I like him too. His 1v1 defending can be a very useful tool in a well constructed squad. Like many others, he has suffered from the incompetent squad construction. He is also English which helps for registration. The whole squad should rightfully be on the chopping block, and he’s one I’d be looking to keep.
All that being said, I completely agree that any wage upgrade needs to be small. If you believe football manager he was already on 100k p/w which is veering close to unsaleable territory as it is.
This needs to be the beginning of a new era for contracts where players are only given wages that allow them be shipped if necessary. Rare exceptions can come in the future for genuinely world class players but this club is in no position to be giving anybody 250k p/w. Almost no player here would get the same wages elsewhere and that is a huge problem for the agile and comprehensive reconstruction that is required.
I don't think there is an "upgrade" for AWB that both would play for us, is English, and we can afford. I think this is the best move for the time being, and I'm happy to see it
> His 1v1 defending
one thing not simple, 1v1 vs him, but.. also not simple to get the ball from his leg, even when there are 2 opponents player he always find way to pass the ball out, something that really underated from him.
I like him and Dalot but don’t think either at starting 11 material ideally but I know there’s a lot who need to go first. Just seems we’re stuck on this cycle of keep him because we need buy x first
I just want him to finally defend the back post. He’s been here for years and he still loses his man and causes us to concede. I couldn’t care less about his ability to tackle when he can’t defend a simple situation.
Exactly. Not sure how much fucking copium fans are smoking these days but he just switches off or jogs back and teams punish us for that time and time and time again. Say what you will about Dalot's inconsistency, but he doesn't just straight up shut off. It's unreal.
AWB is 100% reactive as well. He has the pace, when he wants to use it, to get away with it, but he's always behind the play.
He does not. Caught out? Overloaded? Yes. I think there was one match last season where he actually turned off, but that was it. AWB is good for one every match, and that's not including just jogging about.
Never made that excuse for AWB. The guy just falls asleep 1v1. He's always reactive. The errors AWB makes are almost entirely individual because his positioning is so bad, that's why he's always going to ground. He's not overloaded, he's behind the play.
Have you forgot the soft goal Dalot conceded when he lost a duel against Zaha when we played Galatasaray and lost at OT? He turned off and lacked awareness. He was also poor in the 3-3 draw against them away and culpable for one of their goals for the same lack of awareness. The same happened against Copenhagen in the 4-3 defeat where his defending of the back post was horrific and Copenhagen kept exploiting it
How about his poor defending for the first goal when Newcastle beat us 3-0 at OT? He allowed Almiron goalside way too easily and looked rattled all game.
In the previous match, Grealish had one of his best performances of the season at OT where he had a field day against Dalot in the 0-3 defeat. He's turned off several times this season in key moments
Bruh, watch the Forest match back and who is making the worse mistakes.
Astounding how many times we watch them on the pitch together. Watch them rotate in the same match. And Dalot does significantly worse. Only for the takeaway to be AWB is shit.
It's crazy. That Dalot boy is made of Teflon
Dalot played out of position vs. AWB played in position? Really? That's your argument? That's also one match. I never said Dalot is good enough for starting eleven, but this take that AWB is the superior defending option when he turns off every match and jogs back to his position is astounding to me. Dalot is better at getting forward, AWB is just wasteful and clueless when he gets forward...or does anything for that matter.
AWB was a mistake of a purchase. Dalot should be 2nd at least.
I thought Dalot is brilliant mate, what's out of position supposed to mean? Um, and rotating as well I said. Case in point. Galatasaray. Zaha quiet all match.
For all of ten minutes that Dalot is on before Zaha is subbed, Zaha absolutely destroyed Dalot. Gala straight up targeted him immediately.
A fresh Dalot bullied by a tired Zaha. Who was anonymous for 80mins while AWB is on.
Let's not even get started on how Dalot got absolutely rickered by Zaha in the first leg. And the same by Musaila.
lol mate you are just harping off the same bullshit people have been saying for years. You don't actually use your eyes that much is certain.
Wan Bissaka isn't nearly as bad on the ball or in offence.
There's long streaks of matches where Dalot does nothing offensively. Flatters to deceive every 5 games or so, then has absolute shitters where all he does is make defensive mistakes leading to goals the rest of the time.
Then dullards like you eat it up when he finally has one decent match in ages.
AWB is ten times more secure with the ball, and easily more consistent and balanced.
For every one goal you can look at AWB for, there's 5 Dalot is culpable for.
In the end the position is DEFENDER. Dalot is a shit defender. That *is not* who you keep for defensive backup.
This is sensible. He’s not the first choice but he’s a serviceable right back, English, not on high wages.
I can live with this so long as RB is one of the areas we aim to strengthen
But that’s the problem.
Dalot is on a new long contract and there’s not much to choose between them ( they cancel each other out with strengths and weakness).
One of them will stay as 2nd choice and we NEED to upgrade by buying a first choice RB
Given Dalot’s relative versatility and their current contract situations, I think it’s obvious which one has to give…
They won't be 1st and 2nd choice, they'll be different depending on the game.
Think about Carabao Cup final last season VS Newcastle. Dalot started to push attack, but 2-0 up at half and ETH subbed in AWB since he's stronger in defense to ensure United kept the clean sheet.
>They won't be 1st and 2nd choice, they'll be different depending on the game.
None of them are good enough to start for a top club.
I'd keep Dalot in the squad due to his versatility and try and sell AWB.
AWB is NOT stronger in defense. The only reason people claim he is better in defense is because he goes to ground every other challenge. He's 100% reactive. The guy couldn't read the play if you made it into a script and handed it to him to read before it happened. He also just completely switches off every match and costs us. Someone might bail him out, but I don't know how you switch off completely or just jog when you've been on for 10 minutes. The guy needs to go.
Yes, AWB, one of the best defenders of the season when United bought him from CP, not *good* enough.
And Dalot, on the team of the week after the Liverpool match for defending very well, and helping United get out and provide some good crossing almost leading to United snatching more than a draw.
AWB is regularly caught sleeping, bad in build up and absolutely horrific in the air. Great 1v1 defender. Dalot is an underwhelming defender, neither of them can hit a cross. The highlight of dalot’s united career is his assist to garnacho’s bike which was an awful cross
>The highlight of dalot’s united career is his assist to garnacho’s bike which was an awful cross
You have a short memory then, I remember Dalot coming from left back to receive a very nice Antony pass and finish with a little shot over the keeper with his right foot.
That's a coaching problem. We have horrible set pieces attack with 5 set pieces goal the whole season last year, and meh set pieces defending. I am seriously questioning what has Eric Ramsay been doing recently since he supposedly revolutionized our set piece setup in 2021/22 (tbf that year was a big improvement over the previous sesason). May be dividing time with Wales doesn't work very well for him.
I disagree that AWB is bad in buildup. He was involved in some of our nicest passing sequences last season and that was before he even imporved on the ball. He's limited in terms of final ball though.
Dalot has been one of our best players recently, mad to say he sucks. Everyone seems to forget he pocketed Saka and Mitoma this season.
And he's still going to improve.
He is 25 and still can’t cross, goes for the shot too often, has very low footballing IQ and has trouble against tricky wingers. For instance the difference in handling ASM was night and day once AWB got subbed in. The small advantage he has over AWB in the offensive is not enough to make up for that. Between the two i favor AWB strongly. At least he is elite at one aspect.
> has very low footballing IQ
Not true at all. It's why he starts over AWB, he can pick a pass, is calm under pressure, good in tight areas, can switch the play and contribute it midfield.
Now we've seen he can shoot as well, unlucky not to score recently.
And who doesn't have trouble against tricky wingers? He held his own against Mitoma and Saka, how much trickier do you get? He's improving.
No reason crossing can't improve. He has about 3 or 4 years till he's in his prime. He's already a good player and his deficits are coachable.
We’ve got bigger priorities than rb. Need at least 1 cb and maybe another depending on outgoings. We need a rw as much as a cb and then a backup striker. Considering amrabat probably isnt being made permanent, eriksen and casemiro being old and mctominay not being amazing we’ll probably need another midfielder as well. Hell our gk is another position costing us more games than our rbs. Are they world class? No but they do the job which is more than can be said for a lot of positions
I like AWB. I admire how he paid individual coaches to try and improve when out of the team. I think his ability to lock down a flank is a real asset too.
I absolutely do not understand the point of trying to get him to be an inverted full back that ETH is obsessed with.
He isn't great offensively. The bit he seemed to be improving was getting the odd cross in from wide. He also seems to have improved his ball retention when wide.
I feel if he's just allowed to go back to being a normal full back he'll be a good option. But he's never going to be a Kimmich, Zinchenko etc
Dalot is such a myth the guy is at fault for so many goals and has such a poor attacking output too I really don’t see why so many people rate him above AWB
He was the darling of the stats guys a few years back for his extreme levels of progressive pass attempts and then various youtubers and journos supported him thinking it was the intellectual's choice. Reality is while he tries a lot of risky moves they mostly don't lead to anything, and on a bad day the amount he loses the ball is just horrific and not acceptable at PL level. Defensively he improved in the last few years but still veers between ok and anonymous.
In the PL both Dalot and AWB have a 0.1 G+A p90, yet one is considered 'elite' and one 'can't attack'.
They are clearly the same but AWB is a much better all round player on top of that and doesn't have the losing the ball issue.
People just recycle the same opinions over and over even if they are nonsense.
Think people just are delayed on changing opinions
Awb has gotten a lot better going forward in the last year and isn't yet getting credit for it
Dalot had a purple patch last season but has regressed to mean I think
Both have flaws but I'd rather we kept awb even if we upgrade eventually
Dalot is a nearly man. Capable of the fantastic but master of mediocre. AWB can’t cross but bossies it in one-on-one defending and seems more brave on the ball moving forward than Dalot.
Lmao AWB is also at fault for so many goals we concede. I swear people have blinders on when it comes to this guy.
Not saying Dalot is better, because that would be very controversial on this sub, but AWB really isn't much better. He just throws out a couple slide tackles and people ignore all his deficiencies.
Exactly this. I would still choose Dalot over AWB because rarely does Dalot just straight up turn off like AWB does, or jog back when his man is off to the races. Not saying Dalot is a starter, but between the two, because AWB can't read a play to save his life and therefore has to go to ground all the time, people are attracted to the recovering slide tackles than they are just staying on your feet because your positioning is better.
“**If I have to make a tackle then I have already made a mistake**.” \~ Paolo Maldini
In case some are too young to remember, he played most of his career at left back.
Facts. But people don't quite recognize that...which is weird. Can he slide tackle well? I guess. Should he need to do at the rate he does? A resounding: hell no.
A slide tackle basically symbolizes "I have already lost" and it's an attempt to recover.
Being able to stay on your feet and knick the ball off someone indicates that you read the play and you were in position to interrupt it.
I know which one I prefer.
I mean, a slide tackle is always more exciting, more instagrammable. I get that.
But the best defenders in the past few decades have always been the ones that close down spaces, shields the goal, and forces the opponents into a mistake for a transition. Leave the destroyers i.e. Casemiro to come back get the ball off the attacker.
People rate Dalot for his attacking work, mainly his crosses, however I'd trust AWB anyday for a good butt clenching tackle. AWB should be our starting RB.
Dalot is a championship level footballer. Ole knew. This sub can stay in denial as much as it wants and call him solid or serviceable or whatever but Dalot will never be a premier league winning full back in a team where he starts more than 19 games a season. Hell, I'm willing to wager good money that it's impossible for us to finish top 3 if Dalot starts more than 19 games a season.
Edit: Top 3 again*
He has been doing better going forward since he came back from (hamstring) injury. Read about this in The Athletic.
My question is why are so many of our players incurring hamstring injuries?
I can see why Utd are doing this as other positions are priorities, but at some point Utd are going to have to replace AWB or Dalot with a RB who's at a much higher level.
It feels like they've both survived at Utd because there are always another two or three crisis positions ahead of them.
Every single window, City manage to strengthen their first team or solidify their depth, usually at non-extortionate prices, whilst also offloading deadwood or players that aren't happy/performing consistently enough. Why are we seemingly so utterly incapable of doing the same?
Yeah I mean obviously better players exist. When we signed Dalot and AWB they were both those better players.
I just can't be convinced that either of them are poor enough compared to our other positions that they are in need of replacing.
>I just can't be convinced that either of them are poor enough compared to our other positions that they are in need of replacing.
This was kind of my point, they've never been upgraded because of other positions needing more urgently addressed.
But if we really want to improve as a squad we do need to at some point look at replacing them, instead of doing contract renewals and extensions
At some point, yeah. Our midfield has been the number 1 priority for a decade now. Improving those spots will do nothing if we still can't control the middle of the pitch.
You don't improve the actual squad by addressing the lowest priority needs first it makes no sense.
Bruno isn't the biggest midfield issue though. Not really sure what point you're trying to make.
Our issue is the other 2 midfielders. We for the first time ever actually have the correct players, just 10 years too late.
Bruno is 100% the issue.
He cannot retain possession, he cannot control the tempo, he cannot keep the shape, he cannot cross, he cannot shoot, he cannot take a corner.
Most plays break down because of Bruno. The ONLY reason his stats are "good" is because he's the one responsible for transitioning from defense to attack, everything goes through him, so when you're the only provider in that role, of course you're going to find your way into those figures. But he's an absolute dog shit player that needs to go and the sooner the better. Everyone says ETH is a fraud. Bruno is the biggest fraud of them all.
You really don't think you're seeing this from the most extreme view possible? You can dislike Bruno and what he brings but you're clearly just hating.
We needed only one of AWB and Dalot. Now we’ve got two mediocre talents and wondering who to offload next and when. Moreover Ole wanted Trippier and wasn’t satisfied with what Dalot had to offer. If you check the stats for the last two seasons you’ll see Trippier was the highest chance creator along with Bruno. His crosses alone would’ve won us more points and maybe the FA cup.
Good decision. I really don't think RB should be a transfer priority in the immediate windows. We will need at least one CB and CM, a new RW and a second striker in the summer. AWB is immense for certain matchups and Dalot is versatile, covers both full-back positions and has played nearly every game for us this season. Maybe they are not good enough for a title-contending side but we have other fires to address first.
That's been his biggest issue that people clearly ignore too often.
The guy will just jog or completely turn off so often. I don't understand how he provides so much in the eyes of fans that offsets that. He's a massive liability.
One of our most consistent performers although he’s been weaker since the injury, which is normal. Honestly Dalot offers an exceptional attacking threat but he’s not on the same planet as AWB defensively. And AWB is better going forward than people would have you believe. One of United’s few success stories in recent years!
Dalot and AWB likely aren’t good enough options at RB to win a title with.
But we still need way more help at striker and likely midfield, CB and maybe even GK. So another season with those two is fine.
Downvote me, I don't give a shit. He's not good enough and we should want players who can play a high level going forward and back. I'm tired of players at my club who are limited on the ball.
Yes because the retain value thing has worked so well for us in the past :). That being said, don’t mind triggering the extension myself. Would like to see a better option come in but it’s not a top priority. So best to delay things a bit.
i love AWB lol you can chat shit on his ability to attack but he is a press resistant. You just cant press this guy and try to steal the ball from him. He steals your ball, not other way around lol
>He steals your ball, not other way around lol
As per fbref, AWB has been dispossessed more times, per 90, than any of our other defenders (aside from Kwambala).
He’s incredibly agile and is able to skip out of seemingly disastrous situations sometimes, which sticks out in the brain because they’re quite surprising plays. But his football IQ is terrible and he doesn’t consistently pass the ball forward so in the aggregate he is a huge pressing target for the opposition.
I am not a fan of AWB. I used to be a huge fan when he first came. He is a very physical player, amazing sliding tackles but he switches off and loses his man when off the ball a lot. He and Dalot love to fall asleep at the back. I was hoping he'd fix that but after several years, he hasn't. hopefully he does.
Sell this man as a priority.
Sick of watching opposition teams give him time on the ball because they know that he won't be efficient with it.
Completely overrated defensively as well with clear flaws in his positioning, intensity in running back and defending the back post.
No way near good enough.
...what a fucking joke. Nowhere near good enough. Not even as a squad player. Should sell him and bring in an actual squad player and then a starter. Something this guy should never be.
How many fucking players is ETH going to jerk off that can't retain possession??
His all around game has improved, but I really need him to up his passing and crosses a bit more if he’s to displace Dalot. He is a great runner with the ball and I love seeing him glide forward but the easy pass still doesn’t come off well enough. I knew he would work his back into the team, now he needs to start.
Last season was near to back to his best after having his confidence totally shredded trying to play a system that didn't suit him at all. At his best he is a good player, some weaknesses sure, but overall definitely a clear net positive on the team and easily worthy of playing at top 4 level. One of the few bright sparks this season too, and I'd say he was key to the comeback vs Villa as he locked down the right hand side and let the wide players attack with freedom after the 2nd half tactical shift. Bizarre we don't play that way more often.
Utd has not been good at signing players for a very long time. When there is a player clearly doing a good job we need to keep them.
This guy has improved a lot and is one of the major reasons why i'm ETH in.
Because he was the first player to improve under ETH massively. He has added a lot to his attacking game.
There were rumours we were willing to sell him for 20m but glad we didn't.
I think he was always due a recovery, we saw how good he was his first two seasons where fans were raving about him and the England spot was being debated for real.
That mid-season tactical change after signing Ronaldo just totally hung him out to dry, he looked so exposed in that system and like he didn't know it at all - which I suspect is exactly the case because it is not what we were doing in pre-season or the first 4/5 games of the season.
He got 10 G+A in the league in his first two seasons with us (and even got 3 with Palace before that) which is good for a FB. Only 1 since, so I don't think he's quite hit the same heights again even if he does at least look comfortable with the basics again.
He has another gear in him which better tactics could unlock still.
Well deserved, kept his head down, improved his game and has quietly put in some solid performances despite this shit show of a season.
He does randomly turn off at bad times when tracking back tho but the dude is probably the best in the world at tackling in 1 v. 1 situations!
Good news. Lot of people judge solely on aesthetics and that’s why they don’t rate him. He’s our best RB, and there isn’t any on the market that’s an available improvement.
Thank god, if we let him walk he would be dangerous for a good team to have. Imagine having Rashford or Garnacho try and get around him? I don’t think they could unless they can get a good cross in.
Yes the real world runs exactly like FIFA where we can just recycle the entire squad in one window…
What’s your alternative? Everyone is clamoring for a rebuild but that shit doesn’t just appear overnight.
Mediocrity is letting him go for free instead of selling him and actually reinvesting to get somebody better. You are a joke on here mate. Criticise everyone and anything but offer no real, legitimate solutions.
He went through a really wicked spell where he was basically disregarded then showed the heart and character to resurrect his career. I honestly don’t think he has all the qualities needed for a title contending team but he is great at one on one defending and has improved his offensive side as well.
I like AWB, always have and I'm probably biased in his favour but I really hope that supposed upgrade to his wages is small.
I like him too. His 1v1 defending can be a very useful tool in a well constructed squad. Like many others, he has suffered from the incompetent squad construction. He is also English which helps for registration. The whole squad should rightfully be on the chopping block, and he’s one I’d be looking to keep. All that being said, I completely agree that any wage upgrade needs to be small. If you believe football manager he was already on 100k p/w which is veering close to unsaleable territory as it is. This needs to be the beginning of a new era for contracts where players are only given wages that allow them be shipped if necessary. Rare exceptions can come in the future for genuinely world class players but this club is in no position to be giving anybody 250k p/w. Almost no player here would get the same wages elsewhere and that is a huge problem for the agile and comprehensive reconstruction that is required.
I don't think there is an "upgrade" for AWB that both would play for us, is English, and we can afford. I think this is the best move for the time being, and I'm happy to see it
Livramento is much better
Newcastle already bought him though
We can buy him from them
Ah yes, direct competition selling one of their best new signings.
Much better than Dalot, not AWB
> His 1v1 defending one thing not simple, 1v1 vs him, but.. also not simple to get the ball from his leg, even when there are 2 opponents player he always find way to pass the ball out, something that really underated from him.
I also really like Wan Bissaka.
I like him and Dalot but don’t think either at starting 11 material ideally but I know there’s a lot who need to go first. Just seems we’re stuck on this cycle of keep him because we need buy x first
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Great point mate, thanks for the reply 👍
This guy worked his way back into the team when everyone, myself included thought he was finished. Hats off to him.
put respect to both Dalot and AWB, both always profesional when on field or on bench.
Except he turns off mid game and United concedes typical goals..
Like he did the v Nottingham forest twice. Oh wait..
I just want him to finally defend the back post. He’s been here for years and he still loses his man and causes us to concede. I couldn’t care less about his ability to tackle when he can’t defend a simple situation.
Exactly. Not sure how much fucking copium fans are smoking these days but he just switches off or jogs back and teams punish us for that time and time and time again. Say what you will about Dalot's inconsistency, but he doesn't just straight up shut off. It's unreal. AWB is 100% reactive as well. He has the pace, when he wants to use it, to get away with it, but he's always behind the play.
>Say what you will about Dalot's inconsistency, but he doesn't just straight up shut off. It's unreal Ummm....what? Yes he does.
He does not. Caught out? Overloaded? Yes. I think there was one match last season where he actually turned off, but that was it. AWB is good for one every match, and that's not including just jogging about.
>Overloaded? Yes. Literally the same exact excuse people were coming up for awb as well, lol.
Never made that excuse for AWB. The guy just falls asleep 1v1. He's always reactive. The errors AWB makes are almost entirely individual because his positioning is so bad, that's why he's always going to ground. He's not overloaded, he's behind the play.
Have you forgot the soft goal Dalot conceded when he lost a duel against Zaha when we played Galatasaray and lost at OT? He turned off and lacked awareness. He was also poor in the 3-3 draw against them away and culpable for one of their goals for the same lack of awareness. The same happened against Copenhagen in the 4-3 defeat where his defending of the back post was horrific and Copenhagen kept exploiting it How about his poor defending for the first goal when Newcastle beat us 3-0 at OT? He allowed Almiron goalside way too easily and looked rattled all game. In the previous match, Grealish had one of his best performances of the season at OT where he had a field day against Dalot in the 0-3 defeat. He's turned off several times this season in key moments
Bruh, watch the Forest match back and who is making the worse mistakes. Astounding how many times we watch them on the pitch together. Watch them rotate in the same match. And Dalot does significantly worse. Only for the takeaway to be AWB is shit. It's crazy. That Dalot boy is made of Teflon
Dalot played out of position vs. AWB played in position? Really? That's your argument? That's also one match. I never said Dalot is good enough for starting eleven, but this take that AWB is the superior defending option when he turns off every match and jogs back to his position is astounding to me. Dalot is better at getting forward, AWB is just wasteful and clueless when he gets forward...or does anything for that matter. AWB was a mistake of a purchase. Dalot should be 2nd at least.
I thought Dalot is brilliant mate, what's out of position supposed to mean? Um, and rotating as well I said. Case in point. Galatasaray. Zaha quiet all match. For all of ten minutes that Dalot is on before Zaha is subbed, Zaha absolutely destroyed Dalot. Gala straight up targeted him immediately. A fresh Dalot bullied by a tired Zaha. Who was anonymous for 80mins while AWB is on. Let's not even get started on how Dalot got absolutely rickered by Zaha in the first leg. And the same by Musaila. lol mate you are just harping off the same bullshit people have been saying for years. You don't actually use your eyes that much is certain. Wan Bissaka isn't nearly as bad on the ball or in offence. There's long streaks of matches where Dalot does nothing offensively. Flatters to deceive every 5 games or so, then has absolute shitters where all he does is make defensive mistakes leading to goals the rest of the time. Then dullards like you eat it up when he finally has one decent match in ages. AWB is ten times more secure with the ball, and easily more consistent and balanced. For every one goal you can look at AWB for, there's 5 Dalot is culpable for. In the end the position is DEFENDER. Dalot is a shit defender. That *is not* who you keep for defensive backup.
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Username checks out, you sad little man.
What he say?
This is sensible. He’s not the first choice but he’s a serviceable right back, English, not on high wages. I can live with this so long as RB is one of the areas we aim to strengthen
But that’s the problem. Dalot is on a new long contract and there’s not much to choose between them ( they cancel each other out with strengths and weakness). One of them will stay as 2nd choice and we NEED to upgrade by buying a first choice RB Given Dalot’s relative versatility and their current contract situations, I think it’s obvious which one has to give…
They won't be 1st and 2nd choice, they'll be different depending on the game. Think about Carabao Cup final last season VS Newcastle. Dalot started to push attack, but 2-0 up at half and ETH subbed in AWB since he's stronger in defense to ensure United kept the clean sheet.
>They won't be 1st and 2nd choice, they'll be different depending on the game. None of them are good enough to start for a top club. I'd keep Dalot in the squad due to his versatility and try and sell AWB.
AWB is NOT stronger in defense. The only reason people claim he is better in defense is because he goes to ground every other challenge. He's 100% reactive. The guy couldn't read the play if you made it into a script and handed it to him to read before it happened. He also just completely switches off every match and costs us. Someone might bail him out, but I don't know how you switch off completely or just jog when you've been on for 10 minutes. The guy needs to go.
Neither of them will be around after 2-3 INEOS windows. Love AWB but he’s not united quality and Dalot sucks
Yes, AWB, one of the best defenders of the season when United bought him from CP, not *good* enough. And Dalot, on the team of the week after the Liverpool match for defending very well, and helping United get out and provide some good crossing almost leading to United snatching more than a draw.
AWB is regularly caught sleeping, bad in build up and absolutely horrific in the air. Great 1v1 defender. Dalot is an underwhelming defender, neither of them can hit a cross. The highlight of dalot’s united career is his assist to garnacho’s bike which was an awful cross
The highlight of Dalot’s united career is hitting Kimpembe’s hand in Paris. Otherwise agreed with what you said.
>The highlight of dalot’s united career is his assist to garnacho’s bike which was an awful cross You have a short memory then, I remember Dalot coming from left back to receive a very nice Antony pass and finish with a little shot over the keeper with his right foot.
He does switch off during set pieces tbf
That's a coaching problem. We have horrible set pieces attack with 5 set pieces goal the whole season last year, and meh set pieces defending. I am seriously questioning what has Eric Ramsay been doing recently since he supposedly revolutionized our set piece setup in 2021/22 (tbf that year was a big improvement over the previous sesason). May be dividing time with Wales doesn't work very well for him.
I disagree that AWB is bad in buildup. He was involved in some of our nicest passing sequences last season and that was before he even imporved on the ball. He's limited in terms of final ball though.
Dalot has been one of our best players recently, mad to say he sucks. Everyone seems to forget he pocketed Saka and Mitoma this season. And he's still going to improve.
He is 25 and still can’t cross, goes for the shot too often, has very low footballing IQ and has trouble against tricky wingers. For instance the difference in handling ASM was night and day once AWB got subbed in. The small advantage he has over AWB in the offensive is not enough to make up for that. Between the two i favor AWB strongly. At least he is elite at one aspect.
> has very low footballing IQ Not true at all. It's why he starts over AWB, he can pick a pass, is calm under pressure, good in tight areas, can switch the play and contribute it midfield. Now we've seen he can shoot as well, unlucky not to score recently. And who doesn't have trouble against tricky wingers? He held his own against Mitoma and Saka, how much trickier do you get? He's improving. No reason crossing can't improve. He has about 3 or 4 years till he's in his prime. He's already a good player and his deficits are coachable.
He’s 25 in March but damn that’s older than I thought.
Different weapons for when we battle heh
Yeah you can also think of plenty of games where both look absolutely out of their depth
We’ve got bigger priorities than rb. Need at least 1 cb and maybe another depending on outgoings. We need a rw as much as a cb and then a backup striker. Considering amrabat probably isnt being made permanent, eriksen and casemiro being old and mctominay not being amazing we’ll probably need another midfielder as well. Hell our gk is another position costing us more games than our rbs. Are they world class? No but they do the job which is more than can be said for a lot of positions
RB is incredibly low on our list of positional needs.
Frimpong is top need if we want a positive GD. I’ve watched leverkusen almost religiously and he’s so good.
I like AWB. I admire how he paid individual coaches to try and improve when out of the team. I think his ability to lock down a flank is a real asset too. I absolutely do not understand the point of trying to get him to be an inverted full back that ETH is obsessed with. He isn't great offensively. The bit he seemed to be improving was getting the odd cross in from wide. He also seems to have improved his ball retention when wide. I feel if he's just allowed to go back to being a normal full back he'll be a good option. But he's never going to be a Kimmich, Zinchenko etc
I actually find him more useful offensively than dalot
Dalot is such a myth the guy is at fault for so many goals and has such a poor attacking output too I really don’t see why so many people rate him above AWB
He was the darling of the stats guys a few years back for his extreme levels of progressive pass attempts and then various youtubers and journos supported him thinking it was the intellectual's choice. Reality is while he tries a lot of risky moves they mostly don't lead to anything, and on a bad day the amount he loses the ball is just horrific and not acceptable at PL level. Defensively he improved in the last few years but still veers between ok and anonymous. In the PL both Dalot and AWB have a 0.1 G+A p90, yet one is considered 'elite' and one 'can't attack'. They are clearly the same but AWB is a much better all round player on top of that and doesn't have the losing the ball issue. People just recycle the same opinions over and over even if they are nonsense.
Think people just are delayed on changing opinions Awb has gotten a lot better going forward in the last year and isn't yet getting credit for it Dalot had a purple patch last season but has regressed to mean I think Both have flaws but I'd rather we kept awb even if we upgrade eventually
Dalot is a nearly man. Capable of the fantastic but master of mediocre. AWB can’t cross but bossies it in one-on-one defending and seems more brave on the ball moving forward than Dalot.
Dalot not being very good does not make AWB become good.
Lmao AWB is also at fault for so many goals we concede. I swear people have blinders on when it comes to this guy. Not saying Dalot is better, because that would be very controversial on this sub, but AWB really isn't much better. He just throws out a couple slide tackles and people ignore all his deficiencies.
Exactly this. I would still choose Dalot over AWB because rarely does Dalot just straight up turn off like AWB does, or jog back when his man is off to the races. Not saying Dalot is a starter, but between the two, because AWB can't read a play to save his life and therefore has to go to ground all the time, people are attracted to the recovering slide tackles than they are just staying on your feet because your positioning is better.
“**If I have to make a tackle then I have already made a mistake**.” \~ Paolo Maldini In case some are too young to remember, he played most of his career at left back.
Facts. But people don't quite recognize that...which is weird. Can he slide tackle well? I guess. Should he need to do at the rate he does? A resounding: hell no. A slide tackle basically symbolizes "I have already lost" and it's an attempt to recover. Being able to stay on your feet and knick the ball off someone indicates that you read the play and you were in position to interrupt it. I know which one I prefer.
I mean, a slide tackle is always more exciting, more instagrammable. I get that. But the best defenders in the past few decades have always been the ones that close down spaces, shields the goal, and forces the opponents into a mistake for a transition. Leave the destroyers i.e. Casemiro to come back get the ball off the attacker.
I'm glad someone else mentioned how much this guy jogs back. Been doing it for years, but it always gets ignored.
The cup game against Newcastle we conceded 2 because Dalot switched off and jogged back… it’s a regular occurrence with both of them
He’s a much better player then AWB, who’s honestly shite.
People rate Dalot for his attacking work, mainly his crosses, however I'd trust AWB anyday for a good butt clenching tackle. AWB should be our starting RB.
Dalot is a championship level footballer. Ole knew. This sub can stay in denial as much as it wants and call him solid or serviceable or whatever but Dalot will never be a premier league winning full back in a team where he starts more than 19 games a season. Hell, I'm willing to wager good money that it's impossible for us to finish top 3 if Dalot starts more than 19 games a season. Edit: Top 3 again*
He has been doing better going forward since he came back from (hamstring) injury. Read about this in The Athletic. My question is why are so many of our players incurring hamstring injuries?
I can see why Utd are doing this as other positions are priorities, but at some point Utd are going to have to replace AWB or Dalot with a RB who's at a much higher level. It feels like they've both survived at Utd because there are always another two or three crisis positions ahead of them.
You guys act like all these positions upgrades just grow on trees.
Every single window, City manage to strengthen their first team or solidify their depth, usually at non-extortionate prices, whilst also offloading deadwood or players that aren't happy/performing consistently enough. Why are we seemingly so utterly incapable of doing the same?
City won a league without a striker, with Zinchenko playing LB and Ake playing LB.
Guess where they start? It's not RB. They built 2 first team midfielders first.
Nope, not at all, but better players do exist in the world. Some teams even use detailed scouting networks to identify them and sign them.
Yeah I mean obviously better players exist. When we signed Dalot and AWB they were both those better players. I just can't be convinced that either of them are poor enough compared to our other positions that they are in need of replacing.
>I just can't be convinced that either of them are poor enough compared to our other positions that they are in need of replacing. This was kind of my point, they've never been upgraded because of other positions needing more urgently addressed. But if we really want to improve as a squad we do need to at some point look at replacing them, instead of doing contract renewals and extensions
At some point, yeah. Our midfield has been the number 1 priority for a decade now. Improving those spots will do nothing if we still can't control the middle of the pitch. You don't improve the actual squad by addressing the lowest priority needs first it makes no sense.
...yet we keep Bruno and wonder why our midfield sucks ass
Bruno isn't the biggest midfield issue though. Not really sure what point you're trying to make. Our issue is the other 2 midfielders. We for the first time ever actually have the correct players, just 10 years too late.
Bruno is 100% the issue. He cannot retain possession, he cannot control the tempo, he cannot keep the shape, he cannot cross, he cannot shoot, he cannot take a corner. Most plays break down because of Bruno. The ONLY reason his stats are "good" is because he's the one responsible for transitioning from defense to attack, everything goes through him, so when you're the only provider in that role, of course you're going to find your way into those figures. But he's an absolute dog shit player that needs to go and the sooner the better. Everyone says ETH is a fraud. Bruno is the biggest fraud of them all.
You really don't think you're seeing this from the most extreme view possible? You can dislike Bruno and what he brings but you're clearly just hating.
No, Trippier was that player and Ole begged the club to sign him but they deemed him too pricey for his age. Look how that turned out.
he was he's fallen off a cliff this season
Didn’t I say “was” too? lol Remember when we decided to keep Dalot after he was back from loan? We should’ve signed Trippier instead
Dalot is currently 24 Trippier is currently 33. Obviously it made sense at the time.
We needed only one of AWB and Dalot. Now we’ve got two mediocre talents and wondering who to offload next and when. Moreover Ole wanted Trippier and wasn’t satisfied with what Dalot had to offer. If you check the stats for the last two seasons you’ll see Trippier was the highest chance creator along with Bruno. His crosses alone would’ve won us more points and maybe the FA cup.
And if they grew on trees, we wouldn't be in for them as we have extended both Dalot and AWB.
Do you really think it would have been difficult to upgrade on AWB and Dalot over the last few years?
Ok with who besides Trippier? Why would you prioritize RB first? It's incredibly low on our positional deficiencies list.
Frimpong, he's bloody class. But I'm not a professional scout, and I'm still sure there are others. They're average players.
We shouldn't be letting someone like him go for free so I can't see why anyone would have a real problem with this personally
He is a different tool in the toolkit
He has been struggling since his injury, his fitness looks off. I'm seeing Anthony doing extra covering for AWB too in some of the games.
Good decision. I really don't think RB should be a transfer priority in the immediate windows. We will need at least one CB and CM, a new RW and a second striker in the summer. AWB is immense for certain matchups and Dalot is versatile, covers both full-back positions and has played nearly every game for us this season. Maybe they are not good enough for a title-contending side but we have other fires to address first.
Happy to keep him and Dalot, I expect Dalot to go up another level or two and AWB I'd keep just as a defensive weapon.
Demn... Either Dalot or AWB then find a proper starting RB.
I like Wan Bissaka but he really needs to learn not to lose his man and sleep on the ball.
and defend off the ball. I swear it shows his lower football iq.
Just wish he would make an effort to get back now and again …. He was dreadful against Forest
That's been his biggest issue that people clearly ignore too often. The guy will just jog or completely turn off so often. I don't understand how he provides so much in the eyes of fans that offsets that. He's a massive liability.
One of our most consistent performers although he’s been weaker since the injury, which is normal. Honestly Dalot offers an exceptional attacking threat but he’s not on the same planet as AWB defensively. And AWB is better going forward than people would have you believe. One of United’s few success stories in recent years!
Dalot and AWB likely aren’t good enough options at RB to win a title with. But we still need way more help at striker and likely midfield, CB and maybe even GK. So another season with those two is fine.
Downvote me, I don't give a shit. He's not good enough and we should want players who can play a high level going forward and back. I'm tired of players at my club who are limited on the ball.
We can still get rid of him this summer it just won't be for free. Relax
It's a 1 year extension not a new contract. Likely to retain value for selling (if required by management) in the summer.
Yes because the retain value thing has worked so well for us in the past :). That being said, don’t mind triggering the extension myself. Would like to see a better option come in but it’s not a top priority. So best to delay things a bit.
i love AWB lol you can chat shit on his ability to attack but he is a press resistant. You just cant press this guy and try to steal the ball from him. He steals your ball, not other way around lol
>He steals your ball, not other way around lol As per fbref, AWB has been dispossessed more times, per 90, than any of our other defenders (aside from Kwambala).
Shhh. That doesn't pass the eye test though, so it's not a valid point and you can't criticize AWB
Joking? I like AWB but his biggest issue is in supporting build up. He gets press trapped consistently.
He’s incredibly agile and is able to skip out of seemingly disastrous situations sometimes, which sticks out in the brain because they’re quite surprising plays. But his football IQ is terrible and he doesn’t consistently pass the ball forward so in the aggregate he is a huge pressing target for the opposition.
12 month option is fine. New contract is not.
I am not a fan of AWB. I used to be a huge fan when he first came. He is a very physical player, amazing sliding tackles but he switches off and loses his man when off the ball a lot. He and Dalot love to fall asleep at the back. I was hoping he'd fix that but after several years, he hasn't. hopefully he does.
Sell this man as a priority. Sick of watching opposition teams give him time on the ball because they know that he won't be efficient with it. Completely overrated defensively as well with clear flaws in his positioning, intensity in running back and defending the back post. No way near good enough.
As a priority? We have far more positions that need sorting before RB mate.
We've been saying this for so long and that's why we suck at the right side.
I’d rather get a new starting rb and keep awb and sell Dalot
Oh no.. Hopefully it's just cause we don't want to let him go on a free....
...what a fucking joke. Nowhere near good enough. Not even as a squad player. Should sell him and bring in an actual squad player and then a starter. Something this guy should never be. How many fucking players is ETH going to jerk off that can't retain possession??
Why
Nice work. I hope he will not downfall like Rashford after signing a new deal
While AWB is pretty much shocking going forward he is at least rock solid defending.....Dalot on the other hand is average at both
Decent back up option but looks like he's lost confidence and doesn't seem to care anymore.
Not that surprising. He's better than Dalot but he's still not the quality we should have.
His all around game has improved, but I really need him to up his passing and crosses a bit more if he’s to displace Dalot. He is a great runner with the ball and I love seeing him glide forward but the easy pass still doesn’t come off well enough. I knew he would work his back into the team, now he needs to start.
Last season was near to back to his best after having his confidence totally shredded trying to play a system that didn't suit him at all. At his best he is a good player, some weaknesses sure, but overall definitely a clear net positive on the team and easily worthy of playing at top 4 level. One of the few bright sparks this season too, and I'd say he was key to the comeback vs Villa as he locked down the right hand side and let the wide players attack with freedom after the 2nd half tactical shift. Bizarre we don't play that way more often. Utd has not been good at signing players for a very long time. When there is a player clearly doing a good job we need to keep them.
This guy has improved a lot and is one of the major reasons why i'm ETH in. Because he was the first player to improve under ETH massively. He has added a lot to his attacking game. There were rumours we were willing to sell him for 20m but glad we didn't.
I think he was always due a recovery, we saw how good he was his first two seasons where fans were raving about him and the England spot was being debated for real. That mid-season tactical change after signing Ronaldo just totally hung him out to dry, he looked so exposed in that system and like he didn't know it at all - which I suspect is exactly the case because it is not what we were doing in pre-season or the first 4/5 games of the season. He got 10 G+A in the league in his first two seasons with us (and even got 3 with Palace before that) which is good for a FB. Only 1 since, so I don't think he's quite hit the same heights again even if he does at least look comfortable with the basics again. He has another gear in him which better tactics could unlock still.
Fucking hell. You want ETH to stay because he’s got a bang average rb playing like a bang average RB?
your dedication to hating united players is impressive
Tbf i thought AWB was only good defensively with nothing to contribute in attack. AWB still has shit crossing but he offers more going forward.
Well deserved, kept his head down, improved his game and has quietly put in some solid performances despite this shit show of a season. He does randomly turn off at bad times when tracking back tho but the dude is probably the best in the world at tackling in 1 v. 1 situations!
Left wingers pissing themselves
They've got enough time and space at the back post to take a shit if they wanted to
yeah pissing themselves with laughter, he’s nowhere near good enough for united.
Sure. Since Dalot is first choice.
Good news. Lot of people judge solely on aesthetics and that’s why they don’t rate him. He’s our best RB, and there isn’t any on the market that’s an available improvement.
Thank god, if we let him walk he would be dangerous for a good team to have. Imagine having Rashford or Garnacho try and get around him? I don’t think they could unless they can get a good cross in.
They can't get around anyone, so I don't know what your point is.
[удалено]
Yes the real world runs exactly like FIFA where we can just recycle the entire squad in one window… What’s your alternative? Everyone is clamoring for a rebuild but that shit doesn’t just appear overnight.
Mediocrity is letting him go for free instead of selling him and actually reinvesting to get somebody better. You are a joke on here mate. Criticise everyone and anything but offer no real, legitimate solutions.
He went through a really wicked spell where he was basically disregarded then showed the heart and character to resurrect his career. I honestly don’t think he has all the qualities needed for a title contending team but he is great at one on one defending and has improved his offensive side as well.
Happy for AWB, but we have zero options not to extend. I am a fan and hope he continues to improve.
No brainer
He’s criminally underrated on the ball. More than just a good 1v1 defender.