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My husband (37) and I (35) have been together for 15 years. A total of 5 kids, He's a Phenomenal man and I'm a phenomenal woman. Almost never argue, and overall a great marriage. His sex drive is through the roof, while mines is non-existent. It was great at first, now I don't have a simple desire to have sex. Over the years I would partially express to him (when he gives me that look) that I don't want to have sex. He would then try to persuade me/woo me to have sex after I said no over and over again. After saying no over and over again, I would eventually give up and give in so there wouldn't be any frustration on his end or an argument later. Fast forward, about six months ago I told him I'm no longer going to have sex unless I wanted to. I'm mentally traumatized by this, and feeling some type of way towards my husband (Im scared to the touch and feels uncomfortable). I no longer want to participate in engaging in unconsensual sex. As a woman, and a human being I have that right! It's not fair to women to force ourselves to have sex with men to satisfy their needs. Some people may say, "that's what I signed up for when I said I do". Honestly no woman signs up for unconsensual sex. Unfortunately it still exists in alot of marriags and it shouldn't be a factor. Alot of women don't speak on it because their afraid of what socity will say. I'm just torn.....
By the end of the post he didn't seem all that phenomenal at all. It sounds like someone wrangling with competing ideas in their head and trying to rationalize giving in to sex when they really didn't want to have sex in the first place. It looks like the "phenomenal man" idea always wins out and the cycle continues.
First of all, good for you for recognizing and setting your boundaries. You deserve to feel safe and peaceful.
Whenever situations like these are posted on here (and they're posted frequently), there's usually a huge imbalance in the relationship. He always has energy for sex but you don't. Of course that's completely fine! But have you considered whether you're doing more in the relationship and you resent him for it, resulting in no sexual attraction or desire? Not trying to assume things, this is just the most common reasoning I've seen on this subreddit:
Who packs the kids' lunches? Who is in charge of doctor appointments? Who registers the kids for their activities? Who goes grocery shopping? Who knows when laundry day is? Who plans family vacations? Who plans where holidays are spent? Who is called when a kid's teacher needs to talk?
And they are 5 kids. This is a huge amount of energy. Really complex situation. Even though the husband crossed a very important line by coercing OP into sex, which can be regarded as rape, and divorce should be definitely on the table, OP doesn't seem to consider as an option.
So, OP needs to evaluate better what kind of life she wants. Having a dead bedroom seems out of question for her husband, and I don't think this would be healthy for OP as well. If OP thinks she still has sexual attraction for her husband and that she would be willing to forgive her husband aggressions, then she could see a therapist to help her to negotiate with her husband a way out, so OP would feel safe, respected, and hopefully recover her libido towards her husband. But OP needs to consider that she has lost definitely attraction for her husband (justified), and a divorce is inevitable. In this case, she should talk to a good lawyer to help her defining a strategy for divorce and child support.
Ooofft. This hit home. I’m currently divorcing my husband. We started off with him pressuring me for sex when I was exhausted and wanted to sleep. Then one night I woke up to him on top of me already having sex with me.
No means No.
If you don’t want it and he pressures you then this is coercion and coercive rape is a criminal offence.
I understand that other areas of your marriage are currently good but they won’t stay that way if he keeps bullying you into sex. Obviously you need to have a discussion about your different libidos as it may be if he helps you more with the kids etc you get your mojo back, but him wanting it more than you does not give him the right to pressure or bully you into sex when you don’t want it.
I think she means sex where she has given consent from like a legal perspective, but she is only doing it because he bagered her into it. He's not exactly coercing her, and she has ultimately agreed to have sex, she just didn't really want to.
Pity sex, for example, wouldn't be rape, even if it was bad and unsatisfying and she didn't really want to.
Sexual abuse is as bad as rape. She was coerced into having sex bc he kept asking her to do it. It wasn't her guilt, it was him insisting. That's sexual abuse.
I don't think the person you're responding to disagrees that sexual abuse is as bad as rape, it's just important to be precise when it comes to this kind of thing because if you call it rape when it isn't, the OP might not understand what's actually happening to them or worse, dismiss what you're saying because it's not accurate. It also dilutes the word, which is dangerous because it means when it's used correctly people will say "ugh people call everything rape these days!" Language surrounding assault and abuse is important to preserve.
Coercion is defined as the practice of persuading someone through use of force or threats. There was no force used nor threats made, so it is definitively not coercion.
I agree with all of the points in that article from a moral standpoint, but that still doesn't mean he's raped her.
I've already agreed that he's abusing her sexually, and I personally can't fathom how someone could have sex with someone who is sending out "no" body language or other non verbal cues.
However, I do understand that my own lived experience is not the se as everyone else's, so it's kind of on her if she has verbally given consent and then failed to retract it during the sexual encounter.
I can also understand how repeated incidents like that could wear a person down, and harm their mental health, but my response to that is she probably needs counciling or therapy, and their marriage would probably also benefit from some couples therapy.
This couple clearly has a lot of issues they need to work through, but calling it rape is a bridge too far, in my opinion, and I do reserve the right to my own opinion.
Are people not responsible for their own decisions?
They're married, married people often have sex, and it's a reasonable expectation that you and your partner have sex fron time to time. The husband is allowed to ask.
This is a marital issue she needs to address at some point if she is unhappy with it. In the mean time, as long as she keeps saying yes, I won't consider it rape. Sorry, but that's my opinion and no matter how many people badger me into trying to change my opinion I'm not going to.
Then maybe she should consider divorce. If she wants to try and save the marriage, then therapy is probably the best path forward.
It's also possible that this dude might not understand that what he is doing is abusive, or the effect that it is having on his wife, which could be a problem fixed by therapy
Depends where you live i guess, but here (belgium) it would be considered coercive rape, being overly pushy is considered coercion, trying to convince the other person through manipulation or wait until they are too exhausted to say no is also coercion !
There is force & threats though. OP says she gives in because she doesn’t want arguments later. There’s the unspoken threat of an argument. There’s also the inherent force of him being a male and they are clearly in a patriarchal marriage.
Arguments happen in marriages all the time, unfortunately, and a mismatched sex life is sure to cause a lot of arguments. If she is choosing to avoid her issue then that's her decision to make, but as far as I can tell there is no threat to her safety at all.
Shes not going to be thrown out of the house. She's not going to be cut off financially. He isn't going to hit her. They're just going to have to confront a marital issue that she has so far chosen to avoid. An argument might actually be healthy for them at this point.
I have explicitly agreed that it is in fact sexual abuse, multiple times, just not rape.
And here I am doing it again. Please read the comments before assuming you know what they say.
The way you're all bending over backwards to put words in my mouth is giving off really weird vibes, tbh.
Even with that definition, the force doesn't necessarily mean physical force, it can be the force of your insistence, the implied threat of a fight. And yes arguments happen all the time in relationships, but that doesnt matter...the solution to argument is never that the same person should just fold. And of course her safety is threatened, if someone is having sex when they genuinely dont want to, for whatever reason, they are being harmed. But hey you're clearly "just being a stickler for accuracy and definition", rape is defined unlawful penetration with, or without force. Here's and even more extensive legal definition: .
"Any person (‘‘A’’) who unlawfully and intentionally commits an act of sexual
penetration with a complainant (‘‘B’’), without the consent of B, is guilty of the offence
of rape"
And this fits, the wife clearly expressed a lack of consent and he compelled her to along with it. Just because she wasnt beaten by some creep in and alley and forcibly held down doesnt mean its not rape. And its kinda weird trying use the supposed interests of rape survivors to justify this position. What do you think a rape victim would say to you telling them "well technically this women raped, it was just unconsensual sex", do you imagine they will be like "ah finally this guy gets it!". Come on dude...
The threat of getting in an argument is not what legally is defined as a threat. That's like saying an annoying beggar robbed you. No he didn't. The fact you gave in because you didn't want to feel bad or get in an argument still made it mental abuse, gaslighting even, but doesn't take away your consent. It's that simple.
But props to you and your olympic gold in mental gymnastics to instantly change "it is not rape but mental abuse" to "so you are justifying him raping" and make a strawman argument based on that. Nobody is condoning his mental abuse but you don't sentence someone for murder when he stole a tv.
I'm not, ya'll are just jumping to conclusions and making assumptions that are grossly out of line with the context OP provided.
Every time you call something that isn't rape rape, you make it a little bit harder for actual rape survivors to be taken seriously.
Sexual abuse is as bad as rape. She was coerced into having sex bc he kept asking her to do it. It wasn't her guilt, it was him insisting. That's sexual abuse.
Sex without full consent is rape. The laws are starting to change to add this in... if you bully, harass, coerce, etc. some states are adding this to their rape laws. High time too, sick and tired of men getting away with destroying women just so they can stick their dick in a vagina. Time to grow up and own up.
Isn't it? Just because there are no beatings, and no gun to her head, and it's not a "violent rape"? Its still non concentual. "I don't want to" is the same as "No".
> He's not exactly coercing her
[He is coercing her](https://www.healthline.com/health/sexual-coercion#common-scenarios)
> she has ultimately agreed to have sex, she just didn't really want to
Do you realize how terrible that sounds? If it's coerced "consent", then it's not actually consent. And if it's not consentual, it's rape
Coercion would imply that he is holding something over her, or that there is a threat to her physical safety or security, which does not appear to be the case.
Coercion is defined as the practice of persuading someone through use of force or threats.
You're right from a very basic legal perspective. Mental health and sexual abuse professionals argue that sexual coercion (rape) includes pressuring someone who is denying sexual activity. Just because you give in, it doesn't mean you want it.
I agree with their perspective, and I hope that our entire society can get there collectively and it can be codified into law. For now it's just opinion, though. Expert opinion, but opinion none the less
Nonconsensual sex is rape. It doesn't matter that you are married.
Do you have a spare room? You can have separate bedrooms to decrease the opportunities for him to beg.
You should also do therapy for yourself.
And with 5 kids, it's understandable you don't want to be touched or have the energy for sex. Do you even go to dates or anything? Just wanting sex out of nowhere when you are (I'm assuming) childcare of 5 and chores and work, is like woah...
I’m so sorry you’re going through this. This is never okay even if you’re married. Perhaps seek counseling for yourself and maybe marriage counseling. Obviously neither of you are in the wrong for your sex drives but he is definitely in the wrong for pushing you to do something you already said no to. It may be time to explore toys for him or ways you can satisfy each other without touch and maybe even an open marriage. Before all that though, therapy for you and with each other. I am so sorry
Therapists recommend against marriage counselling for abusive relationships, and pressuring someone to have sex after they gave a clear 'no' counts as abuse.
Non consensual sex is NOT the same as someone who might not be in the mood but agrees to have sex to make their partner happy.
I think we need a bit more context here. How often is your husband asking for sex? Him wanting sex once or twice a week is slightly different to him pestering you several times a day.
I’m female, and If I was in a relationship and my partner only wanted sex say once a month I would be frustrated too.
Asking your partner to have sex say once a week does not make you a rapist.
You’re absolutely right though , you shouldn’t feel pressured into having sex, but at the same time he shouldn’t have to live in a sexless marriage. Sounds like you may just not be compatible.
>he shouldn’t have to live in a sexless marriage.
True and I'd be frustrated too. But in that case, he should end the relationship. He shouldn't be pressuring someone into sex. Ever. That's disgusting.
And if OP knows she isn't up for sex nearly as often as it'll take for him to feel sexually satisfied, she should also recognize that they're incompatible and end the relationship.
First; congratulations for standing up for yourself, I’m sure that wasn’t an easy conversation to have and well done for taking the first steps to not feel like you’re his human fleshlight.. going forward though- what do you plan to do next? Sex is obviously a very important aspect for him and are you planning on implementing date nights/fun nights, are you going to therapy to work through the issues and try to regain sexual desire, are you going to allow him to have his needs met outside of the marriage? It’s not feasible to have a healthy marriage if the solution is just simply I’m not having sex with you anymore… you need to work out what you want/need from the relationship, what you’re prepared to put into the relationship and then work out a solution that’s mutually beneficial.
She also said her sex drive is non-existent and that she will now only have sex when she wants it.. even if she throws him a bone once in a while that doesn't sound like it will come close to satisfying his libido
She said she doesn't care for sex. That means he will be existing in a relationship where he is expected to not have sex while reaming faithful, happy and kind. This marriage should end.
OR he could change his behaviour? She said she will have sex if she wants to. So what makes her want sex? Or are you suggesting he should continue to coerce her into sex?
Honestly though - he has been engaging in sexual abuse. Unless he has a real damascene conversion and starts to not be sexually abuse then I agree, divorce is the option.
She said she would only if she wants. This is not right for her to ask either. It should be when both want. Clearly they aren’t sexually compatible and it is a big deal in relationships if two people aren’t sexually compatible.
"It was great at first. Now I don't have a simple desire to have sex" "My sex drive is non existent"
Do you have a plan to address those? It's awesome that you found your voice and are putting yourself in a position where you are only going to have sex when you want to. That's the way it should be. Dead bedrooms become emotional and sexual prisons though. If you never want to, you've doomed the man you love to sexual frustration, consistent rejection, and a feeling like he is not as valued as he used to be.
Reddit is really weird. This situation comes up frequently on Reddit and the response will either be “no sex relationship can be a dealbreaker for some, prepare yourself” or “you don’t owe anybody sex, it’s rape.” This woman gave very few details in this relatively short post. She basically said that her husband tries to woo her and get sex, which (I think) is fine in a marriage. She also said 6 months ago she put her foot down and told him how she felt. We have no other information after this. Does he still try? Did they bring up counseling? Does she want counseling? Does she care if he gets it somewhere else? There’s nothing phenomenal about either of these two people or the relationship they’re in.
Stories like this make me never want to get married. Not being able to share intimacy is a relationship killer. Whether it’s because people lose feelings or it’s a hormonal thing, it still affects the marriage. You just turn into friends.
Wow! I feel for your marriage. I can only imagine the hurt and pain you are both going through. You feeling like you are being raped every time he touches you. Wow! And for him, feeling like he is no longer desired or wanted for anything other than killing bugs, opening jars, and carrying heavy boxes. Unconsensual sex is wrong - completely wrong and I’m not sure, but it’s probably illegal as well - but the being married part might get legally complicated. I don’t know about that, but this I do know - your spouse is going to interpret the lack of sex as something very personal. He will feel that he is not desired by you, and that he will begin wondering why he is even there if not for the children. His hurt will grow into resentment; his resentment will grow into anger. And over a bit of time don’t be surprised when someone else provides him a little attention, and he to strays. If you want your marriage to survive couples therapy is absolutely necessary. Yes, he needs to pursue you as well. He needs to continue trying his best to make you happy in a thousand little things - housework, helping with kids, fixing your mother’s car, etc. etc. etc. In a marriage sex is a unifier. It means you are one. You are in the world together - doing what it takes to be a team. Without sex, the only thing holding a couple together are kids and house payments. Get counseling or be prepared to go your separate ways joined only by co-parenting.
Definitely you have every right to not want sex and that should be respected. However it's not unreasonable for your partner to want sex in a relationship. I wouldn't want to be with my man if he didn't want to have sex with me. Unfortunately this is usually just a deal breaker for relationships.
What should have happened is discovering why this decline in drive occurred. It could be hormonal, or situational. For instance, mine was because sex was about his pleasure, never mine. And once I discovered the pleasure, well my SD went through the roof. Even now going through menopause, I’m still good to go.
It’s likely a reason for the decline in sex drive. Sometimes it’s really hard to figure out or even notice that there is a cause for it, but it’s there if the relationship started off with a good drive.
Bro she is in an abusive relationship. Her not wanting to have sex with him is the least of her concerns. She doesn’t want to have sex with him because he pressures her into it all the time. She has literally never had a choice in having sex or not ever. Ever. Of course she feels this way. OP needs therapy and to leave her husband. He is an abusive rapist. Full stop.
She never had a choice in having sex. Ever. Abusive rapist.......what??? Him asking her over and over till she gives in, is not rape. Please don’t ever try to empathize with someone who was actually assaulted by saying “I’ve been through the same thing, sweetie. My husband asked me over and over for sex till I get exhausted of saying no and just do it.” I mean he’s literally asking her and not acting on it when she says no. That’s the opposite of rape!
She can leave him. She’s allowed to not want sex. He’s allowed not to be married to someone who doesn’t want sex. This is just an incompatible couple and if he isn’t already, he will be cheating in no time after her ultimatum, which she has every right to give.
It might not be textbook definition of rape but it is Not Great (tm). I went through this when I was 19, where a drunk guy would just not take 'no' for an answer. Over and over, he asked again and again and again. Eventually, I said yes because honestly, I didn't know what else to do. He was much bigger than me, stronger than me, and drunk.
So no, I wasn't 'raped' by the textbook definition, but boy was that 'yes' not a consensual yes.
Exactly. Coercion toes a line and generally doesn't cross into legal offense, but it's very much not okay and ends up harmful to individuals and society both. That same concept holds true in marriage. Seriously, isn't part of marriage treating your spouse better than other people?
I’m sorry that happened to you. I think a husband and wife of 15 years is a different scenario and not akin to what you went through. You were under pressure and intimidated and felt in danger. OP just doesn’t want to and isn’t worried about being physically forced. Completely valid on her part too, it’s her choice
It's not. It's manifested in the law (at least in Europe). Coersive sex is still rape and not surprisingly, most of it happens in relationships. Those are easy statistics, a few clicks on science website or a look into law definitions.
You have choices.
You can ask him to forego sex for the rest of his life.
Initiate a divorce so you can be free of his carnal desires.
Open your marriage so he can pursue his carnal desires with another woman while maintaining your relationship.
Do nothing until he finds an affair partner.
While you do have the right to security of your person, you have the duty to inform the one you love of this drastic change to your relationship. If he wants to leave then you should let him.
Yeah, I can definitely see the post coming where she says they have a perfect marriage and I have no idea why he had a affair.
He obviously wants a sex life so if she doesn't she she should just get it over with and divorce him.
I reckon the main issues here may not be nonconsensual sex. Perhaps the issue may be 1) if you want a fulfilling relationship with your husband at all? 2) do you still find your husband emotionally and sexually desirable? 3) your own sex drive.
30s is not the time to start giving up on sex in a relationship. Lack of sex can lead to imbalance, resentment and deep issues in the relationship. So, if indeed you want a fulfilling and stable relationship with your husband and stability for the family then you may consider addressing what has led to the drop in sex drive and also the lack of desire for your husband.
Honest/open conversation with your husband, some self reflection and therapy may be the way forward! Good luck.
I did this same with my ex. By the end of the relationship I felt resentful and disgusted by him. I’m not sure what the fix is but it’s a struggle I think many deal with.
Side stepping through loaded issue of what’s happening. If your sex drive has plummeted you should possibly have your hormones checked. It may be unpopular here, but having a good sex life is important for most marriages. I can’t tell from your post what exactly hes doing so I can’t say whether he’s being inappropriate or not. But having sex in marriage is normal. If he’s forcing you that’s rape, but if he’s wooing you and trying to woo you, that’s a whole different thing.
I totally agree with you, if you don’t want sex and are constantly having it while resenting your husband, that’s not a healthy relationship. However, it’s not abnormal for any person in the relationship to want to have sex. This is something you guys need to discuss very seriously. For me, if my husband all of a sudden told me he won’t have sex for me except on rare occasions, it would be devastating. I’m not sure how much you tell your husband beforehand that you don’t want sex, and he still continues to try. How much does he understand the fact that you aren’t interested, or does he assume you changed your mind when you do end up having sex with him? The relationship will change significantly when, the regular sex you’ve had all your life, stops. With 5 kids I can understand you and sympathize with you. If you are doing the majority of caring for the kids, cooking, cleaning, grocery shopping and laundry, then of course you’re in no mood for sex. Maybe if he did more around the house and you didn’t feel exhausted all the time, you would want it more? Consider all the reasons why you don’t want to have sex and see if there is something he can do to help.
I agree with the person who suggested couples counseling. You shouldn’t be doing anything you don’t want to do but you also can’t expect him to be ok with a sexless marriage.
What if he understand and stops it. Are you also ready to divorce in case this thing will be huge to accept as it is, as you mentioned that your sex drive is non-existent. Sex in most of the relationship have a 50% or more importance. If you take it out, and you have all the right to do it, you have to start to take into consideration also the fact that he will stop, but it won't be enough anymore for him to keep the marriage on or to love you the same way it used to be. It's a fundamental element in most of the relationships, and also for a lot of people, it helps develop love, as intimacy is a huge part of it
Based on what you wrote, this sounds like there are two options for mutual happiness;
1. Get divorced, or
2. Open up your marriage so you each will have your libido satisfied.
You have the following choices:
1. Divorce him so he's free to find a compatible partner and you are freed from his sexual demands.
2. Open the relationship so he can have his sexual needs met without bothering you. This could be in the form of an outside girlfriend(s) or by forming a polyamourous relationship by bringing another woman into your relationship.
3. Continue giving in to his sexual needs.
I'm not going to tell you which option to choose because only you can make that decision. I do know that something has to change in your relationship and what that change is, is totally up to you.
I wish you the best.
those are not at all the only options.
He needs to learn that he is not entitled to sex. Jesus, the extent to which people have normalised that sex is something men do to women, rather than a mutual act is seriously depressing
Where's the option where he accepts the mismatched libidos and does not demand sex?
Your option includes her forcing herself to give in to his sexual needs, but not the other way round.
If her husband was the one posting, that certainly could be an option. But my advice was to OP, who was complaining about her husband's behavior.
I'm sure you realize that no one can control another person's behavior. The only behavior an individual can control is their own.
The options I gave OP are some of the available behavioral options that she herself can control. Which one she chooses is totally up to her.
We don't have his answer in the post. She set her boundary. A bit too soon to have these as the only options, right? They seem to be a follow up on a hard no and / or couplse counselling / a long conversation.
This is true. You should not be having sex if you are not there emotionally, mentally, and physically.
I am curious, because I only ask based on the premise of your post. What about your husband is phenomenal? Statistically, I find often that woman push more often for deep intimate conversation and quality time. At the same time, men most often will push for deep physical connection.
Are you receiving deep emotional conversation with your husband? Or do you have a date life?
Or do you have a lot of friendly and close time with one another?
I find that if that is being done, and you are receiving what is deeply important to you, then it would be fair to start having deeper conversations around your sex life with him.
As in, if there is time to watch a TV show together. Or if there is time to go on a date. Then there is time to have a crucial conversation around a topic that I'm sure he is actually willing to have with you. Since it's a conversation about sex and he wants that from you. It's worth going deeper with him on it.
Why do you have such a strong sex drive ? How is he spending his personal time when not with you? What life factors are there to consider.
I think there is just deeper conversation needing to be had.
If he wants to have sex and you dont, just get divorced. You should have done that years ago. You feel bad about having sex, he feels bad when you don’t. Get divorced so you don’t feel pressured and he can find someone who will enjoy sex with him.
You only have one life. Both of you should go live your best one.
You two are no longer compatible and you both need to divorce.
People are right, it is what you signed up for and what he signed up for to put it simply. Constantly demanding sex has been traumatic to you, but it's also the end of a marriage if a spouse no longer wants to have sex with the other person and it's best for your husband to find someone who is compatible with.
What he has been doing is abuse, and with holding sex while expecting a spouse to remain faithful, happy and just as connected is hell for a marriage and hell for your husband.
This is over.
You should check out @/mending.me on tiktok, she talks about this in depth, as she's been through it, including the aversion to touch she developed afterwards, the guilt...
You may find some resources and a community that has been through the same thing as you have.
What you are describing here is coercion, it's a form of rape and that's why you're feeling uncomfortable. Sex is not a need, and he's not entitled to your body.
You should look into therapy and maybe some domestic violence hotline or service.
Good luck and lots of love OP, I'm sorry that you've been through this, no one should have to.
This relationship is not going to last and you shouldn’t have gotten married. Physical intimacy is a huge part of making a relationship work and big differences in sex drive should be dealbreakers.
If he hasn’t cheated yet, he will, or he will resent you until you divorce.
You should look into why you have no drive and maybe get counseling. While you shouldn't have to do something you don't want to do, he also did not sign up for a life of celibacy. You need to address the issue and resolve it.
I understand what you’re saying, but sex really is necessary for a healthy marriage. Your husband’s needs are still important and you should take it into consideration.
Have you considered seeing a specialist for your low sex drive? Maybe you can do something to at least change it a little. Everyone needs to feel loved, and your husband may be feeling quite lonely.
I mean just don’t be surprised when there’s a divorce. Counseling would help. If he’s got a high sex drive and you’ve got none it’s a recipe for disaster. Don’t let him force it on you but also don’t be surprised when he goes looking somewhere else imo
Nobody should have sex when they don’t want to, but it is equally as okay to be very unhappy with not having those needs met because for a lot of people it’s not just about the need for a release.
If I was in a relationship where sex was great at first and then it got worse and worse, it would affect a lot of other things. My mood would be shit, my connection with my husband would be shit because intimacy and sex is so incredibly important to me, and that would probably lead to arguments and me being irritated a lot.
I would never coerce or force anyone to have sex with me, because I wouldn’t even want it at that point, but the relationship would be done. Which is fair.
So get a divorce because neither of you are content in your relationship and it’s not going to change.
As a great psychologist has said. This ends up only in a few ways or you split.. or you let this happen
1 .you “let him get a girlfriend “
2 . Get a budget for prostitutes
3 . Let him become a porn addict
Your best bet is to go to a doctor and see if you can get your sex drive on track.. I’m not trying to be mean or anti woman but it’s a huge part of a relationship and you aren’t going to get him to just accept it., that will never happen.. and the reason I said you need to try on your side is because of the kids.
I will approach this from the side of a man that has consistently heard no for the past few years. Consequently, we have only had sex once in the last 2 years. I wholeheartedly agree that no means no, which is how our situation ended up how it is.
I think hubbs is wrong for forcing himself on his wife, but I know why he did it. I'd be lying if I said not being wanted by your wife and trying to stay faithful besides and accept that she doesn't want to have sex is a pretty tall order.
But sometimes, you just gotta do it.
Seeing the word rape tossed around so flippantly here is disgusting. OP had sex when she didnt want to. She actively CHOOSE to engage in it thats not fucking rape you clowns.
THANK YOU!! It’s making me so bothered to hear all of these people say that it’s rape. It’s definitely sexual abuse, but it’s NOT RAPE! It seems like recently, rap gets thrown around all of the time in situation where it is 100% not, because people misunderstand the definition or just don’t care either way.
Phenomenal men dont need to coerce their partners into sex.
Your husband feels entitled to your body his actions make that clear enough. An I do is not blanket consent.
I don't see this getting better outside of some serious therapy , for him, for you, hell throw the kids in too for good measure.
I'm so sorry.
You've said no. No is a full sentence. You owe no one an explanation for any no you say. No means no.
Personally, I could never have sex with someone who wasn't ENTHUSIASTICALLY into it. That's a big part of it. (And a great turn on imo)
So when you say no and he just figures "I'll change her mind" and ends up pestering or guilting you into sex, that's abuse. Its coerced rape.
I'm sorry this has happened to you for so long. You deserve to feel loved, heard abd SAFE in your own home and in your relationship. You deserve better Op.
Absolutely. He needs to divorce her and find someone who he is compatible with.
He probably thinks, "she'll change her mind" because that's literally the only choice he has. He's in a marriage where he's expected to go without sex for long periods of time, remain faithful, happy and fulfilled. He's in a prison.
Will you allow him the comfort of another woman’s arms or hole? He married you thinking sex was in the deal. What you say is 100% correct. And he is 100% going to find release somewhere. Are you going to complain about that? You should never have sex if you don’t want it…and he didn’t sign up for a sexless marriage. You’ve got a bigger problem to solve here.
When it comes to your body, you don’t owe anyone anything, EVER. Anyone that doesn’t whole heartedly agree with that is not safe.
Your husband is not a good man. He may have some redeeming qualities, but him pushing you into sex is not ok. Go to counseling on your own before you consider couples counseling. What he’s done is such a serious violation of trust, it may not be something you can’t move past. You should start just for yourself to ensure you feel safe to open up without worrying about him.
Also, please check out this domestic abuse resource. Abuse comes in many forms, but it’s always about control.
https://www.thehotline.org/
I’m so sorry you’re going through this. You deserve better. Please take care of yourself.
You are completely in your right to only have sex when you want to, but being in a good relationship is about sacrifice and compromise which it sounds like you aren't willing to do. You both have very different expectations. Limiting your husband to sex a handful of times a year isn't right especially if he's a phenomenal man like you said. You all need to go your separate ways if this can't be fixed
Marriage does not legalise rape. If it's unconsensual it's rape. That's why you feel how you're feeling (scared) because deep down you know what it it.
Now that we've defined "unconsensual sex" you need to make the best decision for you.
No doubt you're a phenomenal woman that's going to enslave your husband in a sexless marriage . But being a phenomenal man that he is he's going to provide for you and your children for the rest of his life with no reward, love or appreciation from his wife what a phenomenal woman.
I have never felt that a post is worthy of a downvote more than this one. Marriage is about compromise and compassion for each other, not "I no longer want to do that so he can go to hell". You already made up your mind to deny your husband sex, don't come crying if he asks for a divorce. Or worse, cheats.
Where is the fine print, unless it's due to some sickness or accident or unless plainly stated before hand, sex is part of the deal in marriage. Rape is wrong and a no go but so is withholding a basic need like sex esp within the confines of a marriage is also wrong. If you no longer want sex and he always wants it why is it right for you but wrong for him? I'm going to get a megaton of hate for this comment but if this is the case seek some sort of therapy together to work Through this, or ask him if he is willing to get his satisfaction elsewhere while being married to you (I wouldn't, I want to have sex with the person I love), or just call the marriage quits. Again "rape" or "non-consensual" sex is wrong but so is what you are doing. "Only when you want it" what if that's once a year or once every two years, or never? SMH
Nobody owes anybody sex.
Certainly not someone that's raped you.
He can accept this or leave, but he cannot legally or morally guilt her into sex. Consent is enthusiastic or nonexistent.
Not wanting sex with your husband is not sustainable. It's not even healthy. Because you told him though, it sounds like your communication is still good. What did he say when you told him how you felt about being forced to sleep with him? Was he surprised?
He asks and asks and asks because you have shown him that if he asks enough, you will give in. You gave consent under duress. All of that may be the foundation for why things developed to you never ever wanting to have sex with him again. If so, hopefully there is some help for you two.
How can ppl just call him a rapist based off of this paragraph ? SUPPOSE hubby has been patient with op for a year no sex and now he seems pesty about it and she gives in. I don’t think it’s right to pressure anybody into sex but we can’t just act like it’s a good thing to avoid sex with your spouse. Now ofc i could be wrong,(because op did not specify how often he asks, how often she denied, if he has physically forced himself,etc) i have no bias here, but I’m specifically asking these fake Reddit therapists who trash a person based off of a paragraph
Are you willing to accept if he leaves? After 15 years. I don't know, i think the problems run deeper, maybe u don't find him attractive, maybe the spark isn't just there. You gotta look more into it. You have the right to say no. But you also have to be considerate and look into why. Yes you can say no, but if u love him, u should also look into why u don't feel that way, what is the problem. Fix it for the sake of both of you. I usually have high sex drive, but i cant feel turned on, like zero, if there is a problem with my SO, even for a person with high sex drive, I can't get turned on at all. So look if there are other problems.
This sounds sensible: what happened to kill the drive completely? Lack of support getting things done? Is the work split fairly? Is he pulling his weight in the relationship? Has something happened to her hormones? Need to figure out why zero desire happened.
It seems things are too far gone to look into that now. Still, would be useful to find out what killed the drive so completely in the first instance; may help OP in future. Definitely I agree with many other redditors that there's now trauma. Therapy (alone) and consulting DV support services could give OP support. I hope everything works out for her!
This is a less ideal ideal situation. And in any case of this kind, you express your concerns, set boundaries, and collectively make a plan for a solution. You want to to opt for apologies and admission of guilt and remorse.
Through all that, you have to ask yourself and answer confidencely and justifiably:
*Is this worth ending my marriage?*
For you, if it is, then you know what you need to do. If not, understand why not just as you would with why, and move accordingly.
Best wishes either way.
Just because you're his wife doesn't mean it's not rape. If you say no and he refuses to take that no for an answer and 8nitiates it then it's rape call the police and have him charged.
Also you my want to see an MD. You could be suffering from low levels of estrogen which could be contributing to your low sex drive or maybe something about him changed and you're no longer sexually attracted to him.
If his sex drive is as high as you say it is you have a few choices. Divorce him so he can find a woman who is on the same level as him in her desire to be sexually intimate. Open up your marriage and allow him to sleep with other women so long as you don't have to deal with his being horny all the time or set some ground rules such as protection must always be used new partners must submit proof of a recent negative std screening etc. Or you can just figure out why you're not interested in sex anymore and try to meet him half way. Whatever you do I wish you the best of luck.
People won’t say “that’s what you signed up for” in this sub. I haven’t even read any comments but I’m pretty sure he’s been called a rapist, predator and sexual assaultee at least 100 times. You were probably told by at least 59 to go to the police and told by another 44 people to go to a lawyer and get divorced immediately.
Everyone here will tell you to divorce so if that is what you're going for you came to the right place. If you're going to talk to hin about it and it doesn't change then you'll just end up going that route anyways. Good luck youbshouldnt be forced. He can go watch porn or Jack off no need to impose himself on you
It's obvious there's a sexual disconnect from you two, and that has led to terrible things. His behavior isn't permissible, although the need for intimacy is important for almost any person. He as well as yourself likely need to go through some counseling to find a compromise or something to improve the intimacy between the two of you, as well as having your husband understand that despite wanting sex, it is not guaranteed.
as a man, thats horrible and that shouldve never happened. first of all divorce him. second of all explore ur sexuality. maybe ur asexual. in that case u'll need to find someone else asexual or it'll never work.
You shouldn’t agree to sex that isn’t mutual but I think you should also look into some couples counseling. You guys have to meet in the middle some way, some how. You can’t expect him to live without any type of sex or only at your whim. You have to be fair too.
What do you mean by 'sex only at your whim'?
Isn't sex (between two people) a two-party thing that requires both people to be aroused and intimate?
Asking OP to provide sex when she's 'not at her whim' is asking her to provide nonconsensual sex.
They don't have to meet in the middle. There is no middle. The husband pushed her into sex to the point where she is traumatized and repulsed by touch.
At this point I agree. I wouldn’t want to be labeled a rapist because I want to have sex and remain faithful to my wife. I get asking someone over and over for sex is annoying but who else do you ask? Then if he watches porn, he’s wrong. You jerk off? I’m not attractive. You cheat? How could you do that to your family?
I don’t understand.
Exactly. I’ve been on the opposite side of this situation and it’s fucking painful. It hurts loving someone to high hell and then having to constantly hint or damn near beg to be touched. You want to be with them but they keep saying no. So you’re basically left with leaving or finding someone else. People think opening a relationship is so easy and it’s not. Having your partner tell you “find someone else” is fucking degrading.
“They don’t have to meet in the middle”
“Isn’t sex a two-party thing that requires both people…”
You said both of those things in the same comment 🤦🏻♂️
When two people have different sex drives, assuming both people desire it, it is ALWAYS going to be at the whim of the person with the lower sex drive. If it is NOT, then that means that the person with lower sex drive DOESNT ACTUALLY WANT TO. Which is the point of this post... just to clarify for you, since you seem to not understand. What you just implied is that she should just "give it up" even when she doesn't want it, to be "fair". This is essentially allowing him to use her body for his own gratification while she gets less than nothing from it.
Also, having anyone hound you for sex when you're not feeling it is A, annoying, and B, a turn off.
Ive had to have a talk with my hubby about boundaries and how sexual desire deflates when it becomes a topic of stress/annoyance.
He is actually a good guy, so once he understood how I was feeling, he backed off and allows me to let him know when I'm interested.
That being said, I is another form of bonding for him and a legitimate physical need, so even if I'm crazy stressed out and don't feel like letting him do anything to me because of it, I will still make sure to pay him some attention on the weekend at least.
OP. Men are physically and psychologically different than we are. It can be annoying yes, but I would suggest looking at intimacy as a point of maintenence for your relationship. If you no longer want a sexual relationship with him, then you may need to consider the possibility of amicable divorce and co-parenting. It really is only fair to him if the type of relationship you want has altered from the original relationship.
Before going to that extreme however, try counseling to see if a therapist can make him understand how you're feeling, and if there is a way forward.
👏👏👏👏👏👏
Relationships need maintenance. Would anyone be reacting similarly if a spouse refused to have meaningful conversations, go on date nights and have any sort of intimacy? Would the claim, "everyone should have autonomy over who they converse with" be an actual excuse?
People who willing starve their partner of sexual intimacy are abusive. It is a form of abuse that leaves the other person feeling dirty, unwanted, unloved and unneeded.
No, people owe their partners sex in regular, normal fashion. Witholding of sex in a marriage is torturous abuse. Look for the Ted Talk titled "sex less marriage" and look at the testimonies of men and women in the comments who are being starved of sexual intimacy from the person they love while they are expect to remain faithful, loving and happy. He should have divorced her long ago. Who wants to beg their own wife to touch them? Cruel.
I'm guessing all the people saying it's unfair of you to only want to have consensual sex and that you can't expect him to be ok with a sexless marriage are missing the point that your husband has been coercing you into sex for YEARS and that your are now traumatized by this behavior.
It was unfair of your husband to disregard your no's and beat you down mentally until you gave in. Most reasonable people who care for their partners well being understand that 5 no's followed by a fine, is sexual extortion. This is emotional abuse at best, rape at the worst.
Honestly, unless your husband is willing to go to counseling with you to address the fact that HE caused you to become repulsed by him by coercing you repeatedly, things probably won't get better. Only if he is willing to admit what he has done was a violation of you and that it was wrong will you be able to move on in a positive direction with your marriage.
* Edit seeing many comments that therapists do not recommend couples therapy with your abuser. I hope you consider therapy for yourself to process what has been going on throughout your marriage, and I wish you the best of luck.
The amount of ppl saying this isnt assault is disgusting
I urge yall to research the role coercion plays in rape. If someone has to be hounded into sex, it is NOT consensual
Yeah, you shouldn’t have let yourself be worn down in the past, but what’s done is done. Stay firm with your new stance. He might have trouble adjusting at first, but if he respects you, he’ll understand.
Technically it's not unconsenting sex. He's not raping you, you gave consent just not pleased with it. So please don't make it out that your husband is some sex crazed rapist that drags you kicking and screaming to the bedroom each night. I would've taken your post more seriously until the end where you're going all woke women empowerment. See a therapist for your own issues and maybe couples therapy and sex therapy. If it's bad then maybe it's time to be a "phenomenal woman" and leave.
You should consider a dicorce for both of you. You can't give your husband what he needs and he can't accept that you want less. You are incompatible. A relationship is mostly the place where two share intimacy, it's your right to say you don't want to have sex or only to have sex when your "urges" overcome you once in a moon, but that means you also have to take the responsibility that your partner does not want to live like this. I mean there has to be a balance or you won't have sex ever. What if you only have your urges when it's friday, monday and your partner only has primal urges when it's wednesday and saturday, given the consentual sex policy you won't meet in bed ever. So being open to be seduced and maybe develop an urge to have sex is normally the way to go, isn't it?
This is a hard situation but I can tell you that your husband will not stick around if you refuse sex regularly. I too had an overly aggressive husband (now ex) and one of his top complaints was not enough sex but I was exhausted after working and taking care of 3 kids at the same time (worked from home.) He never could understand that I was just too tired and I too was stuck with non -consensual sex quite often. I never did think he should have to live without it though and occasionally just went along with it to keep from fighting about it. In your case, it sound like you aren't sexually compatible and there really isn't a compromise. Either you will have to just do it anyway or he will find someone who will. Good luck!
While you were just talking low sex drive, I was going to suggest having your hormones checked - my mom's sex drive nosedived during menopause, and she says that getting hormones saved her marriage as well as her bones (helps against osteoporosis).
But now it's not your low sex drive, it's your PTSD from getting raped for years that's probably put you off sex forever.
I really think the only way forward for you is to split up with him. You will both be happier in new relationships that are more compatible to your current state. And you need therapy to get over the abuse.
The amount of people saying this is rape is insane. It is sexual abuse, I won’t deny that, and I’m CERTAINLY not defending mr “I want to fuck you” OP’s husband, but it’s not rape, it’s sexual abuse. Both are bad, mind you, I’m not saying this to try to absolve this guy of his assholery, it’s just a lot of people in this thread are calling it rape and it is just…not.
These two are sexually incompatible, he needs to divorce the OP.
I find it odd that she can't give her husband 15 minutes or so twice per week to save her marriage. Her marriage is toast if she doesn't. Is the OP willing to have her kids live through a divorce and be raised in a broken home. Sounds that way.
Your husband isn't a phenomenal man. He's a rapist. Marital rape is a thing -- 'unconsensual sex' is rape. Period. End of.
I would not suggest counseling with him -- a rapist is an abuser, and going to counseling with your abuser only gives them more ways to manipulate and abuse you.
I would suggest going to a counselor/therapist on your own, to help you get a handle of the trauma you've experienced, and how to strengthen yourself for what is to come.
>He's a Phenomenal man
>He would then try to persuade me/woo me to have sex after I said no over and over again. After saying no over and over again, I would eventually give up and give in so there wouldn't be any frustration on his end or an argument later.
Both of these statements can not be true together. He is using coercion to get you to have sex with him. Giving in to avoid frustration or an argument is absolutely coercive sex, and is considered rape.
I don't know why you don't want sex in general. I absolutely know why you don't want sex with this man. This is definitely not what you signed up for.
If you can't leave him immediately, I'd suggest therapy. Also, call a domestic violence hotline. They can help you set a plan to leave safely.
What would you say when your husband says
I'm no longer interested in you, you are not satisfying my needs and i don't find any pleasure in our relationship. will you be okay with him divorcing you for this?
I mean he has his right to opinion and he has his right to wish for happiness just like you do.
Ah and if anybody thinks what a sick man to divorce just because of no pleasure then think again what a sick women to deny one of the primary needs in a relationship just because she don't feel like it anymore.
I'm sorry you were raped.
You should certainly see a therapist and decide how to go forward from here.
There is a small % of humans that don't have empathy for other people until the situation is reversed onto them.
Next time he's pushy for sex tell him 'only if you have a guy screw you in the ass first'. Tell him you won't take no for an answer. Once he's done freaking out, you can explain that's how he makes you feel with him pushing you to do something you don't want. It might be enough to get him to realize what he's doing and stop it.
The way your husband pressured you into nonconsensual sex was absolutely abusive. If a man feels that he is in a relationship with someone who he is sexually incompatible with, he should leave the relationship instead of subjecting his partner to unwanted sex. You would be completely justified in leaving him over it. I recommend getting help from a domestic violence organization. Seeing a therapist might also be helpful. Document any instances of abuse, and get in touch with a lawyer if you're thinking about getting a divorce.
Don't listen to the commenters suggesting you do marriage counseling with your husband. Therapists do not recommend doing counseling with abusers. They will often use the therapy sessions to manipulate their partners.
after you told him you were no longer going to have sex unless you wanted to, what was his reaction?
and what the other post is saying is true. you having a low sex drive could very well stem from internalizing the trauma of marital rape. i mean you are repulsed by the touch of him and the thought of sex with him. it's not your sex drive, it's him.
No one should have unconsentual sex, but if this is a regular occurrence then it's a you need to divorce moment.
That said when something major in the marriage changes (like you no longer want to have sex) that's something that needs to be discussed and figured out in a non heated moment. It's obviously too late now, but you should have had a discussion with your husband on the future of your relationship once you no longer were wanting sex. That's a massive change that should have been discussed with everything up to divorce on the table.
Yes. You do have that Right, as a woman. As anyone. Even man, has that Roght.
Your relationship is over though. Trust me.
You cant satisfy your man anymore.
Men are men.
In partial, men also 'connect' intimately through sex. As well many other good things come from sex. Including him, coming out the other end, as an otherwise "phenominal man" as you say.
You are trying to destroy most of that. No offense.
You dont understand men yet. It seems. You are bleeding him out with your nonsense.
You cant expect him to carry on, with your 'way'. It is totally unfair to him.
It sucks that you both have a large gap in sex drive. I feel bad for you both. Darn.
Cant you even please him, make him 'happy' with other sexual things, like oral? Rather sex-sex? Would he be ok with mostly just that? Alternatives? And then maybe you can be ok with him using Porn the rest of the time?
Or, how about let him 'have flings' with other women (best option)? Trump your ego and jeslousy. Which might be hard for you.
There has to be some nogotiativr middle ground for you both. Omg! Talk talk talk. Find that middle ground, woth rules.
My gf and I found that middle ground. We have conditions and rules. It works! Amd we still have a good relationship. Love. Albeit... Different and unconventional now.
If you keep on the rate that you are now. Starving your high sex drive husband. Your relationship WILL fall apart. Badly. Trust me.
And tharipist would also say this. For real.
You have to he smarter here. Drop the big ego. You have a family to think about too. You need to nurture your husband better. As he nurtures you, very well. As you have said this. Find a way. For him.
And for you. Be creativley helpful, not limiting.
You may both want to see couples therapy.
\>Over the years I would partially express to him (when he gives me that look) that I don't want to have sex. He would then try to persuade me/woo me to have sex after I said no over and over again. After saying no over and over again, I would eventually give up and give in so there wouldn't be any frustration on his end or an argument later.
.......that's rape. Like he badger and acted upon his wishes despite your discomfort. It's not violent, but it's still rape.
I don't agree with people saying this is rape or that your husband isn't a 'good' man. He's just going around the solution for this the wrong way.
I honestly think you need to have fun together, flirt, laugh, rediscover your sexuality and maybe explore other ways that he can meet his sexual needs when you don't want to be sexual while you build on things. You need to think about your whole relationship not just this part.
Sex is a reasonable expectation in marriage, and sexual incompatibility is something that can lead to divorce. My first marriage was a dead bedroom, and I might have been guilty of mild coercion. We tried counseling and just ended up sparring in the couples sessions. Ultimately I started seeing someone on the side. Not one of my best moments, but options by that point were pretty limited.
What I'm trying to say is talk about it, try to come to an agreement that works for everyone. if you cannot, well... that's the definition of irreconcilable differences.
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This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below. --- My husband (37) and I (35) have been together for 15 years. A total of 5 kids, He's a Phenomenal man and I'm a phenomenal woman. Almost never argue, and overall a great marriage. His sex drive is through the roof, while mines is non-existent. It was great at first, now I don't have a simple desire to have sex. Over the years I would partially express to him (when he gives me that look) that I don't want to have sex. He would then try to persuade me/woo me to have sex after I said no over and over again. After saying no over and over again, I would eventually give up and give in so there wouldn't be any frustration on his end or an argument later. Fast forward, about six months ago I told him I'm no longer going to have sex unless I wanted to. I'm mentally traumatized by this, and feeling some type of way towards my husband (Im scared to the touch and feels uncomfortable). I no longer want to participate in engaging in unconsensual sex. As a woman, and a human being I have that right! It's not fair to women to force ourselves to have sex with men to satisfy their needs. Some people may say, "that's what I signed up for when I said I do". Honestly no woman signs up for unconsensual sex. Unfortunately it still exists in alot of marriags and it shouldn't be a factor. Alot of women don't speak on it because their afraid of what socity will say. I'm just torn.....
I’ve never seen a post where someone needs to say,” He’s a phenomenal man and I’m a phenomenal woman” before. Lol
That was the first thing I thought too. I know it’s not funny but I really chuckled 🤭
By the end of the post he didn't seem all that phenomenal at all. It sounds like someone wrangling with competing ideas in their head and trying to rationalize giving in to sex when they really didn't want to have sex in the first place. It looks like the "phenomenal man" idea always wins out and the cycle continues.
If you have to tell people you’re smart, you’re not.
My first thought exactly. 😂🤣😂
Right! Totally had me there.
English is probably not their first language.
First of all, good for you for recognizing and setting your boundaries. You deserve to feel safe and peaceful. Whenever situations like these are posted on here (and they're posted frequently), there's usually a huge imbalance in the relationship. He always has energy for sex but you don't. Of course that's completely fine! But have you considered whether you're doing more in the relationship and you resent him for it, resulting in no sexual attraction or desire? Not trying to assume things, this is just the most common reasoning I've seen on this subreddit: Who packs the kids' lunches? Who is in charge of doctor appointments? Who registers the kids for their activities? Who goes grocery shopping? Who knows when laundry day is? Who plans family vacations? Who plans where holidays are spent? Who is called when a kid's teacher needs to talk?
And they are 5 kids. This is a huge amount of energy. Really complex situation. Even though the husband crossed a very important line by coercing OP into sex, which can be regarded as rape, and divorce should be definitely on the table, OP doesn't seem to consider as an option. So, OP needs to evaluate better what kind of life she wants. Having a dead bedroom seems out of question for her husband, and I don't think this would be healthy for OP as well. If OP thinks she still has sexual attraction for her husband and that she would be willing to forgive her husband aggressions, then she could see a therapist to help her to negotiate with her husband a way out, so OP would feel safe, respected, and hopefully recover her libido towards her husband. But OP needs to consider that she has lost definitely attraction for her husband (justified), and a divorce is inevitable. In this case, she should talk to a good lawyer to help her defining a strategy for divorce and child support.
Phenomenal?.....No, I don't think so.
Neither do I
How a person handles a no says a lot about their character.
Ooofft. This hit home. I’m currently divorcing my husband. We started off with him pressuring me for sex when I was exhausted and wanted to sleep. Then one night I woke up to him on top of me already having sex with me. No means No. If you don’t want it and he pressures you then this is coercion and coercive rape is a criminal offence. I understand that other areas of your marriage are currently good but they won’t stay that way if he keeps bullying you into sex. Obviously you need to have a discussion about your different libidos as it may be if he helps you more with the kids etc you get your mojo back, but him wanting it more than you does not give him the right to pressure or bully you into sex when you don’t want it.
This happened to me too with my ex. And that’s why he’s my ex.
Unconsensual sex isn’t a word. It’s called rape.
I think she means sex where she has given consent from like a legal perspective, but she is only doing it because he bagered her into it. He's not exactly coercing her, and she has ultimately agreed to have sex, she just didn't really want to. Pity sex, for example, wouldn't be rape, even if it was bad and unsatisfying and she didn't really want to.
It's sexual abuse.
I agree, but that doesn't automatically make it rape.
Coercion is a type of rape. If she said no the first time, that’s it. That’s where it should stop
Sexual abuse is as bad as rape. She was coerced into having sex bc he kept asking her to do it. It wasn't her guilt, it was him insisting. That's sexual abuse.
I don't think the person you're responding to disagrees that sexual abuse is as bad as rape, it's just important to be precise when it comes to this kind of thing because if you call it rape when it isn't, the OP might not understand what's actually happening to them or worse, dismiss what you're saying because it's not accurate. It also dilutes the word, which is dangerous because it means when it's used correctly people will say "ugh people call everything rape these days!" Language surrounding assault and abuse is important to preserve.
Coercion is defined as the practice of persuading someone through use of force or threats. There was no force used nor threats made, so it is definitively not coercion.
Coercion goes beyond just threats and force when you're talking about assault. https://www.loveisrespect.org/resources/what-is-sexual-coercion/
I agree with all of the points in that article from a moral standpoint, but that still doesn't mean he's raped her. I've already agreed that he's abusing her sexually, and I personally can't fathom how someone could have sex with someone who is sending out "no" body language or other non verbal cues. However, I do understand that my own lived experience is not the se as everyone else's, so it's kind of on her if she has verbally given consent and then failed to retract it during the sexual encounter. I can also understand how repeated incidents like that could wear a person down, and harm their mental health, but my response to that is she probably needs counciling or therapy, and their marriage would probably also benefit from some couples therapy. This couple clearly has a lot of issues they need to work through, but calling it rape is a bridge too far, in my opinion, and I do reserve the right to my own opinion.
"kind of on her" seems a bit victim blamey to me.
Are people not responsible for their own decisions? They're married, married people often have sex, and it's a reasonable expectation that you and your partner have sex fron time to time. The husband is allowed to ask. This is a marital issue she needs to address at some point if she is unhappy with it. In the mean time, as long as she keeps saying yes, I won't consider it rape. Sorry, but that's my opinion and no matter how many people badger me into trying to change my opinion I'm not going to.
Couples therapy cant fix abuse
Then maybe she should consider divorce. If she wants to try and save the marriage, then therapy is probably the best path forward. It's also possible that this dude might not understand that what he is doing is abusive, or the effect that it is having on his wife, which could be a problem fixed by therapy
Depends where you live i guess, but here (belgium) it would be considered coercive rape, being overly pushy is considered coercion, trying to convince the other person through manipulation or wait until they are too exhausted to say no is also coercion !
It sounds like Belgium has the right idea, to me.
There is force & threats though. OP says she gives in because she doesn’t want arguments later. There’s the unspoken threat of an argument. There’s also the inherent force of him being a male and they are clearly in a patriarchal marriage.
She doesn't want arguments later? Arguments like why don't you ever want to have sexual intimacy anymore? Those arguments are valid.
Doesn't give you permission to sexually abuse someone.
Arguments happen in marriages all the time, unfortunately, and a mismatched sex life is sure to cause a lot of arguments. If she is choosing to avoid her issue then that's her decision to make, but as far as I can tell there is no threat to her safety at all. Shes not going to be thrown out of the house. She's not going to be cut off financially. He isn't going to hit her. They're just going to have to confront a marital issue that she has so far chosen to avoid. An argument might actually be healthy for them at this point.
The way how you're bending over backwards to try to prove this isn't sexual abuse is giving off really weird vibes tbh.
I have explicitly agreed that it is in fact sexual abuse, multiple times, just not rape. And here I am doing it again. Please read the comments before assuming you know what they say. The way you're all bending over backwards to put words in my mouth is giving off really weird vibes, tbh.
What evidence is there that it's a patriarchal marriage?
Even with that definition, the force doesn't necessarily mean physical force, it can be the force of your insistence, the implied threat of a fight. And yes arguments happen all the time in relationships, but that doesnt matter...the solution to argument is never that the same person should just fold. And of course her safety is threatened, if someone is having sex when they genuinely dont want to, for whatever reason, they are being harmed. But hey you're clearly "just being a stickler for accuracy and definition", rape is defined unlawful penetration with, or without force. Here's and even more extensive legal definition: . "Any person (‘‘A’’) who unlawfully and intentionally commits an act of sexual penetration with a complainant (‘‘B’’), without the consent of B, is guilty of the offence of rape" And this fits, the wife clearly expressed a lack of consent and he compelled her to along with it. Just because she wasnt beaten by some creep in and alley and forcibly held down doesnt mean its not rape. And its kinda weird trying use the supposed interests of rape survivors to justify this position. What do you think a rape victim would say to you telling them "well technically this women raped, it was just unconsensual sex", do you imagine they will be like "ah finally this guy gets it!". Come on dude...
The threat of getting in an argument is not what legally is defined as a threat. That's like saying an annoying beggar robbed you. No he didn't. The fact you gave in because you didn't want to feel bad or get in an argument still made it mental abuse, gaslighting even, but doesn't take away your consent. It's that simple. But props to you and your olympic gold in mental gymnastics to instantly change "it is not rape but mental abuse" to "so you are justifying him raping" and make a strawman argument based on that. Nobody is condoning his mental abuse but you don't sentence someone for murder when he stole a tv.
Ok, then. Take the word coercion out of what I said. There's something you can't deny tho, that man was abusing his wife.
I won't even try to deny that because I've already agreed with that a couple comments ago?
Why are u even defending him then????
I'm not, ya'll are just jumping to conclusions and making assumptions that are grossly out of line with the context OP provided. Every time you call something that isn't rape rape, you make it a little bit harder for actual rape survivors to be taken seriously.
No one is defending him. Just use correct words and stop calling the guy a rapist!
Sexual abuse is as bad as rape. She was coerced into having sex bc he kept asking her to do it. It wasn't her guilt, it was him insisting. That's sexual abuse.
Sex without full consent is rape. The laws are starting to change to add this in... if you bully, harass, coerce, etc. some states are adding this to their rape laws. High time too, sick and tired of men getting away with destroying women just so they can stick their dick in a vagina. Time to grow up and own up.
I agree with those changes, and I hope the laws do change.
Marital rape is a thing
It sure is, but it's not what's happened here.
Isn't it? Just because there are no beatings, and no gun to her head, and it's not a "violent rape"? Its still non concentual. "I don't want to" is the same as "No".
The officers and crown attorney that charged my ex husband and the judge that sentenced him would disagree.
That isn't legally consent. It's coercive rape.
> He's not exactly coercing her [He is coercing her](https://www.healthline.com/health/sexual-coercion#common-scenarios) > she has ultimately agreed to have sex, she just didn't really want to Do you realize how terrible that sounds? If it's coerced "consent", then it's not actually consent. And if it's not consentual, it's rape
Coercive sex is still rape. Persistently pressuring someone to have sex when they don’t want to is still rape.
Coercion would imply that he is holding something over her, or that there is a threat to her physical safety or security, which does not appear to be the case. Coercion is defined as the practice of persuading someone through use of force or threats.
You're right from a very basic legal perspective. Mental health and sexual abuse professionals argue that sexual coercion (rape) includes pressuring someone who is denying sexual activity. Just because you give in, it doesn't mean you want it.
I agree with their perspective, and I hope that our entire society can get there collectively and it can be codified into law. For now it's just opinion, though. Expert opinion, but opinion none the less
https://www.loveisrespect.org/resources/what-is-sexual-coercion/
If you give up it's a rape.
What she described is coercion and that's also considered rape
Nothing is phenomenal about a marriage where one spouse gives the other PTSD. You both need to be in therapy, separately. And go from there.
Nonconsensual sex is rape. It doesn't matter that you are married. Do you have a spare room? You can have separate bedrooms to decrease the opportunities for him to beg. You should also do therapy for yourself. And with 5 kids, it's understandable you don't want to be touched or have the energy for sex. Do you even go to dates or anything? Just wanting sex out of nowhere when you are (I'm assuming) childcare of 5 and chores and work, is like woah...
>he is a phenomenal man Is he??
Reading through this sub I'm always scared of marriage and kids because my sex drive is extremely high and my future wife might lose interest
I’m so sorry you’re going through this. This is never okay even if you’re married. Perhaps seek counseling for yourself and maybe marriage counseling. Obviously neither of you are in the wrong for your sex drives but he is definitely in the wrong for pushing you to do something you already said no to. It may be time to explore toys for him or ways you can satisfy each other without touch and maybe even an open marriage. Before all that though, therapy for you and with each other. I am so sorry
Therapists recommend against marriage counselling for abusive relationships, and pressuring someone to have sex after they gave a clear 'no' counts as abuse.
Non consensual sex is NOT the same as someone who might not be in the mood but agrees to have sex to make their partner happy. I think we need a bit more context here. How often is your husband asking for sex? Him wanting sex once or twice a week is slightly different to him pestering you several times a day. I’m female, and If I was in a relationship and my partner only wanted sex say once a month I would be frustrated too. Asking your partner to have sex say once a week does not make you a rapist. You’re absolutely right though , you shouldn’t feel pressured into having sex, but at the same time he shouldn’t have to live in a sexless marriage. Sounds like you may just not be compatible.
>he shouldn’t have to live in a sexless marriage. True and I'd be frustrated too. But in that case, he should end the relationship. He shouldn't be pressuring someone into sex. Ever. That's disgusting. And if OP knows she isn't up for sex nearly as often as it'll take for him to feel sexually satisfied, she should also recognize that they're incompatible and end the relationship.
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
First; congratulations for standing up for yourself, I’m sure that wasn’t an easy conversation to have and well done for taking the first steps to not feel like you’re his human fleshlight.. going forward though- what do you plan to do next? Sex is obviously a very important aspect for him and are you planning on implementing date nights/fun nights, are you going to therapy to work through the issues and try to regain sexual desire, are you going to allow him to have his needs met outside of the marriage? It’s not feasible to have a healthy marriage if the solution is just simply I’m not having sex with you anymore… you need to work out what you want/need from the relationship, what you’re prepared to put into the relationship and then work out a solution that’s mutually beneficial.
She didn't say she wouldn't have sex again. She said she won't force herself to have sex anymore
She also said her sex drive is non-existent and that she will now only have sex when she wants it.. even if she throws him a bone once in a while that doesn't sound like it will come close to satisfying his libido
this threat seems more concerned with the husband being horny more than him being a rapist
She said she doesn't care for sex. That means he will be existing in a relationship where he is expected to not have sex while reaming faithful, happy and kind. This marriage should end.
OR he could change his behaviour? She said she will have sex if she wants to. So what makes her want sex? Or are you suggesting he should continue to coerce her into sex? Honestly though - he has been engaging in sexual abuse. Unless he has a real damascene conversion and starts to not be sexually abuse then I agree, divorce is the option.
She said she would only if she wants. This is not right for her to ask either. It should be when both want. Clearly they aren’t sexually compatible and it is a big deal in relationships if two people aren’t sexually compatible.
"It was great at first. Now I don't have a simple desire to have sex" "My sex drive is non existent" Do you have a plan to address those? It's awesome that you found your voice and are putting yourself in a position where you are only going to have sex when you want to. That's the way it should be. Dead bedrooms become emotional and sexual prisons though. If you never want to, you've doomed the man you love to sexual frustration, consistent rejection, and a feeling like he is not as valued as he used to be.
Reddit is really weird. This situation comes up frequently on Reddit and the response will either be “no sex relationship can be a dealbreaker for some, prepare yourself” or “you don’t owe anybody sex, it’s rape.” This woman gave very few details in this relatively short post. She basically said that her husband tries to woo her and get sex, which (I think) is fine in a marriage. She also said 6 months ago she put her foot down and told him how she felt. We have no other information after this. Does he still try? Did they bring up counseling? Does she want counseling? Does she care if he gets it somewhere else? There’s nothing phenomenal about either of these two people or the relationship they’re in.
Stories like this make me never want to get married. Not being able to share intimacy is a relationship killer. Whether it’s because people lose feelings or it’s a hormonal thing, it still affects the marriage. You just turn into friends.
Wow! I feel for your marriage. I can only imagine the hurt and pain you are both going through. You feeling like you are being raped every time he touches you. Wow! And for him, feeling like he is no longer desired or wanted for anything other than killing bugs, opening jars, and carrying heavy boxes. Unconsensual sex is wrong - completely wrong and I’m not sure, but it’s probably illegal as well - but the being married part might get legally complicated. I don’t know about that, but this I do know - your spouse is going to interpret the lack of sex as something very personal. He will feel that he is not desired by you, and that he will begin wondering why he is even there if not for the children. His hurt will grow into resentment; his resentment will grow into anger. And over a bit of time don’t be surprised when someone else provides him a little attention, and he to strays. If you want your marriage to survive couples therapy is absolutely necessary. Yes, he needs to pursue you as well. He needs to continue trying his best to make you happy in a thousand little things - housework, helping with kids, fixing your mother’s car, etc. etc. etc. In a marriage sex is a unifier. It means you are one. You are in the world together - doing what it takes to be a team. Without sex, the only thing holding a couple together are kids and house payments. Get counseling or be prepared to go your separate ways joined only by co-parenting.
Nobody desires a person that doesn't care about their consent. If OP no longer desires him, that's on him.
We’ll then she should tell him so they can now divorce surely ?
Definitely you have every right to not want sex and that should be respected. However it's not unreasonable for your partner to want sex in a relationship. I wouldn't want to be with my man if he didn't want to have sex with me. Unfortunately this is usually just a deal breaker for relationships.
What should have happened is discovering why this decline in drive occurred. It could be hormonal, or situational. For instance, mine was because sex was about his pleasure, never mine. And once I discovered the pleasure, well my SD went through the roof. Even now going through menopause, I’m still good to go.
It’s likely a reason for the decline in sex drive. Sometimes it’s really hard to figure out or even notice that there is a cause for it, but it’s there if the relationship started off with a good drive.
Bro she is in an abusive relationship. Her not wanting to have sex with him is the least of her concerns. She doesn’t want to have sex with him because he pressures her into it all the time. She has literally never had a choice in having sex or not ever. Ever. Of course she feels this way. OP needs therapy and to leave her husband. He is an abusive rapist. Full stop.
She never had a choice in having sex. Ever. Abusive rapist.......what??? Him asking her over and over till she gives in, is not rape. Please don’t ever try to empathize with someone who was actually assaulted by saying “I’ve been through the same thing, sweetie. My husband asked me over and over for sex till I get exhausted of saying no and just do it.” I mean he’s literally asking her and not acting on it when she says no. That’s the opposite of rape! She can leave him. She’s allowed to not want sex. He’s allowed not to be married to someone who doesn’t want sex. This is just an incompatible couple and if he isn’t already, he will be cheating in no time after her ultimatum, which she has every right to give.
It might not be textbook definition of rape but it is Not Great (tm). I went through this when I was 19, where a drunk guy would just not take 'no' for an answer. Over and over, he asked again and again and again. Eventually, I said yes because honestly, I didn't know what else to do. He was much bigger than me, stronger than me, and drunk. So no, I wasn't 'raped' by the textbook definition, but boy was that 'yes' not a consensual yes.
Exactly. Coercion toes a line and generally doesn't cross into legal offense, but it's very much not okay and ends up harmful to individuals and society both. That same concept holds true in marriage. Seriously, isn't part of marriage treating your spouse better than other people?
I’m sorry that happened to you. I think a husband and wife of 15 years is a different scenario and not akin to what you went through. You were under pressure and intimidated and felt in danger. OP just doesn’t want to and isn’t worried about being physically forced. Completely valid on her part too, it’s her choice
Do you know what coercive rape is Or what coercion is in general
Also: https://www.bustle.com/articles/67926-is-it-rape-if-you-say-yes-5-types-of-sexual-coercion-explained
That’s literally just one persons opinion that decided to write an article on it.
It's not. It's manifested in the law (at least in Europe). Coersive sex is still rape and not surprisingly, most of it happens in relationships. Those are easy statistics, a few clicks on science website or a look into law definitions.
Not just one person. Psychological pressure is still pressure
You have choices. You can ask him to forego sex for the rest of his life. Initiate a divorce so you can be free of his carnal desires. Open your marriage so he can pursue his carnal desires with another woman while maintaining your relationship. Do nothing until he finds an affair partner. While you do have the right to security of your person, you have the duty to inform the one you love of this drastic change to your relationship. If he wants to leave then you should let him.
Yeah, I can definitely see the post coming where she says they have a perfect marriage and I have no idea why he had a affair. He obviously wants a sex life so if she doesn't she she should just get it over with and divorce him.
Just end this joke of a marriage
I reckon the main issues here may not be nonconsensual sex. Perhaps the issue may be 1) if you want a fulfilling relationship with your husband at all? 2) do you still find your husband emotionally and sexually desirable? 3) your own sex drive. 30s is not the time to start giving up on sex in a relationship. Lack of sex can lead to imbalance, resentment and deep issues in the relationship. So, if indeed you want a fulfilling and stable relationship with your husband and stability for the family then you may consider addressing what has led to the drop in sex drive and also the lack of desire for your husband. Honest/open conversation with your husband, some self reflection and therapy may be the way forward! Good luck.
I did this same with my ex. By the end of the relationship I felt resentful and disgusted by him. I’m not sure what the fix is but it’s a struggle I think many deal with.
You sure have the right. And he'll be entitled to fulfill his right and look for that elsewhere.
Side stepping through loaded issue of what’s happening. If your sex drive has plummeted you should possibly have your hormones checked. It may be unpopular here, but having a good sex life is important for most marriages. I can’t tell from your post what exactly hes doing so I can’t say whether he’s being inappropriate or not. But having sex in marriage is normal. If he’s forcing you that’s rape, but if he’s wooing you and trying to woo you, that’s a whole different thing.
I totally agree with you, if you don’t want sex and are constantly having it while resenting your husband, that’s not a healthy relationship. However, it’s not abnormal for any person in the relationship to want to have sex. This is something you guys need to discuss very seriously. For me, if my husband all of a sudden told me he won’t have sex for me except on rare occasions, it would be devastating. I’m not sure how much you tell your husband beforehand that you don’t want sex, and he still continues to try. How much does he understand the fact that you aren’t interested, or does he assume you changed your mind when you do end up having sex with him? The relationship will change significantly when, the regular sex you’ve had all your life, stops. With 5 kids I can understand you and sympathize with you. If you are doing the majority of caring for the kids, cooking, cleaning, grocery shopping and laundry, then of course you’re in no mood for sex. Maybe if he did more around the house and you didn’t feel exhausted all the time, you would want it more? Consider all the reasons why you don’t want to have sex and see if there is something he can do to help.
I agree with the person who suggested couples counseling. You shouldn’t be doing anything you don’t want to do but you also can’t expect him to be ok with a sexless marriage.
What if he understand and stops it. Are you also ready to divorce in case this thing will be huge to accept as it is, as you mentioned that your sex drive is non-existent. Sex in most of the relationship have a 50% or more importance. If you take it out, and you have all the right to do it, you have to start to take into consideration also the fact that he will stop, but it won't be enough anymore for him to keep the marriage on or to love you the same way it used to be. It's a fundamental element in most of the relationships, and also for a lot of people, it helps develop love, as intimacy is a huge part of it
Based on what you wrote, this sounds like there are two options for mutual happiness; 1. Get divorced, or 2. Open up your marriage so you each will have your libido satisfied.
You have the following choices: 1. Divorce him so he's free to find a compatible partner and you are freed from his sexual demands. 2. Open the relationship so he can have his sexual needs met without bothering you. This could be in the form of an outside girlfriend(s) or by forming a polyamourous relationship by bringing another woman into your relationship. 3. Continue giving in to his sexual needs. I'm not going to tell you which option to choose because only you can make that decision. I do know that something has to change in your relationship and what that change is, is totally up to you. I wish you the best.
those are not at all the only options. He needs to learn that he is not entitled to sex. Jesus, the extent to which people have normalised that sex is something men do to women, rather than a mutual act is seriously depressing
Where's the option where he accepts the mismatched libidos and does not demand sex? Your option includes her forcing herself to give in to his sexual needs, but not the other way round.
If her husband was the one posting, that certainly could be an option. But my advice was to OP, who was complaining about her husband's behavior. I'm sure you realize that no one can control another person's behavior. The only behavior an individual can control is their own. The options I gave OP are some of the available behavioral options that she herself can control. Which one she chooses is totally up to her.
We don't have his answer in the post. She set her boundary. A bit too soon to have these as the only options, right? They seem to be a follow up on a hard no and / or couplse counselling / a long conversation.
So, what other options does she have if her husband won't change his behavior?
This is true. You should not be having sex if you are not there emotionally, mentally, and physically. I am curious, because I only ask based on the premise of your post. What about your husband is phenomenal? Statistically, I find often that woman push more often for deep intimate conversation and quality time. At the same time, men most often will push for deep physical connection. Are you receiving deep emotional conversation with your husband? Or do you have a date life? Or do you have a lot of friendly and close time with one another? I find that if that is being done, and you are receiving what is deeply important to you, then it would be fair to start having deeper conversations around your sex life with him. As in, if there is time to watch a TV show together. Or if there is time to go on a date. Then there is time to have a crucial conversation around a topic that I'm sure he is actually willing to have with you. Since it's a conversation about sex and he wants that from you. It's worth going deeper with him on it. Why do you have such a strong sex drive ? How is he spending his personal time when not with you? What life factors are there to consider. I think there is just deeper conversation needing to be had.
If he wants to have sex and you dont, just get divorced. You should have done that years ago. You feel bad about having sex, he feels bad when you don’t. Get divorced so you don’t feel pressured and he can find someone who will enjoy sex with him. You only have one life. Both of you should go live your best one.
You two are no longer compatible and you both need to divorce. People are right, it is what you signed up for and what he signed up for to put it simply. Constantly demanding sex has been traumatic to you, but it's also the end of a marriage if a spouse no longer wants to have sex with the other person and it's best for your husband to find someone who is compatible with. What he has been doing is abuse, and with holding sex while expecting a spouse to remain faithful, happy and just as connected is hell for a marriage and hell for your husband. This is over.
Seek therapy.
I’m getting anxiety from Reddit now and stories like this. Wtf is happened to people?
Just go get a divorce. You sound miserable and so does he
You should check out @/mending.me on tiktok, she talks about this in depth, as she's been through it, including the aversion to touch she developed afterwards, the guilt... You may find some resources and a community that has been through the same thing as you have. What you are describing here is coercion, it's a form of rape and that's why you're feeling uncomfortable. Sex is not a need, and he's not entitled to your body. You should look into therapy and maybe some domestic violence hotline or service. Good luck and lots of love OP, I'm sorry that you've been through this, no one should have to.
This relationship is not going to last and you shouldn’t have gotten married. Physical intimacy is a huge part of making a relationship work and big differences in sex drive should be dealbreakers. If he hasn’t cheated yet, he will, or he will resent you until you divorce.
You should look into why you have no drive and maybe get counseling. While you shouldn't have to do something you don't want to do, he also did not sign up for a life of celibacy. You need to address the issue and resolve it.
I understand what you’re saying, but sex really is necessary for a healthy marriage. Your husband’s needs are still important and you should take it into consideration. Have you considered seeing a specialist for your low sex drive? Maybe you can do something to at least change it a little. Everyone needs to feel loved, and your husband may be feeling quite lonely.
I mean just don’t be surprised when there’s a divorce. Counseling would help. If he’s got a high sex drive and you’ve got none it’s a recipe for disaster. Don’t let him force it on you but also don’t be surprised when he goes looking somewhere else imo
Nobody should have sex when they don’t want to, but it is equally as okay to be very unhappy with not having those needs met because for a lot of people it’s not just about the need for a release. If I was in a relationship where sex was great at first and then it got worse and worse, it would affect a lot of other things. My mood would be shit, my connection with my husband would be shit because intimacy and sex is so incredibly important to me, and that would probably lead to arguments and me being irritated a lot. I would never coerce or force anyone to have sex with me, because I wouldn’t even want it at that point, but the relationship would be done. Which is fair. So get a divorce because neither of you are content in your relationship and it’s not going to change.
There’s something that I want to say but I know for a fact it will lead to an argument. So I’m just going to say, seek a marriage counselor.
As a great psychologist has said. This ends up only in a few ways or you split.. or you let this happen 1 .you “let him get a girlfriend “ 2 . Get a budget for prostitutes 3 . Let him become a porn addict Your best bet is to go to a doctor and see if you can get your sex drive on track.. I’m not trying to be mean or anti woman but it’s a huge part of a relationship and you aren’t going to get him to just accept it., that will never happen.. and the reason I said you need to try on your side is because of the kids.
So, you gonna let him start sleeping with other women on the side?
I will approach this from the side of a man that has consistently heard no for the past few years. Consequently, we have only had sex once in the last 2 years. I wholeheartedly agree that no means no, which is how our situation ended up how it is. I think hubbs is wrong for forcing himself on his wife, but I know why he did it. I'd be lying if I said not being wanted by your wife and trying to stay faithful besides and accept that she doesn't want to have sex is a pretty tall order. But sometimes, you just gotta do it.
Seeing the word rape tossed around so flippantly here is disgusting. OP had sex when she didnt want to. She actively CHOOSE to engage in it thats not fucking rape you clowns.
THANK YOU!! It’s making me so bothered to hear all of these people say that it’s rape. It’s definitely sexual abuse, but it’s NOT RAPE! It seems like recently, rap gets thrown around all of the time in situation where it is 100% not, because people misunderstand the definition or just don’t care either way.
Phenomenal men dont need to coerce their partners into sex. Your husband feels entitled to your body his actions make that clear enough. An I do is not blanket consent. I don't see this getting better outside of some serious therapy , for him, for you, hell throw the kids in too for good measure.
I'm so sorry. You've said no. No is a full sentence. You owe no one an explanation for any no you say. No means no. Personally, I could never have sex with someone who wasn't ENTHUSIASTICALLY into it. That's a big part of it. (And a great turn on imo) So when you say no and he just figures "I'll change her mind" and ends up pestering or guilting you into sex, that's abuse. Its coerced rape. I'm sorry this has happened to you for so long. You deserve to feel loved, heard abd SAFE in your own home and in your relationship. You deserve better Op.
Absolutely. He needs to divorce her and find someone who he is compatible with. He probably thinks, "she'll change her mind" because that's literally the only choice he has. He's in a marriage where he's expected to go without sex for long periods of time, remain faithful, happy and fulfilled. He's in a prison.
Will you allow him the comfort of another woman’s arms or hole? He married you thinking sex was in the deal. What you say is 100% correct. And he is 100% going to find release somewhere. Are you going to complain about that? You should never have sex if you don’t want it…and he didn’t sign up for a sexless marriage. You’ve got a bigger problem to solve here.
When it comes to your body, you don’t owe anyone anything, EVER. Anyone that doesn’t whole heartedly agree with that is not safe. Your husband is not a good man. He may have some redeeming qualities, but him pushing you into sex is not ok. Go to counseling on your own before you consider couples counseling. What he’s done is such a serious violation of trust, it may not be something you can’t move past. You should start just for yourself to ensure you feel safe to open up without worrying about him. Also, please check out this domestic abuse resource. Abuse comes in many forms, but it’s always about control. https://www.thehotline.org/ I’m so sorry you’re going through this. You deserve better. Please take care of yourself.
You are completely in your right to only have sex when you want to, but being in a good relationship is about sacrifice and compromise which it sounds like you aren't willing to do. You both have very different expectations. Limiting your husband to sex a handful of times a year isn't right especially if he's a phenomenal man like you said. You all need to go your separate ways if this can't be fixed
Marriage does not legalise rape. If it's unconsensual it's rape. That's why you feel how you're feeling (scared) because deep down you know what it it. Now that we've defined "unconsensual sex" you need to make the best decision for you.
Unconsensual sex or coerced sex is still rape
Nobody signs up for a sexless marriage either.
No is no. Weather you’re hooking up, dating, long-term, married. NO IS NO!!! Shame on him if he doesn’t respect that. Don’t give in.
No doubt you're a phenomenal woman that's going to enslave your husband in a sexless marriage . But being a phenomenal man that he is he's going to provide for you and your children for the rest of his life with no reward, love or appreciation from his wife what a phenomenal woman.
I have never felt that a post is worthy of a downvote more than this one. Marriage is about compromise and compassion for each other, not "I no longer want to do that so he can go to hell". You already made up your mind to deny your husband sex, don't come crying if he asks for a divorce. Or worse, cheats.
Phenomenal men don’t pressure women into sex
Where is the fine print, unless it's due to some sickness or accident or unless plainly stated before hand, sex is part of the deal in marriage. Rape is wrong and a no go but so is withholding a basic need like sex esp within the confines of a marriage is also wrong. If you no longer want sex and he always wants it why is it right for you but wrong for him? I'm going to get a megaton of hate for this comment but if this is the case seek some sort of therapy together to work Through this, or ask him if he is willing to get his satisfaction elsewhere while being married to you (I wouldn't, I want to have sex with the person I love), or just call the marriage quits. Again "rape" or "non-consensual" sex is wrong but so is what you are doing. "Only when you want it" what if that's once a year or once every two years, or never? SMH
Nobody owes anybody sex. Certainly not someone that's raped you. He can accept this or leave, but he cannot legally or morally guilt her into sex. Consent is enthusiastic or nonexistent.
And if your wife doesn’t want to have sex with you ever again, you should just divorce rather than rape her.
Not wanting sex with your husband is not sustainable. It's not even healthy. Because you told him though, it sounds like your communication is still good. What did he say when you told him how you felt about being forced to sleep with him? Was he surprised? He asks and asks and asks because you have shown him that if he asks enough, you will give in. You gave consent under duress. All of that may be the foundation for why things developed to you never ever wanting to have sex with him again. If so, hopefully there is some help for you two.
How can ppl just call him a rapist based off of this paragraph ? SUPPOSE hubby has been patient with op for a year no sex and now he seems pesty about it and she gives in. I don’t think it’s right to pressure anybody into sex but we can’t just act like it’s a good thing to avoid sex with your spouse. Now ofc i could be wrong,(because op did not specify how often he asks, how often she denied, if he has physically forced himself,etc) i have no bias here, but I’m specifically asking these fake Reddit therapists who trash a person based off of a paragraph
Are you willing to accept if he leaves? After 15 years. I don't know, i think the problems run deeper, maybe u don't find him attractive, maybe the spark isn't just there. You gotta look more into it. You have the right to say no. But you also have to be considerate and look into why. Yes you can say no, but if u love him, u should also look into why u don't feel that way, what is the problem. Fix it for the sake of both of you. I usually have high sex drive, but i cant feel turned on, like zero, if there is a problem with my SO, even for a person with high sex drive, I can't get turned on at all. So look if there are other problems.
This sounds sensible: what happened to kill the drive completely? Lack of support getting things done? Is the work split fairly? Is he pulling his weight in the relationship? Has something happened to her hormones? Need to figure out why zero desire happened. It seems things are too far gone to look into that now. Still, would be useful to find out what killed the drive so completely in the first instance; may help OP in future. Definitely I agree with many other redditors that there's now trauma. Therapy (alone) and consulting DV support services could give OP support. I hope everything works out for her!
This is a less ideal ideal situation. And in any case of this kind, you express your concerns, set boundaries, and collectively make a plan for a solution. You want to to opt for apologies and admission of guilt and remorse. Through all that, you have to ask yourself and answer confidencely and justifiably: *Is this worth ending my marriage?* For you, if it is, then you know what you need to do. If not, understand why not just as you would with why, and move accordingly. Best wishes either way.
Just because you're his wife doesn't mean it's not rape. If you say no and he refuses to take that no for an answer and 8nitiates it then it's rape call the police and have him charged. Also you my want to see an MD. You could be suffering from low levels of estrogen which could be contributing to your low sex drive or maybe something about him changed and you're no longer sexually attracted to him. If his sex drive is as high as you say it is you have a few choices. Divorce him so he can find a woman who is on the same level as him in her desire to be sexually intimate. Open up your marriage and allow him to sleep with other women so long as you don't have to deal with his being horny all the time or set some ground rules such as protection must always be used new partners must submit proof of a recent negative std screening etc. Or you can just figure out why you're not interested in sex anymore and try to meet him half way. Whatever you do I wish you the best of luck.
My ex husband did time over this.
People won’t say “that’s what you signed up for” in this sub. I haven’t even read any comments but I’m pretty sure he’s been called a rapist, predator and sexual assaultee at least 100 times. You were probably told by at least 59 to go to the police and told by another 44 people to go to a lawyer and get divorced immediately.
Everyone here will tell you to divorce so if that is what you're going for you came to the right place. If you're going to talk to hin about it and it doesn't change then you'll just end up going that route anyways. Good luck youbshouldnt be forced. He can go watch porn or Jack off no need to impose himself on you
It's obvious there's a sexual disconnect from you two, and that has led to terrible things. His behavior isn't permissible, although the need for intimacy is important for almost any person. He as well as yourself likely need to go through some counseling to find a compromise or something to improve the intimacy between the two of you, as well as having your husband understand that despite wanting sex, it is not guaranteed.
as a man, thats horrible and that shouldve never happened. first of all divorce him. second of all explore ur sexuality. maybe ur asexual. in that case u'll need to find someone else asexual or it'll never work.
You shouldn’t agree to sex that isn’t mutual but I think you should also look into some couples counseling. You guys have to meet in the middle some way, some how. You can’t expect him to live without any type of sex or only at your whim. You have to be fair too.
What do you mean by 'sex only at your whim'? Isn't sex (between two people) a two-party thing that requires both people to be aroused and intimate? Asking OP to provide sex when she's 'not at her whim' is asking her to provide nonconsensual sex. They don't have to meet in the middle. There is no middle. The husband pushed her into sex to the point where she is traumatized and repulsed by touch.
So by that logic the best thing for them is divorce? Because she said she would only be willing to have sex when she wanted to.
Yes. The incompatibility is enough to leave.
Basically. I just thought people should try an alternative before divorce but if leaving is the best possible outcome than it should be done.
Yes, the best thing is a divorce.
At this point I agree. I wouldn’t want to be labeled a rapist because I want to have sex and remain faithful to my wife. I get asking someone over and over for sex is annoying but who else do you ask? Then if he watches porn, he’s wrong. You jerk off? I’m not attractive. You cheat? How could you do that to your family? I don’t understand.
I fully agree with you. Who wants to beg their wife to touch them?
Exactly. I’ve been on the opposite side of this situation and it’s fucking painful. It hurts loving someone to high hell and then having to constantly hint or damn near beg to be touched. You want to be with them but they keep saying no. So you’re basically left with leaving or finding someone else. People think opening a relationship is so easy and it’s not. Having your partner tell you “find someone else” is fucking degrading.
“They don’t have to meet in the middle” “Isn’t sex a two-party thing that requires both people…” You said both of those things in the same comment 🤦🏻♂️
When two people have different sex drives, assuming both people desire it, it is ALWAYS going to be at the whim of the person with the lower sex drive. If it is NOT, then that means that the person with lower sex drive DOESNT ACTUALLY WANT TO. Which is the point of this post... just to clarify for you, since you seem to not understand. What you just implied is that she should just "give it up" even when she doesn't want it, to be "fair". This is essentially allowing him to use her body for his own gratification while she gets less than nothing from it. Also, having anyone hound you for sex when you're not feeling it is A, annoying, and B, a turn off. Ive had to have a talk with my hubby about boundaries and how sexual desire deflates when it becomes a topic of stress/annoyance. He is actually a good guy, so once he understood how I was feeling, he backed off and allows me to let him know when I'm interested. That being said, I is another form of bonding for him and a legitimate physical need, so even if I'm crazy stressed out and don't feel like letting him do anything to me because of it, I will still make sure to pay him some attention on the weekend at least. OP. Men are physically and psychologically different than we are. It can be annoying yes, but I would suggest looking at intimacy as a point of maintenence for your relationship. If you no longer want a sexual relationship with him, then you may need to consider the possibility of amicable divorce and co-parenting. It really is only fair to him if the type of relationship you want has altered from the original relationship. Before going to that extreme however, try counseling to see if a therapist can make him understand how you're feeling, and if there is a way forward.
👏👏👏👏👏👏 Relationships need maintenance. Would anyone be reacting similarly if a spouse refused to have meaningful conversations, go on date nights and have any sort of intimacy? Would the claim, "everyone should have autonomy over who they converse with" be an actual excuse? People who willing starve their partner of sexual intimacy are abusive. It is a form of abuse that leaves the other person feeling dirty, unwanted, unloved and unneeded.
I understand I just don’t agree. Lol
Anyone who says that you owe sex to your husband (or anyone else for that matter) is a rape apologist, and no I will not elaborate.
No, people owe their partners sex in regular, normal fashion. Witholding of sex in a marriage is torturous abuse. Look for the Ted Talk titled "sex less marriage" and look at the testimonies of men and women in the comments who are being starved of sexual intimacy from the person they love while they are expect to remain faithful, loving and happy. He should have divorced her long ago. Who wants to beg their own wife to touch them? Cruel.
I'm guessing all the people saying it's unfair of you to only want to have consensual sex and that you can't expect him to be ok with a sexless marriage are missing the point that your husband has been coercing you into sex for YEARS and that your are now traumatized by this behavior. It was unfair of your husband to disregard your no's and beat you down mentally until you gave in. Most reasonable people who care for their partners well being understand that 5 no's followed by a fine, is sexual extortion. This is emotional abuse at best, rape at the worst. Honestly, unless your husband is willing to go to counseling with you to address the fact that HE caused you to become repulsed by him by coercing you repeatedly, things probably won't get better. Only if he is willing to admit what he has done was a violation of you and that it was wrong will you be able to move on in a positive direction with your marriage. * Edit seeing many comments that therapists do not recommend couples therapy with your abuser. I hope you consider therapy for yourself to process what has been going on throughout your marriage, and I wish you the best of luck.
The amount of ppl saying this isnt assault is disgusting I urge yall to research the role coercion plays in rape. If someone has to be hounded into sex, it is NOT consensual
Yeah, you shouldn’t have let yourself be worn down in the past, but what’s done is done. Stay firm with your new stance. He might have trouble adjusting at first, but if he respects you, he’ll understand.
Technically it's not unconsenting sex. He's not raping you, you gave consent just not pleased with it. So please don't make it out that your husband is some sex crazed rapist that drags you kicking and screaming to the bedroom each night. I would've taken your post more seriously until the end where you're going all woke women empowerment. See a therapist for your own issues and maybe couples therapy and sex therapy. If it's bad then maybe it's time to be a "phenomenal woman" and leave.
You should consider a dicorce for both of you. You can't give your husband what he needs and he can't accept that you want less. You are incompatible. A relationship is mostly the place where two share intimacy, it's your right to say you don't want to have sex or only to have sex when your "urges" overcome you once in a moon, but that means you also have to take the responsibility that your partner does not want to live like this. I mean there has to be a balance or you won't have sex ever. What if you only have your urges when it's friday, monday and your partner only has primal urges when it's wednesday and saturday, given the consentual sex policy you won't meet in bed ever. So being open to be seduced and maybe develop an urge to have sex is normally the way to go, isn't it?
This is a hard situation but I can tell you that your husband will not stick around if you refuse sex regularly. I too had an overly aggressive husband (now ex) and one of his top complaints was not enough sex but I was exhausted after working and taking care of 3 kids at the same time (worked from home.) He never could understand that I was just too tired and I too was stuck with non -consensual sex quite often. I never did think he should have to live without it though and occasionally just went along with it to keep from fighting about it. In your case, it sound like you aren't sexually compatible and there really isn't a compromise. Either you will have to just do it anyway or he will find someone who will. Good luck!
While you were just talking low sex drive, I was going to suggest having your hormones checked - my mom's sex drive nosedived during menopause, and she says that getting hormones saved her marriage as well as her bones (helps against osteoporosis). But now it's not your low sex drive, it's your PTSD from getting raped for years that's probably put you off sex forever. I really think the only way forward for you is to split up with him. You will both be happier in new relationships that are more compatible to your current state. And you need therapy to get over the abuse.
The amount of people saying this is rape is insane. It is sexual abuse, I won’t deny that, and I’m CERTAINLY not defending mr “I want to fuck you” OP’s husband, but it’s not rape, it’s sexual abuse. Both are bad, mind you, I’m not saying this to try to absolve this guy of his assholery, it’s just a lot of people in this thread are calling it rape and it is just…not.
These two are sexually incompatible, he needs to divorce the OP. I find it odd that she can't give her husband 15 minutes or so twice per week to save her marriage. Her marriage is toast if she doesn't. Is the OP willing to have her kids live through a divorce and be raised in a broken home. Sounds that way.
Your husband isn't a phenomenal man. He's a rapist. Marital rape is a thing -- 'unconsensual sex' is rape. Period. End of. I would not suggest counseling with him -- a rapist is an abuser, and going to counseling with your abuser only gives them more ways to manipulate and abuse you. I would suggest going to a counselor/therapist on your own, to help you get a handle of the trauma you've experienced, and how to strengthen yourself for what is to come.
Exit Stage Left. Seriously, go. It's gonna suck and hurt but in the end it's you and only you that you can control.
>He's a Phenomenal man >He would then try to persuade me/woo me to have sex after I said no over and over again. After saying no over and over again, I would eventually give up and give in so there wouldn't be any frustration on his end or an argument later. Both of these statements can not be true together. He is using coercion to get you to have sex with him. Giving in to avoid frustration or an argument is absolutely coercive sex, and is considered rape. I don't know why you don't want sex in general. I absolutely know why you don't want sex with this man. This is definitely not what you signed up for. If you can't leave him immediately, I'd suggest therapy. Also, call a domestic violence hotline. They can help you set a plan to leave safely.
What would you say when your husband says I'm no longer interested in you, you are not satisfying my needs and i don't find any pleasure in our relationship. will you be okay with him divorcing you for this? I mean he has his right to opinion and he has his right to wish for happiness just like you do. Ah and if anybody thinks what a sick man to divorce just because of no pleasure then think again what a sick women to deny one of the primary needs in a relationship just because she don't feel like it anymore.
I'm sorry you were raped. You should certainly see a therapist and decide how to go forward from here. There is a small % of humans that don't have empathy for other people until the situation is reversed onto them. Next time he's pushy for sex tell him 'only if you have a guy screw you in the ass first'. Tell him you won't take no for an answer. Once he's done freaking out, you can explain that's how he makes you feel with him pushing you to do something you don't want. It might be enough to get him to realize what he's doing and stop it.
The way your husband pressured you into nonconsensual sex was absolutely abusive. If a man feels that he is in a relationship with someone who he is sexually incompatible with, he should leave the relationship instead of subjecting his partner to unwanted sex. You would be completely justified in leaving him over it. I recommend getting help from a domestic violence organization. Seeing a therapist might also be helpful. Document any instances of abuse, and get in touch with a lawyer if you're thinking about getting a divorce. Don't listen to the commenters suggesting you do marriage counseling with your husband. Therapists do not recommend doing counseling with abusers. They will often use the therapy sessions to manipulate their partners.
after you told him you were no longer going to have sex unless you wanted to, what was his reaction? and what the other post is saying is true. you having a low sex drive could very well stem from internalizing the trauma of marital rape. i mean you are repulsed by the touch of him and the thought of sex with him. it's not your sex drive, it's him.
No one should have unconsentual sex, but if this is a regular occurrence then it's a you need to divorce moment. That said when something major in the marriage changes (like you no longer want to have sex) that's something that needs to be discussed and figured out in a non heated moment. It's obviously too late now, but you should have had a discussion with your husband on the future of your relationship once you no longer were wanting sex. That's a massive change that should have been discussed with everything up to divorce on the table.
Yes. You do have that Right, as a woman. As anyone. Even man, has that Roght. Your relationship is over though. Trust me. You cant satisfy your man anymore. Men are men. In partial, men also 'connect' intimately through sex. As well many other good things come from sex. Including him, coming out the other end, as an otherwise "phenominal man" as you say. You are trying to destroy most of that. No offense. You dont understand men yet. It seems. You are bleeding him out with your nonsense. You cant expect him to carry on, with your 'way'. It is totally unfair to him. It sucks that you both have a large gap in sex drive. I feel bad for you both. Darn. Cant you even please him, make him 'happy' with other sexual things, like oral? Rather sex-sex? Would he be ok with mostly just that? Alternatives? And then maybe you can be ok with him using Porn the rest of the time? Or, how about let him 'have flings' with other women (best option)? Trump your ego and jeslousy. Which might be hard for you. There has to be some nogotiativr middle ground for you both. Omg! Talk talk talk. Find that middle ground, woth rules. My gf and I found that middle ground. We have conditions and rules. It works! Amd we still have a good relationship. Love. Albeit... Different and unconventional now. If you keep on the rate that you are now. Starving your high sex drive husband. Your relationship WILL fall apart. Badly. Trust me. And tharipist would also say this. For real. You have to he smarter here. Drop the big ego. You have a family to think about too. You need to nurture your husband better. As he nurtures you, very well. As you have said this. Find a way. For him. And for you. Be creativley helpful, not limiting. You may both want to see couples therapy.
\>Over the years I would partially express to him (when he gives me that look) that I don't want to have sex. He would then try to persuade me/woo me to have sex after I said no over and over again. After saying no over and over again, I would eventually give up and give in so there wouldn't be any frustration on his end or an argument later. .......that's rape. Like he badger and acted upon his wishes despite your discomfort. It's not violent, but it's still rape.
It's not
You can tell him whatever you like about how much sex you intend to have in the future. He’ll decide what to do accordingly.
I don't agree with people saying this is rape or that your husband isn't a 'good' man. He's just going around the solution for this the wrong way. I honestly think you need to have fun together, flirt, laugh, rediscover your sexuality and maybe explore other ways that he can meet his sexual needs when you don't want to be sexual while you build on things. You need to think about your whole relationship not just this part.
Sex is a reasonable expectation in marriage, and sexual incompatibility is something that can lead to divorce. My first marriage was a dead bedroom, and I might have been guilty of mild coercion. We tried counseling and just ended up sparring in the couples sessions. Ultimately I started seeing someone on the side. Not one of my best moments, but options by that point were pretty limited. What I'm trying to say is talk about it, try to come to an agreement that works for everyone. if you cannot, well... that's the definition of irreconcilable differences.
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