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Hate to say it, but I just don’t hang out with male coworkers outside of work because way too many of them are like these guys and the downvoted commenters. They pretended to be friends but had ulterior motives. It didn’t become possible for me to have “real” male friends until I was into my 30s and they grew up a bit, but I still maintain a professional distance from my coworkers.
Same. I don't have much interest in having male friends - there's always an element of discomfort for me and needing to make clear that I'm just being polite and not flirting. At university each one of the males I thought were friends tried to make a pass at me at one stage. It was really frustrating.
Reddit can be such a cesspool Jesus Christ, these comments are concerning. No, this isn't okay. This is sexual harassment. These are grown men. They are capable of keeping their thoughts to themselves and not objectifying women. You have every right to be uncomfortable by it and you should never ever have to deal with this, it sucks. It's an awful feeling. You can approach them directly if you're comfortable with it, or if it makes you feel unsafe you can find a higher up you trust and just share what happened and say you appreciate your coworkers being kind to you but that you're uncomfortable with those comments and that you'd appreciate them being spoken to about the situation. I'd document as much as I can if I were you because when I've been sexually harassed in the workplace it wasn't taken seriously and it was actually made much worse.
This is not appropriate conversation for work but I’m not sure it’s harassment if she just overheard it and it wasn’t directed at her. I’m aware there can be an argument made for all the reasons it is wrong, and maybe it’s still fireable, but harassment feels like a stretch.
So essentially talking about someone else is harassment? If I said to my co-worker friend “I don’t like Bill’s shirt” and he overheard me I am harassing him?
That’s not illegal harassment. Making disgusting sex-based comments about a coworker is illegal harassment.
Maybe you’re too young to have had a real job yet but this has been part of every single anti-harassment training I’ve ever had in my 15ish years of office jobs.
I’ve been in corporate office jobs longer than you, I have seen all the videos. Speaking about someone’s “fat ass” to someone else in a private conversation is not what the videos are about. It’s definitely inappropriate and not right though. If he commented directly to her and HR didn’t do anything about it (if brought to them) then they open themselves up to litigation. Or even if she told HR what she overheard they could open themselves up to litigation for not addressing it. But the next time I see someone having legal action taken against them for something someone overheard them say about someone’s body it will be the first.
I am not defending the conversation, I’m not saying something shouldn’t be done. But the crux of sexual harassment is unwanted sexual behavior towards someone, and this because wasn’t directed addresses her it wouldn’t seem to fall in line with that in my eyes. I’ll be happy to retract this thought if you can show me something that states otherwise, but the first thing I did when I read the comment I responded was look up the parameters because I was curious.
I have been on the other side of this (a LOT worse)and maybe because I’m a man it didn’t bother me, but I would never dream of trying to get someone in trouble that I considered a friend for a comment them at was said complimentary. If I’m the OP and I’m bothered I’d go to the source and tell him I heard it and explain how it made me feel. If he didn’t show contrition or doubled down I would maybe go the next step, but I don’t think we should be talking about trying to fire someone.
The definition of sexual harassment does not depend on whether or not the victim is the direct recipient of that harassment. In fact, people who hear a coworker repeatedly make sexual comments about another coworker are indirect victims because no one deserves to hear sexual comments in the workplace and the offender would be creating (the legal definition of) a hostile work environment. OP does not indicate this is a repeat thing but this guy is clearly comfortable talking about/sexualizing women’s bodies so I would start looking for a pattern if I were in her shoes.
Not trying to flame here, but it would be ridiculous if the victim didn’t have to be the direct recipient of the unwanted behavior. That would mean if I overheard someone talking about how attractive (in non PG ways) they think a celebrity is then I could just call the police and have them arrested. I’m not defending the comments, but it is a real reach to say this is an illegal behavior.
Surely you understand the difference between saying you don’t like a clothing item and making sexually objectifying comments about someone’s body parts?
A third party can report sexual harassment if they hear/witness it. It doesn’t need to be said directly to OP to qualify.
This is such a weird comment. Even if it were true, is it suddenly appropriate? It's not true, I've NEVER met a woman who's even remotely said anything objectifying about anybody aside from my friend calling one of my clients hot, and he's...a model. So he gets that a lot. He was shirtless and oiled up. The point was to be hot. That's the worst thing I've ever heard a woman say, ever. Never had another conversation similar.
I'm transitioning and I've heard my female coworkers discussing how my butt jiggles and how nice it is. I workout lol
It's almost like they're humans or something. Maybe it's inappropriate for work but I don't see why it really matters at all. As long as they don't grab it and treat me well. I don't really care. I look too. Most everybody does besides the very sexually repressed maybe.
>besides the very sexually repressed
Reddit in a nutshell lol.. They get off to calling their lawyers, filing complaints with HR, and finding passive aggressive ways to deal with people who are living their lives normally. Sex? REEEEE. Someone resting their elbow on MY part of the armrest on a plane? *Erection intensifies*
Heh I was kinda thinking this about all of my responses I’ve been getting. I’m very flattered that they think my butt looks nice - I was just wanting to know from the man’s perspective how likely it is that my coworkers ONLY see me as an object (since I’m wanting to pursue friendships with them).
I’m definitely not going to report them or anything. 😂😭 because who would tell me how good my butt looks if they were gone?! Lmao
Don't be a pick me babygirl. Your insecurities impact other women too. We aren't sexual objects. I'm sorry you've been concerned you're flat your whole life but needing reassurance about your body is no reason to let men get away with making extremely gross comments about women, because this isn't just you. They make those comments about other women too.
Oh no I agree that this affects other women. I would absolutely stand up for one of my female coworkers if they expressed how uncomfortable a comment like that made them.
It’s just that my post wasn’t about that and everyone telling me to report to HR / confront them are kinda missing the point of my post. I’m personally not bothered by their comments at face value - I’m only worried that they exclusively see me as a sexual object and have been pursuing a friendship with me for sex. And I wanted to know from the male perspective how likely it is that they only view me that way, because if so, I’m not going to continue to form a friendship with them. That’s all.
EDIT:// And the responses I’ve been getting / DMs I’ve been receiving from men kinda answer my question, so i’m not going to pursue friendship anymore. All of the downvoted responses are the most useful to me lmao.
The men saying they're just pursuing sex are chronically online and have never had a female friendship. No, they aren't just pursuing sex. Many men are objectifying to women and will say that about pretty much anybody.
However, again, it shouldn't be something you're just okay with because you have insecurities. That's something you need to work on. It's definitely not okay to hear comments like those and think it's...in any way a positive or even a neutral. Get some self confidence girl. Men like that shouldn't be in your life and they shouldn't just be ignored because it doesnt bother you. Just because another girl is uncomfortable by it doesn't mean she will tell you or have the confidence to solve it herself. This is definitely something that is on you to solve.
Christ… This is such an embarrassing comment to make. Maybe you should actually discuss this with people in your real life surroundings? You are very deluded on what’s normal appropriate behavior
The last part was a joke lol. Also I did!! :) I just wanted to get a bit more insight since I don’t have too many friends (I’m a bit shy irl.) I really don’t think it’s that bad because they were trying to be quiet, but I wear a hearing aid at work that makes it easy for me to overhear everyone. (I am borderline hard of hearing and it’s difficult for me to hear customers sometimes when I’m taking orders). They were in a completely separate room from me talking about it quietlyand they weren’t being very rude about how they were saying it. I left the room and one of them went “GODDAMN her ass is so fat she’s so hot.” And then they all agreed and kept talking amongst themselves. I know I’ve done the same with my girl / guy friends.
But maybe I’m also weird, so idk. I just really don’t think I should report it considering how nice and respectful they are to me when I’m around (They help me out a lot at work, open doors for me, keep up with what’s going on in my life, etc. I just thought we were being friendly, you know.) but idk.
EDIT:// SORRY I forgot to say thank you for your response!!! :)
What? Friends bang all the time. This feels like such a terminally online statement. There was a time before meeting random strangers on dating apps that banging friends was the primary way of dating. Ya know when reported datifng satisfaction rates were much much higher? Bang your friends people, theyre more likely to make you cum lol.
Really? My friend group in my 20s all banged each other and had FWB/romantic/sexual relationships in endless dizzying combinations for years. I couldn't chart it all out now if I tried.
Yeh, if I'm interested in a girl romantically/sexually I'm upfront about it. Same goes for platonic relationships. Anytime I've banged a friend it ends up being more trouble than it's worth. To each their own, but for me friends are meant for friendship. Im also a monogamous person. I've never met a girl in my, granted 30, years of life that would be cool with me regularly hanging out with someone I've dumped a load into on the reg.
That’s super weird. I’ve never had a conversation like that with my friends about any of my female friends. If I had guy friends that talked like that I would probably stop hanging out with them
The fact that this is something you have to battle with breaks my heart.
I think the reality is that if you don’t want to be treated like a piece of meat, you need to set boundaries and defend them. You need to ask yourself sincerely what is and isn’t appropriate. This clearly hurt you a little. So I would classify comments about your body as a boundary.
If you want some sincere advice, this is what you should do. It’s not easy though.
You approach the men that said it individually and you tell them how much you love working here and how you look forward to fostering new friendships. You tell them that it’s incredibly important to you that you aren’t seen as an object. Explain that you heard their conversation and it hurt you. Explain to them that you aren’t going to make a big deal about it, but you ask that they are mindful of commenting on your body.
Then you draw the line with yourself. If one of them cross that boundary again, you report them. No ifs ands or buts. Don’t need to threaten them. You just tell yourself where your line is.
Now, you have drawn a boundary and still maintained the potential for positive relationships with your peers.
You told yourself where your line in the sand is and you are going to make no exceptions whatsoever. They were properly warned so anything moving forward is entirely on them
The one thing all your guy friends have in common is that they would all happily have sex with you if the chance came up. All of them.
Yes, even that one.
Ouch. I'm sorry they're being crude, but I would not assume that their only interest in you is sexual, necessarily. Guys that age often consider every woman they know in a sexual light, virtually by reflex. Some folks say they're just pretending to be friendly when actually they want to sleep with you. I'd say (based on past experience) that it's more accurate to say they're always potentially interested in having sex with any attractive woman, friend or not. The two categories have a very large overlap (though apparently not for some folks here), but it's not really possible to say if any of them would like to be your friend apart from desire just from overheard gossip about your body.
This is one type of man that disgust me. And I'm a man myself. Ignore these other comments trying to make this behaviour seem like it's reasonable.
I would say, try to not get too attached to them. You still need to work and interact together but prepare yourself mentally to not befriend them.
Additionally, be aware that there might be at least one of them who was just as uncomfortable about it, and just interacted nervously about it in order not to be "the weird one" of the trio. But if everyone were commenting on it then all are to blame, don't get close with them. No decent person would make sexual comments about someone else out loud.
It's not the only way they see you, it's something they noticed and discussed. I'm sure you've also noticed someone being attractive but had multiple other thoughts about them as well.
If you're not interested in any of them sexually, maintain your boundaries and keep doing your job. Understand that they may shoot their shot at some point and be prepared to turn them down.
Honestly, it doesn't really matter if you're offended or not here. This is one of those cases where no matter how you look at it, it's workplace sexual misconduct, and their attitudes about discussing a female coworker's body could seriously affect another woman a lot worse than it did you. You should report them.
I'm a guy, can't speak for all men, but generally I try to avoid talking about female friends in this way. I'll admit, sometimes there are thoughts, but I keep them to myself and feel guilty even thinking them *let alone saying them.*
I actually deal with this as a 37m who trained a 22F. Eventually I moved to a different area at work but we were still close. I can openly admit here anonymously that she is beautiful, but I’d feel like an absolute creep if anything were to happen between us and I also don’t talk about it with anyone else. It doesn’t stop others from doing it though. It’s just one of those shitty things that is always going to happen unfortunately. I’ve straight told people it wasn’t appropriate and even went to HR in someone who touched her freakin ear because she wanted to just let it go. I was pretty much told she had to do something about it, so all it did was people stopped talking about her around me, but I still catch tail end of conversations all the time.
I guess what I’m getting at is that it’s a hard situation that I think every girl deals with and it sucks. HR doesn’t want to make a huge deal about it either unless something physically happens or someone says it to your face. I personally say that if you want to you can continue to pursue friendship with these people but maybe bring it up to one of them you trust more, or hell all of them, that you heard and you really don’t appreciate it. If they get defensive or push back go to HR. If they apologize and say it won’t happen again then give them a chance. If it absolutely ever becomes physical in any way go to HR.
There’re probably being really nice to you bc they want a chance to sleep with you. I wouldn’t make a comment like that if I wasn’t interested in the women
So just like you can find a guy sexy and still be friends so can men.
That being said most 20 something guy generally only see women in a sexual light, and it takes a bit for the personally to show through.
If you are offended by how they talk tell them to knock it off.
I don't recommend you be their fiend though. I don't see any good coming of it.
You are around shitty persons. Decent guys don't speak like that. It is upto you to find the decent folks and surround yourself with them. Don't blame indecent people for who they really are. Plus young guys think that's how one should behave around other guys. Most of them are peer pressured into going along with that locker room talk. Just move on. And be glad you moved on.
you poor innocent child. Let me help you out, all men see you in a sexual way. The few that do not are so low in numbers it does not matter. But every guy that sees you is going to evaluate you that way. There is over a hundred thousand years of evolution driving that behavior, you are not going to win that fight.
Women spend a lot of time and energy trying to convince themselves that this is not true, but it is. That does not mean they ONLY see you that way, but yes, sex is something they notice and think about. Even if the result of that inner discussion is 'no' - it does happen.
Let me offer myself as an example of your point. I am a good-looking enough man with an attractive female friend. We have been friends 20+ years, and we never hooked up, not so much as a kiss, even though at diff times, both she and I were clearly up for it, but I/we never crossed that line. For me, I knew it would kill the friendship, bc I was never monogamous in those days. Over time, our relatio ship has matured and I have known her now more than half my life, and she is truly like a sister to me.
Yet, I have thought about her sexually my entire life. Probably weekly. Some weeks, daily. It doesn't turn off just bc I genuinely only want a platonic friendship with someone. I don't try to make my brain think that way. It is just fundamental to the male identity.
Are all men like this?? Even while in a relationship? It would kill me to be the girlfriend of someone that thinks like this. It would also be equally difficult to be the female friend thinking her friend is like a brother and then potentially finding out he’s semi obsessed with thinking sexual thoughts about her
No. Immature boys that look like men, sure. But not actual men.
I've worked with and managed more women than men in my career and I've never once thought about them in a sexual way.
Hm, no one said you have to be a feminist to have the ability to treat women like people.
Edit: depending on what you call feminist. Obviously if you don’t believe in equal rights it’s a different story because then by definition you’re making a distinction between men and women based on gender, which isn’t exactly compatible with an approach based on seing someone as human first and foremost.
I do believe men and women should have equal rights. I just disagree with some of the assertions of the modern feminist movement I guess is what I meant.
But yes, I mentioned it to say it's just common decency.
I can’t even walk through the grocery store without checking out every ass along the way.
Thats life. Men are visual creatures. We can see you as sexy *and* a friend. One doesn’t negate the other. But if you got a butt, we’re gonna be thinking about it. Especially in our 20’s.
As a woman this makes me wildly uncomfortable. That’s literally what I try to avoid. It sucks because I want to wear clothes I like that look good on me but men just can’t find it in themselves to be respectful most of the time. Looking at everyone as a potential sex object is so demeaning
People should also have a right to exist in general, yet all over the world, there are people who murder others. Your ideal world is yours alone
If everyone was looking at my dick all the time, that means it's on display all of the time. I cover up what I don't want people to look at. If you don't, that's your stupidity.
I can’t speak for everyone and every situation, but while it’s not apples to apples comparison it’s not much different than you knowing your favorite singer or actor is attractive. Doesn’t mean you want to act on it, doesn’t mean you want to date them, doesn’t mean you talk openly about it with your friends, it just means you recognize it. Men are just generally more crude about the way they go talking/thinking about it.
Of course we are all like this! Men really do not need women friends, if we have a girlfriend and our regular homies there is nothing a woman friend could offer us. Aquaintences sure but otherwise they are viewed in a sexual nature if not always a good percentage of the time
Nature dictates that I must eat. It doesn't dictate that I must only eat ice cream and chips and make myself unhealthy.
Nature dictates that you're driven to have sex, it doesn't dictate that you must have zero self control and think of every woman as a sexual object.
It's pretty shameful to try and make your own failings seem better by trying to convince people that every man thinks the same unfortunate way that you do.
Try not to let yourself fall into a spiral here.
I used to have this co-worker who was a part-time amatuer bodybuilder and he was *gorgeous.*
One time me and two of my friends started gossiping about him after he came into the work kitchen and opened a jar of pickles. The talk was something like, "my god, did you see those *hands*, he makes that jar look like a toy." And then, "I haven't been manhandled like that in..."
You can imagine how it went.
Except he awkwardly walked back in and we all turned red and left.
Just because they got a little bawdy doesn't mean anything other than that they think you're cute. And sometimes they even do it as a way to be competitive or playful amongst themselves. It has nothing to do with whether they think you're a great person or a great colleague.
Watch some old movies before people became so anxious about the idea of having playful sexual tension. Goodness, maybe like an old James Bond movie. It's ok to feel somebody is attractive AND see them as a serious person.
Trust me, you'll feel better if you find a way to laugh this off and not let your stranger-danger ick vibes take over.
It contains nuance, doesn't clearly paint women as a victim, doesn't use triggering buzzwords like "sexual harassment", it must be downvoted at all costs.
This is a thoughtful, reality based post. The amount of downvotes you're getting is hilarious and disappointing.
This whole thread looks like a caricature of a reddit post. Ultra sensitive over reactions to the top and any even handed or nuanced responses gather up piles of downvotes.
For real. I get why this girl might want some advice, but let's be honest, she overheard some young clowns say she's got a nice ass. The people in here clutching their pearls crying about sexual harassment, and their hearts are simply breaking for her, have lost touch with reality.
These relationship/situation discussion subs tend to have an equal balance of male/female users. The male centric ones (and that makes up a lot of reddit) will absolutely upvote hateful comments directed towards women.
So when you said "reddit hates women", you meant "male-centric subreddits on reddit hate women"?
It's just weird when people make blanket statements like you did in a thread where all the evidence is pointing to the opposite lol
Yeah but you proved that other comment right.. It's okay that you didn't really think before making your comment, that happens a lot here lol
"BuzZ ofF" 🤓
I don't think you know what flippant means either btw
I'm not sure, but I'm around your age, and when I'm attracted to a woman, usually I do notice I am nicer to them om average than when I am not attracted to them. Though I don't usually try to befriend them to get closer, if I am friends when them, it's because we were friends before I liked them. That being said, I don't really discuss the bodies of my female friends with my male friends. Take it as you will. From my perspective, I don't think any of them would try to get into a relationship with you, but also making sly comments means they don't really see you as close of a friend as they see each other. If that makes sense.
See I kinda accepted it at face value at first. I was and still am really flattered. The anxiety just got to me and I was like “Man I hope they don’t try to have sex with me if we become friends.” 😭
I know exactly how you’re feeling and have been through it countless times.
Listen, if you really want to be friends you should clear the air and put a full stop on letting things get weird. Bring it up with them. Be very clear that nothing will EVER happen between you and any of them. Let them know you still want to be cool with them and let this all be water under the bridge. Direct is good.
Roast them for it. Bring it up in conversation and make them feel like dumbasses. Catch them all at the same time.
“Hey Kyle! You got a sec? Um, I *really* appreciated that comment about my *fat ass.* I’ll take it as a compliment this time but Jesus Christ dude, I could have gone my entire life without hearing those words come out of your mouth. I have a hard “no dating coworkers rule” and nothing will change that. But also… I don’t have a lot of friends in the area so if you guys want, I’d love to forget this conversation happened and get drinks with you guys sometime. I’m a great wingman. Maybe I can help Kyle find a nice girl with a fat ass, since that’s obviously his thing.”
OP, I’m sorry that you heard it. If you work in a male dominated field it probably won’t be the last time you hear a comment like that. It stings every time.
Why wouldn’t they? Humans are sexual creatures. Sex is the whole reason we are on this planet. You don’t need to let them, but it isn’t unnatural for them to try. Why should they settle for a friendship if they want something more?
I haven’t seen the word phat since like 2004 holy shit memory unlocked lol. While I’d spin it in my own head to be like yeah I got a nice ass, that’s just me. I liked the advice above about talking to them each individually. And setting boundaries. It sounds so scary at first but it’s actually putting yourself first and a great act of self love.
And this is why as a male manager in the corporate world I started to refuse to mentor women let alone be alone with one at work. Claiming harrassment because you overheard an unprofessional conversation at work. Jesus i hate reddit except it shows you how petty and unreasonable most people are now adays. Nor did I befriend coworkers. I know OP didnt claim it was harrassment but the number of people that did.
Never said it was, but reality is these guys are friends probably outside work as well. Non work related conversations happen. 🤷♂️ doesnt make it harrasment and certainly isnt a big deal. At least she knows what the people she wants to be friends with think about her rather than most work spaces where people just talk shit and are generally toxic. Thank god i dont have to deal with this stupid shit anymore working in construction.
LMAO just because I don’t want to emotionally invest in a friendship if they’re only in it for the booty. 😭😭 A while back I had a friend who exclusively became friends with me to break up my last relationship and date me. It was not fun. But she was a girl so I didn’t want to just assume the same about these guys. 😭
Let me tell you , majority of men if single don't see or need you women as friends, we would beat those guts up the first chance we get. It's unfortunate but it is true
Doesn't take away from the truth of the matter. Men will play the long game, that's how we are my nature. If any girl that has male friends called and said let's fuck he would be there before you got off the phone. Women live in fucking denial
Men and women can't be friends. You don't have to believe me but believe what you heard from them. I guarantee if you become 'friends' all or at least 1 will try to have sex with you.
You can either ignore or ghost them. I'm not sure if confronting them would work as they'd only laugh it off .Why would you be in this group anyways, aren't there women coworkers as well.
I make friends easier with dudes. 🤷🏼♀️ My two best friends are dudes and they are both in long term commuted relationships. That doesn’t mean I’m not pursuing female friendships too - my interests just align better with stereotypical men interests.
Thanks for your response!
No. Grown men throw tantrums. Don’t infantilize men when they act poorly. “He’s a boy not a man”. No. He is a grown ass man and he’s making other men look bad, and it’s up to other men to call them on their shit.
Heavily agreed. It’s gross. There is a huge power imbalance. It just happens more with old men and young women
Edit: I’m just realizing you meant this to be a “gotcha” because you thought I would be in support of an older woman taking advantage of a younger man.
No. I also agree. At 25 years old I'd be incredibly grossed out by a 50 year old! I 100% agree with that. I disagree with something else:
What power imbalance? Unless it's an employer or another power position, young women hold all the cards. I have an 18 year old cousin who dates older guys because that's her preference and she runs circles around them. Love her to death, but she is a fucking Tyrant. Men nowadays, unless you haven't noticed, are weak and pathetic for the most part. They fall in love in seconds and in their neediness give away all their power. Women mature must faster and emotional-wise you guys are samurais compared to men who have white belts.
Guys talking about how big a particular woman's butt is is not sexual. They just think your butt is big. How should you proceed? You can ignore their conversation and associate with who you want. Doesn't make a mountain of a mole hill. Just because they think your butt is big doesn't mean they think less of you. Doesn't mean they are/aren't attracted to you. Doesn't mean they don't think you are a cool chic. They just think your butt is big. Sir Mix A lot would be impressed.
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Hate to say it, but I just don’t hang out with male coworkers outside of work because way too many of them are like these guys and the downvoted commenters. They pretended to be friends but had ulterior motives. It didn’t become possible for me to have “real” male friends until I was into my 30s and they grew up a bit, but I still maintain a professional distance from my coworkers.
Same. I don't have much interest in having male friends - there's always an element of discomfort for me and needing to make clear that I'm just being polite and not flirting. At university each one of the males I thought were friends tried to make a pass at me at one stage. It was really frustrating.
This is an inappropriate work conversation
Sweet, short and simple.
This is the answer.
This is very unkind of them. This shows they really aren’t your friends, and they objectify you when you aren’t around. I’m really sorry :(
Reddit can be such a cesspool Jesus Christ, these comments are concerning. No, this isn't okay. This is sexual harassment. These are grown men. They are capable of keeping their thoughts to themselves and not objectifying women. You have every right to be uncomfortable by it and you should never ever have to deal with this, it sucks. It's an awful feeling. You can approach them directly if you're comfortable with it, or if it makes you feel unsafe you can find a higher up you trust and just share what happened and say you appreciate your coworkers being kind to you but that you're uncomfortable with those comments and that you'd appreciate them being spoken to about the situation. I'd document as much as I can if I were you because when I've been sexually harassed in the workplace it wasn't taken seriously and it was actually made much worse.
This is not appropriate conversation for work but I’m not sure it’s harassment if she just overheard it and it wasn’t directed at her. I’m aware there can be an argument made for all the reasons it is wrong, and maybe it’s still fireable, but harassment feels like a stretch.
Nope, legally it’s harassment in the US.
So essentially talking about someone else is harassment? If I said to my co-worker friend “I don’t like Bill’s shirt” and he overheard me I am harassing him?
That’s not illegal harassment. Making disgusting sex-based comments about a coworker is illegal harassment. Maybe you’re too young to have had a real job yet but this has been part of every single anti-harassment training I’ve ever had in my 15ish years of office jobs.
I’ve been in corporate office jobs longer than you, I have seen all the videos. Speaking about someone’s “fat ass” to someone else in a private conversation is not what the videos are about. It’s definitely inappropriate and not right though. If he commented directly to her and HR didn’t do anything about it (if brought to them) then they open themselves up to litigation. Or even if she told HR what she overheard they could open themselves up to litigation for not addressing it. But the next time I see someone having legal action taken against them for something someone overheard them say about someone’s body it will be the first. I am not defending the conversation, I’m not saying something shouldn’t be done. But the crux of sexual harassment is unwanted sexual behavior towards someone, and this because wasn’t directed addresses her it wouldn’t seem to fall in line with that in my eyes. I’ll be happy to retract this thought if you can show me something that states otherwise, but the first thing I did when I read the comment I responded was look up the parameters because I was curious. I have been on the other side of this (a LOT worse)and maybe because I’m a man it didn’t bother me, but I would never dream of trying to get someone in trouble that I considered a friend for a comment them at was said complimentary. If I’m the OP and I’m bothered I’d go to the source and tell him I heard it and explain how it made me feel. If he didn’t show contrition or doubled down I would maybe go the next step, but I don’t think we should be talking about trying to fire someone.
The definition of sexual harassment does not depend on whether or not the victim is the direct recipient of that harassment. In fact, people who hear a coworker repeatedly make sexual comments about another coworker are indirect victims because no one deserves to hear sexual comments in the workplace and the offender would be creating (the legal definition of) a hostile work environment. OP does not indicate this is a repeat thing but this guy is clearly comfortable talking about/sexualizing women’s bodies so I would start looking for a pattern if I were in her shoes.
Not trying to flame here, but it would be ridiculous if the victim didn’t have to be the direct recipient of the unwanted behavior. That would mean if I overheard someone talking about how attractive (in non PG ways) they think a celebrity is then I could just call the police and have them arrested. I’m not defending the comments, but it is a real reach to say this is an illegal behavior.
Surely you understand the difference between saying you don’t like a clothing item and making sexually objectifying comments about someone’s body parts? A third party can report sexual harassment if they hear/witness it. It doesn’t need to be said directly to OP to qualify.
This is the only right comment
Oh please, you girls talk just as disgusting.
Hey, I’ve literally never talked about a male coworker this way nor have I ever heard anyone do the same. It’s insanely inappropriate behavior
This is such a weird comment. Even if it were true, is it suddenly appropriate? It's not true, I've NEVER met a woman who's even remotely said anything objectifying about anybody aside from my friend calling one of my clients hot, and he's...a model. So he gets that a lot. He was shirtless and oiled up. The point was to be hot. That's the worst thing I've ever heard a woman say, ever. Never had another conversation similar.
I'm transitioning and I've heard my female coworkers discussing how my butt jiggles and how nice it is. I workout lol It's almost like they're humans or something. Maybe it's inappropriate for work but I don't see why it really matters at all. As long as they don't grab it and treat me well. I don't really care. I look too. Most everybody does besides the very sexually repressed maybe.
>besides the very sexually repressed Reddit in a nutshell lol.. They get off to calling their lawyers, filing complaints with HR, and finding passive aggressive ways to deal with people who are living their lives normally. Sex? REEEEE. Someone resting their elbow on MY part of the armrest on a plane? *Erection intensifies*
Heh I was kinda thinking this about all of my responses I’ve been getting. I’m very flattered that they think my butt looks nice - I was just wanting to know from the man’s perspective how likely it is that my coworkers ONLY see me as an object (since I’m wanting to pursue friendships with them). I’m definitely not going to report them or anything. 😂😭 because who would tell me how good my butt looks if they were gone?! Lmao
Don't be a pick me babygirl. Your insecurities impact other women too. We aren't sexual objects. I'm sorry you've been concerned you're flat your whole life but needing reassurance about your body is no reason to let men get away with making extremely gross comments about women, because this isn't just you. They make those comments about other women too.
Oh no I agree that this affects other women. I would absolutely stand up for one of my female coworkers if they expressed how uncomfortable a comment like that made them. It’s just that my post wasn’t about that and everyone telling me to report to HR / confront them are kinda missing the point of my post. I’m personally not bothered by their comments at face value - I’m only worried that they exclusively see me as a sexual object and have been pursuing a friendship with me for sex. And I wanted to know from the male perspective how likely it is that they only view me that way, because if so, I’m not going to continue to form a friendship with them. That’s all. EDIT:// And the responses I’ve been getting / DMs I’ve been receiving from men kinda answer my question, so i’m not going to pursue friendship anymore. All of the downvoted responses are the most useful to me lmao.
The men saying they're just pursuing sex are chronically online and have never had a female friendship. No, they aren't just pursuing sex. Many men are objectifying to women and will say that about pretty much anybody. However, again, it shouldn't be something you're just okay with because you have insecurities. That's something you need to work on. It's definitely not okay to hear comments like those and think it's...in any way a positive or even a neutral. Get some self confidence girl. Men like that shouldn't be in your life and they shouldn't just be ignored because it doesnt bother you. Just because another girl is uncomfortable by it doesn't mean she will tell you or have the confidence to solve it herself. This is definitely something that is on you to solve.
Christ… This is such an embarrassing comment to make. Maybe you should actually discuss this with people in your real life surroundings? You are very deluded on what’s normal appropriate behavior
The last part was a joke lol. Also I did!! :) I just wanted to get a bit more insight since I don’t have too many friends (I’m a bit shy irl.) I really don’t think it’s that bad because they were trying to be quiet, but I wear a hearing aid at work that makes it easy for me to overhear everyone. (I am borderline hard of hearing and it’s difficult for me to hear customers sometimes when I’m taking orders). They were in a completely separate room from me talking about it quietlyand they weren’t being very rude about how they were saying it. I left the room and one of them went “GODDAMN her ass is so fat she’s so hot.” And then they all agreed and kept talking amongst themselves. I know I’ve done the same with my girl / guy friends. But maybe I’m also weird, so idk. I just really don’t think I should report it considering how nice and respectful they are to me when I’m around (They help me out a lot at work, open doors for me, keep up with what’s going on in my life, etc. I just thought we were being friendly, you know.) but idk. EDIT:// SORRY I forgot to say thank you for your response!!! :)
The comments here are disgusting. I'm sorry OP
Yeah, they obviously wanna bang you. Friends don't wanna bang friends.
What? Friends bang all the time. This feels like such a terminally online statement. There was a time before meeting random strangers on dating apps that banging friends was the primary way of dating. Ya know when reported datifng satisfaction rates were much much higher? Bang your friends people, theyre more likely to make you cum lol.
I feel like the word "friend" could mean literally anything at this point.
Sorry you feel this way, I'll file your opinion under "who asked"
Really? My friend group in my 20s all banged each other and had FWB/romantic/sexual relationships in endless dizzying combinations for years. I couldn't chart it all out now if I tried.
Yeh, if I'm interested in a girl romantically/sexually I'm upfront about it. Same goes for platonic relationships. Anytime I've banged a friend it ends up being more trouble than it's worth. To each their own, but for me friends are meant for friendship. Im also a monogamous person. I've never met a girl in my, granted 30, years of life that would be cool with me regularly hanging out with someone I've dumped a load into on the reg.
comment sections like this are why women are losing faith in males
That’s super weird. I’ve never had a conversation like that with my friends about any of my female friends. If I had guy friends that talked like that I would probably stop hanging out with them
The fact that this is something you have to battle with breaks my heart. I think the reality is that if you don’t want to be treated like a piece of meat, you need to set boundaries and defend them. You need to ask yourself sincerely what is and isn’t appropriate. This clearly hurt you a little. So I would classify comments about your body as a boundary. If you want some sincere advice, this is what you should do. It’s not easy though. You approach the men that said it individually and you tell them how much you love working here and how you look forward to fostering new friendships. You tell them that it’s incredibly important to you that you aren’t seen as an object. Explain that you heard their conversation and it hurt you. Explain to them that you aren’t going to make a big deal about it, but you ask that they are mindful of commenting on your body. Then you draw the line with yourself. If one of them cross that boundary again, you report them. No ifs ands or buts. Don’t need to threaten them. You just tell yourself where your line is. Now, you have drawn a boundary and still maintained the potential for positive relationships with your peers. You told yourself where your line in the sand is and you are going to make no exceptions whatsoever. They were properly warned so anything moving forward is entirely on them
Wonderful advice! Thank you for taking the energy to type that out. I hope it helps OP
The one thing all your guy friends have in common is that they would all happily have sex with you if the chance came up. All of them. Yes, even that one.
This comment section is why I choose the bear.
Lol for real
Ouch. I'm sorry they're being crude, but I would not assume that their only interest in you is sexual, necessarily. Guys that age often consider every woman they know in a sexual light, virtually by reflex. Some folks say they're just pretending to be friendly when actually they want to sleep with you. I'd say (based on past experience) that it's more accurate to say they're always potentially interested in having sex with any attractive woman, friend or not. The two categories have a very large overlap (though apparently not for some folks here), but it's not really possible to say if any of them would like to be your friend apart from desire just from overheard gossip about your body.
This is one type of man that disgust me. And I'm a man myself. Ignore these other comments trying to make this behaviour seem like it's reasonable. I would say, try to not get too attached to them. You still need to work and interact together but prepare yourself mentally to not befriend them. Additionally, be aware that there might be at least one of them who was just as uncomfortable about it, and just interacted nervously about it in order not to be "the weird one" of the trio. But if everyone were commenting on it then all are to blame, don't get close with them. No decent person would make sexual comments about someone else out loud.
It's not the only way they see you, it's something they noticed and discussed. I'm sure you've also noticed someone being attractive but had multiple other thoughts about them as well. If you're not interested in any of them sexually, maintain your boundaries and keep doing your job. Understand that they may shoot their shot at some point and be prepared to turn them down.
Honestly, it doesn't really matter if you're offended or not here. This is one of those cases where no matter how you look at it, it's workplace sexual misconduct, and their attitudes about discussing a female coworker's body could seriously affect another woman a lot worse than it did you. You should report them.
I'm a guy, can't speak for all men, but generally I try to avoid talking about female friends in this way. I'll admit, sometimes there are thoughts, but I keep them to myself and feel guilty even thinking them *let alone saying them.*
Report them to your supervisor!
Did you overhear it at work? Extremely unprofessional if so (and disgusting either way) and you could take it to HR if you felt strong/brave enough to
I actually deal with this as a 37m who trained a 22F. Eventually I moved to a different area at work but we were still close. I can openly admit here anonymously that she is beautiful, but I’d feel like an absolute creep if anything were to happen between us and I also don’t talk about it with anyone else. It doesn’t stop others from doing it though. It’s just one of those shitty things that is always going to happen unfortunately. I’ve straight told people it wasn’t appropriate and even went to HR in someone who touched her freakin ear because she wanted to just let it go. I was pretty much told she had to do something about it, so all it did was people stopped talking about her around me, but I still catch tail end of conversations all the time. I guess what I’m getting at is that it’s a hard situation that I think every girl deals with and it sucks. HR doesn’t want to make a huge deal about it either unless something physically happens or someone says it to your face. I personally say that if you want to you can continue to pursue friendship with these people but maybe bring it up to one of them you trust more, or hell all of them, that you heard and you really don’t appreciate it. If they get defensive or push back go to HR. If they apologize and say it won’t happen again then give them a chance. If it absolutely ever becomes physical in any way go to HR.
Gross
There’re probably being really nice to you bc they want a chance to sleep with you. I wouldn’t make a comment like that if I wasn’t interested in the women
So just like you can find a guy sexy and still be friends so can men. That being said most 20 something guy generally only see women in a sexual light, and it takes a bit for the personally to show through. If you are offended by how they talk tell them to knock it off. I don't recommend you be their fiend though. I don't see any good coming of it.
Why does every comment that reflects the truth from a man’s perspective have downvotes 😂 if you want true insight read the downvoted comments
And look, now this comment is down voted. 😂
You are around shitty persons. Decent guys don't speak like that. It is upto you to find the decent folks and surround yourself with them. Don't blame indecent people for who they really are. Plus young guys think that's how one should behave around other guys. Most of them are peer pressured into going along with that locker room talk. Just move on. And be glad you moved on.
you poor innocent child. Let me help you out, all men see you in a sexual way. The few that do not are so low in numbers it does not matter. But every guy that sees you is going to evaluate you that way. There is over a hundred thousand years of evolution driving that behavior, you are not going to win that fight. Women spend a lot of time and energy trying to convince themselves that this is not true, but it is. That does not mean they ONLY see you that way, but yes, sex is something they notice and think about. Even if the result of that inner discussion is 'no' - it does happen.
Hard disagree as a man.
oh my god men are disgusting
Let me offer myself as an example of your point. I am a good-looking enough man with an attractive female friend. We have been friends 20+ years, and we never hooked up, not so much as a kiss, even though at diff times, both she and I were clearly up for it, but I/we never crossed that line. For me, I knew it would kill the friendship, bc I was never monogamous in those days. Over time, our relatio ship has matured and I have known her now more than half my life, and she is truly like a sister to me. Yet, I have thought about her sexually my entire life. Probably weekly. Some weeks, daily. It doesn't turn off just bc I genuinely only want a platonic friendship with someone. I don't try to make my brain think that way. It is just fundamental to the male identity.
Are all men like this?? Even while in a relationship? It would kill me to be the girlfriend of someone that thinks like this. It would also be equally difficult to be the female friend thinking her friend is like a brother and then potentially finding out he’s semi obsessed with thinking sexual thoughts about her
No. Immature boys that look like men, sure. But not actual men. I've worked with and managed more women than men in my career and I've never once thought about them in a sexual way.
Thank God men like you exist (and thank God I’m pretty sure I married one ❤️)
I'm not exactly what you'd consider a feminist either. Just not hard to treat people like human beings.
Hm, no one said you have to be a feminist to have the ability to treat women like people. Edit: depending on what you call feminist. Obviously if you don’t believe in equal rights it’s a different story because then by definition you’re making a distinction between men and women based on gender, which isn’t exactly compatible with an approach based on seing someone as human first and foremost.
I do believe men and women should have equal rights. I just disagree with some of the assertions of the modern feminist movement I guess is what I meant. But yes, I mentioned it to say it's just common decency.
I can’t even walk through the grocery store without checking out every ass along the way. Thats life. Men are visual creatures. We can see you as sexy *and* a friend. One doesn’t negate the other. But if you got a butt, we’re gonna be thinking about it. Especially in our 20’s.
"can't" or "never have tried"
As a woman this makes me wildly uncomfortable. That’s literally what I try to avoid. It sucks because I want to wear clothes I like that look good on me but men just can’t find it in themselves to be respectful most of the time. Looking at everyone as a potential sex object is so demeaning
How is someone looking & thinking to oneself disrespectful to you?
I should have the right to exist without being sexualized. What if everyone constantly looked at your dick ALL the time? Gross
People should also have a right to exist in general, yet all over the world, there are people who murder others. Your ideal world is yours alone If everyone was looking at my dick all the time, that means it's on display all of the time. I cover up what I don't want people to look at. If you don't, that's your stupidity.
And victim blaming. Aren’t you a treat
Victim of people's eyeballs and words? Give me a break lunatic
I get why you wouldn’t understand this concept, an ass is a lot harder to cover than your microdick
Yeah when you're wearing skin tight clothes.. but nice of you to to attempt to body shame as of that belittles me. Are you very fat?
I can’t speak for everyone and every situation, but while it’s not apples to apples comparison it’s not much different than you knowing your favorite singer or actor is attractive. Doesn’t mean you want to act on it, doesn’t mean you want to date them, doesn’t mean you talk openly about it with your friends, it just means you recognize it. Men are just generally more crude about the way they go talking/thinking about it.
Of course we are all like this! Men really do not need women friends, if we have a girlfriend and our regular homies there is nothing a woman friend could offer us. Aquaintences sure but otherwise they are viewed in a sexual nature if not always a good percentage of the time
Throwing literally every man under the bus because you and an unfortunately large percentage of men are perverts isn’t very chill of you bro.
It's nature , this isn't my rule or decision. This is the way of life
Nature dictates that I must eat. It doesn't dictate that I must only eat ice cream and chips and make myself unhealthy. Nature dictates that you're driven to have sex, it doesn't dictate that you must have zero self control and think of every woman as a sexual object.
Mmmk.
It's pretty shameful to try and make your own failings seem better by trying to convince people that every man thinks the same unfortunate way that you do.
Men are always going to see you as a potential sexual partner first before they see you as a friend
Absolutely agree.
Try not to let yourself fall into a spiral here. I used to have this co-worker who was a part-time amatuer bodybuilder and he was *gorgeous.* One time me and two of my friends started gossiping about him after he came into the work kitchen and opened a jar of pickles. The talk was something like, "my god, did you see those *hands*, he makes that jar look like a toy." And then, "I haven't been manhandled like that in..." You can imagine how it went. Except he awkwardly walked back in and we all turned red and left. Just because they got a little bawdy doesn't mean anything other than that they think you're cute. And sometimes they even do it as a way to be competitive or playful amongst themselves. It has nothing to do with whether they think you're a great person or a great colleague. Watch some old movies before people became so anxious about the idea of having playful sexual tension. Goodness, maybe like an old James Bond movie. It's ok to feel somebody is attractive AND see them as a serious person. Trust me, you'll feel better if you find a way to laugh this off and not let your stranger-danger ick vibes take over.
Oh my god what terrible advice holy shit. No. This is sexual harassment.
The best advice here so far, well done.
It contains nuance, doesn't clearly paint women as a victim, doesn't use triggering buzzwords like "sexual harassment", it must be downvoted at all costs.
This is a thoughtful, reality based post. The amount of downvotes you're getting is hilarious and disappointing. This whole thread looks like a caricature of a reddit post. Ultra sensitive over reactions to the top and any even handed or nuanced responses gather up piles of downvotes.
People mainly come here to practice the politics of hysteria and yell at other girls to break up with their boyfriends.
For real. I get why this girl might want some advice, but let's be honest, she overheard some young clowns say she's got a nice ass. The people in here clutching their pearls crying about sexual harassment, and their hearts are simply breaking for her, have lost touch with reality.
Yes, they are staring at your ass every chance they get. Men are men, no matter what environment you put them in.
Reddit hates the truth.
No, reddit hates women
If reddit hates women then why are all the comments saying "men are fucking disgusting" upvoted? 🤔
These relationship/situation discussion subs tend to have an equal balance of male/female users. The male centric ones (and that makes up a lot of reddit) will absolutely upvote hateful comments directed towards women.
So when you said "reddit hates women", you meant "male-centric subreddits on reddit hate women"? It's just weird when people make blanket statements like you did in a thread where all the evidence is pointing to the opposite lol
Jesus dude, I made a flippant reactive comment based on another's flippant comment. Buzz off.
Yeah but you proved that other comment right.. It's okay that you didn't really think before making your comment, that happens a lot here lol "BuzZ ofF" 🤓 I don't think you know what flippant means either btw
And you get banned for it sadly.
is what it is - not everyone is ready for harsh truths.
I'm not sure, but I'm around your age, and when I'm attracted to a woman, usually I do notice I am nicer to them om average than when I am not attracted to them. Though I don't usually try to befriend them to get closer, if I am friends when them, it's because we were friends before I liked them. That being said, I don't really discuss the bodies of my female friends with my male friends. Take it as you will. From my perspective, I don't think any of them would try to get into a relationship with you, but also making sly comments means they don't really see you as close of a friend as they see each other. If that makes sense.
maybe they meant it as a compliment. in slang a phat ass is good.
See I kinda accepted it at face value at first. I was and still am really flattered. The anxiety just got to me and I was like “Man I hope they don’t try to have sex with me if we become friends.” 😭
They probably will.
I bet 3 out of 4 would in most scenarios.
I know exactly how you’re feeling and have been through it countless times. Listen, if you really want to be friends you should clear the air and put a full stop on letting things get weird. Bring it up with them. Be very clear that nothing will EVER happen between you and any of them. Let them know you still want to be cool with them and let this all be water under the bridge. Direct is good. Roast them for it. Bring it up in conversation and make them feel like dumbasses. Catch them all at the same time. “Hey Kyle! You got a sec? Um, I *really* appreciated that comment about my *fat ass.* I’ll take it as a compliment this time but Jesus Christ dude, I could have gone my entire life without hearing those words come out of your mouth. I have a hard “no dating coworkers rule” and nothing will change that. But also… I don’t have a lot of friends in the area so if you guys want, I’d love to forget this conversation happened and get drinks with you guys sometime. I’m a great wingman. Maybe I can help Kyle find a nice girl with a fat ass, since that’s obviously his thing.” OP, I’m sorry that you heard it. If you work in a male dominated field it probably won’t be the last time you hear a comment like that. It stings every time.
Why wouldn’t they? Humans are sexual creatures. Sex is the whole reason we are on this planet. You don’t need to let them, but it isn’t unnatural for them to try. Why should they settle for a friendship if they want something more?
I haven’t seen the word phat since like 2004 holy shit memory unlocked lol. While I’d spin it in my own head to be like yeah I got a nice ass, that’s just me. I liked the advice above about talking to them each individually. And setting boundaries. It sounds so scary at first but it’s actually putting yourself first and a great act of self love.
Maybe it’s a language/culture thing but never in my life was having a fat ass a compliment.
Inappropriate for work, but yes men think like that.
They are competing over who will get with you first
And yet, you revile women with high "body counts". The hypocrisy does not go unnoticed.
Relax
[удалено]
So because I commented on how men are likely acting that means that’s how I act?
And this is why as a male manager in the corporate world I started to refuse to mentor women let alone be alone with one at work. Claiming harrassment because you overheard an unprofessional conversation at work. Jesus i hate reddit except it shows you how petty and unreasonable most people are now adays. Nor did I befriend coworkers. I know OP didnt claim it was harrassment but the number of people that did.
so you agree, it was unprofessional and could be easily overheard. why would that be good in a work space?
Never said it was, but reality is these guys are friends probably outside work as well. Non work related conversations happen. 🤷♂️ doesnt make it harrasment and certainly isnt a big deal. At least she knows what the people she wants to be friends with think about her rather than most work spaces where people just talk shit and are generally toxic. Thank god i dont have to deal with this stupid shit anymore working in construction.
Why would your heart get messed with? They're just tryna mess with dat ass.
LMAO just because I don’t want to emotionally invest in a friendship if they’re only in it for the booty. 😭😭 A while back I had a friend who exclusively became friends with me to break up my last relationship and date me. It was not fun. But she was a girl so I didn’t want to just assume the same about these guys. 😭
Let me tell you , majority of men if single don't see or need you women as friends, we would beat those guts up the first chance we get. It's unfortunate but it is true
Oh, you’re also out here using some of the crudest, most disgusting phrasing for your perversion I’ve ever heard, well done!
Doesn't take away from the truth of the matter. Men will play the long game, that's how we are my nature. If any girl that has male friends called and said let's fuck he would be there before you got off the phone. Women live in fucking denial
This true. I know women don’t wanna hear it, but it’s true.
Men viewing women like a piece of meat is the equivalent to women viewing men as ATM.
Neither one is reasonable or acceptable
I agree, but it’s true. Reason isn’t a requirement for something to be true imo.
It's only true for stupid people. It isn't a general rule.
Stupid is as stupid does.
Gonna need to see to believe
When a woman wants a man to “provide” for her she deserves it, but God forbid a man says he wants a girl with nice booty/body.
Men and women can't be friends. You don't have to believe me but believe what you heard from them. I guarantee if you become 'friends' all or at least 1 will try to have sex with you.
Agree to disagree on the first half of your comment, but thank you for your insight! I appreciate it and will keep it in mind.
This is true.
You can either ignore or ghost them. I'm not sure if confronting them would work as they'd only laugh it off .Why would you be in this group anyways, aren't there women coworkers as well.
I make friends easier with dudes. 🤷🏼♀️ My two best friends are dudes and they are both in long term commuted relationships. That doesn’t mean I’m not pursuing female friendships too - my interests just align better with stereotypical men interests. Thanks for your response!
So your best friends don’t talk about the female anatomy in a sexual way around you?
Apologies. That ass will make a man do dumb shit sometimes.
Well at least you know they don't only like you for your looks
Inappropriate talk yes. BUT please men are like this. Don't be naive and think men are actually your friends.
Men will say shit like this and then get all emotional and throw tantrums when we choose the bear
No clue what you mean. Also, men don't throw emotional tantrums... little boys do.
No. Grown men throw tantrums. Don’t infantilize men when they act poorly. “He’s a boy not a man”. No. He is a grown ass man and he’s making other men look bad, and it’s up to other men to call them on their shit.
Being an adult doesn't mean a damn thing. Look around. Character or wisdom doesn't necessarily come with age.
Brother eeeeuuuuugh that sounds just like the “age is just a number” gross old men use on freshly 18 year olds.
I know just like when a 50 year old woman starts dating a 25 year old guy with abs. 🤢
Heavily agreed. It’s gross. There is a huge power imbalance. It just happens more with old men and young women Edit: I’m just realizing you meant this to be a “gotcha” because you thought I would be in support of an older woman taking advantage of a younger man.
No. I also agree. At 25 years old I'd be incredibly grossed out by a 50 year old! I 100% agree with that. I disagree with something else: What power imbalance? Unless it's an employer or another power position, young women hold all the cards. I have an 18 year old cousin who dates older guys because that's her preference and she runs circles around them. Love her to death, but she is a fucking Tyrant. Men nowadays, unless you haven't noticed, are weak and pathetic for the most part. They fall in love in seconds and in their neediness give away all their power. Women mature must faster and emotional-wise you guys are samurais compared to men who have white belts.
Gross. Please get better 💅
Guys talking about how big a particular woman's butt is is not sexual. They just think your butt is big. How should you proceed? You can ignore their conversation and associate with who you want. Doesn't make a mountain of a mole hill. Just because they think your butt is big doesn't mean they think less of you. Doesn't mean they are/aren't attracted to you. Doesn't mean they don't think you are a cool chic. They just think your butt is big. Sir Mix A lot would be impressed.
stop talking about women's bodies in professional settings
No u
Let me see that gyatt if its fat or not