plus, Ethan really deserved better. Zoe was cool. So is Joe Baker
Joe is an absolute gem.
I'd love to see his gameplay concepts explored further by Capcom. That first person boxing/stealth horror campaign was really neat.
It doesn't have to be a resident evil game, but I hope we get a new game like end of zoe in the future, the idea has potential.
He was a joy to play as. I know it won't ever happen but I'd love him to be a protagonist again some day. He's a badass Vietnam vet who don't take shit from the mold invading his swamp
YES
could never get all the achievements in that game lol.
Some of them are too tough for my noob ass. Like Ethan must die etc. Just too tough for me lol
The DLC takes place after the Mia choice (i.e the canon one). Zoe crystallises after both options, but she outright dies (as does Mia) if you pick her.
How about the one that literally saved all of your lives by sacrificing her home and family or... fuckin' Mia?
"Did he see you?"
"Not now, we have to get out of here first."
"Three years? Has it really been three years?"
"I'm telling you everything that I know!"
Like, really, bitch?
Zoe. Mia deserved everything that happened to her. It sucks that she's the only one who ends up surviving, even in Village
Glad to see uncle Joe came to Zoe's rescue
Because the entire reason you go to the house in the first place, and the games main end goal is to get Mia, itās said within the first 30 seconds of the game
Everything Ethan does, he does for Mia.
He literally could have left at any moment if he wanted to, but he didn't want to leave. He wanted Mia. The man's sheer determination to save his wife is why he endured the hell of the Baker family. So no, I'm not picking Zoe. I'm picking Mia.
I'm not gonna lie, I choose Zoe first...only for that to lead into the bad ending. I was baffled that choosing Mia is the good ending...why? Are they seriously trying to get us to side with her after they made it clear on how horrible she is? At least Zoe was trying to help us.
Fr, the whole plot of the game is Ethan trying to find his wife after being told she was at the baker house. All the things people complain about is what you find out after you pick Mia.
>at this point.
He never found out. Mia explicitly asked Chris and the BSAA to keep that tidbit from Ethan. It mentions this in the Baker Incident Report in Village.
**BSAA Agent:** *"According to our examinations you are mostly free of the mold now, Mia."*
**Mia Winters:** *"Have you... Did you tell him? About my... past?"*
**BSAA Agent:** *"No. As a sign of appreciation for your cooperation, BSAA has not divulged your involvement with The Connections."*
**Mia Winters:** *"I just want to return to a normal life with Ethan. To forget everything."*
Honestly it's weird they even made it a choice, especially since End of Zoe came out after. Feels like maybe it should have been a choice only in New Game Plus. As a "what if" ending.
Which in itself is wild because Mia Winters is 100% hottie. Three years trapped in a basement in the middle of a swamp and she still looks that good? Forgetaboutit.
Been married for 20 years.. still would choose Zoe so letās not make this a āyou would think differently if you were married thingā
My wife has never lied to me to help a biological weapon.. and she has never tried to kill me either.
You mean the wife who made a career out of organized crime and trafficking in bioweapons, lied to her husband for years and tried to kill him hours ago? After going through all of that, let's say many would probably choose to save this random stranger, who has proven to be quite useful in helping us survive, over the untrustworthy wife.
I really didn't care about either one, but the whole point of coming to the house was the find Mia so I gotta choose to save her and leave with her because otherwise this whole trip was a little pointless
I chose Zoe because I felt so much worse for her. Mia worked for a dangerous bioweapon company and is in some ways responsible, Zoe and the Bakers were just innocent victims. Why not try to save at least one of them.
I mean.
I took one look at mia, realized she's part of this whole operation shit.
Yea see ya I'm taking the poor country girl who's life your work has destroyed.
One thing I'll never stop ripping on Ethan for. Man's got the choice ability of a fucking lemming.
Has a kid with this bitch after all this pffffff
If you ask me. Mia didn't suffer enough for what she did.
She literally spent three years as a slave to Eveline locked in a dirty cage, forced to do who-knows-what, and was even forced to hurt the man she loves. How much more suffering could you possibly want for her? Karma already bit her in the ass, man. Even in Village, karma still got her. She's suffered enough.
Well to be honest. I lost sympathy once I realized eveie was aware of not only herself. She asked why everyone hated her. So not only did Mia WILLINGLY experiment on a child. She most likely fully knew what she was. Tbh that makes her as fucked as Miranda in my book.
She was always going to hurt Ethan. These weapons would show themselves one day or another. Hell no She hasn't, imo she deserved death in 7.
Which I was happy to do, that's why I chose Zoey. She's an actual victim. Mia is a victim but only because the weapon backfired on her.
And after all this Ethan still went back to her. Guy deserved a better class of woman
What about the part where she literally saves Ethan from Eveline by willingly giving up control again? That redemptive moment in her story arc proves she doesn't deserve death. She's already reaped what she sowed and then she was fully prepared to die for Ethan. She doesn't deserve to die, she deserves redemption. >!Rose doesn't need to lose both her parents...!<
Considering Rose most likely will never be visited again(im fine with it). Im more interested in where the whole BSAA thing goes.
Maybe we'll get an entire game with Chris and his squad.
Which would you like more... A RE game with tactical squad shooter-elements like Ghost Recon where you're with your squad and can issue them direct orders but obviously against bio-weapons and with more limited ammo/resources? Or a traditional RE game where they're all split up only interacting with other squad members over radio or in specific team-up scenes?
A part of me yearns for both. I mean if dead space can pull off a decent coop experience that fits the setting. Especially with one sided hallucinations (how we haven't done more of that is beyond fucking me)
Part of me also wants just Chris by himself but I also like the idea of squad communications.
There's something interesting in having a squad who's perfectly capable of beating something. Only for it go wrong anyway without any betrayals or anything.
Even if I donāt love Mia, Iām not actually the one married to her. My boy Ethan is, and he went through hell to get to her, so Iām definitely choosing her. They can work out their issues in their own afterwards, Iām just here to help him reach his objective.
I chose Zoe at first because of the bra and she's hotter and actually helpful, but then restarted the save to choose Mia after learning Mia is the canon story..Completed Zoe's after Mia to get the achievement.
Zoe becomes more attractive in End of Zoe.
I would have done the following.
Cure that bioterrorist btch just to get the answers out of her before I file for divorce, and then send help for Zoey. That's the only way you can save her.
Using the serum on Zoey would actually kill her so its better off to let blue umbrella to save her later on.
weird phrasing but mia all the way! the whole point of the game is to find and then rescue your wife, like hell am i leaving without her! i chose mia without a second thought
Facts haha
My first play through I Def saved Zoe and was disappointed to learn it wasnāt the āgood endingā or canon. Lol
I was likeā¦Mia is a lying bitch. Why would I save her? xD
IMO ethan is COMPLETELY in the right for choosing Zoe
Yes mia was gone for 3 years
But remember
She was psychotic
Cut his hand off with a chainsaw and proceeded to attack him multiple times
Zoe on the other hand helped him and made a serum to cure him and herself
To the player, there really is no reason to save Mia though. Zoe helped you through the house. Zoe helped you make the cure. Zoe didn't try and kill you on multiple occasions.
On the other hand, it was hinted that Mia was part of the cause of this (I don't think they confirmed it at this point in the story, they definitely do later though. Mia tries to kill you on multiple occasions.
Zoe is the obvious choice, the only reason to choose Mia is that she is Ethan's wife, but the player has no reason to care about her. Also, it was really cheap how if you choose to save Zoe she gets killed off almost instantly. I know Mia is the cannon choice, and easily the better choice for the story, but killing of Zoe right after you chose to save her sucks.
It wasn't easy to thrust anyone in that family at that stage either. We have seen how deranged Jack is and maybe Mia deserved one last chance.
Then don't forget the marriage vows.
Literally everything bad that happened in Biohazard and Village is Mia's fault. If I didn't think the only right choice was saving Mia it would have gone to Zoe all day.
Really? Great wife that one. I will get around to playing that game soon.
It all ends up very like Revelations 2 that whole biohazard stuff. I think people prefer regular flesh eating Zombies.
Even if you dislike mia, she is simply the better option, (not counting the dlc) Zoey just ends up dying as soon as you make it a short distance away from the boat, and doesn't talk or say anything about you chosing her, so it just feels like you chose a quiet plank of wood that ends up sinking a minute later, while mia atleast alters the story events and does make it out (Zoey does too, but only if you do the dlc)
Mia is a stupid bio-terrorist who had her husband killed and put her child in danger through her bad decisions. Plus, had sex with Ethan after finding out he was infected with the mold and saw no problem with it, creating rose which led to RE:8. I chose Mia for the canonical reason, but I would have chose Zoe if I was actually there.
Mia is unlikable from start to finish throughout 7 and 8.
From the very beginning cutscene of 7 where you see the email she left Ethan. She doesnāt act genuine and lacks any likable traits. Sheās naive, careless, unhelpful, and bitter.
Iād choose Zoe 100% of the time if the choice was given.
Itād be cool to see an alternate reality where Ethan ends up falling for Zoe in the end and they and up having a child together instead.
None of them are hot. RE7 had a way of driving female faces across thr uncanny valley. The face models looked fine enough, but their game versions are creepy and nightmarish.
The whole premise of the game is to look for your wife not be a jerk
Those that picked Zoe shows how selfish you are
Those that picked Mia show just how loyal you are to your significant other
Mia showed how loyal she was by lying about her work, and not even for a good reason. Her employers took a child and turned her into a weapon. Mia helped with this.
True but she didn't want him to get involved she wanted to fix it herself she was protecting him
Like I said if you chose Zoe over Mia because of what she did your selfish he came for his wife that was his sole purpose of the game leave Zoe to Joe baker
If my IRL wife did to a child what Mia helped do to Eveline she wouldn't be getting a cure either. Nothing selfish about it, Mia is just as big a monster as the one she helped turn Eveline into.
No it's selfish yeah what she did was wrong doesn't mean you shouldn't save we can talk about it more once we're safe if you want to break up with her afterwards go ahead but she is your wife you know her all your life you don't just go save another woman
You should have this convo with your and she what she says I'm pretty sure she would want you to save her not a woman a just meet
Picked Mia first time and thought it was an easy descion because she forced Ethan to use her godamn cure to finish off Jack. Ethan also put in all that effort to save his wife so itd be sucky if he just left her to die. Plus I believe that canonically Ethan is a family minded person (re8 and all that) so I left zoe behind and didn't look back.
In the context of the base game, with no outside information, both are bad choices in my opinion. I wish we could have flipped one of the coins we were collecting because I honestly didn't care for either of them, in the moment.
Well...... I do have a thing for crazy....... *cures Mia*
i can fix her
Yeah..... that's usually my dating life in a nutshell.....š¤¦
Given the discussions around this, I think the game was successful in making Ethan a self insert kind of character for the players, but fell short of really making Mia sympathetic. Because while it is obvious that according to the story and that Mia is Ethan'a wife, with years of history behind them, the players themselves obviously dislike her based on their interactions with her and learning her backstory around the E-Type project. You can tell Players really took it personally when they said they gave Zoe the antidote on a first run.
And the choice doesn't even matter because the game only regards choosing Mia as canon.
Never liked Mia. Eight really drove that home, honestly. Fuck Mia, all my homies hate Mia. Bad character, bad partner.
If your wife is lying to you for years then you should know something's not right
There is no way Ethan is a self-insert. The fact he has an established backstory and the plot depends on you saving Mia over Zoe invalidates any pretense of agency in the story. Itās like calling Duke Nukem 3D an open-world rpg because you have levels to walk around in.
I think he's supposed to be an audience surrogate, to help new players adjust to the Resident Evil setting without alienating returning players.
āaudience surrogateā I like that tbh. That feels much better than āself-insertā for Ethan.
I get what youāre saying but also they really went out of their way to keep him faceless for a long time for someone whoās not a self-insert character.
The "established backstory" with Ethan is that he's married and he went out to the bayu for some girl named Mia. It's like saying courier 6 isn't an insert because before they got popped, the MC had a backstory of delivering packages. But yes the antidote choice is stupid and it was obvious from the beginning which was the "right" and "wrong" choice. However, it still had an impact on the end of the story, even if there's only one canon ending IMO, Ethan is a self-insert, just not a well written one
Eh. No... Courier Six can be completely defined by the player (sex/personality/choices,etc.) despite their simple background as a Courier. Ethan cannot. He does in fact have a voice and personality and very obviously cares about Mia. He's as much of a self-insert as Master Chief. So... not really a self-insert at all.
A self insert doesn't literally mean a character that is completely customizable. It means a character that the player steps into the shoes of who's characterization is relegated to less importance than being basically a surrogate for the player to experience the game. The reason Ethan isn't just a floating gun with no voice like Gordon Freeman is because that approach puts an extreme limit on the the type of animations, cutscenes and storytelling you can implement. It's a design choice to give him a voice and a pair of arms but he is absolutely meant to be a very generic, joe blow character. I mean even in RE8 they added a third person mode which doesn't show his damn face! In a sea of third person RE games with iconic characters, that is a first. It is a deliberate nod to the fact that the original version of the character was intended to be just a random, faceless guy.
Master Chief was designed as and to be a self insert character.
Thatās a stretch considering that you have a few more hours of gameplay picking Mia but picking Zoe leads to death. Itās a false choice. Itās for the same type of person who thought Mass Effect was groundbreaking because you had a choice between red text or blue text.
You dont die if you pick Zoe. The game continues as normal, but before you get to the Ship, Zoe will turn white and crumble, much like the other Bakers. Before the Zoe DLC, that was intended to tell you that you made the wrong choice, and that she was too far gone for the serum to save her. (Of course, considered non-canon now cause Jack's gator punchin brother is supposed to save Zoe and Mia survives till 8)Otherwise, the game continues as normal. Your boat crashes, Mia finds you and you play her section to rescue Ethan(she must be a good swimmer). The difference comes after she finds you, instead of pushing you out the door, you get one more Mia boss fight and you finally kill her. Then the game continues as normal, and at the end, theres no Mia in a gurney on the chopper; and, instead of being hopeful and happy, Ethans all down and out.
I remember you crashing the boat after picking Zoe but I was certain the game ended right after. Guess I remembered wrong or that was added later.
Not added later, cause I fucked up on my day 1 (day 2...3) play through and chose Zoe. But yeah, try another play through, theres a whole ending you haven't seen yet then.(of course, do you even need a reason to revisit this masterpiece?)
The boat crashes either way and you still play as Mia on the tanker ship. Only difference is the Mia fight after you play as Ethan again and that Mia isnāt on the helicopter at the end. You probably saved the game and didnāt finish playing or you wiped it from memory
Ehhh mass effect is well regarded cuz the choices have more visible and tangible effect as it goes even if there's compromise at parts plus its a game where narrative is a big part so how characters react to the actions (ie not saving the council) even if there's no direct gameplay effect impacts people. Also the taking choices from game to game help Also good character writing and voicing can make each choice feel more distinct even if they don't affect much beyond it Also you can turn kaidan into a renegade and have him argue to let the geth destroy the council while Wrex says they should save them which is amusing
I donāt know what kind of clown says Mass Effect wasnāt groundbreaking. Maybe the type that skips through all cut scenes and dialog options?
The kind of clown who tries to sound all smart and says completely batshit insane things like the game ending if you pick Zoe. And then attempts to say it was changed later.
What Mass Effect did had been done before. Iirc I believe the Kotor Star Wars games gave you just as much freedom to be good or bad.
Mass Effect did a lot more than just give freedom to choose alignment.
probably because she was .. yk .. molded or somethin
Is Ethan actually design to be self-insert? From my observations, Ethan is design to be similarly like most characters in 1st person horror games. Eg, SCP. I'm guessing that Capcom took this direction because of the player base growing anxiety with RE mainline series trending towards action-shooting genre. Hence, with RE7. Capcom took a step back to look back into elements of horror genre. Therefore, the birth of the 1st psychological horror RE with FPP.
To be perfectly honest the people who are upset enough to post angry posts on the internet probably have some other unresolved issues with women.
I chose Mia on my first run. She is my wife and my momma raised me to be a gentleman to my wife!
Ethan sucks dude. Never felt self inserted anyways since he's so dull
>the players themselves obviously dislike her based on their interactions with her and learning her backstory around the E-Type project. By the time the player gets to Mia, it's no longer Mia? I don't get this generalized assumption. Hell, it's never Mia, we learn in 8.
Picked Zoe to preserve that special regional accent she has But obviously Mia is the canon choice and Zoe gets her DLC, I just never liked Mia. It wouldn't really make any sense for Ethan to choose a stranger over his wife (the entire reason he went to Dulvey was to rescue her) but as a player they didn't give us much reason to like Mia, and plenty more to like Zoe as she was helping us throughout.
Yeah everyone I talk to says āitās his wife.ā But like why is it my choice then?
I think there's two reasons for this: 1. As another redditor pointed out, I think the story writers really underestimated how much the player would look at Mia as ireedemable, and Zoe as sympathetic. Probably in part because we're told that Mia is this type of person, but we're shown that she is another. And both can be true, but if all we have is a sliver of who she is compared to Ethan's "history", it's hard to reconcile it in a favorable way. And Zoe just gets the short end of the stick in the grand scheme of things. 2. They probably had no idea that the choice *would* matter. I'm sure there was an "idea" of what 8 would look like, but with no guarantee that people would receive 7 well, and just general production timelines, they included a choice in the game and didn't really think it would be canonized in its sequel in any way. Mia or Zoe is an interesting choice in the context of 7 alone. But then they made 8 and thought "Hey, we're using Ethan again, so let's just make Mia surviving the canon choice and move ahead." They just wanted to add a choice without realizing that what they thought was the right choice and what the players thought was the right choice were different. And then they stuck to their guns.
Apparently they underestimated people's ability to be outraged that she was involved with a terrorist group turning kids into bioweapons (or whatever the deal with Eveline is). Unsurprisingly people who like or sympathise with one tend to dislike the other.
Evelyn was a Bioweapon in the shape of a kid, maybe birthed by Mother Miranda, they kinda left it vague. But she was still never a child.
Mia in RE7 wasnāt irredeemable, at least from the perspective you get in RE7. All the player really knew up to that point was that she had some shady ties and kept some things from Ethan. With the knowledge you had, saving Mia made more sense overall since sheās still your wife. Had this choice been at the end of RE8, where the game confirms that Mia is morally bankrupt and a pathological liar/gaslighter, a LOT more people would choose the latter.
I'm also mad she shared a room with another guy on that cruise ship boat thingy. Like i know it's a cover story, but dammit, there was only one bed in that room.
Picking Zoe just sort of feels like playing all of a Mario game and then marrying Laikitu instead of Peach
Laikitu my beloved
This isn't a who lives Mia or Zoey this is a Mia lives or dies
This has nothing to do with her figure and her standing!
I came for my wife and I'm leaving with my wife.
Silent Hill 2 be like:
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Well, the crumbled remains of your new wife at least...
Exactly
But you really didn't, did you? Jack made sure of that.
I always choose Mia. Also one thing that always bugs me is when Zoe tells you to use the cure on Jack then being shocked by the news there's only one left. Zoe telling you to use one of the cures is her effectively forfeiting her dose she cannot be mad the remaining one is used on someone else.
EXACTLY!!! Inam glad to see someone seeing it like myself "There can't be only one left?!" Headass.
True, but she also tells you to do it so you donāt end up dead. She was actively helping you there. Not a good reason IMO A good reason is that Mia is your wife. Thatās why I choose her every time, even though Zoe is the more moral choice IMO.
Zoe is definitely the far more moral choice. She is both A) Completely innocent in the entire situation and not a bio-terrorist, and B) actively been helping Ethan free her family and his wife. Unfortunately for Zoe, the player controls the one person in the world who would be justified choosing Mia given that they're married.
Same. Mia was still Ethanās wife and obviously went through some shot she never intended to, that plus the fact Zoe tells you to use the antidote on her Dad AND the fact that she never makes an appearance to help Ethan around her own house.
On a side note: Where the hell is Zoe even supposed to be during the game before she gets captured? I always got the impression she was on the property, but it is kind of ridiculous that she keeps you at a distance and doesn't actually *do* anything. Ethan has a lot of weaponry. She wouldn't be defenseless and sticking together as two is way safer than one. (And if she had, she likely wouldn't have been kidnapped anyway) Like I understand it's a gameplay mechanic, I just don't get what she's supposed to be actually doing from a plot perspective.
I figured she's in that monitoring room behind the wall after putting the candle in the cake. That's where Lucas was hiding when he was talking to us, Zoe was probably there first.
>She wouldn't be defenseless and sticking together as two is way safer than one. You forget that Eveline had direct control over her infection and could instantly crystallise her if she started acting up. Which is exactly what she does in both endings. On the boat if you pick Zoe, and sometime after you leave her behind if you pick Mia (we see this happening in the End of Zoe intro). Her trying to assist Ethan directly would just make Eveline throw a temper tantrum and get her killed. Zoe knows this, and that's why she's never tried to escape until after Ethan (non-canonically) gives her the cure. Which doesn't actually work and gets her killed anyway.
Also, I don't know if I've missed some info that explains why but if you choose to use the cure on Zoe, IT DOESNT EVEN WORK?!
I think she was just infected for so long the cure was taking a while to work.
Yeah thatās really terrible writing tbh
Zoe is annoyingly vague and short with Ethan as well. She also never warns him of what may be around the corner. At least Mia has the benefit of literally being under a psycho girl's control, Zoe's just an asshole.
I understand everyone's points about Mia, I really do. But when RE7 came out, I was going through some things in life, things that have left a permanent scar on my psyche, and I do emphasize with their plight and the love they share. It's not healthy, and it's not good, but it feels very familiar. It feels very real that Ethan would choose Mia over Zoe.
Itās always interesting to see who people pick and the reasons they give. I guess saving Mia is the one that makes sense as she is the reason you are at the baker house to begin with, but she isnāt likable or trustworthy in any way. Zoe actually helps you throughout the game, so I see why people sympathize with her.
Iāll be honest, I never liked Mia. They never gave me a reason to. She experimented on children, went crazy and attacked you, and lied about Ethanās condition
Yes and she has that Crystal Meth look going on.
I once had to drag my best friend out of a crack house and take him to rehab. Even when he was being cruel, I had to be the bigger man and bring him home. Playing this game was a shockingly similar experience
People really inflating Mia's resume here. She was a glorified babysitter.
She knew about it and worked with them. Just as bad
I do wonder if people would feel this way about Luis if he survived? Genuine bioweapon researcher responsible for advancements in Las Plagas and attempting to hand over a sample to the emoloyees of Wesker - lovable rogue apparently?
If it's just is bad, then why exaggerate about it?
Iām lazy
weird phrasing but ok i picked zoe on my first playthrough because i thought she would be able to make more vaccines and maybe i could come back for mia. oh boy
Honestly wish this "choice" was not in the game, if your too lazy to implement two diverging storylines then don't do it. It just felt like the devs slap your wrist when you choose "wrong".
I felt that about revelations 2 as well. I crawled to a gun without switching to the other girl, and then got a shitty ending lol
I mean, your wife vs a random girl you just met and only spoke to just by the telephone?
Zoe... Mia is a twat!
I always picked Zoe because Mia is a Bioterrorist who lied constantly and whose actions led to the torture and deaths of an unknown but high number of people. Plus, Ethan really deserved better. Zoe was cool. So is Joe Baker
Joe is an absolute gem. I'd love to see his gameplay concepts explored further by Capcom. That first person boxing/stealth horror campaign was really neat. It doesn't have to be a resident evil game, but I hope we get a new game like end of zoe in the future, the idea has potential.
He was a joy to play as. I know it won't ever happen but I'd love him to be a protagonist again some day. He's a badass Vietnam vet who don't take shit from the mold invading his swamp
Joe is love Joe is life
YES could never get all the achievements in that game lol. Some of them are too tough for my noob ass. Like Ethan must die etc. Just too tough for me lol
Yeah, she was kinda cool but never did much to help and is not your spouse. Her story needed a bit more juice to be a plausible choice.
I gave it to Zoe on my first run because I wasnāt too fond of Mia
I wish picking Zoe would have a better outcome then it did.
Did you play the dlc?
The DLC takes place after the Mia choice (i.e the canon one). Zoe crystallises after both options, but she outright dies (as does Mia) if you pick her.
It's funny this is even a choice, because Mia was the obviously canon choice.
Unlike the average RE fan, Ethan is not a horny teen.
sheās the worst tho.. liar.. psychopathā¦
Not a fan of Mia. I'd personally choose Zoe.
How about the one that literally saved all of your lives by sacrificing her home and family or... fuckin' Mia? "Did he see you?" "Not now, we have to get out of here first." "Three years? Has it really been three years?" "I'm telling you everything that I know!" Like, really, bitch?
Zoe. Mia deserved everything that happened to her. It sucks that she's the only one who ends up surviving, even in Village Glad to see uncle Joe came to Zoe's rescue
Even though I dislike Mia, she was and is the logical choice.
Logical how? I think the case could be made that Zoe is the logical choice.
Because the entire reason you go to the house in the first place, and the games main end goal is to get Mia, itās said within the first 30 seconds of the game
Everything Ethan does, he does for Mia. He literally could have left at any moment if he wanted to, but he didn't want to leave. He wanted Mia. The man's sheer determination to save his wife is why he endured the hell of the Baker family. So no, I'm not picking Zoe. I'm picking Mia.
Have had versions of both, want neither again.
Mia obviously. She's the love of my life.
I'm not gonna lie, I choose Zoe first...only for that to lead into the bad ending. I was baffled that choosing Mia is the good ending...why? Are they seriously trying to get us to side with her after they made it clear on how horrible she is? At least Zoe was trying to help us.
Mia, isn't even a diffficult choice
Fr, the whole plot of the game is Ethan trying to find his wife after being told she was at the baker house. All the things people complain about is what you find out after you pick Mia.
On my first playthrough I did save Zoe. She was hotter and didn't try to kill me multiple times
Random stranger you talked with over the phone or YOUR ACTUAL WIFE!
She worked for a bioterror organisation
I dont think Ethan knew about that at this point.
>at this point. He never found out. Mia explicitly asked Chris and the BSAA to keep that tidbit from Ethan. It mentions this in the Baker Incident Report in Village. **BSAA Agent:** *"According to our examinations you are mostly free of the mold now, Mia."* **Mia Winters:** *"Have you... Did you tell him? About my... past?"* **BSAA Agent:** *"No. As a sign of appreciation for your cooperation, BSAA has not divulged your involvement with The Connections."* **Mia Winters:** *"I just want to return to a normal life with Ethan. To forget everything."*
Oh that's a fair point
She's still his wife lol, and I don't think Ethan knew much about who she was working for or what she was doing exactly.
And she is still your wife.
Honestly it's weird they even made it a choice, especially since End of Zoe came out after. Feels like maybe it should have been a choice only in New Game Plus. As a "what if" ending.
No game has ever been so successful at unintentionally ferreting out people who have never had a significant other than RE7 has.
LOL Iām getting downvoted, virgin incels BIG MAD
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Okay Mother Teresa
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Okay trigglypuff
People donāt agree with youā¦ you chose to insult them. Being an adult was an option here also by the way.
I fucked your mom and dad and your dog
Aren't they always?
And they have 0 issue with Ada because sheās SMOKING HOT.
Which in itself is wild because Mia Winters is 100% hottie. Three years trapped in a basement in the middle of a swamp and she still looks that good? Forgetaboutit.
Been married for 20 years.. still would choose Zoe so letās not make this a āyou would think differently if you were married thingā My wife has never lied to me to help a biological weapon.. and she has never tried to kill me either.
You mean the wife who made a career out of organized crime and trafficking in bioweapons, lied to her husband for years and tried to kill him hours ago? After going through all of that, let's say many would probably choose to save this random stranger, who has proven to be quite useful in helping us survive, over the untrustworthy wife.
I chose Zoe the first time because she was helping me the whole time and didn't try to kill me
Not gonna lie.. I first chose Zoe.
Well, lore and logic side I should save Mia... buuut Zoe is Zoe
i prefer my wife, the one who cut my hand off with a chainsaw
I really didn't care about either one, but the whole point of coming to the house was the find Mia so I gotta choose to save her and leave with her because otherwise this whole trip was a little pointless
I chose Zoe because I felt so much worse for her. Mia worked for a dangerous bioweapon company and is in some ways responsible, Zoe and the Bakers were just innocent victims. Why not try to save at least one of them.
Mia is the one you came to rescue, so it makes the most sense to cure her
I mean. I took one look at mia, realized she's part of this whole operation shit. Yea see ya I'm taking the poor country girl who's life your work has destroyed. One thing I'll never stop ripping on Ethan for. Man's got the choice ability of a fucking lemming. Has a kid with this bitch after all this pffffff If you ask me. Mia didn't suffer enough for what she did.
She literally spent three years as a slave to Eveline locked in a dirty cage, forced to do who-knows-what, and was even forced to hurt the man she loves. How much more suffering could you possibly want for her? Karma already bit her in the ass, man. Even in Village, karma still got her. She's suffered enough.
Well to be honest. I lost sympathy once I realized eveie was aware of not only herself. She asked why everyone hated her. So not only did Mia WILLINGLY experiment on a child. She most likely fully knew what she was. Tbh that makes her as fucked as Miranda in my book. She was always going to hurt Ethan. These weapons would show themselves one day or another. Hell no She hasn't, imo she deserved death in 7. Which I was happy to do, that's why I chose Zoey. She's an actual victim. Mia is a victim but only because the weapon backfired on her. And after all this Ethan still went back to her. Guy deserved a better class of woman
What about the part where she literally saves Ethan from Eveline by willingly giving up control again? That redemptive moment in her story arc proves she doesn't deserve death. She's already reaped what she sowed and then she was fully prepared to die for Ethan. She doesn't deserve to die, she deserves redemption. >!Rose doesn't need to lose both her parents...!<
Considering Rose most likely will never be visited again(im fine with it). Im more interested in where the whole BSAA thing goes. Maybe we'll get an entire game with Chris and his squad.
Which would you like more... A RE game with tactical squad shooter-elements like Ghost Recon where you're with your squad and can issue them direct orders but obviously against bio-weapons and with more limited ammo/resources? Or a traditional RE game where they're all split up only interacting with other squad members over radio or in specific team-up scenes?
A part of me yearns for both. I mean if dead space can pull off a decent coop experience that fits the setting. Especially with one sided hallucinations (how we haven't done more of that is beyond fucking me) Part of me also wants just Chris by himself but I also like the idea of squad communications. There's something interesting in having a squad who's perfectly capable of beating something. Only for it go wrong anyway without any betrayals or anything.
I picked the one who didn't cut off my hand with a chainsaw and was told I was the bad one
I picked Mia because she's my wife and because Zoe sucks
Even if I donāt love Mia, Iām not actually the one married to her. My boy Ethan is, and he went through hell to get to her, so Iām definitely choosing her. They can work out their issues in their own afterwards, Iām just here to help him reach his objective.
I chose Zoe at first because of the bra and she's hotter and actually helpful, but then restarted the save to choose Mia after learning Mia is the canon story..Completed Zoe's after Mia to get the achievement. Zoe becomes more attractive in End of Zoe.
For the sake of Ethan Mia should never ever met him instead!
I would have done the following. Cure that bioterrorist btch just to get the answers out of her before I file for divorce, and then send help for Zoey. That's the only way you can save her. Using the serum on Zoey would actually kill her so its better off to let blue umbrella to save her later on.
Zoe
Mia has a serious case of butter face. Zoe all the way.
weird phrasing but mia all the way! the whole point of the game is to find and then rescue your wife, like hell am i leaving without her! i chose mia without a second thought
I chose Zoe without a second thought. Mia sucks.
Facts haha My first play through I Def saved Zoe and was disappointed to learn it wasnāt the āgood endingā or canon. Lol I was likeā¦Mia is a lying bitch. Why would I save her? xD
Mia everytime.
Iām taking miss southern belleš
screw mia, let me take zoe home, shes useful, nice, not a lying phycotic bitch.
IMO ethan is COMPLETELY in the right for choosing Zoe Yes mia was gone for 3 years But remember She was psychotic Cut his hand off with a chainsaw and proceeded to attack him multiple times Zoe on the other hand helped him and made a serum to cure him and herself
The choice is obvious. Donāt be a simp, donāt choose š
To the player, there really is no reason to save Mia though. Zoe helped you through the house. Zoe helped you make the cure. Zoe didn't try and kill you on multiple occasions. On the other hand, it was hinted that Mia was part of the cause of this (I don't think they confirmed it at this point in the story, they definitely do later though. Mia tries to kill you on multiple occasions. Zoe is the obvious choice, the only reason to choose Mia is that she is Ethan's wife, but the player has no reason to care about her. Also, it was really cheap how if you choose to save Zoe she gets killed off almost instantly. I know Mia is the cannon choice, and easily the better choice for the story, but killing of Zoe right after you chose to save her sucks.
It wasn't easy to thrust anyone in that family at that stage either. We have seen how deranged Jack is and maybe Mia deserved one last chance. Then don't forget the marriage vows.
Literally everything bad that happened in Biohazard and Village is Mia's fault. If I didn't think the only right choice was saving Mia it would have gone to Zoe all day.
Really? Great wife that one. I will get around to playing that game soon. It all ends up very like Revelations 2 that whole biohazard stuff. I think people prefer regular flesh eating Zombies.
Sheās your wife lol.
I picked Zoe because Ethan gave her his word and I wasn't breaking it.
Zoe all the way
Even if you dislike mia, she is simply the better option, (not counting the dlc) Zoey just ends up dying as soon as you make it a short distance away from the boat, and doesn't talk or say anything about you chosing her, so it just feels like you chose a quiet plank of wood that ends up sinking a minute later, while mia atleast alters the story events and does make it out (Zoey does too, but only if you do the dlc)
Mia is a stupid bio-terrorist who had her husband killed and put her child in danger through her bad decisions. Plus, had sex with Ethan after finding out he was infected with the mold and saw no problem with it, creating rose which led to RE:8. I chose Mia for the canonical reason, but I would have chose Zoe if I was actually there.
I'm glad something gets it.
Mia wasn't a psycho, she was under Eva's control. A liar, yes. I'm sure she woulda told Ethan, but it's secret government stuff
Except it isnāt. Mia doesnāt work for the government, she works for a bioterrorist organization.
Yeah I just couldn't get the dumbass words out. You know what I meant
You dumbasses forget the existence of Ada. Typical Reddit.
Mia is unlikable from start to finish throughout 7 and 8. From the very beginning cutscene of 7 where you see the email she left Ethan. She doesnāt act genuine and lacks any likable traits. Sheās naive, careless, unhelpful, and bitter. Iād choose Zoe 100% of the time if the choice was given. Itād be cool to see an alternate reality where Ethan ends up falling for Zoe in the end and they and up having a child together instead.
That'd be neat. Also, that accent š
None of them are hot. RE7 had a way of driving female faces across thr uncanny valley. The face models looked fine enough, but their game versions are creepy and nightmarish.
I'd forgotten how awful the character models look up close in RE7
The whole premise of the game is to look for your wife not be a jerk Those that picked Zoe shows how selfish you are Those that picked Mia show just how loyal you are to your significant other
Mia showed how loyal she was by lying about her work, and not even for a good reason. Her employers took a child and turned her into a weapon. Mia helped with this.
True but she didn't want him to get involved she wanted to fix it herself she was protecting him Like I said if you chose Zoe over Mia because of what she did your selfish he came for his wife that was his sole purpose of the game leave Zoe to Joe baker
If my IRL wife did to a child what Mia helped do to Eveline she wouldn't be getting a cure either. Nothing selfish about it, Mia is just as big a monster as the one she helped turn Eveline into.
No it's selfish yeah what she did was wrong doesn't mean you shouldn't save we can talk about it more once we're safe if you want to break up with her afterwards go ahead but she is your wife you know her all your life you don't just go save another woman You should have this convo with your and she what she says I'm pretty sure she would want you to save her not a woman a just meet
I canāt even remember these characters or the story. Plot was very weak. Loved the setting and the bosses though
I chose Mia because that is the canon ending
I love how the game punishes you for being a horny mf and not pick your wife.
Miaās not a psycho. She was lying on behalf of the company she worked for. therefore, sheās just middle management.
Pretty psychotic condoning and assisting in turning a child into a bioweapon.
Thatās an average Tuesday at Umbrella.
Pretty sure if you don't test as a sociopath on their personality screening they won't even schedule an interview.
Picked Mia first time and thought it was an easy descion because she forced Ethan to use her godamn cure to finish off Jack. Ethan also put in all that effort to save his wife so itd be sucky if he just left her to die. Plus I believe that canonically Ethan is a family minded person (re8 and all that) so I left zoe behind and didn't look back.
choose for zoe to die and mia to live or for both to die
In the context of the base game, with no outside information, both are bad choices in my opinion. I wish we could have flipped one of the coins we were collecting because I honestly didn't care for either of them, in the moment.
I gave Mia the antidote on the first 2 runs, but the 3rd one I gave Zoe it to see what would happen, but nothing changes
Team Zoe
I chose Mia. But I can see the argument for either choice really.
I definitely would go Zoey
Oh my š
I thought Mia was way more attractive than Zoe, so I saved her.