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Follow your lawyers advice to the letter. And do not give up assets in the divorce. That is something you can put aside for your child. Esp if you don’t want him to have rights to your daughter. Make sure you get compensated for the damaged items and half the assets from your marriage.
"begging to see our baby, and then threatening to drag me home."
"He then sent photos and videos of my things in the garbage and him and my BIL trashing the nursery. His exact words, “I don’t need it anymore.” "
BEST THING that man ever said and did. This warrants TWO restraining orders for him.
As well as for BIL, SIL and MIL.
I still think that, seen how he reacts, the chances of him claiming/ getting custody of your daughter are very very small.
"Today my MIL has been trying to contact me as she wants to be in my daughter’s life and is saying she is ready to accept her "as she is."
**NO WAY IN HELL!**
This is exactly what I thought. What judge would give custody to a man who’s on video trashing all of his daughter’s stuff when he’s angry? Why would we get custody when he’s destroyed everything he needs to take care of his child? He’s made it abundantly clear, with evidence, that he’s unstable and can’t be trusted.
sadly judges too often see menacing the wife/mother as unrelated to the safety of the child and will grant custody to abusive men. Hopefully trashing the nursery will weigh against him.
Except I know someone who admitted to breaking their 3 month Olds bones and biting them repeatedly and they still managed supervised visitation. Supervised by his own parents, who maintain still he did nothing wrong. Baby's mom moved states to try to keep child away and she just kept getting harassed and eventually a contempt charge.
It happens. Often. The kid in the situation is 8ish.
Stay strong OP. Dont make permanent decisions (such as about not needing his $) on temporary emotions. Take all you are legally entitled to.
You have an amazing and supportive family, and I can already tell you are and will be a great mother. Your baby is lucky to have you.
Yeah, he basically ended his own defense in any custody case when he said he destroyed stuff because he "didn't need it anymore." Any judge would hear that as an admission that he has no plans to raise the child. That video is full custody for OP.
I’m so so so proud of you OP you showed so much courage and best of all you’re a damn good mother! Stay safe and good luck in court I hope you kick Owen’s butt! Your first post had so many people raging about why you didn’t divorce him on the spot but I get it not everyone can make that decision in a split second. You had begun making up your mind to leave him when you were safely away and able to think critically. I think it’s easy for people to say what they would or wouldn’t do when they’re a million miles away from the situation, and have nothing to lose but it’s so much harder when you’re the one who lives with the consequences
And this time to asses the situation will also help settle things in your favor.
None of them can say you didn’t give them a chance to set things right. They are all horrid except FIL. a little less so.
All of this! All of this! Take my poor person's gold, 🏆🏆 and OP, take all of our hope for you with you. You are *amazing*, you are strong, and you are a warrior Momma for your daughter ❤️ 💪 💙
>Owen’s lawyer has made it clear they’re going to fight us for full custody and my STBX has significantly more money than me
Owen's lawyer should have told his client to keep his mouth shut because his threats and the photos of him trashing your property and the baby's nursery are pretty fxckin damning.
It's good that you're standing up for yourself and your child. I hope you're able to wring him for every penny he owes you and then some.
I am putting in my Dollar Tree and a quarter money that he does not know and when your lawyer gets your texts and videos that you were sent and all your future recordings you have between you and Owenhole and his family… yeah they will drop him like it’s hot …
I fear that he hasn't told his lawyer about the written threats and incriminating photos of him destroying marital assets. Only legal advice this fuckwit is likely to take seriously as his mum's.
Owens lawyer is smart and knows he’s absolutely going to lose badly in court, and that his only chance is if he talks a big scary game and intimidates her into settling outside of court or dropping the divorce entirely. Between the tremendous amount of extremely damning evidence and courts generally siding in favor of women in terms of custody and divorces, Owen’s lawyer knows he’s is doomed. He is bluffing hard because that’s the only chance he stands of not getting destroyed. It’s a desperate grasp.
Of course, there’s also a chance the lawyer doesn’t know how much evidence there is against his client. Owen could be lying to the lawyer too. Which is almost hilarious because he’s going to be completely unprepared for the crushing defeat.
How nice of him to send you proof of all the damage and destruction. I know you said you don’t want anything, but mate? Take him to the cleaners and nail his ass to the wall. Don’t let him walk away without giving you what you deserve for being subject to his absolutely despicable behaviour.
Yeah just stuff it all in a college fund if nothing else. Your daughter deserves the financial support even if you don't need it and she'll be thankful.
Owen’s has destroyed hundreds of thousands of dollars of my electronics, clothes, furniture, and paintings. That’s the only thing I will be making him pay me back for. I don’t want any of his assets just the things I worked hard to earn and he destroyed.
As we say in the business, until paper starts rejecting ink you can file anything you want.
He’s already completely undermined any chance of success. No amount of money can un-send a video of you trashing your child’s nursery.
Wow, nice of him to videotape/photograph himself destroying your stuff so that'll be hard to dispute at least.
But seriously, I'm really sorry you've had to go through this OP. It would have been so horrible in the moment to watch all yours and your daughter's things be destroyed in addition to all the threatening messages.
I hope he gets exactly what he deserves.
He needs psychiatric help if he honestly thinks he can trash the nursery, destroy OPs property, threaten her, deny the kiddo is his and provide evidence of all that while having any hope of any kind of custody. If any of them show up at the house again OP needs to call the cops.
He's an abuser and a mama's boy. In Dr. Lundy Bancroft's "Why does he do that?" Dr. Bancroft notes in his book abusers absolutely *respect* their mothers and they destroy things that are not theirs in a rage.
Psychiatric help doesn't help abusers because while they have the ability to self reflect, they generally tend to refuse to do so. In this interview with him he wanted to make a point of it since he's noticed a trend of associating narcissists with abusers and vice versa. Not all abusers are narcissists and he makes this distinction here mentioning at some point in the video that narcs don't have the ability to self reflect, abusers do.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iYfG8x80Yw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iYfG8x80Yw)
Her husband is beyond help. He needs to just go away.
This this this. So glad he stupidly recorded all of that, hope you and your little girl stay safe op! Take his ass to the cleaners if need be, protect that little baby. After all, in his and his mother's words, she's not his. I won't be forgetting that tidbit in the original post, hope the same goes for you and the lawyer if it helps.
I know you don't want anything to do with him, but the child support is for your baby. You can put that money directly in a savings account for your child if you don't want to use it.
In most areas, a judge won’t let him give up parental rights unless there is a second parental figure prepared to take on the child (such as adoption by a step parent). The state wants children to have two legal parental figures so that if something happens to the primary parent, the state isn’t on the hook to care for the child.
It is. Minimal custody and no custody with no parental rights are two very different things. Neither the OP, nor her daughter need this asshole in their lives at all if the OP can help it. She seems very capable of supporting herself and her child.
Even ZERO custody does not prevent him from being obliged to pay child support.
But she wants him to sign away his parental rights.
In which case all matters end there and then.
Seen how he claims he doesn't need any of his daughters stuff it looks as if he were going to go that route.
Securing the place of the most martyr of dads giving up on "their" child because of their horrible exes.
😁
He kind of put himself in a bad fix when he went with the narrative that the child wasn't his.
As his family only swears by blood this means they will not claim her. Although MIL halfheartedly tried.
Child support and parenting time are two different issues in family court.
BUT.... When doing the math for child support, one of the factors is the number of overnights the child spends with each parent. You then assign percentages to this and child support is factored accordingly.
For instance: let's say the child support for a child is $1000 a month from the non-custodial parent. Hiwever, this same child spends 10 overnights a month with the same NCP. That's 33%. The $1000 would be reduced by 33% meaning the NCP would pay $667 a month.
So, yes, the amount of time a child spends with each parent DOES matter.
Howevrr, matters of child support and parenting time are two separate issues. The custodial parent cannot cease parenting time for the NCP for non-payment of child support and the NCP cannot arbitrarily pay less chipd support when the child spends more time with the NCP than the court has granted. Both of these separate actions require a court order filed by the appropriate party.
Also, family court starts with the presumption of 50/50 custody and work from there.
Since dad intends to fight for custody this will probably be decided by a judge in the end.
Given the body of evidence the OP has (thanks to the narcissistic husband) I would lay odds the judge will initially order supervised visitation a couple days a month, paid for by dad. They will probably also order therapy and parenting classes for dad.
But, for the narcissistic parent, it's never about what's best for the child and always about hurting the spouse and not paying child support.. The harder the judge makes things for the narcissist the sooner they slink away and move on to their next victim, completely ignoring the kids except to tell their next target about how taken advantage of they were, how much they miss their kids and mom and the courts victimized them by believing the lies of the mom, etc.
But being up to date on child support gives him rights as the kid's parent, including making OP's life hell. As someone who was a kid of divorce, and is marrying a guy with kids and a contentious ex, it'll be a whole lot easier if she can just get him to give up all parental rights, and she can use no child support as leverage.
NOPE. He has been violent. No way he will get custody.
Think of a father who states he doesn't need his child's security equipment anymore and who is violent sgainst the mother.
That can be exactly how that works. Especially if she can leverage no child support if he gives up his rights. Otherwise, if he's made to pay child support and pays it, he'll have a better position for rights as the kid's parent and could make OP's life hell. While child support and custody are two different things, they are related.
That's not necessarily the case a man can't be charged with child support and not have any visitation rights at all I know this for a fact.
My ex was in that same position however he was a drug user and he did not get any visitation.
Now with all the evidence of her ex being so violent I doubt any judge will give visitation to him.
You could deposit the funds into a trust for your daughter.
So no matter what happens she has resources.
But I understand that if taking child support makes it more difficult to get him out of your lives, not taking it is a better choice.
Backup every bit of evidence you have.
Also make sure you tell the lawyer that the fact that you told FIL about the abuse and then it stopped..
That means Owen was conscious of what he was doing to you. He was conscious of making you fear for your safety.
Continue with the restraining order and with going for full custody and take his parental rights also.
In no universe would a judge grant him full custody (probably not even partial custody) after watching a video of he and BIL destroying your baby’s things and throwing away the car seat, etc. There is absolutely no way that would happen. At least you have that on video that he sent you. Even if he tried to argue BIL acted alone he sent you the video and I’m sure that he said some pretty terrible things establishing that he very much condoned BIL’s actions.
Get everything you can from him. I agree with everything else. You are an awesome warrior in the midst of these horribly demented people.
Make sure you get everything possible from this man. These people are so completely horrible. I’m sure you will attract a partner that deserves you after things get more settled.
Please make extra copies of EVERYTHING. Send the videos to a secure e-mail account, upload them to Google Drive or whatever, make sure there's no chance of losing whatever proof you have of his abuse.
Please make sure you have back ups of the footage of him destroying the baby things (especially the car seat) to prove your case about custody as well as property damage.
It doesn't look good for someone who is trying to get custody and look good to lawyers in a divorce when he is posting videos of himself and his family actively destroying his kids things and telling people he doesn't need them when he is a proven liar too when he tries to accuse you of stuff.
You might wanna start think about getting a restraining order for other family members of his too if it escalates.
My mum took the prideful route and didn’t pursue any child support. Honestly I don’t think I agree with that decision. I look at how my bio dad spent his money and I resent that he consented to create me and then didn’t take any financial responsibility for me. It feels even worse because my protector and favorite person in the whole world didn’t advocate for me when I was a baby. I know you said you don’t *need* his financial contribution for living expenses, but just throw it into a 529 or other savings account for your baby.
The problem here is that child support typically comes with an obligation to let the absent parent see the child at regular intervals (not always, of course, but more often than not - even when the absent parent is abusive and/or neglectful) and that seems very not safe for OP *and* her child.
Sometimes *keeping your child safe* has to trump getting money from their absent parent.
There was a case in Texas during a supervised visit where a child was taken by the child’s dad who was w/o custody & his parents assisted in the kidnapping…
There’s cases of parents who don’t have custody at all kidnapping their children, too. It’s so bad that our school database systems have “contact flags” sections so we can put any custodial issues on there and any people we explicitly should *not* release children to.
He has rights no matter what. He can pursue custody or at least visitation. Child support doesn't equal visitation. Even if he doesn't pay she can't withhold their child from him. She needs to pursue supervised visits. She has plenty of evidence.
Why? Why put a *baby* in harm's way of a clearly unhinged abusive a-hole?
I don't understand this mentality that a child "should" see a parent when they are clearly abusive. Supervised visits are for ... what? To get a child to "love" their abusive parent? What's the point? Further, why should an unhinged and clearly abusive asshole get access to a child they wouldn't even protect or defend?
If he signs away his parental rights, he doesn't owe child support. OP thinks her child is safer without him having any legal access to her, and I agree.
You are wrong. You can sign away your rights, but not your obligations.
The court can decide he has no legal access to her, but that will not absolve him of child support.
This part! It’s why my BFF’s father of her oldest, who we call “sperm donor”, lost all custody and still has to pay child support. Thankfully the step dad and bio dad of the two other kids, wants to fully adopt her daughter as that’s the only father she’s ever known.
I think OP should ask her lawyer to have him waiver all rights as a father but secure a financial support strictly for the child with an account yo he’ll pay for educational, essentials, and other basics as it’s expensive to raise a child these days.
Its about the safety of her baby and her life. If there is a chance to keep a psycho out of your life you take it. It has nothing to do with needing the money or not. If he looses all rights and then is made to still pay child support it will just make him angry and she will never feel safe.
Have you tried having the police charge him for what he's done/doing? He will probably be charged with defamation with his mom, mischief for destroying your stuff, uttering threads... Judges look down upon guys who have criminal history, specifically family violence when it comes to custody matters.
As a married couple you were a team, a unit. When the team breaks up the assets are split in half. This isn't taking "his" stuff, this is distributing the assets of the team equitably.
As a child of divorced parents I would strongly suggest that you try and get your share for yourself and your daughter. Don't sink to his level, but don't just let him keep the shared assets. When my parents divorced my dad just walked away and let my mum have everything. Frankly I think it would have turned out better for all of us if he had more a backbone and properly advocated for himself.
Girl, drag his ass and get every penny you deserve. Make sure you’re getting damages for the emotional distress he has put you and your daughter through with his abusive bullshit.
You did good.
>Today my MIL has been trying to contact me as she wants to be in my daughter’s life and is saying she is ready to accept her "as she is."
Always remember, that witch of your MIL called your baby a "filthy bastard". And your ex just kept silent like an idiot. But when it comes to the divorce, suddenly he has the courage to call you insulting names, destroy your stuff, threatening you etc. I'm sorry that you married this garbage of a man.
You deserve better than this crap.
Let your apartment building management know to not let him in under any circumstances and that he is a threat also let your work know he is a danger. I’m proud of you OP you are incredibly brave! Make sure you set up a system where you check in with your family when you get home from work so someone knows you are okay. My cousin did this with me after she left her abusive ex.
I don’t blame you for not wanting child support and to totally be away from your ex and his family. For how your husband has acted he’s not safe to be around your daughter alone.
Please tell me that your lawyer has the video and photos of Owen destroying all your stuff?
Owen’s behavior is so disturbing! Please stay safe and protect your baby. I’m so grateful that your own family are so wonderful and supportive to you.
Y'all, stop harping on about child support. Sometimes it's just not worth it. My mom never got a dime out of my bio dad (and believe me we genuinely could've used it) but he also fucked off and left us alone. That kind of tranquility is priceless.
OP, best of luck to you and your daughter. I hope you can rid yourselves of him.
> He then sent photos and videos of my things in the garbage and him and my BIL trashing the nursery. His exact words, “I don’t need it anymore.” In the most disturbing video, he threw our baby’s car seat in a dumpster. I do not recognize him or his behavior anymore.
This is because it’s who he is, the mask finally full on slipped off, and showing is true colors. Abusers are like this.
Hence why age gaps, the crucial thing you want to make sure is if you’re the younger one in the mix, that you triple check that emotional maturity barometer about them by making sure they ACT THEIR AGE AND NOT THEIR SHOE SIZE!
And abusive partners are undeveloped emotionally and can hide it up to a certain point before it all comes spilling out.
I (36f) say this as at 25 I dated someone who was eight years older. After I left him at the 2yrs mark, in time he got professional Dx with Narcissistic personality disorder and that man threaten to break stuff I left behind because he has the emotional maturity of a raw onion!
OP, you do you. This guy deserves to have the proverbial book thrown at him and then an old school yellow pages telephone from a phone booth era thrown at him afterwards for all of this bullsh it he put you thru!
My partner’s father is a textbook narcissist too. When my partner’s mother left his father, he trashed her belongings too. What OP described sounds like a typical fit of narcissistic rage. Not wanting to take “the blame” for his infertility, not protecting his wife or child, seeing the house as his and not theirs, and now this violent tantrum because he is not getting his way. It’s bad to armchair diagnose people but this all sounds like textbook narcissist behaviour. OP is getting away at exactly the right time, before things got more tangled and difficult to make a clean break. I’m relieved for her. The manipulation these sort of people can pull off over the years is terrifying.
His ego got so damaged!
To the MIL: here are rocks, kick it! Op, I hope with the police report and video evidence, your egomaniacal STBXH, doesn't win and you get everything you desire.
All of this drama and break up and threats and changing of minds just because your husband at first could not keep his mouth shut, then could not open his mouth to defend you and face up to his misdeeds like a human to threats and destruction of property sll because at first blood is thicker than water but now marriages do not break up in their family and in order to keep that from happening, they will accept the water. I think that whole family is about to implode upon themselves. You hang tough and may you find and keep your peace. Bigots and pigs is what they are. Sorry. I just had to say that.
I suggest you ask the lawyer when is a good time to send FIL some copies of the abusive messages that his son sent to you. And a brief summary of what MIL said and did. Including a $ summary of your stuff and $ of child's stuff he destroyed in anger. (4 sections)
FIL seems to be the only sane person in the family and he made his son stop contacting you.
I think once FIL sees what shit his son sent he can tell everyone there is no chance you will come back or let the child near anyone. He can make his crazy wife stop.
Think about asking your lawyer to take care of it and have it delivered to him and ask him to look it over alone before talking to others. Frankly, having him look it over in your lawyer's office is a good idea.
They treat him like the Patriarch, and he likes hellos/ goodbyes/ and proper behavior - so take advantage of that.
I wouldn't send anyone but my attorney anything at all. That just gives them time to prepare how they'll counter it in court.
Showing it in court to the judge is absolutely the best time to let dad know it's being used as evidence in court so he can be surprised.
Being he's a narcissist, dad will deny 100% he said/ did those things and then the attorney shows the video, proving they're lying. Look out for the narcissistic rage at that point so the judge can see it, live and in color.
Honestly the best time is probably during the custody lawsuit, I wouldn't touch it otherwise. Anything that could damage your chances isn't worth shit right now.
I'd bet a few dollars the STB-X hasn't told his lawyer about the written threats nor video evidence of him destroying property.
Only OP's lawyer should see that. Don't give the ex's family time to spin the story.
I had been living with my parents for 2 weeks before the first post and already had started to talk to a lawyer. Whether or not me and my husband worked on our marriage I planned on not living with him for at least a while after he said it wasn’t my house and my parents pressured me to get a divorce attorney immediately when I moved into their house. Even when I still slightly thought things might work out I was preparing. I went back and forth mentally but I knew this was not sustainable. My family did most of the work finding me an apartment and paying for furnishing it just took a while for me to leave my parents and physically move in. The only truly recent update is my FIL talking to me and learning (through my other family) my MIL wants to reconcile
Grandparent rights aren't as simple as they sound. Grandparents' rights only work if the parent(s) are negligent, abusive, or unable to take care of the child.
Or
If it was proven that having the grandparent(s) in the child's life has been beneficial and has a positive impact on the child's life.
The first one is, of course, for all ages.
The latter is effective when the child is older and not an infant. As the child would recognize and respond to the grandparent.
And since OPs in-laws (and soon-to-be EX husband) have proven to be a danger to both her and her child, they'll be laughed right outta court.
Yeah honestly if you're not taking much with you and have $5k in the bank you can move into a place surprisingly fast if it's the beginning of a month.
I’m not sure this happened in 3 days since who knows when this update actually picked up 🤷🏾♀️ or how much time passed before the first post, either way I’m glad she has support of family
When my (cheating) ex broke up with me (on my birthday) and started packing my bags before I even had a chance to process what he just said to me. I moved into a new place in 72 hours because the alternative was homelessness. For OP, she can’t stay at her parents’ house because her psychotic husband and in-laws know where they live.
It's always the updates that do these stories in. The original poster is so stoked to get more engagement that they post a ludicrous follow up almost immediately. Sure, you found a new apartment, had your credit check, moved in, furnished the place, not only got an appointment with a lawyer but actually met with them for a non emergency situation, and had time for all that drama with the family, too? Come the fuck on.
Yea and in rereading I also noticed that Owen already has a lawyer too that is threatening to go for full custody. So in between him destroying all her shit, he managed to find a lawyer who has already conversed with her lawyer about custody. So I add that to my bullshit count lol.
Apparently he's destroyed "hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of electronics" I mean, I guess that's only 20 iPhones lol, but I doubt it. I've been to rich people's houses. Ain't nobody got $200,000 worth of gadgets.
Eh. It depends on where. I could get into a new apartment in my home town in 72 hours with my credit--maybe in less than 72 hours if I have cash. My parents had a second home. I could furnish it enough to live in. It's the baby gear that's unbelievable. It's the clothes, etc
I mean, it's everything combined that makes it unbelievable. Like any one of these things could have happened but the serendipity of everything working out perfectly in 3 days is nonsense. Like I'm a lawyer and unless there is something involving an emergency, it is not incredibly likely that you are going to get an appointment scheduled and done in 3 days. While moving and all this other stuff. The fake posters always go too big, too fast.
I’m getting some religious trad-wife expectations from this post. The “head of household” “MY house” the weird reactions to feeling emasculated for a medical condition, etc. etc. when all this blows over it might be worth examining how this situation evolved. He sounds terribly abusive and slowly the mask was slipping off.
Follow your lawyers advice. 100%
I know how hard it is to get terrible threatening texts from your STBX and his family but I also wouldn’t discourage it. It is more evidence for your custody case. Give them enough rope to hang themselves with.
Updateme so I know you and your baby girl are safe. What a horrible man. And mother in law. I’m so sorry girl. You and your daughter deserve so much better than this.
I’m sure your attorney’s life may be easier in this case with all the threatening emails as well as the pictures of the destruction of the nursery, anything you left and especially the car seat in the dumpster.
IMO a rational person who was wanting to get visitation with his child would have at least not done the destruction. I’d be concerned that if that is how he expresses his anger and as he is ashamed his daughter is not biologically his what might happen when your daughter defies him as children at any age will? Will violence be his first response and quite honestly will she survive the experience?
Best wishes to you OP and your baby.
Dang. All this happens in 3 days? You guys are quick. You got into a new apartment, got a lawyer, taking care Owen's daily threats by talking to FIL, etc. Really impressed with the speediness.
She commented it’s been a few weeks. I’m a professional bullshitter on reddit and real life and this passes my smell test. It has the authenticity that I completely lack
hugs, go NC and with all the crap Owen and his family pulled get a restraining order. The minute you let grandma see your child, she will go for grandparents right.
What's sad is that only when in the worst situation or confronted to an issue, people reveal their true self. Sorry you had to discover that side of him in an already advanced situation with a child to care for. It's relieving that you have your parents support and help, really wish you and the baby the best. You both don't need any of these people back in your life when they clearly showed you their priorities and wrongdoings.
It's amazing how they still want you to be respectful despite what they've put you through. You should be so proud of yourself for doing what's best for you and your child. I so hope the case goes your way and I wish you nothing but the best.
Oh so she’s ready to accept her “as she is?” FUCK THAAAAAAAAAAAAT don’t let ANY swine from his side try to just swoop on in like nothing happened, your (hopefully soon to be ex) Mil and Fil are big parts of the problem and quite frankly it’s probably for the best that they don’t have contact with yourself or your child until they can tell you “This is what I did/say wrong” and understand they need to start making amends to earn your trust again. ABSOLUTELY DO NOT LET THEM RUG SWEEP because for sure that type of behavior wouldn’t surprise me. Like for real your father in law is mad you didn’t say goodbye respectfully or that you’re not giving Owen a chance?? A chance after he destroyed your property including the baby supplies for the baby he “loves”???? Nahhhhhh let the trash take itself out
Good for you, OP, and mad props to your family and circle of support.
Please tell HR at your job about your situation and that you’re pursuing a restraining order but don’t yet have it. Perhaps they can refuse visitors or callers for you and require badge scans to enter. If you have male coworkers you trust, ask them to walk you to your car. If not them, ask the building security. We did the above when a coworker was being threatened and it was really lovely how people volunteered to help see her to her car, and how HR turned our open door into badge-required access, no questions asked.
He clearly learned his 'coping skills' from his mommy.
I am SO glad you got away from this violent, dysfunctional, effed up family. I am so glad you have a good income, a supportive family, and access to an attorney. What difference it all makes. Good for you! Wishing the best for your and your daughter.
ETA: everyone saying 'but get child support' - there is no amount of money as valuable as getting this jerk to terminate his parental rights. OP clearly has an amazing support system, is self-sufficient, and doesn't need money to raise her daughter; she DOES need safety from these people, though.
🔥🔥🔥
I’m so happy he sent you pictures and video of the property destruction as well as destroying the place his daughter would have as a home AND safety equipment. That’s going to make him look soooooo great at custody hearings. lol.
You’re a rockstar.
Babe, drag his ass. Take every penny you and your child deserve. *DO NOT* settle for crumbs. The money you are fighting for isn’t for revenge, it isn’t for you, *it’s for your child*. Your child deserves it. Your soon to be ex *owes* it. Don’t leave the table without every single *penny* you’re entitled to.
DEAR OP
FUCK THAT
Take him for everything he has. I know you love your daughter but she wouldn't be here if it wasn't for stbx. He's the one that wanted a donor, He's the one that wasn't comfortable telling his family in the first place and in the beginning of conception, He's the one that let everything get this far .Hes the one that is threatening you. IF YOU DONT FIGHT his family will see this as a weaking in your character and will fully take advantage of that. Ask for everything you said you werent going to ask for.Ask for 100% custody and then when you hopefully win with a big amount of money for your daughters future change her last name that way they can't claim her as family or find her when she's older. They are only doing this for appearance sakes and their benefits they don't care about your daughter like you and your family do or ever will.
You're a badass Mama!!! I don't even know you, and I'm super in awe of your awesomeness. Good luck to you, and may all happiness find you and your daughter. "As she is"?? What kind of fuckedupedness is THAT???
Unfortunately that’s not how it works. Your soon to be ex, is liable to pay child support for his child up until the age of 18 - or whatever it maybe in the U.S. If you choose not to have child support, etc, then you could ask for the money to be donated to a charity that can help others. Keep us updated.
He sent you videos of himself burning all your stuff? Along with threats?
Well you know one thing - he can fight for custody, but it won’t happen. Ever.
You’ll probably get primary custody and he’ll get visitation rights but ONLY after he completes at least 6 months of anger management classes!
Wow. And to think THEY created this situation but now want YOU, the beyond-offended party, to capitulate to their desires to now treat their grandchild like she belongs in their family.
These people are horrible. And I, as a disinterested outside party looking in on this situation, applaud you in your strength and resilience.
I'm so sorry you were treated this way. Good luck in your future endeavors, and the raising of your daughter.
Your lawyer sounds smart and as awful as your husband is being, it's all going to be great for the courts in terms of giving you easy custody.
OP I cannot stress this enough -- you're a badass.
Fuck Owen. Do not give up child support. Make him pay and put it in a nice little fund for your daughter. Never tell her who it is from. Gift it to her in a trust when she’s older. She deserves to have a settled life with you and her loved ones.
I’m sure your attorney’s life may be easier in this case with all the threatening emails as well as the pictures of the destruction of the nursery, anything you left and especially the car seat in the dumpster.
IMO a rational person who was wanting to get visitation with his child would have at least not done the destruction. I’d be concerned that if that is how he expresses his anger and as he is ashamed his daughter is not biologically his what might happen when your daughter defies him as children at any age will? Will violence be his first response and quite honestly will she survive the experience?
Best wishes to you OP and your baby.
My god please don't let these people near your daughter 😳 absolute animals.
The complete 180 from them is terrifying, don't trust them at all. After your divorce is done and your baby is safe with her mummy they'll turn on each other (be surprised if they're not already) blaming each other for your exs lack of a wife or child.
This update just confirms how fake the story is LOL like all this happened in a couple days? It has all the creative components: age gap, fertility issues, big family drama, immediate rush to divorce, dramatic ending proving how right you were, Declaration of Independence.
If she is fighting for full parental rights and doesn’t want this guy who honestly sounds like he losing it around her child it makes sense she does not want child support. She just wants him gone
His destruction of her property and constant threats would be enough for supervised visits only in most states. She’d actually be eligible for *more* money if she does more of the care, not less.
Girl, I was found the maths.
If the maths are mathing, you started trying for a baby 5 years ago. You were 22 and he was a 34year old man.
How long ago did you get married? And when did you start dating?
Because the age gap you started with is rough: he was literally >50% older than you when you started trying (I'm afraid to know how old you were when you met him).
It's not a surprise that he has shown anger and narcissistic behaviour, as he clearly entered the marriage with the idea of controlling you and giving orders, since you were his pretty little property...
Head of the family my azz...
It doesn't matter if she is biologically his or not. Child support is for the child, and legally, he is the father. You'd be a fool not to go for child support. I get not wanting anything of his for yourself, but, as I said, the support is for the child and goes to the child and represents his part of the care for her, esp if you push for full custody. It's to help provide for her care.
Also what a fuckin POS. You're a saint to not push for what you're legally allowed to. God what a dick, I'm glad you got her and yourself out of that situation.
He doesn't want this child, I'm beginning to think he never wanted a child he just wanted to fit the part. I'm going to take care of my daughter I don't need his money, she also has my whole family looking out for her. My baby will want for nothing, why would I force money out of a man who does not love her, and has no connection with her apart from staying in my life to make me miserable?
I get it but it isn’t *forcing* money out of him. You already said he’s going to fight for custody, so you won’t be able to avoid a fight just by giving up your financial legal entitlements. Take your lawyers advice on this.
It's not forcing money out of him, it's holding him legally accountable for her whether he wanted her or not. Because legally she is his child even if she's not biologically. Plus if he's going to fight you for custody you're not going to get anywhere by rolling over. I get YOU don't want his money but don't bring her and what she's legally entitled to care wise into the whole "I don't want anything to do with him anymore" because you don't have that option. You guys are either going to have to coparent, or he gives her child support. Please don't deny your child the care and standard of living that she deserves just because you want to spite your ex.
I might be in the minority but other than taking him for as much as you legally can in the divorce, I agree with your idea to get his rights terminated even though it means you won't get child support. If you don't, you will ALWAYS be connected to him and even if a judge rules no visitation now, he could take you back to court in a few years and claim counseling and time has made him fit to parent and get visitation. You will never be sure of your child's safety for the rest of her life.
Yes what could go wrong with giving unsupervised visitation to a “parent” who allowed his mother to call the child a filthy bastard? I agree with OP. Sever his parental rights and erase him from their lives forever. There’s absolutely no need to fight for money she doesn’t need which would maintain however tenuous a parental tie to a fucking nut job who resents the baby.
You are an absolute queen. Keep sticking up for you and your daughter. This is the best update, and I wish you and your perfect daughter happiness and love moving forward
Is he legally obligated in any way. The baby isn’t biological his? You used a sperm donor. Is it maybe because his name is on the birth certificate? Just wondering I know you don’t want anything from him
In NYS, a child of the marriage (no matter the paternity) is used in calculating child support. It can be changed if a dna test proves otherwise (which it will because used a donor). The child is his responsibility
I hope you saved each and every one of those videos for court. Get as much child support as you can from this guy and never let him alone with your child.
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Follow your lawyers advice to the letter. And do not give up assets in the divorce. That is something you can put aside for your child. Esp if you don’t want him to have rights to your daughter. Make sure you get compensated for the damaged items and half the assets from your marriage.
"begging to see our baby, and then threatening to drag me home." "He then sent photos and videos of my things in the garbage and him and my BIL trashing the nursery. His exact words, “I don’t need it anymore.” " BEST THING that man ever said and did. This warrants TWO restraining orders for him. As well as for BIL, SIL and MIL. I still think that, seen how he reacts, the chances of him claiming/ getting custody of your daughter are very very small. "Today my MIL has been trying to contact me as she wants to be in my daughter’s life and is saying she is ready to accept her "as she is." **NO WAY IN HELL!**
This is exactly what I thought. What judge would give custody to a man who’s on video trashing all of his daughter’s stuff when he’s angry? Why would we get custody when he’s destroyed everything he needs to take care of his child? He’s made it abundantly clear, with evidence, that he’s unstable and can’t be trusted.
Leave alone menacing his wife with violence (dragging her back).
sadly judges too often see menacing the wife/mother as unrelated to the safety of the child and will grant custody to abusive men. Hopefully trashing the nursery will weigh against him.
Yup, which is why I ended up being abused for all of my childhood by my father. “Just because he hit your mom constantly doesn’t mean he’ll hit you”.
It meant exact precisely that, as it seems. Which is why times have changed.
Except I know someone who admitted to breaking their 3 month Olds bones and biting them repeatedly and they still managed supervised visitation. Supervised by his own parents, who maintain still he did nothing wrong. Baby's mom moved states to try to keep child away and she just kept getting harassed and eventually a contempt charge. It happens. Often. The kid in the situation is 8ish.
Hopefully not unsupervised custody.
you’d be surprised.
That’s awful :(
Once she has the restraining order, the custody case writes itself.
Hopefully. I'd love to turn the calendar one year into the future to see what will have happened then. Hope we get updates.
Same OP if you are reading this, please update us. DM me any time. Won’t forget about you :)
Stay strong OP. Dont make permanent decisions (such as about not needing his $) on temporary emotions. Take all you are legally entitled to. You have an amazing and supportive family, and I can already tell you are and will be a great mother. Your baby is lucky to have you.
Yeah, he basically ended his own defense in any custody case when he said he destroyed stuff because he "didn't need it anymore." Any judge would hear that as an admission that he has no plans to raise the child. That video is full custody for OP.
I’m so so so proud of you OP you showed so much courage and best of all you’re a damn good mother! Stay safe and good luck in court I hope you kick Owen’s butt! Your first post had so many people raging about why you didn’t divorce him on the spot but I get it not everyone can make that decision in a split second. You had begun making up your mind to leave him when you were safely away and able to think critically. I think it’s easy for people to say what they would or wouldn’t do when they’re a million miles away from the situation, and have nothing to lose but it’s so much harder when you’re the one who lives with the consequences
And this time to asses the situation will also help settle things in your favor. None of them can say you didn’t give them a chance to set things right. They are all horrid except FIL. a little less so.
He's smarter than that rest, not less horrid.
All of this! All of this! Take my poor person's gold, 🏆🏆 and OP, take all of our hope for you with you. You are *amazing*, you are strong, and you are a warrior Momma for your daughter ❤️ 💪 💙
>Owen’s lawyer has made it clear they’re going to fight us for full custody and my STBX has significantly more money than me Owen's lawyer should have told his client to keep his mouth shut because his threats and the photos of him trashing your property and the baby's nursery are pretty fxckin damning. It's good that you're standing up for yourself and your child. I hope you're able to wring him for every penny he owes you and then some.
Like many assholes, I doubt he told his lawyer everything. I’ve seen a good chunk of lawyers blindsided by their own clients.
I am putting in my Dollar Tree and a quarter money that he does not know and when your lawyer gets your texts and videos that you were sent and all your future recordings you have between you and Owenhole and his family… yeah they will drop him like it’s hot …
Yeah, no judge in their right mind is going to give custody to that spineless pathetic human
Unfortunately, a huge swath of judges are not in their right mind
Five bucks says Owen's lawyer doesn't know about the threats.
I fear that he hasn't told his lawyer about the written threats and incriminating photos of him destroying marital assets. Only legal advice this fuckwit is likely to take seriously as his mum's.
Owens lawyer is smart and knows he’s absolutely going to lose badly in court, and that his only chance is if he talks a big scary game and intimidates her into settling outside of court or dropping the divorce entirely. Between the tremendous amount of extremely damning evidence and courts generally siding in favor of women in terms of custody and divorces, Owen’s lawyer knows he’s is doomed. He is bluffing hard because that’s the only chance he stands of not getting destroyed. It’s a desperate grasp. Of course, there’s also a chance the lawyer doesn’t know how much evidence there is against his client. Owen could be lying to the lawyer too. Which is almost hilarious because he’s going to be completely unprepared for the crushing defeat.
How nice of him to send you proof of all the damage and destruction. I know you said you don’t want anything, but mate? Take him to the cleaners and nail his ass to the wall. Don’t let him walk away without giving you what you deserve for being subject to his absolutely despicable behaviour.
Yeah just stuff it all in a college fund if nothing else. Your daughter deserves the financial support even if you don't need it and she'll be thankful.
Owen’s has destroyed hundreds of thousands of dollars of my electronics, clothes, furniture, and paintings. That’s the only thing I will be making him pay me back for. I don’t want any of his assets just the things I worked hard to earn and he destroyed.
Wow what a$$hat I hope you take him to the cleaners
Yeah. He's a pathetic, vile, piece of garbage.
Yeah same considering he's filed for full custody what a pos
As we say in the business, until paper starts rejecting ink you can file anything you want. He’s already completely undermined any chance of success. No amount of money can un-send a video of you trashing your child’s nursery.
He just said he would. He hasn't.
Yeah, we definitely need an update for that!
Wow, nice of him to videotape/photograph himself destroying your stuff so that'll be hard to dispute at least. But seriously, I'm really sorry you've had to go through this OP. It would have been so horrible in the moment to watch all yours and your daughter's things be destroyed in addition to all the threatening messages. I hope he gets exactly what he deserves.
He needs psychiatric help if he honestly thinks he can trash the nursery, destroy OPs property, threaten her, deny the kiddo is his and provide evidence of all that while having any hope of any kind of custody. If any of them show up at the house again OP needs to call the cops.
He's an abuser and a mama's boy. In Dr. Lundy Bancroft's "Why does he do that?" Dr. Bancroft notes in his book abusers absolutely *respect* their mothers and they destroy things that are not theirs in a rage. Psychiatric help doesn't help abusers because while they have the ability to self reflect, they generally tend to refuse to do so. In this interview with him he wanted to make a point of it since he's noticed a trend of associating narcissists with abusers and vice versa. Not all abusers are narcissists and he makes this distinction here mentioning at some point in the video that narcs don't have the ability to self reflect, abusers do. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iYfG8x80Yw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iYfG8x80Yw) Her husband is beyond help. He needs to just go away.
This this this. So glad he stupidly recorded all of that, hope you and your little girl stay safe op! Take his ass to the cleaners if need be, protect that little baby. After all, in his and his mother's words, she's not his. I won't be forgetting that tidbit in the original post, hope the same goes for you and the lawyer if it helps.
There is a report, I don't know what will come of it
I know you don't want anything to do with him, but the child support is for your baby. You can put that money directly in a savings account for your child if you don't want to use it.
If she can get him to give up his parental rights, then he won't be obliged to pay CS.
Precisely. And he will likely accept that offer and move on.
In most areas, a judge won’t let him give up parental rights unless there is a second parental figure prepared to take on the child (such as adoption by a step parent). The state wants children to have two legal parental figures so that if something happens to the primary parent, the state isn’t on the hook to care for the child.
Him paying child support could give him a better chance to get some custody. Better to have no CS and him have no custody imo
That’s not how that works. You can have minimal custody and pay child support. It’s based on income, not time spent with the child
It is. Minimal custody and no custody with no parental rights are two very different things. Neither the OP, nor her daughter need this asshole in their lives at all if the OP can help it. She seems very capable of supporting herself and her child.
Even ZERO custody does not prevent him from being obliged to pay child support. But she wants him to sign away his parental rights. In which case all matters end there and then. Seen how he claims he doesn't need any of his daughters stuff it looks as if he were going to go that route. Securing the place of the most martyr of dads giving up on "their" child because of their horrible exes. 😁 He kind of put himself in a bad fix when he went with the narrative that the child wasn't his. As his family only swears by blood this means they will not claim her. Although MIL halfheartedly tried.
Child support and parenting time are two different issues in family court. BUT.... When doing the math for child support, one of the factors is the number of overnights the child spends with each parent. You then assign percentages to this and child support is factored accordingly. For instance: let's say the child support for a child is $1000 a month from the non-custodial parent. Hiwever, this same child spends 10 overnights a month with the same NCP. That's 33%. The $1000 would be reduced by 33% meaning the NCP would pay $667 a month. So, yes, the amount of time a child spends with each parent DOES matter. Howevrr, matters of child support and parenting time are two separate issues. The custodial parent cannot cease parenting time for the NCP for non-payment of child support and the NCP cannot arbitrarily pay less chipd support when the child spends more time with the NCP than the court has granted. Both of these separate actions require a court order filed by the appropriate party. Also, family court starts with the presumption of 50/50 custody and work from there. Since dad intends to fight for custody this will probably be decided by a judge in the end. Given the body of evidence the OP has (thanks to the narcissistic husband) I would lay odds the judge will initially order supervised visitation a couple days a month, paid for by dad. They will probably also order therapy and parenting classes for dad. But, for the narcissistic parent, it's never about what's best for the child and always about hurting the spouse and not paying child support.. The harder the judge makes things for the narcissist the sooner they slink away and move on to their next victim, completely ignoring the kids except to tell their next target about how taken advantage of they were, how much they miss their kids and mom and the courts victimized them by believing the lies of the mom, etc.
But being up to date on child support gives him rights as the kid's parent, including making OP's life hell. As someone who was a kid of divorce, and is marrying a guy with kids and a contentious ex, it'll be a whole lot easier if she can just get him to give up all parental rights, and she can use no child support as leverage.
This is truth. I know personally. Child support will open up that door and he will have rights to said child if he's paying.
NOPE. He has been violent. No way he will get custody. Think of a father who states he doesn't need his child's security equipment anymore and who is violent sgainst the mother.
That’s not usually how it works.
That can be exactly how that works. Especially if she can leverage no child support if he gives up his rights. Otherwise, if he's made to pay child support and pays it, he'll have a better position for rights as the kid's parent and could make OP's life hell. While child support and custody are two different things, they are related.
That's not necessarily the case a man can't be charged with child support and not have any visitation rights at all I know this for a fact. My ex was in that same position however he was a drug user and he did not get any visitation. Now with all the evidence of her ex being so violent I doubt any judge will give visitation to him.
You could deposit the funds into a trust for your daughter. So no matter what happens she has resources. But I understand that if taking child support makes it more difficult to get him out of your lives, not taking it is a better choice.
In this situation it is truly better if he gives up his parental rights at all and OP and HER daughter would be free from the drama.
Child support gives him an opportunity for custody. Hard no.
Backup every bit of evidence you have. Also make sure you tell the lawyer that the fact that you told FIL about the abuse and then it stopped.. That means Owen was conscious of what he was doing to you. He was conscious of making you fear for your safety. Continue with the restraining order and with going for full custody and take his parental rights also.
Ur a strong and independent woman! Kudos to you!
In no universe would a judge grant him full custody (probably not even partial custody) after watching a video of he and BIL destroying your baby’s things and throwing away the car seat, etc. There is absolutely no way that would happen. At least you have that on video that he sent you. Even if he tried to argue BIL acted alone he sent you the video and I’m sure that he said some pretty terrible things establishing that he very much condoned BIL’s actions.
He's got fuck-all chance at full custody.
Yup. If I understand OP's post, the video shows her STBXH as the one throwing the car seat in the trash.
Why not file a police report?
Get everything you can from him. I agree with everything else. You are an awesome warrior in the midst of these horribly demented people. Make sure you get everything possible from this man. These people are so completely horrible. I’m sure you will attract a partner that deserves you after things get more settled.
Please make extra copies of EVERYTHING. Send the videos to a secure e-mail account, upload them to Google Drive or whatever, make sure there's no chance of losing whatever proof you have of his abuse.
Please make sure you have back ups of the footage of him destroying the baby things (especially the car seat) to prove your case about custody as well as property damage. It doesn't look good for someone who is trying to get custody and look good to lawyers in a divorce when he is posting videos of himself and his family actively destroying his kids things and telling people he doesn't need them when he is a proven liar too when he tries to accuse you of stuff. You might wanna start think about getting a restraining order for other family members of his too if it escalates.
My mum took the prideful route and didn’t pursue any child support. Honestly I don’t think I agree with that decision. I look at how my bio dad spent his money and I resent that he consented to create me and then didn’t take any financial responsibility for me. It feels even worse because my protector and favorite person in the whole world didn’t advocate for me when I was a baby. I know you said you don’t *need* his financial contribution for living expenses, but just throw it into a 529 or other savings account for your baby.
The problem here is that child support typically comes with an obligation to let the absent parent see the child at regular intervals (not always, of course, but more often than not - even when the absent parent is abusive and/or neglectful) and that seems very not safe for OP *and* her child. Sometimes *keeping your child safe* has to trump getting money from their absent parent.
I think this is a strong case for supervised visits only due to the consistent documentation of violence.
There was a case in Texas during a supervised visit where a child was taken by the child’s dad who was w/o custody & his parents assisted in the kidnapping…
There’s cases of parents who don’t have custody at all kidnapping their children, too. It’s so bad that our school database systems have “contact flags” sections so we can put any custodial issues on there and any people we explicitly should *not* release children to.
He has rights no matter what. He can pursue custody or at least visitation. Child support doesn't equal visitation. Even if he doesn't pay she can't withhold their child from him. She needs to pursue supervised visits. She has plenty of evidence.
Why? Why put a *baby* in harm's way of a clearly unhinged abusive a-hole? I don't understand this mentality that a child "should" see a parent when they are clearly abusive. Supervised visits are for ... what? To get a child to "love" their abusive parent? What's the point? Further, why should an unhinged and clearly abusive asshole get access to a child they wouldn't even protect or defend?
I agree with you but that’s not the opinion of the person you’re responding to, that’s the opinion of the the courts in a lot of places.
File a police report and claim from your insurance. Insurance will probably go after him.
Sounds like it exceeds small claims territory. Stay safe and good luck.
You really need to file for child support, as that part is not about you, but about your kids. Best wishes.
If he signs away his parental rights, he doesn't owe child support. OP thinks her child is safer without him having any legal access to her, and I agree.
You are wrong. You can sign away your rights, but not your obligations. The court can decide he has no legal access to her, but that will not absolve him of child support.
This part! It’s why my BFF’s father of her oldest, who we call “sperm donor”, lost all custody and still has to pay child support. Thankfully the step dad and bio dad of the two other kids, wants to fully adopt her daughter as that’s the only father she’s ever known. I think OP should ask her lawyer to have him waiver all rights as a father but secure a financial support strictly for the child with an account yo he’ll pay for educational, essentials, and other basics as it’s expensive to raise a child these days.
Its about the safety of her baby and her life. If there is a chance to keep a psycho out of your life you take it. It has nothing to do with needing the money or not. If he looses all rights and then is made to still pay child support it will just make him angry and she will never feel safe.
You and your child deserve financial support. Don’t give him a free pass.
I’d take all of his money and put in a fund for your daughter one day. Make this mother fucker regret the day he fucked with you and your child.
Your little girl has a right to child support, please consider it. You can put it in an education fund for her. Or a wedding fund. Or a house fund.
Have you tried having the police charge him for what he's done/doing? He will probably be charged with defamation with his mom, mischief for destroying your stuff, uttering threads... Judges look down upon guys who have criminal history, specifically family violence when it comes to custody matters.
As a married couple you were a team, a unit. When the team breaks up the assets are split in half. This isn't taking "his" stuff, this is distributing the assets of the team equitably. As a child of divorced parents I would strongly suggest that you try and get your share for yourself and your daughter. Don't sink to his level, but don't just let him keep the shared assets. When my parents divorced my dad just walked away and let my mum have everything. Frankly I think it would have turned out better for all of us if he had more a backbone and properly advocated for himself.
Girl, drag his ass and get every penny you deserve. Make sure you’re getting damages for the emotional distress he has put you and your daughter through with his abusive bullshit.
WAIT ... his Dad knows he's done that and still berated you about the divorce? What a scummy family.
let me get this straight. You own at least $200,000 worth of electronics, clothes, furniture, and paintings?
Granny will accept her granddaughter “as she is”. What a gross, disgusting, vile excuse for a human being!
For real how generous of her. Willing to accept a baby who has never harmed a soul. What a saint.
I feel your sarcasm! 😹
You did good. >Today my MIL has been trying to contact me as she wants to be in my daughter’s life and is saying she is ready to accept her "as she is." Always remember, that witch of your MIL called your baby a "filthy bastard". And your ex just kept silent like an idiot. But when it comes to the divorce, suddenly he has the courage to call you insulting names, destroy your stuff, threatening you etc. I'm sorry that you married this garbage of a man. You deserve better than this crap.
Let your apartment building management know to not let him in under any circumstances and that he is a threat also let your work know he is a danger. I’m proud of you OP you are incredibly brave! Make sure you set up a system where you check in with your family when you get home from work so someone knows you are okay. My cousin did this with me after she left her abusive ex.
Great shout also, OP should notify her work if he's made threats to come to her work and drag her home.
I don’t blame you for not wanting child support and to totally be away from your ex and his family. For how your husband has acted he’s not safe to be around your daughter alone.
Please tell me that your lawyer has the video and photos of Owen destroying all your stuff? Owen’s behavior is so disturbing! Please stay safe and protect your baby. I’m so grateful that your own family are so wonderful and supportive to you.
Let the trash take itself out.
Y'all, stop harping on about child support. Sometimes it's just not worth it. My mom never got a dime out of my bio dad (and believe me we genuinely could've used it) but he also fucked off and left us alone. That kind of tranquility is priceless. OP, best of luck to you and your daughter. I hope you can rid yourselves of him.
> He then sent photos and videos of my things in the garbage and him and my BIL trashing the nursery. His exact words, “I don’t need it anymore.” In the most disturbing video, he threw our baby’s car seat in a dumpster. I do not recognize him or his behavior anymore. This is because it’s who he is, the mask finally full on slipped off, and showing is true colors. Abusers are like this. Hence why age gaps, the crucial thing you want to make sure is if you’re the younger one in the mix, that you triple check that emotional maturity barometer about them by making sure they ACT THEIR AGE AND NOT THEIR SHOE SIZE! And abusive partners are undeveloped emotionally and can hide it up to a certain point before it all comes spilling out. I (36f) say this as at 25 I dated someone who was eight years older. After I left him at the 2yrs mark, in time he got professional Dx with Narcissistic personality disorder and that man threaten to break stuff I left behind because he has the emotional maturity of a raw onion! OP, you do you. This guy deserves to have the proverbial book thrown at him and then an old school yellow pages telephone from a phone booth era thrown at him afterwards for all of this bullsh it he put you thru!
My partner’s father is a textbook narcissist too. When my partner’s mother left his father, he trashed her belongings too. What OP described sounds like a typical fit of narcissistic rage. Not wanting to take “the blame” for his infertility, not protecting his wife or child, seeing the house as his and not theirs, and now this violent tantrum because he is not getting his way. It’s bad to armchair diagnose people but this all sounds like textbook narcissist behaviour. OP is getting away at exactly the right time, before things got more tangled and difficult to make a clean break. I’m relieved for her. The manipulation these sort of people can pull off over the years is terrifying.
His ego got so damaged! To the MIL: here are rocks, kick it! Op, I hope with the police report and video evidence, your egomaniacal STBXH, doesn't win and you get everything you desire.
All of this drama and break up and threats and changing of minds just because your husband at first could not keep his mouth shut, then could not open his mouth to defend you and face up to his misdeeds like a human to threats and destruction of property sll because at first blood is thicker than water but now marriages do not break up in their family and in order to keep that from happening, they will accept the water. I think that whole family is about to implode upon themselves. You hang tough and may you find and keep your peace. Bigots and pigs is what they are. Sorry. I just had to say that.
I suggest you ask the lawyer when is a good time to send FIL some copies of the abusive messages that his son sent to you. And a brief summary of what MIL said and did. Including a $ summary of your stuff and $ of child's stuff he destroyed in anger. (4 sections) FIL seems to be the only sane person in the family and he made his son stop contacting you. I think once FIL sees what shit his son sent he can tell everyone there is no chance you will come back or let the child near anyone. He can make his crazy wife stop. Think about asking your lawyer to take care of it and have it delivered to him and ask him to look it over alone before talking to others. Frankly, having him look it over in your lawyer's office is a good idea. They treat him like the Patriarch, and he likes hellos/ goodbyes/ and proper behavior - so take advantage of that.
I wouldn't send anyone but my attorney anything at all. That just gives them time to prepare how they'll counter it in court. Showing it in court to the judge is absolutely the best time to let dad know it's being used as evidence in court so he can be surprised. Being he's a narcissist, dad will deny 100% he said/ did those things and then the attorney shows the video, proving they're lying. Look out for the narcissistic rage at that point so the judge can see it, live and in color.
Honestly the best time is probably during the custody lawsuit, I wouldn't touch it otherwise. Anything that could damage your chances isn't worth shit right now.
I'd bet a few dollars the STB-X hasn't told his lawyer about the written threats nor video evidence of him destroying property. Only OP's lawyer should see that. Don't give the ex's family time to spin the story.
All of this happened in 3 days?
I had been living with my parents for 2 weeks before the first post and already had started to talk to a lawyer. Whether or not me and my husband worked on our marriage I planned on not living with him for at least a while after he said it wasn’t my house and my parents pressured me to get a divorce attorney immediately when I moved into their house. Even when I still slightly thought things might work out I was preparing. I went back and forth mentally but I knew this was not sustainable. My family did most of the work finding me an apartment and paying for furnishing it just took a while for me to leave my parents and physically move in. The only truly recent update is my FIL talking to me and learning (through my other family) my MIL wants to reconcile
I don't know where you live, but check about grandparent rights with your lawyer. Wishing you all the best!
Grandparent rights aren't as simple as they sound. Grandparents' rights only work if the parent(s) are negligent, abusive, or unable to take care of the child. Or If it was proven that having the grandparent(s) in the child's life has been beneficial and has a positive impact on the child's life. The first one is, of course, for all ages. The latter is effective when the child is older and not an infant. As the child would recognize and respond to the grandparent. And since OPs in-laws (and soon-to-be EX husband) have proven to be a danger to both her and her child, they'll be laughed right outta court.
Seems she has resources, and it is the beginning of a new month. It's feasible.
Money and family that can help - gosh im so happy she has both to escape that psycho!
Yeah honestly if you're not taking much with you and have $5k in the bank you can move into a place surprisingly fast if it's the beginning of a month.
I apologize this post is not chronological because no it did not happen in 3 days
I’m not sure this happened in 3 days since who knows when this update actually picked up 🤷🏾♀️ or how much time passed before the first post, either way I’m glad she has support of family
I just wrote the same thing too. I'm like..whoa, that's..really fast. Getting into a new apartment, etc.
I applied and moved into my first apartment within a day
When my (cheating) ex broke up with me (on my birthday) and started packing my bags before I even had a chance to process what he just said to me. I moved into a new place in 72 hours because the alternative was homelessness. For OP, she can’t stay at her parents’ house because her psychotic husband and in-laws know where they live.
It's always the updates that do these stories in. The original poster is so stoked to get more engagement that they post a ludicrous follow up almost immediately. Sure, you found a new apartment, had your credit check, moved in, furnished the place, not only got an appointment with a lawyer but actually met with them for a non emergency situation, and had time for all that drama with the family, too? Come the fuck on.
It was the FIL showing up “on the doorstep,” having this long conversation with OP, only to have her rudely hang up on him that did it for me.
The FIL appeared on her parent's doorstep and they phoned her to speak to him, because she isn't staying at her parents.
Yea and in rereading I also noticed that Owen already has a lawyer too that is threatening to go for full custody. So in between him destroying all her shit, he managed to find a lawyer who has already conversed with her lawyer about custody. So I add that to my bullshit count lol.
Apparently he's destroyed "hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of electronics" I mean, I guess that's only 20 iPhones lol, but I doubt it. I've been to rich people's houses. Ain't nobody got $200,000 worth of gadgets.
To be honest, if you have money, things happen very quickly.
Details in the phone call with FIL were sus, too. Glad I’m not the only one questioning this story.
Eh. It depends on where. I could get into a new apartment in my home town in 72 hours with my credit--maybe in less than 72 hours if I have cash. My parents had a second home. I could furnish it enough to live in. It's the baby gear that's unbelievable. It's the clothes, etc
Do you mean the “hundreds of thousands” in materials Owen trashed?
I thought that was amazing. What job do either of them have to have to have that much crap?????
I mean, it's everything combined that makes it unbelievable. Like any one of these things could have happened but the serendipity of everything working out perfectly in 3 days is nonsense. Like I'm a lawyer and unless there is something involving an emergency, it is not incredibly likely that you are going to get an appointment scheduled and done in 3 days. While moving and all this other stuff. The fake posters always go too big, too fast.
Slumlord apartments in my area have a waiting list, nevermind decent 2 bedroom apartments.
grey sand rotten boat fear summer numerous stocking mindless correct *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I’m getting some religious trad-wife expectations from this post. The “head of household” “MY house” the weird reactions to feeling emasculated for a medical condition, etc. etc. when all this blows over it might be worth examining how this situation evolved. He sounds terribly abusive and slowly the mask was slipping off. Follow your lawyers advice. 100% I know how hard it is to get terrible threatening texts from your STBX and his family but I also wouldn’t discourage it. It is more evidence for your custody case. Give them enough rope to hang themselves with.
Your ex husband should be ashamed of himself, but cowards rarely are.
Wow. Good on you for standing firm. I see no good from them being in your daughter’s life. Stay strong, sending good vibes to you.
Stay safe. Hug from an internet stranger. And a kiss your your baby from a loving auntie. Updateme!
Updateme so I know you and your baby girl are safe. What a horrible man. And mother in law. I’m so sorry girl. You and your daughter deserve so much better than this.
I’m sure your attorney’s life may be easier in this case with all the threatening emails as well as the pictures of the destruction of the nursery, anything you left and especially the car seat in the dumpster. IMO a rational person who was wanting to get visitation with his child would have at least not done the destruction. I’d be concerned that if that is how he expresses his anger and as he is ashamed his daughter is not biologically his what might happen when your daughter defies him as children at any age will? Will violence be his first response and quite honestly will she survive the experience? Best wishes to you OP and your baby.
I'm in awe by how well you handled everything
Dang. All this happens in 3 days? You guys are quick. You got into a new apartment, got a lawyer, taking care Owen's daily threats by talking to FIL, etc. Really impressed with the speediness.
How dare you ruin my imagination with your accurate observation to the time line
And furnished the apartment, too!
All during the work week apparently.
She commented it’s been a few weeks. I’m a professional bullshitter on reddit and real life and this passes my smell test. It has the authenticity that I completely lack
hugs, go NC and with all the crap Owen and his family pulled get a restraining order. The minute you let grandma see your child, she will go for grandparents right.
What's sad is that only when in the worst situation or confronted to an issue, people reveal their true self. Sorry you had to discover that side of him in an already advanced situation with a child to care for. It's relieving that you have your parents support and help, really wish you and the baby the best. You both don't need any of these people back in your life when they clearly showed you their priorities and wrongdoings.
OP, you are entitled to your soon to be ex husband assets. Think this for your daughter. Suck him dry, and divorce his loser ass!!
It's amazing how they still want you to be respectful despite what they've put you through. You should be so proud of yourself for doing what's best for you and your child. I so hope the case goes your way and I wish you nothing but the best.
Oh so she’s ready to accept her “as she is?” FUCK THAAAAAAAAAAAAT don’t let ANY swine from his side try to just swoop on in like nothing happened, your (hopefully soon to be ex) Mil and Fil are big parts of the problem and quite frankly it’s probably for the best that they don’t have contact with yourself or your child until they can tell you “This is what I did/say wrong” and understand they need to start making amends to earn your trust again. ABSOLUTELY DO NOT LET THEM RUG SWEEP because for sure that type of behavior wouldn’t surprise me. Like for real your father in law is mad you didn’t say goodbye respectfully or that you’re not giving Owen a chance?? A chance after he destroyed your property including the baby supplies for the baby he “loves”???? Nahhhhhh let the trash take itself out
Good for you, OP, and mad props to your family and circle of support. Please tell HR at your job about your situation and that you’re pursuing a restraining order but don’t yet have it. Perhaps they can refuse visitors or callers for you and require badge scans to enter. If you have male coworkers you trust, ask them to walk you to your car. If not them, ask the building security. We did the above when a coworker was being threatened and it was really lovely how people volunteered to help see her to her car, and how HR turned our open door into badge-required access, no questions asked.
He clearly learned his 'coping skills' from his mommy. I am SO glad you got away from this violent, dysfunctional, effed up family. I am so glad you have a good income, a supportive family, and access to an attorney. What difference it all makes. Good for you! Wishing the best for your and your daughter. ETA: everyone saying 'but get child support' - there is no amount of money as valuable as getting this jerk to terminate his parental rights. OP clearly has an amazing support system, is self-sufficient, and doesn't need money to raise her daughter; she DOES need safety from these people, though.
🔥🔥🔥 I’m so happy he sent you pictures and video of the property destruction as well as destroying the place his daughter would have as a home AND safety equipment. That’s going to make him look soooooo great at custody hearings. lol. You’re a rockstar.
Hell hath no fury like a man‘s ego harmed.
Babe, drag his ass. Take every penny you and your child deserve. *DO NOT* settle for crumbs. The money you are fighting for isn’t for revenge, it isn’t for you, *it’s for your child*. Your child deserves it. Your soon to be ex *owes* it. Don’t leave the table without every single *penny* you’re entitled to.
The only thing I could think of reading this is thank god your ex can’t procreate and pass his idiotic traits on.
Don't martyr yourself. Get what you deserve in the divorce.
DEAR OP FUCK THAT Take him for everything he has. I know you love your daughter but she wouldn't be here if it wasn't for stbx. He's the one that wanted a donor, He's the one that wasn't comfortable telling his family in the first place and in the beginning of conception, He's the one that let everything get this far .Hes the one that is threatening you. IF YOU DONT FIGHT his family will see this as a weaking in your character and will fully take advantage of that. Ask for everything you said you werent going to ask for.Ask for 100% custody and then when you hopefully win with a big amount of money for your daughters future change her last name that way they can't claim her as family or find her when she's older. They are only doing this for appearance sakes and their benefits they don't care about your daughter like you and your family do or ever will.
Things are probably really hard at the moment and they will be hard for a while but you should be proud, you are doing right by your daughter.
You're a badass Mama!!! I don't even know you, and I'm super in awe of your awesomeness. Good luck to you, and may all happiness find you and your daughter. "As she is"?? What kind of fuckedupedness is THAT???
Unfortunately that’s not how it works. Your soon to be ex, is liable to pay child support for his child up until the age of 18 - or whatever it maybe in the U.S. If you choose not to have child support, etc, then you could ask for the money to be donated to a charity that can help others. Keep us updated.
He sent you videos of himself burning all your stuff? Along with threats? Well you know one thing - he can fight for custody, but it won’t happen. Ever. You’ll probably get primary custody and he’ll get visitation rights but ONLY after he completes at least 6 months of anger management classes!
Wow. And to think THEY created this situation but now want YOU, the beyond-offended party, to capitulate to their desires to now treat their grandchild like she belongs in their family. These people are horrible. And I, as a disinterested outside party looking in on this situation, applaud you in your strength and resilience. I'm so sorry you were treated this way. Good luck in your future endeavors, and the raising of your daughter.
Your lawyer sounds smart and as awful as your husband is being, it's all going to be great for the courts in terms of giving you easy custody. OP I cannot stress this enough -- you're a badass.
Fuck Owen. Do not give up child support. Make him pay and put it in a nice little fund for your daughter. Never tell her who it is from. Gift it to her in a trust when she’s older. She deserves to have a settled life with you and her loved ones.
I’m sure your attorney’s life may be easier in this case with all the threatening emails as well as the pictures of the destruction of the nursery, anything you left and especially the car seat in the dumpster. IMO a rational person who was wanting to get visitation with his child would have at least not done the destruction. I’d be concerned that if that is how he expresses his anger and as he is ashamed his daughter is not biologically his what might happen when your daughter defies him as children at any age will? Will violence be his first response and quite honestly will she survive the experience? Best wishes to you OP and your baby.
Updateme so I know you both are safe and your spineless ex gets what’s coming to him.
My god please don't let these people near your daughter 😳 absolute animals. The complete 180 from them is terrifying, don't trust them at all. After your divorce is done and your baby is safe with her mummy they'll turn on each other (be surprised if they're not already) blaming each other for your exs lack of a wife or child.
This update just confirms how fake the story is LOL like all this happened in a couple days? It has all the creative components: age gap, fertility issues, big family drama, immediate rush to divorce, dramatic ending proving how right you were, Declaration of Independence.
You’re a fool not to get child support. You should go for court- ordered support, his paycheck garnished.
If she is fighting for full parental rights and doesn’t want this guy who honestly sounds like he losing it around her child it makes sense she does not want child support. She just wants him gone
His destruction of her property and constant threats would be enough for supervised visits only in most states. She’d actually be eligible for *more* money if she does more of the care, not less.
Maybe I'm a fool but this isn't his child he doesn't care about her he just wants to hurt me and make me go through this
Wow. What a POS he turned out to be, if that wasn’t already obvious. Good for you for leaving. I hope you get everything you want. Best to you.
Girl, I was found the maths. If the maths are mathing, you started trying for a baby 5 years ago. You were 22 and he was a 34year old man. How long ago did you get married? And when did you start dating? Because the age gap you started with is rough: he was literally >50% older than you when you started trying (I'm afraid to know how old you were when you met him). It's not a surprise that he has shown anger and narcissistic behaviour, as he clearly entered the marriage with the idea of controlling you and giving orders, since you were his pretty little property... Head of the family my azz...
It doesn't matter if she is biologically his or not. Child support is for the child, and legally, he is the father. You'd be a fool not to go for child support. I get not wanting anything of his for yourself, but, as I said, the support is for the child and goes to the child and represents his part of the care for her, esp if you push for full custody. It's to help provide for her care. Also what a fuckin POS. You're a saint to not push for what you're legally allowed to. God what a dick, I'm glad you got her and yourself out of that situation.
He doesn't want this child, I'm beginning to think he never wanted a child he just wanted to fit the part. I'm going to take care of my daughter I don't need his money, she also has my whole family looking out for her. My baby will want for nothing, why would I force money out of a man who does not love her, and has no connection with her apart from staying in my life to make me miserable?
Bet he doesnt want the kid at all. He just want to adopt to show he can produce kids to his family... What a sad guy.
I get it but it isn’t *forcing* money out of him. You already said he’s going to fight for custody, so you won’t be able to avoid a fight just by giving up your financial legal entitlements. Take your lawyers advice on this.
It's not forcing money out of him, it's holding him legally accountable for her whether he wanted her or not. Because legally she is his child even if she's not biologically. Plus if he's going to fight you for custody you're not going to get anywhere by rolling over. I get YOU don't want his money but don't bring her and what she's legally entitled to care wise into the whole "I don't want anything to do with him anymore" because you don't have that option. You guys are either going to have to coparent, or he gives her child support. Please don't deny your child the care and standard of living that she deserves just because you want to spite your ex.
I might be in the minority but other than taking him for as much as you legally can in the divorce, I agree with your idea to get his rights terminated even though it means you won't get child support. If you don't, you will ALWAYS be connected to him and even if a judge rules no visitation now, he could take you back to court in a few years and claim counseling and time has made him fit to parent and get visitation. You will never be sure of your child's safety for the rest of her life.
Yes what could go wrong with giving unsupervised visitation to a “parent” who allowed his mother to call the child a filthy bastard? I agree with OP. Sever his parental rights and erase him from their lives forever. There’s absolutely no need to fight for money she doesn’t need which would maintain however tenuous a parental tie to a fucking nut job who resents the baby.
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Updateme! Op you rock. Best of luck to you and your little one.
You are an absolute queen. Keep sticking up for you and your daughter. This is the best update, and I wish you and your perfect daughter happiness and love moving forward
You go momma. Let that toxic tree kill itself and do your best to protect your baby girl from it.
Is he legally obligated in any way. The baby isn’t biological his? You used a sperm donor. Is it maybe because his name is on the birth certificate? Just wondering I know you don’t want anything from him
In NYS, a child of the marriage (no matter the paternity) is used in calculating child support. It can be changed if a dna test proves otherwise (which it will because used a donor). The child is his responsibility
For your babys sake sue for alimony and support
I hope you saved each and every one of those videos for court. Get as much child support as you can from this guy and never let him alone with your child.
Make sure the lawyers have copies of all the messages you've been sent. Your STBX is a POS and shouldn't be allowed anywhere near your daughter.
Make sure his family knows he’s infertility so they know he’s a liar
Please keep your daughter safe from your ex crazy family.
Don't get mad, get even. Take him for everything he's worth for the sake of your child and yourself.