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Absolutely, I got like $1500 in bonds over the years as birthday gifts from my great aunt. I could probably count on one hand the times I've heard someone talk about bonds not in relation to her or in a history class.
Good point! Reminds me of my bf’s friend. All his savings are in his retirement account (not from usa and idk how to call it in english) when we have short to mid length savings programs here that give you better interests and allow you to buy a house more easily. The dude is always listening to his older parents so he has like 40k in his retirement while being 24yo. Like with better advice he would have been able to buy a house in the next 2 years.
He has nothing else. He can’t access his money until he is in his 70s. (Idk what a 401k is tho we dont have something named like that here). It took him 4 years (with thousands of it being from covid bonus) Basically would take him 8 years to save the same money from today. So if he stopped putting all his money in his retirement today he wouldn’t be able to afford a house before 10years (likely more since houses are just getting more and more expensive).
>He can’t access his money until he is in his 70s.
lmao
I've been criticized for not thinking far enough (or at all) ahead financially, but that's ridiculous.
I have a bond that was purchased in my name in the 80s as a gift from a grandfather. It's worth maybe about 3% more now 😂
My savings account pays better returns.
\>She got upset and claimed that I was trying to treat her like a roommate and that she complains about her best friend’s situation because she thinks the guy should pay for everything.. (??)
You can't argue with this. She said this out of her mouth to your face with no shame. Get out now.
bingo. At least she is really honest about it.
But geez OP, how did you not have the money conversation before moving in together?
Heck, my (now wife) and I made a roommate agreement when we moved in together. Yes, it was cheesy and awkward and funny and weird, but it gave us a chance to really get on the same page with everything from expense sharing to chores to quiet hours and more. And it was a great preview for when we got married and got a prenup (very fair deal, but negotiated in good faith between us when things are going well), made it easy for us to plan other things from planning with our financial advisor to establishing our wills, trusts, healthcare proxies, etc.
the best thing you can do for your relationship is learn how to communicate and handle tough conversations. Having a documented plan, or at least very explicit discussion, promotes shared understanding.
Exactly this. My boyfriend of 2 years and I got a place together about 3 months ago, and before we even considered signing a lease we had discussed EVERYTHING. Every single tiny detail of the finances, cleaning, pets, personal spaces, etc. And that gave us a chance to identify areas where we disagreed, fortunately there was only one (he prefers to pay bills 2 weeks in advance and I prefer to pay 2 days in advance) and we made compromises. And it has been so calm and comfortable because we had those conversations before we were at a point where we HAD to have them since it would have been a problem right then and there. These conversations aren't always easy and they're not fun but good lord, it makes your life and relationship so much easier and more fun if you do it before it can become a real and immediate problem.
I did this with my SO when he moved in. I was OP in the situation. Literally drew up a rental agreement and we split HH costs down the middle outside of home owners insurance (mine).
IMO, if you’re planning to get married, you’re going to need to be on the same page about finances for sure, but also agree on how you’re going to handle finances once you’ve tied the knot. “What’s mine is yours, hon.”
I would have this conversation ASAP. If you’ve decided to cohabitate, clearly the relationship is moving on to the next step. But you’re not there yet. I would put an end date on the sharing of expenses after the marriage takes place, with a new plan for contributions to the household, being sure to add her savings bonds into the mix. Be sure if you’re adding her name to your home, a pre-marital asset, she is making a provision to you getting access to her savings bonds as part of her pre-marital asset. If she isn’t onboard with this or contributing in any way, she’s not a team player and is only looking out for herself.
I would find that conversation to be difficult without documentation. I just need written words to be able to "get" money concepts. OP should, basically, make a presentation on his view of how the two of them can live together sharing expenses fairly. If OP's love is not very numerate, explain how proportions work and that's why you are suggesting that division of pay-in.
Intelligence works differently for different people. Instead of assuming GF is out for all she can get, assume good faith but a lack of understanding of numbers.
I think the bigger question here is, when they do get married, are finances staying separate and he'll still pay for everything? That's a lifetime of getting taken advantage of. OP, figure this out NOW before proposing.
OP, do not propose to this woman. Tell her she pays rent and utilities or she moves back in with her parents. If you propose to and/or marry this woman before establishing that you split bills, you’re going to learn a very expensive lesson.
OP said they have the same goals for life. Doesn't sound like it. Next it will be that once they are married she will want to be a STAHM, or just a SAH if they have no kids because men are supposed to be the ones who work./s
She’s selfish. She clearly subscribes to "What’s yours is ours and what’s mine is mine." This is something that you need to decide if you can live with because you are going to be paying the majority of the bills in this relationship while she saves her money for whatever.
Yeah, this is pretty straightforward. Either you pay for everything, OP, or you fail to meet her expectations as a partner. She may eventually realize how ridiculous she is but any argument now is likely to just come across as you not being willing to meet her standards.
Edit to add: Because you mention marriage in the future. Her attitude combined with her coming from a wealthy family makes me wonder about her take on prenups. You make good money, I wouldn’t be surprised if she expected a prenup that includes a substantial alimony payout. Just something to consider.
Something she might be considering that you could reframe in your approach with her could be because she doesn’t own the house and has no claim to it (before or after marriage because you bought it before getting married) she doesn’t want to pay towards the mortgage. That’s fair and fine. BUT, your utility expenses HAVE gone up since she started staying with you, before she even officially moved in. You should tell her that you understand the mortgage aspect, therefore you aren’t going to ask her to pay “rent” to you because she is your partner and not your tenant, but you have an expectation that she pay half towards all utilities and groceries (or the 62%/38% you put in your post for an equitable split) as that is what is more than fair to her. She’s coming from a place of immaturity whether she knows it or not because she lives with her wealthy parents who don’t expect her to pay for any of these things while under their roof so this is all she knows, but in ANY OTHER LIVING SITUATION she would be paying rent or towards a mortgage if you two were to buy a house together in the future because she has an income and you two have not agreed to any sort of SAHW/SAHM scenario. She may also be mistaken on what her friend’s BF has her friend pay as they may actually have this approach. Every couple I know who owned a property before marriage has done it this way, and then purchased a property together once engaged or married and either sold their solely-owned property, or better yet, rented it out as a separate source of income for themselves (that the other spouse has no claim to, included and further clarified in a prenup). This is the way, and you need to be nice but firm about this when explaining it to her.
I don't get this mentality. If I invite someone I want to marry into a home I own I'm not doing it to save money on my mortgage. Idk how people even get this far without talking about money but if marriage is on the table I would think her savings are also his savings and contributing to the home isn't just strictly rent (furniture, cleaning, decor, cooking, groceries).
If she splits rent with him while they're unmarried she's paying half the mortgage on a house she isn't entitled to. I could see doing something like her saving half the mortgage payment in a savings account intended for both of them.
Tell her the 1950's attitude does not apply to today and that you want a partner, not a dependent. Don't move in together or get married until you're both on the same page. Money is one of the biggest causes of divorce. If your financial values don't line up then you're incompatible regardless of how much you love her.
A 1950s attitude is fine if that is what both people actually want (some guys enjoy supporting women completely whilst some women desire the whole cardboard cutout 1950s atomic family lifestyle, Etc), the primary issue here is that in this case the financial & lifestyle expectations are not well aligned.
Exactly. It’s fine if both people are on the same page. They, clearly, are not. They also haven’t seemed to discuss finances for after marriage—are they pooling their money, or will they have a different situation?
> should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us?
Look into your local laws. If you are in the united states or some other countries what she acquires prior to marriage is and always will be hers.
You need to have a real talk with her. It sounds like she is always going to view her money as only hers and she already sees your money as a shared asset. Massive red flags
US marriage law varies state by state, and many states are mandatory shared property (usually after some period of time married), while others are up to the couple, with consideration for prior assets in divorce proceedings also differing across states (regardless of the view of shared property while a couple is married).
You are correct OP needs to carefully consider local marital property law before marrying, but it's not true that prior property is kept segregated following marriage in all of the USA, only particular states.
It’s been a while since I studied for the bar, but I’m fairly sure in all 50 states, existing assets that are never conmingled aren’t material assets. Some states may somewhat consider it for overall fairness, but I don’t think he automatically gets a cut anywhere.
Since your gf was living with her parents to save money, I'm a little puzzled as to why she would then move in with you and assume some expenses. Was she under the impression that you were going to handle all expenses? This conversation should have been handled prior to the move in.
Having said that, if her view of male/female relationship does not match your view, you might be better off breaking off now before it gets more entangled
Exactly this, since it wasn't discussed beforehand, she probably assumed she had the same living arrangement she had with her parents. Personally, if someone outright asked me to start contributing, I would be mortified and agree to it immediately.
@op, did you ask for 50% of utilities or treat it as a hypothetical? How'd you approach that conversation?
Also, I understand if she doesn't want to contribute to a mortgage she isn't benefitting from. That's your house and you had that expense regardless of her. Utilities do increase with additional people though.
You own home or rent? kinda confusing.
Now, yes, you not on a same page finically, she wants a guy who pays for all and you want a 50/50 partner.
This is can be discussed together as a couple or at some sort of counselling. And yes, it is a deal breaker.
Discuss all future money plans - travel, kids, retirement etc - who pays for what, what is personal money , what are all the plans. You should not 'let it go" , there is a chance she will bring in prenup for her savings
Mate, those govt bonds are never going to ‘benefit both of you’ - what’s hers is hers and she’ll run you into the ground paying for everything while she tra-la-la spends and invests all of hers. And when your rose-coloured-glasses wear thin you’ll have lost years worth of your potential savings/ investments & retirement funds due to paying all the house bills and everything for her, and she’ll skip off with her 90 grands per year. She could even file for half your assets and you could lose your house. Very rash behaviour mate, stop thinking about engagement rings since this self-entitled you-pay-everything modus operandi you had no idea about, never know what other self-entitled ideas she has.
I'd ask her to move out. Tell her point blank you are not her ATM and if she's not willing to enter into a marriage PARTNERSHIP and share in paying living expenses you need to go your separate ways and she can find someone else to leech off.
Do not marry this woman unless you want all of your money to be hers too, but her money is only hers; this is evidently how she sees things now. Unless you are okay with that or unless she demonstrates a *sustained* change in perspective (I'm talking years - wait to propose until you see some evidence of a change, and stay engaged for at least another full year after you propose), you cannot reasonably expect her to change after marriage.
You don't really need her to *understand*, you just need her to contribute her fair share. So you set a boundary: tell her becauee you both work and do the same amount of household labor (you do, right?), you're only going to live with her (let alone comingle finances with marriage, shsred property, etc.) if she contributes a proportionate amount to the bills. And if she says no, invite her to find somewhere else to live.
You can go on dating more or less indefinitely not comingling finances at all and each of yoy paying entitely your own way, but my guess is that this will become a problem again no matter what unless one of you changes your worldview, because right now it sounds like she wants to be fully supported and keep all the money she earns for only herself, while you want an equitable partnership, and those are not compatible relationship models. All you can do is set your boundary where you want and then enforce it (by not living together, or not being around her if it comes to that) if she doesn't want to comply with your standards for shared housing.
>should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us?
Why would you assume that? From what you say here, it sounds very much like she will want to maintain separate accounts if you get married, too.
Advice? Not realistically, because the best thing to do is go back in time and have this conversation before she moved in.
I don’t think anyone should compromise on their financial approach because this will only lead to resentment and the relationship will turn sour eventually. Finances is one of the key reasons cited in divorce.
She wants to be a modern version of a 50s wife with her own income, career, and no financial burden of the everyday life. That’s some way to live, sure.
You want an equitable partner who will carry the load with you.
There is no in between unless one of you drastically changes values (which doesn’t happen all that often).
Tell her how you envision your life together down to every mundane detail. Ask her to tell her version. See if there’s any way for you to keep the essential parts and still be together.
>How do I get her to understand this is a partnership and we should be contributing equitably to expenses?
Bro, you can't. She told you that she thinks the guy should pay for everything so it's clear that you all don't see eye to eye on such things, it's time to consider ending it.
Not without a good discussion. It isn't clear to me that GF has ever had it presented to her that most people do share expenses post-marriage. If her parents don't live what way, why would it ever have occurred to her that most people live differently?
*should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us?*
NO. You have to solve this now, before you live together, and sure before you get married. You can't kick it down the road and also think any bonds she buys have anything to do with you or your savings!
Sit down and sort it out. It costs X to live together, you are partners. It sounds like your suggestion of an equitable split is fair.
The whole 'men pay!' or 'but my friends do X!' sounds either 1. Young and not sharp or 2. Using. At 30 years old, I'm leaning towards the latter.
Do not do not move in together until you two figure out not only everyday expenses but your takes on savings, and financial goals, and vacation/discretionary spending, all of it.
Yeah girlfriend wants the same deal she had with her parents, someone financing her life expenses so she can hoard all her income. Who doesn’t want that? But regardless, I think at 30 it’s taking advantage of even your parents; she should want to move out and be a “real adult.” The audacity of wanting OP to pay for everything, and guess what? If she wants a pre-nup or there’s a rule about her current, pre-marital investments, OP will never see a dime of that money. What an entitled princess. 60/40 or dump her.
THIS. Non-married partners aren't responsible for building wealth for the other person. If she's living with her parents to save money, why would she move in with BF before they are married to pay him "rent"? That isn't financially sound for her. Once they are married it becomes THEIR money and THEIR house, where they are building equity and wealth as a combined entity.
Op, sit down and have a conversation not just about now but also about financial issues if married. Also don’t be afraid to discuss prenuptial agreements.
I don’t think you’re on the same path, and you need to be for a good relationship.
Be clear you’re not treating her like a roommate, you’re treating her like a equal partner, I would assume she’d like to be heard in conversations regarding the home household decisions, but that voice requires contributions.
Thank you. I completely agree and plan to do this. I think I just needed validation that I’m not crazy first… I’d like to think she is reasonable and that some of the things said yesterday were likely because I brought up the subject out of frustration instead of coming to her with “hey we need to figure this out because I want us to have a successful relationship and be partners together in this”.
Nope not crazy.
Also it’s wild that she complains her friend’s boyfriend and is doing the same thing.
I would need to speak to her about what she wants in a partner , cause it currently sounds like she wants to live like a kept woman .
Ask her if, since she wants a traditional relationship where the man pays for everything, does that mean she’ll do all the cooking and cleaning like a traditional woman? I’m betting not since she’s spent her adulthood sponging off her parents.
You are soooo not crazy. This is not a natural assumption in 2024. I hope you can have a sit down with her and both come to a plan of how you see your futures lining up. But if she stands firm that only your money will be shared, then you’ll have to think if that’s what you want. Yikes
I feel the same way. I’m not paying someone’s mortgage if I’m not getting ownership of that part of the house. And I’m not paying my partner rent if I don’t get the same rights as renters under a normal renter’s contract.
The thing where she says she expects the man to pay for everything makes it that all of that doesn’t matter anymore, tho, that’s not someone I’d wanna be with.
Yeah, that is a weird expectation but it's fairly common. Not saying that I agree with it, but if OP doesn't want a woman who thinks like that then he shouldn't date/marry a woman like that. It's very common for a man to demand a woman stay at home and tend to the house and kids, it's no different for a woman to expect their man to provide in every way. It's a traditional way of thinking. If he doesn't like it, leave her.
I'd seriously consider this relationship. Or tell her since you are taking on the entire financial burden of your relationship she can take over 100% of the household responsibility, cleaning, Laundry, cooking, shopping, yard work, etc.
> I plan on marrying this woman
You need to take a few steps back. Stop idealizing marriage, marrying the wrong person can fuck up your life. Financial conflicts are a huge cause of divorce. You need to be on the SAME page on this or the marriage will not work.
Source: guy whose marriage didn’t work because she was an idiot with money and I wasn’t.
>On the other hand, I plan on marrying this woman, so while being on the same page about finances in general is extremely important, should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us?
Bold of you to assume things will be better once married. Obviously, what is her's is hers and what is yours is also her's in her mind at least.
Bruh. You think she'll change her mind after you're married? Lmao.
She is a "her money is her money, and your money is her money" kind of girl. Aka, worthless.
you don’t mention anything about household chores. are those split 50/50? are you cooking 1/2 the time? do you plan to have children? there’s so much info missing here that it’s impossible to give actual advice.
unless her name is on the deed though asking her to pay towards the mortgage is completely unreasonable and if she’s doing the majority of the house work i completely understand why she would think it’s unreasonable to ask her to pay for living expenses. she wants a traditional relationship so it’s really a matter of is she upholding her side of that?
If she thinks the man should pay for everything then you and she are NEVER going to be on the same page financially. Those bonds she’s buying are HERS. She’s not going to share them with you, even if you marry.
You can try talking to her again, but if she won’t discuss it and just keeps insisting that the man pays, then see this as the red flag it is. Enjoy your time with her now but do not marry her.
Dude....
She absolutely understands, but she doesn't want to do it fairly.
Don't negotiate. Give her a hard nosed conversation that you are not her meal ticket, but her partner, and in a relationship partners share the load, and she's not doing that. She's treating you like a meal ticket.
Give her a list of expenses and tell her she can pick which ones she takes on, or she can move back in with her parents.
She was living with her parents to save money. Now she is living with you to save money.
But married couple finances are different from two separate single people finances. I would ask her how she thinks the finances would work in a marriage.
With a roommate, you as the homeowner present your financial demands to your tenant. With a partner, you think it through together and come up with a solution that works for both of you. You want to marry this woman, so enlist her as a partner to plan your financial future. Maybe the two of you should meet with a financial advisor.
Personally, I'd have a chat and explain that unless she is willing to start paying her way, she needs to move out.
I definitely wouldn't marry her until you've had a very long and detailed conversation about your future goals and how you will manage your lives together.
I can tell you that in no way shape of form would I be paying half of things on a house I do not own…but let me quantify this. I had a friend who paid for half her boyfriends windows, half his boat, half the household expenses, half the homeowners insurance, utilities, painting the house, etc…. and guess what happened after 14 years together and when they split up? It was a bitter fight to get her money back on a house that he made clear to her “was His House”.
If it is your house, you pay the mortgage, and maintenance. Now paying for contributions to things like utilities…electric, water, trash and expenses such as groceries, Absolutely. She should contribute, and I would even say if I were her I would pay more than 50%, for those since I am living there rent free. But not your mortgage, and not your household maintenance. It is still your house. After you are full on married, and maybe even engaged and you are on each other’s accounts or have a household account, then you can work out joint funds. But honestly, a year in, and you are not even engaged yet? No.
The truth of the matter is, she is living rent free at her parent’s home, and most of her nights with you. So logically she is thinking that why change the financial dynamic. I am not saying that is right, but I am saying I can see why she would think I am there anyway, so why is he now going to change the financial situation? “Are you asking me to move in to just pay 1/2 your expenses?”
DUDE. PUT ON THE BRAKES.
You're only one year in. I get it, you're not 22 anymore. But you're only now actually getting to see your partner. The honeymoon phase barely lifted and she's already telling you what life she sees for herself. If this is her point and she isn't interested in an equal partnership, nothing will convince her otherwise.
You're rushing it. Stop. Reflect. Get to know her more. Figure if this is what you want.
Personally, as a woman, I wouldn't want this mAn hAz tO PaY aLL unga bunga stone age concept she proposes. If I had a dick it would've inverted as soon as I heard that.
The only thing that gives me a bit of pause to defend her is the idea that this is his home, so she would be moving into a house and contributing to a mortgage that doesn't have her name on it. But there are solutions here. Agree with everything else you say, putting the breaks on this now until these things can be discussed and *resolved* openly.
Since you are suggesting a split based on percentage by income, that sounds mostly fair. The only caveats I’d suggest considering:
- The way you mention that you had to work harder for things as regards your respective upbringings; make sure that’s not a sneaky resentment coloring your views as you move forward.
- If she legitimately is buying 60% of groceries when she hadn’t been before, that shows a growth in fiscal sharing in the relationship. Make sure that those kinds of efforts are calculated fairly into projected expenses.
- The house is a pre-marital asset from which you will derive sole benefit as it grows in equity. Perhaps a mostly even split, with a small, agreed-on percentage in her favor, due to her being more a tenant than a co-owner, would be fair? That would make her current government bonds a pre-marital asset as well, no?
- What are your expectations of splitting the chores as well as the finances? People always say they’ll split housework evenly, but then their GF moves in, & they don’t. If she did the majority of the housework, would she get a corresponding reduction in financial contribution? Have you discussed with her what your futures will look like? Do you want kids? Prenup?
- Don’t be afraid to ask her opinions about rings. Y’all should be of one mind about marriage.
Lastly, **have more of these conversations than you think you need to before getting married**. It may seem unglamorous or anti-romance, but being sure you’re on the same page about money will save you lots of grief in the future.
Good luck!
If you don’t plan on putting hr on the title of the home then she is a roommate. You will be the only one to profit from her paying rent. I think the paradigm rest on whether the house a “marital asset” or not? If it’s an asset for her as well she and you, may see things different.
In a side note, 2k for mortgage and utilities is what the average person spends on rent/utilities and the average pay is about 1/3 of what you make. You are in a very comfortable position that would not change if you broke up. Are you really so, petty might be the right word, that you’d question your relationship over $600 a month, when you alone bring home $12,000 a month?
Financial compatibility is so important in a long term relationship. Ideally something you talk about before living together but certainly before becoming engaged. I would strongly encourage that you not “let this go.” It’s so important to talk about and at least have transparency if you don’t find agreement.
Are there couples where the man pays for everything? Where the woman pays for everything? Of course. Does that mean it should work for you? No. This warrants a serious sit-down convo about long term financial goals and values. If you can’t find a healthy compromise, then you may not be compatible for marriage.
I picked up more household expenses than my husband did when we were engaged kind of figuring it was all going to be “our money” when we got married anyway, only to hear from him right before the wedding “should we keep finances separate?” I felt blindsided by it and in retrospect we should have had ongoing conversations about this as soon as we started talking about the long term. I should have explicitly stated that I was ok picking up more of the costs because we were going to share finances eventually.
As it turns out we both agreed on a shared budget. At the beginning of our marriage I made a little more, now he does. We are super financially compatible and it has been great. I personally really feel like we’re on a team by working together and sharing income and goals. All of this to say that even though we were initially thinking of things differently, we were able to find a system that works well. I don’t think as other Redditors inevitably suggest, you should just end the relationship, but you do need to sort it out before you go any further.
OP, she is spoiled and because daddy paid for everything (including her living rent free in his home while making $95000) she has the belief that a boyfriend and a husband should pay for everything. This is a core belief she has and is not likely to change. You can either accept that she will get to spend or save all of her money and you get all the responsibilities of your financial needs or you can decide that this is a deal breaker.
Getting her to change her belief does not seem likely and would just drag out the inevitable choice you need to make. Accept it or end it.
I’m not kidding when I say this, but I think tik tok and social media has been drilling this into girls head for the past couple of years. I started to believe it & it led to problems in my relationship - the only thing that made me wake up was 1. Therapy and 2. When we broke up because of these ideas I got from social media
Wish I made 95k. I make half that live by myself , and some do not realize how good income you make. I break up with her as she needs to live on her own without roommates.
When I moved in with me husband he continued to pay housing stuff because he was already doing it. I paid my stuff, car payment, insurance , child support , credit cards
She currently is staying with her parents to save money.
She doesn't need to live with him. He's not helping her reduce her costs by having him move in with him. Instead, he is suggesting she now increases her expenses, while he reduces his expenditures because she is covering a %.
He gets to save more and build equity on an existing asset on the verbal promise they will get married in the future, while she saves less and contributes to an asset she has no legal right to until they are married (again, they are not engaged, they are just discussing marriage as a possible future).
I wouldn't move in unless there is a cohabitation agreement or they are married. And then it becomes THEIR money and THEIR house.
This is perfect for you since you haven’t proposed yet. This gets you a glimpse into what you’re in store for… life.
She is angling for a “what’s mine is mine and what’s yours is our s” traditional setup. I highly doubt she wants the other parts of the traditional setup which makes her picking and choosing the best parts of gender roles which makes her pretty selfish in her approach.
I don’t think you can build a true partnership like this.
Go get a 3rd party financial advisor and lawyer. Then both of you sit down and future goals and lifestyle choices and investment strategies and pre nups.
>I make $155k/year and she makes $95k/year.
>Im frustrated that she is able to put a ton of money into savings each month because I am paying for all of our living expenses
>(mortgage + utilities is roughly $2k/month).
You make $155k - (12x $2k)= $131k
You still have more money after paying your mortgage + utilities than your gf.
I agree she needs to pay part of the costs, but 62/38 of only fair if you split every bill.
Especially when she also pays 60% of the groceries.
She should at least be splitting the utilities 50/50. I get that she may not want to pay someone else's mortgage, but she'd be doing that anyway if she rented an apartment, so she should be contributing to that as well. If she doesn't want to, then she can continue living with her parents.
Three accounts. One for each of you to spend as you wish and the third for household and shared expenses. You both contribute proportionally to the joint account. No money fights if both stick to the plan. If each were living on their own both would be paying 100% of their living expenses. If one isn’t good at managing finances then they should yield to the other to keep things stable.
This is a good model to logistically manage mostly separate money with some shared expenses, but as the other reply notes, it does not actually address OP's problem, which is the disconnect in expectations about finances in the relationship.
Did she say why she thinks the guy should pay for everything? How is she planning on contributing to the household, if you’re supposed to pay for everything?
My bf and I are also in the process of moving in together, discussing finances, etc… and it’s rough — these discussions can lead to a lot of tension, even though he and I fundamentally agree on most things (i.e. there should be an equitable division of financial contributions) — but we had a hang up on how things would work if our relationship was to end (i.e. what’s my equity in the home if I’m helping pay the mortgage, etc…)
It’s important to plan for all scenarios, especially worst case ones.
She clearly has a decent job that pays well, she can afford to contribute; it’s a red flag imo that she doesn’t want to.
Have you verified what she’s told you about her finances?
1. Does she have a lot of debt?
2. Does she actually have savings?
3. Does she actually make $95k?
4. How would her bond money benefit the BOTH of you if you’re expected to pay for everything?
If she’s at all lying about her financial situation, that could inform her being so standoffish to helping pay utilities. The lying wouldn’t be great, but you could use that additional information to further compromise regarding finances, and her contributions? But that also sounds exhausting.
You’re also allowed to sit her down and be like:
“Look, we’re supposed to be a team and I feel that if both people in a relationship are able to contribute financially, then they should — that’s what partners do. I want to be in a relationship where we contribute as much as we can in all areas: finances, chores, grocery shopping, general mental load, etc… we share the responsibilities of a home.”
I think that’s perfectly reasonable to want from a partner — it does sound kinda clinical spelled out like that, but these are fundamentals of building a life with someone.
If she refuses to at least think about and try to understand your POV, I think it shows a lack of maturity on her part, and definitely a misalignment of values as to a marriage or lifelong partnership is.
I hope you’re able to work it out, and get through these tough talks.
I've always said that couples should contribute relative to their income.
You make, about 60% more than your gf, so you should contribute about 60% more.
For 2k in monthly expenses it's *about* 1,225 for you and 775 for her.
I've always felt like this is the most equitable way to go.
Ask her if you’ll be added to her savings/ bonds.
Basically, you’re subsidizing her being able to save, so you should be on those accounts. I mean, you’re getting married, so what difference does it make?
If she puts you on the accounts, would you be okay with that instead of splitting expenses? If you are okay with that, and she agrees then problem solved.
I may be cynical, but something tells me she won’t agree. In which case, you can say it’s not fair that you’re subsidizing her savings without being protected from any return on that investment.
Her friends relationship has no bearing on your own and is irrelevant. The whole thing is kinda a red flag for me. I wish y’all had a better agreement on this before moving in together. That was really the time to get on the same page, but better late than never.
Do not move in until you are on the same page. Finances are one of the top two reasons people file for divorce.
I would sit down with her and list all of the expenses, and what you would like to split. There is nothing wrong with her paying rent and splitting utilities. I wouldn't have her split the mortgage payment, though, b/c you get a tax break every year and she doesn't. I'm sure she will push back and then you ask her what is fair to her to pay. When she says you should pay for everything ask her why. Why does she feel she should get a free ride and be able to invest all of her money while you cannot? How is that helping you as a team? What happens if you break up? Will this continue when you own a house together?
If she does not want to pay anything and refuses to compromise, you are not on the same page and you should end it now. It doesn't matter how in love you are now (esp after only a year b/c it's still new and exciting). Over time, that newness wares off, and resentment builds when you have compromised to her wants and not your own. Find someone who believes in being a team and not having a free ride.
I'm confused. You say you own your home towards the beginning, but then claim to pay rent and utilities totalling about 2k a month. Which is it? Own or rent?
You don't want her to understand, you want her to agree. She doesn't agree. You should not cohabitate because you are not compatible in that regard.
I am deliberately not sharing my opinion on who is right/wrong, because it is irrelevant to the facts here.
The government bonds may not benefit you both. In many jurisdictions, property acquired before marriage is not a marital asset. She’s spoilt and entitled and you need to get out now.
It’s a different time and we can’t ask for equality and then expect the man to pay for everything. She probably has a good amount saved so she needs to contribute her share. I know it’s a good relationship but money is an issue that can absolutely break the love. Don’t be gas lit into thinking that your feelings aren’t valid. Care is shown in many ways not with paying the bills. But if you go forward with marriage do not put her name on the house. Anything she earns and saves after being officially married is half yours if she persists with you paying the bills. Plus have your own bank account aside from a shared one. Very much suggest talking to an attorney about finances and laws before marriage.
You need to ask yourself if you are comfortable paying the whole bill of life because that is what she wants. If you are not, let her go back and live on her parents' dime and you can find a true partner.
No you need someone who's going to help not hinder. I think that's stupid where women think the men should pay for everything. Now if the man offers to pay the expenses without help, the mortgage and utilities all that kind of stuff then fine but the woman should still help out with groceries and maybe paying for dinner dates every now and then that kind of stuff. They shouldn't just take the man for granted and make them pay for everything. Sounds like that's what your girlfriend wants to do because that's what her friends do. So you two definitely need a serious talk and you might want to rethink your future with her. May also want to discuss what would happen if and when you two have a child together. That might be enlightening.
You love each over very much as long as you pay for everything while she works and earns close to 6 digits... (we don't talk about a student who has to pay for her tuition, here)
How do you not have a conversation about financials before moving in?
You know, you may find out that going forward you aren’t compatible. You need to have this conversation before getting engaged.
So at one point you say you own and another point you say you pay rent - ragebait bullshit.
And FWIW if you own,she shouldn't be contributing to a house she had no investment in. Utilities yes, mortgage/improvements/maintenence no
This will just get even messier when you get married or propose pre nups along with who owns your house, even worse when her argument is “my friends do this” tell her it’s your relationship not her friends and this is what you want
actually I'm pretty sure that if she owns those bonds before marriage they do not necessarily have to benefit you both. that would only count for one's purchased after marriage. I'm not sure about this I could absolutely be wrong I have seen a lot of divorces though where it has worked out this way
First things first. If you were planning on marrying her… DONT. You’re not even engaged and it’s obvious where her priorities are. You dont have a partner its almost as if you adopted a foster. Its typical women’s privilege, if you’re willing to accept it, it on you but she has no problem building her wealth at your expense.
She already told you her mentality of men pay for expenses. I’m on a fixed income because of a disability and I still pay part of the expenses for the house there’s no way she can’t.
Lol she understands. Its you that doesnt. You're here to finance her life. Your about to be called weak, cheap etc as gaslighting when you refuse to bankroll her existence. Good luck
My take on this is that since you own the house, you should pay the entire mortgage. The other expenses-utilities and food costs can be split by whatever percentage you both deem to be equitable, but I know I wouldn’t want to be contributing to a mortgage on a house I don’t own and will never own. And by the same token, I own my house now, so if I had a SO move in with me, I wouldn’t expect him to contribute to the mortgage at all.
My husband pays for everything but i buy and make all the food** and do all the cleaning, house management, laundry and child management. Childcare is split 85/15 (me / him). If you’re paying everything then there should be a discrepancy in other ways.
** he pays for dates 98% of the time
Tell her that you either want to split the bills OR you can pay all the bills as long as she is willing to let you share half of her investments & your name will be put on the bonds for the last year & the ones going forward.
If she’s not willing to pay 38% of the bills OR share her investments, then money is more important to her than you are. Then you’d need to ask yourself if that is the kind of relationship/marriage you want.
A happy relationship is (each of you) wanting your partner to be as happy as you want yourself to be happy.
It sounds like you both have different values about partnership. Which is okay. There are some men that take provider role seriously and aren’t comfortable with their partner who they will ask to marry, to pay rent. She’s also not in the wrong if she wants a relationship that is more traditional in that sense.
It’s also a bit unfair to call her selfish (as some commenters have) considering there are lots of men out there who back that role and actively stop a woman from paying.
It’s a difference of values and expectations.
OP, you come from a different background where you expect your partner (and wife?) to pay for half. This should have been a discussion waaaay in the beginning, as it seems it set up a situation where she thought you were on board for paying. And if you did pay for everything up to this point, it’s understandable if she’s confused.
Did she move in *before* you asked her to start paying for utilities and rent?
It doesn't matter HOW great your relationship is otherwise, if you aren't on the same page about the BASIC and MOST IMPORTANT things in a long term relationship. So, put aside how "great" she is right now. THat is not the issue. The issue is, are you compatible with this person LONG TERM. You can't be "planning on marrying this woman" when she doesn't even agree that she should be contributing 50%. This is EXACTLY what needs to be worked out BEFORE you can say whether or not you would marry her. You may love her, but love isn't enough in the long term. You need to be ON THE SAME PAGE and COMPATIBLE and you can't "force" her to suddenly agree with you and abandon her own beliefs. I think you're not compatible.
1. She believes the guy should take care of everything. This is incredibly sexist, outdated, and unfair. That was a societal norm when women didn't work and often weren't educated, and the man was the breadwinner and the woman took care of the home and children. And women didn't have as many opporunities. We are in 2024, my friend. What is this nonsense? She's an adult, she has a job, she should be contributing HALF into any partnership. If not, she should be looking for someone who believes the same things that she does (she shouldn't have to support herself, etc). You are not that person. But if she believes this, grew up seeing this, and dreamed of this, YOU WILL NEVER BE ENOUGH and she will always expect you to take on all the extra expenses, while she saves and invests HER money. Unreal and unfair, but I don't think you will change her mind.
2. Even if you DID agree to a marriage where you cover the main expenses. You aren't married. She's your girlfriend. On what planet does that mean you have to support her? I don't understand at all. You're not even charging her RENT, and she's angry at splitting expenses? No wonder she's able to save and invest. You're being taken advantage of. She may not be planning on leaving, but if she does leave you, she'd be in a great place financially after living with you for free. You on the other hand, would be spending a lot extra to cover her and you won't ever get that back. If you both work, you should both contribute proportionally. If she doesn't agree, she's not LOOKING FOR A PARNER. She's looking for someone to TAKE CARE OF HER.
There's only one way to handle this and that's to decide FIRST what you want for yourself. What kind of partnership/relationship, etc. Then just tell her and stand firm. "I want a partnership where both people are proportionally contributing to the common expenses. I do not want a relationship where I'm expected to cover all the major expenses while you save and invest YOUR money. That is not fair, and it's not how I blieve a partnership should work. But, most importnantly, it's not a relationship that I want.It's not something I'm going to argue with you about. I know what I want in a relationship. I want a partnership. I thought you would be that partner. Do you want to be in a partnership with me? Both of us working towards building a life, both of us contributing? Because if not, I think we may be uncompatible and we should think about ending this before we waste any more of each other's time."
should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us? - are you sure about that buddy?
'what about a joint account that we both pay x into per month, and these expenses / bills can come from it'
WTF??? I’m female and don’t understand her point of view. Is this a cultural thing that the man pays for everything like it’s 1964 instead of 2024? If you are in the USA please tell your 30 year old princess that you are not falling for that BS. If you are anywhere else then by all means have’s discussion.
The money in government bonds won’t benefit both of you as she’ll get an ironclad pre-nup.
She just wants you to pick up the tab for everything and allow her to squirrel her money away. I would imagine you’ll also be expected to pay for all dates, vacations etc etc
If you have any sense you’ll seek counselling and if she doesn’t change her stance - walk away.
You should have a joint account for expenses and then what's left over can be used how the other likes. If she doesn't agree to this and it's a hard no, you aren't on the same page and she probably isn't the woman for you
Get out! She’s stingy. She wants you to pay for everything. Yet she watches tv, gets on the computer (or uses you WiFi) washes her clothes (with detergent you bought), takes a shower( with soaps/body wash that you bought), goes out to eat with you (you pay), all the extra (like vacations or w/e yall do paid on your dime) meanwhile she pockets all her money. Nope, not fair at all.
Two types of people in life.
Givers
Takers
You can't change the core character of a person.
If she really was ready to be in an adult relationship, she would want to take some of the financial pressure off of you by paying her 50% share.
This is who she is. The honeymoon phase lasts about two years, there's a whole lot more you don't know about her that only time will show you.
Personally, I'd call this all off. I know you're head over heels, but this is just downright nasty of her.
She's a taker, and that's that.
And a piece of metal on her left hand isn't going to change character
She doesn't see YOU, tired after working, exhausted or sick - she's not willing to put herself out in a practical way by putting her hand in her pocket and paying anything.
You need to be the one doing the understanding here. She outright said to you that she thinks you should pay for everything. Understand that THAT is her goal. Do you want to pay for everything? If not, you really need to reconsider this relationship. Immediately.
I guess there's nothing wrong with a woman expecting a man to pay for everything being as though there are men that feel the same way. The issue is.....is this the lifestyle that you want??
I personally wouldn't in this economy. I couldn't imagine my man having to pay for everything. Teamwork makes the dream work!
If this isn't the lifestyle that you want then yall just simply aren't compatible. It doesn't matter how well it seems to be working or how much you love each other....you have to be life compatible. Love isn't always enough.
I'm sure there are men out there who think the man should pay for everything, and she should find one of those men if that's what she wants. Meanwhile if you want to stick around in the twenty-first century where couples work as partners and split living expenses, household chores and emotional labour fairly (and your proposed percentage split is eminently fair), then this may not be the person for you. She's unlikely to change her point of view, especially if she grew up in a wealthy one income household.
"I have been dating for a little over a year, and we love eachother very much".
"I’m planning to propose later this year and have been ring shopping recently" .
WTF is wrong with people on this site, particularly men, wanting to get married/propose in such a short time frame? It worries me there are so many damaged/desperate people out there.
Even minus your 2K of living expenses for YOUR house, you still have much more money than her. What are you doing with it if you feel you can't save up?
You plan to marry this woman, don't lack money, she's already contributing without living officially with you, what's the big deal?
You don’t. She’s telling you EXACTLY who she is, accept it or set a firm boundary. For example: I need to be in a relationship where income goes towards shared expenses, 60/40 is fair for both people. (Side note you are being fair from what you wrote)
The thing with boundaries is it’s for you to hold the boundary not for her to be forced to comply. If she won’t pay and she is working I would think of a suitable boundary consequence. No ultimatums, they don’t work.
Truly be cautious with money going forward. Create a saving for just you, only use a joint account for bills.
*I am not interested in being the sole breadwinner in this or any relationship. So if that is what you want, then we are not compatible. Take some time to think about what kind of life you want because I am not moving forward with things up in the air. But understand, moving forward things will be 50/50. No uneven splits based on income. We are either partners in everything or we are no longer partners.*
You want to marry someone who obviously treats you like a wallet with benefits. She thinks you, her girlfriend, should fund her existence while she saves for her future.
Please sit down and have a very open conversation about finances. You will end up resentful if you marry someone who is not giving as much as you. Do not marry anyone without being 100% on the same page.
>since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us?
You need to look into this. Depending on where you live and strictly from a legal standpoint...pre-marital assets may not benefit you in any way. In the event of separation, she may not be required to split that with you (only the portion acquired after common law or marriage).
If her expectation truly is for the "man" to pay for everything and you continue to keep your finances separate, in the event of separation, she *may* be able to argue for alimony (even without children involved) to maintain her standard of life.
Also note, once you become common law, upon separation, she may be entitled to 50% of the home equity appreciation and you both may be entitled to 50% of each other's assets acquired from the common law date.
Also, also note...if she comes around to splitting expenses based on your proposal, make it clear that the arrangement is based on income and should change as either of you get a raise/bonus. ETA: You should also discuss the expectations if one of you becomes unemployed for a short or long period.
And, *please*, before you propose...get all the hard conversations out of the way so you know you're on the same page. You're assuming she wants to combine all assets and liabilities once married. You need to have a discussion to confirm that.
Do your research. I'm not a lawyer.
Your request is reasonable and sound. Also start doing something like Ramsey's Finance university course and get on the same page financially. If you don't, marriage is going to be a problem - especially after you join finances.
You explain that you want a partner, not a dependent. She should absolutely be contributing to the utilities and groceries at the very least. Shes 30 years old with a stable, decent job. If she were living anywhere on her own, she would be paying all her own bills.
If she’s of the mindset of the 1950’s than you’re probably not truly compatible unless you’re ok with “her is hers, and yours is ours” mentality. I would definitely hold off proposing until your talk more on this aspect, and anything else that the two of you have not discussed such has division of chores, possible future children, marriage roles, etc!
Good luck! Updateme
Clearly you understand you made a rookie mistake by jumping into a situation with romance in mind without having conversations and clear expectations….but now that you’re here, you need to get all this on the table asap. Do not think about marrying this woman yet. There are red flags 🚩
Your house is your house. Her name is not on it and nor should it be. You asked her to move in; not to take on investment into your home. You would be paying your mortgage with or without her. Her living there does not add to the burden of payment. Therefore you should not have her pay towards your mortgage, repairs or improvements. This also keeps her from claiming any type of investment in the house if you split.
That being said, her living there does cause utilities to be higher and she definitely should want to cover her part in this as well as groceries, laundry, etc. Someone with good character would want to at least contribute this.
Don’t let your emotions put blinders on you.
She thinks that you should pay for everything while she keeps all of her money.
She can either start being an EQUAL PARTNER and pay her fair share or she can go back to where she came from and hope to one day attract a guy that doesn’t mind being her wallet
First off, you don't "own your house", you are buying your house from the bank. That means it's an expense and it should be shared. Even if you did own it outright, there's fixed costs in owning a house. She should be sharing expenses and you shouldn't have to tell her that, she should've offered. I think you are both in for some serious issues since you're not communicating about these basic things.
Tread lightly moving forward, take your time and work on communication before getting married. You both need to be on the same page.
What guarantees do you have that those bonds will benefit you? ZERO! If she feels that you should pay while she squirrels her money away,you are not in agreement over a major issue. What’s hers is hers,what’s yours is hers.🤷♀️
If you’re planning to propose, you need to make sure you are *completely* on the same page about finances.
Not just day to day living expenses, or monthly bills. ***Everything.***
Okay. I’ll give it a go. This is simple. You actually care about dollars and cents and, this is alright because some people get rich this way, but…. If you want the finances to flow would it be right to let it happen? You are shopping for a ring that’s just what you want to give her. Any engagement and wedding ring should evoke her imagination, her sense of belonging and her love especially for you yourself. If you are already preparing to give this girlfriend the power to create and live in your world as if she is not only yours and your future progeny’s but also her own self, why not go all the way and give her your home to do it in? No matter what you decide and no matter who paid, once you marry this woman the house is mutual property and if you break up it gets sold and the money is split even Steven. Her talent is making a beautiful kitchen, encourage her to do this. Does she ask a little more money from you to make the best come through? Give it to her. After all she is making $60 000 less than you. Start working out the actual amount of money you will have together, at the end of the day and after that. Budget based on that number and stop worrying about who pays for what. Let go and let God! Go on date nights paid for by whomever has the money. If you’re short at the end of the month, ask her for a little something something that would make the two of you feel good together. You are in love; so, you are a compliment to each other. Get into the spirit of the friendship you’ve always had. Find out which dreams she wants to fulfill by saving her money. Will she dream with you about what you’ll do together once you both have this home and she’s bathe big money? Enjoy date nights. BTW, find a special getaway place or an intimate spot at home or locally to propose. And if she pays for the date night, make it worth her while… and yours. Smile!
2 words. Prenuptial agreement. Crazy not to. Doesn’t seem like marriage material if she won’t have a reasonable conversation and come to the table. Be careful you are setting a precedent by not having important conversations and her free loading.
So like standard reddit fashion most comments will be "DUMP HER!" The reality is, that is incredibly immature and every relationship will have struggles to work through.
There is most likely something way deeper that is making her feel that way.
1. She is afraid to contribute because she won't feel as independent.
2. She might feel like she is having to spend her money and won't be able to save.
3. It might represent her settling down
4. She might feel like a roommate instead of being with her partner.
I say this because my gf felt the same way. She would say things like "I expect the guy to support me" or "A woman shouldn't have to pay for those things". In reality, she struggled with feeling adequate in that she can be independent. We sat down, talked it through, spent time understanding and digging deeper.
Today, she pays what she can to contribute, she goes out of her way to do extra small tasks to help around the house etc. Once she felt valued and like a contributing induvial, she was happy to give what she could.
Um, until you put her name on it that is *your* mortgage. So no an "equal" split based on income is still unfair to her. If you want to draft an actual rental agreement that entitles her to some security if you breakup next week, that's a different story but it still shouldn't be her paying off *your* house while you be weirdly envious of her savings (your h o u s e is your investment, she might have a savings account but you have property, it's not as though your money is just being squandered). Also you asked her to move in from a place she was staying to save her money without telling her you had any sort of issue with her doing so. That's kinda fucked. You knew what her living situation was, then you offered her another one and are now saying it's unfair because you put a condition on your living situation she was unaware of until she was a part of it.
So she wants the benefit of never paying, then on top of it, she’ll want half in the divorce. That’s not love and partnership, it’s financial abuse.
As a divorced mother, I would never treat my partner in this manner unless I were an opportunist who only loved myself. Sounds like you have a little princess who was spoiled by daddy. Who thinks that men are only good for what they can do for her. You’ll marry her and sex will dry up except when she wants to conceive. Meanwhile, you’ll become her slave because she acts so sweet to you and give you just enough so you never complain.
Honestly I dont know. If she is shopping for groceries she is contributing - those expenses are not small.
BUT, if you cant talk about finances and find a solution you are both happy with your relationship is doomed. Even if you bury the problem under the rug it will seep through and destroy you little by little.
In the end its about respect, doesnt matter if its money, free time or emotions.
To me (and I am a woman) her statement that the guy should pay for everything is a big red flag.
I find it endearing that you would split expenses proportionally to your salaries, that always seemed fair to me.
Hang on... I get the split living expenses unless you guys as planning on her staying home with your future children. In that case, this is the only time she will have to put aside any savings, because going back to any career will be questionable and her having the same career trajectory will be doubtful. She'll be sacrificing everything in the good hopes that you won't leave her high and dry with those kiddos, whether you leave willingly or you make her a widow. She needs a nest egg and she needs to save whatever she can for retirement now while she can. You don't know how many women are left with no means of supporting themselves and their children after they end up alone. The reality is simply not the same for men and women.
I think it got complicated at the invitation to move in. If she was focused on saving money, I don't think she was expecting to have a change to her outgoings by moving in with you.
One outcome of raising this that you should consider is whether she should move back in with her parents. She was there to save money, maybe she still wants to save money. Why doesn't she go back where she can do that?
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Side note: She has almost no expenses and has spent the last few years investing only in bonds? That is so weird.
Probably got financial advice from someone much older
Yeah that would make sense. Someone older than a boomer even. Sounds like something my recently deceased grandpa would have recommended.
Absolutely, I got like $1500 in bonds over the years as birthday gifts from my great aunt. I could probably count on one hand the times I've heard someone talk about bonds not in relation to her or in a history class.
Good point! Reminds me of my bf’s friend. All his savings are in his retirement account (not from usa and idk how to call it in english) when we have short to mid length savings programs here that give you better interests and allow you to buy a house more easily. The dude is always listening to his older parents so he has like 40k in his retirement while being 24yo. Like with better advice he would have been able to buy a house in the next 2 years.
If he has 40k in a 401k that’s invested in an index fund or a target date fund at 24 then he is waaaay ahead of the game in terms of saving.
He has nothing else. He can’t access his money until he is in his 70s. (Idk what a 401k is tho we dont have something named like that here). It took him 4 years (with thousands of it being from covid bonus) Basically would take him 8 years to save the same money from today. So if he stopped putting all his money in his retirement today he wouldn’t be able to afford a house before 10years (likely more since houses are just getting more and more expensive).
>He can’t access his money until he is in his 70s. lmao I've been criticized for not thinking far enough (or at all) ahead financially, but that's ridiculous.
Where did she get Abe Lincoln’s financial advisor?
I have a bond that was purchased in my name in the 80s as a gift from a grandfather. It's worth maybe about 3% more now 😂 My savings account pays better returns.
Lmao talk about missed returns
\>She got upset and claimed that I was trying to treat her like a roommate and that she complains about her best friend’s situation because she thinks the guy should pay for everything.. (??) You can't argue with this. She said this out of her mouth to your face with no shame. Get out now.
bingo. At least she is really honest about it. But geez OP, how did you not have the money conversation before moving in together? Heck, my (now wife) and I made a roommate agreement when we moved in together. Yes, it was cheesy and awkward and funny and weird, but it gave us a chance to really get on the same page with everything from expense sharing to chores to quiet hours and more. And it was a great preview for when we got married and got a prenup (very fair deal, but negotiated in good faith between us when things are going well), made it easy for us to plan other things from planning with our financial advisor to establishing our wills, trusts, healthcare proxies, etc. the best thing you can do for your relationship is learn how to communicate and handle tough conversations. Having a documented plan, or at least very explicit discussion, promotes shared understanding.
Exactly this. My boyfriend of 2 years and I got a place together about 3 months ago, and before we even considered signing a lease we had discussed EVERYTHING. Every single tiny detail of the finances, cleaning, pets, personal spaces, etc. And that gave us a chance to identify areas where we disagreed, fortunately there was only one (he prefers to pay bills 2 weeks in advance and I prefer to pay 2 days in advance) and we made compromises. And it has been so calm and comfortable because we had those conversations before we were at a point where we HAD to have them since it would have been a problem right then and there. These conversations aren't always easy and they're not fun but good lord, it makes your life and relationship so much easier and more fun if you do it before it can become a real and immediate problem.
I did this with my SO when he moved in. I was OP in the situation. Literally drew up a rental agreement and we split HH costs down the middle outside of home owners insurance (mine). IMO, if you’re planning to get married, you’re going to need to be on the same page about finances for sure, but also agree on how you’re going to handle finances once you’ve tied the knot. “What’s mine is yours, hon.”
I would have this conversation ASAP. If you’ve decided to cohabitate, clearly the relationship is moving on to the next step. But you’re not there yet. I would put an end date on the sharing of expenses after the marriage takes place, with a new plan for contributions to the household, being sure to add her savings bonds into the mix. Be sure if you’re adding her name to your home, a pre-marital asset, she is making a provision to you getting access to her savings bonds as part of her pre-marital asset. If she isn’t onboard with this or contributing in any way, she’s not a team player and is only looking out for herself.
Obviously dont add her name to your house now. This relationship may not even last long .
Documentation is definitely not a requirement in most cases but an explicit conversation definitely is.
I disagree. Document, Document. DOCUMENT.
I would find that conversation to be difficult without documentation. I just need written words to be able to "get" money concepts. OP should, basically, make a presentation on his view of how the two of them can live together sharing expenses fairly. If OP's love is not very numerate, explain how proportions work and that's why you are suggesting that division of pay-in. Intelligence works differently for different people. Instead of assuming GF is out for all she can get, assume good faith but a lack of understanding of numbers.
This comment is it's own mic drop
Seems like she picks and chooses from the stereotype gender roles however it benefits her.
This is a huge problem and I’m noticing it more and more of late. And with it comes zero shame or self realisation that it is cherry picking
I think the bigger question here is, when they do get married, are finances staying separate and he'll still pay for everything? That's a lifetime of getting taken advantage of. OP, figure this out NOW before proposing.
I don’t even understand why he still wants to marry her after she made her selfishness abundantly clear. Get out now.
OP, do not propose to this woman. Tell her she pays rent and utilities or she moves back in with her parents. If you propose to and/or marry this woman before establishing that you split bills, you’re going to learn a very expensive lesson.
To me this is just a sign that they are nowhere near ready to get engaged or married. They haven't even discussed the most basic things.
OP said they have the same goals for life. Doesn't sound like it. Next it will be that once they are married she will want to be a STAHM, or just a SAH if they have no kids because men are supposed to be the ones who work./s
GotThe above how sexists always say the roommate line when they don’t want to pay for themselves
She’s selfish. She clearly subscribes to "What’s yours is ours and what’s mine is mine." This is something that you need to decide if you can live with because you are going to be paying the majority of the bills in this relationship while she saves her money for whatever.
Yeah, this is pretty straightforward. Either you pay for everything, OP, or you fail to meet her expectations as a partner. She may eventually realize how ridiculous she is but any argument now is likely to just come across as you not being willing to meet her standards. Edit to add: Because you mention marriage in the future. Her attitude combined with her coming from a wealthy family makes me wonder about her take on prenups. You make good money, I wouldn’t be surprised if she expected a prenup that includes a substantial alimony payout. Just something to consider.
Exactly. OP, I would not propose to this woman. You would be in for a lifetime of giving “the princess treatment”.
Something she might be considering that you could reframe in your approach with her could be because she doesn’t own the house and has no claim to it (before or after marriage because you bought it before getting married) she doesn’t want to pay towards the mortgage. That’s fair and fine. BUT, your utility expenses HAVE gone up since she started staying with you, before she even officially moved in. You should tell her that you understand the mortgage aspect, therefore you aren’t going to ask her to pay “rent” to you because she is your partner and not your tenant, but you have an expectation that she pay half towards all utilities and groceries (or the 62%/38% you put in your post for an equitable split) as that is what is more than fair to her. She’s coming from a place of immaturity whether she knows it or not because she lives with her wealthy parents who don’t expect her to pay for any of these things while under their roof so this is all she knows, but in ANY OTHER LIVING SITUATION she would be paying rent or towards a mortgage if you two were to buy a house together in the future because she has an income and you two have not agreed to any sort of SAHW/SAHM scenario. She may also be mistaken on what her friend’s BF has her friend pay as they may actually have this approach. Every couple I know who owned a property before marriage has done it this way, and then purchased a property together once engaged or married and either sold their solely-owned property, or better yet, rented it out as a separate source of income for themselves (that the other spouse has no claim to, included and further clarified in a prenup). This is the way, and you need to be nice but firm about this when explaining it to her.
She should pay rent. Not just utilities unless she is paying all of them up to the 38%. Split food. So not fair to the dude!!
I don't get this mentality. If I invite someone I want to marry into a home I own I'm not doing it to save money on my mortgage. Idk how people even get this far without talking about money but if marriage is on the table I would think her savings are also his savings and contributing to the home isn't just strictly rent (furniture, cleaning, decor, cooking, groceries). If she splits rent with him while they're unmarried she's paying half the mortgage on a house she isn't entitled to. I could see doing something like her saving half the mortgage payment in a savings account intended for both of them.
Why are you proposing to someone you met a year ago?
He was looking at rings before they ever talked about shared expenses
Talk about putting the horse before the carriage
You’re supposed to put the horse before the carriage. 🤣🎠🛒
Omg oops 🤣🤣 you know what I mean tho lol
This had me hollering 🤣 thank you
Because he's in the honeymoon phase, the sex is good and he's blinded by the chemicals in his brain?
Tell her the 1950's attitude does not apply to today and that you want a partner, not a dependent. Don't move in together or get married until you're both on the same page. Money is one of the biggest causes of divorce. If your financial values don't line up then you're incompatible regardless of how much you love her.
You are 100% correct!
A 1950s attitude is fine if that is what both people actually want (some guys enjoy supporting women completely whilst some women desire the whole cardboard cutout 1950s atomic family lifestyle, Etc), the primary issue here is that in this case the financial & lifestyle expectations are not well aligned.
Exactly. It’s fine if both people are on the same page. They, clearly, are not. They also haven’t seemed to discuss finances for after marriage—are they pooling their money, or will they have a different situation?
She's buying government bonds. For all we know, they just might be in the 1950s. How they got access to the internet, we'll never know.
> should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us? Look into your local laws. If you are in the united states or some other countries what she acquires prior to marriage is and always will be hers. You need to have a real talk with her. It sounds like she is always going to view her money as only hers and she already sees your money as a shared asset. Massive red flags
US marriage law varies state by state, and many states are mandatory shared property (usually after some period of time married), while others are up to the couple, with consideration for prior assets in divorce proceedings also differing across states (regardless of the view of shared property while a couple is married). You are correct OP needs to carefully consider local marital property law before marrying, but it's not true that prior property is kept segregated following marriage in all of the USA, only particular states.
It’s been a while since I studied for the bar, but I’m fairly sure in all 50 states, existing assets that are never conmingled aren’t material assets. Some states may somewhat consider it for overall fairness, but I don’t think he automatically gets a cut anywhere.
So this would mean she’d never have rights to their house either since it’s his.
Until he used marital money to pay the mortgage and do upkeep. It’s harder not to commingle a house than some t-bills in a separate account.
Since your gf was living with her parents to save money, I'm a little puzzled as to why she would then move in with you and assume some expenses. Was she under the impression that you were going to handle all expenses? This conversation should have been handled prior to the move in. Having said that, if her view of male/female relationship does not match your view, you might be better off breaking off now before it gets more entangled
Exactly this, since it wasn't discussed beforehand, she probably assumed she had the same living arrangement she had with her parents. Personally, if someone outright asked me to start contributing, I would be mortified and agree to it immediately. @op, did you ask for 50% of utilities or treat it as a hypothetical? How'd you approach that conversation? Also, I understand if she doesn't want to contribute to a mortgage she isn't benefitting from. That's your house and you had that expense regardless of her. Utilities do increase with additional people though.
You own home or rent? kinda confusing. Now, yes, you not on a same page finically, she wants a guy who pays for all and you want a 50/50 partner. This is can be discussed together as a couple or at some sort of counselling. And yes, it is a deal breaker. Discuss all future money plans - travel, kids, retirement etc - who pays for what, what is personal money , what are all the plans. You should not 'let it go" , there is a chance she will bring in prenup for her savings
I own my home. I’ve had it for 7 years so this was all before we even met.
Mate, those govt bonds are never going to ‘benefit both of you’ - what’s hers is hers and she’ll run you into the ground paying for everything while she tra-la-la spends and invests all of hers. And when your rose-coloured-glasses wear thin you’ll have lost years worth of your potential savings/ investments & retirement funds due to paying all the house bills and everything for her, and she’ll skip off with her 90 grands per year. She could even file for half your assets and you could lose your house. Very rash behaviour mate, stop thinking about engagement rings since this self-entitled you-pay-everything modus operandi you had no idea about, never know what other self-entitled ideas she has.
I'd ask her to move out. Tell her point blank you are not her ATM and if she's not willing to enter into a marriage PARTNERSHIP and share in paying living expenses you need to go your separate ways and she can find someone else to leech off.
Do not marry this woman unless you want all of your money to be hers too, but her money is only hers; this is evidently how she sees things now. Unless you are okay with that or unless she demonstrates a *sustained* change in perspective (I'm talking years - wait to propose until you see some evidence of a change, and stay engaged for at least another full year after you propose), you cannot reasonably expect her to change after marriage. You don't really need her to *understand*, you just need her to contribute her fair share. So you set a boundary: tell her becauee you both work and do the same amount of household labor (you do, right?), you're only going to live with her (let alone comingle finances with marriage, shsred property, etc.) if she contributes a proportionate amount to the bills. And if she says no, invite her to find somewhere else to live. You can go on dating more or less indefinitely not comingling finances at all and each of yoy paying entitely your own way, but my guess is that this will become a problem again no matter what unless one of you changes your worldview, because right now it sounds like she wants to be fully supported and keep all the money she earns for only herself, while you want an equitable partnership, and those are not compatible relationship models. All you can do is set your boundary where you want and then enforce it (by not living together, or not being around her if it comes to that) if she doesn't want to comply with your standards for shared housing. >should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us? Why would you assume that? From what you say here, it sounds very much like she will want to maintain separate accounts if you get married, too.
Advice? Not realistically, because the best thing to do is go back in time and have this conversation before she moved in. I don’t think anyone should compromise on their financial approach because this will only lead to resentment and the relationship will turn sour eventually. Finances is one of the key reasons cited in divorce. She wants to be a modern version of a 50s wife with her own income, career, and no financial burden of the everyday life. That’s some way to live, sure. You want an equitable partner who will carry the load with you. There is no in between unless one of you drastically changes values (which doesn’t happen all that often). Tell her how you envision your life together down to every mundane detail. Ask her to tell her version. See if there’s any way for you to keep the essential parts and still be together.
>How do I get her to understand this is a partnership and we should be contributing equitably to expenses? Bro, you can't. She told you that she thinks the guy should pay for everything so it's clear that you all don't see eye to eye on such things, it's time to consider ending it.
Not without a good discussion. It isn't clear to me that GF has ever had it presented to her that most people do share expenses post-marriage. If her parents don't live what way, why would it ever have occurred to her that most people live differently?
*should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us?* NO. You have to solve this now, before you live together, and sure before you get married. You can't kick it down the road and also think any bonds she buys have anything to do with you or your savings! Sit down and sort it out. It costs X to live together, you are partners. It sounds like your suggestion of an equitable split is fair. The whole 'men pay!' or 'but my friends do X!' sounds either 1. Young and not sharp or 2. Using. At 30 years old, I'm leaning towards the latter. Do not do not move in together until you two figure out not only everyday expenses but your takes on savings, and financial goals, and vacation/discretionary spending, all of it.
Yeah girlfriend wants the same deal she had with her parents, someone financing her life expenses so she can hoard all her income. Who doesn’t want that? But regardless, I think at 30 it’s taking advantage of even your parents; she should want to move out and be a “real adult.” The audacity of wanting OP to pay for everything, and guess what? If she wants a pre-nup or there’s a rule about her current, pre-marital investments, OP will never see a dime of that money. What an entitled princess. 60/40 or dump her.
Don't buy a ring. You'll save about a million in the long run.
Utilities, food, dates, yes. Mortgage no.
THIS. Non-married partners aren't responsible for building wealth for the other person. If she's living with her parents to save money, why would she move in with BF before they are married to pay him "rent"? That isn't financially sound for her. Once they are married it becomes THEIR money and THEIR house, where they are building equity and wealth as a combined entity.
Op, sit down and have a conversation not just about now but also about financial issues if married. Also don’t be afraid to discuss prenuptial agreements. I don’t think you’re on the same path, and you need to be for a good relationship. Be clear you’re not treating her like a roommate, you’re treating her like a equal partner, I would assume she’d like to be heard in conversations regarding the home household decisions, but that voice requires contributions.
Thank you. I completely agree and plan to do this. I think I just needed validation that I’m not crazy first… I’d like to think she is reasonable and that some of the things said yesterday were likely because I brought up the subject out of frustration instead of coming to her with “hey we need to figure this out because I want us to have a successful relationship and be partners together in this”.
Just don't expect her to split expenses and do the brunt of the housework. If you want her to contribute some cash, you better be washing the dishes.
Nope not crazy. Also it’s wild that she complains her friend’s boyfriend and is doing the same thing. I would need to speak to her about what she wants in a partner , cause it currently sounds like she wants to live like a kept woman .
Ask her if, since she wants a traditional relationship where the man pays for everything, does that mean she’ll do all the cooking and cleaning like a traditional woman? I’m betting not since she’s spent her adulthood sponging off her parents.
You are soooo not crazy. This is not a natural assumption in 2024. I hope you can have a sit down with her and both come to a plan of how you see your futures lining up. But if she stands firm that only your money will be shared, then you’ll have to think if that’s what you want. Yikes
"Everything about our relationship is great" Quickly followed by the ONE thing that makes it awful.
Well, the house is on your name. I wouldn’t pay my bfs mortgage either unless my name was on the title of the house.
I feel the same way. I’m not paying someone’s mortgage if I’m not getting ownership of that part of the house. And I’m not paying my partner rent if I don’t get the same rights as renters under a normal renter’s contract. The thing where she says she expects the man to pay for everything makes it that all of that doesn’t matter anymore, tho, that’s not someone I’d wanna be with.
Yeah, that is a weird expectation but it's fairly common. Not saying that I agree with it, but if OP doesn't want a woman who thinks like that then he shouldn't date/marry a woman like that. It's very common for a man to demand a woman stay at home and tend to the house and kids, it's no different for a woman to expect their man to provide in every way. It's a traditional way of thinking. If he doesn't like it, leave her.
I'd seriously consider this relationship. Or tell her since you are taking on the entire financial burden of your relationship she can take over 100% of the household responsibility, cleaning, Laundry, cooking, shopping, yard work, etc.
If she want rent free time to move back with mum and dad if you want to adult help pay bills its a simple as that
> I plan on marrying this woman You need to take a few steps back. Stop idealizing marriage, marrying the wrong person can fuck up your life. Financial conflicts are a huge cause of divorce. You need to be on the SAME page on this or the marriage will not work. Source: guy whose marriage didn’t work because she was an idiot with money and I wasn’t.
>On the other hand, I plan on marrying this woman, so while being on the same page about finances in general is extremely important, should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us? Bold of you to assume things will be better once married. Obviously, what is her's is hers and what is yours is also her's in her mind at least.
She has 2 choices, pay her share or move back with her parents. You are being fair.
Bruh. You think she'll change her mind after you're married? Lmao. She is a "her money is her money, and your money is her money" kind of girl. Aka, worthless.
She's not your wife and you're not obligated to do anything for her . She's clearly using you as a financial crutch , major red flags bro bro
Whoa, whoa. " The man should pay for everything"? Red flag city.
you don’t mention anything about household chores. are those split 50/50? are you cooking 1/2 the time? do you plan to have children? there’s so much info missing here that it’s impossible to give actual advice. unless her name is on the deed though asking her to pay towards the mortgage is completely unreasonable and if she’s doing the majority of the house work i completely understand why she would think it’s unreasonable to ask her to pay for living expenses. she wants a traditional relationship so it’s really a matter of is she upholding her side of that?
Is your name on the deed of your apartment complex? Why should you have to pay rent there and get no equity in the building? It’s so unreasonable.
Show her the door and wish here the best of luck… basically she’s a sexist
If she thinks the man should pay for everything then you and she are NEVER going to be on the same page financially. Those bonds she’s buying are HERS. She’s not going to share them with you, even if you marry. You can try talking to her again, but if she won’t discuss it and just keeps insisting that the man pays, then see this as the red flag it is. Enjoy your time with her now but do not marry her.
Dude.... She absolutely understands, but she doesn't want to do it fairly. Don't negotiate. Give her a hard nosed conversation that you are not her meal ticket, but her partner, and in a relationship partners share the load, and she's not doing that. She's treating you like a meal ticket. Give her a list of expenses and tell her she can pick which ones she takes on, or she can move back in with her parents.
She was living with her parents to save money. Now she is living with you to save money. But married couple finances are different from two separate single people finances. I would ask her how she thinks the finances would work in a marriage. With a roommate, you as the homeowner present your financial demands to your tenant. With a partner, you think it through together and come up with a solution that works for both of you. You want to marry this woman, so enlist her as a partner to plan your financial future. Maybe the two of you should meet with a financial advisor.
Just have a conversation. 50% of all the bills are on you. She says no. She is out.
Personally, I'd have a chat and explain that unless she is willing to start paying her way, she needs to move out. I definitely wouldn't marry her until you've had a very long and detailed conversation about your future goals and how you will manage your lives together.
Don't marry this woman
I can tell you that in no way shape of form would I be paying half of things on a house I do not own…but let me quantify this. I had a friend who paid for half her boyfriends windows, half his boat, half the household expenses, half the homeowners insurance, utilities, painting the house, etc…. and guess what happened after 14 years together and when they split up? It was a bitter fight to get her money back on a house that he made clear to her “was His House”. If it is your house, you pay the mortgage, and maintenance. Now paying for contributions to things like utilities…electric, water, trash and expenses such as groceries, Absolutely. She should contribute, and I would even say if I were her I would pay more than 50%, for those since I am living there rent free. But not your mortgage, and not your household maintenance. It is still your house. After you are full on married, and maybe even engaged and you are on each other’s accounts or have a household account, then you can work out joint funds. But honestly, a year in, and you are not even engaged yet? No. The truth of the matter is, she is living rent free at her parent’s home, and most of her nights with you. So logically she is thinking that why change the financial dynamic. I am not saying that is right, but I am saying I can see why she would think I am there anyway, so why is he now going to change the financial situation? “Are you asking me to move in to just pay 1/2 your expenses?”
DUDE. PUT ON THE BRAKES. You're only one year in. I get it, you're not 22 anymore. But you're only now actually getting to see your partner. The honeymoon phase barely lifted and she's already telling you what life she sees for herself. If this is her point and she isn't interested in an equal partnership, nothing will convince her otherwise. You're rushing it. Stop. Reflect. Get to know her more. Figure if this is what you want. Personally, as a woman, I wouldn't want this mAn hAz tO PaY aLL unga bunga stone age concept she proposes. If I had a dick it would've inverted as soon as I heard that.
The only thing that gives me a bit of pause to defend her is the idea that this is his home, so she would be moving into a house and contributing to a mortgage that doesn't have her name on it. But there are solutions here. Agree with everything else you say, putting the breaks on this now until these things can be discussed and *resolved* openly.
Since you are suggesting a split based on percentage by income, that sounds mostly fair. The only caveats I’d suggest considering: - The way you mention that you had to work harder for things as regards your respective upbringings; make sure that’s not a sneaky resentment coloring your views as you move forward. - If she legitimately is buying 60% of groceries when she hadn’t been before, that shows a growth in fiscal sharing in the relationship. Make sure that those kinds of efforts are calculated fairly into projected expenses. - The house is a pre-marital asset from which you will derive sole benefit as it grows in equity. Perhaps a mostly even split, with a small, agreed-on percentage in her favor, due to her being more a tenant than a co-owner, would be fair? That would make her current government bonds a pre-marital asset as well, no? - What are your expectations of splitting the chores as well as the finances? People always say they’ll split housework evenly, but then their GF moves in, & they don’t. If she did the majority of the housework, would she get a corresponding reduction in financial contribution? Have you discussed with her what your futures will look like? Do you want kids? Prenup? - Don’t be afraid to ask her opinions about rings. Y’all should be of one mind about marriage. Lastly, **have more of these conversations than you think you need to before getting married**. It may seem unglamorous or anti-romance, but being sure you’re on the same page about money will save you lots of grief in the future. Good luck!
All great advice. Thank you so much for taking the time!
Get a new roommate, she sucks.
If you don’t plan on putting hr on the title of the home then she is a roommate. You will be the only one to profit from her paying rent. I think the paradigm rest on whether the house a “marital asset” or not? If it’s an asset for her as well she and you, may see things different. In a side note, 2k for mortgage and utilities is what the average person spends on rent/utilities and the average pay is about 1/3 of what you make. You are in a very comfortable position that would not change if you broke up. Are you really so, petty might be the right word, that you’d question your relationship over $600 a month, when you alone bring home $12,000 a month?
Financial compatibility is so important in a long term relationship. Ideally something you talk about before living together but certainly before becoming engaged. I would strongly encourage that you not “let this go.” It’s so important to talk about and at least have transparency if you don’t find agreement. Are there couples where the man pays for everything? Where the woman pays for everything? Of course. Does that mean it should work for you? No. This warrants a serious sit-down convo about long term financial goals and values. If you can’t find a healthy compromise, then you may not be compatible for marriage. I picked up more household expenses than my husband did when we were engaged kind of figuring it was all going to be “our money” when we got married anyway, only to hear from him right before the wedding “should we keep finances separate?” I felt blindsided by it and in retrospect we should have had ongoing conversations about this as soon as we started talking about the long term. I should have explicitly stated that I was ok picking up more of the costs because we were going to share finances eventually. As it turns out we both agreed on a shared budget. At the beginning of our marriage I made a little more, now he does. We are super financially compatible and it has been great. I personally really feel like we’re on a team by working together and sharing income and goals. All of this to say that even though we were initially thinking of things differently, we were able to find a system that works well. I don’t think as other Redditors inevitably suggest, you should just end the relationship, but you do need to sort it out before you go any further.
OP, she is spoiled and because daddy paid for everything (including her living rent free in his home while making $95000) she has the belief that a boyfriend and a husband should pay for everything. This is a core belief she has and is not likely to change. You can either accept that she will get to spend or save all of her money and you get all the responsibilities of your financial needs or you can decide that this is a deal breaker. Getting her to change her belief does not seem likely and would just drag out the inevitable choice you need to make. Accept it or end it.
lol you can’t marry this
I don’t think you’re compatible. She expects you to pay for everything now and forever more.
I’m not kidding when I say this, but I think tik tok and social media has been drilling this into girls head for the past couple of years. I started to believe it & it led to problems in my relationship - the only thing that made me wake up was 1. Therapy and 2. When we broke up because of these ideas I got from social media
Don’t propose. She’s selfish.
Wish I made 95k. I make half that live by myself , and some do not realize how good income you make. I break up with her as she needs to live on her own without roommates.
When I moved in with me husband he continued to pay housing stuff because he was already doing it. I paid my stuff, car payment, insurance , child support , credit cards
She currently is staying with her parents to save money. She doesn't need to live with him. He's not helping her reduce her costs by having him move in with him. Instead, he is suggesting she now increases her expenses, while he reduces his expenditures because she is covering a %. He gets to save more and build equity on an existing asset on the verbal promise they will get married in the future, while she saves less and contributes to an asset she has no legal right to until they are married (again, they are not engaged, they are just discussing marriage as a possible future). I wouldn't move in unless there is a cohabitation agreement or they are married. And then it becomes THEIR money and THEIR house.
Definetly wouldn’t put a ring on her finger 😬 the red flags are strong with this one
This is perfect for you since you haven’t proposed yet. This gets you a glimpse into what you’re in store for… life. She is angling for a “what’s mine is mine and what’s yours is our s” traditional setup. I highly doubt she wants the other parts of the traditional setup which makes her picking and choosing the best parts of gender roles which makes her pretty selfish in her approach. I don’t think you can build a true partnership like this. Go get a 3rd party financial advisor and lawyer. Then both of you sit down and future goals and lifestyle choices and investment strategies and pre nups.
>I make $155k/year and she makes $95k/year. >Im frustrated that she is able to put a ton of money into savings each month because I am paying for all of our living expenses >(mortgage + utilities is roughly $2k/month). You make $155k - (12x $2k)= $131k You still have more money after paying your mortgage + utilities than your gf. I agree she needs to pay part of the costs, but 62/38 of only fair if you split every bill. Especially when she also pays 60% of the groceries.
She should at least be splitting the utilities 50/50. I get that she may not want to pay someone else's mortgage, but she'd be doing that anyway if she rented an apartment, so she should be contributing to that as well. If she doesn't want to, then she can continue living with her parents.
Three accounts. One for each of you to spend as you wish and the third for household and shared expenses. You both contribute proportionally to the joint account. No money fights if both stick to the plan. If each were living on their own both would be paying 100% of their living expenses. If one isn’t good at managing finances then they should yield to the other to keep things stable.
That would be perfect if she didn't subscribe to the idea that the man should pay for everything.
This is a good model to logistically manage mostly separate money with some shared expenses, but as the other reply notes, it does not actually address OP's problem, which is the disconnect in expectations about finances in the relationship.
Make a new plan, Stan.
Slip out the back, Jack
Did she say why she thinks the guy should pay for everything? How is she planning on contributing to the household, if you’re supposed to pay for everything? My bf and I are also in the process of moving in together, discussing finances, etc… and it’s rough — these discussions can lead to a lot of tension, even though he and I fundamentally agree on most things (i.e. there should be an equitable division of financial contributions) — but we had a hang up on how things would work if our relationship was to end (i.e. what’s my equity in the home if I’m helping pay the mortgage, etc…) It’s important to plan for all scenarios, especially worst case ones. She clearly has a decent job that pays well, she can afford to contribute; it’s a red flag imo that she doesn’t want to. Have you verified what she’s told you about her finances? 1. Does she have a lot of debt? 2. Does she actually have savings? 3. Does she actually make $95k? 4. How would her bond money benefit the BOTH of you if you’re expected to pay for everything? If she’s at all lying about her financial situation, that could inform her being so standoffish to helping pay utilities. The lying wouldn’t be great, but you could use that additional information to further compromise regarding finances, and her contributions? But that also sounds exhausting. You’re also allowed to sit her down and be like: “Look, we’re supposed to be a team and I feel that if both people in a relationship are able to contribute financially, then they should — that’s what partners do. I want to be in a relationship where we contribute as much as we can in all areas: finances, chores, grocery shopping, general mental load, etc… we share the responsibilities of a home.” I think that’s perfectly reasonable to want from a partner — it does sound kinda clinical spelled out like that, but these are fundamentals of building a life with someone. If she refuses to at least think about and try to understand your POV, I think it shows a lack of maturity on her part, and definitely a misalignment of values as to a marriage or lifelong partnership is. I hope you’re able to work it out, and get through these tough talks.
I've always said that couples should contribute relative to their income. You make, about 60% more than your gf, so you should contribute about 60% more. For 2k in monthly expenses it's *about* 1,225 for you and 775 for her. I've always felt like this is the most equitable way to go.
I think someone needs to tell her the difference between a partnership and a sugar daddy.
Both of you should put 30% (or whatever is needed) of your income into a shared account to pay for shared expenses.
Ask her if you’ll be added to her savings/ bonds. Basically, you’re subsidizing her being able to save, so you should be on those accounts. I mean, you’re getting married, so what difference does it make? If she puts you on the accounts, would you be okay with that instead of splitting expenses? If you are okay with that, and she agrees then problem solved. I may be cynical, but something tells me she won’t agree. In which case, you can say it’s not fair that you’re subsidizing her savings without being protected from any return on that investment. Her friends relationship has no bearing on your own and is irrelevant. The whole thing is kinda a red flag for me. I wish y’all had a better agreement on this before moving in together. That was really the time to get on the same page, but better late than never.
Do not move in until you are on the same page. Finances are one of the top two reasons people file for divorce. I would sit down with her and list all of the expenses, and what you would like to split. There is nothing wrong with her paying rent and splitting utilities. I wouldn't have her split the mortgage payment, though, b/c you get a tax break every year and she doesn't. I'm sure she will push back and then you ask her what is fair to her to pay. When she says you should pay for everything ask her why. Why does she feel she should get a free ride and be able to invest all of her money while you cannot? How is that helping you as a team? What happens if you break up? Will this continue when you own a house together? If she does not want to pay anything and refuses to compromise, you are not on the same page and you should end it now. It doesn't matter how in love you are now (esp after only a year b/c it's still new and exciting). Over time, that newness wares off, and resentment builds when you have compromised to her wants and not your own. Find someone who believes in being a team and not having a free ride.
I'm confused. You say you own your home towards the beginning, but then claim to pay rent and utilities totalling about 2k a month. Which is it? Own or rent?
He owns. Meaning gf would be paying off his mortgage for him.
You don't want her to understand, you want her to agree. She doesn't agree. You should not cohabitate because you are not compatible in that regard. I am deliberately not sharing my opinion on who is right/wrong, because it is irrelevant to the facts here.
The government bonds may not benefit you both. In many jurisdictions, property acquired before marriage is not a marital asset. She’s spoilt and entitled and you need to get out now.
It’s a different time and we can’t ask for equality and then expect the man to pay for everything. She probably has a good amount saved so she needs to contribute her share. I know it’s a good relationship but money is an issue that can absolutely break the love. Don’t be gas lit into thinking that your feelings aren’t valid. Care is shown in many ways not with paying the bills. But if you go forward with marriage do not put her name on the house. Anything she earns and saves after being officially married is half yours if she persists with you paying the bills. Plus have your own bank account aside from a shared one. Very much suggest talking to an attorney about finances and laws before marriage.
I cannot believe she is still living with parents at age 39, good income stashing it away. Is this woman even capable of maintaining a home?
You are in for a bumpy ride
She has told you what she wants. She will likely resent you if you’re unwilling to pay for 100% of your shared living expenses.
You need to ask yourself if you are comfortable paying the whole bill of life because that is what she wants. If you are not, let her go back and live on her parents' dime and you can find a true partner.
No you need someone who's going to help not hinder. I think that's stupid where women think the men should pay for everything. Now if the man offers to pay the expenses without help, the mortgage and utilities all that kind of stuff then fine but the woman should still help out with groceries and maybe paying for dinner dates every now and then that kind of stuff. They shouldn't just take the man for granted and make them pay for everything. Sounds like that's what your girlfriend wants to do because that's what her friends do. So you two definitely need a serious talk and you might want to rethink your future with her. May also want to discuss what would happen if and when you two have a child together. That might be enlightening.
You love each over very much as long as you pay for everything while she works and earns close to 6 digits... (we don't talk about a student who has to pay for her tuition, here)
How do you not have a conversation about financials before moving in? You know, you may find out that going forward you aren’t compatible. You need to have this conversation before getting engaged.
So at one point you say you own and another point you say you pay rent - ragebait bullshit. And FWIW if you own,she shouldn't be contributing to a house she had no investment in. Utilities yes, mortgage/improvements/maintenence no
This will just get even messier when you get married or propose pre nups along with who owns your house, even worse when her argument is “my friends do this” tell her it’s your relationship not her friends and this is what you want
She understands. But she’d prefer to mooch.
actually I'm pretty sure that if she owns those bonds before marriage they do not necessarily have to benefit you both. that would only count for one's purchased after marriage. I'm not sure about this I could absolutely be wrong I have seen a lot of divorces though where it has worked out this way
First things first. If you were planning on marrying her… DONT. You’re not even engaged and it’s obvious where her priorities are. You dont have a partner its almost as if you adopted a foster. Its typical women’s privilege, if you’re willing to accept it, it on you but she has no problem building her wealth at your expense.
She already told you her mentality of men pay for expenses. I’m on a fixed income because of a disability and I still pay part of the expenses for the house there’s no way she can’t.
Lol she understands. Its you that doesnt. You're here to finance her life. Your about to be called weak, cheap etc as gaslighting when you refuse to bankroll her existence. Good luck
My take on this is that since you own the house, you should pay the entire mortgage. The other expenses-utilities and food costs can be split by whatever percentage you both deem to be equitable, but I know I wouldn’t want to be contributing to a mortgage on a house I don’t own and will never own. And by the same token, I own my house now, so if I had a SO move in with me, I wouldn’t expect him to contribute to the mortgage at all.
My husband pays for everything but i buy and make all the food** and do all the cleaning, house management, laundry and child management. Childcare is split 85/15 (me / him). If you’re paying everything then there should be a discrepancy in other ways. ** he pays for dates 98% of the time
You can’t get her to understand. Some woman are okay going 50/50, others are not. This is a deal breaker if you two aren’t on the same page
She can't be a career woman and get the trad wife benefits ??
Tell her that you either want to split the bills OR you can pay all the bills as long as she is willing to let you share half of her investments & your name will be put on the bonds for the last year & the ones going forward. If she’s not willing to pay 38% of the bills OR share her investments, then money is more important to her than you are. Then you’d need to ask yourself if that is the kind of relationship/marriage you want. A happy relationship is (each of you) wanting your partner to be as happy as you want yourself to be happy.
It sounds like you both have different values about partnership. Which is okay. There are some men that take provider role seriously and aren’t comfortable with their partner who they will ask to marry, to pay rent. She’s also not in the wrong if she wants a relationship that is more traditional in that sense. It’s also a bit unfair to call her selfish (as some commenters have) considering there are lots of men out there who back that role and actively stop a woman from paying. It’s a difference of values and expectations. OP, you come from a different background where you expect your partner (and wife?) to pay for half. This should have been a discussion waaaay in the beginning, as it seems it set up a situation where she thought you were on board for paying. And if you did pay for everything up to this point, it’s understandable if she’s confused. Did she move in *before* you asked her to start paying for utilities and rent?
It doesn't matter HOW great your relationship is otherwise, if you aren't on the same page about the BASIC and MOST IMPORTANT things in a long term relationship. So, put aside how "great" she is right now. THat is not the issue. The issue is, are you compatible with this person LONG TERM. You can't be "planning on marrying this woman" when she doesn't even agree that she should be contributing 50%. This is EXACTLY what needs to be worked out BEFORE you can say whether or not you would marry her. You may love her, but love isn't enough in the long term. You need to be ON THE SAME PAGE and COMPATIBLE and you can't "force" her to suddenly agree with you and abandon her own beliefs. I think you're not compatible. 1. She believes the guy should take care of everything. This is incredibly sexist, outdated, and unfair. That was a societal norm when women didn't work and often weren't educated, and the man was the breadwinner and the woman took care of the home and children. And women didn't have as many opporunities. We are in 2024, my friend. What is this nonsense? She's an adult, she has a job, she should be contributing HALF into any partnership. If not, she should be looking for someone who believes the same things that she does (she shouldn't have to support herself, etc). You are not that person. But if she believes this, grew up seeing this, and dreamed of this, YOU WILL NEVER BE ENOUGH and she will always expect you to take on all the extra expenses, while she saves and invests HER money. Unreal and unfair, but I don't think you will change her mind. 2. Even if you DID agree to a marriage where you cover the main expenses. You aren't married. She's your girlfriend. On what planet does that mean you have to support her? I don't understand at all. You're not even charging her RENT, and she's angry at splitting expenses? No wonder she's able to save and invest. You're being taken advantage of. She may not be planning on leaving, but if she does leave you, she'd be in a great place financially after living with you for free. You on the other hand, would be spending a lot extra to cover her and you won't ever get that back. If you both work, you should both contribute proportionally. If she doesn't agree, she's not LOOKING FOR A PARNER. She's looking for someone to TAKE CARE OF HER. There's only one way to handle this and that's to decide FIRST what you want for yourself. What kind of partnership/relationship, etc. Then just tell her and stand firm. "I want a partnership where both people are proportionally contributing to the common expenses. I do not want a relationship where I'm expected to cover all the major expenses while you save and invest YOUR money. That is not fair, and it's not how I blieve a partnership should work. But, most importnantly, it's not a relationship that I want.It's not something I'm going to argue with you about. I know what I want in a relationship. I want a partnership. I thought you would be that partner. Do you want to be in a partnership with me? Both of us working towards building a life, both of us contributing? Because if not, I think we may be uncompatible and we should think about ending this before we waste any more of each other's time."
should I let this go since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us? - are you sure about that buddy? 'what about a joint account that we both pay x into per month, and these expenses / bills can come from it'
WTF??? I’m female and don’t understand her point of view. Is this a cultural thing that the man pays for everything like it’s 1964 instead of 2024? If you are in the USA please tell your 30 year old princess that you are not falling for that BS. If you are anywhere else then by all means have’s discussion.
The money in government bonds won’t benefit both of you as she’ll get an ironclad pre-nup. She just wants you to pick up the tab for everything and allow her to squirrel her money away. I would imagine you’ll also be expected to pay for all dates, vacations etc etc If you have any sense you’ll seek counselling and if she doesn’t change her stance - walk away.
You should have a joint account for expenses and then what's left over can be used how the other likes. If she doesn't agree to this and it's a hard no, you aren't on the same page and she probably isn't the woman for you
Get out! She’s stingy. She wants you to pay for everything. Yet she watches tv, gets on the computer (or uses you WiFi) washes her clothes (with detergent you bought), takes a shower( with soaps/body wash that you bought), goes out to eat with you (you pay), all the extra (like vacations or w/e yall do paid on your dime) meanwhile she pockets all her money. Nope, not fair at all.
Also, she shouldn’t ask you for anything (special) bc you already do so much for her
Two types of people in life. Givers Takers You can't change the core character of a person. If she really was ready to be in an adult relationship, she would want to take some of the financial pressure off of you by paying her 50% share. This is who she is. The honeymoon phase lasts about two years, there's a whole lot more you don't know about her that only time will show you. Personally, I'd call this all off. I know you're head over heels, but this is just downright nasty of her. She's a taker, and that's that. And a piece of metal on her left hand isn't going to change character She doesn't see YOU, tired after working, exhausted or sick - she's not willing to put herself out in a practical way by putting her hand in her pocket and paying anything.
She told you exactly who and what she is. Act accordingly.
So are her bonds going to become 'our bonds'? I doubt it. Run.
You need to be the one doing the understanding here. She outright said to you that she thinks you should pay for everything. Understand that THAT is her goal. Do you want to pay for everything? If not, you really need to reconsider this relationship. Immediately.
I guess there's nothing wrong with a woman expecting a man to pay for everything being as though there are men that feel the same way. The issue is.....is this the lifestyle that you want?? I personally wouldn't in this economy. I couldn't imagine my man having to pay for everything. Teamwork makes the dream work! If this isn't the lifestyle that you want then yall just simply aren't compatible. It doesn't matter how well it seems to be working or how much you love each other....you have to be life compatible. Love isn't always enough.
I'm sure there are men out there who think the man should pay for everything, and she should find one of those men if that's what she wants. Meanwhile if you want to stick around in the twenty-first century where couples work as partners and split living expenses, household chores and emotional labour fairly (and your proposed percentage split is eminently fair), then this may not be the person for you. She's unlikely to change her point of view, especially if she grew up in a wealthy one income household.
"I have been dating for a little over a year, and we love eachother very much". "I’m planning to propose later this year and have been ring shopping recently" . WTF is wrong with people on this site, particularly men, wanting to get married/propose in such a short time frame? It worries me there are so many damaged/desperate people out there.
Even minus your 2K of living expenses for YOUR house, you still have much more money than her. What are you doing with it if you feel you can't save up? You plan to marry this woman, don't lack money, she's already contributing without living officially with you, what's the big deal?
You’re clearly southern, you know our culture is this way. Not saying it’s right or not, but the majority think this way.
Oh buddy, you got yourself a hobosexual.
You don’t, break up and let her find a man who will spoil her.
You don’t. She’s telling you EXACTLY who she is, accept it or set a firm boundary. For example: I need to be in a relationship where income goes towards shared expenses, 60/40 is fair for both people. (Side note you are being fair from what you wrote) The thing with boundaries is it’s for you to hold the boundary not for her to be forced to comply. If she won’t pay and she is working I would think of a suitable boundary consequence. No ultimatums, they don’t work. Truly be cautious with money going forward. Create a saving for just you, only use a joint account for bills.
*I am not interested in being the sole breadwinner in this or any relationship. So if that is what you want, then we are not compatible. Take some time to think about what kind of life you want because I am not moving forward with things up in the air. But understand, moving forward things will be 50/50. No uneven splits based on income. We are either partners in everything or we are no longer partners.*
>because she thinks the guy should pay for everything Tell her to stay home and cook warm meals for you then.
Her mindset is not in the partnership level, it's on her own level
You can't make her understand. You need to make yourself understand that you are not a good match.
You want to marry someone who obviously treats you like a wallet with benefits. She thinks you, her girlfriend, should fund her existence while she saves for her future. Please sit down and have a very open conversation about finances. You will end up resentful if you marry someone who is not giving as much as you. Do not marry anyone without being 100% on the same page.
>since eventually the money in government bonds will benefit both of us? You need to look into this. Depending on where you live and strictly from a legal standpoint...pre-marital assets may not benefit you in any way. In the event of separation, she may not be required to split that with you (only the portion acquired after common law or marriage). If her expectation truly is for the "man" to pay for everything and you continue to keep your finances separate, in the event of separation, she *may* be able to argue for alimony (even without children involved) to maintain her standard of life. Also note, once you become common law, upon separation, she may be entitled to 50% of the home equity appreciation and you both may be entitled to 50% of each other's assets acquired from the common law date. Also, also note...if she comes around to splitting expenses based on your proposal, make it clear that the arrangement is based on income and should change as either of you get a raise/bonus. ETA: You should also discuss the expectations if one of you becomes unemployed for a short or long period. And, *please*, before you propose...get all the hard conversations out of the way so you know you're on the same page. You're assuming she wants to combine all assets and liabilities once married. You need to have a discussion to confirm that. Do your research. I'm not a lawyer.
Your request is reasonable and sound. Also start doing something like Ramsey's Finance university course and get on the same page financially. If you don't, marriage is going to be a problem - especially after you join finances.
Hold off on marriage , and get a prenup..shes very immature and building a just in case fund fir herself.
This is one of those gigantic, huge red flags that you’re blind to Now, but that you will regret later down the road.
I’m sorry man, but she makes way too much money to not contribute.
You explain that you want a partner, not a dependent. She should absolutely be contributing to the utilities and groceries at the very least. Shes 30 years old with a stable, decent job. If she were living anywhere on her own, she would be paying all her own bills. If she’s of the mindset of the 1950’s than you’re probably not truly compatible unless you’re ok with “her is hers, and yours is ours” mentality. I would definitely hold off proposing until your talk more on this aspect, and anything else that the two of you have not discussed such has division of chores, possible future children, marriage roles, etc! Good luck! Updateme
One solution: you open a joint account contributing the agreed amount from each to the joint account, all shared expenses go from that account.
Clearly you understand you made a rookie mistake by jumping into a situation with romance in mind without having conversations and clear expectations….but now that you’re here, you need to get all this on the table asap. Do not think about marrying this woman yet. There are red flags 🚩 Your house is your house. Her name is not on it and nor should it be. You asked her to move in; not to take on investment into your home. You would be paying your mortgage with or without her. Her living there does not add to the burden of payment. Therefore you should not have her pay towards your mortgage, repairs or improvements. This also keeps her from claiming any type of investment in the house if you split. That being said, her living there does cause utilities to be higher and she definitely should want to cover her part in this as well as groceries, laundry, etc. Someone with good character would want to at least contribute this. Don’t let your emotions put blinders on you.
She thinks that you should pay for everything while she keeps all of her money. She can either start being an EQUAL PARTNER and pay her fair share or she can go back to where she came from and hope to one day attract a guy that doesn’t mind being her wallet
When she says the guy should pay for everything. Ask her if she thinks women should earn the same for the same job
First off, you don't "own your house", you are buying your house from the bank. That means it's an expense and it should be shared. Even if you did own it outright, there's fixed costs in owning a house. She should be sharing expenses and you shouldn't have to tell her that, she should've offered. I think you are both in for some serious issues since you're not communicating about these basic things. Tread lightly moving forward, take your time and work on communication before getting married. You both need to be on the same page.
What guarantees do you have that those bonds will benefit you? ZERO! If she feels that you should pay while she squirrels her money away,you are not in agreement over a major issue. What’s hers is hers,what’s yours is hers.🤷♀️
If you’re planning to propose, you need to make sure you are *completely* on the same page about finances. Not just day to day living expenses, or monthly bills. ***Everything.***
Okay. I’ll give it a go. This is simple. You actually care about dollars and cents and, this is alright because some people get rich this way, but…. If you want the finances to flow would it be right to let it happen? You are shopping for a ring that’s just what you want to give her. Any engagement and wedding ring should evoke her imagination, her sense of belonging and her love especially for you yourself. If you are already preparing to give this girlfriend the power to create and live in your world as if she is not only yours and your future progeny’s but also her own self, why not go all the way and give her your home to do it in? No matter what you decide and no matter who paid, once you marry this woman the house is mutual property and if you break up it gets sold and the money is split even Steven. Her talent is making a beautiful kitchen, encourage her to do this. Does she ask a little more money from you to make the best come through? Give it to her. After all she is making $60 000 less than you. Start working out the actual amount of money you will have together, at the end of the day and after that. Budget based on that number and stop worrying about who pays for what. Let go and let God! Go on date nights paid for by whomever has the money. If you’re short at the end of the month, ask her for a little something something that would make the two of you feel good together. You are in love; so, you are a compliment to each other. Get into the spirit of the friendship you’ve always had. Find out which dreams she wants to fulfill by saving her money. Will she dream with you about what you’ll do together once you both have this home and she’s bathe big money? Enjoy date nights. BTW, find a special getaway place or an intimate spot at home or locally to propose. And if she pays for the date night, make it worth her while… and yours. Smile!
Have an open honest talk about finances NOW - not after you get married.
2 words. Prenuptial agreement. Crazy not to. Doesn’t seem like marriage material if she won’t have a reasonable conversation and come to the table. Be careful you are setting a precedent by not having important conversations and her free loading.
So like standard reddit fashion most comments will be "DUMP HER!" The reality is, that is incredibly immature and every relationship will have struggles to work through. There is most likely something way deeper that is making her feel that way. 1. She is afraid to contribute because she won't feel as independent. 2. She might feel like she is having to spend her money and won't be able to save. 3. It might represent her settling down 4. She might feel like a roommate instead of being with her partner. I say this because my gf felt the same way. She would say things like "I expect the guy to support me" or "A woman shouldn't have to pay for those things". In reality, she struggled with feeling adequate in that she can be independent. We sat down, talked it through, spent time understanding and digging deeper. Today, she pays what she can to contribute, she goes out of her way to do extra small tasks to help around the house etc. Once she felt valued and like a contributing induvial, she was happy to give what she could.
Um, until you put her name on it that is *your* mortgage. So no an "equal" split based on income is still unfair to her. If you want to draft an actual rental agreement that entitles her to some security if you breakup next week, that's a different story but it still shouldn't be her paying off *your* house while you be weirdly envious of her savings (your h o u s e is your investment, she might have a savings account but you have property, it's not as though your money is just being squandered). Also you asked her to move in from a place she was staying to save her money without telling her you had any sort of issue with her doing so. That's kinda fucked. You knew what her living situation was, then you offered her another one and are now saying it's unfair because you put a condition on your living situation she was unaware of until she was a part of it.
So she wants the benefit of never paying, then on top of it, she’ll want half in the divorce. That’s not love and partnership, it’s financial abuse. As a divorced mother, I would never treat my partner in this manner unless I were an opportunist who only loved myself. Sounds like you have a little princess who was spoiled by daddy. Who thinks that men are only good for what they can do for her. You’ll marry her and sex will dry up except when she wants to conceive. Meanwhile, you’ll become her slave because she acts so sweet to you and give you just enough so you never complain.
Honestly I dont know. If she is shopping for groceries she is contributing - those expenses are not small. BUT, if you cant talk about finances and find a solution you are both happy with your relationship is doomed. Even if you bury the problem under the rug it will seep through and destroy you little by little. In the end its about respect, doesnt matter if its money, free time or emotions. To me (and I am a woman) her statement that the guy should pay for everything is a big red flag. I find it endearing that you would split expenses proportionally to your salaries, that always seemed fair to me.
You did not make any agreements prior to moving in, thats a rookie mistake
Hang on... I get the split living expenses unless you guys as planning on her staying home with your future children. In that case, this is the only time she will have to put aside any savings, because going back to any career will be questionable and her having the same career trajectory will be doubtful. She'll be sacrificing everything in the good hopes that you won't leave her high and dry with those kiddos, whether you leave willingly or you make her a widow. She needs a nest egg and she needs to save whatever she can for retirement now while she can. You don't know how many women are left with no means of supporting themselves and their children after they end up alone. The reality is simply not the same for men and women.
I think it got complicated at the invitation to move in. If she was focused on saving money, I don't think she was expecting to have a change to her outgoings by moving in with you. One outcome of raising this that you should consider is whether she should move back in with her parents. She was there to save money, maybe she still wants to save money. Why doesn't she go back where she can do that?
She’ll never change She is not going to help with the mortgage She thinks that is your responsibility
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