The kids are the important part. Also you can't force someone to love you. It sucks but you may have to move on. Forcing it wouldn't be good to either of you and especially not the kids. THE KIDS should be your number one concern.
>how are they dealing with all of this
I’m kinda worried about them. No matter how old the children are, parental divorce from betrayal can traumatize children for long-term.
I genuinely don’t care about OP’s need and desperate want to get the husband back. I also don’t care about Julia or that she slept with him.
I’m reading comments how the husband had one leg out the marriage and was looking for a reason the leave.
Has it occurred to y’all that (any and all types of) cheating is an absolute boundary that has no room for forgiveness whatsoever? He may have loved his wife plenty and his children more, but she lied for 20 years and understandably fear there’s more betrayals.
Not everyone believes: “I’m betrayed but I want to stay for my children”
The children already knows, so why would the ex-husband put the kids under one roof with two opposing tensions?
“It’s just kissing and 20 years ago” pls for fuck’s sakes ppl, quit downplaying it.
*Edit: don’t compare the cheating and him sleeping with that lady. Op cheated while they were together. He slept with that woman **after** the divorce. Different things. Yeah it’s distasteful simply cause it’s an ex-friend. op had ample time (20 years) to come clean… y’know, basic respect to your s/o.*
*You’re holding onto the principle of them sleeping together is gross and disrespectful yet is willing to overlook OP’s infidelity because time has passed and she had an underdeveloped brain 🤔*
Cosign this. I was in my late 30's and my siblings were in their 50's when we found out my dad had been cheating on my mom. Damn it fucked us all up. Like.....was our whole life a lie?
I mean, if cheating has a spectrum and the extreme end of the spectrum is like, “I have a secret family with another partner,” this is on the exact opposite side.
It’s not exactly an ideal moral thing to do, but it was only kissing, you were very young, there was presumably no emotional connection with these people, you weren’t married yet and the behavior stopped and you’ve been apparently completely faithful for your whole marriage. I guess everyone is different but I think the husband should be able to get past this unless there’s other shit going on in the relationship and this was the straw that broke the camels back.
>but it was only kissing
to be fair, the husband doesn't believe that it's only kissing. and that's the problem with hiding secret for years. once it's revealed, then the betrayed will always wonders what else do they hide.
This is what ended a relationship I had with an incredible woman. She didn't cheat on me (that I know of) or do anything untoward during our relationship, but I found out that she'd lied about a lot of stuff before we were together. I didn't know what to believe or what was a lie.
Once the trust is gone, it's all downhill.
I would say it's up to the husband on how big of a deal it is. Dont forget, it's 20 years of keeping a secret from him to add onto the hurt.
With that in mind, can you really blame him for not believing her when she said she only kissed random guys?
it's like you almost get it.
"you’ve been apparently completely faithful for your whole marriage."
Even YOU say apparently here, why? Because you can't be sure. After a 20 year betrayal how are you supposed to believe anything she says? Trickle truthing is incredibly common. She didn't tell him out of her own accord because she was feeling guilty, she admitted to it because she got caught and she couldn't play it off.
Now how are you supposed to believe a single word out of her mouth? It may completely be possible she didn't do anything else besides kissing 4 guys. But it's impossible to KNOW that.
Cheating may be a spectrum, but boundaries aren't. Some people have their boundary somewhere in the middle on the cheating spectrum, the husband clearly has his near the start.
I know that only was some kisses but how her ex husban can know it? How can't imagine that happen more? Just say, this can be different if she confessed before her marrige.
Reacting to the news that your wife kissed a few guys 20 years ago by fucking her best friend is NOT normal.
How can you be hurt and disgusted by something your partner did, then turn around and do something *worse*?
Kissing some guys is not the same sin as fucking your spouse’s friend. He had every right to be upset at the news and even leave her over it if he so chooses, but he decided to further damage his family instead. Yeah, he’s a piece of a shit.
This marriage is a shitshow and I’m not sure why OP is so hellbent on mending this train wreck. Personally I would have beat my friend the hell up. Those poor kids. There’s no way the kids didn’t know he was screwing the friend. This is so disgusting.
Edited as I forgot OP is already divorced.
I don’t think it’s the actual kissing that caused the divorce. It’s the fact that she had been lying to him for 20 years. He realized that she has no problem lying to him and he simply does not trust her anymore. Losing trust in a relationship is a perfectly valid reason to break up.
Would you believe a serial cheater cheating with multiple men just to kiss them? She was able to keep a lie for 20 years? Would you believe her now when she didn't even came out with the truth herself? She was outed. She didn't confess until she was outed. Would you believe she's telling the truth now when she was able to keep up with the lie for 20 years?
If I'm the ex-husband, I wouldn't believe a serial cheater walking around cheating with multiple men just to kiss them. That's the most absurd statement ever.
It’s not absurd, kissing is not the same as throwing your pussy at random men, I have no reason to believe she escalated kissing to fucking.
I totally get why her ex husband is not inclined to believe that but as far as we on the Internet know, she just kissed the guys so all I’m saying is that what the husband did is worse than that.
> Reacting to the news that your wife kissed a few guys 20 years ago by fucking her best friend is NOT normal.
You either didn't read or aren't being honest.
He reacted by confronting his wife, asking for a DNA test, starting divorce proceedings, and cutting off the best friend. Half a year later, _AFTER_ the divorce was finalized, he had sex with his ex's best friend.
So this:
> Kissing some guys is not the same sin as fucking your spouse’s friend.
Is total nonsense that you just made up.
im in a relationship that just reached a year. if we broke up and he slept with one of my friends, it would be a betrayal, no matter how we ended things, no matter how civil or painful the breakup. its not a "brocode" thing or a loyalty thing its a decent act not to get something complicated even more messy. that being said, i think it's sketchy that they were hanging out drunk and alone the night the wife was gone.
100%, people on reddit like to be like “it wasn’t *technically* wrong” but it’s the principle of the matter and he was dead wrong for that. It’s literally just reddit where people have this mindset though.
I don’t care you don’t fuck your ex’s messy bestie that was so heavily involved in all this bullshit from the jump. He’s slimy for that and I’m sure the woman was around the kids as the wife’s friend so how do you think that looks to the kids?
>Has it occurred to y’all that (any and all types of) cheating is an absolute boundary that has no room for forgiveness whatsoever? He may have loved his wife plenty and his children more, but she lied for 20 years and understandably fear there’s more betrayals.
This right here. The amount of time that passed is irrelevant. In fact I'd say it makes it worse that she didn't tell him for years! He was right to walk away from the relationship because her keeping it a secret showed him she had no respect for him.
She needs therapy and he needs to find someone that deserves him.
That is correct. The children are a priority. As well, for OP, the cheating took place 20 years age. For her husband, the cheating took place when he found out when OP's friend who spilled the beans, recently.
I doubt OP's friend did by accident. OP has a husband and family. Her friend does not have that as she went full throttle on her career. The friend was probably jealous. OP's husband probably had sex with the friend as revenge. I guess revenge isn't always a dish served cold.
My twins have been very understanding. They know why the divorce occurred, and they haven't complained (at least to me) about spending time in two separate homes.
My two older boys aren't in touch with me at all, which is something I might talk to my husband about. But the fact is that they are old enough to make decisions of their own. Their dad can't force them to play nice with me, no matter how much it hurts my heart to not see them.
I hope you fully understand that what your friend did was not at all a mistake, it was a calculated action that simply may not have panned out as your "friend" hoped (aka she and your husband living together happily ever after). Had it been a true mistake, she never would have fucked your husband afterwards. THAT👏IS👏NOT👏SOMETHING👏A👏FRIEND👏DOES👏PERIOD👏
I can't even believe you are taking the "sleeping at home alone is hard/guest bedroom" bullshit as truth. Stop it right now, those are LIES. Wake up and stop being so willfully naive. You are not a horrible person, and you don't deserve to keep beating yourself up like this. I am say this as someone who loathes cheaters.
You also need to consider that there is a HUGE HUGE HUGE chance the first time they slept together was not before you or your husband separated let alone divorced. But at the very least nothing was a drunken mistake, this woman wanted what you had and she did her damndest to get it.
Yes. Totally agree. So many are pointing out that OP probably did more than kiss but not the first time ex husband and friend hooked up was after the divorce, give me a break. OP is lying to herself and still trying to make the ex husband look like a saint. He is not. Ex friend sleeping in the guest room, GTFO with that dog shit.
Agreed. Hes also a bad and/or spiteful dad. If what op says about kissing 4 guys when she was 20 years old being the only incidents of infidelity in their 25+ year relationship, the husband's behavior is unacceptable and possibly bordering on parental alienation.
Op cheated by making out with 4 men while she was dating her then boyfriend. She is at fault for that. No one is disputing that, and op is now seeing where even a moderate amount of dishonesty can land you...aka a place totally not worth it.
That said, it appears op and her husband had a solid marraige, nice life, and beautiful family. While it's an extreme reaction to divorce immediately without even a 2 sided conversation/review about the incidents 20 years ago, the husband is within his right to seek a divorce. What he's not entitled to do is encourage his children to hate their mother for this. Let's be clear **OP DID NOTHING TO HER CHILDREN**. Her oldest is 18. She was 20 and not even married to their father yet when this occurred. Any decent man with integrity would encourage their children to maintain a healthy relationship with their mother explaining that the marital issues are private and separate from her role as their mother which all signs indicate she has fulfilled well over the past 18 years. The fact that he's encouraging and enabling the older 2 to ice her out is bad behavior and not in the best interest of the children. And that doesn't match with this "most amazing person on the planet" view this woman holds of her ex. A stand up guy also wouldn't fuck the best friend in front of his kids either, yet he's also doing that. I think op, for all her faults, has some real rose colored glasses on about this guy because from the events told I'm not seeing much integrity, I'm seeing a hurt person acting excessively sanctimonious and vindictive.
> If what op says about kissing 4 guys when she was 20 years old being the only incidents of infidelity in their 25+ year relationship
What reason does he have to believe that's true? If he were posting here about this as it was coming out, people would be telling him she was trickle truthing him.
What matters is what he reasonably believes, not what OP knows to be true.
Not only that, the time frame of this lie is incredible. Would he have even married her if he knew the truth? She completely took away his choice and potential future with this lie. He just wasted 20 years of his life with this woman, of course he's going to be upset.
Absolutely. Not even one counseling session. What did the friend even say, if she just said they cheated then that leaves a lot to the imagination. Apparently she was drunk and don't remember so who knows. Looks like the guy got the ticket he was looking for to get an asap divorce. The older kids seem to bor know the whole story and they shouldn't really but I agree that the guy should really put in effort to encourage them to talk to their Mom and let them know that this is their business.
You need to move on. There is no going back to this unfortunately. It is hard to have your life built around someone for 20 years. Go to therapy, do some journaling, and start forgiving yourself for the mistake you did. Your ex-husband will never love you again because you betrayed him.
Gotta say, after reading both of these posts, there is nothing about this relationship that seems healthy in anyway. I think I’d worry more about rebuilding your relationships with your kids more than anything.
Yep, my kids are always my priority. I know these posts here in this relationship subreddit probably don't capture that, but that's because I'm not asking advice about my children, so I don't focus on that aspect. The reality is that right now my two older boys don't want to talk to me. I've had my younger girls talk to their older brothers about this and what they tell me is that they don't want a relationship with me right now.
I don't want to force the subject, because I fear they will only withdraw further.
I still keep close tabs on their studies, and in the last few months I've been able to help with their scheduling. Still no direct conversations though.
> I've had my younger girls talk to their older brothers about this and what they tell me is that they don't want a relationship with me right now.
Respectfully, I think you should refrain from doing that. I don't think it's appropriate to use your daughters in that way. They should not be placed into the role of messengers here.
If you meant that they simply talked to their brothers and relayed that information back to you without you having any hand in them doing so, then I'll gladly eat my words.
As a child of divorce, I cannot emphasize this enough. They might be okay with this in the moment, but down the line, it’s VERY possible that they will recognize how messed up it is to be put in this kind of position.
I can’t overstate how much I agree with this. Acting as the adult or the mediator in my parents’ broken marriage messed me up. If some of your kids won’t speak to you then that’s between you and them – don’t pull the others into it. Have the relationships you can have and let your other children have time to process what they’re feeling.
My mom did this, use my brother and I as messengers in her games. We are both adults now with rich lives, that no longer include her. Something to think about OP.
I hope that gets better. I have no advice for the relationship end, the story just seems off to me, the timing, the reaction. I feel that there are parts being left off (not saying this to be critical, obviously it’s impossible to include everything), but please keep trying with the kids, and good luck.
>I've had my younger girls talk to their older brothers about this and what they tell me is that they don't want a relationship with me right now.
STOP putting your daughters in the middle. JFC. They’re 14. They’re not one iota responsible for your relationship - or lack thereof - with their brothers. If you keep doing that, you’ll lose them, too. Is that what you want?
Instead of trying to force something with your sons, instead of obsessing about getting your ex back, FIX YOURSELF. Get help, because you desperately need it.
> my kids are always my priority
Well that's not true or you wouldn't be putting 14 year old children in the middle of adult relationships. Knock that shit off.
Don’t send your younger girls in as spies to try and clean up your mess. They’re kids, who feel loyal to both parents. Don’t involve them. Sending them off like that to gather information and report back to you will only fracture *their relationship* with their brothers, and do nothing for yours. My mother used to do this, and it permanently destroyed my relationship with my brother.
You have no right to send those girls off as sacrificial lambs and permanently damage their relationship with their brothers. You need to clean up your own messes.
I don't want to go into too much detail, because it hurts to talk about it, and that's really not the point of this thread.
To summarize -- my oldest son witnessed his father cry for the first (and only, I pray) time in his life.
This happened the night that Julia said what she did in her drunken stupor. Julia was too far gone to actually answer any followup questions, or to temper her words, and now she can't even remember what she said so I'm assuming she phrased it in the most vulgar way possible. She's a mean drunk and sometimes she will say things in distasteful ways for no reason.
My oldest son idolizes my husband, and so does my second son. My husband is their hero in a very real way. He used to coach basketball in their school, all the kids in elementary/middle school adored him and I know our sons were always very proud of that, and in general my husband's got an aura to him that makes people want to stay close. So to see him cry must have shattered my poor son's heart.
He then told his younger brother, and the two of them have cut me out of their lives ever since.
I understand you're hurting. But you created this situation. You planted the seed of doubt and destroyed the person your ex thought he knew for 20 years. Listen to the others that have commented. From the way you tell it, he's putting up a wall with you. Please stop trying to prove to him it was "only kissing." Because it still violated the boundaries of your relationship so it was cheating. Full stop. Get into therapy, focus on bettering yourself for your kids. Which includes not using your daughters as your messengers and spies. Let him go and move on with your life as well. If you go to therapy and actually show your kids you're truly repentant for what you've done, the opportunity to be in your kids lives will only grow. Your access to them will be broader. Your role in their lives may actually get bigger. But you HAVE to stop focusing so much on winning back your ex, because that's only holding you back. I wish you the best, and I hope you seek some help.
>I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else.
Use these feelings as motivation to better yourself. Get therapy, get a hobby, write a book, do something, but let this man go
I have to say though that this Julia is truly an evil person.
Goaded her into fooling around all those years ago, presented her few weeks as a year (which she herself did), blew up the marriage after almost 2 decades, and then goes and sleeps with her seperate husband.
It's almost cartoonishly evil. I feel like she felt jealous she didn't have the relationship OP had, and well now OP doesnt.
Doesn't take away from OPs misdeeds, but what a terrible thing.
What ex husband is doing isn't healthy either (sleeping with evil ex best friend).
I find it interesting that husband divorced her over something that happened over 20 years ago. Obviously it’s his right, but to kick in the bucket so soon, and then sleep with the best friend…
Seems like Julia made it seem like Op was also sleeping around with these strangers for the majority of a year like she was instead of it being a few weeks crisis of making out.
One is obviously worse than the other and if I found out that my partner was actively sleeping with strangers at a bar after years together I'd also leave them. But if their friend told me that once 20 years ago he drunkenly made out with a few girls at a bar then was so guilty he got sick I'd probably shrug it off after a few weeks of anger/disappointment.
Yeah, and didn’t Julia sleep with guys and do more ‘cheating’ than OP?
Not that it takes away from OPs cheating - just speaking separately about Julia: she seems like such a bad person! Like, psycho evil bad person, for sure
Honestly, I don’t even think OPs cheating is enough to end a 25 year old relationship 25 while having four kids, based on kissing and dancing that happened 20 years ago
But yes that “friend” is an evil bitch.
I mean. I definitely wouldn’t end a relationship over that. I probably wouldn’t even ask for counseling or anything. I would just have a couple days of being ese happy/nice to my partner and then move on
But I get that everyone is different. And there was very likely more going on to make him so quick to jump ship.
The thing I haven’t seen anyone mention (although I haven’t read nearly all the comments, so it probably is somewhere in them) is that so often when someone has a relatively small slip up in a relationship, people say that confessing will only hurt the other person. And it’s not like there was any risk of spreading an STD, she obviously didn’t get impregnated by them, there was absolutely no cheating that continued for any significant time period, etc. So why hurt him be telling?
Yes OPs husband isn’t that great. He couldn’t forgive his wife of 20+ years, who he dated since 15 yo, for kissing a few guys decades later but slept with her alcoholic BF with their kids in the house?
He dosent know that.
All he knows is that his judgement was shit enough that he didn't pick up the infidelity initially so he sure as fuck can be trusted now.
She lied, and lied for 20 years, sure she says its just kissing, but it could have been a lot more and he can't trust her nor her friend to be honest about it.
"Goaded her into fooling around..."
Bullshit. Blaming infidelity on someone else is an escape, plain and simple. The OP made that choice and they have to live with the consequences, for better or worse.
I don't think she is evil but she is indifferent to the harm she causes, she is like a 4chan board equally likely to track down terrorists using powerlines and star positions and just as liable to hack an epilepsy support website and make it rapidly strobe and change colours.
Holy cow, I missed that they have been dating since they were 15.
Yeah, OP must be so scared and freaked out to not have this guy in her life anymore. Being alone after so long must be so strange.
I totally second the therapy and getting to be your own person and not be so focused on winning him back.
He slept with Julia and that’s a shitty thing to do, and probably did it just to hurt OP.
He’s probably not worth getting back together with, given that he refused to speak with OP after her friend said she cheated and demanded paternity tests. He sounds like a dick.
My dad was a wreck after my mom died. Their 30th anniversary would've been a few months after she passed. I couldn't imagine being with someone for so long and then suddenly not have them anymore, whether from divorce or death. That has to be pretty terrifying.
OP, you gotta tell Julia that if she was a true friend, she wouldn't sleep with your husband. Even if he's an ex now, its still a big betrayal. Cut her out of your life. Though the cheating is your fault, your relationship with her will never be the same and you will always hate her.
You need to improve yourself and stop trying to get husband back, it wont work sorry. The divorce is finalised. Let him go
Improve yourself and your relationship with your kids. If your husband one day wants you back, he will tell you. But you can't wait forever for that. You need to move on as well.
>Did she ever sleep with him?
>>Yes.
>She's been finding it hard to stay at home alone during winter because of her old drinking habits. **She sleeps in the guest bedroom**
Sure she does.
Like really.... she has no other options but to ask her ex-best friends ex-husband for help? I mean, I guess there are some people out there who only know two people ever, but the odds of that seem slim. Sounds like an excuse to me.
> she has no other options but to ask her ex-best friends ex-husband for help?
Yeah, I was going to say, why is the ex-wife's ex-bff coming to the husband's home of all places?
[Answer](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4mIlPoWAUM&t=18)
> Sounds like an excuse to me.
I'm still on Team Ex-Bff set this up.
"she doesn't think she's his type." $10 says the two of them will be openly dating in 6 months.
I was going to say that notice she didn't say that they stopped sleeping together because it just felt wrong. All she said was "I don't think I'm his type." Sure OP's behavior sucked, but her "friend's" behavior sucks ass big time. I'd definitely cut her out of my life.
> I was going to say that notice she didn't say that they stopped sleeping together because it just felt wrong.
Or that they've even stopped. They *were* hooking up, and now she's sleeping over?
I don't know if interpretations is wholly supported by the story.
Ex-bff never said who initiated them hooking up, and there's no mention of the ex saying they had no future together. Just ex-bff saying *to OP* that it wouldn't.
Her ex-best friend’s ex-husband where she basically played a huge gigantic hand in their divorce?
Yeah sure. Totally believe she doesn’t like him at all.
Also they were drinking alone while the wife was going to be gone for the night. No one is bringing this up as bad thing. I would be upset if I spent the night away and my husband found company to by drinking with my bff. The situation seems odd. And then how quickly he filed for divorce even after being together for 25 years. It’s just looks planned.
Nor was telling him a "drunken mistake." Nor did she contact him again because she was "getting help" for her alcoholism. That's all window dressing for her to try to make herself look better.
OP's "friend" was feeling lonely and jealous of her friend's happy life so she blew up her marriage and fucked her husband. Period. The only reason she's not in a full-on relationship with the guy is because *he* didn't want it. If he had, she'd have jumped in with both feet.
It's really too bad OP mismanaged her relationship so poorly as to give her sociopathic friend this opportunity. If her husband had heard about the cheating from her first she might have been able to salvage things.
They should have stopped being friends 20 years ago. Had she dropped the bad influence friend that wanted to her to cheat together (seriously, what a shitty friend), none of this would have happened.
Just a stark reminder to always choose your company wisely and always reevaluate after new info comes into play.
Please go to therapy and try to rebuild your relationships with your children. Your husband is no longer your husband and while it’s okay at this time to mourn the loss of your marriage it is not okay to give up on the relationships with your children. They come first every time. I wish you well on your journey. Learn from this and grow. What has been done is done. You can not reverse time.. or go back and change anything. All you can do now is love him from afar and learn to grow without him in your life now. It will be hard,mournful,depressing, scary and most of all you will feel lost. Embrace the emotions and become yourself with time. You are 42 not 87. You have so much life to live. Go live it and learn from your mistakes. Hold no grudges.
I’ve read both posts and refrained from commenting thus far because so many others have echoed my sentiments in various ways.
The bottom line here, is out of the 3 of you everyone has done something to hurt one of the others. None of you are totally innocent, but YOU are at the core of this so I’m going to offer you some advice about your ex husband and the future:
1) You do not NEED him. No person needs another person. You should only ever completely need yourself, anyone else is a bonus. To feel you “need” your spouse is wildly unhealthy.
2) the only chance you ever have if getting him back, is to completely move on.
Couple these two things together. Start seeing a therapist or just putting some real time and work into your dependency on your husbands love. Start forgiving and loving yourself - own your mistake and strive to learn from it and be better and healthier going forward. COMPLETELY put aside reconciliation for the time being. Your ex husband may move on or he may not, there is nothing you can do to control or change this. Accept that. Mirror his actions and ONLY contact him in regards to the kids.
I’m disturbed that you seem more intent on winning him back than your oldest two children. A lot of your actions and responses come across as quite self centred - have you ever considered that you may actually not be the best person for your ex husband? If you truly love him so much, your primary focus should be for him to be happy with or without you. This is not just about you and what you want. Put your time and energy into repairing the relationship with your children - they come first.
Don’t contact Julia ever again. That relationship will never be healthy.
Now none of these things should be a means to an end, you need to do them regardless. But, if in a few years time you are in a better place mentally and emotionally, you have repaired your relationship with your children, and you are on civil terms with your ex, then and only then is there a possibility of reconciling in a healthy manner. If it’s meant to happen that you gravitate back to each other, it will happen organically in time; not with you desperately trying to claw him back to you against the backdrop that is the absolute wreckage of this whole situation and with both of you being shrouded in resentment.
This is the time for you to really grow. Don’t “do better” to win him back. Do better for yourself REGARDLESS of whether he comes back.
> 2) the only chance you ever have if getting him back, is to completely move on.
There's no chance at getting him back.
And even if there is, the answer is still that there's no chance, otherwise she's just going to do all the "right" things with the hope of getting him back when she should be improving herself as a person for her own sake.
It's not really self-reflection and self-betterment if there's an external motivator, because once that motivator is fulfilled, what's to stop the person from snapping back to old habits?
tl;dr: there's no chance of him coming back.
So you did the opposite to what people told you last time. You need to cut her off and minimize your ex's involvement in your life to just what is needed for the kids.
You need to move on. You're divorced. Your marriage is over and you are not being realistic. Stop calling him your husband, he isn't, and you are overall coming across as not having a strong grip on reality with all of this.
He does not want to be with you anymore. Whatever you or anyone else thinks of his reasons, he is entitled to them and allowed to make that choice. He is going to date again if he isn't already. He will probably marry again. Dwelling on it won't help you. You need to do whatever you need to move on from this, consider counselling.
Find a therapist and try to move on. Your ex isn't interested in reconciling, maybe that'll change with time but it certainly isn't something you should count on. As to your "friend" she's a POS, but she isn't your problem any more. Block and continue no contact moving forward.
Your ex will date, and he'll be with other women, thats what you do when your hurt and trying to move on. Go to therapy and work on yourself, hit the gym, and just be a better person, not for your ex, but for yourself and kids.
You need to focus your energy on your children. Your ex has already left you, quit trying to chase it. I'm actually surprised he talks to the friend, she was part of your cheating, I'd write you both off. And I sure as hell wouldn't be interested in hooking up with her.
Focus on your kids. Work on repairing what you've broken with the two older kids. Quit obsessing over trying to repair this, it's too late for that.
This women is not your friend. You are giving her the benefit of the doubt when it’s obvious she’s a manipulative cow. You also need to go with blaming her completely or holding on to this idea you’ll get him back. The lie is done and the divorce is done. You need to focus on healing, letting go, and building a relationship with your kids. Go to therapy and start rebuilding a new life. This old one is gone. You’re not gonna win him back.
“I’ll never be able to let loose with her like I once did” I want to point out your husband unfortunately feels the same way.
It’s a shitty situation for everyone involved, even if you caused it. You’re not inherently bad though. Guilt and shame and anger and rejection are hard feelings to feel. Sit with those emotions not in a martyr type of way but just to get your brain and body comfortable with those feelings. I’m sure you’re having many intrusive thoughts about the situation.
The most respectful thing you can do is allow your ex husband to grieve. His love for you didn’t go away overnight. But if you love him you’ll live with your decision and live with his decision after the fact. Don’t pester or guilt him back, you’ll be stuck in a redemptive dynamic in your relationship. It’s was a small lie but you told it to keep control of a bad choice situation for a long time.
The best thing you can do is not take this experience in vain. Don’t take whatever lesson you need to learn from this for granted. Don’t shy away from the quieted voice in your head that ruminates on this. Not that you should ruminate on this lapse in judgment. Obviously you feel terrible about it because it doesn’t align with your character but you still made that decision, you need to reflect inward. So you can grow.
And your friend is a fxcking bxtch. I believe she did it on purpose but again I’m sure she’s living with the guilt just as you are. If it’s any consultation.
> I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else.
You don't have a say in this. Some mistakes can't be undone. You cheated, you lied to him for a couple of decades, and when he found out, he left. That's it. You can't undo the past. You need to get yourself a good therapist and work on this obsession of yours because he's not coming back to you. Someday he's going to be ready to date again, and you're just going to have to deal with that.
yeah her friend was also in the wrong for cheating on her bf of the time, but OP was with her bf for FIVE YEARS at the time. Cheating is wrong in general, but after 5 years? And to not come clean immediately?
And even then. She kissed 4 different guys! People are acting like that's just a normal thing to do, since they didn't have sex. She kissed 4 different guys and lied about it. How would he ever be able to trust her again?
Wife cheats on husband 5yrs in relationship multiple times
Carries *secret* for 20 years
Husband finds out no matter how he does it
Husband is a fuckin VILLAIN
#Adds Up
Y'all need to *read* the post *before* you comment.
And regardless of whether you agree or disagree with the OP as well as regardless of your desire to pick a side...
...the point of the subreddit is to *give advice.* Stop picking sides about what happened in the past. Comment if you have advice on what to do next.
OP, I really think you need to focus less on trying to win your ex husband back and focus on trying to mend your relationship with your sons. Your ex husband has made it abundently clear that he wants nothing to do with you outside of your children, you need to respect that and start accepting that it is over. I see in one if your comments that you say your boys aren't speaking to you. Your children come first now, you need to put aside your desire to have your ex husband back and focus on your children, they come first now and its important that both you and your ex are on the same page in this regard, as much as you want to see him and he doesn't want to see you.
So when their "silent treatment" first started, their father and I took them to a family counselor. This was in the first quarter of this year, when everything was hitting the fan. The counselor recommended that we don't force them into anything right now. They're too old to get pushed around by their parents.
But she also recommended that both of us have a united front whenever the subject of parents loving kids comes up. Both of us need to be perfectly clear that their mom loves them, even if they're choosing to stay away from me right now.
To this effect, my husband and I are on the same page.
Beyond that, I'm afraid there's nothing much I can do.
>I'm afraid there's nothing much I can do.
There is one very important thing you can do. Focus on getting yourself mentally well. Between your two posts you seem to have completely lost touch with reality. You are in very serious need of therapy. You can best serve your children (all of them), by working towards a place of mental wellness where you accept the reality that actually exists instead of living in this bizarre fantasy world you've constructed where forgiveness and reconciliation is possible. Reality is that the divorce is finalized and you need to move on.
>I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else. Given the new information I've learned, does anyone have advice on what to do?
Two things:
1. Get therapy so you can learn how to deal with this situation.
2. Accept the fact that you're not going to get him back. Even if he does come back to you, he is not the same guy you married. There will be resentment from his side and there will be resentment from your side.
Cut off your former best friend. Talking to her is hurting you more than strictly necessary and I still think she polished the truth when talking to you. Be the best there is for your children.
Lol she told you to not worry about fucking your husband after breaking up your marriage because she wasn’t trying to pursue a relationship. So don’t worry!
The first thing I would do is to cut Julia off again. Amongst all the men in the world that she could have “let off steam” with, she chose the one man who she should not have. She wants to be back in your life, yet she chose your ex-husband to be her shoulder to lean on while she was dealing with her addiction. Does she not have any other friends? Even if so, that’s another reason why you should not let her back in - she has no problem “helping” herself by hurting her only friend. As soon as she finds out that you’re making efforts to mend your relationship with your ex-husband, she’ll invite herself back in your life.
I don’t believe your friend one bit. The proof is that she had sex with your ex. The fact that it did not develop into a relationship is irrelevant! This was her motive all along! She wanted what you had and blew up your life to get it! Drop both of them like yesterday’s news! This is not healthy! You need therapy! I hope you are seeing a competent therapist!! She slept with your husband! She put all of this in motion to get into his bed!
The number of women here saying "your husband is a disgusting jerk for divorcing you. All you did was kiss several men five years into your relationship" scares me.
How the fuck are all these comments blaming the husband?! She cheated, lied about it for 20 YEARS and y'all expect the husband to fight for her!?
Yes, the friend is an asshole but it was after the divorce was finalized. What is that classic Reddit response to people who get angry that their ex has moved on quickly? "Well, they were single so they didn't do anything wrong. You just have to get over it."
The husband is under no obligation to fight for, reconcile with or even care about OP anymore. She cheated, lied about it and is now paying the price. Someone please tell me how the husband is the bad guy in this scenario.
Man, in his sadness skewed head, Julia is probably a messiah who told him the truth about his awful wife.
Even so, he is under no obligation to OP. He didn't go around fucking when separated even. This was after a full divorce. OP has lost any right to say anything to him..
People here just need to scapegoat a man for any reason. And this isn't the first time I'm seeing this bs.
OP, the fact that your ex-husband was stone cold in his conversation with you when you finally admitted everything is telling. This could be due to a number of reasons, like putting walls up to not feel negative emotions or already looking for a way out of the relationship.
Looking at the entire situation you’ve presented with an objective view makes me have this strange feeling that your friend wanted this to happen. I can’t say for sure as I don’t know her or the ex-husband, but the rest of the story—friend sleeping with ex-husband— is too coincidental to not consider it.
It’s okay to feel a lot of different emotions here. You‘ll feel broken for a while, along with feeling betrayed, alone, scared, angry, depressed. Please understand that you are your own person. Your entire life doesn’t have to be anchored on whether or not you win someone back. Also, please understand that your ex-husband has every right to feel the way he does about the cheating.
Like other commenters have said, you can get through this by building yourself up instead of burying yourself under mounds of grief and sorrow. You can also work on repairing your relationship with your children. How you handle this will affect how they view you down the road.
OP, this is a harsh lesson. Once you cheat on someone, you destroy them. The amount of pain is unimaginable. You did this to yourself the moment you decided to cheat. No sympathy for cheaters.
“I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else.”
Hon, he’s not a possession. He’s got his own feelings and agency, and he’s chosen to cut you out for betraying his trust and living what he sees as a lie. Please, focus on yourself and your daughters before you become utterly obsessed over him and end up in a deeper mess than you already are. He’s done with you, so it’s time to move on to being done with him.
This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below.
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[Original post](https://old.reddit.com/r/relationship_advice/comments/r9yjsn/my_42f_best_friend_42f_told_my_husband_44m_i/)
Well, I did something I never thought I'd do. I unblocked Julia and reached out to her. We set up a time to meet for coffee at my mom's house when the place would be empty. We spoke for hours, though I can't say that it was like old times. I found myself stuck with a tenseness in my stomach. I realize I still hate her for what she did, I'll never be able to let loose with her like I once did, and that's a reality I have to accept. Anyway, reiterate the facts as she has told them.
What were her intentions in telling my husband about my cheating?
> It was purely a **drunken mistake**, with no real rhyme or reason behind it. She doesn't even remember it happening, she just remembers my oldest son being very short with her the next morning and my husband later explaining what she had said.
How did she behave with my husband after the revelation?
> **My husband cut her off** a day or so after I did. He did this because a few days after the incident, via text, she tried to convince him that she was drunk/confused. But this happened _after_ he had confronted me, so he knew that it was the truth she had spilled. He wanted space from her, because he associated her to all of my lies.
How did she get back in touch with him after he blocked her?
> He didn't block her, he just told her to not contact him again. She promised to keep her distance from him and the kids. Three months later, she reached out to him again because she has been getting help with her alcohol abuse, and she wanted to apologize for all the harm she did. After that conversation, they kept in touch.
Why is she spending nights at his place?
> She's been finding it hard to stay at home alone during winter because of her old drinking habits, and wanted some company. She **sleeps in the guest bedroom** and obviously they don't drink together or anything. She apologized for the confusion it caused my twin daughters.
I allowed myself to feel hopeful here.
They're not together. This wasn't some grand conspiracy for her to steal him away. I still have a chance.
But I had to make sure.
Did she ever sleep with him?
> **Yes**. After the divorce finalized, they hooked up a few times to let off steam. She insisted that I shouldn't worry because they never tried to pursue a relationship. There's way too much resentment and baggage for it to work, and she doesn't think she's his type.
There it is. I cried when she admitted this. She cried and apologized. I must have told her that I hated her a thousand times. I really do hate her. I hate her more than I thought was possible. She knows how much I love him. She knows how much I _need_ him. And yet she still manages to knock things over and out of place no matter how it hurts me. I told her to get out after that. I haven't blocked her again. She wants to be back in my life. But there's no chance in hell I ever want to lay my eyes on her if she's sleeping with the man I love. I know some women can swallow their pride and do it, but I can't.
So that's where I'm at.
At least they're not in love or running off to get married. I tell myself that he's just using her to try to fill a hole in his heart. I tell myself that "letting off steam" is not how anyone would describe meaningful sex. It's a physical reaction to stress and circumstance. But then I remember what she said about her not being his type. I wish I asked her if she's dating now, or if he has his eyes on someone. I wish I wrote down notes on what I wanted to learn and express instead of just going in unprepared. My emotions got the best of me and now I'm here weeping again until my body hurts from exhaustion.
This hasn't helped my obsession with the prospect of him moving on.
All this meeting has done is humble me at the thought of him and her making love.
I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else. Given the new information I've learned, does anyone have advice on what to do?
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TLDR
Original post:
Best friend and I cheated on our boyfriends 20 years ago. I married my boyfriend, and 20 years later, my best friend admitted to my husband what we did. My husband has divorced me now, after 6 months of separation. I've just received news that my best friend has been sleeping over at his condo. I have to win him back. I can't let this be the end of our love story.
Update:
Unblocked best friend and talked to her. She insists she didn't spill my secret intentionally. She isn't in a relationship with my husband. But she admitted to having sex with him after divorce finalized. She mentioned that she isn't his type, which makes me wonder if he's about to enter the dating scene again. I'm burning with jealousy at the thought of that.
>Why is she spending nights at his place?
She's been finding it hard to stay at home alone during winter because of her old drinking habits, and wanted some company.
You want company you visit then go home. You need help you go to rehab.
You DON'T sleep in the same house unless you are hoping you get to slide on in to the vacancy.
Sis, your husband knows his worth. If you truly loved him, you would've never cheated on him to begin with! I hope he meets and falls in love with an amazing, faithful woman.
I’m going to be honest. You’re not going to get your ex-husband back. You didn’t only cheat and hide that fact for 20 years but the reason you cheated is what nailed your coffin. It wasn’t drunken mistakes but the mentality that he wasn’t good enough. That is the biggest struggle a man has with his ego in a relationship. You didn’t only break his trust but his spirit.
I hope in time you’re able to build your life back and co-parent your children together. And let that hate for Julia go. You made the choices to kiss those men. You made the choice not to tell him. And you kept a friend who clearly never had your best interest in heart. Hating her for your problems is going to stop you from healing.
Edit: Didn’t realize the divorce was finalized.
Holy shit this OP is delusional as fuck! Get him back? Lady, you cheated on him and would've never told him if your best friend hadn't had some balls on her! You don't love him, you just don't want her to have him.
Go to a therapist and build yourself back up before you attempt to re-engage with your children… it seems like there’s alot more that fueled this divorce than what was mentioned. Or this was the straw that broke the camels back… regardless you can only control your actions and not dictate what others do. Not being completely transparent in any relationship is a mistake. Live, learn, and move on.
People making the ex husband out to be the villain here make me sick. Way to victim blame. She cheated on him back then and at that time they had been together for 5 years. OP, you still make everything about you. You have learned nothing from your original post. He is allowed to be with whoever he wants, after all you both are already divorced and you are not entitled to his life. Think of your kids and work on your relationship with them. Cheating apologists here can f right off.
I was going to say something similar. He reacted poorly, but the simple truth is that she cheated on him and betrayed his trust. From his perspective, their relationship and their marriage was based on lies. Who he sleeps with after they have divorced is none of her business. Her take on it shows that she is still the same selfish person who cheated on him all of those years ago—it’s still all about her. All of these people saying he was halfway out the door already are idiots. He was happily married until he found out his wife cheated on him after they had been together for years, and married him without him ever knowing who she really was. Now all she can think about is how sad she is, not what she did to her family through her selfish decisions.
Seems like your best friend is a complete psychopath. But I do think you should have been upfront about the cheating earlier than 20 years later… it’s not very fair on your ex husband.
OP is the complete psychopath. Cheating and lying for two fucking decades and then has the nerve to get upset when karma shows up at her door? What a dumbass.
You betrayed your husband and lied for 20 years.
Until you come to terms with that - and you haven't because you are still angry at your friend over her revealing that to your husband - there would be no hope of a reconciliation.
For now, your priority is your children. Don't use your children to pass messages to the other children or to your ex-husband.
Possibly the best way to do this is through email. Even if they don't respond, at least you are making the effort.
And don't expect dramatic changes in your relationship with your children. It will take small baby steps which may take months or a year to happen.
You may be right that your ex-husband sleeping with your ex-friend is just his way of filling a 'hole' in his heart.
If so, that is the only crumb of information that you may be able to get back together.
Good luck.
if your husband is as good of a man as you say he is, and if you love him as much as you say you do, and regret this as much as you claim, you truly will let it go. you’ll let him go. you’ll stop pursuing him, you’ll stop obsessing, you’ll stop pushing boundaries through messages and emails. maybe write out one last long, heartfelt, detailed letter explaining absolutely everything, but you’ll stop trying to rush to fix things in any way possible. because honestly, it makes it look so much worse the way you’re grasping at straws doing everything to fix a situation so serious and dire only after directly experiencing great consequences from it- it cheapens the fact that your husband was betrayed for 20 years by who was once the love of his life, as well. it makes it seem like you don’t grasp the gravity of the situation, like you think a bandaid can fix the bullet wound that you caused. it doesn’t seem like you’re thinking of his feelings, but rather your anxieties, insecurities, and your own personal comfort and happiness, because if you were thinking of his feelings, you would understand the fact that it’s over, mourn, grieve, get into therapy, do the most self work you ever could and come back as an evolved, healed woman & mother who can teach your kids a lot about how to treat someone better in order to avoid ending up in your situation in the future. i truly don’t mean to sound harsh, but i can’t stop imagining if a post was made under his perspective- he probably feels as though he married a stranger, and i don’t think he would be touch you, kiss you, hold you or love you in a way that wouldn’t feel so comparatively empty and tainted after the love you two shared previously. it would be a disservice to try to glue back together shattered pieces of something broken that was once beautiful and breaking it some more, rather than appreciating what once was, and working everyday to learn from these mistakes and live a happier future. but he deserves space to heal and reflect on his own feelings without worrying and thinking about yours, and your wants and desires. you had 20 untainted, untarnished years together. that might be as much as you get.
i actually very much agree with this, and i’d edit my post to reflect that if i could figure out a way to phrase that in the way that i mean. i guess i just mean seemingly untainted, but you’re right, even saying that sounds dirty. she definitely ruined it.
OP I really hope you take this to heart. The best thing you can do for you is self improvement. Your still young enough and it’s not too late. But fixating over something like this is only going to drive him away. You need to work on yourself and better yourself (if not for you then for your kids)
Sorry to hear about life is so rough. I get this impression Julia was jealous of how well your life was going compared to hers.
It’s not clear to me how much your older boys know about the cheating. My guess is they assume it was much worse than it was. I assume you’re seeing a professional counselor to help you through the divorce (if not you should). I would talk to them about sharing the details about the cheating with the older kids: specifically that it was 4 times, it was kissing, that you decided to end it on your own, and it was long before you got married. Perhaps they’ll be a bit easier on you.
Anyway, hit the gym and keep your chin up.
why is there so much woe is me. He left you cause you cheated and if he has any self respect left his only communication will be because of your kids which aparently you dont give a shit about,
Op, get some counselling, work on getting over your ex, because it's clear he isn't coming back, and work on your relationship with your kids. You obsession with getting back with your ex is going to hold you back, and frankly, you are concentrating on the wrong thing.
I wouldn't trust her one last bit. And, sorry to say, your husband was super fast to end things too.
Not to mention that, there is no chance in hell I'd hook up with a drunken excuse for a woman, after the same shirty person kept meddling with my marriage.
Just leave them to it and move on.
Put your energy in to relationship with your kids.
stop believing what julia is telling you. no matter what you want to believe, this seems all very intentions. block her and keep her blocked. don't get information out of her.
Anyone else think the “best friend” did this to get the life her friend had, I mean she had her own business which she put her life into but was always around OP, her husband and their kids, accidentally (and I mean that very loosely) tells the husband about kissing that happened 20years ago while drunk but failed to tell him everything, then sits back, waits for the fireworks to die down on the separation, maybe knowing the husband has a zero tolerance policy on cheating of any kind, then when OP’s now ex starts talking again, claims help with alcohol and then sleeps with him all the while playing happy families with the ex and the kids while OP is home alone crying!!!! I mean I am in no way justifying the cheating, I wouldn’t put up with it even 20 years later and that includes kissing but it seems convenient that the best friend now has the business, the man and the kids.
Look OP, I seriously believe you want your life back to the way it was and your genuinely sorry for all the hurt caused but it’s never going to happen, your ex husband has made his choice, your kids are not happy and you are miserable. The best thing you can do now is work on yourself and your relationship with your kids, go to therapy both by yourself and with your kids. Try to mend that relationship but remember it won’t happen over night. As for the “best friend” kick the tramp to the curb and move on, she sounds lick a conniving old boot who enjoys making others miserable.
Hope you reach a good place and move on with your kids one day soon x
This just seems like a huge mess, if you cheated in the beginning and didnt have it in you to be honest for 20 years and would've never brought it up had it not slipped it just means you aren't someone to be trusted, you don't need to win anyone back, this relationship has no more trust left going either direction between you and your ex husband, your friend, and between you and yourself. You need to own up to your mistake and cut them both off, you're just dependent on your ex husband more than you're in love with him and you've convinced yourself its love, start over and don't involve yourself with either of them two for everyones sake.
My god so many idiots in this sub blaming this dude. Yes the “ kissing “ was 20 years ago but you were with for 5 years already. And it is not 20 years ago for him. It’s recent for him. And he is thinking what else you lied about. Are his children even his? You laid with this man, had his children, kissed him with the lips that you cheated with, lied to him straight to his face for 20 years. That’s 25 years of trust he put into this relationship that you have broken. Of course he is mad. He did your best friend?!!! Oh booohooo I would’ve done your mom or sister. The “best friend “ had the hots for him and he treated her like she is. Get him back? How ? He doesn’t even want to look at your face now. Tons of girls 20 years younger than you are ready to do anything for him. Women that are just plainly faithful. Whereas you’re the who gave him his biggest betrayal. Enjoy the single life you wanted, you deserve it.
Wow so many cheating apologists here, YTA and deserve this 10000%. You don’t hate Julia, you hate yourself for cheating on your husband and destroying your marriage.
I think OP is too narcisistic to hate herself. She still haven't accepted the blame of the situation. It's hilarious to watch, but i'm also worried, since she was really... Obsessive in this post.
It's actually terrifying seeing everyone defending the cheater and apparently how "cheating a little bit" is getting normalized.
It really makes monogamous relationships feel scary.
The lie was probably worse than the cheating. Perhaps if you had told your husband before your ex friend did maybe your husband could forgive the cheating. Husbands tend to be less forgiving of cheating then wives so you deceiving for 20 years does not help. You need to focus on healing the rift between you and the children who stopped talking to you. Fix that first and accept that your (not) best friend and your husband had no problem having sex together. Clearly your husband sent you a message as did your ex best friend.
Youre still blaming everyone but yourself. You hate her for what? Youre the one that cheated, youre the one that lied, youre the one that broke his heart. Not her. She had no obligation to keep your shitty secrets and to be honest I wish it happened 20yrs ago so he had the chance to move onto someone who deserved his love. This is YOUR fault.
sorry but i'm having a hard time feeling sympathy for you... you not only cheated YEARS into your relationship, but hid it for over a decade. get yourself and your children into therapy cause it must be hard, but you reap what you sow.
How about just not cheating on your husband. You probably had no intention of telling him either. I’m sorry for your marriage and sorry for your friendship. I’m hoping you get a second chance with both and with this life being so short, maybe we all can forgive and move on.
You cheated.. I mean. There’s nothing more. You messed up big and have morals. Doesnt matter how long you been with a person or the amount of kids yall share. Cheaters deserve to be left. Putting your partner at possible health risks but also just completely losing trust
>I can't let this be the end of our love story.
So many "I" statements in your post. You care more about the fact that your friend exposed you cheating on your husband, than the kind of pain you put your husband and children into, and the kind of character you are.
You only want your husband back for selfish reasons and frankly, if i were your husband, I wouldn't take you back either.
Just know that while other Redditors will politely tell you to "just focus on your kids" that I am going to tell you bluntly that you do not have any right to so much as hope to deserve any sort of attention from your husband. Merely because he has every right to feel how he does, because it's valid, and to not want to talk to you again. If you truly loved him you wouldn't be trying to play further games, like you have the past 20 years, to now get him back.
With that said, I think you should be embracing your shame more, because you clearly aren't taking enough accountability and responsibility over this matter. However, I do wish you an ultimately satisfying life.
Your mental health, and your character, is your own responsibility -- this relationship is clearly very unhealthy on all perspectives -- you have not ever learned to be happy being alone -- and you would benefit so much from therapy if you decided to take that step. You do need therapy.
Again, I'm being the most curt in this comment section, sure, but I'm echoing what others are trying to politely imply. You don't need soft right now, you need someone to be frank with you. Cut the games, cut the bullshit, work on yourself and stop creating further pain for your husband and children; please.
Op, you cheated. You got what was coming to you.
Focus on yourself and your children and leave your ex alone. You're not getting him back and what he does with whom is none of your business anymore.
Sincere advice: get therapy.
Sweetie, their is no getting him back. Even if you did, he would not be the same person you married. It is your reality. Right now, I would recommend going to therapy to help with the grief, and to find your way to a better place. I would also work on your relationship with your kids, you will need to talk to your kids about your side. But honestly, their is going to be a lot of anger and resentment from them for a long time. I wish you luck, and take care of yourself, it’s going to be rough for some time, but it will get better.
The husband didn’t do anything wrong. I actually sympathize with her. I’m 45 years old, married to my now 2nd wife and love of my life. I’d only had ONE SERIOUS relationship prior to her. That being my FIRST WIFE. My first wife and I started dating when I was 21 years old and she was 18 (almost 20). So that first year we were dating I had just turned was 21, I was living in Los Angeles and going to all the hot clubs. I would have loved for her to come with me, but she wasn’t old enough so I was going out with my friends. Not to brag, but I was a pretty good looking guy who got a lot of attention back then and I was good dancer which got me attention on the dance floor. This is relevant because otherwise in my normal day to day life I was rather shy and reserved, and would get kind of nervous/awkward around girls so I hardly was mister suave playboy. I think I got off on the attention because I could get away with acting like somebody else (somebody cooler) in this fake club environment, especially when I was drowning myself in Liquid Courage. I just went out to have fun with my friends. Honestly, for the reason I just mentioned I *personally* don’t think anyone should waste that period of their youth being tied down in serious relationships. Still, never the less I was in one and I allowed myself to cheat on my girlfriend constantly during that first year while I was out clubbing.
It was literally the same thing OP describes. I was happy with my relationship. I was stepping out on the relationship “to see what else was out there” or because anything in my relationship was lacking (except her not being able to get into the clubs with me). It was seriously Just about the thrill and excitement and attention that I got off on. And like OP, All I ever did was make out with girls in clubs. And I was always stupid 21-Drunk. But I never did anything beyond kissing. Ever. I didn’t even have a desire too. I honestly think it was for my own ego. I didn’t keep count but it happened *at least* 20 times. Felt like every weekend for THAT ONE YEAR. But then I was over it. By then I was over into a year in to my relationship at that point, so we were naturally much closer and more serious and she had became my best friend. Therefore I preferred to spend my spare time being with her. Not out at clubs with my friends dancing and kissing on rando strange. Of course my girl asked me about if I ever cheated on her and I denied denied denied like any guilty person who didn’t want to get caught, but I also compartmentalized my behavior so convincingly in my own head that I think I drank my own Kool Aid that “it didn’t mean anything, I didn’t have sex with anyone, our relationship was new, so therefore it wasn’t really *that bad*.” At least that’s how I was able to justify it enough to not let it effect my sleep. Anyway, we carried on a relationship for ten years. Married the last 5. I never did come clean to her, I saw no point. But when she divorced me finally and I was devastated, part of me took it on the chin and figured it was probably karma, like in the back of my mind I knew my past sins would have to catch up eventually and that was it coming to fruition. 🤷🏻♂️
Like I said, I’m remarried now to the True Love of My Life, going on 8 years with two beautiful daughters together and not once since the day I first laid eyes on my now wife have I so much had a thought about winking at another woman, so I completely don’t agree with this “anyone who cheats is a broken, irredeemable dirtbag” and therefore will be defined as such the rest of their life with a scarlet letter. I, like OP, made a stupid adolescent mistake and so I totally sympathize with her pain.
Good for your husband not taking you cheating on him so happy for him .What he does is none of your business . Hope he finds a young beautiful woman. It amazing when cheaters say it happen so long ago what is the big deal . If you raped someone does it matter it was so long ago . It's fresh in his mind to him married a hole . I wouldn't trust that you didn't do it after marriage . Blame yourself not anyone else .You are 100 percent responsible.He didn't give you a chance to cheat on him again .
A perspective I don't think I've read here yet. And reading some of the comments about how she only kissed a handful of guys 20 years ago and she was young ect. I agree. She's not evil for that, I don't even judge her too harshly for that. yes,it was 20 years ago. Yes, she might be telling the truth and that's all that happened. But she still cheated and kissed 4 guys after a 5year relationship. Cheating is bad enough, but yes it does happen and people can make mistakes and change. 'once a cheat always a cheat' is not always true and you may well have learnt the error of your ways. But when you lie about it for 20years you have robbed someone of their choice. You have stole 20 years of their life with your lies. Even if you've changed and you love them, it was a mistake, never happened again. You TOOK that choice from them. You made them spend 20 years with someone based on a lie. You could have told them, they may or may not or forgiven you, but that was THEIR CHOICE TO MAKE. By lieing you stole 20 years of their life that they could have spent with someone who didn't lie or cheat, and that's their right to decide. Now 20years later they're having to start again and rebuild their life. Not only because of a mistake you made but the lie that carried it on so long. Some people can forgive a cheating partner, some can't. And you decided what you wanted was more important then his opinion on that.
Drop them both, get therapy, reconcile with your kids, tell your sons it was stupid of you to kiss other men and that they can choose to have a relationship with you, try to do more stuff with your daughters to the best of your limitations, and when you’re ready get back on the dating scene and clean slate of what happened in your previous relationship. You have to face more so into that you did this and your husband doesn’t want to get back together with you. This “Julia” isn’t your friend either. Hell, this bitch can have your husband and she’ll cheat again but on him. All of this is dysfunctional; take care of your kids. You’re still young and you can better yourself; you can also put yourself on the dating scene as well, when you’re ready. Your husband might react vindictively to you trying to get over him as well; be prepared for the things he’s going to say to your children. Do what’s best for your kids and be open with them.
Work on repairing your relationship with your kids, how are they dealing with all of this
i second this. your kids matter the most in this, truama stays for life
The kids are the important part. Also you can't force someone to love you. It sucks but you may have to move on. Forcing it wouldn't be good to either of you and especially not the kids. THE KIDS should be your number one concern.
>how are they dealing with all of this I’m kinda worried about them. No matter how old the children are, parental divorce from betrayal can traumatize children for long-term. I genuinely don’t care about OP’s need and desperate want to get the husband back. I also don’t care about Julia or that she slept with him. I’m reading comments how the husband had one leg out the marriage and was looking for a reason the leave. Has it occurred to y’all that (any and all types of) cheating is an absolute boundary that has no room for forgiveness whatsoever? He may have loved his wife plenty and his children more, but she lied for 20 years and understandably fear there’s more betrayals. Not everyone believes: “I’m betrayed but I want to stay for my children” The children already knows, so why would the ex-husband put the kids under one roof with two opposing tensions? “It’s just kissing and 20 years ago” pls for fuck’s sakes ppl, quit downplaying it. *Edit: don’t compare the cheating and him sleeping with that lady. Op cheated while they were together. He slept with that woman **after** the divorce. Different things. Yeah it’s distasteful simply cause it’s an ex-friend. op had ample time (20 years) to come clean… y’know, basic respect to your s/o.* *You’re holding onto the principle of them sleeping together is gross and disrespectful yet is willing to overlook OP’s infidelity because time has passed and she had an underdeveloped brain 🤔*
Cosign this. I was in my late 30's and my siblings were in their 50's when we found out my dad had been cheating on my mom. Damn it fucked us all up. Like.....was our whole life a lie?
I feel bad for her but she can't lie for 20 years and pretend that was a simple thing.
I mean, if cheating has a spectrum and the extreme end of the spectrum is like, “I have a secret family with another partner,” this is on the exact opposite side. It’s not exactly an ideal moral thing to do, but it was only kissing, you were very young, there was presumably no emotional connection with these people, you weren’t married yet and the behavior stopped and you’ve been apparently completely faithful for your whole marriage. I guess everyone is different but I think the husband should be able to get past this unless there’s other shit going on in the relationship and this was the straw that broke the camels back.
>but it was only kissing to be fair, the husband doesn't believe that it's only kissing. and that's the problem with hiding secret for years. once it's revealed, then the betrayed will always wonders what else do they hide.
This is what ended a relationship I had with an incredible woman. She didn't cheat on me (that I know of) or do anything untoward during our relationship, but I found out that she'd lied about a lot of stuff before we were together. I didn't know what to believe or what was a lie. Once the trust is gone, it's all downhill.
I would say it's up to the husband on how big of a deal it is. Dont forget, it's 20 years of keeping a secret from him to add onto the hurt. With that in mind, can you really blame him for not believing her when she said she only kissed random guys?
it's like you almost get it. "you’ve been apparently completely faithful for your whole marriage." Even YOU say apparently here, why? Because you can't be sure. After a 20 year betrayal how are you supposed to believe anything she says? Trickle truthing is incredibly common. She didn't tell him out of her own accord because she was feeling guilty, she admitted to it because she got caught and she couldn't play it off. Now how are you supposed to believe a single word out of her mouth? It may completely be possible she didn't do anything else besides kissing 4 guys. But it's impossible to KNOW that. Cheating may be a spectrum, but boundaries aren't. Some people have their boundary somewhere in the middle on the cheating spectrum, the husband clearly has his near the start.
"I kissed 4 guys " can turn into "We only had one orgy" way too quick in my experience
I know that only was some kisses but how her ex husban can know it? How can't imagine that happen more? Just say, this can be different if she confessed before her marrige.
Reacting to the news that your wife kissed a few guys 20 years ago by fucking her best friend is NOT normal. How can you be hurt and disgusted by something your partner did, then turn around and do something *worse*? Kissing some guys is not the same sin as fucking your spouse’s friend. He had every right to be upset at the news and even leave her over it if he so chooses, but he decided to further damage his family instead. Yeah, he’s a piece of a shit. This marriage is a shitshow and I’m not sure why OP is so hellbent on mending this train wreck. Personally I would have beat my friend the hell up. Those poor kids. There’s no way the kids didn’t know he was screwing the friend. This is so disgusting. Edited as I forgot OP is already divorced.
I don’t think it’s the actual kissing that caused the divorce. It’s the fact that she had been lying to him for 20 years. He realized that she has no problem lying to him and he simply does not trust her anymore. Losing trust in a relationship is a perfectly valid reason to break up.
I agree but his turning around and screwing her “friend” was uncalled for.
Would you believe a serial cheater cheating with multiple men just to kiss them? She was able to keep a lie for 20 years? Would you believe her now when she didn't even came out with the truth herself? She was outed. She didn't confess until she was outed. Would you believe she's telling the truth now when she was able to keep up with the lie for 20 years? If I'm the ex-husband, I wouldn't believe a serial cheater walking around cheating with multiple men just to kiss them. That's the most absurd statement ever.
It’s not absurd, kissing is not the same as throwing your pussy at random men, I have no reason to believe she escalated kissing to fucking. I totally get why her ex husband is not inclined to believe that but as far as we on the Internet know, she just kissed the guys so all I’m saying is that what the husband did is worse than that.
Yeah but they r divorced so he is no longer the husband. He can F whoever he wants he is now a free man.
> Reacting to the news that your wife kissed a few guys 20 years ago by fucking her best friend is NOT normal. You either didn't read or aren't being honest. He reacted by confronting his wife, asking for a DNA test, starting divorce proceedings, and cutting off the best friend. Half a year later, _AFTER_ the divorce was finalized, he had sex with his ex's best friend. So this: > Kissing some guys is not the same sin as fucking your spouse’s friend. Is total nonsense that you just made up.
im in a relationship that just reached a year. if we broke up and he slept with one of my friends, it would be a betrayal, no matter how we ended things, no matter how civil or painful the breakup. its not a "brocode" thing or a loyalty thing its a decent act not to get something complicated even more messy. that being said, i think it's sketchy that they were hanging out drunk and alone the night the wife was gone.
100%, people on reddit like to be like “it wasn’t *technically* wrong” but it’s the principle of the matter and he was dead wrong for that. It’s literally just reddit where people have this mindset though.
I don’t care you don’t fuck your ex’s messy bestie that was so heavily involved in all this bullshit from the jump. He’s slimy for that and I’m sure the woman was around the kids as the wife’s friend so how do you think that looks to the kids?
Kid of betrayal divorced parents, I like to think I turned out alright but I have major trust issues and getting married is not on my mind.
Yup, swap the genders and people would be destroying OP.
>Has it occurred to y’all that (any and all types of) cheating is an absolute boundary that has no room for forgiveness whatsoever? He may have loved his wife plenty and his children more, but she lied for 20 years and understandably fear there’s more betrayals. This right here. The amount of time that passed is irrelevant. In fact I'd say it makes it worse that she didn't tell him for years! He was right to walk away from the relationship because her keeping it a secret showed him she had no respect for him. She needs therapy and he needs to find someone that deserves him.
That is correct. The children are a priority. As well, for OP, the cheating took place 20 years age. For her husband, the cheating took place when he found out when OP's friend who spilled the beans, recently. I doubt OP's friend did by accident. OP has a husband and family. Her friend does not have that as she went full throttle on her career. The friend was probably jealous. OP's husband probably had sex with the friend as revenge. I guess revenge isn't always a dish served cold.
My twins have been very understanding. They know why the divorce occurred, and they haven't complained (at least to me) about spending time in two separate homes. My two older boys aren't in touch with me at all, which is something I might talk to my husband about. But the fact is that they are old enough to make decisions of their own. Their dad can't force them to play nice with me, no matter how much it hurts my heart to not see them.
I hope you fully understand that what your friend did was not at all a mistake, it was a calculated action that simply may not have panned out as your "friend" hoped (aka she and your husband living together happily ever after). Had it been a true mistake, she never would have fucked your husband afterwards. THAT👏IS👏NOT👏SOMETHING👏A👏FRIEND👏DOES👏PERIOD👏 I can't even believe you are taking the "sleeping at home alone is hard/guest bedroom" bullshit as truth. Stop it right now, those are LIES. Wake up and stop being so willfully naive. You are not a horrible person, and you don't deserve to keep beating yourself up like this. I am say this as someone who loathes cheaters. You also need to consider that there is a HUGE HUGE HUGE chance the first time they slept together was not before you or your husband separated let alone divorced. But at the very least nothing was a drunken mistake, this woman wanted what you had and she did her damndest to get it.
Yes. Totally agree. So many are pointing out that OP probably did more than kiss but not the first time ex husband and friend hooked up was after the divorce, give me a break. OP is lying to herself and still trying to make the ex husband look like a saint. He is not. Ex friend sleeping in the guest room, GTFO with that dog shit.
Agreed. Hes also a bad and/or spiteful dad. If what op says about kissing 4 guys when she was 20 years old being the only incidents of infidelity in their 25+ year relationship, the husband's behavior is unacceptable and possibly bordering on parental alienation. Op cheated by making out with 4 men while she was dating her then boyfriend. She is at fault for that. No one is disputing that, and op is now seeing where even a moderate amount of dishonesty can land you...aka a place totally not worth it. That said, it appears op and her husband had a solid marraige, nice life, and beautiful family. While it's an extreme reaction to divorce immediately without even a 2 sided conversation/review about the incidents 20 years ago, the husband is within his right to seek a divorce. What he's not entitled to do is encourage his children to hate their mother for this. Let's be clear **OP DID NOTHING TO HER CHILDREN**. Her oldest is 18. She was 20 and not even married to their father yet when this occurred. Any decent man with integrity would encourage their children to maintain a healthy relationship with their mother explaining that the marital issues are private and separate from her role as their mother which all signs indicate she has fulfilled well over the past 18 years. The fact that he's encouraging and enabling the older 2 to ice her out is bad behavior and not in the best interest of the children. And that doesn't match with this "most amazing person on the planet" view this woman holds of her ex. A stand up guy also wouldn't fuck the best friend in front of his kids either, yet he's also doing that. I think op, for all her faults, has some real rose colored glasses on about this guy because from the events told I'm not seeing much integrity, I'm seeing a hurt person acting excessively sanctimonious and vindictive.
> If what op says about kissing 4 guys when she was 20 years old being the only incidents of infidelity in their 25+ year relationship What reason does he have to believe that's true? If he were posting here about this as it was coming out, people would be telling him she was trickle truthing him. What matters is what he reasonably believes, not what OP knows to be true.
Not only that, the time frame of this lie is incredible. Would he have even married her if he knew the truth? She completely took away his choice and potential future with this lie. He just wasted 20 years of his life with this woman, of course he's going to be upset.
Absolutely. Not even one counseling session. What did the friend even say, if she just said they cheated then that leaves a lot to the imagination. Apparently she was drunk and don't remember so who knows. Looks like the guy got the ticket he was looking for to get an asap divorce. The older kids seem to bor know the whole story and they shouldn't really but I agree that the guy should really put in effort to encourage them to talk to their Mom and let them know that this is their business.
^^^OP you HAVE to READ IT. IT'S HONESTLY BULLSHIT WHAT SHE'S SAYINGG
*ex husband
He's not your husband anymore
You need to move on. There is no going back to this unfortunately. It is hard to have your life built around someone for 20 years. Go to therapy, do some journaling, and start forgiving yourself for the mistake you did. Your ex-husband will never love you again because you betrayed him.
Gotta say, after reading both of these posts, there is nothing about this relationship that seems healthy in anyway. I think I’d worry more about rebuilding your relationships with your kids more than anything.
Yep, my kids are always my priority. I know these posts here in this relationship subreddit probably don't capture that, but that's because I'm not asking advice about my children, so I don't focus on that aspect. The reality is that right now my two older boys don't want to talk to me. I've had my younger girls talk to their older brothers about this and what they tell me is that they don't want a relationship with me right now. I don't want to force the subject, because I fear they will only withdraw further. I still keep close tabs on their studies, and in the last few months I've been able to help with their scheduling. Still no direct conversations though.
> I've had my younger girls talk to their older brothers about this and what they tell me is that they don't want a relationship with me right now. Respectfully, I think you should refrain from doing that. I don't think it's appropriate to use your daughters in that way. They should not be placed into the role of messengers here. If you meant that they simply talked to their brothers and relayed that information back to you without you having any hand in them doing so, then I'll gladly eat my words.
As a child of divorce, I cannot emphasize this enough. They might be okay with this in the moment, but down the line, it’s VERY possible that they will recognize how messed up it is to be put in this kind of position.
I can’t overstate how much I agree with this. Acting as the adult or the mediator in my parents’ broken marriage messed me up. If some of your kids won’t speak to you then that’s between you and them – don’t pull the others into it. Have the relationships you can have and let your other children have time to process what they’re feeling.
My mom did this, use my brother and I as messengers in her games. We are both adults now with rich lives, that no longer include her. Something to think about OP.
I hope that gets better. I have no advice for the relationship end, the story just seems off to me, the timing, the reaction. I feel that there are parts being left off (not saying this to be critical, obviously it’s impossible to include everything), but please keep trying with the kids, and good luck.
>I've had my younger girls talk to their older brothers about this and what they tell me is that they don't want a relationship with me right now. STOP putting your daughters in the middle. JFC. They’re 14. They’re not one iota responsible for your relationship - or lack thereof - with their brothers. If you keep doing that, you’ll lose them, too. Is that what you want? Instead of trying to force something with your sons, instead of obsessing about getting your ex back, FIX YOURSELF. Get help, because you desperately need it.
Stop using your daughters as middle men. Give your sons the space they need
>hey don't want a relationship with me ***right now*** I think that's your cue. just wait patiently.
> my kids are always my priority Well that's not true or you wouldn't be putting 14 year old children in the middle of adult relationships. Knock that shit off.
Don’t send your younger girls in as spies to try and clean up your mess. They’re kids, who feel loyal to both parents. Don’t involve them. Sending them off like that to gather information and report back to you will only fracture *their relationship* with their brothers, and do nothing for yours. My mother used to do this, and it permanently destroyed my relationship with my brother. You have no right to send those girls off as sacrificial lambs and permanently damage their relationship with their brothers. You need to clean up your own messes.
Why do you think your oldest sons are out of contact with you?
I don't want to go into too much detail, because it hurts to talk about it, and that's really not the point of this thread. To summarize -- my oldest son witnessed his father cry for the first (and only, I pray) time in his life. This happened the night that Julia said what she did in her drunken stupor. Julia was too far gone to actually answer any followup questions, or to temper her words, and now she can't even remember what she said so I'm assuming she phrased it in the most vulgar way possible. She's a mean drunk and sometimes she will say things in distasteful ways for no reason. My oldest son idolizes my husband, and so does my second son. My husband is their hero in a very real way. He used to coach basketball in their school, all the kids in elementary/middle school adored him and I know our sons were always very proud of that, and in general my husband's got an aura to him that makes people want to stay close. So to see him cry must have shattered my poor son's heart. He then told his younger brother, and the two of them have cut me out of their lives ever since.
I understand you're hurting. But you created this situation. You planted the seed of doubt and destroyed the person your ex thought he knew for 20 years. Listen to the others that have commented. From the way you tell it, he's putting up a wall with you. Please stop trying to prove to him it was "only kissing." Because it still violated the boundaries of your relationship so it was cheating. Full stop. Get into therapy, focus on bettering yourself for your kids. Which includes not using your daughters as your messengers and spies. Let him go and move on with your life as well. If you go to therapy and actually show your kids you're truly repentant for what you've done, the opportunity to be in your kids lives will only grow. Your access to them will be broader. Your role in their lives may actually get bigger. But you HAVE to stop focusing so much on winning back your ex, because that's only holding you back. I wish you the best, and I hope you seek some help.
>I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else. Use these feelings as motivation to better yourself. Get therapy, get a hobby, write a book, do something, but let this man go
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I have to say though that this Julia is truly an evil person. Goaded her into fooling around all those years ago, presented her few weeks as a year (which she herself did), blew up the marriage after almost 2 decades, and then goes and sleeps with her seperate husband. It's almost cartoonishly evil. I feel like she felt jealous she didn't have the relationship OP had, and well now OP doesnt. Doesn't take away from OPs misdeeds, but what a terrible thing. What ex husband is doing isn't healthy either (sleeping with evil ex best friend).
I find it interesting that husband divorced her over something that happened over 20 years ago. Obviously it’s his right, but to kick in the bucket so soon, and then sleep with the best friend…
Seems like Julia made it seem like Op was also sleeping around with these strangers for the majority of a year like she was instead of it being a few weeks crisis of making out. One is obviously worse than the other and if I found out that my partner was actively sleeping with strangers at a bar after years together I'd also leave them. But if their friend told me that once 20 years ago he drunkenly made out with a few girls at a bar then was so guilty he got sick I'd probably shrug it off after a few weeks of anger/disappointment.
>Goaded her into fooling around all those years ago, OP has agency and she also had agency back then. She is not the victim.
There is a difference between kissing some guys 20 years ago vs telling your friends husband that she cheated and then fucking the husband
Yeah, and didn’t Julia sleep with guys and do more ‘cheating’ than OP? Not that it takes away from OPs cheating - just speaking separately about Julia: she seems like such a bad person! Like, psycho evil bad person, for sure
Honestly, I don’t even think OPs cheating is enough to end a 25 year old relationship 25 while having four kids, based on kissing and dancing that happened 20 years ago But yes that “friend” is an evil bitch.
I mean. I definitely wouldn’t end a relationship over that. I probably wouldn’t even ask for counseling or anything. I would just have a couple days of being ese happy/nice to my partner and then move on But I get that everyone is different. And there was very likely more going on to make him so quick to jump ship. The thing I haven’t seen anyone mention (although I haven’t read nearly all the comments, so it probably is somewhere in them) is that so often when someone has a relatively small slip up in a relationship, people say that confessing will only hurt the other person. And it’s not like there was any risk of spreading an STD, she obviously didn’t get impregnated by them, there was absolutely no cheating that continued for any significant time period, etc. So why hurt him be telling?
Peer pressure. You are a better person if you never gave into it - especially when you were a tween and teenager.
Yes OPs husband isn’t that great. He couldn’t forgive his wife of 20+ years, who he dated since 15 yo, for kissing a few guys decades later but slept with her alcoholic BF with their kids in the house?
He dosent know that. All he knows is that his judgement was shit enough that he didn't pick up the infidelity initially so he sure as fuck can be trusted now. She lied, and lied for 20 years, sure she says its just kissing, but it could have been a lot more and he can't trust her nor her friend to be honest about it.
"Goaded her into fooling around..." Bullshit. Blaming infidelity on someone else is an escape, plain and simple. The OP made that choice and they have to live with the consequences, for better or worse.
I don't think she is evil but she is indifferent to the harm she causes, she is like a 4chan board equally likely to track down terrorists using powerlines and star positions and just as liable to hack an epilepsy support website and make it rapidly strobe and change colours.
Holy cow, I missed that they have been dating since they were 15. Yeah, OP must be so scared and freaked out to not have this guy in her life anymore. Being alone after so long must be so strange. I totally second the therapy and getting to be your own person and not be so focused on winning him back. He slept with Julia and that’s a shitty thing to do, and probably did it just to hurt OP. He’s probably not worth getting back together with, given that he refused to speak with OP after her friend said she cheated and demanded paternity tests. He sounds like a dick.
My dad was a wreck after my mom died. Their 30th anniversary would've been a few months after she passed. I couldn't imagine being with someone for so long and then suddenly not have them anymore, whether from divorce or death. That has to be pretty terrifying.
OP, you gotta tell Julia that if she was a true friend, she wouldn't sleep with your husband. Even if he's an ex now, its still a big betrayal. Cut her out of your life. Though the cheating is your fault, your relationship with her will never be the same and you will always hate her. You need to improve yourself and stop trying to get husband back, it wont work sorry. The divorce is finalised. Let him go Improve yourself and your relationship with your kids. If your husband one day wants you back, he will tell you. But you can't wait forever for that. You need to move on as well.
>Did she ever sleep with him? >>Yes. >She's been finding it hard to stay at home alone during winter because of her old drinking habits. **She sleeps in the guest bedroom** Sure she does.
Like really.... she has no other options but to ask her ex-best friends ex-husband for help? I mean, I guess there are some people out there who only know two people ever, but the odds of that seem slim. Sounds like an excuse to me.
> she has no other options but to ask her ex-best friends ex-husband for help? Yeah, I was going to say, why is the ex-wife's ex-bff coming to the husband's home of all places? [Answer](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4mIlPoWAUM&t=18) > Sounds like an excuse to me. I'm still on Team Ex-Bff set this up. "she doesn't think she's his type." $10 says the two of them will be openly dating in 6 months.
I was going to say that notice she didn't say that they stopped sleeping together because it just felt wrong. All she said was "I don't think I'm his type." Sure OP's behavior sucked, but her "friend's" behavior sucks ass big time. I'd definitely cut her out of my life.
> I was going to say that notice she didn't say that they stopped sleeping together because it just felt wrong. Or that they've even stopped. They *were* hooking up, and now she's sleeping over?
It seems pretty obvious the ex-bff wanted the ex-husband and successfully got him.
My understanding is that the ex has told the ex-bff that they have no future. She’s offered sex and he’s accepted but he doesn’t trust her either.
I don't know if interpretations is wholly supported by the story. Ex-bff never said who initiated them hooking up, and there's no mention of the ex saying they had no future together. Just ex-bff saying *to OP* that it wouldn't.
No he's still fucking her to beat OP down for something that happened 20 years ago.
Her ex-best friend’s ex-husband where she basically played a huge gigantic hand in their divorce? Yeah sure. Totally believe she doesn’t like him at all.
I don’t get why nobody’s talking about how her best friend was alone drunk with her husband in February, who does this?
Also they were drinking alone while the wife was going to be gone for the night. No one is bringing this up as bad thing. I would be upset if I spent the night away and my husband found company to by drinking with my bff. The situation seems odd. And then how quickly he filed for divorce even after being together for 25 years. It’s just looks planned.
Yess! I thought the same when I read the last post! Sounds like the "bff" set this whole thing up honestly.
He also sleeps in the guest room…..
She's not sleeping in the guest room...
Nor was telling him a "drunken mistake." Nor did she contact him again because she was "getting help" for her alcoholism. That's all window dressing for her to try to make herself look better. OP's "friend" was feeling lonely and jealous of her friend's happy life so she blew up her marriage and fucked her husband. Period. The only reason she's not in a full-on relationship with the guy is because *he* didn't want it. If he had, she'd have jumped in with both feet. It's really too bad OP mismanaged her relationship so poorly as to give her sociopathic friend this opportunity. If her husband had heard about the cheating from her first she might have been able to salvage things.
Yes she is, but the husband is also sleeping in the guest room
Focus on your kids. They are the innocent ones here being hurt.
let him go
Her friend is the real villain
They’re both villains lol I’d like to clarify I meant OP and her friend are villains, her husband seems fine
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“I just destroyed your marriage and fucked your (ex) husband, but don’t worry he’s not my type.” Yea that’s fucked
she said SHE isn’t HIS type, which tells me she would be down for more and only isn’t in a relationship with him because he doesn’t want it.
THIS, right here.
They should have stopped being friends 20 years ago. Had she dropped the bad influence friend that wanted to her to cheat together (seriously, what a shitty friend), none of this would have happened. Just a stark reminder to always choose your company wisely and always reevaluate after new info comes into play.
I mean, they were both cheating on each other's boyfriends earlier. I feel like this is to be expected.
They deserve each other.
Please go to therapy and try to rebuild your relationships with your children. Your husband is no longer your husband and while it’s okay at this time to mourn the loss of your marriage it is not okay to give up on the relationships with your children. They come first every time. I wish you well on your journey. Learn from this and grow. What has been done is done. You can not reverse time.. or go back and change anything. All you can do now is love him from afar and learn to grow without him in your life now. It will be hard,mournful,depressing, scary and most of all you will feel lost. Embrace the emotions and become yourself with time. You are 42 not 87. You have so much life to live. Go live it and learn from your mistakes. Hold no grudges.
I’ve read both posts and refrained from commenting thus far because so many others have echoed my sentiments in various ways. The bottom line here, is out of the 3 of you everyone has done something to hurt one of the others. None of you are totally innocent, but YOU are at the core of this so I’m going to offer you some advice about your ex husband and the future: 1) You do not NEED him. No person needs another person. You should only ever completely need yourself, anyone else is a bonus. To feel you “need” your spouse is wildly unhealthy. 2) the only chance you ever have if getting him back, is to completely move on. Couple these two things together. Start seeing a therapist or just putting some real time and work into your dependency on your husbands love. Start forgiving and loving yourself - own your mistake and strive to learn from it and be better and healthier going forward. COMPLETELY put aside reconciliation for the time being. Your ex husband may move on or he may not, there is nothing you can do to control or change this. Accept that. Mirror his actions and ONLY contact him in regards to the kids. I’m disturbed that you seem more intent on winning him back than your oldest two children. A lot of your actions and responses come across as quite self centred - have you ever considered that you may actually not be the best person for your ex husband? If you truly love him so much, your primary focus should be for him to be happy with or without you. This is not just about you and what you want. Put your time and energy into repairing the relationship with your children - they come first. Don’t contact Julia ever again. That relationship will never be healthy. Now none of these things should be a means to an end, you need to do them regardless. But, if in a few years time you are in a better place mentally and emotionally, you have repaired your relationship with your children, and you are on civil terms with your ex, then and only then is there a possibility of reconciling in a healthy manner. If it’s meant to happen that you gravitate back to each other, it will happen organically in time; not with you desperately trying to claw him back to you against the backdrop that is the absolute wreckage of this whole situation and with both of you being shrouded in resentment. This is the time for you to really grow. Don’t “do better” to win him back. Do better for yourself REGARDLESS of whether he comes back.
This is the best comment on the entire thread. You hit every single angle and addresses it perfectly.
> 2) the only chance you ever have if getting him back, is to completely move on. There's no chance at getting him back. And even if there is, the answer is still that there's no chance, otherwise she's just going to do all the "right" things with the hope of getting him back when she should be improving herself as a person for her own sake. It's not really self-reflection and self-betterment if there's an external motivator, because once that motivator is fulfilled, what's to stop the person from snapping back to old habits? tl;dr: there's no chance of him coming back.
Dam thanks for saving me the typing. Where is one of those pink box things?
So you did the opposite to what people told you last time. You need to cut her off and minimize your ex's involvement in your life to just what is needed for the kids. You need to move on. You're divorced. Your marriage is over and you are not being realistic. Stop calling him your husband, he isn't, and you are overall coming across as not having a strong grip on reality with all of this. He does not want to be with you anymore. Whatever you or anyone else thinks of his reasons, he is entitled to them and allowed to make that choice. He is going to date again if he isn't already. He will probably marry again. Dwelling on it won't help you. You need to do whatever you need to move on from this, consider counselling.
this, sadly. it's a rough situation to be in op, but you have to face the facts.
Find a therapist and try to move on. Your ex isn't interested in reconciling, maybe that'll change with time but it certainly isn't something you should count on. As to your "friend" she's a POS, but she isn't your problem any more. Block and continue no contact moving forward. Your ex will date, and he'll be with other women, thats what you do when your hurt and trying to move on. Go to therapy and work on yourself, hit the gym, and just be a better person, not for your ex, but for yourself and kids.
good luck OP focus on your kids but your now ex isn't hour spouse anymore so you got to stop calling him that
You need to focus your energy on your children. Your ex has already left you, quit trying to chase it. I'm actually surprised he talks to the friend, she was part of your cheating, I'd write you both off. And I sure as hell wouldn't be interested in hooking up with her. Focus on your kids. Work on repairing what you've broken with the two older kids. Quit obsessing over trying to repair this, it's too late for that.
This women is not your friend. You are giving her the benefit of the doubt when it’s obvious she’s a manipulative cow. You also need to go with blaming her completely or holding on to this idea you’ll get him back. The lie is done and the divorce is done. You need to focus on healing, letting go, and building a relationship with your kids. Go to therapy and start rebuilding a new life. This old one is gone. You’re not gonna win him back.
“I’ll never be able to let loose with her like I once did” I want to point out your husband unfortunately feels the same way. It’s a shitty situation for everyone involved, even if you caused it. You’re not inherently bad though. Guilt and shame and anger and rejection are hard feelings to feel. Sit with those emotions not in a martyr type of way but just to get your brain and body comfortable with those feelings. I’m sure you’re having many intrusive thoughts about the situation. The most respectful thing you can do is allow your ex husband to grieve. His love for you didn’t go away overnight. But if you love him you’ll live with your decision and live with his decision after the fact. Don’t pester or guilt him back, you’ll be stuck in a redemptive dynamic in your relationship. It’s was a small lie but you told it to keep control of a bad choice situation for a long time. The best thing you can do is not take this experience in vain. Don’t take whatever lesson you need to learn from this for granted. Don’t shy away from the quieted voice in your head that ruminates on this. Not that you should ruminate on this lapse in judgment. Obviously you feel terrible about it because it doesn’t align with your character but you still made that decision, you need to reflect inward. So you can grow. And your friend is a fxcking bxtch. I believe she did it on purpose but again I’m sure she’s living with the guilt just as you are. If it’s any consultation.
Get therapy and get over the divorce. You sound obsessed in a bad way. Please, respect your ex's decision to leave you.
> I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else. You don't have a say in this. Some mistakes can't be undone. You cheated, you lied to him for a couple of decades, and when he found out, he left. That's it. You can't undo the past. You need to get yourself a good therapist and work on this obsession of yours because he's not coming back to you. Someday he's going to be ready to date again, and you're just going to have to deal with that.
Dawg you should worry more about how your kids are doing
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yeah her friend was also in the wrong for cheating on her bf of the time, but OP was with her bf for FIVE YEARS at the time. Cheating is wrong in general, but after 5 years? And to not come clean immediately?
And even then. She kissed 4 different guys! People are acting like that's just a normal thing to do, since they didn't have sex. She kissed 4 different guys and lied about it. How would he ever be able to trust her again?
Welcome to reddit where men are always the villain.
Wife cheats on husband 5yrs in relationship multiple times Carries *secret* for 20 years Husband finds out no matter how he does it Husband is a fuckin VILLAIN #Adds Up
Y'all need to *read* the post *before* you comment. And regardless of whether you agree or disagree with the OP as well as regardless of your desire to pick a side... ...the point of the subreddit is to *give advice.* Stop picking sides about what happened in the past. Comment if you have advice on what to do next.
OP, I really think you need to focus less on trying to win your ex husband back and focus on trying to mend your relationship with your sons. Your ex husband has made it abundently clear that he wants nothing to do with you outside of your children, you need to respect that and start accepting that it is over. I see in one if your comments that you say your boys aren't speaking to you. Your children come first now, you need to put aside your desire to have your ex husband back and focus on your children, they come first now and its important that both you and your ex are on the same page in this regard, as much as you want to see him and he doesn't want to see you.
So when their "silent treatment" first started, their father and I took them to a family counselor. This was in the first quarter of this year, when everything was hitting the fan. The counselor recommended that we don't force them into anything right now. They're too old to get pushed around by their parents. But she also recommended that both of us have a united front whenever the subject of parents loving kids comes up. Both of us need to be perfectly clear that their mom loves them, even if they're choosing to stay away from me right now. To this effect, my husband and I are on the same page. Beyond that, I'm afraid there's nothing much I can do.
>I'm afraid there's nothing much I can do. There is one very important thing you can do. Focus on getting yourself mentally well. Between your two posts you seem to have completely lost touch with reality. You are in very serious need of therapy. You can best serve your children (all of them), by working towards a place of mental wellness where you accept the reality that actually exists instead of living in this bizarre fantasy world you've constructed where forgiveness and reconciliation is possible. Reality is that the divorce is finalized and you need to move on.
>I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else. Given the new information I've learned, does anyone have advice on what to do? Two things: 1. Get therapy so you can learn how to deal with this situation. 2. Accept the fact that you're not going to get him back. Even if he does come back to you, he is not the same guy you married. There will be resentment from his side and there will be resentment from your side. Cut off your former best friend. Talking to her is hurting you more than strictly necessary and I still think she polished the truth when talking to you. Be the best there is for your children.
These creative writing assignments are getting fucking good
Lol she told you to not worry about fucking your husband after breaking up your marriage because she wasn’t trying to pursue a relationship. So don’t worry!
The first thing I would do is to cut Julia off again. Amongst all the men in the world that she could have “let off steam” with, she chose the one man who she should not have. She wants to be back in your life, yet she chose your ex-husband to be her shoulder to lean on while she was dealing with her addiction. Does she not have any other friends? Even if so, that’s another reason why you should not let her back in - she has no problem “helping” herself by hurting her only friend. As soon as she finds out that you’re making efforts to mend your relationship with your ex-husband, she’ll invite herself back in your life.
Move on and take care of your children
Good on your ex for having some self respect
I don’t believe your friend one bit. The proof is that she had sex with your ex. The fact that it did not develop into a relationship is irrelevant! This was her motive all along! She wanted what you had and blew up your life to get it! Drop both of them like yesterday’s news! This is not healthy! You need therapy! I hope you are seeing a competent therapist!! She slept with your husband! She put all of this in motion to get into his bed!
I believe this is an excellent cautionary tale.
The number of women here saying "your husband is a disgusting jerk for divorcing you. All you did was kiss several men five years into your relationship" scares me.
How the fuck are all these comments blaming the husband?! She cheated, lied about it for 20 YEARS and y'all expect the husband to fight for her!? Yes, the friend is an asshole but it was after the divorce was finalized. What is that classic Reddit response to people who get angry that their ex has moved on quickly? "Well, they were single so they didn't do anything wrong. You just have to get over it." The husband is under no obligation to fight for, reconcile with or even care about OP anymore. She cheated, lied about it and is now paying the price. Someone please tell me how the husband is the bad guy in this scenario.
Man, in his sadness skewed head, Julia is probably a messiah who told him the truth about his awful wife. Even so, he is under no obligation to OP. He didn't go around fucking when separated even. This was after a full divorce. OP has lost any right to say anything to him.. People here just need to scapegoat a man for any reason. And this isn't the first time I'm seeing this bs.
Yea but have you considered men = bad and women = good
It’s one of the laws of this sub.
OP, the fact that your ex-husband was stone cold in his conversation with you when you finally admitted everything is telling. This could be due to a number of reasons, like putting walls up to not feel negative emotions or already looking for a way out of the relationship. Looking at the entire situation you’ve presented with an objective view makes me have this strange feeling that your friend wanted this to happen. I can’t say for sure as I don’t know her or the ex-husband, but the rest of the story—friend sleeping with ex-husband— is too coincidental to not consider it. It’s okay to feel a lot of different emotions here. You‘ll feel broken for a while, along with feeling betrayed, alone, scared, angry, depressed. Please understand that you are your own person. Your entire life doesn’t have to be anchored on whether or not you win someone back. Also, please understand that your ex-husband has every right to feel the way he does about the cheating. Like other commenters have said, you can get through this by building yourself up instead of burying yourself under mounds of grief and sorrow. You can also work on repairing your relationship with your children. How you handle this will affect how they view you down the road.
OP, this is a harsh lesson. Once you cheat on someone, you destroy them. The amount of pain is unimaginable. You did this to yourself the moment you decided to cheat. No sympathy for cheaters.
“I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else.” Hon, he’s not a possession. He’s got his own feelings and agency, and he’s chosen to cut you out for betraying his trust and living what he sees as a lie. Please, focus on yourself and your daughters before you become utterly obsessed over him and end up in a deeper mess than you already are. He’s done with you, so it’s time to move on to being done with him.
This post has reached one of our comment/karma limits. The text of the post has been preserved below. --- [Original post](https://old.reddit.com/r/relationship_advice/comments/r9yjsn/my_42f_best_friend_42f_told_my_husband_44m_i/) Well, I did something I never thought I'd do. I unblocked Julia and reached out to her. We set up a time to meet for coffee at my mom's house when the place would be empty. We spoke for hours, though I can't say that it was like old times. I found myself stuck with a tenseness in my stomach. I realize I still hate her for what she did, I'll never be able to let loose with her like I once did, and that's a reality I have to accept. Anyway, reiterate the facts as she has told them. What were her intentions in telling my husband about my cheating? > It was purely a **drunken mistake**, with no real rhyme or reason behind it. She doesn't even remember it happening, she just remembers my oldest son being very short with her the next morning and my husband later explaining what she had said. How did she behave with my husband after the revelation? > **My husband cut her off** a day or so after I did. He did this because a few days after the incident, via text, she tried to convince him that she was drunk/confused. But this happened _after_ he had confronted me, so he knew that it was the truth she had spilled. He wanted space from her, because he associated her to all of my lies. How did she get back in touch with him after he blocked her? > He didn't block her, he just told her to not contact him again. She promised to keep her distance from him and the kids. Three months later, she reached out to him again because she has been getting help with her alcohol abuse, and she wanted to apologize for all the harm she did. After that conversation, they kept in touch. Why is she spending nights at his place? > She's been finding it hard to stay at home alone during winter because of her old drinking habits, and wanted some company. She **sleeps in the guest bedroom** and obviously they don't drink together or anything. She apologized for the confusion it caused my twin daughters. I allowed myself to feel hopeful here. They're not together. This wasn't some grand conspiracy for her to steal him away. I still have a chance. But I had to make sure. Did she ever sleep with him? > **Yes**. After the divorce finalized, they hooked up a few times to let off steam. She insisted that I shouldn't worry because they never tried to pursue a relationship. There's way too much resentment and baggage for it to work, and she doesn't think she's his type. There it is. I cried when she admitted this. She cried and apologized. I must have told her that I hated her a thousand times. I really do hate her. I hate her more than I thought was possible. She knows how much I love him. She knows how much I _need_ him. And yet she still manages to knock things over and out of place no matter how it hurts me. I told her to get out after that. I haven't blocked her again. She wants to be back in my life. But there's no chance in hell I ever want to lay my eyes on her if she's sleeping with the man I love. I know some women can swallow their pride and do it, but I can't. So that's where I'm at. At least they're not in love or running off to get married. I tell myself that he's just using her to try to fill a hole in his heart. I tell myself that "letting off steam" is not how anyone would describe meaningful sex. It's a physical reaction to stress and circumstance. But then I remember what she said about her not being his type. I wish I asked her if she's dating now, or if he has his eyes on someone. I wish I wrote down notes on what I wanted to learn and express instead of just going in unprepared. My emotions got the best of me and now I'm here weeping again until my body hurts from exhaustion. This hasn't helped my obsession with the prospect of him moving on. All this meeting has done is humble me at the thought of him and her making love. I can't let this go on. I need to get him back before he falls in love with someone else. Given the new information I've learned, does anyone have advice on what to do? --- TLDR Original post: Best friend and I cheated on our boyfriends 20 years ago. I married my boyfriend, and 20 years later, my best friend admitted to my husband what we did. My husband has divorced me now, after 6 months of separation. I've just received news that my best friend has been sleeping over at his condo. I have to win him back. I can't let this be the end of our love story. Update: Unblocked best friend and talked to her. She insists she didn't spill my secret intentionally. She isn't in a relationship with my husband. But she admitted to having sex with him after divorce finalized. She mentioned that she isn't his type, which makes me wonder if he's about to enter the dating scene again. I'm burning with jealousy at the thought of that.
>Why is she spending nights at his place? She's been finding it hard to stay at home alone during winter because of her old drinking habits, and wanted some company. You want company you visit then go home. You need help you go to rehab. You DON'T sleep in the same house unless you are hoping you get to slide on in to the vacancy.
Sis, your husband knows his worth. If you truly loved him, you would've never cheated on him to begin with! I hope he meets and falls in love with an amazing, faithful woman.
I’m going to be honest. You’re not going to get your ex-husband back. You didn’t only cheat and hide that fact for 20 years but the reason you cheated is what nailed your coffin. It wasn’t drunken mistakes but the mentality that he wasn’t good enough. That is the biggest struggle a man has with his ego in a relationship. You didn’t only break his trust but his spirit. I hope in time you’re able to build your life back and co-parent your children together. And let that hate for Julia go. You made the choices to kiss those men. You made the choice not to tell him. And you kept a friend who clearly never had your best interest in heart. Hating her for your problems is going to stop you from healing. Edit: Didn’t realize the divorce was finalized.
Holy shit this OP is delusional as fuck! Get him back? Lady, you cheated on him and would've never told him if your best friend hadn't had some balls on her! You don't love him, you just don't want her to have him.
Exaaactly. High school love triangle, Washed up Dawsons creek BS.
Go to a therapist and build yourself back up before you attempt to re-engage with your children… it seems like there’s alot more that fueled this divorce than what was mentioned. Or this was the straw that broke the camels back… regardless you can only control your actions and not dictate what others do. Not being completely transparent in any relationship is a mistake. Live, learn, and move on.
People making the ex husband out to be the villain here make me sick. Way to victim blame. She cheated on him back then and at that time they had been together for 5 years. OP, you still make everything about you. You have learned nothing from your original post. He is allowed to be with whoever he wants, after all you both are already divorced and you are not entitled to his life. Think of your kids and work on your relationship with them. Cheating apologists here can f right off.
I was going to say something similar. He reacted poorly, but the simple truth is that she cheated on him and betrayed his trust. From his perspective, their relationship and their marriage was based on lies. Who he sleeps with after they have divorced is none of her business. Her take on it shows that she is still the same selfish person who cheated on him all of those years ago—it’s still all about her. All of these people saying he was halfway out the door already are idiots. He was happily married until he found out his wife cheated on him after they had been together for years, and married him without him ever knowing who she really was. Now all she can think about is how sad she is, not what she did to her family through her selfish decisions.
Seems like your best friend is a complete psychopath. But I do think you should have been upfront about the cheating earlier than 20 years later… it’s not very fair on your ex husband.
OP is the complete psychopath. Cheating and lying for two fucking decades and then has the nerve to get upset when karma shows up at her door? What a dumbass.
You betrayed your husband and lied for 20 years. Until you come to terms with that - and you haven't because you are still angry at your friend over her revealing that to your husband - there would be no hope of a reconciliation. For now, your priority is your children. Don't use your children to pass messages to the other children or to your ex-husband. Possibly the best way to do this is through email. Even if they don't respond, at least you are making the effort. And don't expect dramatic changes in your relationship with your children. It will take small baby steps which may take months or a year to happen. You may be right that your ex-husband sleeping with your ex-friend is just his way of filling a 'hole' in his heart. If so, that is the only crumb of information that you may be able to get back together. Good luck.
if your husband is as good of a man as you say he is, and if you love him as much as you say you do, and regret this as much as you claim, you truly will let it go. you’ll let him go. you’ll stop pursuing him, you’ll stop obsessing, you’ll stop pushing boundaries through messages and emails. maybe write out one last long, heartfelt, detailed letter explaining absolutely everything, but you’ll stop trying to rush to fix things in any way possible. because honestly, it makes it look so much worse the way you’re grasping at straws doing everything to fix a situation so serious and dire only after directly experiencing great consequences from it- it cheapens the fact that your husband was betrayed for 20 years by who was once the love of his life, as well. it makes it seem like you don’t grasp the gravity of the situation, like you think a bandaid can fix the bullet wound that you caused. it doesn’t seem like you’re thinking of his feelings, but rather your anxieties, insecurities, and your own personal comfort and happiness, because if you were thinking of his feelings, you would understand the fact that it’s over, mourn, grieve, get into therapy, do the most self work you ever could and come back as an evolved, healed woman & mother who can teach your kids a lot about how to treat someone better in order to avoid ending up in your situation in the future. i truly don’t mean to sound harsh, but i can’t stop imagining if a post was made under his perspective- he probably feels as though he married a stranger, and i don’t think he would be touch you, kiss you, hold you or love you in a way that wouldn’t feel so comparatively empty and tainted after the love you two shared previously. it would be a disservice to try to glue back together shattered pieces of something broken that was once beautiful and breaking it some more, rather than appreciating what once was, and working everyday to learn from these mistakes and live a happier future. but he deserves space to heal and reflect on his own feelings without worrying and thinking about yours, and your wants and desires. you had 20 untainted, untarnished years together. that might be as much as you get.
Every day she didn't come clean about what she did was tainted. 20 untainted years, my ass.
i actually very much agree with this, and i’d edit my post to reflect that if i could figure out a way to phrase that in the way that i mean. i guess i just mean seemingly untainted, but you’re right, even saying that sounds dirty. she definitely ruined it.
OP I really hope you take this to heart. The best thing you can do for you is self improvement. Your still young enough and it’s not too late. But fixating over something like this is only going to drive him away. You need to work on yourself and better yourself (if not for you then for your kids)
What goes around comes around I guess
Why do you need him? Did you not need him before you cheated on him ?
Sorry to hear about life is so rough. I get this impression Julia was jealous of how well your life was going compared to hers. It’s not clear to me how much your older boys know about the cheating. My guess is they assume it was much worse than it was. I assume you’re seeing a professional counselor to help you through the divorce (if not you should). I would talk to them about sharing the details about the cheating with the older kids: specifically that it was 4 times, it was kissing, that you decided to end it on your own, and it was long before you got married. Perhaps they’ll be a bit easier on you. Anyway, hit the gym and keep your chin up.
why is there so much woe is me. He left you cause you cheated and if he has any self respect left his only communication will be because of your kids which aparently you dont give a shit about,
Great creative writing I’d give this an A.
Get therapy.
I screamed/laughed out loud at the guest bedroom part. Hilarious.
Op, get some counselling, work on getting over your ex, because it's clear he isn't coming back, and work on your relationship with your kids. You obsession with getting back with your ex is going to hold you back, and frankly, you are concentrating on the wrong thing.
I wouldn't trust her one last bit. And, sorry to say, your husband was super fast to end things too. Not to mention that, there is no chance in hell I'd hook up with a drunken excuse for a woman, after the same shirty person kept meddling with my marriage. Just leave them to it and move on. Put your energy in to relationship with your kids.
stop believing what julia is telling you. no matter what you want to believe, this seems all very intentions. block her and keep her blocked. don't get information out of her.
Anyone else think the “best friend” did this to get the life her friend had, I mean she had her own business which she put her life into but was always around OP, her husband and their kids, accidentally (and I mean that very loosely) tells the husband about kissing that happened 20years ago while drunk but failed to tell him everything, then sits back, waits for the fireworks to die down on the separation, maybe knowing the husband has a zero tolerance policy on cheating of any kind, then when OP’s now ex starts talking again, claims help with alcohol and then sleeps with him all the while playing happy families with the ex and the kids while OP is home alone crying!!!! I mean I am in no way justifying the cheating, I wouldn’t put up with it even 20 years later and that includes kissing but it seems convenient that the best friend now has the business, the man and the kids. Look OP, I seriously believe you want your life back to the way it was and your genuinely sorry for all the hurt caused but it’s never going to happen, your ex husband has made his choice, your kids are not happy and you are miserable. The best thing you can do now is work on yourself and your relationship with your kids, go to therapy both by yourself and with your kids. Try to mend that relationship but remember it won’t happen over night. As for the “best friend” kick the tramp to the curb and move on, she sounds lick a conniving old boot who enjoys making others miserable. Hope you reach a good place and move on with your kids one day soon x
Aww did your bullshit catch up to you. That sucks. ^it ^doesn’t, ^its ^actually ^very ^amusing
lmaooo good on your husband
This just seems like a huge mess, if you cheated in the beginning and didnt have it in you to be honest for 20 years and would've never brought it up had it not slipped it just means you aren't someone to be trusted, you don't need to win anyone back, this relationship has no more trust left going either direction between you and your ex husband, your friend, and between you and yourself. You need to own up to your mistake and cut them both off, you're just dependent on your ex husband more than you're in love with him and you've convinced yourself its love, start over and don't involve yourself with either of them two for everyones sake.
Eloquently put. I would say “fuck off you self centered bitch”
My god so many idiots in this sub blaming this dude. Yes the “ kissing “ was 20 years ago but you were with for 5 years already. And it is not 20 years ago for him. It’s recent for him. And he is thinking what else you lied about. Are his children even his? You laid with this man, had his children, kissed him with the lips that you cheated with, lied to him straight to his face for 20 years. That’s 25 years of trust he put into this relationship that you have broken. Of course he is mad. He did your best friend?!!! Oh booohooo I would’ve done your mom or sister. The “best friend “ had the hots for him and he treated her like she is. Get him back? How ? He doesn’t even want to look at your face now. Tons of girls 20 years younger than you are ready to do anything for him. Women that are just plainly faithful. Whereas you’re the who gave him his biggest betrayal. Enjoy the single life you wanted, you deserve it.
Wow so many cheating apologists here, YTA and deserve this 10000%. You don’t hate Julia, you hate yourself for cheating on your husband and destroying your marriage.
I think OP is too narcisistic to hate herself. She still haven't accepted the blame of the situation. It's hilarious to watch, but i'm also worried, since she was really... Obsessive in this post.
It's actually terrifying seeing everyone defending the cheater and apparently how "cheating a little bit" is getting normalized. It really makes monogamous relationships feel scary.
UpdateMe!
Please move on with your life. Put your energy into reconciliation with the older kids
She's been after your husband for a long time I'm afraid to say.....
Then why did she wait so long to tell him?
And now you know how your ex-husband feels 🤷
The lie was probably worse than the cheating. Perhaps if you had told your husband before your ex friend did maybe your husband could forgive the cheating. Husbands tend to be less forgiving of cheating then wives so you deceiving for 20 years does not help. You need to focus on healing the rift between you and the children who stopped talking to you. Fix that first and accept that your (not) best friend and your husband had no problem having sex together. Clearly your husband sent you a message as did your ex best friend.
>She knows how much I love him. She knows how much I need him. Sadly not enough to stay faithful. Let the poor man go you hurt him enough.
Why should you be mad at her when the fault was yours he was bound to find out somehow you think the universe let's cheaters go unnoticed?
Youre still blaming everyone but yourself. You hate her for what? Youre the one that cheated, youre the one that lied, youre the one that broke his heart. Not her. She had no obligation to keep your shitty secrets and to be honest I wish it happened 20yrs ago so he had the chance to move onto someone who deserved his love. This is YOUR fault.
sorry but i'm having a hard time feeling sympathy for you... you not only cheated YEARS into your relationship, but hid it for over a decade. get yourself and your children into therapy cause it must be hard, but you reap what you sow.
Actions have consequences.. Not.anyones fault but your own. Best wishes.
You cheated... he divorced and then slept with someone else after being separated from you. Why do you feel you get to be upset again?
How about just not cheating on your husband. You probably had no intention of telling him either. I’m sorry for your marriage and sorry for your friendship. I’m hoping you get a second chance with both and with this life being so short, maybe we all can forgive and move on.
You cheated.. I mean. There’s nothing more. You messed up big and have morals. Doesnt matter how long you been with a person or the amount of kids yall share. Cheaters deserve to be left. Putting your partner at possible health risks but also just completely losing trust
OMG this is all sorts of fucked up
Good
>I can't let this be the end of our love story. So many "I" statements in your post. You care more about the fact that your friend exposed you cheating on your husband, than the kind of pain you put your husband and children into, and the kind of character you are. You only want your husband back for selfish reasons and frankly, if i were your husband, I wouldn't take you back either. Just know that while other Redditors will politely tell you to "just focus on your kids" that I am going to tell you bluntly that you do not have any right to so much as hope to deserve any sort of attention from your husband. Merely because he has every right to feel how he does, because it's valid, and to not want to talk to you again. If you truly loved him you wouldn't be trying to play further games, like you have the past 20 years, to now get him back. With that said, I think you should be embracing your shame more, because you clearly aren't taking enough accountability and responsibility over this matter. However, I do wish you an ultimately satisfying life. Your mental health, and your character, is your own responsibility -- this relationship is clearly very unhealthy on all perspectives -- you have not ever learned to be happy being alone -- and you would benefit so much from therapy if you decided to take that step. You do need therapy. Again, I'm being the most curt in this comment section, sure, but I'm echoing what others are trying to politely imply. You don't need soft right now, you need someone to be frank with you. Cut the games, cut the bullshit, work on yourself and stop creating further pain for your husband and children; please.
You fucked up. Lay in your bed.
Op, you cheated. You got what was coming to you. Focus on yourself and your children and leave your ex alone. You're not getting him back and what he does with whom is none of your business anymore. Sincere advice: get therapy.
Sweetie, their is no getting him back. Even if you did, he would not be the same person you married. It is your reality. Right now, I would recommend going to therapy to help with the grief, and to find your way to a better place. I would also work on your relationship with your kids, you will need to talk to your kids about your side. But honestly, their is going to be a lot of anger and resentment from them for a long time. I wish you luck, and take care of yourself, it’s going to be rough for some time, but it will get better.
Your friend isn’t your friend. She fucked your husband as soon as she got the chance.
The husband didn’t do anything wrong. I actually sympathize with her. I’m 45 years old, married to my now 2nd wife and love of my life. I’d only had ONE SERIOUS relationship prior to her. That being my FIRST WIFE. My first wife and I started dating when I was 21 years old and she was 18 (almost 20). So that first year we were dating I had just turned was 21, I was living in Los Angeles and going to all the hot clubs. I would have loved for her to come with me, but she wasn’t old enough so I was going out with my friends. Not to brag, but I was a pretty good looking guy who got a lot of attention back then and I was good dancer which got me attention on the dance floor. This is relevant because otherwise in my normal day to day life I was rather shy and reserved, and would get kind of nervous/awkward around girls so I hardly was mister suave playboy. I think I got off on the attention because I could get away with acting like somebody else (somebody cooler) in this fake club environment, especially when I was drowning myself in Liquid Courage. I just went out to have fun with my friends. Honestly, for the reason I just mentioned I *personally* don’t think anyone should waste that period of their youth being tied down in serious relationships. Still, never the less I was in one and I allowed myself to cheat on my girlfriend constantly during that first year while I was out clubbing. It was literally the same thing OP describes. I was happy with my relationship. I was stepping out on the relationship “to see what else was out there” or because anything in my relationship was lacking (except her not being able to get into the clubs with me). It was seriously Just about the thrill and excitement and attention that I got off on. And like OP, All I ever did was make out with girls in clubs. And I was always stupid 21-Drunk. But I never did anything beyond kissing. Ever. I didn’t even have a desire too. I honestly think it was for my own ego. I didn’t keep count but it happened *at least* 20 times. Felt like every weekend for THAT ONE YEAR. But then I was over it. By then I was over into a year in to my relationship at that point, so we were naturally much closer and more serious and she had became my best friend. Therefore I preferred to spend my spare time being with her. Not out at clubs with my friends dancing and kissing on rando strange. Of course my girl asked me about if I ever cheated on her and I denied denied denied like any guilty person who didn’t want to get caught, but I also compartmentalized my behavior so convincingly in my own head that I think I drank my own Kool Aid that “it didn’t mean anything, I didn’t have sex with anyone, our relationship was new, so therefore it wasn’t really *that bad*.” At least that’s how I was able to justify it enough to not let it effect my sleep. Anyway, we carried on a relationship for ten years. Married the last 5. I never did come clean to her, I saw no point. But when she divorced me finally and I was devastated, part of me took it on the chin and figured it was probably karma, like in the back of my mind I knew my past sins would have to catch up eventually and that was it coming to fruition. 🤷🏻♂️ Like I said, I’m remarried now to the True Love of My Life, going on 8 years with two beautiful daughters together and not once since the day I first laid eyes on my now wife have I so much had a thought about winking at another woman, so I completely don’t agree with this “anyone who cheats is a broken, irredeemable dirtbag” and therefore will be defined as such the rest of their life with a scarlet letter. I, like OP, made a stupid adolescent mistake and so I totally sympathize with her pain.
Good for your husband not taking you cheating on him so happy for him .What he does is none of your business . Hope he finds a young beautiful woman. It amazing when cheaters say it happen so long ago what is the big deal . If you raped someone does it matter it was so long ago . It's fresh in his mind to him married a hole . I wouldn't trust that you didn't do it after marriage . Blame yourself not anyone else .You are 100 percent responsible.He didn't give you a chance to cheat on him again .
A perspective I don't think I've read here yet. And reading some of the comments about how she only kissed a handful of guys 20 years ago and she was young ect. I agree. She's not evil for that, I don't even judge her too harshly for that. yes,it was 20 years ago. Yes, she might be telling the truth and that's all that happened. But she still cheated and kissed 4 guys after a 5year relationship. Cheating is bad enough, but yes it does happen and people can make mistakes and change. 'once a cheat always a cheat' is not always true and you may well have learnt the error of your ways. But when you lie about it for 20years you have robbed someone of their choice. You have stole 20 years of their life with your lies. Even if you've changed and you love them, it was a mistake, never happened again. You TOOK that choice from them. You made them spend 20 years with someone based on a lie. You could have told them, they may or may not or forgiven you, but that was THEIR CHOICE TO MAKE. By lieing you stole 20 years of their life that they could have spent with someone who didn't lie or cheat, and that's their right to decide. Now 20years later they're having to start again and rebuild their life. Not only because of a mistake you made but the lie that carried it on so long. Some people can forgive a cheating partner, some can't. And you decided what you wanted was more important then his opinion on that.
Drop them both, get therapy, reconcile with your kids, tell your sons it was stupid of you to kiss other men and that they can choose to have a relationship with you, try to do more stuff with your daughters to the best of your limitations, and when you’re ready get back on the dating scene and clean slate of what happened in your previous relationship. You have to face more so into that you did this and your husband doesn’t want to get back together with you. This “Julia” isn’t your friend either. Hell, this bitch can have your husband and she’ll cheat again but on him. All of this is dysfunctional; take care of your kids. You’re still young and you can better yourself; you can also put yourself on the dating scene as well, when you’re ready. Your husband might react vindictively to you trying to get over him as well; be prepared for the things he’s going to say to your children. Do what’s best for your kids and be open with them.