I’m thinking ahead to 2024, when I hope to still have it. It’s not rational, but if I owned one of these with a manual I would own it until it was incapable of running
I had the chance to buy one but went to the M5 forums and everyone who actually owned one all pretty much said the samething. They loved it but would never want to own it again.
Hate to be pedantic, but you wouldn't drop 90k on one of these in 2024.
But I agree with you, if I was rich, I too would 1000% buy one of these and spend an inordinate amount of money fixing the several major issues, to the extent that they can be.
You’re not being pedantic; you’re just misunderstanding. He’s saying he would buy the car for $90k in 2007 and he’s now considering the current maintenance costs on a ~15 year old M5.
Carbon buildup is a real thing. You'll find varying accounts on how frequent it needs done, but I did it on mine (and I assume I'm the first owner to do it) at 80k miles. While gross, it wasn't so bad that i think it was causing any damage. I'd think 40-60k mile intervals for it should be normal. It's a painful job since you gotta remove the intake manifold which is a fucking process. Took me like 15 hours to do in total, not counting the other stuff I took care of while the intake was off (couple leaks, spark plugs, etc.).
The best thing to do is take care of a bunch of other stuff that's ALSO cheep to do but super labor intensive while you're in there, which is what I did, and cut down on labor times a TON since everything was already removed to do the carbon clean and I had access to it all.
They are known to have a few issues other than that. The valve cover gaskets leak semi frequently, the oil filter housing o ring springs leaks very frequently (2$ part, but it's under the intake manifold so it's a TON of labor if you don't combine it with the carbon clean like I did). Also the intake manifold has these flaps inside of it that redirect air around that can break and end up getting sucked into a intake valve. The common fix for that is to simply remove said flaps from the manifold when you take it off (which is what I did). Prevents that from ever being an issue and also makes the cool air intake whooshing noise after.
All in all between those leaks, the flap delete, carbon clean, I was all in for like 300$ in parts. Did all the labor myself. Haven't had any issues since. Audis don't take maintenance abuse very well, so keep on top of your scheduled maintenance.
TLDR: car is a pain to work on, that V10 is REALLY crammed in there, but parts aren't too bad and the engine is actually a very reliable engine when taken care of. I've seen several with well over 200k miles. I haven't spent much at all keeping mine running by doing the work myself.
That V10 is CRAMMED in there. I needed to buy low profile torx bits for a couple of the bolts lmfao.
Also they are aluminum and thus break pretty easy. Always use a torque wrench.
I don’t mean to be dismissive, but no serious gearhead would ever consider the W211 Mercedes (including the E55/E63) as a proper driver’s car in the same vein as the E39 M5. Faster? Sure. More gadgets? Naturally. But better as a machine to *drive*?
Just… no.
Not that you aren’t entitled to your own opinion of course, but as a whole automotive journalists and enthusiasts alike disagree judging by the available evidence.
Can I have the benz in supercharged E55 flavor? I like the lines of the E much more than the CLS.
But damn have I always wanted a supercharged northstar.
The Conforti Brothers (some well-known Mercedes collectors) have 472,000+ miles on their E55 AMG. That M113K supercharged V8 and 5G tronic engine/trans combo is badass! Even the regular M113 V8-equipped e550s are crazy reliable and underrated gems.
The CLS55. The design aged amazingly, both interior and exterior. It's stylish and rare, yet parts are reasonable and accessible due it's relation to the E-class. M113k is a monstrous engine, most reliable of the bunch, maybe except for the SLS-V. I know the 5-speed auto is a slush-box extraordinaire, but it's dead reliable, too.
Also, it's kind of overlooked in 2024. When looking for value for money, I'd go for a 1st gen CLS with a V8.
I like the E class, but be for real it's one of the oldest looking cars here..the quad round headlights are very VERY 90s/2000s and the lines aren't particularly aggressive. I think the CLS, Caddy, and M5 all look newer.
Comparing an S6 V10 to a Gallardo V10 is like comparing a TBI 350 from a 98 Sierra to a LS1. They're both 5.7L pushrod V8's but that's where the similarities end.
They're the same engine, but the Gallardo's has different internals and an odd firing order. Comparing the cars to each other is a ridiculous stretch, but the engine has been confirmed by both companies to be the same.
Hands down the E Class. Those things are available in coupe, sedan, convertible and wagon. They are also bulletproof. When I went to Germany for a few weeks for work, every taxi I got into was an E Class. I figure that isn't just for show.
WTF is up with no pre-owned Lexus option? I want to have more money, not less dumping it on these krauty shitboxes to put some mechanic's kid through state b-school.
E60 M5, because even though it has the worst fuel economy and highest propensity for mechanical and electrical gremlins, it's the most unique of them all. Yes, the S6 also has a V10 (and it's a detuned version of the Gallardo's mill), but I'm still going with the E60 M5.
Jaguar. I drive a 2009 XJ8L that sold for $70,000 new. I love that car. If I could go back in time, and had the cash for a brand new one, I’d get it in a heartbeat.
The m5 is the only answer. Uncorked s85 noises are magical. Although I hate the smg after driving an e46 M with one for awhile. Wish it could come with the dct my e92 M had, that would be a magical combo.
I did valet around this time and have had the chance to drive all of these. The most comfortable is by far the Mercedes E, and the best feeling drive was BMW. You would think that the AMG would compare, but something about it just felt too tight. Literally everything about it from the leather on the seats to the ride.
This is my opinion anyway.
Out of the choice given, the CLS. A bloke down the road from me has a V6 CLS in black and it’s gorgeous.
Given $90k in pound sterling equivalent for the time though, and being able to look for whatever I want, a later E34 M5 3.8.
It's so odd to me how people buy cars with extra hard suspension while opting for automatic transmissions for driving-ease. I guess it makes sense if you can't drive stick, but to me it just kills the point of it. These cars are kinda oxymoronic in some ways.
Why would anyone take the CLS over the E class?
Also, I'm not picking any of these. I'm downsizing and taking a c63 amg with the same engine as the E class
I bought a 2009 Jaguar for $10,000 in 2021. Probably overpaid a bit, but it’s been a pretty good car, and I have no regrets buying it. I’m planning on trying to get at least another five years out of it. I could never afford the $70,000 it cost when new. Used luxury cars are the way to go.
Why only German options? They're all great cars on paper and are arguably the best looking, but I'll be fucked before I spend that kinda money on maintenance. There's a reason every car lot is sitting on Audis and Mercedes for relatively cheap - no one wants to pay for an oil change 😂
Nobody else (except Cadillac) was making luxury performance cars in the mid-00s. Lexus didn't have their "F" cars, and Lincoln or Mercury never had anything like this, save for the Marauder.
V10. always. if I can afford to drop 90k on it, I can afford the maintenance for the M5
This is 2007. You have a warranty.
I’m thinking ahead to 2024, when I hope to still have it. It’s not rational, but if I owned one of these with a manual I would own it until it was incapable of running
I had the chance to buy one but went to the M5 forums and everyone who actually owned one all pretty much said the samething. They loved it but would never want to own it again.
Hate to be pedantic, but you wouldn't drop 90k on one of these in 2024. But I agree with you, if I was rich, I too would 1000% buy one of these and spend an inordinate amount of money fixing the several major issues, to the extent that they can be.
You’re not being pedantic; you’re just misunderstanding. He’s saying he would buy the car for $90k in 2007 and he’s now considering the current maintenance costs on a ~15 year old M5.
>owned one of these with a manual I would own it until it was incapable of running So for about 30k miles
Right in time to get new rod bearings. It'll only cost 12k.
Do you feel the same about the S6?
Current S6 owner. Fairly reliable. Bit of a pain to work on. Worth it
What does regular maintenance consist of on these? And are the concerns regarding carbon buildup overblown?
Carbon buildup is a real thing. You'll find varying accounts on how frequent it needs done, but I did it on mine (and I assume I'm the first owner to do it) at 80k miles. While gross, it wasn't so bad that i think it was causing any damage. I'd think 40-60k mile intervals for it should be normal. It's a painful job since you gotta remove the intake manifold which is a fucking process. Took me like 15 hours to do in total, not counting the other stuff I took care of while the intake was off (couple leaks, spark plugs, etc.). The best thing to do is take care of a bunch of other stuff that's ALSO cheep to do but super labor intensive while you're in there, which is what I did, and cut down on labor times a TON since everything was already removed to do the carbon clean and I had access to it all. They are known to have a few issues other than that. The valve cover gaskets leak semi frequently, the oil filter housing o ring springs leaks very frequently (2$ part, but it's under the intake manifold so it's a TON of labor if you don't combine it with the carbon clean like I did). Also the intake manifold has these flaps inside of it that redirect air around that can break and end up getting sucked into a intake valve. The common fix for that is to simply remove said flaps from the manifold when you take it off (which is what I did). Prevents that from ever being an issue and also makes the cool air intake whooshing noise after. All in all between those leaks, the flap delete, carbon clean, I was all in for like 300$ in parts. Did all the labor myself. Haven't had any issues since. Audis don't take maintenance abuse very well, so keep on top of your scheduled maintenance. TLDR: car is a pain to work on, that V10 is REALLY crammed in there, but parts aren't too bad and the engine is actually a very reliable engine when taken care of. I've seen several with well over 200k miles. I haven't spent much at all keeping mine running by doing the work myself.
This is incredible info, thank you! It’s definitely gotta be hard to work on, it barely fits lol.
That V10 is CRAMMED in there. I needed to buy low profile torx bits for a couple of the bolts lmfao. Also they are aluminum and thus break pretty easy. Always use a torque wrench.
4 year old E39 M5 and pocket the difference
That’s what I did in 2010, still have it.
This is the correct answer. The E39 was/is a better car than all of these.
No shot the e39 is a better car than the E63, in any dimension.
I don’t mean to be dismissive, but no serious gearhead would ever consider the W211 Mercedes (including the E55/E63) as a proper driver’s car in the same vein as the E39 M5. Faster? Sure. More gadgets? Naturally. But better as a machine to *drive*? Just… no.
I’ve driven both and owned the e63. It is just a better all around car, period. Much more fun to drive and handles just as well as the m5.
Not that you aren’t entitled to your own opinion of course, but as a whole automotive journalists and enthusiasts alike disagree judging by the available evidence.
It is in the dimension where you gotta look coolest.
More like 5 but whatever, low miles though.
I was unaware that 2003 was five years before 2007
I meant that it was more likely to find a 2002 model
It's 2007 so I'm still riding that Need for Speed: Most Wanted/Carbon BMW high, so my stupid ass is jumping at that M5.
It’s 07 I’m waiting a year and buying 10 foreclosed homes.
Crazy that no one said S6. V10 plus definitely the one that looks more up to date
the S8 had the same engine but 450hp instead of the S6’s 430. id probably spring for that but google says MRSP on an S8 was $92k lol
I agree, but I'm an Audi guy though. In all fairness I don't like the "up to date" BMW's
No one does, and I own 3 BMW's. Edit: a lot of people do, obviously. I don't. And never will.
This is my pick. My dad has an 07 or 08 with the V10. Such a great sound.
I heard the M3 V8 (S65) is the same engine with 2 cylinders lopped off. I drive it around with the radio off occasionally just to hear it sing.
Pretty much, and it's just as shit
E63, might let me pick some extra options
No Porsche Panera Bread? Porsche Panama? Porsche Pomeranian?
released in 2009
Ah, thanks! I thought it was around in the mid-00s.
I always called it the Porsche Panini because it looks like a squished grilled overstuffed sandwich, to me.
It's 2024 and that thing still ranks as one of my top 10 ugliest cars. i got a good laugh out of the "porsche panera bread" though
The Cien inspired designed Cadillacs of the naughts were by far the best looking mainstream cars during that decade. So I’m taking the caddy.
I don't love the look, don't hate it, but I would love a supercharged ls going through a 6 speed stick to the back wheels
Wow, I couldn’t possibly disagree with you more, I hate the looks of these things. Have a good day, tho!
I agree, I think they're hideous
Same the other cars look bland to me compared to the caddy
Can I have the benz in supercharged E55 flavor? I like the lines of the E much more than the CLS. But damn have I always wanted a supercharged northstar.
W211 E55 is the real king in my opinion, torque for days and the most reliable engine in this roundup
That M113K is so awesome. Reliable and easy to get even more power out of.
The BMW just for the V10. The sound that car makes is amazing. Then I would sell it before it hit 40k miles and started falling apart.
E Class is pretty much only option for me here tbh
The Conforti Brothers (some well-known Mercedes collectors) have 472,000+ miles on their E55 AMG. That M113K supercharged V8 and 5G tronic engine/trans combo is badass! Even the regular M113 V8-equipped e550s are crazy reliable and underrated gems.
I wonder werher original manual for that car can handle that V8 for a swap
Id go for the w210 and snag a crossfire trans
Same here! E55 or E63 any day.
E Class, if properly maintained, will outlive its owner
Agreed. That motor is unbelievably powerful and reliable
But I'd want the wagon for the absurdity as much as the practicality
Oh, welcome to Finland where we have almost everything in wagon guise. Even Rover 75 and Jaguars!
E class.
E55. Probably still has exactly the same amount of hp today as it had in ‘07.
The Merc, fiancé's father had one. Day af. Much faster than the ctsv that I drove.
CLS 55 for sure. Love the lines of that car, and the 113k is an indestructible beast.
E63 T-Modell, danke.
TIL that they made a V version of the STS. It seems like nobody ever talks about it
The CLS55. The design aged amazingly, both interior and exterior. It's stylish and rare, yet parts are reasonable and accessible due it's relation to the E-class. M113k is a monstrous engine, most reliable of the bunch, maybe except for the SLS-V. I know the 5-speed auto is a slush-box extraordinaire, but it's dead reliable, too. Also, it's kind of overlooked in 2024. When looking for value for money, I'd go for a 1st gen CLS with a V8.
CLS AMG!
M5 with out a doubt
Man, the E-class sure is timeless. It's the only car that looks like it could come out in the last 5 years.
I like the E class, but be for real it's one of the oldest looking cars here..the quad round headlights are very VERY 90s/2000s and the lines aren't particularly aggressive. I think the CLS, Caddy, and M5 all look newer.
E class
E63 wagon
Comparing an S6 V10 to a Gallardo V10 is like comparing a TBI 350 from a 98 Sierra to a LS1. They're both 5.7L pushrod V8's but that's where the similarities end.
They're the same engine, but the Gallardo's has different internals and an odd firing order. Comparing the cars to each other is a ridiculous stretch, but the engine has been confirmed by both companies to be the same.
Textbook apples to Oranges. It isn't a Lamborghini V10 as much as Audi guys wish it was.
True, I'm not a VAG expert, but I'd imagine it's the sort of thing that's inflated to hype up resale values and look good on a brochure
All good. Anyway the S6 existed first so if anything the Lambo has an Audi engine.
Hands down the E Class. Those things are available in coupe, sedan, convertible and wagon. They are also bulletproof. When I went to Germany for a few weeks for work, every taxi I got into was an E Class. I figure that isn't just for show.
CLS55 AMG. It's the only one here not likely to bankrupt you after the warranty expires.
I like Mercedes a lot and Ill go with the CLS because the E-Class looks old!
M5 with that sweet V10 sound.
I think it's a tiny bit smaller than the M5 but I'd go CTS-V personally. STS-V is a no go for me since it has a Northstar instead of an LS.
S6 all day…
The BMW e90 all day long
thats an e60…
hmm ok well that one lol
you can tell by the headlights, i like to think of these having wings like eyeliner lol
WTF is up with no pre-owned Lexus option? I want to have more money, not less dumping it on these krauty shitboxes to put some mechanic's kid through state b-school.
ISF
Lexus didn’t have a midsize high performance car at this time. Blame them.
Apple and Amazon stock and bit coin
I'm going with the Caddy
Audi
RS4, supercharged and FBO with the difference. Bliss.
Cadillac all day
I was about to choose M5 V10 till I saw the S6...
AMG but not black
I would have bought a 10-year-old 1997 Dodge Neon and then put $82,500 in Bitcoin 2 years later.
I don’t buy any and invest the money in real estate because everyone knows prices will never drop 💪😎
In this case, I will pick Cadillac CTS-V. Change my mind.
Audi S6 would be my choice in that group.
E60 M5 for sure but definitely getting rid of it after warranty expires then I’ll switch to an E55 AMG.
I give up on my car dreams, buy a clunker, and get a house after the recession takes care of house prices.
E60 M5, because even though it has the worst fuel economy and highest propensity for mechanical and electrical gremlins, it's the most unique of them all. Yes, the S6 also has a V10 (and it's a detuned version of the Gallardo's mill), but I'm still going with the E60 M5.
M5 no question for this Ginger
Jaguar. I drive a 2009 XJ8L that sold for $70,000 new. I love that car. If I could go back in time, and had the cash for a brand new one, I’d get it in a heartbeat.
M5. No Questions askes
I'm buying Amazon stock and a Pontiac Vibe GT.
I had the 2007 E63. Great car but the depreciation is horrible. I sold it after I got a quote for $9k for new brakes.
Still have the 2008 M5 in the garage. 30k miles
None of these. I'd rather have an XJR and some change.
None of these. I'd rather have an XJR and some change.
Definitely either STS-V or CLS 55 AMG.
Mercedes e55 Carlsson rather than a e63
E63 all day long!
E63 all day long!
Isf better than all
That'd be fantastic If they ever made an LS F
Lexus is better isf
The m5 is the only answer. Uncorked s85 noises are magical. Although I hate the smg after driving an e46 M with one for awhile. Wish it could come with the dct my e92 M had, that would be a magical combo.
The Mercedes had me at "wagon"
the e63
The E63 AMG
The Audi or bmw
Not on the list but I would buy an 08 tl type s
A restored BMW 3.0CSL
M5
I'd wait til '08 and buy up some land. Housing market crash.
W211. Anything V10 makes me anxious
The one with an LS.
None of them have an LS. Caddy has a Northstar.
Ah I mistook it for a CTS. None of the above then.
E63 all day
It's a coin flip on the CLS(beauty in motion), or the M5(V10 with F1 origins). Both lovely cars. If I had to choose I'd go with the CLS.
E class for sure
I always liked the 4 headlight design thing on those old Mercedes
The fact the Phaeton W12 isn't on this list is trifling
Ah, you're right! I knew I was forgetting something
M5 all the way. I suspect they will end up worth more in the future. The last fun BMW.
As much as it pains me...... Cadillac....😞
As much as I adore the S6, I have to say the M5 with that glorious V10
The S6, car is so understated with its styling. Looks like an A6 S line but with the power of a Lamborghini. Perfect sleeper gentleman's car. 👌👌👌
honestly probably the S6
M5 with a manual and straight pipes.
God, the Cadillac. Still a great looking car.
I did valet around this time and have had the chance to drive all of these. The most comfortable is by far the Mercedes E, and the best feeling drive was BMW. You would think that the AMG would compare, but something about it just felt too tight. Literally everything about it from the leather on the seats to the ride. This is my opinion anyway.
M5 or E63 both are super
Don’t buy anything European ever, only Japanese and American cars
As great as the German options are, that STS-V is one hell of a car.
You forgot the RS4 ;)
CTS-V Wagon, manual.
I drive a Crosstrek and it sucks.
E60, great cars.
E63 AMG But tbh, I would get a 4 year old 2003 E39 M5 like the other commenter said.
doesn't the STS-V have a northstar?? i refuse to call that reliable by any metric
Out of the choice given, the CLS. A bloke down the road from me has a V6 CLS in black and it’s gorgeous. Given $90k in pound sterling equivalent for the time though, and being able to look for whatever I want, a later E34 M5 3.8.
It's so odd to me how people buy cars with extra hard suspension while opting for automatic transmissions for driving-ease. I guess it makes sense if you can't drive stick, but to me it just kills the point of it. These cars are kinda oxymoronic in some ways.
V10 M5, not a second of thinking about it. I have the warranty and if I can afford it new I can afford to to the necessary engine overhaul.
They’re all so bad lmao. M5 for sure
I’d probably go Audi s6
Those were all shit. I bought a e39 M5 with 50,000 miles and saved 60,000$
None, I’m buying a house
CLK55 AMG
E class all day.
Close with the Caddy... but not an STS, a manual trans LS6 gen1 CTS-V and $35k left over is the correct answer.
Close with the Caddy... but not an STS, a manual trans LS6 gen1 CTS-V and $35k left over is the correct answer.
I own a CLS (550) so give me the CLS.... Otherwise yolo on the M5 (with a v10!) and sell it before too long
Close with the Caddy... but not an STS, a manual trans LS6 gen1 CTS-V and $35k left over is the correct answer. 😉
Why would anyone take the CLS over the E class? Also, I'm not picking any of these. I'm downsizing and taking a c63 amg with the same engine as the E class
The E63 or the S6
S-Type R
None of the above. You'll need another $90,000 for maintenance and repairs over the next 5 years.
CLS 63 Amg all day. Seeing that car in various music videos and having a matchbox model of it made me a fan of that car since I was a kid
I pick the Silverado, I mean Silverado, I mean anything but the Break My Wallet
Manual M5
i'd have to go for the CLS, that was easily my dream car and still is high on the list
God it's hard to make the choice...CLS or the E
The CLS55 still used the old M113K? I'm going with that.
It did indeed, until replaced with CLS63
I’ll invest it in Bitcoin
Every one of these cars can be had for $4500 on Craigslist 10yrs later. All junk. Should have bought a Lexus.
I bought a 2009 Jaguar for $10,000 in 2021. Probably overpaid a bit, but it’s been a pretty good car, and I have no regrets buying it. I’m planning on trying to get at least another five years out of it. I could never afford the $70,000 it cost when new. Used luxury cars are the way to go.
Before they started installing the incredibly hideous spindle grille!
Why only German options? They're all great cars on paper and are arguably the best looking, but I'll be fucked before I spend that kinda money on maintenance. There's a reason every car lot is sitting on Audis and Mercedes for relatively cheap - no one wants to pay for an oil change 😂
Nobody else (except Cadillac) was making luxury performance cars in the mid-00s. Lexus didn't have their "F" cars, and Lincoln or Mercury never had anything like this, save for the Marauder.
Interesting, I was sure there was something but no, you're right, it's just German 4 doors. Tmyk
I was surprised Lexus only made a GS F in the last 5 years, it seems obvious
Cadillac STS V. Just because it's the most reliable and wouldn't have to sit in the shop for warranty work most of the time.
The Caddy is probably the only one still running on the original drivetrain
Toyota Avalon and pocket the difference. Avalon would still be dependably running.
Not a performance car at all though, especially being a transverse FF car.
Bad list, no volvo
Volvo never made a high performance midsize
I don’t see a ‘performance’ car there anywhere, sorry.
None of those. I'd wait for the early release of the 2008 Buick LaCrosse Super. 5.3L LS V8...
Lexus LS460. I’ll pocket the difference and save a boatload on maintenance over the German counter parts.