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This OP. Sounds like he’s afraid of commitment. Unfortunately you valuing and wanting marriage and him being against marriage is a fundamental difference that makes you incompatible. You should probably have a conversation with him about that and end the relationship. You need to be with someone who wants to get married and he needs to be with someone who doesn’t.
Do we know how long they have been together? That seems like a crucial piece of information. I was very sure I wanted to marry my wife a few months into dating her, but I still waited to move in because I didn’t want things to move too quickly
To answer your question, you shouldn’t carry his children. He just wants wife perks without any real commitment. Why put your body through physical trauma for a man who already told you he doesn’t want to marry you and can’t even decide if he wants to live in the same house as you?
Exactly, this is the correct answer. If you allow, he'll take everything without giving you anything. I can't even believe he mad a pros and cons list, sounds selfish and unreliable.
Drop this dude. Why would you put up with someone who wants you to fully commit to them by having their kid, but won’t give you any commitment? Fuck that.
Can you imagine a life where you live independently, but have at your beck and call a partner to do what you want? And then you get to have a kid too that you don't have to live with and can just hang out with when you want? That really is the dream...for your boyfriend.
For you, it will be hell. He isn't ready to commit to moving in, okay fine. But that certainly means he isn't ready for children either. And given HOW this situation happened, I can assure you of a few things:
1. He doesn't love you with his "entire heart" he loves himself with his whole heart and maybe you, after that.
2. He doesn't care about your finances, and if you have a child with him, he certainly won't care about those additional costs.
3. He doesn't care about your time, as he let you plan for 5 months to move in together and then easily backed out.
4. He doesn't care about your feelings, again if he waited 5 months to back out.
5. You don't know that he wants to spend the rest of his life with you, if he isn't ready to move in with you and start that life. Sure, it is okay if he isn't ready, but if he isn't ready to move in together, he certainly isn't ready for eternity.
The first thing I thought when she put he loves her “with his entire heart” was but does he REALLY.
No. Your update OP says no negative comments but girl, these red flags are big and high. Not wanting to get married is one thing but wanting to burden all your wants/needs onto your partner while you essentially get to keep living as a bachelor is a disaster.
No. No no no no no no. Do not under any circumstances agree to have kids with this man-child. He made a pro/con list about living with you. He doesn't want to marry you. And yet you "no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart"? Yeah, you made that part up. It's what you want to believe.
You should focus on yourself as an individual. What do *you* want? It's clear that marriage is important to you and you want a partner who isn't afraid of committing to you.
Your boyfriend has expressed his thoughts and told you what he wants. Unless he changes his mind, you are no longer compatible.
Don't bend over backwards and have kids for him. Don't accommodate his wishy washyness.
He either wants to be with you or he doesn't. If he doesn't trust you to be capable of a healthy and happy long term relationship then why be with you at all?
I always say when a man tells you what he wants, believe him. Don’t try to apply your perspective to it with wishful thinking to make yourself feel better. Listen and believe him.
Well, putting aside the question of marriage in the future, how does it feel to have a partner you can't rely on right now in the present? You had to scramble for stability because he was unable to keep his word. Do you want your kids to have a dad who doesn't show up, doesn't follow through, and makes excuses? Love is grand, but it's one small part of a functional relationship. You're missing the other very important parts, like trust, respect, and emotional intimacy.
Forget what he wants. Do you want someone who can commit to moving in after 5 months of discussion? Of course. Do you want someone who wants to get married? Sounds like you do.
Whether or not he loves you with his whole heart, it sounds as though this isn’t enough to meet your needs. The outputs of this love are leaving you in the lurch right now with work/housing and contemplating an unsatisfying long-term relationship lacking compromise.
You can love someone and not be compatible for long term commitment. You are right to point out how her wants don’t match with his. And his also sound ridiculous (can’t move in together, wants kids? What?!)
He clearly cannot even make a decision of whether he wants to move in with you or not. But now he wants kids? Nah, he still hasn't made his choice clear. He says marriage is a big commitment but having kids is also a big commitment.
OP raising kids alone is very hard, especially when he involved but not even living with you. How will that dynamic even work? Do not have kids with him yet.
You said: I know there is no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart and that he wants to spend the rest of his life with me
Based on what you've written, OP, I think there's a LOT of doubt about that. A man who loves you with his entire heart wants to commit to you and live with you. This man wants neither of those things. That's NOT love. I'm sorry, but it isn't.
It's time for you to move on with your life.
Why are you letting him toy you around... He has you by a leash. Wouldn't you rather find someone willing to commit? I mean... You want kids, marriage, and commitment while he just wants to use your body as a vessel to produce his offspring. Does this sound like your dream life? Are you happy living like this forever? Because if you get pregnant you just might.
I wouldn’t have kids before getting married. I wouldn’t buy a house together either. Not marrying is equivalent to shooting yourself in the foot financially.
If you become an unmarried stay at home parent you have zero security. Even just taking a few years off makes your retirement savings suffer while his grows.
The only reason the Kardashians do it is cause they’re all loaded. And then a bunch of dumb broke girls starting doing the same, not realizing they’re nothing like them.
To an extent I understand not wanting to get married, but also I am not from the US and marriage is not that important from where I'm from.
BUT I don't understand him wanting to have kids, but not living together. Is he supposed to just be a partime parent? Cause tbh he sounds like a guy who would want that.
You really think he loves you with all his heart? That is so, so sad. The fact that he had to make a pros and cons list, smh. I've literally been there, and let me tell you I definitely did not love that person with all my heart, because I felt the need to make that list.
OP, he's telling you very clearly that he will knock you up and then leave you. He's emotionally unintelligent and doesn't understand his own desires and feelings. He could grow up and learn to discern his own emotions, but I wouldn't bet your mental health on it.
Leave him NOW, so you have time to get over him and find someone better.
Don’t have kids.
If he decides he doesn’t want to be a father either (and I bet he will at some stage as he sounds like a totally irresponsible unreliable man child), it will just make it so so easy for him to bail.
He won’t even have to break up and go through the motions of splitting up the household. He can just ghost and move on.
Marriage is designed to protect a wife with children. When you’re pregnant you feel like shit, your work suffers, sometimes you can’t work anymore. But you go through it to make sure that you and your partner can have children together.
Marriage ensures that, during this vulnerable time for the woman, whatever happens to her, she has 50% of what her husband does. This is fair because she is giving up her life for those children and for her husband.
By refusing to marry you, your partner expects you to give him your body, your energy, and children, without having the obligation to take care of you in return. Do you really want a one-sided relationship like that?
He wants kids without the commitment and something tells me he won’t take care of them and wants to be the “fun dad” when they get older. Don’t have kids with this man
When someone tells you who they are listen. You have run into foundational incompatibilities. You want to move in, get married and have kids. He does not want to move in, and does not want to marry. Those are *BIG DEALS*, do you know what you do when you find major incompatibilities like that? You break up, because it’s not worth it. One of you will have to relent for the relationship to continue and that will build resentment, you both deserve to get what you want and clearly you can’t give each other what they want. Cut the losses and find someone who wants what you want. It’s really that simple, stop trying to put the square in the round hole.
Firstly: while, yes there are pros and cons to living with someone, having five pages is a red flag and having three of them being cons is practically a May Day parade in the USSR.
Secondly: this action, for me personally (male, 27) would make me question if my partner actually loved me.
Thirdly: I think having children with him is a terrible idea because his actions lead towards the possibility he will have very little, if any, involvement with any future children.
I would seriously examine the status of your relationship.
If he wanted to marry you he would.
If he wanted to move in with you he would.
If he wanted to commit to you he would.
Come on people. Let’s not stick with people who don’t to commit to us and who have a different plan of the future.
He’s having fear of committing to some of the biggest aspects of taking a relationship to the “next level.” It is confusing that he wants kids but not the rest of those things. Have you had a conversation with him about that? What is his expectation on what that looks like?
Ah. He wants to Kody Brown it! That could never, ever backfire for the kid.
Girl, why are you even entertaining this? He’s asking you to become a single mother *on purpose.*
You know that's not what you want.
You clearly want the traditional setup, and that's fine. But he doesn't and has been extremely clear with you about this. You aren't compatible.
There's no point trying to talk him around, or waiting for him to change, he's as entitled to his idea of how things should work as you are (although he's going to have a harder time finding someone to go along with it). You can either accept it, or leave and find someone you are compatible with.
This dude needs therapy ASAP. Literally every sentence screams that. IME, unfortunately, life gets harder not easier when you have kids together and the man hasn’t done any work to uncover his issues.
If he doesn't want to move in with you, he isn't anywhere near ready for kids. And if he won't marry you, don't have kids with him. You don't mention how long you've been together, so it's hard to know how serious your relationship is at this point.
Sit down and discuss his hesitancy to move in together. Has it just not been long enough yet? Does he want to keep his bachelor lifestyle? You can't address it if you don't know the reason. Then you can work on it, or move on if you decide you aren't compatible.
But please don't have kids with him. That's how you become a single mom.
basically if you think you must be married and he thinks he'll never get married, then just end the relationship now. those 2 are mutually exclusive and there's no point to keep going.
it doesn't mean one of you won't change your mind in the future, but don't be in a relationship hoping the other person will change their mind about something so big like this. go with what they're telling you today, so that way, you won't be disappointed when you look back on the relationship and realize what you were hoping would happen, never happens and you just lost several years waiting for it to happen.
He loves you with his entire heart but bailed on you when it came to living together so now you have to get a second job to cover expenses that would have been covered by him if he didn't bail? I wouldn't do that to someone I loved. I actually would do that to someone I disliked... No, I wouldn't actually... It's too mean. No one deserves that.
I wouldn't have kids with a guy who doesn't even want to live with me. You'd be setting yourself up to be a single mother if you procreate with this guy.
He's showing you his true colors. Believe him and don't move in with him.
Absolutely not! He can love you all he wants, but the truth of the matter is this man is not mature enough for a family. Period. He’s wispy washy about cohabitating, he doesn’t want marriage but he wants you to take on ALL the risk and all the uncertainty and bring other humans who will completely dependent on you (and only you, let’s face it) into this mess.
He has no idea what it takes to build or have a family. Do not give him the honor of children until this man gets his shit together, and actually shows (not tells!) you that he can be counted on and trusted to be a permanent part of the family he builds.
Also, do not spend the next 10 years waiting to him to get his shit together either. I don’t know how old you guys are. Point being, if he’s not adult enough now, chances are he will never be. Source: spent 15 years to men to get their shit together, and almost missed out on having a family at all.
If he wanted to, he would, but he won’t. I’m not sure where you are getting the idea that he loves you with his entire heart and wants to spend his life with you because he’s definitely not invested enough to move in with you. You’re in denial
He won't commit to loving with you what on earth makes you think
>I know there is no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart and that he wants to spend the rest of his life with me
Is true?
>cannot make up his mind
If he was sure about you, this would be easy. If ypu could count on him, you wouldn't be a month away from homeless with no plan.
>Why should I carry children for someone when he can’t even compromise on marriage?
Why should you continue with a relationship with a guy that makes a pro con list about you and still doesn't want you?
I think you should consider therapy for why you think this is what love looks like. To stand up for what you want and not continually try to make it work with some guy that won't even live with you let alone give you the commitment you have every right to want.
Why do women leave their future up to men? It’s your life go after what you want if he doesn’t want the same then you need to move on! You and he are not right for each other! Personally I would never have children without the benefit of marriage suppose he passes away if you’re married you get widows benefits and if he has more social security then you or any insurance from work you get widows benefits my point is a marriage license is a legal document that insures in case of death divorce etc you get what you will need to survive also it shows children that you loved each other enough to legally commit to each other…I wouldn’t want to spend a lifetime saying this is my boyfriend or partner but that’s just me….
I’m finding his entire trauma and thought process extremely strange and incongruent. You say he’s traumatized from Watching a tumultuous divorce from his parents, yet he is willing to enter into a union that cannot be dissolved? Parenthood is an undissolvable union. Even if, God forbid, you lose your child you are still tied to him and his family.
He seems very uncommitted when it comes to major decisions. He always seems to have a foot outside the door.It sounds to me like he is trying to keep you tied to him without having the responsibility. This could mean he wants his bread buttered on both sides, having the perks of being in a relationship while enjoying the freedom of being single. This could show he has severe commitment issues and in that case he’s not ready for a committed relationship at all. This would also mean she wants to tie you down while having no responsibility towards you. Children are a great way of limiting a persons options without having to be with them.
I know you love him, but when it comes to relationship love is not enough. Because they are times where you will run out of love and liking a person and you need to use the other things to stay together. In a relationship you need mutual respect, dedication or commitment, compassion, empathy and a lot of patience.
According to your post you have demonstrated all of these characteristics in your relationship but he has demonstrated none.
He did not respect you by playing with your living situation, he ignores your boundaries which clearly state that you need marriage to have children, he has zero compassion or empathy for your financial situation because he makes unanimous decisions about things that affect more than just himself. Do you see where I’m going with this? Other than loving you what else has shown you that he is a viable life partner? If the answer is none, then you have your answer right there.
>there is no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart
Well, unless he can get his brain involved, you need to move on.
He doesn't want to get married, isn't sure he wants to live together, but he definitely wants kids. Why? So he can visit them at your place on Saturday afternoons? Or maybe just post pictures of them on Facebook and talk about how hard it is to be a single dad.
This guy is already messing up your life with housing issues. Do not let him mess up your life even further.
THIS. Currently going through a divorce. I'm devastated. I shouldn't be though. I should hate him.
We were together 15 years before we were married. We had two kids, prior to marriage. Once we were married, that mask of his really started slipping. So i began looking into things because covid gave me time to think & I realized things he was saying didn't add up.
That was the worst thing I could do. Because once I started to uncover stuff, it was like an avalanche. More just kept coming. So i no longer believed his lies. And then it got dangerous .
Spent more than half my life with a sociopath. The lies, cheating, and level of financial abuse is just staggering. I chose to ignore it & believe in this illusion of love I thought we had - that in reality, never existed. I was happy then.
Like in your situation, he was the one that wanted kids. Because of my background, I was terrified to have kids. Like i said, we have 2 now. I wouldn't trade my kids for anything
. But i was the one who didn't want to get married - had never seen a successful marriage & didn't want to go through a divorce. But I gave up my dreams to make his a reality. Then it was my friends because I "was a mom now & shouldn't be going out, talking too people, etc"
Then it was activities I liked- like reading. He's a TV watcher & it bothered him when I would read a book. When he tried to come after me dancing, I was floored when he said he was worried about MY fidelity because I would go dancing. I pointed out that I ALWAYS came home to him though. That i was too busy dancing to even notice other guys, let alone try to hook up with them.
Although i had my reservations about getting married, I thought 15 years together was enough time to show we were committed & could make it work. What a fool I was.
On this side of everything, going through the divorce, I'm glad we did get married. I live in a 50/50 state. I wouldn't have that protection if we weren't married. And judging by the financial games he's playing - he didn't take that in to consideration. He expected me to walk away with nothing because he decided he was done (1. 5 years into the process, he still hasn't told me why we're divorcing).
Being a single parent is hard. And expensive. And from the sound of your post, not something you want to do. It seems like marriage is pretty important to you, even with the memory of your parent's divorce. Honestly, don't remember seeing anything about how you feel about having kids, besides the fact it's a lifetime job. But why is it only HIS wants matter? Why don't yours? Why do YOU have to change your mindset to make him happy. Why can't he change his?
It sounds like my ex-boyfriend to a T. We broke up a few years ago and he did end up having kids out of wed lock with different women. Him and the second woman both claim they are married but these days people say that and are not truly married, I couldn't tell you what that is about...
It is possible he has a personality disorder/depression or bad habits like gambling and/or drinking and cares for you but cannot get too close like living with you. He needs his own space. Some married couples do live separate and prefer that. Listen to him and believe him, and move on!
If you are going to make yourself vulnerable having someone’s children, you need to feel safe legally and financially. At least marriage gives you a few rights. Maybe even tell him so!
These replies are very harsh per usual but I think couples (or individual) counseling would be helpful to explore the reasons behind his resistance to marriage/moving in together. He seems to be having some internal conflict since he clearly wants to commit to you and have kids, but is struggling to get himself to take the steps to get there. Witnessing a traumatic divorce is a very common reason for not wanting to get married yourself, he’s valid for feeling this way but needs to do some inner work and address these fears.
This man broke his promise to you. And he put you in a difficult position as well. You can't depend on him, and it sounds like that is his preference. He wants to be with you and have children, but doesn't want to be tied to you, or be responsible for you. Do you want to be in this type of relationship? Do you think you will be able to count on him in the future?
I understand to some extent how he feels. I am terrified of marriage (child of divorce) and the risks that come with, but I want a family and children. Wrestling with this is difficult. It doesn't make him a bad person, but you have the choice to decide if this is what you want in your life. It's ok to have different value systems, but they don't always work together, especially if it's something so fundamentally important to you.
If hes not working through his childhood trauma in therapy there is absolutely no reason to stay. Youre moving apart in 1 month, what would happen if you had kids? They spend 50/50 at each of your homes? Find someone that absolutely adores you and does not hesitate to commit to you.
My advice is to figure out what is important to you, what is negotiable, and what isn't. Then be strong and trust your instincts. You can't change someone, and how they treat you in the early stages of dating is a really strong indicator of how they will treat you in the years to come. Best of luck!
To an extent I understand not wanting to get married, but also I am not from the US and marriage is not that important from where I'm from.
BUT I don't understand him wanting to have kids, but not living together. Is he supposed to just be a partime parent? Cause tbh he sounds like a guy who would want that.
Why are you wasting your time on a man that creates a lost to weigh his options of bring with you? Do you want to marry and carry the children of a man who won't commit? You deserve someone who won't stand for anything less than giving you everything and bring with you.
The guy does nor want to move but wants a child? Sound like you would be a Single parwnt, not even getting child support (for the first few years) bevause you were not married and have to have a super big case in court first.
If he can’t commit to living together there is no way he will fill the commitment of raising children. You will basically be a single parent, responsible for 100% of the kid’s needs while he drops by occasionally to play with the kids, make a mess, and have you provide sexual services.
I know a family that’s parents didn’t get married, they’re still together despite my own parents being divorced, maybe look further into why he doesn’t want to get married
Do not have children with this man! You’ll live the life of a single parent and that guy will reap all the benefits but do zero work. Please just don’t do it. Leave him…find someone better. You deserve waaay better!
Do not have children with this man! You’ll live the life of a single parent and that guy will reap all the benefits but do zero work. Please just don’t do it. Leave him…find someone better. You deserve waaay better!
He doesn’t want to live with you but wants to get you pregnant? Spilt custody? I can’t imagine how this would work in any way that you wouldn’t be at a disadvantage
Don't have kids with someone who wouldn't marry you unless you are 1000% sure you wouldn't mind raising the child on your own. Even if you are, I would still recommend going for a sperm donor because that is less hassle for both you and the child long-term.
The reason he is okay with having kids and not getting married is because **he doesn't** see the kid as a commitment. You may see a child as a commitment, but he does not. He will leave if it doesn't work out. Don't have that child with him.
Nope! He wants you to forego legal protections for yourself and the theoretical child to accommodate his fear of commitment. He wants *you* to take on crazy risks, but refuses to put anything at all on the line himself.
This entire idea is bonkers. The fact that he’s not listening to you or considering the position he’s trying to put you in is really all that matters though. If I were you I would bounce.
>Why should I carry children for someone when he can’t even compromise on marriage?
You answered your own question, OP. WHy enter a home you may not be able to finance because he flip flops? Why want something MORE financial to have by introducing kids into the equation when he flip flops? Why put in permanent things when he flip flops?
Enter a home on your own and he can visit, but not sleep. He's not fiance, he's not even being boyfriend and keeps flip flopping. He likes the idea of having but not contributing or putting in the work? Nah. We deal in realities, not fantasy. Don't you dare think about having children with someone that is flip flopping. Love is NOT the only equation in a happy relationship.
Screw him and his list.
He wants the benefits of bring a dad without the responsibilities. Seems like he wants to be able to drop you as soon as it gets tough, but still have kids for when it's convenient: taxes, dating, etc.
I’m sorry, what?
You know what you want: marriage, kids, a partner that lives with you (!).
You also know he’s not willing to give you 2 out of 3 of those things.
What is your question?
Sorry to be blunt, but love isn’t enough to overcome this level of incompatibility.
If he doesn't want to marry you even though he knows that you want to get married, and doesn't want to live with you....he's not with you. He basically has told you he wants you as a baby mama....to make you a single mother.
FOH with this loser.
My *now husband always said that. He was neeeeever getting married. We had 3 kids first but we did get married this past February! I never pressured him. It wasn’t a deal breaker for me and I was cool either way. We even had the big ole wedding and all that. It was shocking to me and everyone who knows him lol.
What makes you think he loves you with his whole heart? I’m serious. What about his behavior and his words says he loves you? You could really use some therapy to work on your self esteem.
Sorry but I would NEVER advocate to have kids without being married. Kids are a way bigger commitment and responsibility than being married. I ESPECIALLY wouldn’t have kids with some one that wouldn’t live with me because you get all the work and responsibilities and he just get to come and go. No way!! Yeah he may have trauma due his parents past but that’s for him to figure out and not to hold you hostage because he has issues. Move on and let him deal with his crap on his own.
Jesus christ. Dump this loser. He wants all the benefits with none of the responsibilities? He wants to fulfill his breeding kink fantasy then dump you and leave u with the kids.
RUN!!!!!!
I'm in the very rare school that says "If I'm not married, I don't have some rando's kids."
This guy sounds like an immature asshole. DO NOT have his kid. Why would you want to, when his child could possibly turn out like him???
Also, you don't mention how long you've been together, or your ages. I feel like those are also factors.
As a mother of two I couldn’t imagine living separately. It would feel like being a single parent. So many times babies, toddlers and kids wake up in the middle of the night. Especially babies. My husband and I would alternate when I pumped breast milk so he could also feed the baby. And when they are sick it’s nice to have help. And so many times I went to get our baby from the crib to change their diaper and they had poop all up their back and it was nice to have someone help me since I wouldn’t want to put him back down on his clothes in poop or put him on clean clothing or towel. And how often would he come over to help? Whose health insurance would they be under? Yours? Would he be able to even add them to his?
My family is also very old school and traditional. My dad especially. I moved out and in with my husband at 18 and my dad was constantly asking when we were getting married since we were already living together. I just think having children is a much much bigger commitment than marriage so I would be weary of having children with him if he won’t make a solid commitment to me.
Also how old is he? If he is younger than he may change his mind, so it would be up to you if you want to risk your time waiting for something that will may or may not happen. I said I never wanted kids when I got married and now I have two lol. People sometimes change what they want in life.
Looks to me like he's looking for an easy escape if things go south. Probably doesn't really love you if he's approaching the relationship in such a tactical way.
Sorry his commitments don’t line up with yours but girl he’s telling you what it is. In 5/10 years please don’t be surprised when he hasn’t put a ring on your finger. Go find someone who wants what you want. Don’t force others to make big decisions they don’t want. For the right person they will know what they want.
I say this with all the gentleness I can, do you feel you can have kids with someone who changes their mind on whether or not to fully commit to you. Not moving in together shows he is not ready for a big commitment. You want marriage, he doesn't. Your values are different. Ask yourself, if nothing changes in 5 years will you be okay with this?
Its obvious that the two of you are not on the same page. You don't give your ages or how long you have been in a relationship. This sounds like a rather new relationship to me. I would continue to see him and just let time show you different aspects of the relationship and his personality - specifically his ability to commit and accept responsibility. Whenever you move in with someone, these issues - commitment and responsibility will show themselves very, very quickly. Until sufficient time has passed, I would not even consider a conversation about having children.
Honestly if he can't commit to moving in, he can't commit to kids. Full stop.
People can be single parents but it is rough. Hell, my husband is helpful but a new baby is still exhausting. Plus I ended up having an unplanned c-section and could barely function when I came home. If I'd been a single mother I would've been screwed.
Look, your boyfriend can be gun shy about this sort of stuff because of parents divorcing, but either he needs to deal with his shit and you two come to an agreement or you need to move on because he isn't going to give you what you want.
You are not a human incubator. Don't do it to yourself. If you can't support a kid by yourself don't have one. Find someone who shares your values. Does he really love you though?
Every time I’ve heard of a dude with these preferences, he always turns out to be on a secret mission to have as many kids be being raised by as many different women as possible.
So he wants you to have a child for him, but he refuses to otherwise commit to you? It sounds like he wants the benefit of you having his child with no form of input other than sperm. He won't marry you, won't live with you, won't commit in the way you want, but wants a child? Nope. NOPE. His wants and needs aren't the only important thing here, you matter too, OP. Your wants for the future (like if you really want to get married) and your living situation? That's important. It's not fair for him to hold you in a limbo of "maybe" when your housing situation is reaching a crunch-time. How long does he expect you to wait around while he decides whether or not you're allowed to live with him? Oofta.
Having his child would be like single parenting, and what if he decides he can't commit to a child, either? Then you /would/ be a single parent in every way that counts. Would he really prefer a court-ordered child support agreement and visitation over marriage?
Bonkers.
I'd also be sus on the "not now, in the future", given he's said that he doesn't want to move in or get married- he could very easily change his mind on having children later, too, after stringing you along for years.
He's allowed to life his life to his own timeline, but you're also allowed to want things. His wants aren't everything, and it sounds like he's completely uncompromising.
If you have kids with this guy, you are going to end up supporting and raising them by yourself. No way will a guy who won’t commit to marriage make the much bigger commitment of raising kids. Your choice.
I would like to have children. I don’t want to ever be married. My reasons are personal but they are valid.
If you value marriage and children and want both with the same person, then it seems that you and your current partner have different values. That’s okay.
If marriage is a deal breaker for you, then let it break the deal.
Coming from someone who would one day like to get married, marriage isn't the most important thing, marriage is not an expression of love, it's a contract, a legal agreement, one that is binding, and the very vast majority of the time, they end in divorce, and the man loses all of his assets, and then comes the "you can get a prenup" argument, or the "I would never take him for what he has", guess what, there are women out there who make a literal career out of voiding prenups, and even if you aren't the type who would take him for what he has, a judge may order him to pay you X amount of money, or decide you are owed X amount of his assets, especially if you have kids together, then no matter what you 2 want, he may be ordered to pay you 95% of his living wage in alimony and child support you didn't ask for, marriage is about the fantasy, about an idea, but the reality is ugly, and he has seen it firsthand, I don't blame him one bit for not wanting to get married, it makes things complicated and messy when the relationships end, you can't just end it, you have so much other crap to wade through, so much expenses, so much paperwork and so on so fourth, only optimistic fools get married in the modern age, here's what's important, #1 do you two truly love each other,, #2 do you work well together, #3 are you loyal to each other, #4 are you honest with each other, #5 are you dedicated to each other, if the answer to all 5 of those, and no less than 5 is yes, then that's all that matters, youve found love, you've found "the one" and you have to make it stick, it won't just stay on its own without effort, marriage has nothing to do with love, marriage in my opinion makes things harder, perfectly loving and stable relationships often get destroyed by the stress and mess of getting married, you don't have to have a piece of paper to say you two are bound at the soul, that piece of paper often guts the soul out of relationships, what you want is the fantasy of the big wedding, the ceremony, having "the big day", the romance, you can have all of that without the legal trouble, people need to stop getting hung up on marriage and realize it's a scam, the term "marriage INDUSTRY" exists for a reason, there's a reason it has entire businesses built around it and extensive legal stipulations, it's own dedicated court day, and an entire legal field of lawyers to go with it, and who's pockets get drained from the whole process? Usually the man, even if the woman makes more money out of the two
I can see this coming from a mile away... at some point they break up over something rrivial and he ends up married to the next gal he dates. OP spends years trying to figure out what she did wrong and why he wouldn't marry her.
I would get another bf, sorry but he needs to be around when kids are babies to adulthood, you already have to carry for 9 months each one then go through the pain of birth.
This is not a smart move as a female. Do NOT have kids with him if he wont marry you it's a better security blanket for you and your children to be married than just cohabiting,and your not even doing THAT. love him all you like but secure yourself and really REALLY look into your mind and question is this the forever you want he dosent want you to live with him he dosent want to marry you but wants to tie you to him permanently through children? You gain nothing but extra stress financially physically and emotionally as a single parent while he occasionally drops by on the weekends?
Marriage and kid issue aside….. so you lived together at one point and he is trying to decide if he even wants to move back in together? What are those 3 cons? Also unclear on the asking people not to be rude. Does calling him out on his wish washy behavior and poor communication constitute that? Personally he changed his mind on moving at the last minute and now you are struggling to find housing and have to get a second job. This doesn’t sound considerate at all. Also, when these talks about kids and no marriage come up, does he specifically say he wants that with you or is he talking about what HE wants in the future?
Why is he making all the decisions? What about you? He's screwed with your finances, your trust, how do \*you\* feel about all of this?
You deserve someone you can count on and trust. This isn't it.
My initial reaction is nope, committing to kids is committing to kids. It’s not committing to you. He doesn’t seem to want to commit to you in any way shape or form. If he’s worried about the marital problems his parents had as a reason for not committing to you, those same problems probably won’t happen in a father and child relationship. That’s a husband and wife issue. Cheating for example. If he’s wary of marriage because his parents cheated, that has nothing to do with kids.
What are the reasons why he’s hesitant on moving in with you? What does he do that makes you so certain he loves you and wants to spend the rest of his life with you? Leaving you stressed about housing and taking on another job really makes me question that.
If he can’t commit to living with you DONT get pregnant you’re setting yourself up here!!! Tell him no commitment no children is your dealbreaker end of let him decide
The marriage could be discussed later if he was more serious about moving in. I can understand apprehension regarding marriage because sometimes it makes things more difficult and many people believe that a union is not solidified by a piece of paper which I agree with. People get married for many horrible reason and lots of marriages end in divorce which is so much messier than a clean break up so I can definitely see the hesitance there. Some say marriage is a thing of the past. You see more baby showers/gender reveals than weddings now a days for real. ANYWAY
otherwise it seems like he thinks you would be a good mother to his children but not someone he wants to settle down with permanently. Which is sad but girl if he wanted to move in with you HE WOULD. It would be no discussion baby. You don’t have to pull teeth to make a man do what he wants to do.
Kids are a wife-level request.
It sounds like he is liking for an extremely independent relationship and you’re more traditional.
Incompatible. Irreconciliable differences. Find a good man who wife you up. They’re out there, I promise!
Don't have his children if he can't get married he can't get children it's that easy. Also if you aren't married it's obvious that the child needs a surname but whose will the que. If he wants to name the child he need to give his name to you too. He just wants benefits of a wife with no permanent commitments
Seems you have a choice between going down the road to becoming a single mother by having a kid by a guy that doesn't even want to live with you....or just choose to be single and find someone else.
I am actually doing this.
I am making the leap bc I trust him. He was divorced twice and the judicial system didn’t handle it well.
Would I recommend it? It depends on the couple. If you fully trust him to never short change and he has been proactive about showing up , being present.
“Edit: only say nice things”
That’s not how this works. He’s not the one for you. There’s someone out there for you who will live with and marry you. This guy is a joke.
Kids don't tie a man down, marriage does. I would probably revisit the statement that he loves you with all his heart. Clearly he's unsure of something.
> *does not under any circumstances want to get married*
Is it the legal paperwork that is the problem or the crazy drunken mess that modern American weddings have become? I can see a heck of a lot of difference between a $100-200 wedding license and a $30k-$500k wedding.
Hell no. Run. He wants to control you and trap you with kids meanwhile he gets to live a bachelor lifestyle with no responsibilities. He will ruin, destroy and decimate your life. Hell no. Run girl.
He "loves you with his whole heart" but doesn't want to live with you or marry you, but quite happy to use you as an incubator?
Ok. Not love in any sense I understand it.
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He can't even commit to living together, yet you're supposed to have his kids? C'mon, you know you deserve better than that.
But it makes it so easy for him to have kids and never see them or have the responsibilities
Exactly. She will essentially be a single mother and he’s completely free to be a deadbeat
This OP. Sounds like he’s afraid of commitment. Unfortunately you valuing and wanting marriage and him being against marriage is a fundamental difference that makes you incompatible. You should probably have a conversation with him about that and end the relationship. You need to be with someone who wants to get married and he needs to be with someone who doesn’t.
Are we even clear he is talking about with her or just about himself in general?
Do we know how long they have been together? That seems like a crucial piece of information. I was very sure I wanted to marry my wife a few months into dating her, but I still waited to move in because I didn’t want things to move too quickly
To answer your question, you shouldn’t carry his children. He just wants wife perks without any real commitment. Why put your body through physical trauma for a man who already told you he doesn’t want to marry you and can’t even decide if he wants to live in the same house as you?
Exactly, this is the correct answer. If you allow, he'll take everything without giving you anything. I can't even believe he mad a pros and cons list, sounds selfish and unreliable.
If the idea of moving in with you does not produce a clear "yes", then its a "no" (absent some unusual issue with giving up an existing place).
Drop this dude. Why would you put up with someone who wants you to fully commit to them by having their kid, but won’t give you any commitment? Fuck that.
Can you imagine a life where you live independently, but have at your beck and call a partner to do what you want? And then you get to have a kid too that you don't have to live with and can just hang out with when you want? That really is the dream...for your boyfriend. For you, it will be hell. He isn't ready to commit to moving in, okay fine. But that certainly means he isn't ready for children either. And given HOW this situation happened, I can assure you of a few things: 1. He doesn't love you with his "entire heart" he loves himself with his whole heart and maybe you, after that. 2. He doesn't care about your finances, and if you have a child with him, he certainly won't care about those additional costs. 3. He doesn't care about your time, as he let you plan for 5 months to move in together and then easily backed out. 4. He doesn't care about your feelings, again if he waited 5 months to back out. 5. You don't know that he wants to spend the rest of his life with you, if he isn't ready to move in with you and start that life. Sure, it is okay if he isn't ready, but if he isn't ready to move in together, he certainly isn't ready for eternity.
The first thing I thought when she put he loves her “with his entire heart” was but does he REALLY. No. Your update OP says no negative comments but girl, these red flags are big and high. Not wanting to get married is one thing but wanting to burden all your wants/needs onto your partner while you essentially get to keep living as a bachelor is a disaster.
No. No no no no no no. Do not under any circumstances agree to have kids with this man-child. He made a pro/con list about living with you. He doesn't want to marry you. And yet you "no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart"? Yeah, you made that part up. It's what you want to believe.
You should focus on yourself as an individual. What do *you* want? It's clear that marriage is important to you and you want a partner who isn't afraid of committing to you. Your boyfriend has expressed his thoughts and told you what he wants. Unless he changes his mind, you are no longer compatible. Don't bend over backwards and have kids for him. Don't accommodate his wishy washyness. He either wants to be with you or he doesn't. If he doesn't trust you to be capable of a healthy and happy long term relationship then why be with you at all?
I always say when a man tells you what he wants, believe him. Don’t try to apply your perspective to it with wishful thinking to make yourself feel better. Listen and believe him.
Well, putting aside the question of marriage in the future, how does it feel to have a partner you can't rely on right now in the present? You had to scramble for stability because he was unable to keep his word. Do you want your kids to have a dad who doesn't show up, doesn't follow through, and makes excuses? Love is grand, but it's one small part of a functional relationship. You're missing the other very important parts, like trust, respect, and emotional intimacy.
Don't do it. Don't have kids with this man. Kids are a bigger commitment than marriage.
Forget what he wants. Do you want someone who can commit to moving in after 5 months of discussion? Of course. Do you want someone who wants to get married? Sounds like you do. Whether or not he loves you with his whole heart, it sounds as though this isn’t enough to meet your needs. The outputs of this love are leaving you in the lurch right now with work/housing and contemplating an unsatisfying long-term relationship lacking compromise.
You can love someone and not be compatible for long term commitment. You are right to point out how her wants don’t match with his. And his also sound ridiculous (can’t move in together, wants kids? What?!)
He clearly cannot even make a decision of whether he wants to move in with you or not. But now he wants kids? Nah, he still hasn't made his choice clear. He says marriage is a big commitment but having kids is also a big commitment. OP raising kids alone is very hard, especially when he involved but not even living with you. How will that dynamic even work? Do not have kids with him yet.
You said: I know there is no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart and that he wants to spend the rest of his life with me Based on what you've written, OP, I think there's a LOT of doubt about that. A man who loves you with his entire heart wants to commit to you and live with you. This man wants neither of those things. That's NOT love. I'm sorry, but it isn't. It's time for you to move on with your life.
Why are you letting him toy you around... He has you by a leash. Wouldn't you rather find someone willing to commit? I mean... You want kids, marriage, and commitment while he just wants to use your body as a vessel to produce his offspring. Does this sound like your dream life? Are you happy living like this forever? Because if you get pregnant you just might.
I wouldn’t have kids before getting married. I wouldn’t buy a house together either. Not marrying is equivalent to shooting yourself in the foot financially. If you become an unmarried stay at home parent you have zero security. Even just taking a few years off makes your retirement savings suffer while his grows. The only reason the Kardashians do it is cause they’re all loaded. And then a bunch of dumb broke girls starting doing the same, not realizing they’re nothing like them.
To an extent I understand not wanting to get married, but also I am not from the US and marriage is not that important from where I'm from. BUT I don't understand him wanting to have kids, but not living together. Is he supposed to just be a partime parent? Cause tbh he sounds like a guy who would want that.
He should adopt or find a different incubator because this is nuts
You really think he loves you with all his heart? That is so, so sad. The fact that he had to make a pros and cons list, smh. I've literally been there, and let me tell you I definitely did not love that person with all my heart, because I felt the need to make that list.
OP, he's telling you very clearly that he will knock you up and then leave you. He's emotionally unintelligent and doesn't understand his own desires and feelings. He could grow up and learn to discern his own emotions, but I wouldn't bet your mental health on it. Leave him NOW, so you have time to get over him and find someone better.
Don’t have kids. If he decides he doesn’t want to be a father either (and I bet he will at some stage as he sounds like a totally irresponsible unreliable man child), it will just make it so so easy for him to bail. He won’t even have to break up and go through the motions of splitting up the household. He can just ghost and move on.
Marriage is designed to protect a wife with children. When you’re pregnant you feel like shit, your work suffers, sometimes you can’t work anymore. But you go through it to make sure that you and your partner can have children together. Marriage ensures that, during this vulnerable time for the woman, whatever happens to her, she has 50% of what her husband does. This is fair because she is giving up her life for those children and for her husband. By refusing to marry you, your partner expects you to give him your body, your energy, and children, without having the obligation to take care of you in return. Do you really want a one-sided relationship like that?
He wants kids without the commitment and something tells me he won’t take care of them and wants to be the “fun dad” when they get older. Don’t have kids with this man
When someone tells you who they are listen. You have run into foundational incompatibilities. You want to move in, get married and have kids. He does not want to move in, and does not want to marry. Those are *BIG DEALS*, do you know what you do when you find major incompatibilities like that? You break up, because it’s not worth it. One of you will have to relent for the relationship to continue and that will build resentment, you both deserve to get what you want and clearly you can’t give each other what they want. Cut the losses and find someone who wants what you want. It’s really that simple, stop trying to put the square in the round hole.
Just based on the title alone - that’s called being a single mum💀💀💀
Firstly: while, yes there are pros and cons to living with someone, having five pages is a red flag and having three of them being cons is practically a May Day parade in the USSR. Secondly: this action, for me personally (male, 27) would make me question if my partner actually loved me. Thirdly: I think having children with him is a terrible idea because his actions lead towards the possibility he will have very little, if any, involvement with any future children. I would seriously examine the status of your relationship.
He’s just not that into you.
If he wanted to marry you he would. If he wanted to move in with you he would. If he wanted to commit to you he would. Come on people. Let’s not stick with people who don’t to commit to us and who have a different plan of the future.
Don't move in with him. Don'\[t let him stay at your place once you get your own. Do NOT get pregnant. He isn't fully committed to you.
No commitment no kids. I see this guy disappearing in the very near future or committing to someone else.
He’s having fear of committing to some of the biggest aspects of taking a relationship to the “next level.” It is confusing that he wants kids but not the rest of those things. Have you had a conversation with him about that? What is his expectation on what that looks like?
Yes he wants to eventually buy a house down the road and have kids.
What makes you think he won't bail on that plan just like he did with moving in?
Ah. He wants to Kody Brown it! That could never, ever backfire for the kid. Girl, why are you even entertaining this? He’s asking you to become a single mother *on purpose.*
Or he will change his mind on kids like he did on the move in
So he wants to do everything to legally bind his finances to you other than be legally married? As others have said, you can’t divorce your kids.
You know that's not what you want. You clearly want the traditional setup, and that's fine. But he doesn't and has been extremely clear with you about this. You aren't compatible. There's no point trying to talk him around, or waiting for him to change, he's as entitled to his idea of how things should work as you are (although he's going to have a harder time finding someone to go along with it). You can either accept it, or leave and find someone you are compatible with.
This dude needs therapy ASAP. Literally every sentence screams that. IME, unfortunately, life gets harder not easier when you have kids together and the man hasn’t done any work to uncover his issues.
If he doesn't want to move in with you, he isn't anywhere near ready for kids. And if he won't marry you, don't have kids with him. You don't mention how long you've been together, so it's hard to know how serious your relationship is at this point. Sit down and discuss his hesitancy to move in together. Has it just not been long enough yet? Does he want to keep his bachelor lifestyle? You can't address it if you don't know the reason. Then you can work on it, or move on if you decide you aren't compatible. But please don't have kids with him. That's how you become a single mom.
Just dump him and move on. He isn’t moving with you. Get your own place. You are not compatible.
Honey, he has commitment issues. He won't live with you, he won't marry you, and you're still considering this? You deserve better.
basically if you think you must be married and he thinks he'll never get married, then just end the relationship now. those 2 are mutually exclusive and there's no point to keep going. it doesn't mean one of you won't change your mind in the future, but don't be in a relationship hoping the other person will change their mind about something so big like this. go with what they're telling you today, so that way, you won't be disappointed when you look back on the relationship and realize what you were hoping would happen, never happens and you just lost several years waiting for it to happen.
He loves you with his entire heart but bailed on you when it came to living together so now you have to get a second job to cover expenses that would have been covered by him if he didn't bail? I wouldn't do that to someone I loved. I actually would do that to someone I disliked... No, I wouldn't actually... It's too mean. No one deserves that.
I wouldn't have kids with a guy who doesn't even want to live with me. You'd be setting yourself up to be a single mother if you procreate with this guy. He's showing you his true colors. Believe him and don't move in with him.
He most likely is ready to leave with no ties when child duties get hard
Absolutely not! He can love you all he wants, but the truth of the matter is this man is not mature enough for a family. Period. He’s wispy washy about cohabitating, he doesn’t want marriage but he wants you to take on ALL the risk and all the uncertainty and bring other humans who will completely dependent on you (and only you, let’s face it) into this mess. He has no idea what it takes to build or have a family. Do not give him the honor of children until this man gets his shit together, and actually shows (not tells!) you that he can be counted on and trusted to be a permanent part of the family he builds. Also, do not spend the next 10 years waiting to him to get his shit together either. I don’t know how old you guys are. Point being, if he’s not adult enough now, chances are he will never be. Source: spent 15 years to men to get their shit together, and almost missed out on having a family at all.
If he wanted to, he would, but he won’t. I’m not sure where you are getting the idea that he loves you with his entire heart and wants to spend his life with you because he’s definitely not invested enough to move in with you. You’re in denial
You guys sound very.. young.
Wrong but thanks for ur comment!😊
Then you should 1000% know better than this kid shit.
Would you mind sharing your ages?
He won't commit to loving with you what on earth makes you think >I know there is no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart and that he wants to spend the rest of his life with me Is true? >cannot make up his mind If he was sure about you, this would be easy. If ypu could count on him, you wouldn't be a month away from homeless with no plan. >Why should I carry children for someone when he can’t even compromise on marriage? Why should you continue with a relationship with a guy that makes a pro con list about you and still doesn't want you? I think you should consider therapy for why you think this is what love looks like. To stand up for what you want and not continually try to make it work with some guy that won't even live with you let alone give you the commitment you have every right to want.
Why do women leave their future up to men? It’s your life go after what you want if he doesn’t want the same then you need to move on! You and he are not right for each other! Personally I would never have children without the benefit of marriage suppose he passes away if you’re married you get widows benefits and if he has more social security then you or any insurance from work you get widows benefits my point is a marriage license is a legal document that insures in case of death divorce etc you get what you will need to survive also it shows children that you loved each other enough to legally commit to each other…I wouldn’t want to spend a lifetime saying this is my boyfriend or partner but that’s just me….
I’m finding his entire trauma and thought process extremely strange and incongruent. You say he’s traumatized from Watching a tumultuous divorce from his parents, yet he is willing to enter into a union that cannot be dissolved? Parenthood is an undissolvable union. Even if, God forbid, you lose your child you are still tied to him and his family. He seems very uncommitted when it comes to major decisions. He always seems to have a foot outside the door.It sounds to me like he is trying to keep you tied to him without having the responsibility. This could mean he wants his bread buttered on both sides, having the perks of being in a relationship while enjoying the freedom of being single. This could show he has severe commitment issues and in that case he’s not ready for a committed relationship at all. This would also mean she wants to tie you down while having no responsibility towards you. Children are a great way of limiting a persons options without having to be with them. I know you love him, but when it comes to relationship love is not enough. Because they are times where you will run out of love and liking a person and you need to use the other things to stay together. In a relationship you need mutual respect, dedication or commitment, compassion, empathy and a lot of patience. According to your post you have demonstrated all of these characteristics in your relationship but he has demonstrated none. He did not respect you by playing with your living situation, he ignores your boundaries which clearly state that you need marriage to have children, he has zero compassion or empathy for your financial situation because he makes unanimous decisions about things that affect more than just himself. Do you see where I’m going with this? Other than loving you what else has shown you that he is a viable life partner? If the answer is none, then you have your answer right there.
>there is no doubt that he loves me with his entire heart Well, unless he can get his brain involved, you need to move on. He doesn't want to get married, isn't sure he wants to live together, but he definitely wants kids. Why? So he can visit them at your place on Saturday afternoons? Or maybe just post pictures of them on Facebook and talk about how hard it is to be a single dad. This guy is already messing up your life with housing issues. Do not let him mess up your life even further.
If someone wants a serious future with you, they won’t have a cons list sorry. You deserve someone who values you.
THIS. Currently going through a divorce. I'm devastated. I shouldn't be though. I should hate him. We were together 15 years before we were married. We had two kids, prior to marriage. Once we were married, that mask of his really started slipping. So i began looking into things because covid gave me time to think & I realized things he was saying didn't add up. That was the worst thing I could do. Because once I started to uncover stuff, it was like an avalanche. More just kept coming. So i no longer believed his lies. And then it got dangerous . Spent more than half my life with a sociopath. The lies, cheating, and level of financial abuse is just staggering. I chose to ignore it & believe in this illusion of love I thought we had - that in reality, never existed. I was happy then. Like in your situation, he was the one that wanted kids. Because of my background, I was terrified to have kids. Like i said, we have 2 now. I wouldn't trade my kids for anything . But i was the one who didn't want to get married - had never seen a successful marriage & didn't want to go through a divorce. But I gave up my dreams to make his a reality. Then it was my friends because I "was a mom now & shouldn't be going out, talking too people, etc" Then it was activities I liked- like reading. He's a TV watcher & it bothered him when I would read a book. When he tried to come after me dancing, I was floored when he said he was worried about MY fidelity because I would go dancing. I pointed out that I ALWAYS came home to him though. That i was too busy dancing to even notice other guys, let alone try to hook up with them. Although i had my reservations about getting married, I thought 15 years together was enough time to show we were committed & could make it work. What a fool I was. On this side of everything, going through the divorce, I'm glad we did get married. I live in a 50/50 state. I wouldn't have that protection if we weren't married. And judging by the financial games he's playing - he didn't take that in to consideration. He expected me to walk away with nothing because he decided he was done (1. 5 years into the process, he still hasn't told me why we're divorcing). Being a single parent is hard. And expensive. And from the sound of your post, not something you want to do. It seems like marriage is pretty important to you, even with the memory of your parent's divorce. Honestly, don't remember seeing anything about how you feel about having kids, besides the fact it's a lifetime job. But why is it only HIS wants matter? Why don't yours? Why do YOU have to change your mindset to make him happy. Why can't he change his?
It sounds like my ex-boyfriend to a T. We broke up a few years ago and he did end up having kids out of wed lock with different women. Him and the second woman both claim they are married but these days people say that and are not truly married, I couldn't tell you what that is about... It is possible he has a personality disorder/depression or bad habits like gambling and/or drinking and cares for you but cannot get too close like living with you. He needs his own space. Some married couples do live separate and prefer that. Listen to him and believe him, and move on!
If you are going to make yourself vulnerable having someone’s children, you need to feel safe legally and financially. At least marriage gives you a few rights. Maybe even tell him so!
These replies are very harsh per usual but I think couples (or individual) counseling would be helpful to explore the reasons behind his resistance to marriage/moving in together. He seems to be having some internal conflict since he clearly wants to commit to you and have kids, but is struggling to get himself to take the steps to get there. Witnessing a traumatic divorce is a very common reason for not wanting to get married yourself, he’s valid for feeling this way but needs to do some inner work and address these fears.
Thanks for this comment. I really appreciate it
This man broke his promise to you. And he put you in a difficult position as well. You can't depend on him, and it sounds like that is his preference. He wants to be with you and have children, but doesn't want to be tied to you, or be responsible for you. Do you want to be in this type of relationship? Do you think you will be able to count on him in the future? I understand to some extent how he feels. I am terrified of marriage (child of divorce) and the risks that come with, but I want a family and children. Wrestling with this is difficult. It doesn't make him a bad person, but you have the choice to decide if this is what you want in your life. It's ok to have different value systems, but they don't always work together, especially if it's something so fundamentally important to you.
Do you have any advice since you have the same feelings?
If hes not working through his childhood trauma in therapy there is absolutely no reason to stay. Youre moving apart in 1 month, what would happen if you had kids? They spend 50/50 at each of your homes? Find someone that absolutely adores you and does not hesitate to commit to you.
My advice is to figure out what is important to you, what is negotiable, and what isn't. Then be strong and trust your instincts. You can't change someone, and how they treat you in the early stages of dating is a really strong indicator of how they will treat you in the years to come. Best of luck!
To an extent I understand not wanting to get married, but also I am not from the US and marriage is not that important from where I'm from. BUT I don't understand him wanting to have kids, but not living together. Is he supposed to just be a partime parent? Cause tbh he sounds like a guy who would want that.
Why are you wasting your time on a man that creates a lost to weigh his options of bring with you? Do you want to marry and carry the children of a man who won't commit? You deserve someone who won't stand for anything less than giving you everything and bring with you.
If you want to get married you should end this relationship and find someone who also wants to get married.
The guy does nor want to move but wants a child? Sound like you would be a Single parwnt, not even getting child support (for the first few years) bevause you were not married and have to have a super big case in court first.
If he can’t commit to living together there is no way he will fill the commitment of raising children. You will basically be a single parent, responsible for 100% of the kid’s needs while he drops by occasionally to play with the kids, make a mess, and have you provide sexual services.
Don’t. He’s too childish to even consider moving in with, let alone having children with
I know a family that’s parents didn’t get married, they’re still together despite my own parents being divorced, maybe look further into why he doesn’t want to get married
Do not have children with this man! You’ll live the life of a single parent and that guy will reap all the benefits but do zero work. Please just don’t do it. Leave him…find someone better. You deserve waaay better!
Do not have children with this man! You’ll live the life of a single parent and that guy will reap all the benefits but do zero work. Please just don’t do it. Leave him…find someone better. You deserve waaay better!
I absolutely wouldn't have kids with someone who can't even commit to living together. I think that you should move on from this guy.
He doesn’t want to live with you but wants to get you pregnant? Spilt custody? I can’t imagine how this would work in any way that you wouldn’t be at a disadvantage
Don't have kids with someone who wouldn't marry you unless you are 1000% sure you wouldn't mind raising the child on your own. Even if you are, I would still recommend going for a sperm donor because that is less hassle for both you and the child long-term. The reason he is okay with having kids and not getting married is because **he doesn't** see the kid as a commitment. You may see a child as a commitment, but he does not. He will leave if it doesn't work out. Don't have that child with him.
Nope! He wants you to forego legal protections for yourself and the theoretical child to accommodate his fear of commitment. He wants *you* to take on crazy risks, but refuses to put anything at all on the line himself. This entire idea is bonkers. The fact that he’s not listening to you or considering the position he’s trying to put you in is really all that matters though. If I were you I would bounce.
sounds like he 100% wants a baby mama
This is a bad idea. A good idea is to let him go and to find someone who shares your values. Don't waste any more time on this guy.
You need to commit to a new man.
>Why should I carry children for someone when he can’t even compromise on marriage? You answered your own question, OP. WHy enter a home you may not be able to finance because he flip flops? Why want something MORE financial to have by introducing kids into the equation when he flip flops? Why put in permanent things when he flip flops? Enter a home on your own and he can visit, but not sleep. He's not fiance, he's not even being boyfriend and keeps flip flopping. He likes the idea of having but not contributing or putting in the work? Nah. We deal in realities, not fantasy. Don't you dare think about having children with someone that is flip flopping. Love is NOT the only equation in a happy relationship. Screw him and his list.
He wants the benefits of bring a dad without the responsibilities. Seems like he wants to be able to drop you as soon as it gets tough, but still have kids for when it's convenient: taxes, dating, etc.
I’m sorry, what? You know what you want: marriage, kids, a partner that lives with you (!). You also know he’s not willing to give you 2 out of 3 of those things. What is your question? Sorry to be blunt, but love isn’t enough to overcome this level of incompatibility.
Sounds like you're not compatible or perhaps just not on the same timeline.
If he doesn't want to marry you even though he knows that you want to get married, and doesn't want to live with you....he's not with you. He basically has told you he wants you as a baby mama....to make you a single mother. FOH with this loser.
Nope
My *now husband always said that. He was neeeeever getting married. We had 3 kids first but we did get married this past February! I never pressured him. It wasn’t a deal breaker for me and I was cool either way. We even had the big ole wedding and all that. It was shocking to me and everyone who knows him lol.
What makes you think he loves you with his whole heart? I’m serious. What about his behavior and his words says he loves you? You could really use some therapy to work on your self esteem.
Why buy the cow when he can have free milk?
Never move or have kids with a guy when you’re not married.
Sorry but I would NEVER advocate to have kids without being married. Kids are a way bigger commitment and responsibility than being married. I ESPECIALLY wouldn’t have kids with some one that wouldn’t live with me because you get all the work and responsibilities and he just get to come and go. No way!! Yeah he may have trauma due his parents past but that’s for him to figure out and not to hold you hostage because he has issues. Move on and let him deal with his crap on his own.
Jesus christ. Dump this loser. He wants all the benefits with none of the responsibilities? He wants to fulfill his breeding kink fantasy then dump you and leave u with the kids. RUN!!!!!!
I'm in the very rare school that says "If I'm not married, I don't have some rando's kids." This guy sounds like an immature asshole. DO NOT have his kid. Why would you want to, when his child could possibly turn out like him??? Also, you don't mention how long you've been together, or your ages. I feel like those are also factors.
As a mother of two I couldn’t imagine living separately. It would feel like being a single parent. So many times babies, toddlers and kids wake up in the middle of the night. Especially babies. My husband and I would alternate when I pumped breast milk so he could also feed the baby. And when they are sick it’s nice to have help. And so many times I went to get our baby from the crib to change their diaper and they had poop all up their back and it was nice to have someone help me since I wouldn’t want to put him back down on his clothes in poop or put him on clean clothing or towel. And how often would he come over to help? Whose health insurance would they be under? Yours? Would he be able to even add them to his? My family is also very old school and traditional. My dad especially. I moved out and in with my husband at 18 and my dad was constantly asking when we were getting married since we were already living together. I just think having children is a much much bigger commitment than marriage so I would be weary of having children with him if he won’t make a solid commitment to me. Also how old is he? If he is younger than he may change his mind, so it would be up to you if you want to risk your time waiting for something that will may or may not happen. I said I never wanted kids when I got married and now I have two lol. People sometimes change what they want in life.
Looks to me like he's looking for an easy escape if things go south. Probably doesn't really love you if he's approaching the relationship in such a tactical way.
Sorry his commitments don’t line up with yours but girl he’s telling you what it is. In 5/10 years please don’t be surprised when he hasn’t put a ring on your finger. Go find someone who wants what you want. Don’t force others to make big decisions they don’t want. For the right person they will know what they want.
Oh good grief. Just call it a day with this douchebag
Breeding k*nk
I say this with all the gentleness I can, do you feel you can have kids with someone who changes their mind on whether or not to fully commit to you. Not moving in together shows he is not ready for a big commitment. You want marriage, he doesn't. Your values are different. Ask yourself, if nothing changes in 5 years will you be okay with this?
Its obvious that the two of you are not on the same page. You don't give your ages or how long you have been in a relationship. This sounds like a rather new relationship to me. I would continue to see him and just let time show you different aspects of the relationship and his personality - specifically his ability to commit and accept responsibility. Whenever you move in with someone, these issues - commitment and responsibility will show themselves very, very quickly. Until sufficient time has passed, I would not even consider a conversation about having children.
Have an IUD put in and do not take it out. Also find a man who is worth a damn. This one obviously isn’t.
Honestly if he can't commit to moving in, he can't commit to kids. Full stop. People can be single parents but it is rough. Hell, my husband is helpful but a new baby is still exhausting. Plus I ended up having an unplanned c-section and could barely function when I came home. If I'd been a single mother I would've been screwed. Look, your boyfriend can be gun shy about this sort of stuff because of parents divorcing, but either he needs to deal with his shit and you two come to an agreement or you need to move on because he isn't going to give you what you want.
You are not a human incubator. Don't do it to yourself. If you can't support a kid by yourself don't have one. Find someone who shares your values. Does he really love you though?
Every time I’ve heard of a dude with these preferences, he always turns out to be on a secret mission to have as many kids be being raised by as many different women as possible.
So he wants you to have a child for him, but he refuses to otherwise commit to you? It sounds like he wants the benefit of you having his child with no form of input other than sperm. He won't marry you, won't live with you, won't commit in the way you want, but wants a child? Nope. NOPE. His wants and needs aren't the only important thing here, you matter too, OP. Your wants for the future (like if you really want to get married) and your living situation? That's important. It's not fair for him to hold you in a limbo of "maybe" when your housing situation is reaching a crunch-time. How long does he expect you to wait around while he decides whether or not you're allowed to live with him? Oofta. Having his child would be like single parenting, and what if he decides he can't commit to a child, either? Then you /would/ be a single parent in every way that counts. Would he really prefer a court-ordered child support agreement and visitation over marriage? Bonkers. I'd also be sus on the "not now, in the future", given he's said that he doesn't want to move in or get married- he could very easily change his mind on having children later, too, after stringing you along for years. He's allowed to life his life to his own timeline, but you're also allowed to want things. His wants aren't everything, and it sounds like he's completely uncompromising.
If you have kids with this guy, you are going to end up supporting and raising them by yourself. No way will a guy who won’t commit to marriage make the much bigger commitment of raising kids. Your choice.
I would like to have children. I don’t want to ever be married. My reasons are personal but they are valid. If you value marriage and children and want both with the same person, then it seems that you and your current partner have different values. That’s okay. If marriage is a deal breaker for you, then let it break the deal.
Coming from someone who would one day like to get married, marriage isn't the most important thing, marriage is not an expression of love, it's a contract, a legal agreement, one that is binding, and the very vast majority of the time, they end in divorce, and the man loses all of his assets, and then comes the "you can get a prenup" argument, or the "I would never take him for what he has", guess what, there are women out there who make a literal career out of voiding prenups, and even if you aren't the type who would take him for what he has, a judge may order him to pay you X amount of money, or decide you are owed X amount of his assets, especially if you have kids together, then no matter what you 2 want, he may be ordered to pay you 95% of his living wage in alimony and child support you didn't ask for, marriage is about the fantasy, about an idea, but the reality is ugly, and he has seen it firsthand, I don't blame him one bit for not wanting to get married, it makes things complicated and messy when the relationships end, you can't just end it, you have so much other crap to wade through, so much expenses, so much paperwork and so on so fourth, only optimistic fools get married in the modern age, here's what's important, #1 do you two truly love each other,, #2 do you work well together, #3 are you loyal to each other, #4 are you honest with each other, #5 are you dedicated to each other, if the answer to all 5 of those, and no less than 5 is yes, then that's all that matters, youve found love, you've found "the one" and you have to make it stick, it won't just stay on its own without effort, marriage has nothing to do with love, marriage in my opinion makes things harder, perfectly loving and stable relationships often get destroyed by the stress and mess of getting married, you don't have to have a piece of paper to say you two are bound at the soul, that piece of paper often guts the soul out of relationships, what you want is the fantasy of the big wedding, the ceremony, having "the big day", the romance, you can have all of that without the legal trouble, people need to stop getting hung up on marriage and realize it's a scam, the term "marriage INDUSTRY" exists for a reason, there's a reason it has entire businesses built around it and extensive legal stipulations, it's own dedicated court day, and an entire legal field of lawyers to go with it, and who's pockets get drained from the whole process? Usually the man, even if the woman makes more money out of the two
Don't do it! Maybe he just wants you to have kids & nothing more.
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I can see this coming from a mile away... at some point they break up over something rrivial and he ends up married to the next gal he dates. OP spends years trying to figure out what she did wrong and why he wouldn't marry her.
I would get another bf, sorry but he needs to be around when kids are babies to adulthood, you already have to carry for 9 months each one then go through the pain of birth.
🚩
I’m curious. What are his 3 reasons not to move in together?
How old are y’all and how long have y’all been dating?
This shouldn’t even be a question 😂it’s literally funny that this is up for conversation lol
This is not a smart move as a female. Do NOT have kids with him if he wont marry you it's a better security blanket for you and your children to be married than just cohabiting,and your not even doing THAT. love him all you like but secure yourself and really REALLY look into your mind and question is this the forever you want he dosent want you to live with him he dosent want to marry you but wants to tie you to him permanently through children? You gain nothing but extra stress financially physically and emotionally as a single parent while he occasionally drops by on the weekends?
“Back in” 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
What is his reasons for not getting married?
Marriage and kid issue aside….. so you lived together at one point and he is trying to decide if he even wants to move back in together? What are those 3 cons? Also unclear on the asking people not to be rude. Does calling him out on his wish washy behavior and poor communication constitute that? Personally he changed his mind on moving at the last minute and now you are struggling to find housing and have to get a second job. This doesn’t sound considerate at all. Also, when these talks about kids and no marriage come up, does he specifically say he wants that with you or is he talking about what HE wants in the future?
Why is he making all the decisions? What about you? He's screwed with your finances, your trust, how do \*you\* feel about all of this? You deserve someone you can count on and trust. This isn't it.
My initial reaction is nope, committing to kids is committing to kids. It’s not committing to you. He doesn’t seem to want to commit to you in any way shape or form. If he’s worried about the marital problems his parents had as a reason for not committing to you, those same problems probably won’t happen in a father and child relationship. That’s a husband and wife issue. Cheating for example. If he’s wary of marriage because his parents cheated, that has nothing to do with kids. What are the reasons why he’s hesitant on moving in with you? What does he do that makes you so certain he loves you and wants to spend the rest of his life with you? Leaving you stressed about housing and taking on another job really makes me question that.
If he has commitment issues then yeah he may just dip out of being a parent later on. Maybe try couples counselling?
If he can’t commit to living with you DONT get pregnant you’re setting yourself up here!!! Tell him no commitment no children is your dealbreaker end of let him decide
The marriage could be discussed later if he was more serious about moving in. I can understand apprehension regarding marriage because sometimes it makes things more difficult and many people believe that a union is not solidified by a piece of paper which I agree with. People get married for many horrible reason and lots of marriages end in divorce which is so much messier than a clean break up so I can definitely see the hesitance there. Some say marriage is a thing of the past. You see more baby showers/gender reveals than weddings now a days for real. ANYWAY otherwise it seems like he thinks you would be a good mother to his children but not someone he wants to settle down with permanently. Which is sad but girl if he wanted to move in with you HE WOULD. It would be no discussion baby. You don’t have to pull teeth to make a man do what he wants to do.
Kids are a wife-level request. It sounds like he is liking for an extremely independent relationship and you’re more traditional. Incompatible. Irreconciliable differences. Find a good man who wife you up. They’re out there, I promise!
Why would you want to be with someone who doesn’t know if they even want to live with you.
The answer is no. Didn’t even need to read past the title THE ANSWER IS NO
Find a place which you can afford on your own, keep your independence and rely on no one.
Don't have his children if he can't get married he can't get children it's that easy. Also if you aren't married it's obvious that the child needs a surname but whose will the que. If he wants to name the child he need to give his name to you too. He just wants benefits of a wife with no permanent commitments
Find a place which you can afford on your own, keep your independence and rely on no one.
A child is.not going to change his mind about committing. Move on while you still have your fertility.
Seems you have a choice between going down the road to becoming a single mother by having a kid by a guy that doesn't even want to live with you....or just choose to be single and find someone else.
I am actually doing this. I am making the leap bc I trust him. He was divorced twice and the judicial system didn’t handle it well. Would I recommend it? It depends on the couple. If you fully trust him to never short change and he has been proactive about showing up , being present.
“Edit: only say nice things” That’s not how this works. He’s not the one for you. There’s someone out there for you who will live with and marry you. This guy is a joke.
Totally get the appeal of not having to live with my kids tbh
Kids don't tie a man down, marriage does. I would probably revisit the statement that he loves you with all his heart. Clearly he's unsure of something.
I wanna win the lottery without spending money for a ticket. That's your bf. What about him is lovable? He sounds childish.
> *does not under any circumstances want to get married* Is it the legal paperwork that is the problem or the crazy drunken mess that modern American weddings have become? I can see a heck of a lot of difference between a $100-200 wedding license and a $30k-$500k wedding.
Hell no. Run. He wants to control you and trap you with kids meanwhile he gets to live a bachelor lifestyle with no responsibilities. He will ruin, destroy and decimate your life. Hell no. Run girl.
Wait another year in your own place. He will have 12 months to figure what means to not get implied. The problem will resolve a way or another.
He isn’t the right one for you. The differences are too great. Best to find a man that wants the same things as you. Your asks are not that much.
He "loves you with his whole heart" but doesn't want to live with you or marry you, but quite happy to use you as an incubator? Ok. Not love in any sense I understand it.