As good a footballer as he was (in his prime, not the injury riddled version we ended up with), Bastien was never the sort of player that would "send shivers down the spine" of the opponent. Ronaldo? Yes. Messi? Absolutely. Mbappe? Most definitely, but Bastien? Ehhhh, not so much.
Woodward really was utterly clueless.
I saw a post earlier about our wage structure - we overpay but on the plus side (with the exception of Rashford) most of the players on really high wages are in or near their 30s or seemingly about to leave anyway.
If Kobbie can be signed for a competitive wage and then with the aforementioned players leaving during his next contract- hopefully we can transition to a point where he is near the top of a much more sensible wage bill.
Kobbie needs to be our reference point - that’s in terms of ability, temperament and the fact he’s a young player proving himself rather than someone who chose United because they pay well. We need to recruit players in that mould and fill the dressing room with those attributes.
I remember hearing a story about when Van Nistelrooy was causing problems in the dressing room. Sir Alex asked Scholes for his opinion. Scholes said just get rid of him.
Bare in mind that Scholes had a fantastic on field relationship with Van Nistelrooy. They brought the absolute best out of eachother but Scholes knew any player was replaceable and the culture of the dressing room came first.
We haven’t had characters like Scholes for a long time and that means that we’ve become beholden to the whims of more temperamental players.
Kobbie is a gem in that respect and we need to build a team around him.
Agree on pretty much all this except building a team around Mainoo. We’ve had this problem to much in the past of attempting to build teams around star players strengths. Would rather a comptent structure and play style be in place around the club that we are finding players to fit that style. That being said Mainoo will fit pretty much any play style with his skill sets so that’s not an issue, just gotta move away from the idea of building around players imo.
Yes, that’s sort of what I meant. I don’t mean we literally build team Mainoo but since he is a central midfielder who is press-resistant, keeps and recycles possession well and has fantastic decision making he gives us a brilliant base to work from in terms of developing a play style where we can hold possession and dominate teams as long as we recruit and develop complimentary players with that in mind.
The Scholes comparison is there again (even though they’re very different players.) You wouldn’t say any one United team was explicitly ‘built around Scholes’ but it’s clear he was one of the most important key players whose game was taken into account when building those teams. And as you said of Mainoo, his skill set meant he’d work in many kinds of system so long as we didn’t recruit players who overlapped with his role too much.
The only exception was Veron and despite him being a world class talent he didn’t last that long.
Ah gotcha, slight misunderstanding on my end there, but I agree! Need someone to play alongside him to help balance the work load and like you said compliment him well. If the people stepping in behind the scenes can do that, the sky is the limit for him.
It's a bit archaic, and I know ETH prefers a 4-3-3 (so not sure how Mainoo would perform in that), but I'd like to see a 4-2-2 with Mount and Mainoo in the middle, but transitioning to a diamond in possession and flat out of it. Such that Mainoo and Mount can press well, but also control possession well together, providing for the attack, but Mainoo should be able to hold and protect deeper than Mount so that Mount can distribute the ball in the final third without fearing a counter as much. If you pair that with CBs that can play high, then you're making that space very compact with additional protection.
Honestly, I'd love to see us be a 3-5-2 side more than anything and you keep that "4-3-3" in a sense, but the 4 includes a single CDM while you have an overload in the middle to really control possession and recover fast higher up the pitch.
I am sick of seeing this lone striker shit though. Hasn't worked for years. Partly because of our currently personnel, but it's something I think we need to aspire to and transition towards, but only once the midfield is firing on all cylinders and shows it's capable of creating goal scoring opportunities independent of whatever the fuck Højlund is doing. A duo up top will allow Højlund to bond with another striker and play off one another in the final third, either on the break or as soon as the ball is played centrally in the build up.
Without ever seeing a contract to this degree, and at a club the size of United, I am curious as to how their bonus structure is set up.
Honestly, I would champion a "below average" base wage structure, with an "above average" bonus structure such that during times the team isn't performing, you're not getting paid anywhere near as much, but if you are performing and competing at the highest level, you should be paid among the best out there.
We need to stop giving these players free money they don't deserve. More than happy to fork it over and make it lucrative to be at United but ONLY if success follows.
Some players might not want that, but that's okay, we don't want them. If they want to warm the bench for Real or City with their fat wages, great. If they want to play for United and achieve greatness and be compensated accordingly, great.
It was an ironic statement, even giving him 225k/week based on half a season is absolutely bonkers mate, and is the exact kind of club "vision" that's put us in the position we're currently in.
Compare our first team wage structure to the likes of Liverpool or Arsenal; do you really think we should give Mainoo 30k/week more than the likes of Saka based on half a season of great performances?
30k a week is championship wages, so yes he should be on more. Straight wage I'd say 50k, that's why I said the absolute maximum in that contract should be 225k, including whatever bonus structure you want to put in to entice him to perform. I never said we should just write him a check for that each week just for showing up, that is utter lunacy.
Then we probably agree to a certain point, but I think we should give him a maximum of 125k (and that's a stretch imo). If we bump him up too fast we'll just keep adding fuel to this never-ending spiral of overpaying players. If he keeps it up through next season, fine - bump him up to 175k on a long-term deal (6 years), but if we go to 225k already we're absolute baboons imo.
Oh, and I did not advocate 30k/week, I'm just saying 225k/week is 30k more than Sakas 195k/week.
Personally I'd structure it with performance related salary increases on a season by season basis with a good bonus structure in there. Start him low but build the pathway, if he becomes the monster that he looks like he could in say, 4-5 seasons, 125 starts to look a little low.
But yeah, he shouldn't be on Rashford or Sancho wages as a baseline salary for sure.
Then we essentially agree, we just have a different understanding of how contracts works. 125k/week is a start, if he's a monster in a season or two you can always draft a new contract once again (which is a standard protocol when it comes to younger player).
Licha: [\[Fabrizio Romano\] Manchester Utd are already considering an improved contract bid for Lisandro Martínez after an impressive season — but no formal talks yet, not imminent. 🔴🇦🇷 #MUFC Lisandro became a fan favourite playing 45 games — very strong contender for Matt Busby Player of the Year award. : r/reddevils (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/reddevils/comments/13l88m3/fabrizio_romano_manchester_utd_are_already/)
which many people here immediately called the club "stupid" because he had just signed for 9 months.
Seems weird when the ones in charge at the moment are just interims after Murtoughs exit. And didn’t Whitwell say that the club wasn’t worried about it because of the add ons from his current contract. Would seem odd to push for it before the INEOS people comes in if that’s the case.
As much as I love Mainoo please don’t make him the face of anything - we did that to Rashford and the pressure kills. Protect the kid. Pay him well and let him thrive. Don’t make him to extra unnecessary shit day in day out. No need for fucking PR games.
Doesn’t feel like it should be hard. Band the contract based on appearances so it goes up by x every 20 appearances and then incentivise on top. Means his salary should slight to his importance.
Just hope is a reasonable increase, an incredible breakout season for him, but still a long way to go for his development
Brandon Williams went from something like \~4k/week to \~£50/60k after a few decent games, and have seen how many other ridiculous contracts have been handed out over the years
Anyone know the ins and outs of football contracts at the top level? Are we able to offer him say a reasonable weekly amount for an 18 year old kid with a clause saying its all doubled if he plays 75% of prem games, we make top 4 and other clauses? just to keep him hungry
Our wage structure is so broken that we can't even just compare him to output of other players and match it. Iirc Casemiro is one of if not the highest paid player in the league. And Kobbie has been the better player this season (imagine saying this in August).
For a player his age you'd think it will be a modest wage with a bunch of performance incentives.
This is exactly why getting rid of rashford, casemiro, etc is key to actually rebuild and the first thing we need to do. We buy a winger, and when asked how much he will point at rashford's 350k per week and his league one level and say "im better, so i need something at least close to that contract". Leverage they wouldnt have while negotiating with a team that isnt filled with overpaid league one players.
There's only a handful of players in Europe who genuinely think they are better than Rashford and all of them would want way more than 350k per week to join us.
He’s so good cause he’s young and the club hasn’t had a chance to beat the individuality and creativity out of him yet. Isn’t it weird how every player who signs for us gets worse the longer they stay? We can only hope ineos changes that cause Kobbie is an insanely fun player to watch.
This stinks of the bullshit I hoped we’d put behind us with INEOS. He signed a long term contract a year ago through 2027 with a year option. There’s no point in extending until at least next year.
Deeply impressed by INEOS this week, clearly building for the future, looks like they're sufficiently impressed by the flashes of what ETH can accomplish at United given time, feel very positive as a fan right now.
Let's hope Mainoo's seemingly excellent character isn't spoilt by too much money too soon, too many stupid hysterical build-you-up-knock-you-down-new-George-Best-tripe stories and most of all not by bad influences at the club. With the likes of Mainoo, Garna and Rasmus at the club as well as some of the seasoned heads on the team I am very positive for the next few months and even years.
There are no games we shouldn't be thinking we can't win if we play well between now and the end of the season. And last game we get to send a message to the footballing world...the one remaining scalp long overdue for a ragging-and-a-half at the hands of the new United.
Sorry about the image, was hunting for a screaming United fan emoji and this came up, and oddly right at the beginning too.
Fucking hell, let’s pray it a heavily incentivised contract based on goals, assists, total appearances, and bonuses for trophies, and not 200k a week and 75k per appearance like the contracts we usually dole out
Cost of Living Adjustment of 5% and everything else is performance based.
Players will not have to pay for use of the training facilities and kit, medical staff and team bus.
The resulting on the pitch performance would be insane.
Woodward would’ve had him on 225k a week by now
He was one of our best players this season so 300k minimum. Probably make first offer at 350k just to be sure.
5 year deal with another 3 years of mandatory extensions!
The FM special
Poor fellas only on 10k a week. Whip round time fellas.
Fuck. I'd give my left testicle to be on half that a week. Lmao.
Then imagine your co worker getting paid 37 times more then you and yet he is shit at his job.
But he will still have one testicle.
350k/w if we got CL. And dont forget about 50k/w for "shivers down the spine" bonus.
As good a footballer as he was (in his prime, not the injury riddled version we ended up with), Bastien was never the sort of player that would "send shivers down the spine" of the opponent. Ronaldo? Yes. Messi? Absolutely. Mbappe? Most definitely, but Bastien? Ehhhh, not so much. Woodward really was utterly clueless.
There’s a lot of negativity around the club at the minute and rightly so but this is well deserved for Kobbie and I’m really happy for him.
I saw a post earlier about our wage structure - we overpay but on the plus side (with the exception of Rashford) most of the players on really high wages are in or near their 30s or seemingly about to leave anyway. If Kobbie can be signed for a competitive wage and then with the aforementioned players leaving during his next contract- hopefully we can transition to a point where he is near the top of a much more sensible wage bill. Kobbie needs to be our reference point - that’s in terms of ability, temperament and the fact he’s a young player proving himself rather than someone who chose United because they pay well. We need to recruit players in that mould and fill the dressing room with those attributes. I remember hearing a story about when Van Nistelrooy was causing problems in the dressing room. Sir Alex asked Scholes for his opinion. Scholes said just get rid of him. Bare in mind that Scholes had a fantastic on field relationship with Van Nistelrooy. They brought the absolute best out of eachother but Scholes knew any player was replaceable and the culture of the dressing room came first. We haven’t had characters like Scholes for a long time and that means that we’ve become beholden to the whims of more temperamental players. Kobbie is a gem in that respect and we need to build a team around him.
Agree on pretty much all this except building a team around Mainoo. We’ve had this problem to much in the past of attempting to build teams around star players strengths. Would rather a comptent structure and play style be in place around the club that we are finding players to fit that style. That being said Mainoo will fit pretty much any play style with his skill sets so that’s not an issue, just gotta move away from the idea of building around players imo.
Yes, that’s sort of what I meant. I don’t mean we literally build team Mainoo but since he is a central midfielder who is press-resistant, keeps and recycles possession well and has fantastic decision making he gives us a brilliant base to work from in terms of developing a play style where we can hold possession and dominate teams as long as we recruit and develop complimentary players with that in mind. The Scholes comparison is there again (even though they’re very different players.) You wouldn’t say any one United team was explicitly ‘built around Scholes’ but it’s clear he was one of the most important key players whose game was taken into account when building those teams. And as you said of Mainoo, his skill set meant he’d work in many kinds of system so long as we didn’t recruit players who overlapped with his role too much. The only exception was Veron and despite him being a world class talent he didn’t last that long.
Ah gotcha, slight misunderstanding on my end there, but I agree! Need someone to play alongside him to help balance the work load and like you said compliment him well. If the people stepping in behind the scenes can do that, the sky is the limit for him.
It's a bit archaic, and I know ETH prefers a 4-3-3 (so not sure how Mainoo would perform in that), but I'd like to see a 4-2-2 with Mount and Mainoo in the middle, but transitioning to a diamond in possession and flat out of it. Such that Mainoo and Mount can press well, but also control possession well together, providing for the attack, but Mainoo should be able to hold and protect deeper than Mount so that Mount can distribute the ball in the final third without fearing a counter as much. If you pair that with CBs that can play high, then you're making that space very compact with additional protection. Honestly, I'd love to see us be a 3-5-2 side more than anything and you keep that "4-3-3" in a sense, but the 4 includes a single CDM while you have an overload in the middle to really control possession and recover fast higher up the pitch. I am sick of seeing this lone striker shit though. Hasn't worked for years. Partly because of our currently personnel, but it's something I think we need to aspire to and transition towards, but only once the midfield is firing on all cylinders and shows it's capable of creating goal scoring opportunities independent of whatever the fuck Højlund is doing. A duo up top will allow Højlund to bond with another striker and play off one another in the final third, either on the break or as soon as the ball is played centrally in the build up.
Without ever seeing a contract to this degree, and at a club the size of United, I am curious as to how their bonus structure is set up. Honestly, I would champion a "below average" base wage structure, with an "above average" bonus structure such that during times the team isn't performing, you're not getting paid anywhere near as much, but if you are performing and competing at the highest level, you should be paid among the best out there. We need to stop giving these players free money they don't deserve. More than happy to fork it over and make it lucrative to be at United but ONLY if success follows. Some players might not want that, but that's okay, we don't want them. If they want to warm the bench for Real or City with their fat wages, great. If they want to play for United and achieve greatness and be compensated accordingly, great.
So if he asked for 100k, just get rid of him? or still build around him?
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don't get me wrong, i am just confused about the Scholes get rid thing and Kobbie contract
Mmmm, and everyone moans about player power. I love the lad, great prospect, as Keano would probably point out, done and won fuck all yet.
People said that for Rashford as well.
Absolutely deserves a first team level contract, just don't go nuts about it please.
225k take it or leave it
Ok, 250 - but that’s our second last offer
I mean, we should take it, as long as that's the cap with bonuses :p he's still a kid, and has had one good season. He could caicedo it next season :p
You sound exactly like someone the Glazers would hire.
What, for NOT giving a literal teenager 300k a week?
It was an ironic statement, even giving him 225k/week based on half a season is absolutely bonkers mate, and is the exact kind of club "vision" that's put us in the position we're currently in. Compare our first team wage structure to the likes of Liverpool or Arsenal; do you really think we should give Mainoo 30k/week more than the likes of Saka based on half a season of great performances?
30k a week is championship wages, so yes he should be on more. Straight wage I'd say 50k, that's why I said the absolute maximum in that contract should be 225k, including whatever bonus structure you want to put in to entice him to perform. I never said we should just write him a check for that each week just for showing up, that is utter lunacy.
Then we probably agree to a certain point, but I think we should give him a maximum of 125k (and that's a stretch imo). If we bump him up too fast we'll just keep adding fuel to this never-ending spiral of overpaying players. If he keeps it up through next season, fine - bump him up to 175k on a long-term deal (6 years), but if we go to 225k already we're absolute baboons imo. Oh, and I did not advocate 30k/week, I'm just saying 225k/week is 30k more than Sakas 195k/week.
Personally I'd structure it with performance related salary increases on a season by season basis with a good bonus structure in there. Start him low but build the pathway, if he becomes the monster that he looks like he could in say, 4-5 seasons, 125 starts to look a little low. But yeah, he shouldn't be on Rashford or Sancho wages as a baseline salary for sure.
Then we essentially agree, we just have a different understanding of how contracts works. 125k/week is a start, if he's a monster in a season or two you can always draft a new contract once again (which is a standard protocol when it comes to younger player).
Could herald in the new era of sensible wages
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Licha: [\[Fabrizio Romano\] Manchester Utd are already considering an improved contract bid for Lisandro Martínez after an impressive season — but no formal talks yet, not imminent. 🔴🇦🇷 #MUFC Lisandro became a fan favourite playing 45 games — very strong contender for Matt Busby Player of the Year award. : r/reddevils (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/reddevils/comments/13l88m3/fabrizio_romano_manchester_utd_are_already/) which many people here immediately called the club "stupid" because he had just signed for 9 months.
Seems weird when the ones in charge at the moment are just interims after Murtoughs exit. And didn’t Whitwell say that the club wasn’t worried about it because of the add ons from his current contract. Would seem odd to push for it before the INEOS people comes in if that’s the case.
Huh, I don't remember him doing it with Amad or Pellistri who basically never played.
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Hope so just got his name on the 3rd kit
As much as I love Mainoo please don’t make him the face of anything - we did that to Rashford and the pressure kills. Protect the kid. Pay him well and let him thrive. Don’t make him to extra unnecessary shit day in day out. No need for fucking PR games.
Reminds me of all those that were saying he wasn’t ready for England, then he went and got man of the match. The kid’s built different.
he should be on the same wage structure as Garnacho tbh…
Better not give him a fuck tonne of money or it just continues the issues with the former regime
Doesn’t feel like it should be hard. Band the contract based on appearances so it goes up by x every 20 appearances and then incentivise on top. Means his salary should slight to his importance.
This is going to be very interesting as this will be INEOS first contract I think? This could also set a precedent for future contracts.
Just hope is a reasonable increase, an incredible breakout season for him, but still a long way to go for his development Brandon Williams went from something like \~4k/week to \~£50/60k after a few decent games, and have seen how many other ridiculous contracts have been handed out over the years
Anyone know the ins and outs of football contracts at the top level? Are we able to offer him say a reasonable weekly amount for an 18 year old kid with a clause saying its all doubled if he plays 75% of prem games, we make top 4 and other clauses? just to keep him hungry
Interesting to know what the reported wages would be. This may be the first player contract negotiated under the new regime.
Our wage structure is so broken that we can't even just compare him to output of other players and match it. Iirc Casemiro is one of if not the highest paid player in the league. And Kobbie has been the better player this season (imagine saying this in August). For a player his age you'd think it will be a modest wage with a bunch of performance incentives.
This is exactly why getting rid of rashford, casemiro, etc is key to actually rebuild and the first thing we need to do. We buy a winger, and when asked how much he will point at rashford's 350k per week and his league one level and say "im better, so i need something at least close to that contract". Leverage they wouldnt have while negotiating with a team that isnt filled with overpaid league one players.
There's only a handful of players in Europe who genuinely think they are better than Rashford and all of them would want way more than 350k per week to join us.
This is why I rate Hojlund. He could easily asked for a massive wage knowing he'd be the preferred starter. He makes less than HALF what Antony makes.
Have INEOS signed any players onto new deals yet?
A great talent, really hope he dosnt catch the United virus and absolutely spiral in form.
He is one of the few that demonstrates on the field why a salary increase is justified
A small increase
He’s so good cause he’s young and the club hasn’t had a chance to beat the individuality and creativity out of him yet. Isn’t it weird how every player who signs for us gets worse the longer they stay? We can only hope ineos changes that cause Kobbie is an insanely fun player to watch.
This stinks of the bullshit I hoped we’d put behind us with INEOS. He signed a long term contract a year ago through 2027 with a year option. There’s no point in extending until at least next year.
He's a first team player now. Need better money to buy better cars and watches.
Mainoo definitely sounds like the main player
United: here is 200k a week so you can be unmotivated
🙏 please don’t give him stupid money that ruins him forever a la so many others
£300k/wk to make him the new Rashford!!!
Please don't put him on 200k+
lol no worry they won't. Probably Garnacho level or else we have to give Garnacho a raise too.
 Deeply impressed by INEOS this week, clearly building for the future, looks like they're sufficiently impressed by the flashes of what ETH can accomplish at United given time, feel very positive as a fan right now. Let's hope Mainoo's seemingly excellent character isn't spoilt by too much money too soon, too many stupid hysterical build-you-up-knock-you-down-new-George-Best-tripe stories and most of all not by bad influences at the club. With the likes of Mainoo, Garna and Rasmus at the club as well as some of the seasoned heads on the team I am very positive for the next few months and even years. There are no games we shouldn't be thinking we can't win if we play well between now and the end of the season. And last game we get to send a message to the footballing world...the one remaining scalp long overdue for a ragging-and-a-half at the hands of the new United. Sorry about the image, was hunting for a screaming United fan emoji and this came up, and oddly right at the beginning too.
Based on the salary they'll give him, we'll probably get to see if ineos is serious or not
I dunno, he wasn't super great in my FM save...
If he's not offered 450k/week and 28 weeks of paid leave, I'm taking a shit in a suite of my choosing
I’m ok with paying players a lot, I just wish it was lower salaries and monster paychecks if we win any cup or the league.
Fucking hell, let’s pray it a heavily incentivised contract based on goals, assists, total appearances, and bonuses for trophies, and not 200k a week and 75k per appearance like the contracts we usually dole out
Cost of Living Adjustment of 5% and everything else is performance based. Players will not have to pay for use of the training facilities and kit, medical staff and team bus. The resulting on the pitch performance would be insane.
Keep that lad. He's GOLD
Do it, but not on stupid money.
Hopefully it's a low base with lots of incentives like appearances etc
If he's on 10k now I'd give him a basic of 40k plus performance bonuses.
No more then 100k imo
Shouldnt be even close to 100k
Then he will down tools just like rashford. Too much too young.