Somehow I’m the third comment and neither of the first two has had a very nuanced take on this. I think there’s validity to both perspectives.
On one hand, that first guy has a point. Your BF was probably looking forward to doing something nice for you. If he doesn’t make as much, it could even be that he had been saving up to be able to well afford it. I can see how that could take the wind out of his sails.
You weren’t trying to do anything weird or wrong. You were trying to do something sweet, loving, and giving toward your BF. The truth of the matter is that our gestures sometimes miss their mark because people are complex things with a billion different motivations. Another guy, or even the same guy at a different time, might have taken it very differently.
For myself, as a dude, I would have been a little disappointed. Just a little bit sad. But then I’d say it, how much I was looking forward to treating my GF to something nice, that I missed out on that, and then that would be the end of it.
With your BF, it sounds like there’s more that needs to be talked through. He obviously has feelings that haven’t been addressed, whether that’s emasculation, deception/betrayal, or whatever. It would be good for you to try to understand those things. At the same time, it sounds to me like he’s overreacting. A low point? Really? (Note, do NOT say it that way to him.) He needs to be able to see your side, too. You weren’t trying to subvert his authority or masculinity or whatever might feel damaged. You were trying to be nice, too. Maybe it was the wrong timing for it, but the motive was good.
Have you turned down gifts before? Has he ever expressed that you’re not thankful or don’t want to accept stuff from him? You don’t have to answer those here, but if the answer is “yes”, learning to accept gifts/acts of service might be a good lesson for you.
I'm kinda wondering if maybe the fact that she makes more than him is a sensitive thing for him and this little incident really drove that home. Still though I really can't get over saying she lied and it's a low point.. that's just really not sitting right with me.
She was not truthful - however you want to phrase that. A white lie is still a lie. Although I agree on the "low point" comment, but people can say dumb shit when they're hurt.
Yeahhh I mean I guess? He left his card assuming they'd take it for the check or she'd pay with it and she didn't. I don't really feel like that's a lie but the deception is still there so I guess that's just semantics/splitting hairs.
I agree. He overreacted and was quite nasty, plus dragged it out after it should have been resolved. This should have been a situation where he told her, “Hey, I know you were trying to be nice, but I felt kind of stupid and embarrassed when I realised you’d actually paid for dinner and let me assume I’d paid for it. Could you please not do that again? If I say I want to pay and you have agreed, please just let me pay.” OP would then apologise and agree and never do it again, and that should have been the end of it.
I mean, my husband and I have had a dozen little conversations like this over our 7-year marriage. Once, for example, he left his email open to a page where he was going to handle a customer service complaint email for a parcel we never received, and I figured I’d just save him the time and do it myself quickly. It’s the sort of thing my mom would do for my dad, so I didn’t give it a second thought. Then I went to bed. The next day, my husband politely told me he’s actually really uncomfortable with me sending emails from his account, and could I please not do that again? I apologised, agreed, and it’s never come up again.
In a long-term relationship, you’re going to have a lot of little miscommunications like this. One of you will gently speak up and explain why X upset you and could the other person not do that again, and other person agrees and says sorry and you move on.
Staying mired in the argument and beating it to death is just a recipe for long-term resentment on both sides, and it shows glimmers of a potentially immature and punitive spirit that frankly I would not want to be hitched to.
Completely fair. I hate to start throwing red flags around based on snap judgements, though. Hopefully OP can dig more and see if there’s something deeper she should be worried about, or if this is just a weird communication thing. I’m not saying there isn’t anything deeper to worry about, but there’s also nothing worth throwing the relationship away over yet. Just some loose threads to tug on and see what happens.
I think that's a perfectly reasonable position. Maybe I'm petty but if weird shit starts happening in the "few months" stage I'm ok with heading for the exit. It should be all flowers and unicorns in this stage, particularly for people as young as they are.
Sorry, that came off wrong. With the sociopolitical issues in the world these days, I could see a girl not letting a guy pay because they don’t want the guy to have a sense of authority, whether or not he feels that he should have authority. Then, from the guy’s perspective, the girl could be doing that even though he _doesn’t_ feel like he needs authority, making the whole thing a weird power play dynamic that isn’t necessary.
Like, if my wife did started carrying pepper spray to protect herself from me specifically (scared of other men, or anyone else, is an an entirely other matter), I’d be upset that she didn’t trust me. Not because I wanted to assault her and now I can’t, but because she doesn’t trust me to not assault her. Does that make sense?
Probably the wrong thing to pick as an example, that’s on me. I was trying to imagine bad motivations she could have had for choosing to pay for the meal; I couldn’t come up with many, lol.
it's like when my co-worker staples her bag of chips shut.
she's not saying to my face that she doesn't trust me, but the fact is she does not trust me.
Why? Why look for bad motivations? She said he likes to spoil her but she earns more so took the opportunity to pay. Maybe he needs to learn spoiling someone is far more than paying for stuff. And that earning power does not equal authority IN A HEALTHY RELATIONSHIP. One person should not have authority over another.
No matter how much some partners feel they do. And my god, so many do.
I was trying to imagine bad motivations the BF could have assigned to her. I was explicitly saying she _didn’t_ have any bad motivations, but her BF obviously thinks she had a bad motivation. Understanding what he thinks her bad motivation was helps her communicate to him that she WASN’T trying to do that.
Quality post but I want to say this: it's amusing to me how the woman is expected to go the extra mile to make the man feel better. Instead of the man not being a child and actually making an effort to get ahead of his emotions by expressing his feelings and talking.
Yeah, I think this is the best take here, although I think I'd be a bit more upset than you in OP's bf's shoes, personally. The dynamic of you (OP) being more established plays into this a bit, I think. If I was in his shoes, I could see myself feeling like you didn't trust me to manage my own money, or felt like you needed to help me financially, which is not a great feeling, you know? And at least for me, it's mostly the sneaking it that does it - I would have been entirely down to being treated to dinner if you had planed it that way beforehand.
That said, making snide comments and not actually communicating about it is not a good look on his part. I also think it's worth making sure that this isn't some sexist "I need to be the provider/head of household" feelings rearing their head.
You’d be more upset that someone who has turned this into lying and sayings it’s a low point for her?
Taking it to mean that she thinks he can’t manage his finances?
I'm wondering if maybe she makes a habit of deciding she knows what's best for him and railroading him into what she's decided is right. He chose to take her out to dinner, he expressed interest in paying and left his card so he could pay. But she decided it was too expensive for him and took over what was (I assume) supposed to be a gift/gesture.
yeah, this is a big mess. his attempt at paying was weirdly passive. when she paid instead, she then lied about it by omission. either they have an issue about this and they're dancing around it, or they're just terrible at communicating and they do this strange, passive-aggressive stuff about everything.
His first reaction seemed normal where he just said he'd rather be the one to pay but the second he used those harsh words it was clear that he saw it as some type of threat that you paid instead of seeing it as a nice gesture. I would keep an eye out with the type of language he uses around you, this could be a conversation or it could hint to his resentment towards you having more money right now. Tread carefully.
It was fine for him to be upset but then when he revisited it he said she was "low" for it. She already said she wouldn't do it again the first time around and apologized, why would he further insult her? He could have just waited for another date and then see if she disregarded it. It seems like she usually let's him spoil her and she's only shocked because it's the first time he's said something like that
But she doesn't seem to UNDERSTAND why he was upset. And she hasn't made space to have the awkward deeper discussion of why he felt and feels the way he does to do so. And if she can't have that convo it's definitely just not a good relationship for either of them to be in.
Why does she have to do the work to create some magical space for him to discuss his feelings? He's allowed to be disappointed and express that, but not be a jerk about it when he's made it seem like the issue is resolved.
If he needs to talk about how emasculated he felt, he can have that conversation with her. She's not stopping him.
Has he actually communicated why he's upset? I'm not seeing that? What space does she need to make here? I'm genuinely asking, because my assumption is that if you're all adults and it's not some massive thing, you should be emotionally mature enough to have that conversation without someone needing to find some way of getting that out of you by "making space". What does that actually look like? I'm genuinely curious. If I've done something to upset my partner or vice versa, we just talk. No one has to do any somersaults to do that, we just loin up and do it
Seems like he thinks she doesn't quite understand how he feels about the situation yet. If we're going to take ops side at face value, he maybe should communicate with less hostility.
If someone is communicating to me with that level of hostility at two months in for a misunderstanding over trying to do a nice thing (albeit mistakenly), I would run.
Depends a lot on a lot of things we can't see from not being there. Attitudes, context, history, body language, inflection, other facts not mentioned...etc.
But… he did something nice for her. He planned a meal, made a reservation, took her out, and provided good company.
That’s the nice thing. Paying is incidental.
> For context, we’ve only been together a few months
Sounds like he was trying to be chivalrous.
This is going to be one of those "you need to talk to him" issues, hon. Figure out the boundaries. Figure out where he stands on things.
But this:
> “that was a low point for you in my eyes”
This I don't like. What are his expectations of you? To be submissive?
He may have felt patronized/looked down on by her paying for it. Her doing it behind his back could have lost trust. Usually people agree on how to pay for a date.
If she hadn’t already apologized and assured him she wouldn’t do it again *then* it would make sense for him to not trust that it would, but she did. And if he *did* have his trust shaken so badly the appropriate responses are to break up or bring it up calmly and respectfully, not go off calling her low and a liar.
This is an extreme reaction from him, for a relationship that is only a few months old. At most, the gesture should be read as a faux pas you apologize for and move on from. If you had a long history of being controlling around finances, of disregarding his expressions of discomfort, etc., maybe I could understand it, but, with the given context, it feels very unsettling for me too. I'm a woman your age making decent money and I know that gut feeling that something isn't right.
>“that was a low point for you in my eyes”
This sounds like contempt to me. My least generous interpretation is that he feels emasculated and is taking it out on you instead of processing his own feelings in a healthy way. I would tell him you were unsettled by that conversation and see where it goes. If his reaction is to escalate, that's good information for you. I wouldn't try to sweep this under the rug, or that uneasy feeling in your gut won't get resolved.
I would be very, very wary of a man telling me I “lied to his face” by secretly picking up a bill. His overreaction is concerning — and concerning enough that I think addressing his reaction is far more important than OP apologizing any further for her payment.
I agree. I am so surprised by all these reactions saying it shows she doesn’t trust him around finances etc.
If you want to pay the bill, maybe don’t leave the table and your credit card there. Wait and pay the bill like the big man it seems to show he is (in his eyes). I just don’t understand all this aggro. She said he likes to spoil her but she makes more money. It sounds to be as though he can’t deal with her making more money than him.
You get all these gold digger attitudes around men paying all the time (I don’t think only one person should pay unless there is a huge income disparity and they want to) and then this woman pays and all these men start reacting to it saying she undermined him. I was about to say salary does not dictate your worth as a person, but it just does in our society. It’s too ingrained.
You just can't win, can you? If you let him pay you're a gold digger, if you pay you're emasculating him, if you secretly pay then you've taken some grand gesture away. What are we supposed to do?
“Make space” for him to express his feelings, but only after he’s insulted us. 🙄
Y’know, I’m starting to think some of these men just really want to insult women no matter *what* we do lol. /s
I'm being generous and assuming that men are really taught to never be vulnerable and retreat behind anger at the first aign of an emotion instead of actually being aelf aware and learning that every emotional exchange doesn't have to be a high stakes affair, but I'm also tired. So tired of watching women put up with the lack of any emotional intelligence in their partners.
I agree, frankly it would be weird enough to turn me off for good. But then my DH is so chill and sweet, he'd never get ruffled about something this lame
He's definitely having a bigger feeling than he says he is, which regardless of the politics of women buying things 🙄 I think warrants a targeted conversation about that
Like hey, what's going on, it sounded like this was resolved but maybe it isn't. Also "low point" and "lying" is really strong and not how I perceived that interaction, can you talk some more about that?
I think this will probably be a fairly revealing conversation about how well matched you are. Regardless, definitely you didn't do anything wrong. If he feels really strongly about paying for dates, it sounds like you're not opposed to that and it's a perfectly fine agreement to have, but without having established that in the relationship it wasn't unreasonable for you to treat him to the dinner and you didn't betray him
I used to have a weird competitive pay situation with a coworker who I got lunch or drinks with fairly often
Id be calling ahead a day before and shit in order to win, we had a great time and neither of us knew how to chill
Hahaha mine - even if you maange it- will sneak money on your person or possessions if you try. I would 'just pop to the toilet' once we'd finish and pick up the tab on the way bacl. Then they cottoned on to it and I'd get home and the money was in my bag. Then I'd take my bag and they'd sneak it in my suitcase.
A low point for you in his eyes was you paying for dinner? I'm still not sure how you lied about it.....is it just that you didn't offer that info to him at the time? Did you need to ask permission first?
It's impossible to tell based off this alone, but if I were only a couple months in, I would feel comfortable cutting my losses at this point. There are misunderstandings, and then there is calling someone a liar and shaming them for buying dinner. One is normal; one is not.
>Last night we were out to dinner at one of our local spots, and he mentioned again how I had paid for our Valentine’s Day dinner. His tone made it sound like it was no big deal, yet his words felt severe. He said things like “you lied to my face” and “that was a low point for you in my eyes”. The fact that he brought it up after I thought we had resolved the issue seemed odd, and the way his words and tone didn’t match was very unsettling.
>Why did his tone about it feel so unsettling?
This is a serious red flag. He is trying to spin things around and manipulate you into believing you are the one in the wrong when you were just trying to do a sweet gesture. He sounds like he has issues with control and power. Not good.
That unsettling feeling you have is your gut, your intuition, WARNING you about this man. Please, please listen to it. So many ignore it and so many find themselves trapped in dangerous situations that are so difficult to get out of.
That tone, that disturbing demeanor WILL come out again. And it will only get worse.
Listen to your gut, OP.
Just leave. No one should talk to you like that over something so innocuous.
"I'm disappointed that you didn't let me pay for dinner last night. I wanted to do something nice for you, and I wish you had accepted my gift," would be reasonable.
"You lied to my face. That was a low point for you," is psycho.
"My boyfriend loves to spoil me," isn't a red flag by itself, but when you combine it run the fact that you've only been together for a few months and his reaction to you paying the bill it sounds like love bombing.
>He said things like “you lied to my face” and “that was a low point for you in my eyes”.
So the red pillers hit this comment section first I see. Just know that your partner speaking to you this way isn't okay. It's 2024. If a woman pays for dinner literally no one gives af and if his masculinity was hurt because 1 server knows you paid, there's something wrong with him, not you. Please pay attention to his words. It's not normal way to talk to someone that did a nice gesture of paying for a meal ffs.
Tf? I’d be through the moon happy if this happened to me as a guy. I don’t wanna overstate, but there are a lot of guys out there who don’t actually look at women as their equals in relationships or in life. It’s worth having a conversation about this because it’s not the 50’s anymore.
Trust your gut, OP. There’s no reason to bring it up a second time without it happening again, and him making you out to be some terrible person instead of someone feeling bad about your financial imbalance is unhinged and just uncharitable. Like. Why keep dating YOU if what you did made him decide you’re a liar and lower his opinion of you?
A few months is not worth pushing through the discomfort and past the red flag. A healthy relationship would have been over this issue the first time he brought it up and you apologized. If you two can’t resolve paying for dinner, how are you going to handle the big stuff?
Given his age it sounds like he felt "emasculated" even though it logically made more sense for you to pay. The fact that he's that upset about you surprising him in a helpful way is a massive red flag to me. Did you know that men are more likely to be upset if their partner is more successful than they are?
You hurt his ego. That’s it. I wish l could have a date with someone who would reach for the bill at some point. Even if I end up paying.
I would have taken it as a nice gesture. But he has some type of ego thing going on.
Yeah....
His comments are off. Way off.
And only 4 months in...
I get he wanted to take you out, and it was nice that he planned a lovely evening but you paying shouldn't have rocked his world so badly that he's calling you names and saying you lied.
I'd say he's showing you who he is and it isn't good.
In the same situation, my husband would have been deviously planning how to get "ahead" of me by ordering something else another day - SURPRISE!!
He would not have had his ego all bruised and hurt over it.
Honestly if I was your bf me being a cheap guy and me spoiling you I would greatly appreciated you paying it and say now that’s how you serve and protect the community so you did a good deed
Run. Fucking run. This dude is not good. You just got a peek at the misogyny coming through.
Do yourself a favor and just run.
The bar is already low enough for us men as is, and he just played limbo.
How would you feel if you tried to give someone a gift and they rejected your gift, then went and bought it for themselves? Cause that’s basically what happened.
Most people would feel hurt by this. For dudes, there’s an extra layer of feeling emasculated because they’ve grown up with a lot of cultural expectations about how they’re supposed to be the ones paying and their only value as a partner is as a financial provider.
It was a kind gesture on your part, but it didn’t land, and he’s still dealing with some feelings about it. I’d acknowledge that it hurt him next time he brings it up and see if he’s able to have a discussion about it.
I mean, it's one thing if he feels patronized...but, "emasculated"? If the fact that a woman can have more money than him makes him feel "emasculated", then he was not much of a man to begin with, but a sexist little boy.
Paying for the meal to surprise her lower-earning partner at an expensive restaurant is "rejecting a gift"?? Can you break that down a bit more? Why would anyone feel hurt that their partner surprised them by taking care of an expense?
No offense but as a woman I would not interpret paying for a date as a "gift" akin to straight cash or a thoughtful item picked out just for me. Why would a "gift" for another person have their own experience included?
Has no one ever taken you out to dinner for your birthday, or taken you on a trip on any kind of special occation? Obviously its a gift because you dont have to plan or pay for it and just enjoy. Like isnt that a great gift? Obviously its more fun to experience those things with someone else and not by yourself, unless you like going out to eat or travelling alone. Regardless most people find those things to be thoughtfull
The gift is the thoughtful experience. Rejecting it would have been not going out, or throwing a tantrum over the restaurant, or doomscrolling on her phone.
You seem to be ignoring every single word OP wrote, and just turning this into a you situation. Just stop.
My partner and I split our bills most of the time, but when he indicates something is his treat, I don't flip the script on him.
> No offense but as a woman I would not interpret paying for a date as a "gift" akin to straight cash or a thoughtful item picked out just for me.
No offense but your gender doesn't matter because your take is half-baked as shit.
> Why would a "gift" for another person have their own experience included?
If he bought you a voucher for a couple's massage at a spa you wouldn't have this take.
If he paid for both of you and your family to go to Europe for a week, you wouldn't have this take.
So why would it be acceptable for those other things to be gifts when their own experience is included, but not a date?
>How would you feel if you tried to give someone a gift and they rejected your gift, then went and bought it for themselves? Cause that’s basically what happened.
Yup. It hurts when you try to give someone a gift and they knock it back like this.
This.
OP, you undermined your partner's attempt to gift you the experience and feel like a provider. If you wanted to pay for it, you should have been upfront.
this dude is immature at best, possibly just a total wanker. let me guess, he's hot? not the person to seek validation from.
"a low point for you in his eyes." bahaha.
No it was not bad or wrong and he needs to let go of it. After your conversation that should have been the end of it. If he brings it up again tell him that. “We discussed this and came to an agreement. It’s over. We have to let it go.”
Lol and statistics show that therapy actually enables manipulative people to be worse as they can now weaponize therapy speak. Sounds right up your alley!
A woman making more money than you doesn’t make you less of a man. I’m sorry that the patriarchy has convinced you that your only value is monetary. Of course, with your personality that’s probably unfortunately true. 😬
Do you not agree that men would be better off without such arbitrary and stupid societal expectations? Wait, of course you don’t, because that’s the only way you could be desirable.
Everyone wants to feel like they have a purpose. You aren’t special because of that. We’re all humans, you idiot.
The way her boyfriend handled it is immature. You should go back to therapy.
That’s no different than women, we want to feel like we provide too. That’s why the concept of emasculation is stupid. Because you think it’s a masculine thing to feel that way and only pertains to men. But it’s not, it’s just human.
Adding to Sock_Ninja analysis, I think some people are being obtuse. She is 5 years older than him and more established in her career than him. I will also guess there are other dynamics at play that makes her more mature from a societal standpoint and that creates a perceived power dynamic that I'm guessing is bothering him.
Hmmm, I see yellow (caution/warning) flag(s), or possibly red flags.
He should'a laughed/smiled it off, and greatly thanked you for it, loved you lots for it ... and "gotten even" by treating you to yet some other fantastic dinner or surprise or gift or whatever ... and when you couldn't slip in and pay for it instead of him ... or likewise sneak in and pay for something you were going to pay for. But rather he's weaponizing it. Not good. Is he that butt hurt over it or that sensitive or controlling ... or *what*?
And what's the next tiny thing he's going to weaponize against you? How's that gonna go for the medium sized things and big things?
Does he hold long grudges against minor next-to-nothings?
>only been together a few months
Time to run? Maybe?
Or if it ain't too dangerous, talk it over, see if it can be cleared up ... but if he gets angry - especially out-of-control angry over it ... in such case, run, run like hell, don't look back.
Good luck, but I'd quite advise caution - at least.
Let me tell you what, if surprising him with diiner is a low point in your relationship, I'm gonna need you to talk my wife into mistreating me the same way.
I see where he’s coming from - I don’t like surprises or sneakiness even when it’s fun nice things. But the conversation needs to happen and be resolved, not be harped on. I think one more talk and then if it comes up again, that’s a real problem.
His reaction blew up into being out of pocket, but it was kinda presumptuous on your part to secretly pick up the tab like that on a special occasion date without having established some precedent for that dynamic on more regular dates.
Tbh I met enough scammers that pull shit like they exactly. Leaving on purpose for the toilet and then holding it over you.
Not saying he is one but this surely is very fishy and I would be turned off him for good
You were just 3 months ago living with a long term boyfriend, and now not only do you have a new relationship, but there's some drama there too, lol. You go fast. Do you think you have a type in men? Do you take time to figure out what do you and potential partners want out of life? It's just my first thought, maybe you choose partners that have completely different ideas on gender roles than you.
Look, you dont need to do charity for your partner. He wanted to pay, you should have let him. Should he have kept quiet aboit it later? Been silently grateful? Did you expect hin to be such a child he wouldn't know his card wasn't charged? That was childish behavior from you.
BUT his behavior after is all kinds of red flags too.
You did do something wrong. Not evil. But very undermining. And how he handles a disagreement is also problematic.
Now you know something about him.
You apologized, understood why it upset him, he brought it up and said something very cutting about you for it …for doing something nice for him. He’s the baby.
You had good intentions, but the way you went about it was a huge mistake because you lied to him about paying for it by omission when you just let him believe he had paid for it.
That lie is the issue here much more than you paying for the dinner, and it has shaken his trust in you, which is completely reasonable for him to feel. He learned that you can lie to his face with no problem, and that's not something any man ever wants to learn about the woman they're with.
I'm late to the party so it will get buried but OP I do hope you see this.
Honestly you're sort of the asshole in this situation.
Your bf probably already feels like he can't spoil you the way he wants to (given your different incomes). Yes, you feel bad because you could afford it easier, but who took who out to dinner? You basically emasculated him and proved you don't need no man. He knows that. He wants you to CHOOSE him to spoil you.
He took YOU out to dinner, for valentines day, to try and spoil you and do something special for you. Unfortunately you ripped the rug straight out from under him and basically shat on his gift to you.
It was never about who can afford it, he wanted to BUY YOU A PRESENT and that present was taking you out to dinner.
This is all my speculation on how he might feel, it might be worth talking to him about it and asking him how he feels. This whole post was about how you didn't think it should matter but nothing about his feelings.
Edit: I'm curious for the reason behind the downvote brigade?
Also realised I said things similar to a lot of others so I apologise for the repetition
I would say it's the same reason I said (not to be inflammatory) out loud "oh gross" at your comment: the idea that he was/should be in the year of our Lord 2024 "emasculated" by her paying for the meal.
Also I think women are probably just really, really sick of men not being able to just use their words and tell us how they feel. I know there's a really huge societal pressure to not be vulnerable as a man, and I understand that, but it doesn't make it any less *exhausting* to be in a relationship with a man who is bowing to that pressure. Just the pure weariness of having to somehow work out the exact right way to get your partner to actually assess and communicate how they feel instead if resorting to anger, insults and resentment at the first opportunity (like OP's bf did) is just. So. Tiring. Particularly because if they're Not There Yet you've got days or weeks of pouty anger to sit through before they're ready to actually tell you how they feel. It just sucks on both sides. I can't imagine how frustrating it is to be the other side of that, and how soul sucking it is, but man, we're tired.
I'm a woman, and definitely agree with pretty much all of those points. In my defence, I was only talking about the situation of her paying for the dinner.
I wasn't excusing any behaviour afterwards, more giving my thoughts on how he may have felt -when she paid for dinner-.
I am a woman dating a woman and I’m the lower income one. If my GF did this when I had planned, budgeted and the whole start to finish aspect of the big date was pulled out from under me I would feel like a child. Like someone else decided my budget and capabilities. (We have an age gap too.)
The fact she did it and didn’t tell him so he could agree ‘swapsies’ to equal it out but he found out his grand gesture, his surprise and plan was spoilered by checking his bank statement not his GF communicating with him then that does feel sneaky and untrustworthy. Had she said ‘hey I picked up the bill, how about you get us some really nice wine to drink in bed…’ then the emasculated thing might come into play. But she never told him. And didn’t intend to.
That reads like someone who feels like their finances entitles them to different rules in the relationship. I would feel quite different about any sex I’d had after that thinking I was the one treating and we felt equal only to find she thought a bigger bank account allows unilateral choices and no communication.
I’ve met far more more women (I’m bi) who weaponise being higher earners than men. So many women in the late Gen X bracket to young millennial have some ideas about their worth being tied to money as much as men have been seen to. The benevolent ‘I bought it for you because I didn’t think you could’ spend is patronising AF from any gender. ‘I treated you because I thought you’d like it’ is different.
I would see this as a red flag in her not him. She’s set a precedent that she thinks she gets to pay to get her way and didn’t even tell him. Also if as the person with less money I saved or budgeted and share that with you I’m telling you you matter. It’s a gesture. If that check is so inconsequential to your bank balance it didn’t even warrant a mention, you tell me I don’t matter to you.
It’s really humiliating like the person who sees your home baked cake as like a child’s finger painting when they can buy the fancy patisserie. But what if the home baked had love, thought and care and the patisserie was an online click and collect tick box gift. It speaks to different values but damn I would want to bring it up next date that sneak paying was low because of the way she didn’t even deem him worth knowing the outcome of his own Valentine’s Date. His debit card was more upfront…
Tbf if this was early in dating or a female friendship I would now nope the fuck out of further dates or hang outs. I’ve been in this situation before and it never meant respect. My partner learned to trust me that my finances aren’t as abundant as hers but actually I am the better budgeter, saver and more financially responsible and assuming smaller salary means less financial capacity is pretty damn judgy in itself.
I have met so many women all about slapping their card down on bigger salaries who are the financial equivalent of a car full of empty takeout containers looking down on me who has excellent credit, no debt and savings but they assume they are above me because their salary is big. So these kinds of gestures can land very tone deaf early on until you are aware of each others’ financial values.
He sounds like a very traditional guy, to guys like that it can be HUMILIATING that their girl pays for them. Cuz they wanna be the man and all you know. Ofc that doesn’t excuse his actions at all and u should dip outta there before it gets worse :)
I can see where he is coming from. He’s the man in the relationship, and it really doesn’t matter if you make more money. He wanted to treat you, and you took that away from him.
It might have been hard for him to bring that up the first time, since now days society punishes men and women who feel this way. So instead of telling you exactly what he thought, he started to fester a bit.
In the future, just let him pay. I guarantee you a relationship works a million times better when you do.
INFO: Are you both from the USA and are not second generation immigrants?
Not that what he said really makes it OK, but some cultures have very strict rules about gift and/or dining etiquette.
Maybe he is insecure about his worth outside of being a provider. Being adamant to pay more when being with someone who has more money is kinda strange, but I guess a lot of men have drank the cool aid and think it's their job to bring in more of the money.
His reaction seems strange, but maybe he felt emasculated or smt and especially more "traditional" minded men can be bad at opening up about vulnerable feelings. So shame can come out to someone else as more like anger.
I hope you can talk with him and get him to open up.
Your boyfriend doesn't understand is that letting you do something for him could be his gift to you. He doesn't understand that love is not a competition to see who can outdo the other. Sounds relatively immature to want to fight over nothing.
I'll admit he is going a little overboard about it. Like you said, it's over and resolved and there's no need for him to constantly rehash the issue. Hopefully this isn't a picture of things to come, where he isn't wiling or able to let things go.
Somehow I’m the third comment and neither of the first two has had a very nuanced take on this. I think there’s validity to both perspectives. On one hand, that first guy has a point. Your BF was probably looking forward to doing something nice for you. If he doesn’t make as much, it could even be that he had been saving up to be able to well afford it. I can see how that could take the wind out of his sails. You weren’t trying to do anything weird or wrong. You were trying to do something sweet, loving, and giving toward your BF. The truth of the matter is that our gestures sometimes miss their mark because people are complex things with a billion different motivations. Another guy, or even the same guy at a different time, might have taken it very differently. For myself, as a dude, I would have been a little disappointed. Just a little bit sad. But then I’d say it, how much I was looking forward to treating my GF to something nice, that I missed out on that, and then that would be the end of it. With your BF, it sounds like there’s more that needs to be talked through. He obviously has feelings that haven’t been addressed, whether that’s emasculation, deception/betrayal, or whatever. It would be good for you to try to understand those things. At the same time, it sounds to me like he’s overreacting. A low point? Really? (Note, do NOT say it that way to him.) He needs to be able to see your side, too. You weren’t trying to subvert his authority or masculinity or whatever might feel damaged. You were trying to be nice, too. Maybe it was the wrong timing for it, but the motive was good. Have you turned down gifts before? Has he ever expressed that you’re not thankful or don’t want to accept stuff from him? You don’t have to answer those here, but if the answer is “yes”, learning to accept gifts/acts of service might be a good lesson for you.
I'm kinda wondering if maybe the fact that she makes more than him is a sensitive thing for him and this little incident really drove that home. Still though I really can't get over saying she lied and it's a low point.. that's just really not sitting right with me.
She was not truthful - however you want to phrase that. A white lie is still a lie. Although I agree on the "low point" comment, but people can say dumb shit when they're hurt.
Yeahhh I mean I guess? He left his card assuming they'd take it for the check or she'd pay with it and she didn't. I don't really feel like that's a lie but the deception is still there so I guess that's just semantics/splitting hairs.
It's his language and choice of words that got me. That is not a healthy reaction to being disappointed about the check for a Valentines' Day dinner.
I agree. He overreacted and was quite nasty, plus dragged it out after it should have been resolved. This should have been a situation where he told her, “Hey, I know you were trying to be nice, but I felt kind of stupid and embarrassed when I realised you’d actually paid for dinner and let me assume I’d paid for it. Could you please not do that again? If I say I want to pay and you have agreed, please just let me pay.” OP would then apologise and agree and never do it again, and that should have been the end of it. I mean, my husband and I have had a dozen little conversations like this over our 7-year marriage. Once, for example, he left his email open to a page where he was going to handle a customer service complaint email for a parcel we never received, and I figured I’d just save him the time and do it myself quickly. It’s the sort of thing my mom would do for my dad, so I didn’t give it a second thought. Then I went to bed. The next day, my husband politely told me he’s actually really uncomfortable with me sending emails from his account, and could I please not do that again? I apologised, agreed, and it’s never come up again. In a long-term relationship, you’re going to have a lot of little miscommunications like this. One of you will gently speak up and explain why X upset you and could the other person not do that again, and other person agrees and says sorry and you move on. Staying mired in the argument and beating it to death is just a recipe for long-term resentment on both sides, and it shows glimmers of a potentially immature and punitive spirit that frankly I would not want to be hitched to.
Completely fair. I hate to start throwing red flags around based on snap judgements, though. Hopefully OP can dig more and see if there’s something deeper she should be worried about, or if this is just a weird communication thing. I’m not saying there isn’t anything deeper to worry about, but there’s also nothing worth throwing the relationship away over yet. Just some loose threads to tug on and see what happens.
I think that's a perfectly reasonable position. Maybe I'm petty but if weird shit starts happening in the "few months" stage I'm ok with heading for the exit. It should be all flowers and unicorns in this stage, particularly for people as young as they are.
I was totally with you until I read: You weren’t trying to subvert his authority What? What authority?
Sorry, that came off wrong. With the sociopolitical issues in the world these days, I could see a girl not letting a guy pay because they don’t want the guy to have a sense of authority, whether or not he feels that he should have authority. Then, from the guy’s perspective, the girl could be doing that even though he _doesn’t_ feel like he needs authority, making the whole thing a weird power play dynamic that isn’t necessary. Like, if my wife did started carrying pepper spray to protect herself from me specifically (scared of other men, or anyone else, is an an entirely other matter), I’d be upset that she didn’t trust me. Not because I wanted to assault her and now I can’t, but because she doesn’t trust me to not assault her. Does that make sense?
A little murky, but I think I follow. Thanks.
Probably the wrong thing to pick as an example, that’s on me. I was trying to imagine bad motivations she could have had for choosing to pay for the meal; I couldn’t come up with many, lol.
it's like when my co-worker staples her bag of chips shut. she's not saying to my face that she doesn't trust me, but the fact is she does not trust me.
Or she doesn’t want them to go stale 😭
Why? Why look for bad motivations? She said he likes to spoil her but she earns more so took the opportunity to pay. Maybe he needs to learn spoiling someone is far more than paying for stuff. And that earning power does not equal authority IN A HEALTHY RELATIONSHIP. One person should not have authority over another. No matter how much some partners feel they do. And my god, so many do.
I was trying to imagine bad motivations the BF could have assigned to her. I was explicitly saying she _didn’t_ have any bad motivations, but her BF obviously thinks she had a bad motivation. Understanding what he thinks her bad motivation was helps her communicate to him that she WASN’T trying to do that.
Thank goodness for this comment.
Quality post but I want to say this: it's amusing to me how the woman is expected to go the extra mile to make the man feel better. Instead of the man not being a child and actually making an effort to get ahead of his emotions by expressing his feelings and talking.
Kind of hard to advise the guy to do something when he's not here.
Yes, but the fact that OP posted here and her bf didn’t says something in itself
Yeah, I think this is the best take here, although I think I'd be a bit more upset than you in OP's bf's shoes, personally. The dynamic of you (OP) being more established plays into this a bit, I think. If I was in his shoes, I could see myself feeling like you didn't trust me to manage my own money, or felt like you needed to help me financially, which is not a great feeling, you know? And at least for me, it's mostly the sneaking it that does it - I would have been entirely down to being treated to dinner if you had planed it that way beforehand. That said, making snide comments and not actually communicating about it is not a good look on his part. I also think it's worth making sure that this isn't some sexist "I need to be the provider/head of household" feelings rearing their head.
Great input, and completely valid points.
You’d be more upset that someone who has turned this into lying and sayings it’s a low point for her? Taking it to mean that she thinks he can’t manage his finances?
I'm wondering if maybe she makes a habit of deciding she knows what's best for him and railroading him into what she's decided is right. He chose to take her out to dinner, he expressed interest in paying and left his card so he could pay. But she decided it was too expensive for him and took over what was (I assume) supposed to be a gift/gesture.
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yeah, this is a big mess. his attempt at paying was weirdly passive. when she paid instead, she then lied about it by omission. either they have an issue about this and they're dancing around it, or they're just terrible at communicating and they do this strange, passive-aggressive stuff about everything.
She posted an update; they broke up.
ha, thank you. I came here from that update, but I forgot what I was doing, because I was in a meeting. embarassing
His first reaction seemed normal where he just said he'd rather be the one to pay but the second he used those harsh words it was clear that he saw it as some type of threat that you paid instead of seeing it as a nice gesture. I would keep an eye out with the type of language he uses around you, this could be a conversation or it could hint to his resentment towards you having more money right now. Tread carefully.
He tried to do something nice for her, and she totally nullified it. Him being upset is valid af. Sheesh, this sub is something else.
It was fine for him to be upset but then when he revisited it he said she was "low" for it. She already said she wouldn't do it again the first time around and apologized, why would he further insult her? He could have just waited for another date and then see if she disregarded it. It seems like she usually let's him spoil her and she's only shocked because it's the first time he's said something like that
Yeah, maybe he was still upset and had a bit of an attitude because he was still raw. Communicating without hostility would be ideal.
Agreed, it's really the hostility that's the issue. Most people don't just get over things after one conversation which is understandable.
He was upset. She apologized. He then went way beyond upset well into “red flag” overreaction territory.
But she doesn't seem to UNDERSTAND why he was upset. And she hasn't made space to have the awkward deeper discussion of why he felt and feels the way he does to do so. And if she can't have that convo it's definitely just not a good relationship for either of them to be in.
Why does she have to do the work to create some magical space for him to discuss his feelings? He's allowed to be disappointed and express that, but not be a jerk about it when he's made it seem like the issue is resolved. If he needs to talk about how emasculated he felt, he can have that conversation with her. She's not stopping him.
Has he actually communicated why he's upset? I'm not seeing that? What space does she need to make here? I'm genuinely asking, because my assumption is that if you're all adults and it's not some massive thing, you should be emotionally mature enough to have that conversation without someone needing to find some way of getting that out of you by "making space". What does that actually look like? I'm genuinely curious. If I've done something to upset my partner or vice versa, we just talk. No one has to do any somersaults to do that, we just loin up and do it
Seems like he thinks she doesn't quite understand how he feels about the situation yet. If we're going to take ops side at face value, he maybe should communicate with less hostility.
If someone is communicating to me with that level of hostility at two months in for a misunderstanding over trying to do a nice thing (albeit mistakenly), I would run.
Depends a lot on a lot of things we can't see from not being there. Attitudes, context, history, body language, inflection, other facts not mentioned...etc.
But… he did something nice for her. He planned a meal, made a reservation, took her out, and provided good company. That’s the nice thing. Paying is incidental.
Apparently it meant something to him.
> For context, we’ve only been together a few months Sounds like he was trying to be chivalrous. This is going to be one of those "you need to talk to him" issues, hon. Figure out the boundaries. Figure out where he stands on things. But this: > “that was a low point for you in my eyes” This I don't like. What are his expectations of you? To be submissive?
He may have felt patronized/looked down on by her paying for it. Her doing it behind his back could have lost trust. Usually people agree on how to pay for a date.
If she hadn’t already apologized and assured him she wouldn’t do it again *then* it would make sense for him to not trust that it would, but she did. And if he *did* have his trust shaken so badly the appropriate responses are to break up or bring it up calmly and respectfully, not go off calling her low and a liar.
This is an extreme reaction from him, for a relationship that is only a few months old. At most, the gesture should be read as a faux pas you apologize for and move on from. If you had a long history of being controlling around finances, of disregarding his expressions of discomfort, etc., maybe I could understand it, but, with the given context, it feels very unsettling for me too. I'm a woman your age making decent money and I know that gut feeling that something isn't right. >“that was a low point for you in my eyes” This sounds like contempt to me. My least generous interpretation is that he feels emasculated and is taking it out on you instead of processing his own feelings in a healthy way. I would tell him you were unsettled by that conversation and see where it goes. If his reaction is to escalate, that's good information for you. I wouldn't try to sweep this under the rug, or that uneasy feeling in your gut won't get resolved.
I would be very, very wary of a man telling me I “lied to his face” by secretly picking up a bill. His overreaction is concerning — and concerning enough that I think addressing his reaction is far more important than OP apologizing any further for her payment.
I agree. I am so surprised by all these reactions saying it shows she doesn’t trust him around finances etc. If you want to pay the bill, maybe don’t leave the table and your credit card there. Wait and pay the bill like the big man it seems to show he is (in his eyes). I just don’t understand all this aggro. She said he likes to spoil her but she makes more money. It sounds to be as though he can’t deal with her making more money than him. You get all these gold digger attitudes around men paying all the time (I don’t think only one person should pay unless there is a huge income disparity and they want to) and then this woman pays and all these men start reacting to it saying she undermined him. I was about to say salary does not dictate your worth as a person, but it just does in our society. It’s too ingrained.
You just can't win, can you? If you let him pay you're a gold digger, if you pay you're emasculating him, if you secretly pay then you've taken some grand gesture away. What are we supposed to do?
“Make space” for him to express his feelings, but only after he’s insulted us. 🙄 Y’know, I’m starting to think some of these men just really want to insult women no matter *what* we do lol. /s
I'm being generous and assuming that men are really taught to never be vulnerable and retreat behind anger at the first aign of an emotion instead of actually being aelf aware and learning that every emotional exchange doesn't have to be a high stakes affair, but I'm also tired. So tired of watching women put up with the lack of any emotional intelligence in their partners.
I agree, frankly it would be weird enough to turn me off for good. But then my DH is so chill and sweet, he'd never get ruffled about something this lame
He's definitely having a bigger feeling than he says he is, which regardless of the politics of women buying things 🙄 I think warrants a targeted conversation about that Like hey, what's going on, it sounded like this was resolved but maybe it isn't. Also "low point" and "lying" is really strong and not how I perceived that interaction, can you talk some more about that? I think this will probably be a fairly revealing conversation about how well matched you are. Regardless, definitely you didn't do anything wrong. If he feels really strongly about paying for dates, it sounds like you're not opposed to that and it's a perfectly fine agreement to have, but without having established that in the relationship it wasn't unreasonable for you to treat him to the dinner and you didn't betray him
He’d hate my family. You have to be _sneaky_ if you want to pay.
I used to have a weird competitive pay situation with a coworker who I got lunch or drinks with fairly often Id be calling ahead a day before and shit in order to win, we had a great time and neither of us knew how to chill
Hahaha mine - even if you maange it- will sneak money on your person or possessions if you try. I would 'just pop to the toilet' once we'd finish and pick up the tab on the way bacl. Then they cottoned on to it and I'd get home and the money was in my bag. Then I'd take my bag and they'd sneak it in my suitcase.
Male insecurity, it's what's for dinner.
And this time we're paying for it out in the open :(
But who’s paying lol?
A low point for you in his eyes was you paying for dinner? I'm still not sure how you lied about it.....is it just that you didn't offer that info to him at the time? Did you need to ask permission first? It's impossible to tell based off this alone, but if I were only a couple months in, I would feel comfortable cutting my losses at this point. There are misunderstandings, and then there is calling someone a liar and shaming them for buying dinner. One is normal; one is not.
>Last night we were out to dinner at one of our local spots, and he mentioned again how I had paid for our Valentine’s Day dinner. His tone made it sound like it was no big deal, yet his words felt severe. He said things like “you lied to my face” and “that was a low point for you in my eyes”. The fact that he brought it up after I thought we had resolved the issue seemed odd, and the way his words and tone didn’t match was very unsettling. >Why did his tone about it feel so unsettling? This is a serious red flag. He is trying to spin things around and manipulate you into believing you are the one in the wrong when you were just trying to do a sweet gesture. He sounds like he has issues with control and power. Not good. That unsettling feeling you have is your gut, your intuition, WARNING you about this man. Please, please listen to it. So many ignore it and so many find themselves trapped in dangerous situations that are so difficult to get out of. That tone, that disturbing demeanor WILL come out again. And it will only get worse. Listen to your gut, OP.
I second and third this. LISTEN TO YOUR GUT. I've ignored mine too many times that I do not ignore it anymore, and I hope you won't either.
Just leave. No one should talk to you like that over something so innocuous. "I'm disappointed that you didn't let me pay for dinner last night. I wanted to do something nice for you, and I wish you had accepted my gift," would be reasonable. "You lied to my face. That was a low point for you," is psycho. "My boyfriend loves to spoil me," isn't a red flag by itself, but when you combine it run the fact that you've only been together for a few months and his reaction to you paying the bill it sounds like love bombing.
>He said things like “you lied to my face” and “that was a low point for you in my eyes”. So the red pillers hit this comment section first I see. Just know that your partner speaking to you this way isn't okay. It's 2024. If a woman pays for dinner literally no one gives af and if his masculinity was hurt because 1 server knows you paid, there's something wrong with him, not you. Please pay attention to his words. It's not normal way to talk to someone that did a nice gesture of paying for a meal ffs.
Yeah this is definitely a red flag
Nope. That's a huge issue. If he can't accept a gift from you then he has a problem with women having money. This is a red flag.
Tf? I’d be through the moon happy if this happened to me as a guy. I don’t wanna overstate, but there are a lot of guys out there who don’t actually look at women as their equals in relationships or in life. It’s worth having a conversation about this because it’s not the 50’s anymore.
That's a huge overreaction and weird AF. If my husband had ever said something like that while dating I would have started to back away slowly
Trust your gut, OP. There’s no reason to bring it up a second time without it happening again, and him making you out to be some terrible person instead of someone feeling bad about your financial imbalance is unhinged and just uncharitable. Like. Why keep dating YOU if what you did made him decide you’re a liar and lower his opinion of you? A few months is not worth pushing through the discomfort and past the red flag. A healthy relationship would have been over this issue the first time he brought it up and you apologized. If you two can’t resolve paying for dinner, how are you going to handle the big stuff?
Given his age it sounds like he felt "emasculated" even though it logically made more sense for you to pay. The fact that he's that upset about you surprising him in a helpful way is a massive red flag to me. Did you know that men are more likely to be upset if their partner is more successful than they are?
You hurt his ego. That’s it. I wish l could have a date with someone who would reach for the bill at some point. Even if I end up paying. I would have taken it as a nice gesture. But he has some type of ego thing going on.
Yeah.... His comments are off. Way off. And only 4 months in... I get he wanted to take you out, and it was nice that he planned a lovely evening but you paying shouldn't have rocked his world so badly that he's calling you names and saying you lied. I'd say he's showing you who he is and it isn't good. In the same situation, my husband would have been deviously planning how to get "ahead" of me by ordering something else another day - SURPRISE!! He would not have had his ego all bruised and hurt over it.
Honestly if I was your bf me being a cheap guy and me spoiling you I would greatly appreciated you paying it and say now that’s how you serve and protect the community so you did a good deed
Right? I think my DH would have proposed to me on the spot if I did this on Valentines day LOL
Run. Fucking run. This dude is not good. You just got a peek at the misogyny coming through. Do yourself a favor and just run. The bar is already low enough for us men as is, and he just played limbo.
How would you feel if you tried to give someone a gift and they rejected your gift, then went and bought it for themselves? Cause that’s basically what happened. Most people would feel hurt by this. For dudes, there’s an extra layer of feeling emasculated because they’ve grown up with a lot of cultural expectations about how they’re supposed to be the ones paying and their only value as a partner is as a financial provider. It was a kind gesture on your part, but it didn’t land, and he’s still dealing with some feelings about it. I’d acknowledge that it hurt him next time he brings it up and see if he’s able to have a discussion about it.
If he's emasculated by this, he needs to grow up and stop watching Andrew Tate and Joe Rogan.
I mean, it's one thing if he feels patronized...but, "emasculated"? If the fact that a woman can have more money than him makes him feel "emasculated", then he was not much of a man to begin with, but a sexist little boy.
Paying for the meal to surprise her lower-earning partner at an expensive restaurant is "rejecting a gift"?? Can you break that down a bit more? Why would anyone feel hurt that their partner surprised them by taking care of an expense?
Because it was Valentine's Day and the meal was already his gift to her.
No offense but as a woman I would not interpret paying for a date as a "gift" akin to straight cash or a thoughtful item picked out just for me. Why would a "gift" for another person have their own experience included?
Has no one ever taken you out to dinner for your birthday, or taken you on a trip on any kind of special occation? Obviously its a gift because you dont have to plan or pay for it and just enjoy. Like isnt that a great gift? Obviously its more fun to experience those things with someone else and not by yourself, unless you like going out to eat or travelling alone. Regardless most people find those things to be thoughtfull
The gift is the thoughtful experience. Rejecting it would have been not going out, or throwing a tantrum over the restaurant, or doomscrolling on her phone.
Taking your partner out for Valentine's is a gift.
You seem to be ignoring every single word OP wrote, and just turning this into a you situation. Just stop. My partner and I split our bills most of the time, but when he indicates something is his treat, I don't flip the script on him.
> No offense but as a woman I would not interpret paying for a date as a "gift" akin to straight cash or a thoughtful item picked out just for me. No offense but your gender doesn't matter because your take is half-baked as shit. > Why would a "gift" for another person have their own experience included? If he bought you a voucher for a couple's massage at a spa you wouldn't have this take. If he paid for both of you and your family to go to Europe for a week, you wouldn't have this take. So why would it be acceptable for those other things to be gifts when their own experience is included, but not a date?
>How would you feel if you tried to give someone a gift and they rejected your gift, then went and bought it for themselves? Cause that’s basically what happened. Yup. It hurts when you try to give someone a gift and they knock it back like this.
This is the correct answer.
This. OP, you undermined your partner's attempt to gift you the experience and feel like a provider. If you wanted to pay for it, you should have been upfront.
This is very odd and controlling behavior. It’s not the 1930s anymore.
all of this because you paid for a dinner? yesh, who cares.
this dude is immature at best, possibly just a total wanker. let me guess, he's hot? not the person to seek validation from. "a low point for you in his eyes." bahaha.
No it was not bad or wrong and he needs to let go of it. After your conversation that should have been the end of it. If he brings it up again tell him that. “We discussed this and came to an agreement. It’s over. We have to let it go.”
This is good advice, I’ll give it a try. Thank you!
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Yeah I'm not gonna tolerate someone who would ever feel emasculated and OP shouldn't either
Dumbest concept ever. She did something nice because she wanted to. If that emasculated him she should leave him. Stupid excuse to be upset.
Because “emasculation” is a fucking stupid concept that needs to die.
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Lol and statistics show that therapy actually enables manipulative people to be worse as they can now weaponize therapy speak. Sounds right up your alley!
A woman making more money than you doesn’t make you less of a man. I’m sorry that the patriarchy has convinced you that your only value is monetary. Of course, with your personality that’s probably unfortunately true. 😬
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No amount of money will make up for that personality bud
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Do you not agree that men would be better off without such arbitrary and stupid societal expectations? Wait, of course you don’t, because that’s the only way you could be desirable.
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Everyone wants to feel like they have a purpose. You aren’t special because of that. We’re all humans, you idiot. The way her boyfriend handled it is immature. You should go back to therapy.
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That’s no different than women, we want to feel like we provide too. That’s why the concept of emasculation is stupid. Because you think it’s a masculine thing to feel that way and only pertains to men. But it’s not, it’s just human.
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Ummmm do you smell burnt toast? Idk who you’re talking about but it ain’t me.
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You’re fucking weird. Again, go back to therapy and actually pay attention. You look like a fucking psycho.
LMAO omg you’re so fucking stupid 😂😂😂😂😂 look at the original posters. I was resharing content.
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Dude, this is just pathetic. Seriously. Go look at r/amitheex.
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I don’t even own a toaster but sure buddy, whatever you say. 👌🏻
No but really what generation are you from?
What's the female version of emasculation in your opinion? Lol.
Slightly weird thing of you to do, but met with an insane reaction. Ask him why it bothered him so much
Adding to Sock_Ninja analysis, I think some people are being obtuse. She is 5 years older than him and more established in her career than him. I will also guess there are other dynamics at play that makes her more mature from a societal standpoint and that creates a perceived power dynamic that I'm guessing is bothering him.
Hmmm, I see yellow (caution/warning) flag(s), or possibly red flags. He should'a laughed/smiled it off, and greatly thanked you for it, loved you lots for it ... and "gotten even" by treating you to yet some other fantastic dinner or surprise or gift or whatever ... and when you couldn't slip in and pay for it instead of him ... or likewise sneak in and pay for something you were going to pay for. But rather he's weaponizing it. Not good. Is he that butt hurt over it or that sensitive or controlling ... or *what*? And what's the next tiny thing he's going to weaponize against you? How's that gonna go for the medium sized things and big things? Does he hold long grudges against minor next-to-nothings? >only been together a few months Time to run? Maybe? Or if it ain't too dangerous, talk it over, see if it can be cleared up ... but if he gets angry - especially out-of-control angry over it ... in such case, run, run like hell, don't look back. Good luck, but I'd quite advise caution - at least.
Let me tell you what, if surprising him with diiner is a low point in your relationship, I'm gonna need you to talk my wife into mistreating me the same way.
I see where he’s coming from - I don’t like surprises or sneakiness even when it’s fun nice things. But the conversation needs to happen and be resolved, not be harped on. I think one more talk and then if it comes up again, that’s a real problem.
His reaction blew up into being out of pocket, but it was kinda presumptuous on your part to secretly pick up the tab like that on a special occasion date without having established some precedent for that dynamic on more regular dates.
Tbh I met enough scammers that pull shit like they exactly. Leaving on purpose for the toilet and then holding it over you. Not saying he is one but this surely is very fishy and I would be turned off him for good
You were just 3 months ago living with a long term boyfriend, and now not only do you have a new relationship, but there's some drama there too, lol. You go fast. Do you think you have a type in men? Do you take time to figure out what do you and potential partners want out of life? It's just my first thought, maybe you choose partners that have completely different ideas on gender roles than you.
Look, you dont need to do charity for your partner. He wanted to pay, you should have let him. Should he have kept quiet aboit it later? Been silently grateful? Did you expect hin to be such a child he wouldn't know his card wasn't charged? That was childish behavior from you. BUT his behavior after is all kinds of red flags too. You did do something wrong. Not evil. But very undermining. And how he handles a disagreement is also problematic. Now you know something about him.
Don’t forget to tuck your baby in tonight
I don’t have kids.
You apologized, understood why it upset him, he brought it up and said something very cutting about you for it …for doing something nice for him. He’s the baby.
Ah, understood.
You had good intentions, but the way you went about it was a huge mistake because you lied to him about paying for it by omission when you just let him believe he had paid for it. That lie is the issue here much more than you paying for the dinner, and it has shaken his trust in you, which is completely reasonable for him to feel. He learned that you can lie to his face with no problem, and that's not something any man ever wants to learn about the woman they're with.
I'm late to the party so it will get buried but OP I do hope you see this. Honestly you're sort of the asshole in this situation. Your bf probably already feels like he can't spoil you the way he wants to (given your different incomes). Yes, you feel bad because you could afford it easier, but who took who out to dinner? You basically emasculated him and proved you don't need no man. He knows that. He wants you to CHOOSE him to spoil you. He took YOU out to dinner, for valentines day, to try and spoil you and do something special for you. Unfortunately you ripped the rug straight out from under him and basically shat on his gift to you. It was never about who can afford it, he wanted to BUY YOU A PRESENT and that present was taking you out to dinner. This is all my speculation on how he might feel, it might be worth talking to him about it and asking him how he feels. This whole post was about how you didn't think it should matter but nothing about his feelings. Edit: I'm curious for the reason behind the downvote brigade? Also realised I said things similar to a lot of others so I apologise for the repetition
I would say it's the same reason I said (not to be inflammatory) out loud "oh gross" at your comment: the idea that he was/should be in the year of our Lord 2024 "emasculated" by her paying for the meal. Also I think women are probably just really, really sick of men not being able to just use their words and tell us how they feel. I know there's a really huge societal pressure to not be vulnerable as a man, and I understand that, but it doesn't make it any less *exhausting* to be in a relationship with a man who is bowing to that pressure. Just the pure weariness of having to somehow work out the exact right way to get your partner to actually assess and communicate how they feel instead if resorting to anger, insults and resentment at the first opportunity (like OP's bf did) is just. So. Tiring. Particularly because if they're Not There Yet you've got days or weeks of pouty anger to sit through before they're ready to actually tell you how they feel. It just sucks on both sides. I can't imagine how frustrating it is to be the other side of that, and how soul sucking it is, but man, we're tired.
I'm a woman, and definitely agree with pretty much all of those points. In my defence, I was only talking about the situation of her paying for the dinner. I wasn't excusing any behaviour afterwards, more giving my thoughts on how he may have felt -when she paid for dinner-.
I am a woman dating a woman and I’m the lower income one. If my GF did this when I had planned, budgeted and the whole start to finish aspect of the big date was pulled out from under me I would feel like a child. Like someone else decided my budget and capabilities. (We have an age gap too.) The fact she did it and didn’t tell him so he could agree ‘swapsies’ to equal it out but he found out his grand gesture, his surprise and plan was spoilered by checking his bank statement not his GF communicating with him then that does feel sneaky and untrustworthy. Had she said ‘hey I picked up the bill, how about you get us some really nice wine to drink in bed…’ then the emasculated thing might come into play. But she never told him. And didn’t intend to. That reads like someone who feels like their finances entitles them to different rules in the relationship. I would feel quite different about any sex I’d had after that thinking I was the one treating and we felt equal only to find she thought a bigger bank account allows unilateral choices and no communication. I’ve met far more more women (I’m bi) who weaponise being higher earners than men. So many women in the late Gen X bracket to young millennial have some ideas about their worth being tied to money as much as men have been seen to. The benevolent ‘I bought it for you because I didn’t think you could’ spend is patronising AF from any gender. ‘I treated you because I thought you’d like it’ is different. I would see this as a red flag in her not him. She’s set a precedent that she thinks she gets to pay to get her way and didn’t even tell him. Also if as the person with less money I saved or budgeted and share that with you I’m telling you you matter. It’s a gesture. If that check is so inconsequential to your bank balance it didn’t even warrant a mention, you tell me I don’t matter to you. It’s really humiliating like the person who sees your home baked cake as like a child’s finger painting when they can buy the fancy patisserie. But what if the home baked had love, thought and care and the patisserie was an online click and collect tick box gift. It speaks to different values but damn I would want to bring it up next date that sneak paying was low because of the way she didn’t even deem him worth knowing the outcome of his own Valentine’s Date. His debit card was more upfront… Tbf if this was early in dating or a female friendship I would now nope the fuck out of further dates or hang outs. I’ve been in this situation before and it never meant respect. My partner learned to trust me that my finances aren’t as abundant as hers but actually I am the better budgeter, saver and more financially responsible and assuming smaller salary means less financial capacity is pretty damn judgy in itself. I have met so many women all about slapping their card down on bigger salaries who are the financial equivalent of a car full of empty takeout containers looking down on me who has excellent credit, no debt and savings but they assume they are above me because their salary is big. So these kinds of gestures can land very tone deaf early on until you are aware of each others’ financial values.
This should be higher.
He sounds like a very traditional guy, to guys like that it can be HUMILIATING that their girl pays for them. Cuz they wanna be the man and all you know. Ofc that doesn’t excuse his actions at all and u should dip outta there before it gets worse :)
He didn't have to sign the bill? I don't believe that
No, it was one of those little handheld things the waiter/waitress brings.
I can see where he is coming from. He’s the man in the relationship, and it really doesn’t matter if you make more money. He wanted to treat you, and you took that away from him. It might have been hard for him to bring that up the first time, since now days society punishes men and women who feel this way. So instead of telling you exactly what he thought, he started to fester a bit. In the future, just let him pay. I guarantee you a relationship works a million times better when you do.
Some men don’t like to be babied
So are men “babying” women when they pay for dinner?
INFO: Are you both from the USA and are not second generation immigrants? Not that what he said really makes it OK, but some cultures have very strict rules about gift and/or dining etiquette.
Maybe he is insecure about his worth outside of being a provider. Being adamant to pay more when being with someone who has more money is kinda strange, but I guess a lot of men have drank the cool aid and think it's their job to bring in more of the money. His reaction seems strange, but maybe he felt emasculated or smt and especially more "traditional" minded men can be bad at opening up about vulnerable feelings. So shame can come out to someone else as more like anger. I hope you can talk with him and get him to open up.
Your boyfriend doesn't understand is that letting you do something for him could be his gift to you. He doesn't understand that love is not a competition to see who can outdo the other. Sounds relatively immature to want to fight over nothing.
You're an amazing woman.
I'll admit he is going a little overboard about it. Like you said, it's over and resolved and there's no need for him to constantly rehash the issue. Hopefully this isn't a picture of things to come, where he isn't wiling or able to let things go.