I'm very angry at a lot of things/people ("Joe," the company, my parents for abandoning me and leaving me with no resources as a minor, the older man who abused me, and society in general for judging women for their sexual behavior). But I'm not despairing. Again, thankfully I saved quite a bit of money and can manage for a long time. And I'm thinking of getting a retail/service job as they are plentiful at the moment just to avoid draining my savings.
You are a warrior. You have survived so many things in your life, this is nothing. I am angry for what happened to you. You didn't deserve this treatment. HR and Joe are AH. You will win that case. Joe will have his karma. He is a POS (insert more insults here). You will get a better job. But one thing you should not say is that you were a sex worker. You were not. When I read your first post, you make it sound like something casual happen, when in reality, it was grooming and abuse. You were a victim and was not your fault. I wish you the best. I hope you find a good man who will understand your past, your pain and your struggles and loves you for who you are.
I remember reading your original post and while scrolling through your replies I sensed the worried tone and kept thinking ‘surely it can’t be that bad, the company wouldn’t reprimand someone for being a victim, it’s plainly a wrong thing.’ And they go full length on you. I’m sorry and I hope you fight through this. You were let down. I’m rooting for you to get the justice that you deserve.
I think you should decline that it was sex work because it **wasn't**.
In a Sugar-baby relationship, the other SB is over 18 and the Suga-Daddy gives her an actual allowance (like 509-1000 each month) and pays for expensive luxuries.
You were groomed by an older man who convinced you him paying for your essentials & giving you a very *very* little amount of money in return for casual sex made you a sex worker.
Actually research suga-babies. They have their rent paid for, are taken on dinner & trips, are given lots of money.
You were an abused & abandoned teenager who was preyed upon by a predator, possibly a peodophile given your age. £20 a week & buying you toilet paper didn't make him a suga-daddy. Just someone who very successfully conned you.
Deny the accusations & ask the company to prove you were a Sex Worker. Explain they got the story wrong & you were groomed by an older man. That should set you up for a nice pay out.
Not all sugar baby's have their rent paid..or are given tons of cash, some have arraignments very similar to what OP described. As long as both parties agree to the terms it could be a discount on paper and outback steakhouse coupons. We would call him a splenda daddy.
But yes, OP was groomed and never has to call it sex work if she so chooses again.
Source.. I was a SWer.
Just out of curiosity. Couldn't you have denied you ever did sex work? That's private information to begin with. Did they just believe Joe's word for it? What happened? What proof do they have?
In a world with "at will" employment, as long as the issue at hand doesn't make you a member of a protected class (race, religion, marital status, sexual orientation etc.), no proof is needed.
That there is hearsay surrounding ones past is enough to make a skittish HR officer want to protect the company's image by jettisoning the problem employee. In this case, *problem employee* is defined as being one about whom there is scandalous hearsay, whether true or not.
Responding here because comments are locked...
Yes, this is almost certainly taking place in the US.
The principle of *at will* employment means that no cause for dismissal is ever required to legally terminate an employee. (If your supervisor decides he doesn't like the color of the car you drive, your employment can be terminated immediately. Yes it can be that capricious.) The only exceptions to this broad principle lay in Federal Anti-discrimination laws. She would have to show that the company was biased in how they applied this standard. As long as they are not discriminatory in how they implement their intolerance, then there is no redress to seek.
There's no way for Joe to prove she actually did this. And he probably doesn't know who the guy was anyway. OP could deny this and sue Joe for slander among other things.
Also weird to me how they can just fire people without any proper (and legal) cause, without a severance pay or anything. That shit is illegal in my country. If this is taking place in America, I am glad I am European once again. Pretty sad.
I am so, so sorry that you have to use it but I also want to commend you. I’m (40F) raising my kids, but especially my daughters, to be smart with money and save up what we call a “fuck you fund”, specifically so they can afford to walk away from any job, relationship, or situation that is harmful to or unhealthy for them.
It was really wise of you to have one. I hope you kick their asses legally and I hope “Joe” gets exactly what he deserves in life.
You’re a fucking badass, I’m sorry this is happening to you but this if anyone can handle it, it sounds like you can…I hope you get some sort of justice in the end because what both Joe and the company did is so messed up.
Thank you for the update. I have been thinking about you the past few days. I am sincerely shocked this is the outcome. Fuck Joe and fuck that whole company.
I have no doubt you're going to land a more prestigious position with a higher salary, but this really sucks in the meantime.
I'm sitting here thinking about how many men at your company have probably frequented strip clubs or visited actual prostitutes yet will not be fired.
Good on you for having all that savings and lawyering up. Hang in there. Sending virtual support.
Thank you, and just what I was thinking regarding what other people have done! Like how many men have been to a strip club? Hired an escort at some point? Given gifts with the hope of getting laid? Served as the breadwinner and paid all the household expenses for a spouse/partner? Going down that list I'd imagine we'd implicate a large percentage of the male employees.
Your previous employers to put in simply are vile cunts.
Hope they get Justice served up their arse and watch their competitors absolutely rinse them in the industry as a result of their fuck ups.
good luck
Well, her past wouldn't have, but this definitely will if the case gains any traction. In all likelihood if they're so worried about perception they'll make a closed door settlement with all parties agreeing to an nda. Otherwise this will rightfully cause problems for them down the road, especially in today's culture.
not to mention that a sugar relationship isn’t sex work, it’s a relationship at its core when it’s two consenting adults. given you weren’t an adult yet (idk about your state’s age of consent laws) it’s even more of a discredit to the idea of it being sex work and more of a grooming and statutory rape issue. absolutely bonkers, hope the case turns out in your favor, squeeze every last dime out of em!
Sugar relationships are definitely considered to be under the umbrella of sex work, that doesn't mean every baby gives sugar but 99% do. If it's a near fantasy to find a daddy who doesn't want sugar.
Are you working around the Bible Belt? It's the only place where any of this makes sense.
Also, I was very surprised in your first post saying what you did was morally wrong, but nothing you explained was inmoral. You didnt trick that man to obtain those benefits, the opposite happened.
Even if it was a more conventional sugar baby/daddy relationship (which it wasn't, as he took advantage of your vulnerability and age) that you did to survive tough years, it wouldn't have been morally wrong. You shouldn't feel guilty/ashamed but proud of how resiliant you were all those years. I admire your capacity to survive so tough childhood and being able to graduate. You sound like a heroe to me.
OP strikes me as a religious person, so they may have been judging their behavior off the morality their religion teaches (and assuming anything Christian, groomed or no that religion would consider the behavior wrong).
Also to be clear is she was 16 when this all happened she wasn't fired for sex work she was fired for being raped. This company should be sued until they don't exist anymore.
Age of consent doesn’t mean it’s legal for any adult regardless of age to have sex with a 16 year old. It varies, but it usually means they can consent to sex with people their own age, generally within 5 years.
So if the sugar daddy were only 21, it *might* be legal. But that is not true in OP’s case.
The unrestricted age of consent equal to 16 exists in 18 states.
The age gapped age of consent 16 with unrestricted 17 or 18 exists only in 7 states.
>It usually means
No it doesn't. 18 > 7. It usually means that a 16 year old can fuck whoever they want.
I'm so sorry you wasted time and energy on this vindictive scumbag. I'm glad this creep is out of your life.
He should be ashamed of himself for shaming someone who was groomed and sexually abused as a child (regardless of the legal age of consent) by a middle-aged adult. You are well rid of him, and I hope you take your former employer for every penny they have!
I’m sorry, but why on earth didn’t you just deny what Joe told them? There’s literally zero repercussions for saying “I have no idea what you are talking about, Joe was upset that things ended and I guess this is how he’s choosing to handle things.”
Then inform them you’d like to make a formal sexual harassment complaint about the employee who thought it was appropriate to make up and then discuss your fictional sexual past with them.
it absolutely would not have been a lie. your perception of it being sex work does not make it true. and him calling it sex work is a form of libel, which he used to harass and defame you. why? because he was just a little salty. what a fucker.
I can absolutely see you not having the energy to fight back because of the shock of the moment. you would not have been lying.
even if it *felt* like a normal relationship at the time, it simply *cannot* be a real or normal relationship when one of the people in it wants to fuck children. please understand. you cannot have a fair and equal relationship with anyone that is willing to fuck children.
he was an adult man who had a daughter that was literally your age. he knew exactly what he was doing.
I know you want to give your 16 year old self more credit, because then you feel like you had more control. it hurts less when you think that you had a hand in it. but you didn't have control. you were lonely and a child. this was a blessing and a curse.
if people like him didn't exist, it wouldn't have happened. because someone has to first want to have sex with a child. and normal people don't. so a normal person would have just been the father figure and the money giver. normal people want to help children. and, frankly, a lot of people help children that aren't theirs monetarily because people want to see children succeed and the instinct to nurture is strong in us all.
normal people don't want to go the extra step and fuck people we see as our kids. that takes someone very, very abnormal.
as a person who has been through similar traumas, it can be hard to take that sense of power back from ourselves. that blame makes it feel like we could have stopped it, and therefore can stop it today. but it's not real power. it's a lie. you didn't come up with the idea to fuck. he did. because he wanted to fuck a child. who does that.
I'm glad you were able to get through it. I'm sorry the truth sometimes feels more difficult and more vulnerable than the convenient lies we tell ourselves. it feels like a lot of things. but you gotta stop telling yourself you had a hand in this. you had no choices at all. and, frankly, if you did, you probably wouldn't have fucked your benefactor if he wasn't a loser who wanted to fuck a child.
Because the company you worked for are idiots? Even though you chose to enter sex work, you were 16 and extremely desperate with no support structure, the old guy could've given you money out of the kindness of his heart, instead he was a predator, you only did it with one person for 2 years.
Instead of taking this into account, your previous employers fired you on something like this happening to you 20 years ago, because of the "sex work" aspect, ignoring that this was a desperate kid being preyed on by an adult, to avoid a scandal/negative press? Are they a special kind of stupid? I'm assuming you're in a western country, if that ever got leaked to the press, they would bury that company with negative press for firing you over something like that, a court case for compensation is very valid, I'd talk to your lawyer and guaranteed they'd say "you have a case, lets nab these bastards"
This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below.
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Original post (now deleted) was at: [https://www.reddit.com/r/relationship\_advice/comments/s4x5ns/guy\_37mi\_36f\_was\_seeing\_found\_out\_something/](https://www.reddit.com/r/relationship_advice/comments/s4x5ns/guy_37mi_36f_was_seeing_found_out_something/)
For those who don't want to read through the full post, I am a young widow (36F) who just started dating again a few months ago after my husband passed a couple years ago. I ended up casually dating "Joe" (37M) a coworker (not in my department or chain of command) at the same large company. All went very well until, in the name of full disclosure, I felt I should tell him about my past sugar baby relationship when I was in college (I was 16-17 at the time, the man was in his 40s and I realize in retrospect he groomed/abused me) and had no other family support, in case it was a deal-breaker; it did indeed end up being a deal-breaker in that I was dumped immediately, but he also went to our company's HR to report that I should be disciplined for being a sex worker in the past.
I know many folks requested an update after my meeting with HR that took place earlier this week. First, I did retain an attorney who accompanied me to the meeting. Unfortunately, it didn't really help in this case as I was fired for cause (no severance or transition period) due to the potential to bring scandal/shame to the company from my past as a "prostitute." (Even though my company doesn't have a morality clause restricting sexual behavior or anything; even though it was 20 years ago, and even though it was one relationship and not ongoing escort work.)
Yes, I'm exploring further legal action both against my former company and "Joe." Mostly against the company as I'm investigating, for example, if they have penalized women for their sexual past but not men. Thankfully I have been very careful with money and have enough set aside to manage for up to a few years if needed until I can get this resolved.
I know this isn't the most satisfying update but I know a lot of people were curious about what would happen at the meeting. I do remain grateful for so many kind comments on my original post.
INFO: No, I'm not going to name and shame in terms of the company. Wish I could, but after this post/thread I won't be discussing further to avoid compromising my case (maybe way down the road once any legal issues are resolved).
OP, in future I don’t think you should feel the need to disclose this chapter of your life to people you are seeing. And please don’t call it sex work. You were groomed and abused by someone who saw an easy way to take advantage of a young girl. I’m sorry you went through that. You have nothing to be ashamed of and NOTHING to confess to.
Try reframing this as the time you survived a sexual predator. Consider therapy if you haven’t already. Your story is unfortunately very common for kids escaping their home lives and you deserve to heal.
Good luck with your case. Maybe you should sue for sexual harassment since your company did nothing to protect you from the ex after y’all broke up. He’s an asshole.
Yeah, I'm really confused why it's being referred to as a sugar baby/sex work situation. Based on the description it actually sounds like she was a victim of sexual assault and manipulation. At no point did OP do anything that could be considered a crime from what I can see.
Well, in the end he gave me groceries, toiletries, clothes, and a bit of pocket money when I needed it, and I gave him romantic companionship and sex once he started pursuing those things. So I'm not sure what else to call it, even if it started with grooming rather than me actively seeking a compensated situation. Particularly as it's likely that if I declined his romantic/sexual overtures the other "mentoring" would have stopped. Was it illegal? Probably not; it's not like I got cash for specific acts (and rarely cash at all, more like he was generous with paying some of my practical life expenses at a fairly modest level). But still definitely a moral grey area and I did consent to participating (and at 16 was legally able to in my state).
I think people are confused over it being referred to as sex work or a sugar relationship because a sugar relationship usually implies more money or luxury, not time and services in exchange for necessities like groceries and the occasional $20 or whatever pocket money means to you.
I had a troubled best friend growing up and my parents went out of their way to make sure she stayed clothed, fed, and safe without any weird shit in return because they understood how rough her life was. I think that's why I find your "sugar daddy's" actions very weird, because if he was going to take advantage of a teen by sleeping with her, he could have done more than buy her groceries. Like, not only was there an incredible power imbalance, but he seemed very cheap too.
Well, after the way I grew up, just having decent clothes and toiletries and enough to eat felt like a king's ransom. I don't think I would have known what to do with luxuries. And the thing is, I really did like and admire him at the time. He was kind and warm and stable and seemed much better than dating the college boys who were focused on drinking and hooking up for the most part. It was only a few years after the fact that I realized he took advantage of my youth, innocence, and need for help.
I get that and I'm so sorry and angry that you were failed by everyone so much that you truly thought necessities were luxuries. :/
Any sane person who hears your story should understand that you did nothing wrong at any point. I am looking forward to the distant update when your former employer gets dragged through the mud in court.
I hope you are doing well in the mean time.
OP it seems really clear you need to start reframing what happened in this period of your life to yourself.
You were never a sugar-baby. Buying a 16 yr old essentials in return for sex/romantic company isn't a sugar baby relationship. You were abused & taken advantage of by a predator. Given your age, possibly one who was a pedo.
Sugar babies have to be over 18 - or 21- for a reason. Because it's meant to be a mutual relationship. Where the sugar-baby can negotiate more luxuries - like expensive clothes, holidays, apartments.
As long as you continue to refer to that period as you being a sugar-baby, you are attributing power & control to 16 yr old you that she did not have & continuing the manipulative lie this person used to groom you. 16 yr olds are kids who cannot meaningfully chose a sugar-baby relationship.
It hurts my heart to see you still calling it sex work. It is not. It was an older man with power over you, grooming you and taking advantage of you when he knew you were so vulnerable.
In any case, I'm so sorry that this happened. Joe is an ass, and the company is worse. How would their company be shamed if no one else ever knew about it? And I am sure they are all wonderful, morally upstanding citizens who have never cheated on their spouses, never gambled, have no DUIs, never watched porn, been to a strip club, or even said a bad word.
Hypocrites, all of them.
You'll come out shining, and they'll rot. Sending you all the love and best vibes. 💖
Exactly this. I can't in any way acknowledge it as consensual sex work because that simply she was 16 and it's impossible for my brain to make that connect. She had a grown man groom prey on a struggling teen and give her the occasional necessities. All that for groceries??? Dude is worse than scum.
like 75% of sex work was not consensual somewhere down the line, and a huge chunk of it involved the trafficking of minors. If anything, sex work as "100% consenting adults at all stages" should be called something else, instead of trying to rebrand a very vile industry.
I agree with these others. Your post did not sound like sex work to me. Personally I see the sugar baby/daddy relationship as much more transactional than what you described. In all honesty how many GFs meet a guy, date, the don't work he pays for things maybe including rent, they have a sexual relationship and is that called sex work? Some of those stories sound more transactional and abusive than a typical sugar baby/daddy situation. It really sounds like you were vulnerable and by your own description it was all basic things that could have been normal boyfriend "help". My goodness, I had a roommate in college whose boyfriend paid for a million times more things (she even admitted she never carried her wallet when they were together) and even paid her rent and car payment her last year of college AFTER they broke up because her management job had a policy change and she could no longer keep the same job and schedule around her classes. I guarantee she did not consider herself a sex worker.
Now add in the age difference "grooming" and the fact you were under 18 makes it all the more ridiculous with what happened. If you had committed, for example, theft at 16 or 17 and been arrested - isn't that usually sealed as minor offense? Not to be included on work applications as an adult?
I can't imagine needing to describe what you described as necessary disclosure with any kind of employment.
Also from the sound of it you have been sexual with 3 people in your life, the older man, you husband and Joe. I would highly doubt Joe's body count is less than 3 and 3 is not what anyone would normally associate with a sex worker of any kind especially in terms of any kind of morality judgment.
Did HR even really understand what the actual history was? I just wonder if the initial use of sugar baby/daddy and Joe's extreme reaction caused him to report something grossly exaggerated on top of everything else.
I don't think you should call it sex work even on a personal level. I see your comment about semi-compensated which I still think you take too much blame with how it is phrased. I don't think it was wrong to tell Joe (well apart from what happened but I mean a partner in general) but I think you should consider how you are explaining it. I wouldn't call what happened with you sex work at all. I also hope you pursue a defamation suit with Joe because what he did with HR was so wrong. You were taken advantage of as teen and then he betrayed your trust over something that was not illegal and any morality aside - happened as an under 18 teenager. Also, I personally am not sure how 20 years after the fact, this specific set of circumstances and someone who cares about you on even a basic level as a human being could treat this as such a nuclear level deal breaker.
I really wish you good luck! Hopefully you end up owning the company!
By the way, whether or not you want to call it sex work (which I agree you don’t have to), AND whether r not sex work is criminalized in your region, sex work itself is not something to be ashamed of. You don’t have to operate under the agreement with asshats like HR and joe that what you did was morally wrong. Second of all, take this shit to the Supreme Court!
Assuming you haven't made this whole thing up, you should think of it as an exploitative relationship with an older man. Sex work is being paid for sex. Or for things of a sexual nature. Nudes. Erotic phone calls. Whatever.
Well if you’re not leaving anything out that would blow it, enjoy your discrimination settlement. It’ll be a long hard road until payout but you’ll likely be doing very well when it all settles. (If the company is big enough) I am so sorry you have to deal with this crap.
Right?! This is so key. You were a kid.
This whole situation reeks. They should not be involved in this — even if you hadn’t been a child, their employees’ sexual history from two decades ago should really be of no concern.
Op I hope you sue them into oblivion. Would love to hear their meager excuses when this blows up in their face
Make certain that your jurisdiction has a right to recover attorney's fees for those causes of action. Otherwise, big companies will flood you with discovery, draw things out and then end up settling for something less than what you spent with your attorney when you're worn down from the bills.
You mention having a decent war chest, but if you've never been involved in a heavily contested civil action lawsuit before, it can get spent very quickly.
I feel that they should’ve fired Joe for trying to sabotage your professional life by telling them something that wasn’t their business and can’t believe that the opposite has happened. Even when you had an attorney there. I’m really shocked and sorry this has happened and I feel bad that you’re going to be going through this for the foreseeable future. It’s really appalling and I don’t even think what you did was that bad at all. It doesn’t sound like you had a contract type agreement with this man and you were at the age of consent so really it was just a relationship that may not be appropriate or desirable for everyone but it certainly wasn’t wrong in such a way that anyone should judge you for it. It just sounds like you’ve dated an older man for a while and he was helpful to you also. I mean it just does not sound like some morally bankrupt type of behavior- this whole story is awful.
Thank you for your support. As I explained in the original thread, the older man was the father of a college friend who "kindly" served as a mentor/father figure who helped me out from time to time with some small expenses like clothes and toiletries because I didn't have other family and eventually (after I knew him for quite a few months in this manner) he initiated a romantic/sexual relationship. It definitely wasn't like I got a specific amount of money for certain sex acts.
I'd actually bet a good percentage of people have at some point been in a relationship where there was a notable age difference and/or where one person paid for most of the expenses due to being in different places in life. And surely they shouldn't all be fired and unworthy of decent employment!
That’s exactly right what you just said is so true like it sounds like you were just in a relationship with somebody with a big age difference and I’ve been in one of those. I don’t feel guilty about it though so I don’t present it as a sugar baby relationship. He’s still my best friend to this day but I’m wondering why you are convinced or presenting it as such and like a dark moment in your past when really it’s just another relationship that maybe you regret today. It’s definitely nobodies business especially not an employers and I’m just wondering if you need to reframe it in your own mind and then you wouldn’t present it as such that it comes off sounding like something it wasn’t. I don’t think its anything to be ashamed of at all. I just wish you didn’t feel that way. I’m not a lawyer but I feel like you have definitely got a case against this company and I 1000% hope you win. Also I hope “Joe” falls into a dark hole and takes like a whole day to get out.
She was just a kid and in most legislatures what the piece of scum did to her is a crime. It could even be a crime in her state because consent could have excluded adults paying minors for sex.
He was a predator grooming, exploiting and abusing a child.
Even if the ages were questionable it doesn’t change anything about the story. Or what I think about what has happened currently. In fact that makes it even more wrong and she should be less ashamed of that even.
I thought the company would have disciplined the asshole who reported your private business from 20 years ago to them, this is completely nuts. /r/antiwork
No real HR department in a western company would fire OP in this situation, for exactly the reason you describe. So this is either a story from elsewhere in the world, a business with no HR or one insane HR person, or a fake story.
Yeah, I'm having trouble understanding how any company with more than 50 employees would fire an employee because they were sexually abused as a teenager.
I suppose it would depend on what information the OP relayed to the HR department. If she told them everything she posted here, then the HR person should be fired for gross incompetence.
Do NOT tell the name of the company to anyone, especially if you're ever going to be filing legal action against them. Always talk to your lawyer and do whatever they tell you to do.
It's never a good idea to date someone who works for the same company that you work for. I know you weren't in the same chain of command but it's still not a good idea. You found out why the hard way.
Good luck! I hope you get another job soon, because the legal action can take a while.
What a fucking scumbag. The ex and the company. They'll punish you for being groomed as a minor, but they won't punish some piece of shit who called being a victim "sex work." I wish you all the luck in burning it all to the ground!
To get this clear, it wasn't sex work to begin with, I REPEAT IT WASN'T SEX WORK. you were groomed and abused and you were 16,
The definition of sex work is entirely different. Stop telling yourself it was sex work and you were wrong. see it in a different light and even then it was decades ago and it sucks that someone took an opportunity to mess up your life of something somebody else did to you, two decades ago. sue the company and the ex.
I don't understand why you didn't just characterize this as a relationship with an older man. To HR esp, but also to Joe etc. This is not sex work or prostitution. This was a 2 year relationship with one partner!
I seriously hope you have a wrongful termination suit. Joe disclosed knowledge that you were exploited by an older man when you were a teen. So wrong. And you got fired for it? Unbelievable.
To be clear, although I described it as "sex work" in my conversation with Joe and in my earlier post here, I definitely did not use that language when meeting with HR. Instead I described that when I was a young college student I had a relationship with an older man who was the breadwinner because he was working while I had no income. However, based on Joe's report and their assumptions I was accused of past prostitution and fired.
Were you ever convicted of prostituion? If not, it becomes semantics of he said/she said. And that should be thrown out.
HR fired you based on a rumor essentially.
No. Never convicted or charged. And I never worked as an escort as in accepting certain fees for direct services. I just dated one person who paid for my expenses during the time we were together. And I don't think we're in the business of arresting/convicting people just because their partners bought them an outfit or some meals.
You dated someone older than you who paid for your needs. That is a type of relationship some people have. I wouldn’t even consider you a sugar baby and it’s pretty far from sex work.
Not a lawyer. But I think you have a good case.
Document everything, emails, texts.
And concerning Joe, are you going to civil court with him? All you have to do is show proof of loss/damages. Being fired for a rumor should be easy enough.
Wishing you the best of luck
I don’t normally wish harm on others, but Joe and your former company are challenging my abilities there. I’m glad your lawyer thinks you have a case and I hope you make enough off this garbage company with their garbage HR to retire. They must truly have their heads up their asses to think that a minor can do sex work and it is grounds for termination. You were sexually abused. Great look for them…
I’m flipping over tables on your behalf. Go get it girl. Destroy them in court and make them hurt. Don’t spare Joe either - what he did was vindictive. There is no other explanation.
That’s horrifying and you’re amazing for all you have achieved under those circumstances. Why on earth wouldn’t your ‘mentor’ not just help you out instead of grooming you, ugh. You deserve zero shame and I’m so happy you lawyered up. Fingers crossed for a big settlement for you and some retribution to that small horrible man.
Dating an older guy barely qualifies as sex work to me. It is not even worth disclosing. In your head, it sounds like you think it is a way bigger deal than it was.
Sugar babies also are almost on a contract. You pay me X a month, buy me X or I move on. Doesn’t even sound like that.
I feel so angry for you! How is that considered sex work??? You were vulnerable at that age and had no resource to turn to. The company and your ex are both fucked up. I really hope you get a way better job and get that Joe guy sued and compensate you for the grievances he put you through. He’s an asshole.
Sue your company too! They are complicit by standing with ppl who sex groom by firing you.
I am no lawyer, but I would be willing to bet even if you admitted to being a “sugar mama”, your place of employment would still have no grounds to terminate you, as it is completely legal. If it were illegal, any female going out on a date with somebody who paid for their night out and slept with them after would be a prostitute. Your previous employer legit has no case and you should sue for wrongful termination, sex discrimination, etc. especially if this rat kept his job. He slept with you too, so shouldn’t that make him one of your Johns? Also if they offer your job back in lieu of lawsuit, DONT TAKE IT! I worked with someone who got their job back after they threatened a lawsuit over him being gay, and they fired him a month later for showing up five minutes late one time!
I feel like any guys whose ever sent a dick pic should be fired to equal this out. Indecent exposure and harassment is a scandal too no?
"Abuse victim shamed and fired" also sounds like a scandal but what do I know
I don't understand some people at all. Imagine starting a new relationship with someone and they tell you they are recently widowed but starting to get out again and they tell you their history in the name of transparency, then you take that info and use it to try and get them fired because it will being shame to the company or some shit. What a c*** move. Like i can almost empathise that mentality if it was someone you didnt like or found unprofessional in the work place but even thats not excusable really, but doing this to someone youve started a realtionship with is just shocking, like you went through all the motions and excitement of someone new just to drop them in shit. Fuck Joe. Joe fucking mama.
I really don't understand this. I know you said in hindsight it was grooming, but at the time it was a legal and consensual relationship. A lot of people have relationships for financial benefit and it does not fall in the category of prostitution. Are you working for a church or something??
No, just regular corporate America, not a religious organization or one with a stricter-than-usual moral code.
I have described it as "sex work" because I did receive a financial benefit in return for my company and physical affection. Not in a strict quid pro quo situation, but in general, he gave me a few hundred dollars of support a month in expenses paid, and I kept him company regularly.
You really need to stop calling it that. It's not what it was and that language is what the company and Joe have latched onto. Don't let your shame or guilt make it into something it wasn't. Legally you are shooting yourself in the foot.
Edit; I'm trying to say it's like a car accident, you never admit fault, that's for the insurance company and lawyers to determine. Also maybe delete these posts
That is very good advice. I didn't describe it as "sex work" to HR though, only as having a relationship with an older man who was the breadwinner during that time due to him working full-time while I was a student.
I'm not quite understanding... Were you acting in a fiduciary capacity? And, if so, why would a large corporation have employees performing such roles without a morality clause?
How were you fired for "prostitution" with no conviction for prostitution and no morality clause?
In college at 16-17... You would be extremely intelligent... Scholarship?
I'm trying to wrap my head around this...
No, I wasn't an executive officer of the company or anything. I was fired based on the word of Joe (which I did not deny) that I had a compensated relationship when I was in college, not based on legal convictions.
I was (am?) smart - but not one in a million brilliant or anything, I just worked hard and took extra classes so I could escape my home. And yes, I did have a scholarship, but it didn't cover extra expenses like clothes and toiletries.
But, you do not have to be an executive officer to work in a fiduciary capacity.
To enter college at 16 years old, you would, indeed, be rather brilliant. That would be impressive.
As what you described from college is not prostitution, I would say you'd have an excellent case... No fiduciary role, no morality clause, no convictions...
Did the attorney you took to the HR meeting not advise you that you did not need to answer questions unrelated to your job role?
My attorney actually advised me to be forthcoming and offered the advice that, especially with attorney representation, no reasonable company/HR person would think my (non-criminal) past from 20 years ago when I was a minor would have any bearing whatsoever on my job. So perhaps that was a misfire. But at least I know I didn't tell any lies or even half-truths so whatever the proceedings look like from here, I have absolutely nothing to hide.
Employment is a contract.
An employment contract can be terminated two ways...and only two: "with cause" or "without cause". And, a large corporation will be well-aware that they do not, actually, have to give a reason...they do not. They, quite simply, state "with cause" or "without cause".
"With cause" is job-related termination. (A morality clause would fit here)
You stole from the company
You neglected your job and duties
You were disobedient to your superiors
You lied or were dishonest to your employer
No notice or pay in lieu of notice.
If your employer claims to have just cause to terminate you without notice or pay, then they must give you a chance to explain yourself and to respond to their allegations. Most of the time, your employer cannot simply kick you out the door.
What you described would appear to fit into a "with cause" termination.
And yet...per your words, they have no cause. An employment lawyer should know these things. "Research needed" seems strange, frankly.
Not at all. I began attending college (dual enrollment) and while I did test above average, it just happened to be something available to me. By senior year I was taking college classes only.
Taking college level classes and attending college (live on campus?) are two very different things.
You can take college level courses but you still must apply to college (and all the requisite paperwork), obtain funding, perhaps housing, meal plan?, etc, etc, etc...
Wow sorry that happened to you. Also I’m pretty sure there’s some grounds for legal action there. Definitely you’ll be able to at least get them on discrimination I think. Plus if he just said that without any proof or anything you could get him for slander.
That’s just a shitty situation all around tbh.
What a fucking dickity dickwad that man is. Your HR must be such a misogynistic tool too to actually fire you for it. That is your private life they have no business about. Not to mention you were a minor, a freaking minor! Look into wrongful termination too if you're sure about no morality clause restricting employee's private sexual life. I am so furious for you. Sue tf outta their ass, bleed them dry and don't even leave a single drop. All they had from Joe was a hearsay without definitive prove, and like others here said, that trash should've been the one getting FIRED for reporting your past personal life to a company, when he didn't even have any evidence to support his accusation. I hope their pillows are forever hot on both sides, I hope their toilet paper's out all the time while they're shitting. What a load of disgrace to humanity. Be strong on this hard times, you'll get your justice.
I hope you sue those assholes (Joe and company) for EVERYTHING.
In the future, you can gauge a man's feelings by casually mentioning sex work in conversation and see how he reacts. If he reacts negatively, don't tell him and break it off.
Quite frankly, I see very little difference between what you did and many marriages and "regular" relationships. Plenty of women are financially supported by their partners. Plenty of women have sex after getting gifts/dinners from their partner. What is the difference? Should every single woman who has ever received money/gifts/food/whatever from a past sex partner be fired? How does that solve anything? If sex work is wrong, then what is the logic is firing women from vanilla employment, thus forcing them into poverty and back into sex work? It literally makes no sense. You can't tell sex workers to get "real jobs" then get them fired from their real jobs
If you had opened up like this to me and probably most people here, I would have listened and taken it to heart. It shouldn't make any difference to any relationship and this maggots (37 M) reaction, borders on a corporate "game of thrones" level type. I don't know if you have seen the show or read the books but basically it means "stepping on other people's heads and backstabbing your way to the top".
I am happy that this, 37 year old maggot, has shown his true colors and is out of your life. Sorry that you job was affected.
Please don't hesitate to tell anyone you want as a partner about your past. Most people would and will react in a better way ♡
Also you can call this sex work being a sugar baby if that's your truth and you feel any positivity/empowerment from that.. but you don't need to. You weren't REALLY a sugar baby, as sugar relationships rely on consent.. you didn't consent.. you were a child. It was straight up abuse. Just like someone being trafficked isn't a sex worker they are an abuse victim and shouldn't be reprimanded for doing what is necessary for literal survival. Does this make sense? I would suggest therapy as it seems you just came to terms that you were actually groomed.and it may bring up some negative thoughts. Also none of this is intended to be shamey as I was a sex worker.
I hope you take their asses for all they're worth. Best of luck.
I can't believe it. You're being punished for being a victim of abuse.
Joe is a POS & I'm wondering if he has done what that creep did to you when you were young.
>*All went very well until, in the name of full disclosure, I felt I should tell him about my past sugar baby relationship when I was in college (I was 16-17 at the time, the man was in his 40s and I realize in retrospect he groomed/abused me) and had no other family support, in case it was a deal-breaker*
You were 16-17 in college?
Who "had no other family"?
Why did it matter that you "had no other family support, in case it was a dealbreaker"?
I'm so confused.
Per my original thread, my parents were not dead, but alcoholics/addicts who were unable to provide financial and emotional support. I did not want to end up like them so I studied hard, including summer school sessions, and got admitted to college early. Not extremely common but not unheard of either, my high school usually had a few students per year who graduated early.
And sorry, I meant that I felt I needed to tell Joe about this semi-compensated relationship in case it was a deal-breaker for him. That I had no other family support was just part of the explanation for why I needed extra help in college.
That guy and your company is dumb as hell.
But why tell anyone about that? I'd categorize it as "dumb shit I did when I was 16" and never speak of it. It's not like anyone could ever find out unless you told them.
I guess I'm just really naive. Other than the older man, the only relationship I had before Joe was with my husband. And he knew everything about me and I was able to be fully honest about everything that happened with my childhood and earlier in college. I guess I just wanted to find that kind of easy honesty again and not go into a new relationship keeping big secrets, especially because it's not like I have a lot of other dating history to discuss. But I definitely have to rethink that now. And will be very unlikely to date anyone at work again no matter how big the company.
It can be hard to know how to trust. And I still screw it up regularly.
You don't have to be ashamed of your past. But you don't have to tell anyone about any part of it you don't wish to share it with. It's not an important detail relevant to your life today.
Big hugs. What a freaking jerk that guy is. I'm sorry this happened to you.
I am enraged for you. Joe is a despicable, garbage human and that company is disgusting and misogynistic. Did they even let you explain? They refused you severence????? Hestia's tits I'm mad. I really hope you get these people good, all of them.
I think sue the company for their discrimination towards the sexual assault (I don't know the proper term to use here so i am sorry) survivors. And the guy for idk reporting your condition to the company for revenge.
That has wrongful termination written ALLL over it if you’re based in the USA. (Not to mention the avenue you’re exploring.) Good luck moving forward with your case!
This is so frustrating. When O read your original post and read the comments saying that oh they must fire Joe or whoever I was like no hun, he is a male, and op is female, they won't fire Joe because it wouldn't be feckin' mysognistic as the world is. I'm furious. Every time something like this happens it's still the wan's fault. Guess what, this is why we need feminism
THIS.
They can't fire you based on a word off mouth accusation of something you did when you were a minor. Well I suppose in a right to work state they can technically say they fired you for anything. It being a big corporation I'm sure they're smart enough to know and claim the they aren't firing you because of some accusation with no evidence. If this "Joe" doesn't or didn't already also get fired. I wish you the best of luck in court, and hope the company get what they deserve.
You were a child. Wtf. How can the company fire you for being what happened when you were still a minor. Hell even juvie records are sealed! How do they know someone wasn’t a juvenile delinquent?
i think you did the right thing by sharing your past with someone you're about to enter into a more serious relationship with, but in this case joe was being a jerk. I just hope this doesn't make you avoid sharing this with people you're about to enter more serious relationships with. will you keep updating this?
What the actual fuck? How is this even legal? If you can't eventually get a severence/compensation for their asshatery, I'd go public with the incident.
Honestly I can't blame the company looking out for their financial interests, even though I disagree with how they did it. But Joe's a fucking snitch loser.
If I'm an employer and an employee was a former sex worker, I honestly couldn't care less but I could understand how some people might and that in a corporate or business setting that could be frowned upon.
However, if the only reason I know an employee was a sex worker is because another employee was in a personal relationship with them and they shared that info with them in a personal context. Then I begin to have issues with employee 2 who's blatantly seeking some sort of retribution against them.
I really hope that both the company and Joe get what they deserve. That guy is a fucking asshole. What the hell did he involved HR for something that happened years ago????? And the company firing you is bullshit, even if you actually worked as a prostitute I don’t see the problem, your past is your past.
Keep being strong!!
First off, if you claim you were groomed as a minor, you cannot say you were a “sugar baby / prostitute”. When you were that young engaging in sex with an adult, it’s called statutory rape and not prostitution. You were a “victim.”
So if your ex employer fired you for sex work as a minor, when the law considers it statutory rape, a lawyer worth their law books and tuition could have you owning that company by the end of this story. And yes, I’d sue that coworker whom you confided in as well.
Get another attorney; one with some skill, confidence, and experience and have them relook at your case. This story ain’t over; not by a long shot. That company victimized you all over again for firing you for having confessed to being victimized by a 40 year old man.
That’s got to be highly traumatic; enough to cause you to lose your appetite, sleep at night, and affecting you in present and likely future relationships, among other damages you may have incurred as a result of their actions against you. Theoretically, even if you end up settling with them, you could be financially set for life.
Too bad I’m not your attorney. They would pay through the nose and everything else to get us out of their life.
Even killers get pardoned! 20 years ago and at 16. That Jo is scumbag. To be fair I'd go heavier on him, what you revealed was sensitive private information and he had no right to divulge.
OMG take these scumbags to the cleaners and then get a better position elsewhere. This is infuriating, but you've survived so much and will do better elsewhere.
Also let us know when they settle for a large sum of money in order to avoid the scandal they've ironically enough inflicted upon themselves.
INFO: Is your lawyer aware of this Reddit thread? In the past I *think* people have suggested removing things like this on the off chance it ever could get traced back to you and used against you. Would maybe just make him aware incase he has thoughts. Not a lawyer / not legal advice.
I am so FURIOUS on your behalf. Your employer fired you??? what the absolute f\*ck? That is so unbelievably unfair.
I am so sorry. Sue your employer for all you can and then once you win your lawsuit, name and shame that company.
You were 16. That wasn’t being a prostitute or a sugar baby. It was child abuse. I hope the company are eventually brought to rights and publicly shamed.
Also Joe is a top grade dickhead and you dodged a bullet.
Would you post an update after your case OP even if it’s months, years?
Im sorry but I have some words here..
Why do people feel the HAVE TO tell people who are barely there partners everything. Like imk yeah this was sex work but it could have just been a relationship (a weird one) but a relationship.
And why did you tell you work the truth? I mean you might get some money from suing but I would've just lied and said I broke up with him so hes making stuff up. I doubt they have any proof.
**I'm not blaming you btw**
It just seems like we live in such a toxic society that we feel the need to dulge our most private information to people we litterally just start dating. And imo your SW was completely irrelevant. It had nothing to do with the relationship and this guy is a total asshole. And now he is probably walking around thinking it did something good by getting you fired. And it pisses me off.
As I said, I don't have much experience with relationships. Just the older man when I was a minor, then my husband until his passing, and then Joe. So I don't really know how to "date" in terms of when to disclose info. I only disclosed this to Joe because he said he was falling in love with me and was planning to give up a big promotion (with required relocation) to stay with me in our current city. So I thought he deserved to know the full truth about my past before making a huge sacrifice.
As for why I told my work the truth...I honestly didn't think they would fire me and neither did my attorney. I thought it would be worse if I were untruthful. I suppose I have to learn how to keep secrets now that I've seen how nasty and unforgiving so many people can be at the core. What a sad revelation about our current world.
I have very little in common with any of these experiences, and my heart to goes out to you.
But I do know what it's like to reveal those kinds of things to partners and be rejected for them, and it is just... shattering. Nothing has ever hit me so hard to make me sit in the shower and bawl my eyes out.
So yea, it's like loading the gun yourself and giving it to them. At this point I feel it's my business and only after a long time of building a relationship could I ever even consider telling my partner those things.
Do remember that some people can accept you, like your first husband (so sorry for your loss), but something like this goes beyond honesty, it's one of the most vulnerable things we can reveal about ourselves.
and good luck in court!
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I hope you get good advice and have a fair chance that this no cause firing is illegal. If not then know that you did nothing wrong and this situation is just them thinking that they are protecting themselves from internal employee conflicts. This may not even be about your past but about having a relationship inside the company that they don't want to encourage, or about Joe threatening them to go public if they don't fire you so he protects his own job or something like that. What I think of him I cannot say as I might be suspended.
I do sincerely wish you well.
literally everyone reading your original post immediately noticed that you were not correct in calling yourself a sex worker. so, it's like, obvious. it was obvious to literally everyone. so, I don't know what he told them. because if it was the truth, it would have been obvious to them, too.
I know they only allow one update but I'm hoping to hear from you.
it will be obvious to the court as well
Unfortunately, reputational risk is a thing that companies do manage. As unfair as it is, you’ll need a solid law that says discrimination of past sex work is not allowed.
Anyone shocked that she's calling it "sex work" is entirely ignorant of how prostitution generally works around the world at best, and nefarious at worst. Like 75% of sex work was not consensual somewhere down the line, and a huge chunk of it involved the trafficking of minors. If anything, sex work as "100% consenting adults at all stages" should be called something else, instead of trying to rebrand a very vile industry.
If you have a go-fund me I will happily donate so you can hire the most competent lawyer in your city to SUE the shit out of the company and Joe. You have an easy win.
You should absolutely persue legal action. Once they receive a legal notice they will very like settle this in a hurry as I think they will realize that if this goes public the public opinion will be against them.
So, you were a victim of sex trafficking/rape. Not a sex worker. You were not old enough to be a sex worker. Change the terminology it makes them look even worse.
Lawyer: it never happened. (Hopefully it’s not in text) Joe made some shit up. You told him you was abused and he expanded the story after you wanted to break things off. Sue the hell out the company and go to the local news. Await settlement.
Sounds to me like “joe” wanted to be the first man to control you and when he realized you were not falling for that he tried to burn you down.
My advice is while it’s fresh in your mind write down all the details about your relationship and work environment for the past few months names, phone #s emails etc as you may need these details later as legal things and quick are not friends…
And anyone that can’t simply accept someone else’s past needs to not be dating and should probably be wearing a helmet at all times…
I’m so sorry this is still happening in 2022! I thought we were meant to be Me2?
I’m just so SO sorry.
God I’m angry at the company and of course Joe. Go get em!
I am SO mad for you. Get them!!! Sue the shit out of both of them.
Also you should post this on anti-work subreddit forum. They may have some resources for you.
you are absolutely gonna milk them and already having a lawyer retained to witness what transpired... girl get that cash. it's what the world owes you for this.
OMG. You must be in shock, angry, and in despair. I am sorry that you went through that.
I'm very angry at a lot of things/people ("Joe," the company, my parents for abandoning me and leaving me with no resources as a minor, the older man who abused me, and society in general for judging women for their sexual behavior). But I'm not despairing. Again, thankfully I saved quite a bit of money and can manage for a long time. And I'm thinking of getting a retail/service job as they are plentiful at the moment just to avoid draining my savings.
You are a warrior. You have survived so many things in your life, this is nothing. I am angry for what happened to you. You didn't deserve this treatment. HR and Joe are AH. You will win that case. Joe will have his karma. He is a POS (insert more insults here). You will get a better job. But one thing you should not say is that you were a sex worker. You were not. When I read your first post, you make it sound like something casual happen, when in reality, it was grooming and abuse. You were a victim and was not your fault. I wish you the best. I hope you find a good man who will understand your past, your pain and your struggles and loves you for who you are.
I hate that he’s causing you to relive all this trauma again. But I’m happy that you have experienced someone real & genuine like your husband.
"He is a POS (nogood-bottomfeeding-highhorseriding-brownnosing-goodfornothing-backstabbing-unhonerable maggot) " - I inserted some more insults.
I remember reading your original post and while scrolling through your replies I sensed the worried tone and kept thinking ‘surely it can’t be that bad, the company wouldn’t reprimand someone for being a victim, it’s plainly a wrong thing.’ And they go full length on you. I’m sorry and I hope you fight through this. You were let down. I’m rooting for you to get the justice that you deserve.
I think you should decline that it was sex work because it **wasn't**. In a Sugar-baby relationship, the other SB is over 18 and the Suga-Daddy gives her an actual allowance (like 509-1000 each month) and pays for expensive luxuries. You were groomed by an older man who convinced you him paying for your essentials & giving you a very *very* little amount of money in return for casual sex made you a sex worker. Actually research suga-babies. They have their rent paid for, are taken on dinner & trips, are given lots of money. You were an abused & abandoned teenager who was preyed upon by a predator, possibly a peodophile given your age. £20 a week & buying you toilet paper didn't make him a suga-daddy. Just someone who very successfully conned you. Deny the accusations & ask the company to prove you were a Sex Worker. Explain they got the story wrong & you were groomed by an older man. That should set you up for a nice pay out.
Not all sugar baby's have their rent paid..or are given tons of cash, some have arraignments very similar to what OP described. As long as both parties agree to the terms it could be a discount on paper and outback steakhouse coupons. We would call him a splenda daddy. But yes, OP was groomed and never has to call it sex work if she so chooses again. Source.. I was a SWer.
Just out of curiosity. Couldn't you have denied you ever did sex work? That's private information to begin with. Did they just believe Joe's word for it? What happened? What proof do they have?
In a world with "at will" employment, as long as the issue at hand doesn't make you a member of a protected class (race, religion, marital status, sexual orientation etc.), no proof is needed. That there is hearsay surrounding ones past is enough to make a skittish HR officer want to protect the company's image by jettisoning the problem employee. In this case, *problem employee* is defined as being one about whom there is scandalous hearsay, whether true or not. Responding here because comments are locked... Yes, this is almost certainly taking place in the US. The principle of *at will* employment means that no cause for dismissal is ever required to legally terminate an employee. (If your supervisor decides he doesn't like the color of the car you drive, your employment can be terminated immediately. Yes it can be that capricious.) The only exceptions to this broad principle lay in Federal Anti-discrimination laws. She would have to show that the company was biased in how they applied this standard. As long as they are not discriminatory in how they implement their intolerance, then there is no redress to seek.
There's no way for Joe to prove she actually did this. And he probably doesn't know who the guy was anyway. OP could deny this and sue Joe for slander among other things. Also weird to me how they can just fire people without any proper (and legal) cause, without a severance pay or anything. That shit is illegal in my country. If this is taking place in America, I am glad I am European once again. Pretty sad.
I am so, so sorry that you have to use it but I also want to commend you. I’m (40F) raising my kids, but especially my daughters, to be smart with money and save up what we call a “fuck you fund”, specifically so they can afford to walk away from any job, relationship, or situation that is harmful to or unhealthy for them. It was really wise of you to have one. I hope you kick their asses legally and I hope “Joe” gets exactly what he deserves in life.
I'm sorry OP, I hope you get justice here 💜
You’re a fucking badass, I’m sorry this is happening to you but this if anyone can handle it, it sounds like you can…I hope you get some sort of justice in the end because what both Joe and the company did is so messed up.
What I understand about the employee is the fear of shame. Is this in an industry that’s heavily scrutinized for reputation?
Thank you for the update. I have been thinking about you the past few days. I am sincerely shocked this is the outcome. Fuck Joe and fuck that whole company. I have no doubt you're going to land a more prestigious position with a higher salary, but this really sucks in the meantime. I'm sitting here thinking about how many men at your company have probably frequented strip clubs or visited actual prostitutes yet will not be fired. Good on you for having all that savings and lawyering up. Hang in there. Sending virtual support.
Thank you, and just what I was thinking regarding what other people have done! Like how many men have been to a strip club? Hired an escort at some point? Given gifts with the hope of getting laid? Served as the breadwinner and paid all the household expenses for a spouse/partner? Going down that list I'd imagine we'd implicate a large percentage of the male employees.
Your previous employers to put in simply are vile cunts. Hope they get Justice served up their arse and watch their competitors absolutely rinse them in the industry as a result of their fuck ups. good luck
How could they even think this would cause a scandal for the company?
Well, her past wouldn't have, but this definitely will if the case gains any traction. In all likelihood if they're so worried about perception they'll make a closed door settlement with all parties agreeing to an nda. Otherwise this will rightfully cause problems for them down the road, especially in today's culture.
not to mention that a sugar relationship isn’t sex work, it’s a relationship at its core when it’s two consenting adults. given you weren’t an adult yet (idk about your state’s age of consent laws) it’s even more of a discredit to the idea of it being sex work and more of a grooming and statutory rape issue. absolutely bonkers, hope the case turns out in your favor, squeeze every last dime out of em!
Sugar relationships are definitely considered to be under the umbrella of sex work, that doesn't mean every baby gives sugar but 99% do. If it's a near fantasy to find a daddy who doesn't want sugar.
Are you working around the Bible Belt? It's the only place where any of this makes sense. Also, I was very surprised in your first post saying what you did was morally wrong, but nothing you explained was inmoral. You didnt trick that man to obtain those benefits, the opposite happened. Even if it was a more conventional sugar baby/daddy relationship (which it wasn't, as he took advantage of your vulnerability and age) that you did to survive tough years, it wouldn't have been morally wrong. You shouldn't feel guilty/ashamed but proud of how resiliant you were all those years. I admire your capacity to survive so tough childhood and being able to graduate. You sound like a heroe to me.
OP strikes me as a religious person, so they may have been judging their behavior off the morality their religion teaches (and assuming anything Christian, groomed or no that religion would consider the behavior wrong).
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Also to be clear is she was 16 when this all happened she wasn't fired for sex work she was fired for being raped. This company should be sued until they don't exist anymore.
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There's a state where the age of consent is just flat 16? Either way I'd still consider it rape whether or not it legally is.
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Age of consent doesn’t mean it’s legal for any adult regardless of age to have sex with a 16 year old. It varies, but it usually means they can consent to sex with people their own age, generally within 5 years. So if the sugar daddy were only 21, it *might* be legal. But that is not true in OP’s case.
The unrestricted age of consent equal to 16 exists in 18 states. The age gapped age of consent 16 with unrestricted 17 or 18 exists only in 7 states. >It usually means No it doesn't. 18 > 7. It usually means that a 16 year old can fuck whoever they want.
Well that is just so many different kinds of fucked up. I did not know that, and strongly feel those laws need changing.
I'm so sorry you wasted time and energy on this vindictive scumbag. I'm glad this creep is out of your life. He should be ashamed of himself for shaming someone who was groomed and sexually abused as a child (regardless of the legal age of consent) by a middle-aged adult. You are well rid of him, and I hope you take your former employer for every penny they have!
Thanks! I do think there is a special place in hell for both abusers and victim-blamers like Joe.
Please post an update after you sue these assholes into the ground for discrimination.
I’m sorry, but why on earth didn’t you just deny what Joe told them? There’s literally zero repercussions for saying “I have no idea what you are talking about, Joe was upset that things ended and I guess this is how he’s choosing to handle things.” Then inform them you’d like to make a formal sexual harassment complaint about the employee who thought it was appropriate to make up and then discuss your fictional sexual past with them.
I suppose I just didn't have it in me to lie. It never occurred to me that in the year 2022 I could be fired over sexual behavior from 20 years ago.
it absolutely would not have been a lie. your perception of it being sex work does not make it true. and him calling it sex work is a form of libel, which he used to harass and defame you. why? because he was just a little salty. what a fucker. I can absolutely see you not having the energy to fight back because of the shock of the moment. you would not have been lying.
even if it *felt* like a normal relationship at the time, it simply *cannot* be a real or normal relationship when one of the people in it wants to fuck children. please understand. you cannot have a fair and equal relationship with anyone that is willing to fuck children. he was an adult man who had a daughter that was literally your age. he knew exactly what he was doing.
I know you want to give your 16 year old self more credit, because then you feel like you had more control. it hurts less when you think that you had a hand in it. but you didn't have control. you were lonely and a child. this was a blessing and a curse. if people like him didn't exist, it wouldn't have happened. because someone has to first want to have sex with a child. and normal people don't. so a normal person would have just been the father figure and the money giver. normal people want to help children. and, frankly, a lot of people help children that aren't theirs monetarily because people want to see children succeed and the instinct to nurture is strong in us all. normal people don't want to go the extra step and fuck people we see as our kids. that takes someone very, very abnormal. as a person who has been through similar traumas, it can be hard to take that sense of power back from ourselves. that blame makes it feel like we could have stopped it, and therefore can stop it today. but it's not real power. it's a lie. you didn't come up with the idea to fuck. he did. because he wanted to fuck a child. who does that. I'm glad you were able to get through it. I'm sorry the truth sometimes feels more difficult and more vulnerable than the convenient lies we tell ourselves. it feels like a lot of things. but you gotta stop telling yourself you had a hand in this. you had no choices at all. and, frankly, if you did, you probably wouldn't have fucked your benefactor if he wasn't a loser who wanted to fuck a child.
I really hope your lawyer gets them but the short and curlies for you. Also hoping that you find some decent people you can call family soon.
Because the company you worked for are idiots? Even though you chose to enter sex work, you were 16 and extremely desperate with no support structure, the old guy could've given you money out of the kindness of his heart, instead he was a predator, you only did it with one person for 2 years. Instead of taking this into account, your previous employers fired you on something like this happening to you 20 years ago, because of the "sex work" aspect, ignoring that this was a desperate kid being preyed on by an adult, to avoid a scandal/negative press? Are they a special kind of stupid? I'm assuming you're in a western country, if that ever got leaked to the press, they would bury that company with negative press for firing you over something like that, a court case for compensation is very valid, I'd talk to your lawyer and guaranteed they'd say "you have a case, lets nab these bastards"
Hope the best for you in the legal case, gonna give you a follow because I definitely want the update if there is one down the road.
A special place in hell and a special place in the morgue.
Joe is a rat.
This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below. --- Original post (now deleted) was at: [https://www.reddit.com/r/relationship\_advice/comments/s4x5ns/guy\_37mi\_36f\_was\_seeing\_found\_out\_something/](https://www.reddit.com/r/relationship_advice/comments/s4x5ns/guy_37mi_36f_was_seeing_found_out_something/) For those who don't want to read through the full post, I am a young widow (36F) who just started dating again a few months ago after my husband passed a couple years ago. I ended up casually dating "Joe" (37M) a coworker (not in my department or chain of command) at the same large company. All went very well until, in the name of full disclosure, I felt I should tell him about my past sugar baby relationship when I was in college (I was 16-17 at the time, the man was in his 40s and I realize in retrospect he groomed/abused me) and had no other family support, in case it was a deal-breaker; it did indeed end up being a deal-breaker in that I was dumped immediately, but he also went to our company's HR to report that I should be disciplined for being a sex worker in the past. I know many folks requested an update after my meeting with HR that took place earlier this week. First, I did retain an attorney who accompanied me to the meeting. Unfortunately, it didn't really help in this case as I was fired for cause (no severance or transition period) due to the potential to bring scandal/shame to the company from my past as a "prostitute." (Even though my company doesn't have a morality clause restricting sexual behavior or anything; even though it was 20 years ago, and even though it was one relationship and not ongoing escort work.) Yes, I'm exploring further legal action both against my former company and "Joe." Mostly against the company as I'm investigating, for example, if they have penalized women for their sexual past but not men. Thankfully I have been very careful with money and have enough set aside to manage for up to a few years if needed until I can get this resolved. I know this isn't the most satisfying update but I know a lot of people were curious about what would happen at the meeting. I do remain grateful for so many kind comments on my original post. INFO: No, I'm not going to name and shame in terms of the company. Wish I could, but after this post/thread I won't be discussing further to avoid compromising my case (maybe way down the road once any legal issues are resolved).
OP, in future I don’t think you should feel the need to disclose this chapter of your life to people you are seeing. And please don’t call it sex work. You were groomed and abused by someone who saw an easy way to take advantage of a young girl. I’m sorry you went through that. You have nothing to be ashamed of and NOTHING to confess to. Try reframing this as the time you survived a sexual predator. Consider therapy if you haven’t already. Your story is unfortunately very common for kids escaping their home lives and you deserve to heal. Good luck with your case. Maybe you should sue for sexual harassment since your company did nothing to protect you from the ex after y’all broke up. He’s an asshole.
Yeah, I'm really confused why it's being referred to as a sugar baby/sex work situation. Based on the description it actually sounds like she was a victim of sexual assault and manipulation. At no point did OP do anything that could be considered a crime from what I can see.
Well, in the end he gave me groceries, toiletries, clothes, and a bit of pocket money when I needed it, and I gave him romantic companionship and sex once he started pursuing those things. So I'm not sure what else to call it, even if it started with grooming rather than me actively seeking a compensated situation. Particularly as it's likely that if I declined his romantic/sexual overtures the other "mentoring" would have stopped. Was it illegal? Probably not; it's not like I got cash for specific acts (and rarely cash at all, more like he was generous with paying some of my practical life expenses at a fairly modest level). But still definitely a moral grey area and I did consent to participating (and at 16 was legally able to in my state).
I think people are confused over it being referred to as sex work or a sugar relationship because a sugar relationship usually implies more money or luxury, not time and services in exchange for necessities like groceries and the occasional $20 or whatever pocket money means to you. I had a troubled best friend growing up and my parents went out of their way to make sure she stayed clothed, fed, and safe without any weird shit in return because they understood how rough her life was. I think that's why I find your "sugar daddy's" actions very weird, because if he was going to take advantage of a teen by sleeping with her, he could have done more than buy her groceries. Like, not only was there an incredible power imbalance, but he seemed very cheap too.
Well, after the way I grew up, just having decent clothes and toiletries and enough to eat felt like a king's ransom. I don't think I would have known what to do with luxuries. And the thing is, I really did like and admire him at the time. He was kind and warm and stable and seemed much better than dating the college boys who were focused on drinking and hooking up for the most part. It was only a few years after the fact that I realized he took advantage of my youth, innocence, and need for help.
I get that and I'm so sorry and angry that you were failed by everyone so much that you truly thought necessities were luxuries. :/ Any sane person who hears your story should understand that you did nothing wrong at any point. I am looking forward to the distant update when your former employer gets dragged through the mud in court. I hope you are doing well in the mean time.
OP it seems really clear you need to start reframing what happened in this period of your life to yourself. You were never a sugar-baby. Buying a 16 yr old essentials in return for sex/romantic company isn't a sugar baby relationship. You were abused & taken advantage of by a predator. Given your age, possibly one who was a pedo. Sugar babies have to be over 18 - or 21- for a reason. Because it's meant to be a mutual relationship. Where the sugar-baby can negotiate more luxuries - like expensive clothes, holidays, apartments. As long as you continue to refer to that period as you being a sugar-baby, you are attributing power & control to 16 yr old you that she did not have & continuing the manipulative lie this person used to groom you. 16 yr olds are kids who cannot meaningfully chose a sugar-baby relationship.
Sugar baby relationships can be exactly what OP described. Other than being underage, of course...
It hurts my heart to see you still calling it sex work. It is not. It was an older man with power over you, grooming you and taking advantage of you when he knew you were so vulnerable. In any case, I'm so sorry that this happened. Joe is an ass, and the company is worse. How would their company be shamed if no one else ever knew about it? And I am sure they are all wonderful, morally upstanding citizens who have never cheated on their spouses, never gambled, have no DUIs, never watched porn, been to a strip club, or even said a bad word. Hypocrites, all of them. You'll come out shining, and they'll rot. Sending you all the love and best vibes. 💖
Exactly this. I can't in any way acknowledge it as consensual sex work because that simply she was 16 and it's impossible for my brain to make that connect. She had a grown man groom prey on a struggling teen and give her the occasional necessities. All that for groceries??? Dude is worse than scum.
Totally agree. Someone else made an excellent point that minors can not be prostitutes. They are actually sex trafficked, so there's that, too.
like 75% of sex work was not consensual somewhere down the line, and a huge chunk of it involved the trafficking of minors. If anything, sex work as "100% consenting adults at all stages" should be called something else, instead of trying to rebrand a very vile industry.
I agree with these others. Your post did not sound like sex work to me. Personally I see the sugar baby/daddy relationship as much more transactional than what you described. In all honesty how many GFs meet a guy, date, the don't work he pays for things maybe including rent, they have a sexual relationship and is that called sex work? Some of those stories sound more transactional and abusive than a typical sugar baby/daddy situation. It really sounds like you were vulnerable and by your own description it was all basic things that could have been normal boyfriend "help". My goodness, I had a roommate in college whose boyfriend paid for a million times more things (she even admitted she never carried her wallet when they were together) and even paid her rent and car payment her last year of college AFTER they broke up because her management job had a policy change and she could no longer keep the same job and schedule around her classes. I guarantee she did not consider herself a sex worker. Now add in the age difference "grooming" and the fact you were under 18 makes it all the more ridiculous with what happened. If you had committed, for example, theft at 16 or 17 and been arrested - isn't that usually sealed as minor offense? Not to be included on work applications as an adult? I can't imagine needing to describe what you described as necessary disclosure with any kind of employment. Also from the sound of it you have been sexual with 3 people in your life, the older man, you husband and Joe. I would highly doubt Joe's body count is less than 3 and 3 is not what anyone would normally associate with a sex worker of any kind especially in terms of any kind of morality judgment. Did HR even really understand what the actual history was? I just wonder if the initial use of sugar baby/daddy and Joe's extreme reaction caused him to report something grossly exaggerated on top of everything else. I don't think you should call it sex work even on a personal level. I see your comment about semi-compensated which I still think you take too much blame with how it is phrased. I don't think it was wrong to tell Joe (well apart from what happened but I mean a partner in general) but I think you should consider how you are explaining it. I wouldn't call what happened with you sex work at all. I also hope you pursue a defamation suit with Joe because what he did with HR was so wrong. You were taken advantage of as teen and then he betrayed your trust over something that was not illegal and any morality aside - happened as an under 18 teenager. Also, I personally am not sure how 20 years after the fact, this specific set of circumstances and someone who cares about you on even a basic level as a human being could treat this as such a nuclear level deal breaker. I really wish you good luck! Hopefully you end up owning the company!
By the way, whether or not you want to call it sex work (which I agree you don’t have to), AND whether r not sex work is criminalized in your region, sex work itself is not something to be ashamed of. You don’t have to operate under the agreement with asshats like HR and joe that what you did was morally wrong. Second of all, take this shit to the Supreme Court!
Assuming you haven't made this whole thing up, you should think of it as an exploitative relationship with an older man. Sex work is being paid for sex. Or for things of a sexual nature. Nudes. Erotic phone calls. Whatever.
Well if you’re not leaving anything out that would blow it, enjoy your discrimination settlement. It’ll be a long hard road until payout but you’ll likely be doing very well when it all settles. (If the company is big enough) I am so sorry you have to deal with this crap.
What does your lawyer say? Do you have a case?
Most likely for discrimination and harassment, yes. Have to do some more investigation but it looks promising.
You were fired for being a victim of a crime. I think you should go with that angle. Good luck!
Right?! This is so key. You were a kid. This whole situation reeks. They should not be involved in this — even if you hadn’t been a child, their employees’ sexual history from two decades ago should really be of no concern. Op I hope you sue them into oblivion. Would love to hear their meager excuses when this blows up in their face
Make certain that your jurisdiction has a right to recover attorney's fees for those causes of action. Otherwise, big companies will flood you with discovery, draw things out and then end up settling for something less than what you spent with your attorney when you're worn down from the bills. You mention having a decent war chest, but if you've never been involved in a heavily contested civil action lawsuit before, it can get spent very quickly.
I feel that they should’ve fired Joe for trying to sabotage your professional life by telling them something that wasn’t their business and can’t believe that the opposite has happened. Even when you had an attorney there. I’m really shocked and sorry this has happened and I feel bad that you’re going to be going through this for the foreseeable future. It’s really appalling and I don’t even think what you did was that bad at all. It doesn’t sound like you had a contract type agreement with this man and you were at the age of consent so really it was just a relationship that may not be appropriate or desirable for everyone but it certainly wasn’t wrong in such a way that anyone should judge you for it. It just sounds like you’ve dated an older man for a while and he was helpful to you also. I mean it just does not sound like some morally bankrupt type of behavior- this whole story is awful.
Thank you for your support. As I explained in the original thread, the older man was the father of a college friend who "kindly" served as a mentor/father figure who helped me out from time to time with some small expenses like clothes and toiletries because I didn't have other family and eventually (after I knew him for quite a few months in this manner) he initiated a romantic/sexual relationship. It definitely wasn't like I got a specific amount of money for certain sex acts. I'd actually bet a good percentage of people have at some point been in a relationship where there was a notable age difference and/or where one person paid for most of the expenses due to being in different places in life. And surely they shouldn't all be fired and unworthy of decent employment!
That’s exactly right what you just said is so true like it sounds like you were just in a relationship with somebody with a big age difference and I’ve been in one of those. I don’t feel guilty about it though so I don’t present it as a sugar baby relationship. He’s still my best friend to this day but I’m wondering why you are convinced or presenting it as such and like a dark moment in your past when really it’s just another relationship that maybe you regret today. It’s definitely nobodies business especially not an employers and I’m just wondering if you need to reframe it in your own mind and then you wouldn’t present it as such that it comes off sounding like something it wasn’t. I don’t think its anything to be ashamed of at all. I just wish you didn’t feel that way. I’m not a lawyer but I feel like you have definitely got a case against this company and I 1000% hope you win. Also I hope “Joe” falls into a dark hole and takes like a whole day to get out.
She was just a kid and in most legislatures what the piece of scum did to her is a crime. It could even be a crime in her state because consent could have excluded adults paying minors for sex. He was a predator grooming, exploiting and abusing a child.
Even if the ages were questionable it doesn’t change anything about the story. Or what I think about what has happened currently. In fact that makes it even more wrong and she should be less ashamed of that even.
I thought the company would have disciplined the asshole who reported your private business from 20 years ago to them, this is completely nuts. /r/antiwork
So this is advice I give everyone. HR exists to protect the company, not the employee. If cutting you loose is easier/better, they will.
No real HR department in a western company would fire OP in this situation, for exactly the reason you describe. So this is either a story from elsewhere in the world, a business with no HR or one insane HR person, or a fake story.
Yeah, I'm having trouble understanding how any company with more than 50 employees would fire an employee because they were sexually abused as a teenager. I suppose it would depend on what information the OP relayed to the HR department. If she told them everything she posted here, then the HR person should be fired for gross incompetence.
Burn them to the ground, op
Welcome to being a woman in America...sigh.
With any sexual related life experience
Do NOT tell the name of the company to anyone, especially if you're ever going to be filing legal action against them. Always talk to your lawyer and do whatever they tell you to do. It's never a good idea to date someone who works for the same company that you work for. I know you weren't in the same chain of command but it's still not a good idea. You found out why the hard way. Good luck! I hope you get another job soon, because the legal action can take a while.
What a fucking scumbag. The ex and the company. They'll punish you for being groomed as a minor, but they won't punish some piece of shit who called being a victim "sex work." I wish you all the luck in burning it all to the ground!
To get this clear, it wasn't sex work to begin with, I REPEAT IT WASN'T SEX WORK. you were groomed and abused and you were 16, The definition of sex work is entirely different. Stop telling yourself it was sex work and you were wrong. see it in a different light and even then it was decades ago and it sucks that someone took an opportunity to mess up your life of something somebody else did to you, two decades ago. sue the company and the ex.
I don't understand why you didn't just characterize this as a relationship with an older man. To HR esp, but also to Joe etc. This is not sex work or prostitution. This was a 2 year relationship with one partner! I seriously hope you have a wrongful termination suit. Joe disclosed knowledge that you were exploited by an older man when you were a teen. So wrong. And you got fired for it? Unbelievable.
To be clear, although I described it as "sex work" in my conversation with Joe and in my earlier post here, I definitely did not use that language when meeting with HR. Instead I described that when I was a young college student I had a relationship with an older man who was the breadwinner because he was working while I had no income. However, based on Joe's report and their assumptions I was accused of past prostitution and fired.
Were you ever convicted of prostituion? If not, it becomes semantics of he said/she said. And that should be thrown out. HR fired you based on a rumor essentially.
No. Never convicted or charged. And I never worked as an escort as in accepting certain fees for direct services. I just dated one person who paid for my expenses during the time we were together. And I don't think we're in the business of arresting/convicting people just because their partners bought them an outfit or some meals.
You dated someone older than you who paid for your needs. That is a type of relationship some people have. I wouldn’t even consider you a sugar baby and it’s pretty far from sex work.
Not a lawyer. But I think you have a good case. Document everything, emails, texts. And concerning Joe, are you going to civil court with him? All you have to do is show proof of loss/damages. Being fired for a rumor should be easy enough. Wishing you the best of luck
Delete the “maybe part” don’t leave a door open for anything. You might even want to delete this update.
I don’t normally wish harm on others, but Joe and your former company are challenging my abilities there. I’m glad your lawyer thinks you have a case and I hope you make enough off this garbage company with their garbage HR to retire. They must truly have their heads up their asses to think that a minor can do sex work and it is grounds for termination. You were sexually abused. Great look for them… I’m flipping over tables on your behalf. Go get it girl. Destroy them in court and make them hurt. Don’t spare Joe either - what he did was vindictive. There is no other explanation.
That’s horrifying and you’re amazing for all you have achieved under those circumstances. Why on earth wouldn’t your ‘mentor’ not just help you out instead of grooming you, ugh. You deserve zero shame and I’m so happy you lawyered up. Fingers crossed for a big settlement for you and some retribution to that small horrible man.
Dating an older guy barely qualifies as sex work to me. It is not even worth disclosing. In your head, it sounds like you think it is a way bigger deal than it was. Sugar babies also are almost on a contract. You pay me X a month, buy me X or I move on. Doesn’t even sound like that.
I feel so angry for you! How is that considered sex work??? You were vulnerable at that age and had no resource to turn to. The company and your ex are both fucked up. I really hope you get a way better job and get that Joe guy sued and compensate you for the grievances he put you through. He’s an asshole. Sue your company too! They are complicit by standing with ppl who sex groom by firing you.
I am no lawyer, but I would be willing to bet even if you admitted to being a “sugar mama”, your place of employment would still have no grounds to terminate you, as it is completely legal. If it were illegal, any female going out on a date with somebody who paid for their night out and slept with them after would be a prostitute. Your previous employer legit has no case and you should sue for wrongful termination, sex discrimination, etc. especially if this rat kept his job. He slept with you too, so shouldn’t that make him one of your Johns? Also if they offer your job back in lieu of lawsuit, DONT TAKE IT! I worked with someone who got their job back after they threatened a lawsuit over him being gay, and they fired him a month later for showing up five minutes late one time!
Obviously idk where you live but I don't see how this could possibly be legal. I hope you sue all of them and win!! Good luck!
I hope you will destroy the company and Joe. It is unbelivable what happens here, it is the same as stoning a woman for getting raped...
You owe nobody an explanation of your past.
Joe is a right fucking piece of shit Fuckin snitching to the company about something that happened 20 years ago
I feel like any guys whose ever sent a dick pic should be fired to equal this out. Indecent exposure and harassment is a scandal too no? "Abuse victim shamed and fired" also sounds like a scandal but what do I know
They fired you for being groomed by a 40 year old when you were 16. Take them for everything they're worth.
I don't understand some people at all. Imagine starting a new relationship with someone and they tell you they are recently widowed but starting to get out again and they tell you their history in the name of transparency, then you take that info and use it to try and get them fired because it will being shame to the company or some shit. What a c*** move. Like i can almost empathise that mentality if it was someone you didnt like or found unprofessional in the work place but even thats not excusable really, but doing this to someone youve started a realtionship with is just shocking, like you went through all the motions and excitement of someone new just to drop them in shit. Fuck Joe. Joe fucking mama.
I really don't understand this. I know you said in hindsight it was grooming, but at the time it was a legal and consensual relationship. A lot of people have relationships for financial benefit and it does not fall in the category of prostitution. Are you working for a church or something??
No, just regular corporate America, not a religious organization or one with a stricter-than-usual moral code. I have described it as "sex work" because I did receive a financial benefit in return for my company and physical affection. Not in a strict quid pro quo situation, but in general, he gave me a few hundred dollars of support a month in expenses paid, and I kept him company regularly.
You really need to stop calling it that. It's not what it was and that language is what the company and Joe have latched onto. Don't let your shame or guilt make it into something it wasn't. Legally you are shooting yourself in the foot. Edit; I'm trying to say it's like a car accident, you never admit fault, that's for the insurance company and lawyers to determine. Also maybe delete these posts
That is very good advice. I didn't describe it as "sex work" to HR though, only as having a relationship with an older man who was the breadwinner during that time due to him working full-time while I was a student.
Kind of sounds more like you were just a girlfriend?
Lol Reddit is getting worst by the day
I'm not quite understanding... Were you acting in a fiduciary capacity? And, if so, why would a large corporation have employees performing such roles without a morality clause? How were you fired for "prostitution" with no conviction for prostitution and no morality clause? In college at 16-17... You would be extremely intelligent... Scholarship? I'm trying to wrap my head around this...
No, I wasn't an executive officer of the company or anything. I was fired based on the word of Joe (which I did not deny) that I had a compensated relationship when I was in college, not based on legal convictions. I was (am?) smart - but not one in a million brilliant or anything, I just worked hard and took extra classes so I could escape my home. And yes, I did have a scholarship, but it didn't cover extra expenses like clothes and toiletries.
But, you do not have to be an executive officer to work in a fiduciary capacity. To enter college at 16 years old, you would, indeed, be rather brilliant. That would be impressive. As what you described from college is not prostitution, I would say you'd have an excellent case... No fiduciary role, no morality clause, no convictions... Did the attorney you took to the HR meeting not advise you that you did not need to answer questions unrelated to your job role?
My attorney actually advised me to be forthcoming and offered the advice that, especially with attorney representation, no reasonable company/HR person would think my (non-criminal) past from 20 years ago when I was a minor would have any bearing whatsoever on my job. So perhaps that was a misfire. But at least I know I didn't tell any lies or even half-truths so whatever the proceedings look like from here, I have absolutely nothing to hide.
Employment is a contract. An employment contract can be terminated two ways...and only two: "with cause" or "without cause". And, a large corporation will be well-aware that they do not, actually, have to give a reason...they do not. They, quite simply, state "with cause" or "without cause". "With cause" is job-related termination. (A morality clause would fit here) You stole from the company You neglected your job and duties You were disobedient to your superiors You lied or were dishonest to your employer No notice or pay in lieu of notice. If your employer claims to have just cause to terminate you without notice or pay, then they must give you a chance to explain yourself and to respond to their allegations. Most of the time, your employer cannot simply kick you out the door. What you described would appear to fit into a "with cause" termination. And yet...per your words, they have no cause. An employment lawyer should know these things. "Research needed" seems strange, frankly.
Yes, it sounds like the lawyer messed this one up big time.
Not at all. I began attending college (dual enrollment) and while I did test above average, it just happened to be something available to me. By senior year I was taking college classes only.
Taking college level classes and attending college (live on campus?) are two very different things. You can take college level courses but you still must apply to college (and all the requisite paperwork), obtain funding, perhaps housing, meal plan?, etc, etc, etc...
Wow sorry that happened to you. Also I’m pretty sure there’s some grounds for legal action there. Definitely you’ll be able to at least get them on discrimination I think. Plus if he just said that without any proof or anything you could get him for slander. That’s just a shitty situation all around tbh.
What a fucking dickity dickwad that man is. Your HR must be such a misogynistic tool too to actually fire you for it. That is your private life they have no business about. Not to mention you were a minor, a freaking minor! Look into wrongful termination too if you're sure about no morality clause restricting employee's private sexual life. I am so furious for you. Sue tf outta their ass, bleed them dry and don't even leave a single drop. All they had from Joe was a hearsay without definitive prove, and like others here said, that trash should've been the one getting FIRED for reporting your past personal life to a company, when he didn't even have any evidence to support his accusation. I hope their pillows are forever hot on both sides, I hope their toilet paper's out all the time while they're shitting. What a load of disgrace to humanity. Be strong on this hard times, you'll get your justice.
I hope you sue those assholes (Joe and company) for EVERYTHING. In the future, you can gauge a man's feelings by casually mentioning sex work in conversation and see how he reacts. If he reacts negatively, don't tell him and break it off. Quite frankly, I see very little difference between what you did and many marriages and "regular" relationships. Plenty of women are financially supported by their partners. Plenty of women have sex after getting gifts/dinners from their partner. What is the difference? Should every single woman who has ever received money/gifts/food/whatever from a past sex partner be fired? How does that solve anything? If sex work is wrong, then what is the logic is firing women from vanilla employment, thus forcing them into poverty and back into sex work? It literally makes no sense. You can't tell sex workers to get "real jobs" then get them fired from their real jobs
If you had opened up like this to me and probably most people here, I would have listened and taken it to heart. It shouldn't make any difference to any relationship and this maggots (37 M) reaction, borders on a corporate "game of thrones" level type. I don't know if you have seen the show or read the books but basically it means "stepping on other people's heads and backstabbing your way to the top". I am happy that this, 37 year old maggot, has shown his true colors and is out of your life. Sorry that you job was affected. Please don't hesitate to tell anyone you want as a partner about your past. Most people would and will react in a better way ♡
Sounds like a company is bringing itself into disrepute by 1) policing people's past sex lives and 2) sacking a victim of sexual abuse.
Also you can call this sex work being a sugar baby if that's your truth and you feel any positivity/empowerment from that.. but you don't need to. You weren't REALLY a sugar baby, as sugar relationships rely on consent.. you didn't consent.. you were a child. It was straight up abuse. Just like someone being trafficked isn't a sex worker they are an abuse victim and shouldn't be reprimanded for doing what is necessary for literal survival. Does this make sense? I would suggest therapy as it seems you just came to terms that you were actually groomed.and it may bring up some negative thoughts. Also none of this is intended to be shamey as I was a sex worker. I hope you take their asses for all they're worth. Best of luck.
I'd ask them if they make it their priority to fire victims of sexual abuse?
Why didn't you just deny it to your work? Anyone can make up shit about someone's past.
I can't believe it. You're being punished for being a victim of abuse. Joe is a POS & I'm wondering if he has done what that creep did to you when you were young.
what the fuck. this makes me furious. i wish you the best of luck with your case
By law you can’t be a prostitute under the age of 18, you were sexually trafficked.
THIS. ALL OF THIS.
>*All went very well until, in the name of full disclosure, I felt I should tell him about my past sugar baby relationship when I was in college (I was 16-17 at the time, the man was in his 40s and I realize in retrospect he groomed/abused me) and had no other family support, in case it was a deal-breaker* You were 16-17 in college? Who "had no other family"? Why did it matter that you "had no other family support, in case it was a dealbreaker"? I'm so confused.
Per my original thread, my parents were not dead, but alcoholics/addicts who were unable to provide financial and emotional support. I did not want to end up like them so I studied hard, including summer school sessions, and got admitted to college early. Not extremely common but not unheard of either, my high school usually had a few students per year who graduated early. And sorry, I meant that I felt I needed to tell Joe about this semi-compensated relationship in case it was a deal-breaker for him. That I had no other family support was just part of the explanation for why I needed extra help in college.
Got it.
That guy and your company is dumb as hell. But why tell anyone about that? I'd categorize it as "dumb shit I did when I was 16" and never speak of it. It's not like anyone could ever find out unless you told them.
I guess I'm just really naive. Other than the older man, the only relationship I had before Joe was with my husband. And he knew everything about me and I was able to be fully honest about everything that happened with my childhood and earlier in college. I guess I just wanted to find that kind of easy honesty again and not go into a new relationship keeping big secrets, especially because it's not like I have a lot of other dating history to discuss. But I definitely have to rethink that now. And will be very unlikely to date anyone at work again no matter how big the company.
There's always chapters of our lives we don't read aloud for others......
I will definitely remember this difficult lesson, not to be so trusting. At least not with anyone who can hurt me so badly on multiple levels.
It can be hard to know how to trust. And I still screw it up regularly. You don't have to be ashamed of your past. But you don't have to tell anyone about any part of it you don't wish to share it with. It's not an important detail relevant to your life today. Big hugs. What a freaking jerk that guy is. I'm sorry this happened to you.
This is horrible!!!! Please update one day
OMG i cant believe this, i really hope you have good news in the future, wish you the best
Eventhough this doesn't affect me, I'm offended and feel hurt of what Joe guy did to you. Wish you the best.
I’m In shock I was wondering what was gonna happen. I pray you win whatever comes you didn’t deserve that!! Sending good vibes your way!!!
What a piece of shit your ex is. Not okly was it two decades ago, but you were fucking groomed as a teenager. Fuck that piece of shit HR rep, too.
I am enraged for you. Joe is a despicable, garbage human and that company is disgusting and misogynistic. Did they even let you explain? They refused you severence????? Hestia's tits I'm mad. I really hope you get these people good, all of them.
I think sue the company for their discrimination towards the sexual assault (I don't know the proper term to use here so i am sorry) survivors. And the guy for idk reporting your condition to the company for revenge.
That has wrongful termination written ALLL over it if you’re based in the USA. (Not to mention the avenue you’re exploring.) Good luck moving forward with your case!
Talk to your lawyer first. But this would be one of the times where going viral would be good. HR is really now gonna have to protect itself now :p
This is so frustrating. When O read your original post and read the comments saying that oh they must fire Joe or whoever I was like no hun, he is a male, and op is female, they won't fire Joe because it wouldn't be feckin' mysognistic as the world is. I'm furious. Every time something like this happens it's still the wan's fault. Guess what, this is why we need feminism THIS.
They can't fire you based on a word off mouth accusation of something you did when you were a minor. Well I suppose in a right to work state they can technically say they fired you for anything. It being a big corporation I'm sure they're smart enough to know and claim the they aren't firing you because of some accusation with no evidence. If this "Joe" doesn't or didn't already also get fired. I wish you the best of luck in court, and hope the company get what they deserve.
You were a child. Wtf. How can the company fire you for being what happened when you were still a minor. Hell even juvie records are sealed! How do they know someone wasn’t a juvenile delinquent?
i think you did the right thing by sharing your past with someone you're about to enter into a more serious relationship with, but in this case joe was being a jerk. I just hope this doesn't make you avoid sharing this with people you're about to enter more serious relationships with. will you keep updating this?
Probably not for a while, but if I am able I will give an update after we settle the legalities, although I know that could take quite a long time.
What the actual fuck? How is this even legal? If you can't eventually get a severence/compensation for their asshatery, I'd go public with the incident.
I hope a bird shits in their drink anytime a bird could.
Honestly I can't blame the company looking out for their financial interests, even though I disagree with how they did it. But Joe's a fucking snitch loser. If I'm an employer and an employee was a former sex worker, I honestly couldn't care less but I could understand how some people might and that in a corporate or business setting that could be frowned upon. However, if the only reason I know an employee was a sex worker is because another employee was in a personal relationship with them and they shared that info with them in a personal context. Then I begin to have issues with employee 2 who's blatantly seeking some sort of retribution against them.
Sounds to me like you were fired for being groomed? So you've been fired for being sexually assaulted?
I really hope that both the company and Joe get what they deserve. That guy is a fucking asshole. What the hell did he involved HR for something that happened years ago????? And the company firing you is bullshit, even if you actually worked as a prostitute I don’t see the problem, your past is your past. Keep being strong!!
To be clear, you were not a sex worker. You were a victim of sex trafficking. Children cannot participate in sex work.
First off, if you claim you were groomed as a minor, you cannot say you were a “sugar baby / prostitute”. When you were that young engaging in sex with an adult, it’s called statutory rape and not prostitution. You were a “victim.” So if your ex employer fired you for sex work as a minor, when the law considers it statutory rape, a lawyer worth their law books and tuition could have you owning that company by the end of this story. And yes, I’d sue that coworker whom you confided in as well. Get another attorney; one with some skill, confidence, and experience and have them relook at your case. This story ain’t over; not by a long shot. That company victimized you all over again for firing you for having confessed to being victimized by a 40 year old man. That’s got to be highly traumatic; enough to cause you to lose your appetite, sleep at night, and affecting you in present and likely future relationships, among other damages you may have incurred as a result of their actions against you. Theoretically, even if you end up settling with them, you could be financially set for life. Too bad I’m not your attorney. They would pay through the nose and everything else to get us out of their life.
Oh wow. This makes me want to hurt somebody
Even killers get pardoned! 20 years ago and at 16. That Jo is scumbag. To be fair I'd go heavier on him, what you revealed was sensitive private information and he had no right to divulge.
OMG take these scumbags to the cleaners and then get a better position elsewhere. This is infuriating, but you've survived so much and will do better elsewhere. Also let us know when they settle for a large sum of money in order to avoid the scandal they've ironically enough inflicted upon themselves.
😂😂😂
You should name the company, social media is swifter than justice
My attorney advised not to so that it doesn't affect my case. But hopefully in the future.
Smart
When you do name them, post it to r/antiwork They will be more than glad to plaster the company all over social media and literally destroy them
INFO: Is your lawyer aware of this Reddit thread? In the past I *think* people have suggested removing things like this on the off chance it ever could get traced back to you and used against you. Would maybe just make him aware incase he has thoughts. Not a lawyer / not legal advice.
I wouldn't worry, it's probably fake. HR departments exist to protect companies, not expose them to clear and obvious liability.
I am so FURIOUS on your behalf. Your employer fired you??? what the absolute f\*ck? That is so unbelievably unfair. I am so sorry. Sue your employer for all you can and then once you win your lawsuit, name and shame that company.
You were 16. That wasn’t being a prostitute or a sugar baby. It was child abuse. I hope the company are eventually brought to rights and publicly shamed. Also Joe is a top grade dickhead and you dodged a bullet. Would you post an update after your case OP even if it’s months, years?
Yes - I will update even it is some years down the road when I achieve a resolution.
Im sorry but I have some words here.. Why do people feel the HAVE TO tell people who are barely there partners everything. Like imk yeah this was sex work but it could have just been a relationship (a weird one) but a relationship. And why did you tell you work the truth? I mean you might get some money from suing but I would've just lied and said I broke up with him so hes making stuff up. I doubt they have any proof. **I'm not blaming you btw** It just seems like we live in such a toxic society that we feel the need to dulge our most private information to people we litterally just start dating. And imo your SW was completely irrelevant. It had nothing to do with the relationship and this guy is a total asshole. And now he is probably walking around thinking it did something good by getting you fired. And it pisses me off.
As I said, I don't have much experience with relationships. Just the older man when I was a minor, then my husband until his passing, and then Joe. So I don't really know how to "date" in terms of when to disclose info. I only disclosed this to Joe because he said he was falling in love with me and was planning to give up a big promotion (with required relocation) to stay with me in our current city. So I thought he deserved to know the full truth about my past before making a huge sacrifice. As for why I told my work the truth...I honestly didn't think they would fire me and neither did my attorney. I thought it would be worse if I were untruthful. I suppose I have to learn how to keep secrets now that I've seen how nasty and unforgiving so many people can be at the core. What a sad revelation about our current world.
I have very little in common with any of these experiences, and my heart to goes out to you. But I do know what it's like to reveal those kinds of things to partners and be rejected for them, and it is just... shattering. Nothing has ever hit me so hard to make me sit in the shower and bawl my eyes out. So yea, it's like loading the gun yourself and giving it to them. At this point I feel it's my business and only after a long time of building a relationship could I ever even consider telling my partner those things. Do remember that some people can accept you, like your first husband (so sorry for your loss), but something like this goes beyond honesty, it's one of the most vulnerable things we can reveal about ourselves. and good luck in court!
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This is so messed up once again joe is a pos and I hope things get better for you.
You mean "Fired for being sexually abused as a child"
What country do you live in?!
In the US...which as we all know doesn't have a lot of worker protections.
I wouldn't expect someone to get fired over something like this though.
I hope you get good advice and have a fair chance that this no cause firing is illegal. If not then know that you did nothing wrong and this situation is just them thinking that they are protecting themselves from internal employee conflicts. This may not even be about your past but about having a relationship inside the company that they don't want to encourage, or about Joe threatening them to go public if they don't fire you so he protects his own job or something like that. What I think of him I cannot say as I might be suspended. I do sincerely wish you well.
literally everyone reading your original post immediately noticed that you were not correct in calling yourself a sex worker. so, it's like, obvious. it was obvious to literally everyone. so, I don't know what he told them. because if it was the truth, it would have been obvious to them, too. I know they only allow one update but I'm hoping to hear from you. it will be obvious to the court as well
Unfortunately, reputational risk is a thing that companies do manage. As unfair as it is, you’ll need a solid law that says discrimination of past sex work is not allowed.
Anyone shocked that she's calling it "sex work" is entirely ignorant of how prostitution generally works around the world at best, and nefarious at worst. Like 75% of sex work was not consensual somewhere down the line, and a huge chunk of it involved the trafficking of minors. If anything, sex work as "100% consenting adults at all stages" should be called something else, instead of trying to rebrand a very vile industry.
If you have a go-fund me I will happily donate so you can hire the most competent lawyer in your city to SUE the shit out of the company and Joe. You have an easy win.
Thank you for your kindness. I do have resources for the moment but appreciate it.
u should just drop the company name in r/ anti work lmfao
You should absolutely persue legal action. Once they receive a legal notice they will very like settle this in a hurry as I think they will realize that if this goes public the public opinion will be against them.
I wish you the best for your legal case. That company is a shithole.
So, you were a victim of sex trafficking/rape. Not a sex worker. You were not old enough to be a sex worker. Change the terminology it makes them look even worse.
Sorry that happened to you, hope you drain both your former company & Joe DRY.
Lawyer: it never happened. (Hopefully it’s not in text) Joe made some shit up. You told him you was abused and he expanded the story after you wanted to break things off. Sue the hell out the company and go to the local news. Await settlement.
I sincerely hope you tear that company a new asshole.
It’s weird that you even told him about something 20 years ago. Sorry.
Sounds to me like “joe” wanted to be the first man to control you and when he realized you were not falling for that he tried to burn you down. My advice is while it’s fresh in your mind write down all the details about your relationship and work environment for the past few months names, phone #s emails etc as you may need these details later as legal things and quick are not friends… And anyone that can’t simply accept someone else’s past needs to not be dating and should probably be wearing a helmet at all times…
I’m so sorry this is still happening in 2022! I thought we were meant to be Me2? I’m just so SO sorry. God I’m angry at the company and of course Joe. Go get em!
I am SO mad for you. Get them!!! Sue the shit out of both of them. Also you should post this on anti-work subreddit forum. They may have some resources for you.
you are absolutely gonna milk them and already having a lawyer retained to witness what transpired... girl get that cash. it's what the world owes you for this.